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How are you feeling these days? What's your life like?
So sleepy all the time. I'm sleepy, but I'm also energized by. I think this whole last year of my life has really reminded me that I just love doing what I'm doing, even through the moments that are a little bit. um tiresome or annoying at times, it always takes me back to like I love being on stage and singing songs that mean something to me.
So um so yeah, it's it's just reminded me how special all of this is and how I'm lucky to do it. Are you able in this moment to step back and appreciate all of it or is it just moving so fast? Like a small percentage of it right now. But no, I mean, anytime someone's like, Have you celebrated? I'm like, No, maybe when I'm dead.
I don't know. Like, I just right now I've really been so excited about what I'm making that I want to continue making things. And that requires a lot of focus and dedication. And I'm I'm like, I'm kind of captain of my own ship. No one's like forcing me to do all this.
It's really just, again, I love doing it. But yeah, I think in a couple months I'll be able to look back on it a little bit easier and be like, wow, that happened. I think something that was funny the other night, the Emmys were on and they said my name during the intro of the Emmys and I wasn't like fully understanding what was happening, but that was like the first moment in a long time that I was like, wow, I didn't realize like. I didn't realize like what was happening in my life until I got the little shout out at the Emmys. You know the intro when they're like just shouting out random people?
Like, I wasn't even there. That was just like a very weird moment to me where I was like, oh, I think really exciting things are happening. Because you're part of the cultural conversation right now. I guess so it seems at the Emmys. Yeah.
Which is lovely. I want to talk about the captain of your own ship thing in a little bit. But first, and this kind of goes to that, there was an article written about you recently where you said Sabrina wasn't built in a day. And I love that idea. There are some people out there who might think you're an overnight success.
And they're still there now watching this. Yes. Not true. No. I think.
I think it's very funny to me. You brought up an interesting point of the people that have grown up with me. You know, the people that are my age, or maybe slightly younger than me, or slightly older than me, they really have seen kind of my journey from the beginning. I know people that have been following me since I was 11 years old posting covers on YouTube. And then I've also seen people that have been following me since I started working on a TV show and then post-TV show my first tour when I was 16.
And all the in-betweens, all the festivals where I was playing a pre-show, not the main stage, and I was like, I hope one day I can play that stage. You know, those things are kind of happening right now. And yeah, I think for the people that think it's an overnight thing, they're just not tuned in or they just haven't done the research, which is fine, but maybe they will after this. Who knows? Yeah, I mean, truth is you're 25 years old, and this is your sixth album.
Yeah. How does that even happen? I used to be upset about that. Like I used to be upset about having six albums, especially at the age of 25, because I knew that if I started later, I creatively would have made very different choices. But then when I look at it now, And I see how much those early albums meant to my fans when I was younger and I was the same age as them dealing with those things at that time.
I don't regret it. I mean, maybe I don't like listening to it, but I don't regret it. And if anything, it really inspires me the fact that I can be making music for this long and people are still interested in what I have to say after all this time. I think that's been really special and rewarding. Yeah, I mean it's been what a decade now?
Yeah, um I don't know. It makes me seem very old. Um no I just I I was just one of those kids that popped out of the womb knowing exactly what I wanted to do. It doesn't mean that it was easy and it doesn't mean that I knew how I was going to do it. I just think that when things are meant to be, you find your way there blindly.
Like, you don't need to know how to do it, you will be guided. Like, you know what I mean? I think universally I've always felt like I had that relationship with myself and with the universe that's like, I just know that this is meant to be, so it'll happen. And I just have to work really hard until it does. Yeah.
So go back. You grew up in Pennsylvania and started singing just off the bat. Yeah, I feel like so many people from Pennsylvania that I grew up idolizing, like Christina Guillera and Taylor Swift. And those were some of my first inspirations. They were both Pennsylvania girls.
And so it's really interesting.
Now I think of how much my roots of my music are stemmed from growing up in Pennsylvania. I always had this... folky element to the things that I do or just even more organic to the way I like to write songs.
So I grew up in Pennsylvania, middle of nowhere, like very much in the middle of the woods. And we had like four stray cats and I have three older sisters and yeah, we were all kind of like my mom put us in dance lessons. She was a dancer.
So the idea of performing and entertaining came at a very young age. I was probably two in my first dance lesson. And then when I was six years old, I sang in my first uh talent show in school. And I sang Part of Your World by The Little Mermaid. in a mermaid outfit, naturally.
Of course. course. And from that, like from that year on, I sang every year at my talent show and just kind of became known in my school as the little singer girl. And yeah, it was just, it was a, I don't know. Again, like I said, it would be like I'd be in restaurants and I would be asking to sing people happy birthday.
Like, I just wanted a crowd. I just wanted an audience. Any chance to sing for an audience. Yeah. So when you started posting videos on YouTube of you singing popular songs, what were you hoping for?
What were you thinking?
Well, when you're that young, I think you're just. fascinated by how you look in a camera. Like I ha like genuinely you're like looking at the camera being like, Wow, that's me on it and it's like not that crazy. But I think it was it was that combined with my love of taking songs that I loved so much and making them my own. And yeah, my my dad helped me set up a YouTube account, which Seems like probably scary to parents watching this, but my parents were very like, you know, they they monitored what was going on.
I I didn't have like full control at that point. But I posted uh I kept posting covers and I kept like just really falling in love with The idea of sharing art and and using that to maybe make people happy. That's all I mean there's so many clips of me when I was little and you know my parents would ask me like why do you want to do this? I'd be like I just want to make people happy and I think I always remind myself of that when I go back to like why am I doing this still? You think that it's still that?
Yeah. I think I think it's definitely morphed into other things over the years and I think now it's it's a personal relationship with myself and it's also just like a love for it. it's like a a good book that you can't put down, you know. You just don't want to put it down.
So that's what I'm doing right now. When did you start writing songs? I started, well, my first song that I wrote that was very bad was when I was 10 years old. And it was called Lights. It was just about wanting to perform and be in the lights, essentially.
So that was the first concept. And then from that point on, it was really like. Again, I I would be so inspired by the music that my mother and my father raised me on. I'd say more so my mother. My dad was a big Rush fan.
My dad did introduce me to the Beatles and Queen, which I'm so grateful for. My mom loved Patsy Klein and Etta James and Dolly Parton and Carol King and Those are now really, really big influences to me in my life.
So that's when I kind of started. And then. I think when I was quite young it it it took this turn of I was because I was from Pennsylvania, my parents had no idea what was what this world was. There's a lot of people that will it interject. and try to take control.
of a young, impressionable woman who's figuring out who she is and telling her what she should look like and who she should be and how she should sound. And so when I was around 12 years old, that was something that I was dealing with and struggling with. And I knew deep down the kind of songs I wanted to sing. And it was a journey. It was a journey of giving a little and taking a little and then to the point where I really started to become the Taurus that I am and really make my voice known in those situations where maybe when I was younger I would have been more fearful to stand up and say exactly what I wanted and make exactly what I wanted to make.
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See Midmobile.com. I mean, Espresso was number one on Spotify until a song knocked it out, which was please, please, please, another one of your songs. Yes, which I'm so, so happy that. I put out Please Is Please at the time that I did, and that it's such a different song. But they live in the same umbrella.
They live in the same universe. I was really excited about that, because I think when I put out Please Who's Please, I was so nervous that someone was gonna say, I don't know who I am as an artist. Because sonically, by the way, one person I'm sure did, but I wasn't reading those comments. Just because they're sonically so different. But if you hear both songs The personality is mine, you know what I mean?
And the words and the experiences, like those are both singular to me, and that's what glued them together. And also, again, like they both have this sort of throwback yet modern production to them in very different ways. But that was so exciting to me, and the fact that. You know, when I wrote Please Who's Please, I was like, I know this is This is special, I just don't know What other people are going to think of it, but I know it's very special.
So I was very happy with the way that it happened. Glad that I trusted my gut. Yeah, trusting your gut. Yeah. So you mentioned comments.
You read the comments that people write on social media?
Sometimes. Why? Um, to hurt my own feelings. No, I don't know. I've I've actually.
This has been such a funny thing to me because it's like.
Sometimes it's useless information and sometimes it's valuable.
Sometimes when I read something mean about myself that's just so blatantly wrong, I can almost go, well, they're just so out of touch. This almost makes me feel a little bit better about like. I don't know, the the fact that I'm not always right and the fact that I sometimes misjudge things. You know, it makes me feel human sometimes when I see how other people are crazy.
So so sometimes when I read it, it makes me feel better, and then other times I read it and it makes me feel sad, and people go, You shouldn't read the comments. And I go, I'm only human and I'm twenty-five and I am, you know, I'm I'm I I would be lying to say that I don't Care? But at the same time, I don't think it's ever stopped me. Like Just because I read something negative that someone says about me and it hurts my feelings does not mean I take it to heart and I don't wake up motivated the next day to keep doing what I want to do. It just means it's like, oh, you know I want to block that person, you know, which is fine.
People have that in real life. Like, I think about this people in a in their own workspaces and their own work environments, you know, that there's People that aren't fans of you, and there's people that are, and you still have to exist in that universe with people that you get along with and love you, and people that. You're not their cup of tea and that's okay.
So this is just my own version of that. Just like a lot more people and people that aren't always super articulate. And don't know how to spell all the time, but it's okay. Speaking of not knowing how to spell, my absolute favorite line from Slim Pickens is, and my daughter. They're there and they are.
Yes, they're there and they are. This boy doesn't even know the difference between they're there and they are. was like I mean, it it it came out in a sentence because that's literally what it is. You know? I have so many situations.
I could pull up all the receipts right now on my phone and show them, but I won't do that. Where it's like you can't tell me off and use the wrong form of your. It's not working. I just don't buy it then. You know?
I want to talk about because You started at such a young age, and I you know, we've seen it happen over and over again where people who start young Encounter pitfalls in their lives. And I think it's a credit to your mom, but I don't want to take the words out of your mouth. But I'm curious how much. I don't know how to phrase it, but how much has your mom helped to keep you grounded? I would give credit to.
I would give credit to my whole family. I mean my sisters are really important in that. My mother is so important in that. I'm gonna give my father a bone as well. Um I grew up in a family of of women plus my father, so it's just like the the the feminine powers are so strong.
Um But truthfully, My mom was so good at being supportive and being there for me when I need her, but not being a stage mom and not being overbearing and not being, you have to do this because I want to live my dreams through you, but more, I just want to see my daughter live her dreams. It makes me like emotional sometimes 'cause she's so selfless um and has been that way her whole life with me and my sister.
So yeah. Not gonna be I love her so much. Oh, it's sweet. What do you think is the best advice she ever gave you? Um Well Verbally, I mean my my mom and dad always called me Bumblebee growing up to remind me to be humble.
That's always been my nickname. And no matter what I do, just remain super humble. And I think that has kind of Spread across a lot of the things that I do, it's it's m Less about always being humble, but more just about being grounded and knowing that, you know. not to take everything so seriously all the time.
So that's been really helpful. And then also I'm like still on like three sentences ago. Um that and then and then just again, like the way my mom is such a my mom's such a positive person, you know. She has such a great sense of humor. She loves my little cute outfits.
Sh you know, she doesn't I d I don't think she's ever made me feel like what I was doing was too much ever. I'm very grateful to my parents from the time I was really young and my sisters as well. Like They never told me to stop singing when I was like singing around the house all the time. And it can get annoying hearing a little kid like repeat the same part of the song over and over. I don't know if you've experienced this, but they never told me to stop singing.
And I think that like Psychologically really probably. helped me.
So, yeah, love them for that. What's it like to share that? I mean, you said that was so perfect what you said, that she wasn't trying to live her dreams through you. She wanted you to live your dreams.
So, what's it like now that you're living your dreams? It's so sweet. I mean, it's just this balance of. She's mind blown and also it's like Like What curtains do you want in your bedroom? You know what I mean?
It's just like, it's such a beautiful, like, normalcy to the fact that it's like. I knew you'd get here. I'm so proud of you. Let's figure out when to set this doctor's appointment, make sure you're healthy. Do you know what I mean?
So I think that's also just like, she's still so. Great at being a mother, which is really Lovely for me. Is this what you dreamed of starting out? What do you when you say this? This, what you have now, you're about to embark on this arena tour, you have the number one album.
Is this what you dreamed of starting out? I remember very vividly when I was around ten years old. I saw Miley Cyrus play She was 16. and I was like, I want to play Arenas Like that's That's what I wanna do. I wanna make music.
I wanna play arenas. And and I thought I was gonna do it by 16 and and reality definitely settled and it took me a little bit longer. But I'm playing them now and it's like a little uh It's like you're talking to your childhood self, and it's really sweet. What I say, it's like. This is what I dreamed of in the sense of Like, um The the numbers are So cool.
I just got here yesterday. Like, when I see my name on the charts, I'm like, I got here on Tuesday. Like, I've not experienced that long enough for it to really mean something to me emotionally. It's so cool, and it's so lovely for the people that I make my music with that we can celebrate those accomplishments. But for me, seeing an arena full of people is.
So rewarding and just so fun. I can't even express like the feeling when you get off stage after that. It's just it's euphoric.
So Yeah, I would say that's that's definitely what I dreamed of as a child.
Well, let me ask you this. What would you say to that Little Girl Making YouTube videos. Don't wear the fedora. Yeah. When you think you look really cool.
'Cause I had like so many faces where I just wore the wrong things. What would I say to her? I mean, for me, it's it's a It's so much more than just keep going because truthfully, there are. I can't sit here and act like there hasn't been moments that I've just been like.
so defeated or so, you know felt so not myself. I think it's really beautiful that all of this is happening at a moment where I feel like very much myself and I feel very grateful to the people that I have around me and my friends, my family, the people on my team, because that is That is so exciting to me. But yeah, I think I would say to her, you know. Be patient, which has always been kind of the the story for me. Just patience is a virtue.
So When you released emails You said that you were in a different place emotionally than you are now. Can you explain that? Like, what happened? for that album and this album that's so different emotionally. I think, um What a lot of people don't realize is because I was home schooled and I was working on a T V show from a young age, I never went to, you know, public high school.
I didn't have my heart broken at like a normal age. My first real heartbreak was when I was 21. And so it came much later. And I think that that was such a. It just felt like my world was ending every day.
I know that people that have gone through heartbreak know what that feels like. You just, you can't even look at food without sobbing into it. It's a. It's a very formative experience, but I experienced it a bit later than I think people probably would have thought, because at that time I definitely also shared elements of my life, but it wasn't. It wasn't to the degree that I did in emails I can't send.
In emails I can't send, it felt like it was just like a big old band-aid, you know? And so I think for me it was really important to. I learned so much about myself and why I fixate on people that you know, aren't maybe giving me enough love or people that don't see my value the way I see theirs and You know, all of those relationships where you turn it back on yourself and you try to make it your own fault before you realize maybe it's a them problem or maybe they're experiencing something that has nothing to do with you. And again, and all the like mature headspaces that you find years down the line, still not there, but I think you slowly start to get to those places where you. Wish people well.
You hope they're okay. You can Acknowledge that in a moment you can be mad and jealous and angry and bitter, and that's real, and also get to a place where you. Have a tenderness and a softness in your heart, and you regret ever being angry or mad or jealous. But you don't get to see all those parts. of a human being when you're listening to a two and a half minute song, you get the little snippets of it.
So then when it is something that the rest of the world hears and they pick apart, it's very easy for, you know, people to label it or label you as one thing. But I'm I'm really really happy about the fact that you know Songwriting is my vessel, regardless of if people hear the songs or not, because I'll continue to kind of work through those emotions and those feelings. You know, it just depends on what mood I'm in that day if I want to put them out there. But emails was um. was the kind of first time I felt really Like I was able to be so honest.
Is there ever a part of you that once you release that into the world, depending on how people react, you're like, no, that's not what I meant. course. Absolutely. And then if I respond to that Tweet or something, X. I don't even know what you call it anymore.
If you respond to that, There's so many people that misperceive the response and then it's just like a never ending So sometimes I can't say I'll never respond. To something, just to give myself grace for the future in case I lose my mind. Most of the time It's a little bit easier to just be like, you know what, let them misunderstand you. Let them also let them be a fan of the person they want to be a fan of. 'Cause usually the people that are that are criticizing you, they're so they're they support someone else so much that they want to tear you down to bring the person they love up.
And and I get it, and that's fine. And I just hope that they continue to be a fan of the people they want to and that They just let me do what I do, and they don't have to like it. Like I'm more than happy with with that situation. But I think it it definitely gets a little um Crazy to remind yourself that sometimes when you're in the thick of it. Yeah, I'm sure.
But we can peacefully coexist. We could peacefully go. Yeah, all the different fans and know that there's different artists for different people in the world. You know, there's so many artists that I grew up respecting, but I wasn't a massive fan of. And artists that I would have liked.
Cried and died to be at their shows. It's just there's it's that there's different people for everyone.
So I think we're. we're kind of losing a little bit of that understanding that We're all here for a reason. There isn't going to be one. There isn't gonna be one artist. There's always going to be so many artists doing different things, and that's how music Has always been.
That's how it grows, that's how it gets better, that's how it gets worse, that's how it gets better again. It's just, it's an endless cycle, which. I'm happy about because I enjoy listening to my friends make music and um And the fact that I can call them friends now is also so cool and so special. Yeah, speaking of friends who make music, you were on the Eros tour. Has Taylor given you advice about how to handle this kind of crazy level of fame?
Hm. I mean, she's you just watch her, like, walk in a room and it's it's very easy to understand that she's just so She's so composed, she's graceful, she's gracious, and Yeah, I wouldn't say it's like a verbal thing as much as just like she's very supportive of me and knows who I am as a person and is very supportive of that.
So I'm I'm I'm grateful for that. I think like Again, if we're talking about How to deal with it all. I think everyone has such an individual unique experience that. There's no kind of blanket statement or advice on How to not let it. Rattle you.
You just kind of have to exist and figure out what you can handle and what you don't want to deal with. And again, you... you you just kind of figure it out along the way. I know that sounds a little vague, but I I really do think like you find the people that you surround yourself with that make you feel safe and Go from there. What are you most grateful for?
Oh, um I mean So many things. Truly, so many things. I think if I didn't have laughter, And friendship? I would lose my mind. I've already lost it, but I think I would lose it more.
That's such an important part of all of it to me. Like, if there's just a sense of kind of. There's always going to be stress, there's always going to be anxiety, there's always going to be drama, I think. But for me, like. like being able to laugh about it, being able to like look at it and just kind of find the humor in it and also the love in all of it is really important.
So I would say that. And also caffeine. Because without caffeine, I wouldn't be doing this interview right now. Is it espresso? Uh you know, for me, espresso is my lifeline.
What a lot uh like I actually don't like the taste of espresso, so I I I'm sorry to anyone that I'm letting down. But yeah, that's my lifeline. Like, if I've already had coffee and nothing's working, it's a shot of espresso. It usually does the trick. I'm Jane Pauley.
Thank you for listening. And for more of our extended interviews, follow and listen to Sunday Morning on the free Odyssey app. or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm a monster emergency.
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