Monday, September 30th | Poptart Politics ft. Gov. Mike Huckabee

This episode of Clearview Today is brought to you by Le Bleu Ultra Pure Water.

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Fun fact, no. I have to make my own with McDonald's Sprite, and you guessed it, Texas Pete. I am genuinely horrified to hear that.

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Where's my Mountain Dew? You're listening to Clear View Today with Dr. Abaddon Shah, the daily show that engages mind and heart for the gospel of Jesus Christ. I'm Ryan Hill. I'm John Galantis. You can find us online at ClearViewTodayShow.com, or if you have any questions for Dr. Shah or suggestions for new topics, send us a text to 252-582-5028, or you can email us at contact at ClearViewTodayShow.com.

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Why would you do that? Ryan, it's a beautiful, beautiful Monday morning here at The Clear View Today Studio, and you know what that means, don't you, my friend? It's time for Million Dollar Monday.

And I love that for me. Oh, this is the section where all of our listeners write us a check for a million dollars. Yes, get your checkbook out now. Get your checkbooks out and send it in, because we're going to do some crazy stuff for y'all's Munty.

Did y'all hear that? Do that one more time. Easy stuff. All right, here we go.

That was wild. Million dollars. I've been saving this one for a rainy day. I was going through my phone and had a bunch of these on my phone and I've been saving this one.

Million dollars, because we've got a very, very special guest today that I'm looking forward to asking this question. But every formal dinner or lunch that you attend, any lunch in any banquet, anything like that, that you know, OK, hey, I've got to be on my best here. You can't eat the food that's there.

You've got to bring a Pop-Tart from home and eat that for dinner. Yeah, I'll do that. What? Sure. No way.

Sure. And I probably, honestly, I'd probably just eat it quietly under the radar, and just be like, oh, I'm so sorry. I'm allergic. I can't. I can't have that.

If you'll excuse me, gentlemen, I'm going to visit the restroom. You just cram a Pop-Tart in your mouth. Yeah, just shove the Pop-Tart in my mouth. Yeah, I'd take that. 100 percent. OK. OK. I don't think... A million dollars. Easy meal.

And I get deep Pop-Tarts. I don't think that I would take the money. Well?

I don't think I would take it. Because you've got to think about who I'm representing. I'm representing Clearview. I'm representing Dr. Shaw. But also I'm representing like, I'm there with my wife. You can play it off, though. Like, oh, I already ate.

And you did, but you just ate a Pop-Tart in the hallway. Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah. Thank you so much. I already ate.

I'm all set with, like, this water, this coffee. Yeah, I'm all good. But thank you. I appreciate it.

It looks delicious. Oh, man. Yeah. Yeah.

There's ways around that, for sure. I'd take that. Absolutely. All right. There you go.

Why'd you do that? I'm very interested to hear what Dr. Shaw and our special guests are saying. So the reason I've been saving this one is because we have a special guest on today's episode.

Like, when I say special guest, I mean a special guest. I mean, I guess we can say it. No, we'll wait and reveal it here. Yeah. You can maintain the element of surprise. Although, if you're listening and you see the title of this episode, then you already know exactly who it is. But if you listen on the radio, stay tuned, because I've been wanting to ask this guy this question for almost two or three months now.

Yeah. Make sure you guys stay tuned. Write in and let us know if you would take that deal. Pop-Tarts for a million dollars at any fancy lunch you go to or dinner.

Write in and let us know. 2-5-2-5-8-2-5-0-2-8. And also tell us what flavor of Pop-Tart are you choosing. That's what I was meant to say.

I should have brought this up. You can choose the flavor. Yeah. You can bring any flavor you want.

Oh, 100%. You can do it. You may as well bring cookies and cream. Imagine doing all this and bringing an unfrosted blueberry Pop-Tart. That's the only kind my kids will eat.

That's just sad to me. All right. Let's get our guest in here. Stay tuned.

We'll be right back. Hey, what's going on, listeners? My name is Jon.

And I'm Ellie. And we just want to take a second and let you know about Dr. Shah's new book on the market right now called, Can We Recover the Original Text of the New Testament? Boy, that is a long title. True, but it's a very simple message. The original text of the New Testament is not only attainable, but there are lots of different ways that scholars go about discovering it. There's a lot of people out there saying that the original text is lost forever or that it's hopeless to actually try to find it or that there's many texts of the New Testament. But alongside Dr. David Allen Black, Dr. Shah has actually compiled papers from some of the world's leading experts in textual criticism, including one written by himself on various methodologies for extracting the original text. And listen, if you're interested in textual criticism, this book is a great introduction to the field. You can pick up your copy on Amazon or you can buy it from our church website. That's ClearviewBC.org. We're going to leave a link in the description box so you can get your copy today. Love that. Ellie, let's hop back in.

Let's do it. Welcome back to Clear View Today with Dr. Abbadan Shah, the daily show that engages mind and heart for the gospel of Jesus Christ. You can visit us online at ClearViewTodayShow.com or if you have any questions or suggestions for new topics, send us a text to 252-582-5028. That's right. We're here in the Clear View Today studio once again with Dr. Abbadan Shah, who's a PhD in New Testament textual criticism, along with a very, very special guest today. Ryan, you want to introduce our very special guest, your genuine pleasure. It would be my honor. You did me the super special favor of writing this out for me, so I want to make sure I get this right. Hey man, chat.

GPT wrote it. It was all good. But today we have with us a very special guest, former Arkansas governor, presidential candidate and political commentator, Mike Huckabee.

Ladies and gentlemen, Mr. Mike Huckabee. Thank you very much. Thank you. Giving you the highest honors on the show. And I love the crowd.

You know, it's funny. I actually watched your show and I was like, we need to film this in front of a live studio audience. So as far as the listeners are concerned, that's what we're doing.

Yeah, we have to create the clapping too. Same thing, you know? Exactly. Ladies and gentlemen, today is Million Dollar Monday, so I want to ask you this question and just get your reaction. Is this something that you would do? Million dollars. You get a million dollars, direct deposit if you like, but any business lunch or dinner, any like nice black tie dinner that you go to for the rest of your life, you can't eat what's there. You have to bring in pop tarts from home, any flavor that you want. But for a million dollars, I'll do it in a heartbeat.

Oh, yes. For a million dollars, you show up with pop tarts. Yeah, but it's like you're, there's some esteem to you.

There's some prestige. It's like, ladies and gentlemen. For a million bucks, I'll sell it away and eat pop tarts at a big dinner. There you go.

I love it. Come on. I would, absolutely. I wish you would.

Absolutely we would. For an extra half million, you get up and deliver your keynote address still eating the pop tart. Let me tell you, I've been at many banquets. I've spoken to thousands of them.

Most of the time, the food is less than valuable. Oh, I love it. Absolutely. Let me tell you, I was at a place a few weeks ago. I spoke.

Food was so bad, three terrorist groups called in responsibility for the menu. Oh my goodness. That's crazy.

Pop tarts, and they're just convenient right out of the coat pocket. You can stick it right back in there. Now I'm just going to grab my checkbook.

I'm out two million? Just go ahead and make that check out. Fantastic. Very cool. The verse of the day today is coming from 2 Corinthians chapter 10, starting in verses 3. For though we walk in the flesh, we do not war according to the flesh. For the weapons of our warfare are not carnal, but mighty in God for pulling down strongholds, casting down arguments, and every high thing that exalts itself against the knowledge of God, bringing every thought into captivity to the obedience of Christ.

Wow. Amen. Amen. I mean, that's a powerful verse.

I mean, that's what we just talked about and heard from Governor Huckabee. I think what's so powerful about that verse, Dr. Shaw, is that it's all about, we have the ball. We're on offense. So many Christians act like that all we do is go out on the field and play defense.

No, we're on the offense. The gates of hell will not prevail against us. Well, nobody uses a gate as an offensive instrument.

That's right. A gate is a defensive point. And so when we're told the gates of hell won't prevail, it expects us to be pushing against those gates. What you just talked about in spiritual warfare, we tear down those high things.

We tear them down. Well, you don't do that if you don't have the ball. That's right. So we need to start acting like that we're scoring touchdowns, not like we're just trying to get run over. 100%.

That's right. Absolutely. And it's so encouraging to hear, you know, we talk about that, Dr. Shaw, you talk about that from the stage, from the pulpit in your messages. But it's so encouraging to hear people like yourself, Governor Huckabee, and others saying that, you know, we as Christians need to be advancing. We need to be gaining ground.

We need to be going on the offensive and capturing ground for the kingdom. When do you think the paradigm shifted? When do you think that Christians went from offensive to defensive? Is that something that's just kind of innate in Christians that always have had to be pushed out?

Or do you think it switched at some point? We were like, you know what? We're taking our hands off the wheel. I mean, the early church clearly understood that their goal was to evangelize the world. They were not shy. They paid a heavy price. Some of them were crucified upside down.

They were martyred for what they did. And throughout centuries, that has been the case. But I think here in the United States, what really started happening maybe started in the days of the thirties and forties, when government got bigger and bigger and churches got smaller. We started allowing the government to do things that had historically been the work of the church, widows and orphans, the work of relief and taking care of people. The churches basically abandoned that and said, government, you do it.

So we had all these big government programs. Then starting in the fifties and particularly in the sixties, the abolition of prayer, Bible reading, moving into what was a very secular society, no-fault divorce, one of the worst things that ever happened to the country, one of the worst things that happened to marriage. So we saw a regular capitulation of moral issues either turned over to the government or the church just stepped back and said, we don't want to be involved in politics.

I do think there was one other factor. In many cases in the fifties and sixties, a lot of evangelical churches did not take a strong moral stand on racism. And it was a period of time in this country where a lot of churches remained segregated, even justified it, tried to make it as if it were right, which it wasn't. And I think God maybe wrote Ichabod over a lot of churches in this country because we didn't take the stand.

And it was left to people often on the other side. To his credit, Dr. Martin Luther King Jr., who often was misunderstood, people said he was a civil rights leader. He never called himself a civil rights activist. He called himself a preacher of the gospel. When I was in seminary, I studied his sermons.

I found myself overwhelmed. I said, no one's ever told us this, that he really believed that the entire foundation of his message was from the scripture. And it was not about civil rights. It was about the moral propriety of believing that all people had equality under God. I mean, that's the gospel, right? It is the gospel, but a lot of white churches, you know, unfortunately stepped away from that. And I think it, as a result, that combined with all these other things left a lot of churches saying, oh, we don't want to get involved in politics. What they really were saying was we don't want to be on the offense. We just want to come to church on Sunday. And what we do on Sunday is not going to affect what we do Monday through Saturday. And I'm always of the position that if what you do on Sunday does not change what you do on Monday through Saturday, it wasn't worth doing on Sunday. One of the things, in some ways, I mean, I think they lost the ethos.

Would you say that? I mean, the churches when they didn't speak out when they could have. So now churches are looked upon as well.

You guys only, you're selfish or you want what you want for your benefit or capitalism. They don't realize we stand for a whole lot more than just 100%. One of the things I really respect about you, Dr. Shah, is that, you know, coming here to America in the 90s at 17 years old and then growing up and seeing this American culture, you brought with you a culture that is not the same as it is here, because, you know, where you grew up, where Christianity is a very, very fraction of a minority, you have to be offensive.

And when I say offensive, I mean, you have to go on the offense. You have to bring it. So bringing that here with you, I think you came at like the perfect time. Well, today it's, it's, I mean, I'm pinching myself that I'm sitting next to Governor Huckabee, because back in the 90s, I remember hearing about you and seeing, and I was like, wow. So today I was saying, I was like, this is not real.

I know I'm trying to play this role right now, but I kind of feel the same way. But I remember those were the years I was learning and understanding issues. I grew up, of course, as a minority, as a Christian. My dad was a pastor and we had to always speak out because if we didn't speak out, then we wouldn't have rights. We would lose our rights. There would be persecution.

And now persecution in India is just growing by leaps and bounds because of that. Yeah. And a lot of Christians just believe that it's inappropriate for them to get involved in political activity.

If it's just partisan political activity for the sake of we win, you lose. You know what? I agree. But if it's about the moral issues of the day, if it really is about protecting our children from pornography, from the exploitation of their sexual being, God has a message for how we're to live, how we're to raise our children and the standards by which we should raise them. So if we back away and pretend there are no standards and then we allow the secular standards to be the standards for Christian children, which it will be if we don't speak up, then we end up, as I often say, not with the government we want, but it's the government we deserve. That's right.

That's right. It's so important for us as believers to go out and make an impact in the political sphere. We can't just afford to stay behind church doors and just hope things change or hope for the best.

We've got to be out there taking ground and gaining ground and going on the offensive. Governor Huckabee, you've operated for years in the political realm as both a believer and a politician. What has that journey been like for you? What are some lessons you learned along the way and what encouragement can you give our audience? I think the most important lesson that I've learned is be faithful to the Word. The Scriptures really is the foundation.

And I think sometimes Christians getting involved in politics, they want to somehow, again, compartmentalize and say, well, now, when I'm in church, you know, I have to be this person who believes in the Bible. But in the political realm, you know, I've got to play ball with the way it's run. You are who you are. Stand strong, stand firm. Doesn't mean you beat people over the head with a bat. But you do step up to the plate and you swing hard and you swing for the fences and you shoot for the home runs. And, you know, for a Christian to say, I want to be engaged in politics, but I don't want to offend anyone. This is, I like to say it this way. It's a full contact sport.

It's going to get rough. People say, but is that OK for a Christian? Here's my response to that. Let's say a Christian and a lot of Christians play NFL football.

There are quite a few very strong Christian believers who play NFL football. When they line up at the line of scrimmage, do they look over to the other side and say, I'm so sorry, but when the ball is snapped, I might even bump into you. I just want to let you know what's about to happen.

I just don't want to hurt you. No, that's not what happens. The ball is snapped and they run in full speed and they're trying to knock this guy down. They're trying to get the quarterback, take the ball away from him and keep him from completing a pass. Now, if they do that outside the boundaries of the rules or the boundaries of the field, then that's a foul. That's a penalty.

That's inappropriate and it's wrong. But in the context of that field of play, it's playing to take the other team backwards, not let them go forward. And it's to take the ball from them.

It's to score and to keep them from scoring. We've got to approach the political realm the same way. Our goal is to get to 50 plus one. Politics is real simple math.

You don't have to be into physics or geometry. This is simple math. 50 plus one, you win. Anything less, you lose. It's that simple.

So what does it take to get to 50 plus one? That's your goal. And if you do it within the context of morality and ethics and you play within the rules of the game and play it properly, you still play it as if to win. You don't play to lose. It's a great explanation because I think there's people out there who don't see it that way. They don't see it as a game as win or lose.

They see it as this ideal utopia where everyone works together and together, Republican, Democrat, whatever, we're going to just create this American utopia. And what they don't realize is something that you've said, and I know David Lane has said before in some of his speeches this, this is a game of values. Someone's values are, it's not really fighting for control. It's fighting for whose values will be suppressed.

Absolutely. And somebody's values will overcome. So if I believe that every life is precious and that from conception forward, that is a human life. God has made this life.

God has a purpose for this life. Then I, I'm not going to argue the nuances of when it is okay to take the life. I'm going to stick to the principle of it's not okay to take the life. I may not win that battle. I may end up having to get what I can and live to fight for another day. So maybe, you know, the ultimate answer is we take it back to the States. That's not an ideal, but it's better than having States with unlimited abortion power, even though some have that now. Right.

Yeah. You know, I, Dr. Shaw, I know that's on your heart as well. Cause especially when you're forming a church, you, the very, very first thing we ever started with our values are our four core values before we ever decided on our style of music or an aesthetic. It was always comes back to who are we and what are our values?

Well, I mean, we heard governor Huckabee just a few moments ago talking about that. It is not about all the other things. There's the basic values on where scripture stands and just stand on them. And, and that's, that's what we tell our church people a hundred percent. I think the Bible becomes really the most important aspect of, of what we do, not only in our churches, but politically, you know, I've got friends that I went to college and seminary with 50 years ago, and many of them were very faithful, strong believers in the inerrancy of scripture then, and I'm watching now in, in order to be accepted, I like to say, cause they want to sit at the cool kids table.

They don't want people to hate them, say nasty things to them on social media art to their face. So now they're saying, well, the scripture may say this, but we living in a different day. We're living in a different culture.

And so we have to be able to move with the culture and I'm thinking, no, we really don't. We need to stand firm, take our lumps if it means people are angry at us for being biblical. But scripture is all we got. That's right. That's it.

That's all we've got. If we don't believe in the scripture as authoritative, and if we don't believe in the veracity of scripture, then just simply saying shrugging the shoulders, it's whatever you want to think it's fine. It doesn't really matter. And I'm thinking someday I got to face God. And I don't want him to say, Hey, it really matters. You pretended that it didn't, but it really did. Yeah.

Well, what you said right there is like a breath of fresh air because you don't hear that much anymore. But scripture matters. That's right. The inerrancy, the veracity of scripture, the first attack the enemy had was, has God indeed said, did he really say that? Are you sure?

Yeah. That's a great point. And it said that even among Christians, even among Christian scholars, that's coming into question. That is the saddest thing right now is Christian scholars who are debating over abortion or traditional marriage. That shocks me. It's like, which Bible are you reading? Right.

One hundred percent. I'm so glad to hear you say that because I just don't understand if you don't have a biblical authority, what's the point of standing in the pulpit? What do you got to preach?

What ground are you standing on? Is this some psychology babble that we're going through? Well, I'm glad you mentioned that because I think, and this was an illustration that I heard you give a couple of times in some of your keynote addresses. And I thought it was one of the best that I've ever heard about Christians who feel like they don't have that authority or they don't have the right to stand up and say something. You gave an illustration. I'd like you to give it now about how the people who had to go through the security to get to you.

I thought that was such a great illustration of how Christians should approach this. Well, it was a real life example of what happened. You know, I cut to the chase. My daughter had come to see me at the Capitol.

Normally a person would go through many, many layers of security to go from the outer office to where I actually sat in my inner office. And so one day I'm sitting at my desk and all of a sudden I look up. I like to tell the story to kind of give some suspense to it that the shabbily dressed young lady is standing over me and she's demanding money. And then I first time I heard that I was like, wow, somebody failed.

We went to go see you speak in Greenville. And I remember you telling that I was like somebody got fired. But it was my daughter. And so nobody stopped her. The reason they didn't stop her was because unlike anyone else who would have an appointment with me, she had something they didn't have. She had my name. And because she had my name, she had to go through no one.

And she had unfettered access to the Father. And I have to remind myself and remind other believers, we don't have to get someone's permission to ask God to intervene in our lives, to intervene in our country. And sometimes we act like we're so afraid, so timid. Is it okay if I pray?

Is it okay if I boldly come to the throne? Well, it's okay if you do, it's not okay if you fail to. That's when we have messed up.

That's right. Hundred percent. Such a great reminder for us.

I mean, so many times you're absolutely right. Christians have that timidity that that just I don't want to take up too much space. Please forgive me for existing. You know, I'm going to just exist quietly over in my corner. But we have always been meant to be the salt and the light. And we can't do that hidden away in a pantry somewhere. We've got to be out in the culture.

And I want to just commend both of you two men because you guys are examples to me. I grew up in like the 90s. Like I was born in 92. So I've grown up in a culture where, you know, you always you play it safe.

You ask first you because you never know when you will hurt someone's feelings. You've got to be tolerant. You've got to be this and that. And so to see bold men of God stand up and talk this way and I mean, it makes me feel like, you know, I can conquer the world almost. It makes me feel like that Jesus that the words that he said have meaning and Christians are slowly but surely starting to take it seriously again. What you just said, please embrace that and live it because so many times people say, well, I know what the scripture says, but I'm not sure that, you know, I can say that to the world.

Actually, that's the only thing you can say. And the words, it's not your words that have power. It's the word of God that has power. We sometimes forget that when we utter the word of God, we're not expressing our opinions, our thoughts, our views. We're expressing what God has put forth as holy truth, eternal with power behind it. So if I speak his words, I got a lot of confidence in them. If I speak my words, they may not be all that effective.

Amen. Well, right now, your daughter is doing a fantastic work on a different note, if I can say that. So are you being introduced as Sarah's dad or are you still... Mostly Sarah's dad.

It's funny because before you walked in, we were in a group chat and I was like, how do we, is it Governor Huckabee, former Governor Huckabee, Mike, like party Mike, like I don't know. Sarah's dad has a lot of places these days. Ladies and gentlemen, please welcome Sarah's dad.

I say to people all the time, but no parent is jealous of his or her child's success. We're grateful to God for it. And so, you know, I'm thrilled to watch her. It's a joy to see her from a distance and just, just to see her stand, you know, the thing people say, are you proud of your daughter? More than I'm proud of her holding a political office, which is wonderful, what I'm grateful for, and we use the word proud, I'm grateful that she holds to the biblical truths that she was raised in. She still embraces the values that were a part of the fabric of her life from the time she was a small child. It would break my heart for her to be a governor and reject everything she was taught when she was a child. What thrills me is not that she got elected or that she gets legislation passed, that's great, but that she has not forsaken her belief that the Bible is the word of God and that she's accountable to God for the life she lives. That's what thrills me. Amen.

I love it. What advice would you have for parents? You know, in this crazy world in which we live, parents feel like we don't know what to do, how to raise them.

What would you say? Looking back, I think some of the successes were accidental. I wish I could say that I had a real intentional, I understood everything I was doing as a parent, I didn't. Most of us as parents, when we're young, our kids are young and we're flying by the seat of our pants. But looking back, two things I think became really important.

One was authenticity. Be the same person at home that you are in public so that your kids don't see duplicity. Because if they see that, what they really see is phoniness and they think that the public person you are is not a real person. And that you're play acting and you have to be authentic, which means they see your best, your worst, and you go through it.

And sometimes you have to apologize for the person you are. The other thing is that give them uninterrupted attention. When my kids were little, I would take each one of the three of my kids to breakfast once a week, just one-on-one. We didn't go to places that were fancy.

It's usually McDonald's or some play, maybe a donut. It wasn't about the food. It wasn't about breakfast. It was about time. And I remember my daughter, when I was running for president, was being interviewed by the New York Times, and I read her quote and it touched me. She was asked, tell me about your dad, what you remember about your teenage years.

She said, my dad was governor. Everybody wanted a piece of him. He had every reason to give every single day to everybody who was lined up to see him. But no matter what, my dad would take me to breakfast, just like he did when I was a little girl. And no matter how many people were waiting to see him, that was time that he took with me. But I realized that love is spelled T-I-M-E. You cannot substitute it. When I hear parents say, well, I don't have a lot of time to spend with my kids, but I spend quality time. And I think, no, no, no, no, no.

There's no such thing. Quality time is the result of quantity of time. And the greatest moments of quality are the unexpected moments when it happens organically because you were there.

That I think is important. Amen. That was so beautiful. That was worth it.

Yeah, that was great. These are young kids. I was going to say, we've got young kids over here, so we're like, writing notes. Okay. I'm writing that season of life, so it's helpful.

It's helpful. So amazing. As we wrap up, we've got just maybe a minute or two left. Governor Huckabee and then maybe Dr. Shaw, what do believers need to do in order to make a difference? Especially as we're headed toward elections, you know, the world is crazy.

People are divided. What do we as believers need to do in order to capture the culture? My simple answer is take a stand.

That's right. You know, just take a stand. Don't be obnoxious. Don't yell at people, scream at people, or make them feel small because you believe differently. But with love and compassion, let people know what you believe, but more importantly, why you believe it, why you think it's important. But do it with a broken heart and with an humble spirit.

And I do believe it has an impact. Amen. Amen.

Well, that's perfect. I would add that don't lose hope. You know, the Holy Spirit is a spirit of hope. And sometimes as a pastor, I've seen people feel hopeless.

So things happen and they feel like, well, that's it. We tried, or it's not going to be. Well, God is still sovereign.

That's right. He is still on his throne, not for a moment. He is, you know, wringing his hands wondering what's going to happen next. How are we going to get this? God is in control. So don't lose heart. And as Governor Huckabee said, you know, go out there and make a difference. Pray. Talk to people. That's right.

That to me is don't lose heart. We'll get those Pop-Tarts to you later. Anything you want to plug before we leave?

Any websites, anything you're doing you want to plug? You know, I do a newsletter. It comes out twice a day. It's free. People can get it at mikehuckabee.com. Subscribe to it. There's a sub stack version that doesn't have advertising.

Some people like that. It's a subscription, but the free version is supported by advertising. And you know, people would send to their email inbox twice a day. There's a lot of news and analysis of the day. Hope you guys enjoyed today's episode of the show.

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