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That's MightyMuscadine.com and use that promo code, T-O-D-A-Y. You're listening to Clearview Today with Dr. Abbadon Shah, the daily show that engages mind and heart for the gospel of Jesus Christ. I'm Ryan Hill.
I'm John Galantis. You can find us online at ClearviewTodayShow.com. Or if you have any questions for Dr. Shah or suggestions for new topics, send us a text to 252-582-5028. Or you can email us at contact at ClearviewTodayShow.com.
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I don't think so. I think it's Apple podcast. It's Apple podcast. Wherever you get your podcasting content from, leave us a five star review. Back in my day, we had to get our Apple podcast from the iTunes store. The year was 2003. The movie that was out was Shrek. And I watched it in the theaters and I went home and I downloaded a podcast.
It was the future of radio. Anyway. Oh my.
If y'all know what to do, just leave us some reviews. The verse of the day today is coming from Isaiah chapter six, verse three. And one cried to another and said, Holy, holy, holy is the Lord of hosts.
The whole earth is full of his glory. There's a reason this theme keeps showing up in the Bible. It's all over the Psalms.
It's all over Revelation. It's because what we're going to be doing for eternity. And when I really got my head around that, you know, we have a guy here at Clearview who kind of helps coach our worship team and who kind of coaches me as a young worship leader. And when he told me that, that what we're doing truly is designed to be done for all of eternity, is perhaps the most important training that you can get here on earth is how to worship God appropriately and how to worship him properly.
That changed my entire perspective. And when I read that holy, holy, holy is the Lord of hosts. The whole earth is full of his glory. And I think about the time that we're going to spend, the endless time that we're going to spend around his throne.
My heart just swells. It's something different. And it just makes me think of worship much differently.
Yeah. Worship is powerful. And there's a reason that worship is emphasized and commanded throughout Scripture. And worship through music. So there are a lot of people who are listening that might be like, Oh, music isn't my thing. I don't sing, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. Or that music is an inappropriate way to worship God. I didn't realize there's actually people out there who believe that. That you should only worship with your voice.
That's crazy. But worship through music is commanded through Scripture because music does something. It brings us together. It unites us. It focuses our minds and our hearts. And there's a reason that God has gifted us music so that we can turn it around and offer it as an offering of worship to him.
And John, you said it best. That's training for what we're going to be doing for eternity. Now that doesn't mean we're going to be sitting up on a cloud like a cherub in a little glowing loincloth, singing forever and ever. But it does mean that we're going to be operating in a spirit of worship forever.
That's right. So you better get used to the idea of worship now. And if you need some help doing that, you can get the Date the Word app on your phone. And every single day you can get verses just like this one, designed really to keep you in God's Word. To keep your heart constantly seeking him and hungering after his Word.
You can do that by going to the Apple Store or by going to Google Play and downloading the app for free right now. Every single day connects today's date to God's Word with the hope of making it more memorable for you. That's right. Well, today is Monday. And you know what that means. It's time for our Monday segment. That's all the small things. This is the part of our show where we talk about these little things in life that God has given us to enjoy. And I've got to tell you, something has really been making me not too happy lately, but it has given me the goal to go back to. And that is, when I walk into a room and I just see a blank table, a clear countertop, if you will, my heart just swells within me.
Just like we were talking about this, when I think about worship before eternity, I get a similar, albeit smaller, joy, should I say, out of a clear countertop. Now, I'm looking at this table here. We've got cups, we've got hats, we've got a little phone thing, I've got the little stream deck.
Microphones, papers, books you can't see off camera. It's a little cluttered, but fine. Well, and largely functional. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Everything here serves a purpose.
I look over there, you're not going to be able to see it on camera, but that's over there in the editorial production zone. That's bad. That's a nightmare.
That makes me, there's cables, there's plants, there's monitors, speakers, all this kind of stuff, wires, adapters. It makes me unwell in my spirit. It makes me feel bad to me.
So, at home, same thing. My wife, and I was not this way, but I have become this way over time. Because she, and I think a lot of women, when they see a clear countertop, the house does not have to be clean. It doesn't have to be organized. It just has to appear that way.
Yes, oh yeah. When they come home and they just see a clear countertop, clear table, the joy of the Lord is upon them. And I have become that way to where now, when I walk into the sound booth, I want it to be completely clean. I don't want anything, like if a little paper is out of line, it bothers me, so I've got to fix it. And so, I'm just wondering now, because we're in a time of transition where there's a new building coming, nothing is clean.
Nothing is going to be clean. No, no, no. Look at that. Is that in the switch? It is?
Okay. So, there's Nick. If you're watching the video... Also, shout out to Nick. That's the first time some of you have seen what he looks like.
Yeah, that's Dr. Shah's son, Nicholas Shah. So, okay. Let's just get a breakdown.
I see batteries, cables, switches, some of that stuff has to be there. Empty water bottle! Look, look, look. Hate, hate, hate. Double hate. Load entirely.
Load entirely. There's SD cards. I think two of those are mine, by the way. Trash. I mean, this is... Here's the better question. Why am I going to publicize our trashiness?
I don't know. We've got a guest coming in, by the way. It's time to clean up. We've got to get this cleaned up before Stu Epperson, who really is the CEO of the network that we're on.
This is a big deal. Yeah, let's get this taken care of. Yeah, let's take a break and get this taken care of. We're going to take a quick cleaning break, and then we'll bring Dr. Shah and our special guest in.
We'd love to hear from you guys about your workstation. Do you keep it messy, or do you keep it neat? No, y'all keep it messy.
2-5-2-5-8-2-5-0-2-8, or visit us online at clearviewtodayshow.com. We'll be right back. We'll be right back.
Amen. Let's hop back into the show. Welcome back to Clear View Today with Dr. Abbadan Shah, the daily show that engages mind and heart for the gospel of Jesus Christ.
You can visit us online at clearviewtodayshow.com, or if you have any questions or suggestions for new topics, send us a text at 2-5-2-5-8-2-5-0-2-8. That's right, and we are here with Dr. Abbadan Shah, who is a PhD in New Testament textual criticism, professor at Carolina University, author, full-time pastor, and the host of today's show, alongside very, very special guests. You want to do the honors, my friend? Very special guest, our personal friend and the owner and CEO of The Truth Network, Mr. Stu Epperson, Jr. Pew, pew, pew, pew, pew. Oh, everybody, applause, everybody. Stu Epperson. Good to see you, my friend.
Our studio audience approved. He looks like the president. He's like, thank you very much. He'll be signing autographs later. Well, Stu Epperson is here with us this afternoon.
Stu, it's so good to see you. Listen, we were talking earlier in the intro today about clean countertops, how good it makes you feel when you come in, and you see there's no clutter on the desk, there's no papers spilling all over the place, no desk toys don't fall over, batteries, cables, all that stuff. That very rarely happens anywhere I'm involved. How often does that happen over at The Truth Network?
You walk in, just clean countertops all over the place. Well, let us know you're coming. Well, it's interesting. I walked off the air the other day and I had three guys in there pushing buttons because somehow the SRN News feed didn't come.
They're trying to find out what the problem is, but it's a work in progress. Oh, yeah, constantly. I think there's definitely an important to be organized and to have that cleanliness, but I think the godliness definitely trumps everything, getting the message out.
Sometimes it's sticky and sometimes you step in chewing gum on your way to the mission and you don't have time to get it off. That's right. You make that noise the whole way there. Amen. Your office is the, if I can say this, is the epitome of just pristine cleanliness, but do you ever walk out? It is.
I think it is. It typically is. Your desk has very rarely got stuff on it. Do you ever go home or somewhere or even just go to other parts of the church and you're like, man, this place is just spotless? Or is it always there's cables, there's papers, there's stuff? You guys have changed so much through the years.
Really? I remember the first time I was like, oh my goodness, this is chaos. This is chaos. But now, I mean, they keep it spotless. They have it organized. John's wife gets back there and she'll have everything labeled and put together, and she gets pretty angry when people mess it up.
I was actually going to say that. It wasn't that we changed. It's that women started actually doing stuff here. Ryan's wife as well. She was with the nursery and the children's church.
I mean, she does a phenomenal work. My wife is here organizing the resource center with the books and all those things. It's great to have those ladies. That's what I was going to say.
I was going to say, thank God for our wives. I listened to you last week driving through Lake Norman on the new 98.5. It was so cool. Of course, I wanted to take videos and take pictures and text.
I'm driving, so I better be careful. I just enjoyed the chemistry. I love hearing from this man of God. I just love what God's doing here at Clearview.
Amen. We are excited to have you on the show. On today's episode, we've been doing this together for a while, but we wanted to give our listeners a chance to hear from you and to hear from you, Dr. Shaw, about what is our mission collectively? What are we trying to do together with the Truth Network, the Clearview Today show? In light of that, maybe Stu and then Dr. Shaw, what is the daily encouragement for our listeners and our viewers today? My daily encouragement, I've asked three people today this question, one on the phone and two in person. How is your soul? I've been drilling deep in Mark 8 where Jesus says, What would a man give in exchange for his soul?
We have a lot of speakers, commencement speakers, graduation speakers, motivating, challenging the kids, Hey, go out there, love yourself, find yourself, kick the world's butt, earn a bunch of money, and all of this. And Jesus kind of gave a different commencement message in Mark 8. He said, deny yourself, take up your cross, follow me. But then he asked this question, this value question, What would a man give in exchange for his soul?
And so that just convicted me. And I thought, in the way I asked this of a high-level executive earlier today, I said, you know, very few people ask me this. It's more about how's the family, how are the kids, where are they going to school, what's going on, how's the construction, things like that. But I said, I just want to ask you, how is your soul?
And I really hope you don't ask me that, because that's a little invasive and a little uncomfortable. But anyway, that's been my thought, and God's been working on me recently to kind of live there, because there is nothing more valuable. That's right, that's 100 percent right. The body's going to fade, everything in our world says, Make your body better, right?
We say, Heaven's so great, then why are we emphasizing material in worldly things? It's not that we shouldn't work out. Obviously, at least three out of the four of us do. Look at these guys, look at these three specimens right here. You don't work out, Steve? Well, I just don't want to show off.
I can put some plates in the air. There you go, there you go. So that's my challenge. How is your soul, and how is the spiritual that which is eternal? 2 Corinthians 4.18, we focus on things unseen rather than things that are seen.
Things which are seen are temporal, things which are unseen, like your soul, are eternal. That's right. It lines up with what I see every day, and I encourage people to find Christ. That's right. And that's the goal of our church, is to make Christ visible.
Exactly what Stu said just now, seeing things that are visible versus invisible, we're making Christ visible. That's right. That's our goal.
That's the whole point. Even right now in our building, we have different organizations meeting for different purposes. We let them use this place, but our ultimate goal is that someone walking through here, through a conversation, maybe just looking at a notice board or picking up a bulletin that's lying there, or actually having a conversation with them, which I think is very important. They will come to see Christ and their need for salvation. That is the heart of everything we do.
Amen, amen. I think people in ministry especially, it's easy to lose sight of the stakes. You know what I mean? The stakes are, well, if we don't do this right, not as many people will attend church.
Or if we don't say this the right way, or if we don't get organized, then people will leave, and they'll go to some other church. And it's easy to forget that the stakes are eternal. You know what I mean? The stakes of the battle are way higher than we give credit for. And I love the way you said it, Stu, that the soul is the most precious thing that you have is your soul. So you've got to think, even doing this radio show right now, the goal isn't to get people listening so that numbers on the screen go up or that more money comes in. The goal is that people would hear and be saved.
You know what I mean? I love it. And I love how that ties in with the name of the ministry here. And every time I've been around you all, I always have a clear view of what's really important. And this is everything you're doing from behind the pulpit to your great books you've published to your teaching at the seminary level to the discipleship happening with your team, your leaders, and all of that, and on this radio, on the podcast, the broadcast, you are giving folks a clear view of what, or really more importantly, who is important.
You know, Jesus Christ. And so I would like to publicly thank you for that and how it's impacted my own life. Thank you. We are grateful to you.
We say that often, and I hope it never becomes just rote. We really mean it. God has used you tremendously to be a blessing to us.
Hundreds. So that we can be a blessing to our community and to the world. And this radio show has been just amazing. Just an answer to prayer.
That's right. Praise God. Thank you. And while we've got you here, since you are a captive audience, much of our audience does not know your story, does not know kind of your journey through radio. You were kind of born into this world. So will you just take a minute and just share with our listeners and our viewers kind of what makes Stu Epperson? What has led you to where you are? What is the story thus far? Yes, the story of Stu.
That's a great question. For the first probably dozen or so years of my life, I had a great test-a-phony. I love that. And then it became a testimony.
I've got to get quicker on the draw with that. In the Luke account of the publican and the Pharisee, I was the one praying, Lord, thank you, I'm not like that scally woman. I was the one that was not going to get to heaven.
I was too good to go to heaven. And I had scriptures memorized. I probably led people to Christ. I had done missions trips and I had led VBS, and I could fit in just right, answer all the questions and all that. God really got a hold of my heart, and God really transformed me as an early teen to realize, wait a second, I need the righteousness of Christ.
And I wasn't so much an outwardly unrighteous person. You know, Lord, think I'm not like those kids partying or their homes messed up. I had a great Christian home. I was so blessed it's unreal. Mom and Dad, Dad had a Christian radio. Him and my uncle started a Christian radio company, Salem Media, 50 years ago. So I'm like a son of the pioneer. And you have great ministry, and you're a pedigree, and God's really blessed. I think the older we get, the more we're grateful for that. Maybe younger, a little earlier on, so we were like, oh no, I've got to go do that. And so I never really dreamed or visioned myself in broadcasting, because my dad and uncle did it so well, and Mom was involved too, until the Lord changed my heart in college and did something pretty cool there to get me a part of starting a campus radio station, of all things. And all of a sudden, I just like, I love doing this.
This is so cool. What year was that? This was circa 1992, and I'm taking a class to just have fun. The professor was like the absent-minded professor, an older guy, who was really a lot smarter than we thought he was. And it was an elective. I was a communications major, and I took so much Bible. I was almost a Bible major. I was cis-close, but I took a lot of Bible courses, which I was really thankful now in what I do. But I had to take one more communications course in my elective, and the only one available at the only time that I could take with my fiance and my sister and all my best buddies and kind of goof off with a really soft professor was Broadcast 101. I'm like, hey, I'm going to breeze through this easy-peasy.
I know exactly everything he said. I was going to say, I've heard this story before, but I've been in this all my life. I'm like, I'm going to have no problem. Day one of class, I walk in, and we're in this beautiful master's university, John MacArthur School of California, and we're in these under-the-oaks, this classroom, and we're in these little wooden desks. We've got our back sacks and our books out, and so the professor gets up and says, okay, here's what we're doing for the class this semester. I'm already cutting jokes and writing just to cut loose. We didn't have cell phones. That's probably good.
Or fall asleep. He says, we are starting a Christian campus radio station on this campus. That's going to be our project, and you're going to be great based on that. Wow. No pressure at all. Wow. No pressure, and there's maybe 15, 20 of us in the class, and so I was whatever. Then he says, now leadership starts at the top.
Who's going to be our manager? Well, you know my reputation, and you know that everyone knew who I was. I'm a senior at this time. College senior. I was on my way to play pro basketball. I actually had some interest in some European teams. I was on my way to go to law school, go to seminary.
There's a really powerful communication school out there, Claremont had, and I was looking at all these options, or go work somewhere, or just go on the mission field. Suddenly, everything changed. He says, leadership starts out, who's our leader? I kind of just skulked underneath that, tried to hide underneath it.
Everyone looked at me. He's the one. He's the guy.
He's the manager. He's the general manager, so I've got to find an engineer. I've got to find sound guys. I've got to find pastors to preach.
I've got to find a sales guy who will go sell advertising in a little local community. So I thought, oh no, and then it was like an oh me, and then it was like an amen. All of a sudden. The biggest thing as an early teen, like I mentioned, when the Lord really changed me from the inside out. I had plenty of outside conformity, but he transformed my heart, and then it was now up to him. Even though it was tough getting to these spots, but the Lord just used all that to set me on where I am today.
There were a whole lot of others. I went and worked at Secular Radio for a long time in Winston-Salem, and I loved it. I worked for the biggest Secular Radio company, iHeartMedia, and I sold Country Western and Newstalk and all that, and made a lot of money, but there's some emptiness in me. Because I was listening to programming and selling programming that wasn't soul transforming. And you know, faith comes from hearing, hearing by the Word of God. And so I needed soul care, like we opened up talking about.
How's your soul? And so I left that job and bought a little station for my dad that was kind of dying. It was separate from Salem.
See, Salem never had any stations in Salem. Winston-Salem. It's like, Daddy, Uncle Ed, I'll go work for you. You want me to go to Atlanta?
I'll go clean the control room in LA. You know, but like, God put a burn in my heart for the Bible Belt. You know, what's the Bible Belt? Well, everyone's a Christian, but hardly anyone knows what that means.
You know, it's a mile wide, but an inch deep. And so God just put it on my heart when I woke up at four in the morning. In the second job, he says, truth, truth, truth for the triad, truth for the triangle, truth for Charlotte. And so that set off a series of things, and this station opened up where we started the Truth Network 25 years ago this year. And in our heart, the answer to that prayer is being realized right here, right now, just inches away from me, because our passion is to put godly men of God who study the Bible, who hold to a high value of God's Word in the gospel, and who preach it boldly, unapologetically. And so that's what we've set out to do, is put friends like you on the radio, Dr. Shaw, that are faithful to do that. And so that's kind of the whole mission of the Truth Network. And then to mobilize our listeners to be plugged into churches like this, where they can be built up, discipled, and then sent out into the world, because there's 3.2 billion who've never heard the gospel.
And that's really kind of the biggest thing that we're passionate about right now, is that mobilization part. That's awesome. And I know, Dr. Shaw, that's similar to your story as well. Very similar. I'm listening to this and I'm going, wow. I was honestly thinking y'all had met and wrote it out beforehand.
Did you compare notes or what? Yeah, I mean, I came to Tocqueville Falls College and joined the broadcast journalism program. I was a communications major.
But I took that program because I was looking for the most secular degree there, because Dad wanted me to go and study the Bible for a couple of years before I'd go anywhere else. And so came there, and in 1992, we had a campus station, and this was part of our grade in broadcast class, is to run the campus station. Of course, they had the WRAF. They had that network.
I mean, that was different. But the campus radio station was going to be run by students and led by students and all of that. Right. And so we began that.
I don't know if it's still there or not. But I was not called to be the manager of that station because I had no clue about broadcasting. But I learned and developed some skills that are helping me today. I would say that 99% of all radio media is felt need driven. Right. And you know what?
I'm not knocking that. I want to hear something. You know, I was turning my Truth Network station on the way up here, and then I heard this song, I want to know what love is. I'm not going to sing anymore because then I will drive your ratings right into the fork. Oh, they just took a drop. I can't believe that. But you know, once in a while, you want to hear something, an oldie, goodie.
You hear a couple of guys cutting up in the morning. But when you turn on Truth Network, it's not felt need, although there's some fun stuff. It's real need. That's right.
That's 100%. And it's people are here. People are here. Listen, I spoke at a ministry group last week, and I wasn't there to speak. I was there to support a guy who got saved, who used to be my customer when I was in secular radio. And he called me and said, Stu, I got saved. I'm leaving this ministry group, coming to my church. I walk in. They all love Truth Network.
It was like a love fest. And I'm getting up to leave, and a gentleman puts his hand on my shoulder and says, Stu, I'm going to tell you something. He says, you don't know me, but I was listening to AM 830 in 2003.
I never heard anything like this, any kind of teachers like this before. Wow. And he said, I just found this Truth Network station.
I was listening. He says, I can take you to the parking space in the Food Lion that I pulled into to surrender my life to full-time ministry. Wow. That is amazing. And he's telling me this with tiered eyes, and he said, thank you for what you're doing.
He says, I'm serving in this church today because of the influence of that in my life. And I'm just like, wow, I'm done for the day. I'm going to go home. Yeah, that's it.
No more for me. I still had three more meetings, a coffee with a pastor, and then I had to do the show Truth Talk Live. Yeah. And it still had a whole bunch of stuff going on, but I've been riding that wave from that testimony. Wow. Incredible. Just how God works. There's miracle stories in you guys' lives. Yeah.
Yes. And how God brought you here in just this church. You just showed me around the church what God's doing at Clearview. Listeners, I don't care where you're listening.
You've got to come to Henderson, North Carolina. You might not leave. Amen.
You might not, man. A lot of folks, they move somewhere, they think, okay, now I've got to find a church. But the way I'm seeing Clearview is I think people are thinking, hey, there's a church there. I'm going to go there. Amen. Now let me see where I can find a job.
I can teach. But I want to get the nucleus of a church in my life and a Clearview of God's will for my family, my marriage, my children, my grandchildren. And that's what's happening here.
That's what's so exciting about being on your campus. That's why we love Jefferson because you say exactly what's on our hearts because that's the goal is to have a place where the truth is proclaimed that people actually are drawn to this place because they want to worship here. They want to hear.
They want to raise their families. They want to disciple lost people in their lives. So that is the heart of who we are.
That's right. And that's a big part of what we do, and Dr. Shaw, you mentioned earlier about different organizations using the facility right now. It's been too long since the church was the center of culture, and there was a time past where that was true, and that time has unfortunately gone away.
So much of culture has moved away from the church. But that's our desire. I know that's your desire, Dr. Shaw, that you shared before. That we would be a hub for people. We would be the nucleus that draws people in, and life and things are shaped here and impacted from this campus. Right. Church is the body, right? People. But at the same time, the location is what we're referring to when you use that word.
Church is that we're allowing people to and inviting people to come and use the space here. So right now there's a store that is having their meetings here. There's also a blood drive going on. There's other events happening this evening. Yeah, I was going to say, not later this week. It's happening right now as we're recording. As we speak.
It's happening. There's two different factions. I saw them coming in here. I'm like, what are these people doing at church? We don't allow those kind of people in here. But you guys are a light, and these people are coming to church, and they say, hey, these people love us, and they're welcoming us, and their arms are open. And just imagine what happens when they come back Sunday with their family. That's right.
100%. That's the goal. That's the goal, is that they come to know Christ, or at least are drawn one step closer to the Gospel.
And that's our goal. Back in, I want to say, 2002 or 2003, somewhere there, this was right before church. And our location was not here. This was another side of town where the church was built and had been there for 40, 50 years. And I was teaching Sunday school, one of the men's classes, and absolutely nobody showed up. So I'm sitting there, and I decided to pray, and I said, God, I don't know what's going on.
What will it take? Is this the place where we're going to build our lives and touch this community for the rest of our lives? We don't know. And at the same time, I was reading Charles Spurgeon. I was reading one of his messages. And I was reading a message that he had preached on John chapter 12, verse 32. And the passage I have it open in front of me, it says, and I, if I am lifted up from the earth, will draw all peoples to myself. That was about 20 years ago, and that has proven to be so true, making Christ visible. That's what we have to do.
Lift him up and see what will happen. Amen. Thank you both so much for today's episode. Hopefully today was encouraging to you all at home.
If it was, write in and let us know, 252-582-5028, we'd love hearing from you. Or you can visit us online at cleerviewtodayshow.com. Don't forget, you can partner with us financially on that same website. Scroll to the bottom, click that donate button, and let us know what's coming from our Clearview Today Show family. Lots of great content coming your way for the rest of this week. Make sure you guys tune in. We love you guys. We'll see you tomorrow on Clearview Today.
