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Carolina Journal Radio No. 897: Cooper’s school reopening plan creates uncertainty

Carolina Journal Radio / Donna Martinez and Mitch Kokai
The Truth Network Radio
July 27, 2020 8:00 am

Carolina Journal Radio No. 897: Cooper’s school reopening plan creates uncertainty

Carolina Journal Radio / Donna Martinez and Mitch Kokai

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July 27, 2020 8:00 am

Gov. Roy Cooper has announced that N.C. public schools should reopen with a mix of online and in-person classes. No public school can reopen with all students in class at the school building. Terry Stoops, John Locke Foundation vice president for research and director of education studies, analyzes the impact of Cooper’s order for students, parents, and teachers in the upcoming academic year. A recent report focused on diversity of viewpoints at the University of North Carolina’s flagship Chapel Hill campus. Co-author and UNC business professor Mark McNeilly discussed details of the report during a recent online John Locke Foundation forum. McNeilly explains why a variety of viewpoints help lead to a better educational climate. COVID-19 has struck nursing homes particularly hard. During a recent legislative briefing, Rep. Perrin Jones, R-Pitt, recounted one particularly sad story about the impact of nursing home restrictions. Jones urged state health officials to help ensure that ailing nursing home residents continue to have contact with their closest family members. That idea also motivates a piece of legislation dubbed the No Patient Left Alone Act. You’ll hear highlights from a recent legislative debate on that proposal. As North Carolina and the rest of the country continue to deal with the COVID-19 pandemic, the 2020 election season moves forward. Rick Henderson, Carolina Journal editor-in-chief, offers an update on the N.C. governors’ race, as well as President Trump’s re-election bid against Democratic challenger Joe Biden.


From Cherokee to current attack and the largest city to the smallest and from the statehouse into the schoolhouse Carolina Journal radio your weekly news magazine discussing North Carolina's most of public policy events and issues welcome to Carolina Journal radio why Michiko got during the next hour, Donna Martinez and I will explore some major issues affecting our state. A recent report raises questions about diversity of viewpoints at the University of North Carolina's flagship campus will hear from one of that report's authors. 19 is prompted a series of restrictions at North Carolina nursing homes you hear from one state lawmaker who believes those restrictions go to for he cites one heartbreaking story of an elderly couple separated by nursing home rules build up the note patient left alone act is designed to help patients stuck in a hospital during the time of covert 19 concerns, you'll hear highlights from a hearing on the bill that will offer an update on the race for North Carolina's Gov.'s mansion along with the state's 15 electoral votes.

Those topics are just ahead. First, Donna Martinez joins us with the Carolina Journal headline part time in the classroom part time online that is the word from Gov. Roy Cooper about how he would like to see the new public school year. Look here in North Carolina and with recent polling showing the public split on all of this. The best thing to do for North Carolina kids.

Well it's really up to everybody to decide one of the folks is been following all of this is the John Locke foundation's vice president for research. Also, director of education studies. He is Dr. Terry stoops. He joins us now with a look at what the school year might be like as it comes up very quickly. Terry welcome back to the show. Thank you that your reaction to Gov. Cooper's announcement that he wants to go with plan B. Is he refers to it while think anyone was surprised that Plan B was to be the choice. There have been rumors for weeks that Plan B was the choice the governor did delay that decision and waited an additional two weeks beyond the point that would which he originally said that he was going to announce the coming school year so I don't think anyone is surprises Plan B. There was probably a desire in the Cooper administration on the Department of Health and Human Services and everyone else involved that we would get to a point where plan a this is the minimal social distancing that would allow kids to go to school five days a week and just have minimal sanitation and social distancing requirements was going to be possible for the fall.

I think that would have been the ideal, and perhaps they were waiting for the possibility of announcing a plan day which would have given maximum flexibility to school districts to offer even more stringent requirements under Plan B or full-time remote learning under plan C, but that didn't happen so I don't think anyone was surprised to hear that it was Plan B and now were going to have to see how each school district attacks their next school year, which is just about a month away.

How will this work.

I mean how can you have kids them. Are they gonna be alternating days in and out of the physical building and then what does this mean I mean in terms of practicality are teachers gonna have to be walking around with Clorox wipes all the time and I don't say that flippantly I may say that seriously. Well it depends what districts your end because districts were asked to come up with three plans. Plan a B and C in preparation for the governor's announcement and those Plan B's look different from school district, the school district. Some have alternating days. Some of alternating weeks so have morning shifts and afternoon shifts.

Some go part in person part online so there really isn't a way to generalize what Plan B is going to look like for North Carolina because this can vary from district to district. There are some districts or even talking about going full-time remote learning because that is something that they're allowed to do. They don't have to do any in-person instruction if if they don't want to now. I think that would be tremendously inconvenient for parents, especially working parents, but still that is an option that's left open to them in an right now Guilford County is considering going to a full-time online education for most of the school district so it is going to be in the next month, school districts, revealing their plans talking to educators and parents on how to implement those plans and then very likely changing those plans is the school year starts because as we know there are going to be plenty of plans in place that will seem good on paper but once you get in the school building will not work. And so there's can be a lot of adjustment on fly. We know that 10 school districts across the state are very different in terms of size and the makeup of their students. You got the huge districts in Charlotte Mac and wake County and then you got much, much smaller districts in other areas of the state and what makes me wonder is if this idea of the local officials really taking control. Knowing what time is best for their students what the challenges are etc. in each district, even down to each school is a kind of makes sense that the local folks are just stomach their plan to move on. It absolutely does make sense that the local should have been given much more flexibility in this and this is a point that was made by the Republican leaders of the Gen. assembly is that there are parts of the states there school districts that don't have much of a coronavirus problem that could go back to school under plan a where there is really minimal attention to coronavirus mitigation plans. There is the possibility that there are districts that could easily do a five days a week, perhaps with masks with very minimal social distancing with as much as close to a traditional classroom setting.

As you can get with some precautions taken in place, but this is not the case. Under the governor's plan. The plan that the governor set forth was that he was going to make a decision that all school districts will be subject to across the state with some flexibility's built-in but as the Republican leaders of the Gen. assembly point out, it's not flexible enough because it really is a nod to the one-size-fits-all idea that there each school district needs to approach their coronavirus mitigation measures in a common way and we know that that is not necessarily the case at such an important point because the governor has said well okay Plan B is the floor and if you want to be stricter in terms of limiting in person contact. You can go to plan C, the all remote virtual learning, but he is prohibiting school districts. The ones that you described it may not have much of a an issue at all, or smaller number of students he's preventing them from actually doing what makes sense for them that they had scratcher. It certainly is an and when you consider the charter schools are also subject to the governor's orders. These are individual schools so were not talking about school districts here and what makes sense for a charter school, a single school may not make sense for what the district has to do so were not just talking about school districts here were talking about charter schools and charter schools from the beginning. In my opinion should have had much more flexibility under the governor's orders than they do now but unfortunately now they have to do what school districts do and that doesn't make a whole lot of sense Terry as parents and teachers and administrators have been adapting now for months based on the coronavirus we've seen the virtual education for several months earlier in the spring.

Now we got this hybrid system that people are trying to adapt to.

Is it accurate to say that this is now crystallizing for everyone involved in an education that kids are different circumstances are different. Parents have different situations summer working parents.

Some are not.

In other words, is it helping people understand that they have some choices and they should be able to decide what works best for them. Gosh I hope so. I was called cynical by a radio host because I'm not sure the parents are or lease the system will get that message and and that's because there there are really caught up in the details. Looking at the bigger picture. That's the message that I hope this conveys is that this experience proves that one-size-fits-all is a very very poor approach to educating children and that really meeting their individual needs requires a whole lot more flexibility. A lot of educational options and a lot more differences in the types of schools that are available.

I want them to to get that message but as a parent is the spouse of of us, a schoolteacher, the there so much attention right now to the details and the unknowns and a whole lot of fear out there that it's going to take a while before that message sinks in. The John Locke foundation will make sure that it does in fact them tear you been writing about this for literally four years about the issues of school choice and all sorts of things. Thank you for joining us and then you say with this much more Carolina journal radio to come in just a moment tired of fake names tired of reporters with political axes to grind. What you need to be reading Carolina journal, honest, uncompromising, old-school journalism, you expect and you need even better, the monthly Carolina journal is free to subscribers sign you'll receive Carolina journal newspaper in your mailbox each month.

Investigations into government spending revelations about boondoggles who the powerful leaders are and what they're doing in your name and with your money. We shine the light on it all with the stories and angles. Other outlets barely cover but there's a bonus print newspapers published monthly by our daily news site gives you the latest news each and every day lot onto Carolina once, twice, even three times a day. You won't be disappointed. It's fresh news if you'd like a heads up on the daily news sign up for our daily email do that Carolina Carolina journal rigorous unrelenting old-school journalism.

We hold government accountable for you look back Carolina journal radio amateur coca. There's been lots of discussion about free expression and diverse political viewpoints on college campuses. A recent study focused on the diversity of views at just one campus UNC Chapel Hill business Prof. Mark McNealy co-authored the report he discussed its findings in an online presentation for the John Locke foundation. The reason we do across campus Wednesday. There's been a lot of discussion about the status of free expression and civil discourse on campus, but we think there's not a lot of space.

So we want to understand the culture of our institution that was important was like UNC from the expression dialogue standpoint we got what we learned UNC could be because UNC was represented at least a certain terrorist schools and universities. Universities press edition there wasn't a lot of evidence about straight on campus. Lastly, we thought the composition of a research team would improve the quality of our effort. McNealy and his colleagues conducted more than 1000 surveys in class. The majority of the pressers UNC try to discuss both sides of data that support this is when asked whether instructors encouraged participation will serve as alike agreed, and only a small portion disagree and even only 11% of those students is concerned overall positive data so there is there might be some indoctrination going on that wasn't consistent with what we found in our data doesn't happen some classes. I imagine so lease across the broad structures not that's pretty good news. On the other hand, the study shows the University does not consistently promote free expression students that within the classes that they were in the discussed politics concerned the percent rated percent lower in about 90% were concerned, here's a post on social media was more concerned about beers is about 36% of respondents so at least once a 25% the local McNealy and his colleagues also asked what students thought of people with opposing political views way students are pretty hesitant to apply positive about 28% response rate as conservatives of the liberal syndrome in my percent of students do as liberals and conservatives. However, they are quite happy to apply to more than 65% of students written, but as liberals conservative peers were racist and sexist by percent of response as conservatives are liberal. These concerns aren't limited to conservative students but McNealy says there is a difference between liberal and conservative concerns. Look at the question about expressing political views and self-censorship. Their concerns about expressing your views across the board and also her self-censorship.

Conservatives were multiple times that are concerned about getting more grace. Instructors appears having a low opinion and that's Mark McNealy business professor at UNC Chapel Hill. He spoke recently during online presentation for the John Locke foundation. Despite the bad news.

McNealy found one more reason for optimism is across political structure. One more opportunity to engage in. So surprisingly is concerned UNC but it's too few conservative speakers as liberal presents of service speakers are too few concerns because of the same document. Also, the same 37% say that the service speakers consider lastly which I think was a positive percent of response is liberal, 62% is moderate conservative constructive distant company for more research findings led McNealy and his colleagues to several recommendations reminding stands of the importance of free speech, expression, giving them some some suggestions for training for faculty to foster welcoming and inclusive environment of the classroom as he or speakers that provide space ideas from across the political, social, cultural, research on free expression dialogue to include not just underground but we also look at faculty, staff and ministry reminders about free expression ought to take place more than once your orientation is not a good place to start.

Just because doing a little blurb on free speech is good to continue that training sessions workshop dictations to the students how can faculty encourage free expression things I do in my syllabus is a statement for expression and constructive dialogue in the syllabus also cover that in the first class. What about increasing the variety of external speakers.

McNealy has ideas about the types of speaker who would be best is based on inviting provocateurs a lot of people that are well respected and have some research the Bassler discussion and so is there a way to go ahead and get going McNealy turned his attention back to students interest in their peers and how those peers judged for students especially is a time where peers are important. Just a couple pieces of the data you think that if you're conservative and you're probably a minority already on campus in terms of your points rate would probably we know that some of data and so number and you also know that there are people that don't have anything to do with you.

You you so it's like okay well do I and also using a large portion of those you have very negative views of conservatives which is probably why will you will be your friend.

There is social consequences to yourself as a conservative, so you really think about is is really worth it. Not going to. Also, from a standpoint of like what the social consequences of the time you're trying to make a lot of friends in you know partners is elegant time so it's that's that's a big pressure for. I think why you see conservatives self-centered number.

A significant portion, students, McNealy says conservative UNC students don't respond the same way in all instances running to students, but also sensor will say in class, not just make sure I follow the rubric serve so all should be okay sign.

You also see if she says she'll make a statement class and deliver the conservatives just say something you know, the longer everyone stays quiet in working order soon. There's no conservatives in the class.

McNealy says the perception among UNC faculty members is been good most part you've been there are some that you should read with any research? I will analogy is usually or interpreting this right of the administrators love this faculty welcomes research welcome the chance to have this conversation so I would say the majority of the professors in a recent release from what I found receptive to what we found her engaged in working on it. There's probably some that are not, but overall what pleases a group to the reception we got.

That's Mark McNealy business professor at UNC Chapel Hill. He delivered a recent online presentation to the John Locke foundation, the topic free expression on the University campus, North Carolina Journal radio. If you have freedom we got great news to share with you now. You can find the latest news, views, and research from conservative groups across North Carolina all in one place North Carolina it's one stop shopping. North Carolina's freedom movement and North Carolina You'll find links to John Locke foundation blogs on the days news Carolina reporting and quick takes Carolina Journal radio interviews TV interviews featuring CJ reporters and let foundation analysts, opinion pieces and reports on higher education James G. Martin Center for academic renewal, commentary and polling data from the scimitar's Institute and news and views from the North Carolina family policy Council. That's right, all in one place North Carolina that's North Carolina spelled out North Carolina Try it today. North Carolina is changing not just day-to-day but outward to our minute to minute.

Even 2nd to 2nd, how can you keep up with the changes, especially the ones that affect you, your family, your home, your job, make the John Locke foundation and Carolina Journal part of your social media diet on Facebook like the John Locke foundation like Carolina Journal. Follow us on Twitter at John Locke in the sea and at Carolina. Journal news, insights and analysis you'll find nowhere else. Thanks to the experts at the John Locke foundation and thanks to the first-class investigative reporting of Carolina Journal. Don't wait for the morning newspaper. Don't wait for the evening news if it's happening now it's happening here the John Locke foundation and Carolina Journal have you covered with up to the second information like us on Facebook the John Locke foundation and Carolina Journal. Follow us on Twitter at John Locke NC and at Carolina. Journal. Who knew you could shop and invest in freedom at the same time it is true online shopping is now a great way to support the John Locke foundation just shop using the Amazon smile program and designate the John Mott foundation to receive a portion of your purchase amount that's right you shop Amazon donates money to pass the John Locke foundation. Here's how long. Time to Amazon smile is the same Amazon you know same products same prices. But here's what's better is on donates 0.5% of the price of your eligible Amazon smile purchases to the John Locke foundation. Be sure to designate as the nonprofit you want to support. It's that easy.

So now not only will you enjoy what you buy. You also support freedom. Don't forget log on to today, something nice and help defend freedom, help support the John Mott foundation Qubec Carolina Journal radio language coca the COBIT 19 pandemic is produced multiple heartbreaking tales. Some of them involve residents of nursing homes and long-term care facilities, state representative Karen Jones discussed one sad story.

During a recent legislative briefing, Jones addressed his comments to the head of the North Carolina Department of Health and Human Services earlier this week I received a letter from a position affiliated with the Congaree living facility here in North Carolina it was addressed and sent to you approximately three weeks ago and I know you been busy, so the lack of response on your part is certainly understandable.

Let me take a moment to sum it up for you right now describes a couple in their 80s. Moving into the wings of the same facility. The husband and assisted living the life and independent care have been separated, unable to see each other for 13 weeks because of DHS regulations. This couple has been married for over 50 years, the husband voice to his caregiver, a desire to hurry this up and die because he could not see or touch his wife is been clinically depressed since the start of 19 because of the deprivation of social contact when they were finally allowed to see one another. Last week they were forbidden to touch and had to view one another through a glass divider and sobbed for 30 minutes before saying a word to his wife. This couple has been the product of 1/4 of a year together as they near the end of the DHS regulations are responsible not only for higher concentrations of COBIT 19 in congregate facilities they are causing significant heartbreak for their residence story. I just shared with you is almost certainly not the only one and it extends beyond marriage, children, grandchildren, siblings are now cut out of interaction with one another.

Apparently as a state we have moved beyond simply made saying that certain occupations are essential and nonessential. We are now experiencing. DHS regulations are tearing asunder the bonds of human life positive lasted for 45 and even six decades. I appreciate the time that you're putting into this.

I do think that this is an issue that needs a result and needs it soon.

This is not something that we can put into a panel discussion necessarily and come out with a solution, two, three, four weeks from now.

These are people that are truly dying from depression.

That's state representative Karen Jones was also a medical doctor he's sharing his concerns about state health department restrictions linked to covert, 19 return with more Carolina Journal radio where doubling down on freedom at Carolina Journal radio were proud to bring you stories that impact your life and your wallet. And now get twice as much freedom when you also listen to our podcast headlock available on iTunes headlock is a little bit different. It's a no holds barred discussion that challenges softheaded ideas from the left and the right, like Carolina Journal radio headlock is smart and timely but with headlock you hear more about the culture wars get some more humor as well.

We guarantee great information and a good time that's listen to Carolina Journal radio each week and listen to headlock to remember, you can listen to or subscriber download each week iTunes Carolina Journal radio and headlock just what you need to stay informed and stay entertained both brought to you in the name of freedom by the John Locke foundation Qubec Carolina Journal radio I Mitch coca some North Carolina lawmakers want to ensure that all hospital patients have at least one person by their side. Even during the COBIT 19 crisis. That's the idea behind the new patient left alone back Republican State Sen. Warren Daniel discussed the reasons underlying the bill patients are not diagnosed with having 19 and been forced to be alone during the treatment for various serious conditions, traumas, illnesses, heart attacks and routine, both routine and emergency surgeries, some of whom were alone for the entire course of their treatment in the interest of the state and its residents that are hospital patients be allowed at least one immediate family member designated health care agent, guardian or parent to be physically present at reasonable times throughout the hospitalization. Patients need an advocate for their treatment and the need to love and support of at least one family member Sen. Jim Carrey has worked with Daniel on the new patient left alone legislation during a time of crisis or emergency. It's it's easy to overreact or rush to judgment and I think that there's probably not a lawmaker in the room or in the general assembly that hasn't heard from someone some constituent is been impacted in some way, but by not being able to see their loved one. I think the knee-jerk reaction that we would all have is to say, that's absolutely rigid. Listen, you must build a have someone no matter what and I think that's a reasonable fall. If your compassionate person after holding and thinking about the situation and in thinking through different scenarios and having conversations with the healthcare Association we came up with some some interesting scenarios and caveats of what else and we felt like we needed to take steps is on those conversations to give them more flexibility and to understand that these are very uncertain times and we need to add a certain amount of weight to both sides of the equation the needs of the patient and the family which are very real and the need to keep the healthcare environment safe. This is about people.

This is about family about relationships and it is important to have someone there to provide that emotional moral support.

Lawmakers heard from people who could benefit from the new patient left alone act. State representative Michelle Presnell shared a personal family story.

I had a heart attack. He ended up being flown by helicopter to Mission Hospital in Asheville it with family able to speak on his behalf. He was totally aligned with the doctor finally came in to talk with him on Thursday morning. He told me sending him home with 25% of his hard-working devastating to me because I thought how take care someone with 25% of their heart and not medically know these kind of things he said. I think this is that I don't know how we can do this is in the parking lot waiting for his release had been there for 10 o'clock that morning to a truck with a couple of days that's been in and out to the day I met we strike up a conversation. I told him about Keith in his heart and bulldozer every day.

I had a heart attack 10 years ago, sitting here right now with 25% of my heart will make me feel so why did not Suzanne Warfield offered lawmakers another first-hand account in support of the new patient left alone act. My mother Jane Braswell to North Carolina hospital on Thursday, April 9 and was there for six days without any family or loved ones with her she had to thrive and can barely think at times that the economy repeatedly every day me to call the nurses station because often no one would come to her room.

She pushed the combat I also had to call the nurses station several times each day to try to get update from the mother's condition, results of the test and to request that a doctor called me to discuss her condition. My mother was Tuesday, April 14 and died two days later we were told that her issue had resolved itself and thought she was going to be okay. One of the reasons listed on her death certificate was pneumonia and I had no idea she ever had pneumonia. A doctor or nurse ever to inform me of that day by my parents died in the past when they been in the hospital and I know that patients need that loved one went down.

To be sure that they are getting the attention they need to discuss their situation with the doctor and ask questions. Nurse Kathy Dula told lawmakers about one of her patients.

I have spent my lifetime doing emergency medicine and neurotrauma so I'm here to speak on behalf of the Scott Starnes family on April 26. Mr. Starnes is involved in an automobile accident in Claremont area of North Carolina with a young man running in excess of 100 mph he crossed the dinner lane and hit Mr. Starnes head down. Mr. Starnes suffered me and Mimi multiple issues and injuries that were life-threatening and most life-threatening issue that he has brain trauma that he suffered take him to surgery immediately upon arrival to the facility families. They are probably going to surgery, but they were not allowed to see him at all.

Mr. Starnes is allowed one visit with his wife after I contacted our Sen. Mr. Daniel to assist me in the five and half weeks that Mr. Starnes was in the hospital. He was only allowed two hours of visitation time with his wife after Starnes passed away on June 3, with no one by his side. Donna Maguire told lawmakers about the medical problems. Her husband Tim has faced in recent months. Tim developed a brain tumor in 1991 after removing the tumor. He underwent 30 radiation treatments negative effects of the treatments left calcification on the brain caused occasional seizures mountain nation in nature, but he was fully functional for the next 20 years. In 2010.

Tim suffered his first drug he did not fully recover but was still somewhat independent but was deemed discipled at that time. 2019. He suffered another stroke caused him to have constant seizures. Tim was hospitalized and put into a medically induced comfort 12 days I was allowed to stay with him around the clock. During this time he was not able to communicate with medical staff and I was his voice and his advocate 29 2020. Tim suffered another striped in a different part of his brain. He was taken to the ER and I was only allowed a brief visit with him before being transferred to errors made in his care. During the last day were a direct result of the hospital not allowing me to be there to advocate for him to become nonverbal and was unable to question their decision not to monitor seizure activity had been allowed to stay with him. I could have spoke up and asked why doctors orders were not followed. Ken Sharp explained the lawmakers that he and his brother have been hampered in efforts to take care of their ailing mother. Gov. Cooper's emergency orders took turns going to visit her check up on her. She's in her late 70s he has entrusted assistance to check on the day we have set up months ago she was met at the Cohen Hospital in Greensboro ER for complications related to your heart medicine see her sense to go mother the hospital. She was sent to Blumenthal's rehab in Greensboro for treatment. Continue straight upon and we have received no explanation is not able to advocate for herself. Effectively she needs us to help her navigate the system so that she understands what is going on. She has been despondent repeatedly due to extreme boredom and loneliness.

We have been very frayed at several points as she could follow afterlife close family contact both facilities and repeatedly refused to fallacy cedar siding Gov. Cooper's orders really loud occasional telephone contact the staff to bring her telephone to use this is outright abuse. That's Ken Sharp, one of the speakers supporting North Carolina's new patient left alone act will return with more Carolina journal radio in a moment really influence you either have it or you don't and at the John Mott foundation we have it, you'll find our guiding principles in many of the freedom forward reforms of the past decade here in North Carolina. So while others talk or complain or name call. We provide research solutions and hope our team analyzes the pressing issues of the day jobs, healthcare, education, and more. When you look for effective ways to give you more freedom, more options, more control over your life. Our goal is to transform North Carolina into a growing, thriving economic powerhouse envy of every other state. Our research is how policymakers make decisions that ensure you keep more of what you are. Expand your choice of schools for your kids. Widen your job opportunities improve your access to doctors. The recipe for stability and a bright future for truth for freedom for the future of North Carolina. We are the John Locke foundation. Welcome back to Carolina journal radio Donna Martinez just over 100 days North Carolina voters will play a critical role in choosing the next president. The next US Sen. to represent our state as well as all of the people who will lead our state as governor and state legislators, members of the court, etc. it is a huge election.

That's not far away. Carolina journal is covering the key races and Rick Henderson who is editor-in-chief joins us now for a little update on how the campaigns are going in this time of COBIT 19 Rick welcome back to the program.

Thank you for so I can't believe that's it's come really, really fast. First of all, and then COBIT. 19 obviously is turned life on its head in every respect but politically give us a sense of what is happening. Are we starting late.

Really what we are because I think like one. One respect because people orders wondering now if there are going to be any major live public events between now and the election is quite possible there will not be we are still under the safer at home.

Phase 2 is the buzzword goes from Gov. Cooper's administration until August 7 is now the latest is now the earliest that it would be lifted and even if we enter into phase 3 whether or not it's safe at home. I don't know that so I going to allow full of public participation in large events and so some of the more notable investment. None of 4 July barbecues take place are usually these big political rallies. These low dollar fundraisers where there's a lot of meet and greet opportunities that that's long gone. There may not be anything like that in. We may not have state fair this year. They're still planning for that the amount state fair West is already been canceled but the we may just see a situation in which there will be a political campaign that takes place with none of these rallies or none of these church picnic type events that allow people to meet with candidates in this just that's unprecedented since maybe it happened in 1918. I don't know a lot of folks are talking about, well, you know, rather than voting in person.

I may just step file for an absentee ballot so that could completely change the whole complexion as well. Yes people. If people are not going to the polls. There's networking that takes place around polling places people may choose not to go to early voting sites I may just do it all by mail and this is a completely different sort of atmosphere in this atmosphere that that tends to play in some candidates hands better than others. Let's talk about the race for governor. We have Lieut. Gov. Dan Forest is the Republican nominee versus Roy Cooper wants a second term. So Dan Forest has filed a lawsuit related to the executive orders and emergency powers that Roy Cooper has used during COBIT 19 Cooper seems to be leading in a number of polls right the governor is still seems to be ahead by possibly double digit margin will double digit margin and a number of the polls within the government force having a hard time making inroads on that the especially during a time of emergency. Governor of course has much larger pulpit is his megaphone is much louder than it would be during normal times, and to some extent the keeping the state locked down is to the advantage of someone or to the disadvantage of someone who needs actually out about leading people, great people have not been able to do that is disrespectful.

Therefore, strikes exactly Dan Forest has been known during his campaigns for having a very involved and robust grassroots effort to get out the vote effort visiting every nook and cranny as the saying goes, and so with the pandemic that has been curtailed, but I also hear that the force campaign has a pretty deep and robust social media effort going on so they're not completely off the rate they have had a couple of foot in person rallies as well. Small small groups will the campaigns are releasing their first couple of ads.

The. The interesting contrast between the two the Dan Forest and is almost like a surreal morning in America kind of thing away morning and North Carolina's notion that that Lieut. Gov. Forrest is the person who can really help rebuild the economy.

You can bring can bring back the state from this precipice of near depression brought on by covert. 19.

The ad from Gov. Cooper is very very somber.

This is a tough time and we need someone who's strong, who can help us eventually get back at some point.

Maybe it is not the tenor of it is not is very resolute and not real update in the forest ad seems to be much seems irresolute and upbeat and so this is a different zero action contrast about the race for United States Senate, where we have the Republican incumbent Tom Tillis seeking a second term, his Democratic challenger is Cal Cunningham look at the polling on that and that is essentially tied. So does that mean that Tom Tillis should be really concerned about what's happening here. What he should be concerned simply because he never has surpassed 50% approval ratings as far as I know from his entire time in the U.S. Senate. He has been underwater or close to it and this is a good sign for incumbent and the other thing is that you do have a very concerted effort by national Democrats to try to pick off a handful seats in which you do have incumbents who are running and the interesting thing about that is that some of these races are with people such as Sen. Tillis, Susan Collins of Maine, Cory Gardner, of Colorado Senators who have not always been close to Pres. Trump and so they see that as a sign of the resident is ace is a sign of vulnerability away in that these are people who need Pres. Trump to do well on their home state for them to succeed and there were times that they have had diversion opinions were present trouble very serious center.

Tillis's treatment of the best he can serve men.

Those fences if you will, but I guess also pull those that that will seed of doubt about it, so it's not helpful to the Tillis campaign at all.

Seeking a Pres. Trump. That's a really interesting scenario as well. Now we got to former VP Joe Biden, who presumably will receive the official nomination of the Democratic Party. We had a recent Republican primary in the state of Alabama where Pres. Trump with his endorsement really ended up in a surge, a big win for the candidate that he endorsed them and against Jeff sessions, the former Atty. Gen. which Pres. Trump essentially on social media campaign against some people are saying that shows the president strength. Although Alabama Republican state right make it a helmet was really fascinating because Tommy tumble former Auburn University head football coach in the race against Jeff sessions, who was Pres. Trump's Atty. Gen. Remember in the first member of the Senate to really publicly go to bat for Donald Trump back in 2015. He was the was the about the only prominent elected official of the country who was really standing behind Pres. Trump early and got thrown overboard. Tub revealed one fairly comfortably against the total will be running against incumbent Democrat Doug Jones who just barely one last time around. This is going to be one of those races can be interesting washable because Republicans think they can get the seat back.

It's a very strongly red state.

They think they can get it back. But if they can't then insist it's going to be an indicator that could be a long night for Republicans nationally can Joe Biden do well essentially in in the pandemic. By doing these news conferences from his basement, apparently in and things like that without actually getting out and about some point to get out and do things before crowds of people in more areas were spontaneous and like it is interacting is actually very strong with that sort of thing. Well it is only a little more than 100 days away, Carolina journal covering all of the key races here in North Carolina.

Rick Anderson is editor-in-chief. Thank you thank you all the time we have for Carolina journal radio this week. Thank you for listening on behalf of Mitch Martinez join us again next week for more Carolina journal radio Carolina journal radio is a program of the John Locke foundation to learn more about the John Locke foundation donations support programs like Carolina journal radio send email to development John Locke 66 GLS 166-553-4636 Carolina journal radio is the John line foundation, Carolina free-market think tank and Carolina broadcasting system, Inc. all opinions expressed on this program are so clearly reflect the station. For more information about the show. Other programs, foundation John Locke toll-free at 868 JL would like to thank our wonderful radio affiliates across Carolina and our sponsors. Carolina journal radio. Thank you for listening.

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