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Every time you turn on the news, it seems like there's some new horrific tragedy. No question about it. Our nation is in trouble. And with so much evil, where do you turn? What is the hope in the middle of all this darkness?
This is an important question. And we're going to talk about it and here with me to do that is my longtime friend, Pastor Greg Laurie. Greg is pastor of Harvest Christian Fellowship out of Riverside, California. He does his Harvest Crusades all across this country. He's been a friend of mine for over 40 years, and we've served on boards together.
We've traveled around the world. And so I'm glad. That Greg is here today to discuss this. I don't think anyone has better insight than Greg.
So, Greg, welcome. Franklin, good to be here. Yeah, it's crazy. What's going on in America right now? You know, I believe we're in the last days.
And Jesus said, The signs of the times, of the end times, Would get closer and closer together, and he compared it to a woman having labor pains. And it seems like every time you turn around. almost daily now, sometimes even hourly. There's a new crisis. There's a shooting here.
There's a stabbing there. There's some other horrible thing happening. But of course, what is on our minds right now is the horrible murder, even the assassination. of a fellow believer, Charlie Kirk. as he was on a college campus in Utah.
And I think that's especially traumatizing because even though you and I had met and knew Charley, Other people, I think, felt as though they knew him because they saw him all the time on TikTok. You know, he really had the ear of the young generation, frankly. You know, a lot of kids today get their news on TikTok. They don't watch television. And Charlie was all over TikTok, and they would film these little debates you'd do on campuses.
And, you know, Charlie, when we say debate, he was a very friendly guy, very intelligent. Students would walk up to him, they would insult him to his face and say the worst things to him. He'd just smile and nod and wait till they were done and calmly and clearly answer their questions. Yes, he talked about political issues and what's going on in the country, but he was very. upfront about his faith.
right before he was shot. He was talking about Jesus Christ. He said, I am nothing. Without Jesus. Yes.
And he was very bold about his faith, as you said. He talked about it all the time. Yes, he did. And so. And one of the things he he said that I want to talk about Jesus.
And then he encouraged people To do that this weekend. Talk about Jesus. Tell someone about Jesus. Uh he was a I guess so. An evangelist as well.
He was asked in an interview: what do you want to be known for? Like after you die. And he said, I want to be known. for my courage for speaking up for Christ. And you know, I think it's I think we need to mourn the death of this young man.
You know, Stephen was the first martyr of the early church. He died a horrific death, as Charlie did, frankly. And God gave Stephen a glimpse of heaven. And we read that after Stephen died, godly men mourned over him. And even though we know Charlie's in heaven, And even though we know he's safely in the arms of Jesus, there is a place for us as a nation.
to mourn the loss of this gifted talented, wonderful, young man of God, thirty one years old, But then to also reflect on this fact, he packed a lot of life in. You know, Corey Tin Boom once said. Life is not measured by its duration, but by its donation. Charlie did not live a long life, sadly. but he lived a very impactful life and he made a great donation.
He did. And Greg, we've seen other horrific violence just recently. The young girl in Charlotte, North Carolina. Uh A Ukrainium. uh came to this country with their family To try to find safety because of the war in her country.
Now, I do think about that young girl sitting. uh on the the train, the light rail. it stops and the camera shows her getting on and just sitting down and the man behind her said he di he said he didn't even know who she was, pulls out his knife and just stabs her. Another thing that surprised me on that No one Got up to help her. And some people were filming it on their phones.
And it's unbelievable. The scripture warns us against those that call. Evil, good, and good, evil. And it seems like The nation and many people around the world celebrate evil. They do.
Even the assassination attempts. President Trump. Two of them. We've seen that. And all of this is, it seems like it's just escalating.
It is. And maybe it's because we. Yeah. live in a digital age and we we We are aware of it. Maybe more today than we were just a few years ago.
But I believe, like you say, Greg, we are living in the last days. And I want to encourage pastors and churches, this is a good time. Uh for your church. to review The scriptures and to look at prophecy, and what does the Bible say about the end times? Are we ready?
Are we prepared? for what God has in store. But our nation is in trouble. What would you say, Greg, to people who say if God is really a God of love, He would not let this happen. Why does he allow evil things to happen?
Uh If he's God, he can stop this. And I don't know the answer. I mean, why? When I don't know the answer to the white question, I pivot back. to the what in the who question.
You know, Charlie was a young man, and as you know, Frank Gunnar's son Christopher died at the age of 33 in an automobile accident. And I s we spend a lot of time asking the why question. And you go to a point where there's just no answer to that, satisfies you.
So it comes down to this. We don't live On Explanations, we live on promises. We go back to the promises of God.
So here's what I don't understand. Why did this happen? I don't know. Here's what I do understand: God loves us. I know God loved Charlie.
I know that As Joseph said to his brothers who sold him into slavery, You meant this for evil, but God meant it for good to save many people alive.
So, what happened to Charlie is a horrible tragedy. We should mourn his death. But at the same time, we should be inspired by his life and we should carry on what he did. That's what he would want. I mean, if I'm Charlie Kirk sitting in heaven, I'd say, preach the gospel.
Because you're going to be here before you know it with me in the presence of Jesus.
So I think, you know, as the Bible says, work while it is the day, for the night is coming when no man can work. And so just. Follow his example, and we can't always answer that why question, but we turn to God. And what do we do? We give people the gospel and call them to Christ because death will come for all of us, and we don't know when.
Charlie had his hope in Christ. And so the moment he took his last breath on earth, he took his first breath in heaven. And if we trust in Christ, we can have that same hope. I don't feel Sorry for Charlie. And it sounds maybe a little strange to say that.
That he's in God, he's in the presence of God. And now I feel very sorry for his wife. Yes. And his two little children. This is very, very difficult, very tough.
You know, Franklin, your dad once said In response to the question, What has been the greatest surprise of your life? He said, The brevity of it. We look at Charlie, young man 31 years old. This young lady from Ukraine coming here to our country, seeking refuge. losing her life so suddenly, Life can end quickly.
We need to be ready for the afterlife. Life is so.
So short, and we're all We're all dying, we're just at different stages of dying. And death is coming for all of us. And the question is: are we ready? Are we prepared? And a lot of people, Greg, just don't want to talk about it.
They don't want to think about it. and they think they're just gonna live, you know. that life's just going to keep going. But it doesn't. It comes to an end.
I think it's scary to young people right now to see all these things happen. Jesus said, Let not your hearts be troubled, neither let them be afraid. In my father's house are many mansions, your dwelling places. Ah, if it were not so, I would have told you, I go to prepare a place for you, and if I go to prepare a place for you, I will come again and receive you unto myself, that where I am, you may be also.
So, at a time like this, it can be scary, but we should not have troubled hearts. We should look to the Lord. And, you know, I remember a story I heard about. Father, who was an atheist, and he wanted his daughter to be an atheist as well.
So he wrote down on a piece of paper: God is nowhere. And he said, Write that down. God is nowhere. And she sounded it out: God is N-O-W-H-E-R-E. She goes, Oh, I understand, Daddy.
God is now here. She saw it differently. And I think this is what we must realize: God is now here. Yes, it's a tragedy what happened to Charlie Kirk, but We should follow his example, He's passed his torch on in his short An impactful life, and we should pick that torch up and say, okay, let's not be silent because the only hope is the gospel. Because the heart of the problem is the problem of the heart.
And only God can change the human heart. Only God. Politics can't change it. Technology can't change it. Religion even can't change it.
It's Christ. And so we need to keep proclaiming that message to this world more than ever. We live in a troubled world and our country seems to be broken. Uh morally. Yeah.
With as a nation, we've turned our back on God. It's a spiritual problem. It's the spiritual a problem of the heart. And the Bible says that we have all sinned and come short of God's glory. All of us are sinners.
And um so we've failed God. But God loved us enough to send His Son Jesus Christ of this earth. To take our sins and to die and shed His blood for our sins. There's the only hope. Is the Lord Jesus Christ.
In tragedy, There are times when people Turn to God for a brief moment. And we saw that after 9-11, the nation was looking for. Why? And churches were full and churches full. Yeah.
And George W. Bush, that's my father. to come to Washington for a special prayer service and my father was able to speak to the nation. And so the airspace was still closed. I remember that my father had to, we had to get special permission from the FAA to fly.
into Washington, that the whole country was afraid. The country was kind of on a lockdown. And so my father addressed the nation. From the National Cathedral. And so I thought this would be maybe a good time just to.
Hear the words of comfort. that my father I brought to the nation at that time. We've seen so much on our television, heard on our radio. Stories. that bring tears to our eyes.
and make us all feel a sense of anger. But God can be trusted. even when life seems at its darkest. But what But what are some of the lessons we can learn? First, we are reminded of the mystery and reality of evil.
I've been asked hundreds of times in my life. why God allows tragedy and suffering. I have to confess that I really do not know the answer. Totally. even to my own satisfaction.
I have to accept by faith. That God is sovereign. And he's a God of love and mercy. and compassion. in the midst of suffering.
The Bible says that God is not. The Arthur of Evil. It speaks of evil. as a mystery. In 1 Thessalonians 2, 7.
It talks about the mystery of iniquity. The Old Testament prophet Jeremiah said, The heart is deceitful. Above all things, and beyond cure. Who can understand it? He asked that question, who can understand it?
And that's one reason. We each need God in our lives. The lesson of this event is not only about the mystery. of iniquity and evil, But secondly, it's a lesson about our need for each other. What an example.
New York and Washington. have been to the world. these past few days. None of us will ever forget. the pictures of our courageous firefighters and police.
many of whom have lost friends and colleagues. A tragedy like this could have torn. our country apart. But instead, It has united us. and we've become a family.
So those perpetrators who took this on to tear us apart. It has worked the other way. It's backlash. It's backfired. We're more united than ever before.
I think this was exemplified in a verse. Moving weight. when the members of our Congress stood shoulder to shoulder the other day and sang God Bless America. Finally, difficult as it may be for us to see right now. This event can give a message of hope.
Hope for the present. and hope for the future. Yeah. There is hope. There's hope for the present.
because I believe the stage has already been set. for a new spirit in our nation. One of the things we desperately need There's a spiritual renewal in this country. We need a spiritual revival in America. And God has told us in his word time after time that we're to repent of our sins.
And we're turned to him. And he will bless us. in a new way. But there's also Hmm. for the future.
because of God's promises. As a Christian. I have hope. Not just for this life. But for heaven and the life to come.
And many of those people Who died this past week. are in heaven right now. And they wouldn't want to come back. It's so glorious and so wonderful. And that's the hope for all of us.
to put our faith in God. I pray that you will have this hope. in your heart. This event reminds us of the brevity and the uncertainty of life. We never know when we too will be called.
into eternity. I doubt if even one of those People who got on those planes. I walked into the World Trade Center. Or the Pentagon last Tuesday morning thought it would be the last day of their lives. They didn't it didn't occur to them And that's why each of us needs to face our own spiritual need.
and commit ourselves to God. and his will now. Here in this majestic National Cathedral. We see all around us. Symbols.
of the cross. For the Christian, I'm speaking for the Christian now. The cross tells us that God understands our sin. And our suffering. For he took upon himself in the person of Jesus Christ.
Our sins. and our suffering. And from the cross, God declares, I love you. I know the heartaches and the sorrows and the pains that you feel. But I love you.
The story does not end with the cross. For Easter points us beyond the tragedy of the cross. to the empty tomb. It tells us that there is hope for eternal life. For Christ.
has conquered evil and death and hell. There is hope. I've become an old man now. And I've preached all over the world. And the older I get, the more I cling to that hope.
that I started with many years ago. and proclaimed it. in many languages. to many parts of the world. Several years ago, at the National Prayer Breakfast here in Washington.
Ambassador Andrew Young. who had just gone through the tragic death of his wife. closed his talk with a quote. From the old hymn. how firm our foundation.
We all watched. in horror. as planes crashed into the the steel and glass of the World Trade Center. Those majestic towers built. on solid foundations were examples.
of the prosperity and creativity. of America. When damaged, Those buildings eventually plummeted the ground. imploding it upon themselves. Yet underneath the debris, is a foundation.
that was not destroyed. Therein lies the truth of that old hymn, that Andrew Young quoted. How firm a foundation. Yes, our nation has been a type. Buildings destroyed, lives lost.
But now we have a choice. whether to implode And disintegrate emotionally and spiritually. as a people and a nation. Or Whether we choose to become stronger. Through all of the struggle.
to rebuild on a solid foundation. And I believe that we're in the process of starting to rebuild on that foundation. That foundation is our trust in God. That's what this service is all about. And in that faith, We have the strength to endure something as difficult and horrendous.
That's what we've experienced this week. This has been A terrible week with many tears. But also it's been a week. of great faith. churches all across the country.
I've called prayer meetings. And today is a day That they're celebrating not only in this country. but in many parts of the world. And in the words of that familiar hymn, that Andrew Young quoted. It says, fear not.
I'm with thee. O be not dismayed, for I am thy God. and will give thee aid. I'll strengthen thee. Help them.
and cause thee to stand upon my righteous on thy righteous omnipotent hand. My prayer today is that we will feel the loving arms of God. wrapped around us. and will know in our hearts He will never forsake us. as we trust in him.
Hey, everybody, thanks for listening to my podcast. Before you go, I wanted to let you know about the important work we're doing here at Harvest. You know, we've had the same goal these last 50 years, which is simply this: we want to know God and we want to make Him known. And we do that in a lot of ways: documentary films, animation, radio, television, large-scale evangelistic events, and more. If you want to be a part of what we're doing to fulfill the great commission, you can support us with whatever you can give at harvest.org/slash donate.
Again, that's harvest.org/slash donate. And thanks so much.
