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And it's available in all 50 states and around the world. Learn more at chministries.org faithbuy. For the moment, all discipline seems painful rather than pleasant, but later it yields the peaceful fruit of righteousness. Hebrews 12, 11.
I am Rob West. No doubt every one of us can read that verse and think of a time when the Lord used a trial in our lives to teach us something of value. Chris Fabry joins us today to talk about that and much more. Then it's on to your calls at 800-525-7000.
That's 800-525-7000. This is faith and finance, biblical wisdom for your financial journey. Well, I'm delighted to have Chris Fabry as our special guest today. If you don't know him as the incredibly popular Christian Network talk show host on Moody Radio, you probably have at least one of his books on your shelf. Chris, great to have you here, my friend. Rob, thanks for inviting me.
I'm honored to be here. Well, I'm looking forward to our conversation. As you know, we're talking today about trusting God. I had a conversation with Tricia, your producer for Chris Fabry live recently, and she was just recounting this theme that had come up several times recently on your program around trusting God in difficult times and how so often in situations like that we can rush to the fix it rather than realizing it's a process and seeing God at work in the mess. Talk to me a bit about what's been coming up and some of your thoughts on that.
Well, that to me is just the tip of the spear. That is the main thing that I struggle with the most. And I say I can say I believe in God and I trust God. But what how do I live my life? And I often what I'm seeing in my life is I'm grasping, I'm striving, I'm running on the treadmill and try to make things work in my own power. And it takes a work of God, you know, that that whole struggle with that struggle is not a sign of failure struggles, a sign of life. That's what my mentor, a radio pastor Donald Cole said a long time ago. And I really believe that that if you are struggling in your Christian life with something that you see that you're doing that you're not doing or that you're not doing that you want to do, and there's a struggle there, it means that the Spirit is at work in your life. And you are being drawn toward that trust that he wants you to have as he conforms you to the image of his son, because that's his goal. He doesn't want just the outcome. It's like, we could pray this way.
And all this happens over here. What he wants is the process. And part of the process is the struggle.
Yes, there's no doubt about that process is important. Chris, what are some of the keys to being open to God's voice and instruction in the midst of the difficulty and not closed off? I think it's being well, and that's just even entertaining that are you going to be open to this?
First, it's humility versus having the ability to say, and we pray this before my program, and you were praying just a minute ago, Rob, before we went on, you know, God, get us out of the way. I want to be out of the way. I want you to do what you want to do here. I have my list of wants that I want.
What I need most of all is you. And so I think that's the biggest thing to be able to see how much I get in my own way. And how much I get in God's way, the old hymn that we used to sing, or we'll walk by his side in the way. And I always saw myself in the way of Jesus.
He's like, get out of the way, Chris, let me do it. And there's a truth to that, that I get so wrapped up in everything that I want to see happen, or I want to do with my life, and the Lord make me a great person or whatever, and make me have a lot of impact. And he just wants me to be his son.
He wants me to conform to the image of his son. And so as I keep that in mind, I think that's part of the process. Chris Yeah, there's no doubt that it is. And I love what you said about getting out of the way. And in some respects, I guess, we need to get to the end of ourselves, don't we?
Chris Yeah. And that's the hard part. Because if you get to the end of yourself, then you see that you're not in control. And your dependence is all on him. That's why it's not about everything that you can obey with God and all the good that you can do. And I'm not encouraging you not to.
But the main thing that God wants to do, especially with that verse that you started with, is allow him to bring you to a place where you are dependent on him, period. Chris Yes. Chris And that's hard.
That's hard. Chris Yes, it is. Well, I thought this was a show about biblical finance, and it is. So when we come back with Chris Fabry, we're going to apply this to your financial life.
What about that financial mess that you're in? How do we learn along the way and practice those disciplines that are going to take us where God ultimately wants to lead us? And what about trials that our kids are facing? Chris is a dad of nine. He's got some experience in that area.
We'll unpack that as well. Much more to come on faith and finance just around the corner. I'm Rob West, Chris Fabry here today, and we'll be right back. If you enjoy this radio program, you're going to love all of the many different resources waiting for you at faithfi.com and the Faithfi app. You'll find powerful wisdom, free podcasts, articles, videos, and more from leading voices such as Randy Alcorn, Howard Dayton, Ron Blue, and our own Rob West. Grow in wisdom and knowledge by connecting with a community of thousands of Christians driving to be good and faithful stewards at faithfi.com or by downloading the Faithfi app. Are you looking for a financial professional who aligns with your biblical values? Certified kingdom advisors are trusted financial, legal, or accounting professionals who have completed a rigorous certification program to ensure they provide biblically wise financial advice as part of their practice.
You can find a local CKA professional in your area by going to faithfi.com and clicking find a CKA. So thankful to have you with us today on faith and finance. I'm Rob West with me today, my friend, Chris Fabry, the host of Chris Fabry live on Moody radio, the author of many books. In fact, he's got a new one coming out later this year that we'll talk about in just a moment, but the focus of our conversation today is trusting God in the midst of the difficult times. And Chris was sharing just before the break that it's a process that we need to learn to listen, that we need to get out of God's way and ultimately get to the end of ourselves.
And Chris, this of course applies to the subject at hand on this broadcast each day. And that is our finances. When we find ourselves in a mess, we can do the hard work and be obedient and faithful, perhaps a steady plotter, or we can try to fix it with that plastic. And that leads to a mess.
What thoughts do you have there? Well, the other way that I've tried to fix it is to work harder and longer and just get on the treadmill. And that's been one of the things as a person who's done freelance since 1999. So it's been 24 years that I've been kind of out on my own. When I have a job that comes in that I could do, it's very hard to say no to it, because if you live in a scarcity mindset, this might not come around again, or I'll just work a little harder.
And what happens then is that you start to believe that you're doing this in your own strength. And so, the time in which we live, it's really interesting because my parents grew up in the Depression. And I would go down in the basement of our house that my dad built in the early 1960s. And I'd see all of these ball jars with green beans and all the stuff that they'd canned down there that they never touched. It's like, why we got all this stuff down there?
It's because they'd lived through a time when they didn't have anything to eat, you know, they both grew up in abject poverty. And so that colored the way that they lived and spent their money. And then our generation comes along, it's a lot better. And now we're getting into a place where it's a lot tighter and it's uncertain. Tomorrow is uncertain, next year and the stock market and all that. It's always been uncertain, but it's even more so now. And I think this is just a time that where we are being called to ask that same question, are you going to live in your own strength? You're going to depend on him. Are you gonna make wise decisions or unwise decisions?
You could be lazy, you know, are you going to move toward comfort and just do what you want to do and fulfill your wants? Or are you going to have this kingdom mentality of looking out? Now is a great time to live in the world.
I know there's darkness and it's bleak and everything. Now's a great time for the gospel to go out. You can invest in the kingdom today rather than just in your own comfort and ease.
So those are some of the things that came to mind. Yeah, boy, and you got to really counteract the message of this world if you're going to do that and turn up God's voice and the noise of the world turn that down. Chris, what about when it comes to our kids? You know, as a dad of nine, now nine grown children that are on their own, it's really easy to want to step in their mess and fix it and we can circumvent God's instruction and leading in their lives. What have you learned about that?
Well, three of them still live with us. Okay. So I'm in the middle of, you know, you say they're growing on their own. It's like, well, yeah, there are several of them that are, but they're still struggling, you know, and they're still asking the questions.
And I like the, you mentioned you can go in, you can helicopter, you can rescue. Absolutely. But there have been times my wife has these conversations that I'm overhearing. She's, she stays connected with them even more than I do.
And I will hear her hold back. Well, what do you think? You know, questions are always better than the rescue or the advice. And when your kids ask you for advice, especially on financial things, I say, give it to them.
But the, the leading them and showing them, I think you model this better than you actually teach it. And when my daughter, you're going to love this because Larry Burkett, I saw a movie the other day and it was from the 1980s, early 1980s. And the main character was supposed to be really rich. And she drove up in a Lincoln town car.
And I thought Larry Burkett, cause Larry would always tell me, don't buy a new car, Chris, as soon as you drive it off the lot, you know, it loses value. And he got the watch at the gas station every four years, I think. But I found a, my daughter needed a car. It was, you know, the first thing that she was doing, we go give her this car. I found a 1999 Honda Civic.
This was like in 2019. So it was 20 years old. It had 21,000 miles on it. And I called him up, anybody who has a Honda, you know, that you have to find out when they're going to do the fuel, the water pump and the timing belt.
That's the big, you know, that costs a lot. So I said, with 21,000 miles on this, has it ever had that change? And the guy looked at it. He said, it was an older couple who moved from California to Arizona.
He said they changed it 18,000 miles. And I thought, sold, sold. She's still driving that car. And you know, one of the back doors doesn't open. It's got these little things that are going on. But that engine is just, you know, it's solid. Anyway, I say that because you can help your kids make good decisions about those kinds of decisions that they're making in their life about money.
There's no question about it. You mentioned your parents, and I know they're both deceased now, but you grew up in rural West Virginia in coal mining country. What's one lesson you took away from your parents financially? My mom died about a year ago. And so I'm in the middle of, you know, the grief process.
It came kind of slow for me for her. I think just what I learned from my dad, I'll just use him, is he loved to farm. He loved being out on his tractor. He loved going down and had some cattle and some other other things, but he had to have a main job.
And I think if he had it, you know, to do over, he would just farm all the time. But he couldn't make that work. And when I told him that I was going to do this freelance thing, he pushed back on it and said, Well, you know, they're laying people off over here and there. You know, he was really scared about this. I think what I learned from them is to not be so afraid of what was going to happen. To be able to take a little bit of a risk, especially if you really love something and you want to do it.
And I love what I do. And I just wonder what would have happened. It's probably better for him to do farming on the side than it was full time.
But I wonder what would have happened if he had tried that. I love that. Chris, we're almost out of time here. I know you're working on a new book project. I want to finish today by giving you a chance to tell us about it. There's a fellow that I have, a friend of mine who has an Alzheimer's diagnosis and focus on the family asked me, if you could write a novel about anything that people are dealing with in the culture, what would it be?
And this one of my best friends ever in life is going through this long goodbye. And so I came up with a plot that says, here's a fellow who was an English professor and a writer named Grayson Hayes. And his recurring dream is that he has an unsolved murder in the town where he grew up. So the last thing that he wants to do before the words leave him is to solve this mystery, the mystery basically of his own life. And you see the struggle of his family around him to love him well.
And then the struggle that he has to receive the love of his family. Saving grace comes out in November. Thanks for letting me talk about it. Absolutely. Saving grace.
It comes out in November. You're going to want to pick that up. Chris, we've just scratched the surface. We're going to have to have you back, but it's been a lot of fun to talk today. Thanks for stopping by. Thank you for the invitation, Rob. God bless you. That's Chris Fabry, host of Chris Fabry Live on Moody Radio.
We're going to take a quick break and then back with your questions just around the corner. can help you visit christiancreditcounselors.org. That's christiancreditcounselors.org or call 800-557-1985. We are grateful for support from Praxis Mutual Funds. Praxis Mutual Funds has seven impact strategies that are designed to create positive real world change. More information is available at praxismutualfunds.com. The fund's investment objectives, risks, charges, and expenses are contained in the prospectus and summary prospectus. This and other information is available at praxismutualfunds.com. Investments involve risk.
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How are you using God's resources? We're talking about it, and the lines are open to take your calls and questions. 800-525-7000.
Again, that's 800-525-7000. You can call right now. Gabby T. is standing by to take your calls. We'll look forward to getting you on the air quickly. All right, we're going to head to the phones.
Dawn is in Alabama. You'll be our first caller. Go right ahead. Hey, Rob. I'm currently retired and I have three 401ks and various companies I worked with before, and one of the three 401k programs is terminating, so I'm forced to move my funds to someplace else.
Since I'm not currently working and I'm retired, would I be able to roll that money over into one of my other two 401k programs, or do I have to put it like in an IRA? Yeah, that's a good question. Yeah, let me clarify one thing though, Dawn. Did you say one of these was your son's retirement account? No, no, no. They're all three of mine. Okay, I thought I heard you say your son.
My apologies. Yeah, typically when you separate from an employer, you're no longer able to roll other 401ks in. Often when you're still employed and you have an active 401k, the plan administrator may allow you to roll other 401ks in, and we will on occasion recommend that just because it keeps things a little simpler to have everything in one place, and then you're not managing multiple accounts with different investment strategies. But given that you're fully retired, you're separated from all three of these companies, really your opportunity is to roll these into one traditional IRA.
That will not be a taxable event. You won't be taking a distribution as long as you do a rollover, so you'll set up that IRA first. You could do that at Fidelity or Schwab, or if you wanted to hire an advisor, I'd do that first, and then they'll tell you where to open the account.
In fact, they'll do it for you. And then you'll just request the rollover paperwork, or you probably do it electronically with each of the three 401k plan administrators, and then that check will be sent directly to the custodian, or it'll be sent electronically through the ACAT system directly to the custodian of that new IRA. All the money will eventually be in one place, and then you can begin investing. Okay. Do you know if they have Fidelity or Schwab, do they have ETF IRAs or IRAs that are ETF-based?
Yeah. So once you get it into the IRA, you can invest in anything you want. Now, a lot of that has to do with the company you select. You could open an IRA with a bank, or you could do it at a discount brokerage like Fidelity or Schwab, or you could go to a Merrill Lynch or a Morgan Stanley, and they would all have multiple options. But if you went to, let's say, a Fidelity or Schwab, one of the discount brokerages, you could basically select anything you want. If you wanted more of a robo-solution where they automatically use ETFs to build an indexed approach to investing where you're just capturing the broad moves of the stock market with an allocation that's based on your age, you might want to go into the Schwab Intelligent Portfolios. But if you just want to build it yourself, all of those fund options, whether they're mutual funds that are indexes or exchange-traded funds, they'll all be available there on either of those platforms.
Okay. So I just have to get the money in there, and then I can invest in whatever I want. That's exactly right. It'll come in in the form of cash, so it'll go into the money market, whichever you select as your sweep account. So I would usually select the government money market, which means it's investing in government bills, bonds, and notes. And then that's your default account. That'll start earning interest.
And then as you begin to deploy it in whatever investments you want, individual stocks, ETFs, mutual funds, then that's when it gets invested. Okay. I appreciate it. You're welcome, Dawn. Thank you for calling today. We appreciate you being on the program. Let's see, a few lines open, 800-525-7000. But we haven't been to Green Bay in a while. Let's head there to Wisconsin. Hi, Tricia. Go ahead.
Hi there. My siblings and I were wondering, we were told that when our mother passes away, she has a home that's in a trust that we will all inherit. That within one year of her passing, we have to sell that home.
It's a vacation home. Otherwise, if we don't sell it within that first year of her death, the cost basis will revert back to what her cost basis was versus the day we inherited. Yeah, that would be news to me.
I'm not familiar with that. Essentially, what happens is that cost basis is reset to the date of death when you inherit it. Now, from that point forward, if it continues to increase in value, well, then at that point, you could generate a capital gain. But I'm not aware of any kind of provision where it would revert back after a period of time. I mean, you could connect with an estate attorney just to confirm that. But my understanding has always been that it would essentially step up permanently to the date of death.
That's one of the benefits of a trust is you're receiving it as a beneficiary through an inheritance. Therefore, you enjoy that stepped up cost basis. Okay. All right. That's what we needed to kind of hear and where to go if we need to then. Thank you. Okay, very good. Thanks for your call today, Tricia. We appreciate it.
Chicago's where we'll go next. Adam, go ahead, sir. Yes. How are you doing, sir? Can you hear me? I sure can. Yes, sir. Okay.
Real quick. My company just started a 401k. The maximum amount of contribution from them is $4,000 a year. I'm 68 years old. They just took out the second contribution of 10%.
My question is, oh, I'm sorry. And 5% is the minimum you have to contribute to get to 4,000 a year. Should I knock it down from 10% to five? And I put the money in the least amount of volatility because I'm not concerned about making a lot of money with my age. So the question is, should I go from 10% to five on my part?
Should I pay taxes on it now or later? That's the two questions I have. Yeah, very good. So you're obviously still working in Plan 2 for some time?
Well, no, about another 18 months. Okay. All right. Yeah, I like you putting it in. I think you can put in as much as you want. I would be more concerned about what are your savings goals and let that drive your contributions. You could put in up to $30,000 for 2023 and a 401k over the age of 50. What you're talking about is the amount that they'll match. You certainly want to put in enough to get the match.
That's free money. Whether you go beyond that has to do with how much you ultimately want to put away for retirement. So if you're still not there yet and you're working, this is a great time to accelerate the contributions up to 10% plus because you're going to get a deduction on that, which is good because you're in a higher bracket since you're still working and then you could pull it out down the road.
So I'd keep it up at 10% or more as long as that's in line with your retirement savings goals. Thanks for your call. Well, we're almost out of time. If you liked today's program, why not share it with a friend? And while you're at it, share the Faith Buy app with them as well. Help us get the word out. Thanks for listening and sharing. And I hope you'll come back and join us again next time for another edition of Faith and Finance. Faith and Finance is provided by Faith Buy and listeners like you.
