After Hours with Amy Lawrence PODCAST: Hour 3

The Lions.

Anything can and will happen. The radio announcer, bless his heart, says the kick's up, it hits the crossbar, it's in. And I, as usual, have to listen to why my Lions have found the most creative way to lose every single time. Hi, I'm Dan Campbell's crazy.

And on the way up, we're gonna buy the kneecap off. I'm 65, I've lived in Detroit my whole life. I'm a big Lions fan. I was live when the Lions won their only championship in 1957. I was only a year old, so I don't remember too much of it.

You don't remember any of it, be honest. The Detroit Lions were so, so, so close. This keeps happening. It doesn't matter who coaches, it doesn't matter who runs it, it doesn't matter who owns it. We're gonna find a way to lose every time. And I just don't know how to deal with it anymore. So I figured I'd ask you, as a Lions fan, what should I possibly do at this point?

Who says we can't get flexed? This is After Hours with Amy Lawrence. New experience for me on Thanksgiving Day. I was with some friends, some friends from my church, and they had a family, a huge family gathering, more than 25 people, when you count the kiddos as well.

It was controlled chaos and it was amazing. And I got to watch these family dynamics, I really enjoyed that. What I didn't realize is that some of the out of towners came from Michigan. And others who don't live there anymore still claim Michigan is home. And so we get this first game on TV, as we're eating our Thanksgiving dinner, and there are people cheering for the Lions where I am. I've never watched a football game with Lions fans.

I actually thought that was a really cool experience. They were passionate about the Lions. Although I did get one of them, excuse me, one of them was a crank pot, who kept saying they're going to lose, no matter what they're going to lose.

They're going to lose, they'll find a way to lose. He was so cranky crankerton. It would have been better if he'd been in a food coma or something.

But yeah, he would walk away. And so when the Lions continued to make this a game, he was still bah humbug, but at least wouldn't walk away anymore. So that was fun for me, and I think this was a great game.

I know the Lions were the only team playing on Thanksgiving Day that did not have a winning record, but they came in with three consecutive victories, including one over the Giants in Week 11. It's After Hours with Amy Lawrence on CBS Sports Radio. We're live from the Rocket Mortgage studios. Whether you're looking to purchase a new home or refinance yours, Rocket Mortgage can help you get there.

For home loan solutions that fit your life, Rocket can. This is one of the reasons I love working holiday nights, because they fly. We're already halfway through the show. We haven't even gotten to the third football game yet.

We're about to do that. We still have college football to talk about, and look ahead to the bulk of Week 12, and this show will be over before we know it. And then, because there's no traffic on the morning of a holiday, my commute is about five minutes shorter. It's amazing. It's like a ghost town in New York, the mornings of holidays. Although on this Friday morning, because it's an extended holiday weekend, there are a lot of tourists in from out of town, so a ton of people visiting from elsewhere in the U.S. and North America, and even international tourists.

So it is busy, but not at 6 a.m. Eastern time, which I appreciate. So find me on Twitter, ALawRadio. Love to hear from you, and I'm asking you simply on this holiday, who's out there? Where are you, and how are you listening? So send us your tweets.

Again, ALawRadio. I'm retweeting them from our show account, After Hours CBS, and then also on our Facebook page, After Hours with Amy Lawrence. And so far, we've been inundated. Dozens and dozens of your responses. In fact, we're well over 100 responses now, and we're getting them from all over the country, from north of the border, even from a few of the Caribbean islands. And so it's good to connect with you. We've got a little bit of college football chatter coming up, because you may have heard about this OSU Michigan game.

Can I tell you a quick story? When I was growing up, we spent a good portion of our time in Northeast Ohio. So I'm from New Hampshire.

I grew up in New Hampshire. But my mom's whole side of the family is from the Youngstown, Ohio area, which is halfway between Cleveland and Pittsburgh. So it's Northeast Ohio. It's just over the western border of PA. For those of you who are familiar, Interstate 80 goes right into the Youngstown area. The number of times I have traversed Interstate 80 across Pennsylvania, there's nothing in the middle of the state, nothing.

Anyway, doesn't matter. So when I was growing up, I only knew of one OSU. OSU was Ohio State to me. It wasn't until I moved to Oklahoma for an early job in my career that I realized, oh my gosh, there's another OSU. Oklahoma State. And then when I started covering college football on a national scale, I realized there's also Oregon State.

So I could never, once I started doing national radio, I couldn't say OSU anymore. But in my family, obviously, OSU will, well my mom's whole side of the family, OSU will always be the Buckeyes. It will always be Columbus. It will always be the Horseshoe.

It will always be Ohio State. It was really neat for me a few years ago. I was able to call a women's basketball game between Ohio State and Hartford. So I was traveling with the Hartford women's team for about seven, eight years. And we did a game in Columbus. And I had never been to the campus as an adult. So I had been when I was a kid. But I had never been to the campus as an adult.

And to be able to do a game in that arena and walk around the campus, see the football stadium was pretty cool. I did not sneak into the Horseshoe the way that I snuck into Notre Dame when I was there. I did that. Oh my gosh, you guys, I was so clandestine. I waited until the delivery truck had pulled into the delivery gate and left the gate open because the driver wasn't going to be there very long. And I snuck into the gate. I looked up and down the concourse. There were people walking away from me. So I made a beeline. I just ran across the concourse.

They didn't see me, didn't hear me. Out onto the field, it was, weirdly enough, it wasn't yet set up for a game. And so, I wouldn't say there was trash or anything, but just like the field wasn't ready.

And the scoreboard wasn't up. It was just so cool to be able to stand there and be the only person, the only person in that stadium. It was super cool.

And then on my way out, again, managed to avoid detection out the same gate after taking a few pictures. So I'm very proud of myself that I once snuck into that stadium in South Bend. I did not do that in Columbus, but it was really an email walk around the stadium and kind of look at it and take pictures. And I did get an OSU hat, a couple of them actually, Ohio State hats for family members. All that to say, it's a big game this weekend.

Don't you love how I take digits? This is why I could never do TV. They don't let you tell stories on TV.

You gotta be on radio and take the scenic route to be able to tell stories. All right, so, Ohio State, Michigan, number two, number three. Before Thanksgiving, so Tuesday night into Wednesday morning, in fact it was Wednesday morning when Jerry Palm joined us live. And I was asking him about the rankings and the implications for the loser of Ohio State, Michigan. Not for the winner. The winner is in. The winner is locked up at spot, essentially, for the college football playoff. Ohio State has lost four of these in a row.

Can they topple the Wolverines and secure their spot in the playoff? What happens to the loser of this game? Because that's a huge question. And also, what else is already set based on the college football playoff committee's movement? What do we know? What is still up for grabs?

How many teams can still get in? So those are questions that I asked Jerry Palm. The whole conversation is on our podcast, After Hours, AmyLawrence.com. But we're going to use a chunk of it here in the next 15 minutes, just so that you can hear what he had to say. For those of you who are anticipating this big game coming up on Saturday at 9 a.m. Pacific time, but noon Michigan. Well, noon Ann Arbor and Columbus, Ohio time. Alright, let's now get to the other football team in Michigan.

Okay, that's not fair. Don't get mad at me. The other football team in the spotlight in Michigan on Thursday, that would be the Lions.

Three wins in a row, trying to move to five and six on the season. That would have been big. It would have been a big deal. By now you know how this turned out.

But there are a lot of elements to this game that I found really fascinating. Number one, the Bills left Detroit on Sunday, went back to snowy Orchard Park in snowy western New York, still digging out. Their neighbors who helped them dig out were probably still digging out from that snow. Some of the photos are, I mean, it's like apocalyptic. I love snow so much. That's my idea of heaven.

I know you don't love it when I say that. The Bills then turned around and went back to the Motor City for a game against the actual team that pays rent in that stadium. So the Bills were back in Detroit hoping to go 2-0 at Ford Field. And from the jump, remember this was the first game?

High octane, high powered. It was a lot of fun to watch this game and to know that it was setting the table for the rest of our Thanksgiving slate. Motion across. Big offensive lineman to give is to Williams. Over the left side and into the end zone for his 13th rushing touchdown of the season. 6-0 Lions. A march capped by the NFL's rushing touchdown leader. Allen with the shotgun, stomps his right foot, gets the waist high, shotgun snap. Looking left all the way, throws it left for the end zone and it is caught. Isaiah McKenzie plucking it at helmet level in the end zone and pulls it in for a Buffalo touchdown. Empty back field for the Bills.

Three receivers to the right, single wide left. Singletary motion, fumbled snap by Allen, picks it up. Allen runs up the middle and Allen into the end zone for the touchdown. He dribbled the snap off the turf, picked it up and took it right up the gut for 6 and Buffalo grabs a 13-7 lead. Williams the single back. Golf under center.

Motion from left to right. Golf play fake, throws right side, caught, touchdown. Abenrath, St. Brown in the right back corner of the end zone all alone for 6 and the Lions win it 1 at 14-13. Kevin Coogler on Westwood 1, busy in that first half.

No joke, it was back and forth the entire time. So you hear him call the Jamal Williams touchdown. He also had a fumble in the first half so it was a mixed bag for Jamal in the first half.

But he did get his NFL leading, NFL best 13 rushing touchdowns now. And then, get this, the Lions put together a 6 minute drive that goes 15 plays before the break. And it's Amunras St. Brown that is able to catch the ball from Jared Goff for another score. So just before half, Buffalo tacks on a field goal and that would be foreshadowing for what was to come.

It's after hours here on CBS Sports Radio. So early in the fourth quarter, Detroit is able to get that nose out in front. And remember, the Detroit offense was, I don't think it's still the case, but had the most number of points per game through the first 6 weeks of the season.

We know they can score, they have a lot of weapons. From the shotgun, play action, Goff looking to throw, over the middle into the end zone, it is caught, DJ Chalk, a fingertip grab, working against Dane Jackson in the middle of the end zone, gives Detroit a 20-19 lead with 13.47 to go. Digs to the left with Knox the tight end of the slot, McKenzie and Davis to the right. Singletary motioning to the right out of the backfield, second goal at the 5, Allen throws, slant, caught, digs, touchdown. Bills with the lead, 25-22. Extra point from Tyler Bass is up and it's no good.

He missed it to the left. His last missed extra point was in the 20-20 season. This one keeps it a field goal game on Thanksgiving.

Add that to the list of things Lions fans are thankful for this year. Tyler Bass, 104 consecutive point after attempts and then he misses the PAT. So, you get the fourth quarter score by Detroit that takes the lead on that DJ Chalk catch. They get the two-point conversion to go up 22-19. There are then just play after play after play after play, all these plays in a row at 90 yards for the Buffalo Bills.

So, they answer, right? After Detroit does its thing, then the Bills go heavy on Singletary. Devon Singletary and Stephon Diggs, oh man, it was a wicked route too for Diggs to get open on his touchdown catch. That then put the Bills up 25-22, but Tyler Bass misses that point after attempt. And so, instead of being a four-point lead, it's a three-point lead. Detroit is able to get a field goal on the board. So again, pushing back.

I love this. And honestly, probably thought that they had taken enough time off the clock. But we know, well we know what we know about the Josh Allen offense and certainly the Josh Allen-Stephon Diggs connection.

So, the teams are still pushing to the very end, which made for great drama. By the time Detroit gets its field goal, Buffalo has only 23 seconds left to be able to score. To move down the field in range for Tyler Bass, who had just missed the point after attempt. On first down, steps away, over the middle, open is Diggs, Diggs with a catch at the 40 of Detroit.

Of course. And down, timeout called, they'll spot him down near the 38-yard line. Kirby Joseph with the tackle, one play. Josh Allen, 37 yards. And the Bills on the doorstep again from 45 yards.

Good snap. The hold is down. The kick is on the way and it is good. Two seconds remain and Buffalo takes the 28-25 lead. Redemption Part 2, Tyler Bass.

Hmm. Kevin Coogler on Westwood One. We should hear it though from the Bills radio perspective. Here we go. Ferguson, the snapper.

Martin, the holder. The snap is good. The kick is long enough. It is up.

It is good. Still two seconds left on the clock. A 45-yard field goal for Tyler Bass to put the Bills on top.

28-25 with two seconds remaining. Tyler Bass owns this building. Well, I mean, he owns the building after he missed a point-after attempt. That's why I love that call from John Murphy.

I know there's Tyler Bass in the system, Carlos, if you want to grab it. Because he had a bit of a wild ride there at the end. Kind of similar to Jamal Williams right in the first half. Owned a touchdown but then had a fumble. Well, Tyler Bass misses a point-after attempt. Hasn't done that in a couple years.

And what happens? He gets a chance for redemption at the end. I just knew we were going to have another chance, you know, given our offense. I just knew another chance was going to pop up and I got to be ready for it.

And I just quickly reset and just got to my next process. Good for you, Tyler Bass. The life of a kicker is not easy. And certainly Josh Allen knows that well.

But they're not in position unless he finds Stephon Diggs with a bullet. This thing was a dart. Oh, my goodness. I could watch this catch over and over again. It was phenomenal. The way that he was able to get the ball where it needed to be at exactly the moment with a throw that would have knocked a lot of people over.

That's how much force and power was on it. There were defenders all around him. One nearly snagged and intercepted. There were three Lions in the vicinity who could have probably reached out and touched Stephon Diggs. And yet somehow the ball was able to make it in for that Diggs catch. It was a sweet connection.

They were playing a little two-man concept and actually me and Doris kind of talked about that a few days ago. You know, we saw the same look in a previous game and just said, hey, let's put this play in just in case we might need it. We called it and Steph ran a heck of a route and just gave him a chance. He made a heck of a play. T-Bass being able to have a short memory after that PAT and take the game-winning field goal. That's tough as nails. That's tough to do for an NFL kicker.

You know, you just missed one. You're stepping up to the plate to win a game and you delivered for us. We'll get more from the Buffalo Bills and this win for them huge because of the tumultuous week they've had. So we'll hear from Stephon Diggs as well about that final drive and also Sean McDermott. The scary moment, though, the Von Miller knee injury gets carted off of the field and into the locker room and does not return. This was in the first half and so that's got to temper the enthusiasm over this win.

Even though the Bills now moved to eight and three, that defense is not the same without Von Miller. And so the reports initially are that he did avoid the worst of the worst. So a torn knee ligament, something like that. But to see the way that his knee was roll while his knee buckled in just really painful, excruciating fashion. And it happened as a lineman or there's an athlete who was kind of rolling up on him from behind. And his knee just kind of got, well, it was bent but it was bent in a way that there was no flex to it. And so it was stuck in that position while this lineman is rolling up on him. And so a little bit scary, worried about him. He's one of my favorite players in the NFL. But hopefully the reports are correct that he avoided the worst. So they are expecting to do an MRI on Friday.

So we'll get more reaction. The Lions were so close to a fourth consecutive win, but 23 seconds is too long. Like 13 seconds was too long in the postseason last year. Man, some of these high-octane combos, like a Patrick Mahomes to a Travis Kelce or a Josh Allen to a Stavon Diggs.

I mean, it's always inciting fear in a defense. It's After Hours with Amy Lawrence, CBS Sports Radio. You are listening to the After Hours Podcast. First down.

Steps away. Over the middle. Diggs with a catch at the 40 of Detroit and down.

Timeout cold. They'll spot him down near the 38-yard line. Kirby Joseph with the tackle. One play.

Josh Allen, 37 yards. And the Bills on the doorstep again. When I anticipate going into those drives, those last drives, I'm right on my cue. And I tell them to trust me out there. Whatever you see, it's me or nobody. So I just want them to trust me out there, especially in those moments. My team trusts me. And my team looks for me to make those plays. And I never want to let my teammates down. You know, I kind of play for my teammates. You know, I play with that energy, and I try to always bring that positive energy and those positive manifestations and affirmations. So when those moments come around, I want to show them that it is true. I practice what I preach. It's After Hours with Amy Lawrence.

Amy's taking your calls at 855-212-4CBS. He definitely does practice what he preaches. Staphon Diggs, 8 catches, 77 yards, and the touchdown there in the fourth quarter that capped a 90-yard march by the Buffalo Bills. They were heavy on both Devin Singletary and Staphon Diggs on that drive. I went back and kind of counted the number of plays. And 75% of that drive was those two guys with Josh Allen. It's After Hours, CBS Sports Radio. Did you all happen to catch the end of this game? After Tyler Bass had his moment of redemption, and he's able to put the field goal through the uprights and secure the Bills win, 28-25. The embrace between an exhausted Josh Allen and Staphon Diggs on the sidelines.

Did you guys see it? And what a tumultuous week it's been. It was one of those where you're hugging, but you're holding each other up. Have you ever had a hug like that?

You're so exhausted. Maybe it was in sports, and maybe it was something else. You're so exhausted that you're actually holding up the person who's hugging you, and they're holding you up.

It was one of those. And after, so the TV cameras focused on them, the two of them were just standing there in this extended embrace. And as the cameras are focused in, it's Josh Allen's face that you see.

And if you read lips, the only word he said was, the F-bomb. Like, that just says it all at the end of this game that was back and forth, back and forth, high-octane, and high-powered. Now, he did not use that word in his postgame press conference, but man, thrilled with two victories in two games in Detroit. And now, looking ahead to Week 13 versus the Patriots. We gave ourselves a chance at the end there. You know, second half didn't play great football.

I wouldn't say we played great football. But on the way, guys were resilient. The ups and downs of an NFL game, that's a good team playing very well and playing good football right now. They're coached extremely well. So credit to them for having such a good game plan. Guys just continuing to grind.

Guys going down, stepping up, just finding a way. Proud of our guys for doing that. You know, we've got another short week next week playing on Thursday. Obviously, we've got a week to prepare, but we've got to be ready for that one, too. That's in division, and we know what that means, and we've got to be ready for it. It's not a pity party, but what the guys have been through and being on two plane rides in five days.

You know, just dealing with things at home and then trying to focus on their job I think was impressive. When you win, it goes in the win column as one. When you lose, it goes in the loss column as one.

So no matter how you win, you've got to find a way to win. And I think our guys are sure that they know how to do that. Sean McDermott and Josh Allen. He goes 24 of 42.

If you think about the percentages there, you wouldn't say that was anything to write home about. But he did have 253 yards, a couple of touchdowns, an interception. Was sacked three times, too. So there was a fair amount of pressure on him from the Lions. He also ran for nearly 80 yards and had a touchdown. And on that last drive after the Stavon Diggs bullet, he actually extends the drive a couple of times with his legs as well. And that is certainly what he's capable of. Man, I was laughing because I was watching this game with a lot of people, which I don't normally do with football.

I normally sequester myself to take notes. But it's Thanksgiving, so it's a special occasion. I was watching with a big group and it featured a bunch of Lions fans. And when Josh Allen was on the receiving end of the roughing the passer penalty, I made some comment about how that's not roughing the passer. It's impossible to rough Josh Allen like that. Josh Allen could truck most of these dudes out there on the field.

And so, yeah, we know roughing the passer has gotten pretty soft in terms of the NFL. So I don't love that call. But I do love what we saw from the Bills and from the Lions. Disappointing for Detroit, right? They'd won three in a row. They were hoping to get a little bit closer to 500.

I do believe that Dan Campbell is building the right culture in Detroit. Even going back to last year, his first campaign, all of the biting kneecaps notwithstanding, I don't think they did any of that. But what they did is push teams a lot. They ended up with, what was the number two pick that they got Aiden Hutchinson?

It was the number two pick, right? They ended up with one of the worst records in the NFL. But what they did was challenge their opponents. The number of times that they pushed their opponents to the very brink and had fought so hard, we're seeing that become the culture in Detroit with Dan Campbell. I was proud of our guys. We fought, took it all the way to the end, had an opportunity, and we fell short. But I was proud of them the way we played. We're getting better.

We're still getting better. So it still stings. For Dan Campbell, it's funny because I always joke about how he used to tell people he's not a lunatic. And if you could tell people you're not a lunatic, then, I mean, for instance, Carlos doesn't walk around telling people he's not a lunatic, right? That's not something that you do?

No, but I probably should. Now for me, I just tell people I'm crazy. That's always my caveat. But my motto is find people in life who are your kind of crazy. And then you all speak the same language, so what's the difference? But when you try to tell people you're not a lunatic, it automatically tips them off to the fact that you are. And yet I like his kind of lunacy.

I think it's amazing. This guy incites, well, he's a leader. He incites guys to follow. He incites energy. He brings passion.

He cares. And, again, he and his coaching staff are putting the team in a better position to win. Remember, this defense was giving up more points.

It was weird, right? No other team had ever led the NFL in scoring but also led the NFL in points allowed through, what was it, five or six games. That was the Lions. It was such a massive disparity that they weren't winning because they were giving up so many points. So people who were pointing to Jared Goff, oh, he sucks, you were not paying attention.

The team was scoring like bombs away. And now they've got Jamal Williams, who leads the NFL in rushing touchdowns. They've got DeAndre Swift, who has a nice one-two punch. They've certainly got a Jared Goff who can deliver. When he doesn't turn the ball over, which he did not do on Thursday, he is an above-average quarterback. The guy can deliver when he needs to.

And they spread the ball around. He may not have a receiver corps that features someone like Justin Jefferson or Stefan Diggs or, I mean, Cooper Cupp, right? We're not talking about a receiving corps of superstars. Maybe they bring in one next year or in the draft or free agency. But Amunras St. Brown had over 120 yards receiving and a touchdown. A lot of times it's about the rapport that you have with your quarterback. And I like what I see from this Detroit offense.

And I think the defense is getting better. Aiden Hutchinson is like energy on steroids. And I don't mean actual steroids, so don't start that rumor. He's like energy times seven. I mean, he brings so much energy. He's next-level energy is what I should have said.

And I really enjoy watching him play. So it's one of those teams that's on the rise. Three wins in a row is a huge deal for the Lions. So I know they lost on Thursday. But, hey, they're tied for second place in the NFC North with the Packers. Anyway, we're going to get to a little more of that. But, yeah, what we get from this game to start, 28-25, and it's back and forth, back and forth.

And the Lions actually outscore the Bills in the fourth quarter. This was amazing drama to start our Thanksgiving Day. All right, so I know I lied to you, not on purpose. Well, two things that I actually lied to you about, neither one of them on purpose. I don't do it on purpose.

When I was a kid, I lied on purpose just to see if I gave it away with it. But I swear that's not what I'm doing now. So we're going to get to your calls. But I did promise you a little bit of a precursor to this big weekend in college football. It's rivalry weekend. We've got the Iron Bowl. And we've got the classic OSU-Michigan clash. We didn't get to it here.

We're going to get to it right after the update. And also, I want to thank our listener, I didn't see his name, who alerted me to the fact that I had an error in what I was saying about OSU. And I know this is true because, of course, I remember last year's Michigan game in which the Wolverines embarrassed the Buckeyes and ended the streak of OSU wins. It was the first time in a long time for Michigan, for Jim Harbaugh. It obviously put them in the college football playoff.

The number four was in my head for a different reason because it was the first time after four consecutive Big Ten championship games for Ohio State that they weren't there. So just, like, sorry. I made a mistake. I messed up just a lot in my head. So I wanted to clarify that.

Yes, they have had the best of Michigan until last year. And remember, the game was canceled in 2020. So I just, I got that wrong.

So I apologize for that. We're going to get you to hear part of a conversation with someone who always gets it right. That's Jerry Palm. And he can tell you the implications of the game coming up. And then we'll get to calls to Alice and Beck are waiting to get on the air.

855-212-4227. You are listening to the After Hours Podcast. Follow Amy Lawrence on Twitter after hours or anytime her Twitter handle is at ALawRadio. Just nod and smile at your weird host.

I told you, find people in life where you're kind of crazy. It's After Hours CBS Sports Radio. A little bit from the head coaches for this Ohio State Michigan clash, which comes up on Saturday at noon Eastern Time.

That's 9 a.m. Pacific. Do you know it's the 13th time since the early 40s that they're both top five in the Associated Press rankings. But a lot of people are pointing to this as the biggest installment of this particular series. Going back now probably six years because it was Ohio State that was ranked number two back in 2016. Michigan was third.

The game went into double overtime. But there is the revenge factor based on what happened last year. Buckeyes were also number two and they were bum rushed in Ann Arbor. So now the game goes back to Columbus for the first time in several years.

Remember it was canceled in 2020. Okay, so that's where the four came from too, right? Because it's the first time in four years that they've been, okay, oh my gosh. There's a lot of information packed in this brain of mine and sometimes it's like a plate of spaghetti. So instead of compartmentalizing and keeping it all straight, I say my brain is like a full plate of pasta where you twirl a couple of strands on the fork and all this other stuff just falls off the plate.

All this other stuff just falls out of my head. So, okay, anyway, let's just have Ryan Day and Jim Harbaugh talk about the game, the head coaches respectively. Four years, it's been a while and being the 100th year anniversary is going to mean a lot more to a lot of people on Saturday. We understand that and there's nothing quite like the game and certainly have learned so much over my time here at Ohio State about what this tradition means to so many across the country and that's why we work the game so hard and take a lot of pride in being our best here and this is our number one goal every season. It's a tremendous team and we're very grateful to be in this position, to be playing in this game.

Winner takes the East, winner takes all right there. So, strong opponent and it's the kind of situation that gives you the opportunity to display how strong our team is. There's no need to hate. Be grateful for the opponent. It's like superheroes.

It's through a strong opponent that you get to find out who you are. They have a lot of players that are really good. They've got great players. We've got great players. We have great coaches. We have great coaches. They have players with Heisman habits. We have players with Heisman habits and congratulations.

Be grateful for having the opportunity to play in this kind of big game. He actually said there's no need to hate. You think that's going to work on the fans? Even a little bit? I guess it's because Michigan's going into hostile territory.

There's no need to hate. He's kind of asking the Buckeyes fans to take it easy a little bit. What?

Hmm. Wonder how that flies. Alright, so with Jerry Palm, a college football insider who knows the college football playoff committee and its ways inside and out. We talked to him on Wednesday morning, so it was live right here on CBS Sports Radio at the time. He had a bunch of interviews lined up.

He squeezed us in when we were still on the air. Not bringing back the whole thing, just a little snippet about how this game impacts the rankings. What I wanted to know is not so much about the winner, but about the loser. So I asked Jerry, what happens to the team that is on the wrong end of Ohio State Michigan? Well, probably not much because the Big Ten this year outside of those two and Penn State has been really mediocre. So much so that my school, Purdue, might actually get to play for the title as a 30-point underdog probably against one of those two teams.

I know. So, but that's, you know, it's more likely Iowa. Still, Iowa was so bad offensively for the first two months of this season that people were wondering why they didn't fire their offensive coordinator.

Well, he's the son of the head coach, you know, so there was a lot talked about Iowa for the first two months. Now, they're actually the favorite to get to the title game to play Ohio State or Michigan. So the loser has got a strength of schedule problem because other than Penn State, they haven't been able to beat anybody good. Ohio State has a win over Notre Dame. So they've got the better case as an 11-1 team versus Michigan who played, you know, three. Well, UConn actually had a surprisingly good year, but they're 6-6 and the other two are among the worst in FBS. So it's, their strength of schedule is going to hold them down for sure.

But Ohio State's got that problem as well to a lesser degree. So this winner is in the playoffs and the loser is certainly out. Is there anything that you know for sure about the college football playoff or is everything still on the table? Well, unless Georgia loses to Georgia Tech, they're in. They could lose to LSU in the SEC championship game. They will still be in. So that's the one team that we know for sure is going to play in the college football playoff game, barring, you know, like this massive upset. And that's going to be true of the Ohio State Michigan winner as well. That team will also be in barring, you know, a massive upset.

So, you know, those are the sure things after that. It gets a little sketchy what happens if TCU loses, especially if they lose a conference championship game, because being a conference champion is criteria in a sense for the college football playoff committee, conference champion gets some priority in tie-breaking type situations that they're evaluating teams. So it is important being 12-1 and a conference champion is better than 12-1 and not a conference champion in this situation. So what happens if TCU loses? Can USC finish the job for the Pac-12 and put them in the playoff for the first time in 2016, I think?

It's been a while, Washington, I think, was the last team. So, you know, there's a lot of doubt still, things that can happen. But there's really only the six teams, I think, that have a legitimate shot at the playoff without some Armageddon scenario.

Okay, because that's what I was going to ask you next. What's the lowest team down that would have a shot at the playoff? But you're telling me LSU, USC, who are five and six, are really the only other options unless everything blows up?

I don't even know how that would happen. Yeah, I mean, LSU has to beat Georgia, so good luck with that. But Clemson at 12-1, the ACC is really down this year, plus they lost to Notre Dame, which is the best team they will have played. It's going to be hard for Clemson to get in at 12-1. They're going to need a lot of help and probably help that's not realistic. Jerry Palm, college football insider, has actually been inside the room with the college football playoff committee, which is kind of cool.

Same thing with the March Madness stuff. He understands it, got it down to his science, and so when he tells you what is likely to happen or not likely to happen, you should take it almost as gospel. He says, though, with a caveat, barring anything massive or crazy. It's after hours on CBS Sports Radio and our podcast, After Hours, AmyLawrence.com, where you can hear the rest of that interview with Jerry Palm. All right, let's see if we can sneak in one quick, which one? Give me one.

I'll sneak in one quick call before the top of the hour. Let's go with Alice. Alice is listening in Boston.

Alice, hi, you got about 90 seconds. Go ahead. Oh, okay. Well, this is a longtime listener, first time star. Yay, cool. Yes, I listen all the time.

Well, I listen to you, and then during the day, I'm from Boston, I listen to our local station. WEEI? Yes. Yes. But you are so smart. I mean, I can't even keep up with how fast you're able to talk.

You're so kind, especially since I just made a really dumb mistake a few minutes ago, but thank you. No, but I'm just saying, today, I was somebody that was hoping that the Lions would win because, of course, next week are the Patriots and the Bills. Yes. So would it be great if the Bills didn't win? Yes, and then the game that we had, well, we almost won. The Patriots almost won. Yes, I was actually really happy with the Pats offense for the most part. I know those last few possessions in the fourth quarter, the Minnesota defense stepped up, and they had a couple of huge sacks, especially the one on third down. But I thought the offense looked pretty good, and there have been a lot of questions about it, especially after last week. But I think Max playing really well. His completion rate is near 80% the last two weeks.

Here, I don't know what the rest of the country thinks about it, but we are really tough on our players. I mean, people are ready to get rid of him. I'm ready to get crazy, get rid of somebody else, Matt Patricia. As the offensive coordinator? That whole thing is weird. I wonder if Belichick's going to backpedal on that come the offseason.

I know he wants Matt on his staff, but I don't know about offensive coordinator. Well, Alice, it's great to talk to you. Let's talk again about football soon. All right. Thank you. Happy Thanksgiving.

Bye-bye. I love that. I love that she's listening on our Boston affiliate, WEEI. It's a station I grew up listening to when I was a kid. Do you know that WEEI is one of the big reasons I'm in this business? It's After Hours with Amy Lawrence, CBS Sports Radio. That's I-N-D-O-C-H-I-N-O dot com promo code fall update.