Overreaction or Proper Reaction (Hour 3)

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Humanity has been shaped by moments in which one person approached a crowd with something important to say. I'm Jon Meacham, and this is It Was Said, Season 2, a creation and production of C-13 originals, a Cadence 13 studio in association with the History Channel. It Was Said, Season 2. Listen and subscribe for free on the Odyssey app or wherever you get your podcasts. That's what I'm talking about. We're coming to you live from the Rocket Mortgage Studios. Whether you're looking to purchase a new home or refinance yours, Rocket Mortgage could help you get there for home loan solutions that fit your life.

That's right, Rocket can. Appreciate Angelo Cataldi joining us in the last hour. Jeremiah Trotter Jr. is going to be stopping by 20 minutes from now. Clemson fifth in the country. They have a big matchup against Syracuse this upcoming weekend and in the final hour of the show at 9 20 p.m. Eastern, 6 20 p.m. Pacific. Kyle Whittingham, always love when we talk to coach from Utah.

He's going to stop by Utah off their big win against USC, where Cam Rising, come on up for Cam Rising, Clemson had five touchdowns in the game against USC. They come from behind. They get the job done. They go for two as coach Whittingham and Cam Rising and Dalton Kincaid.

Very, very, very aggressive. And Utah takes down USC and Hickey that Utah USC game and the Pac-12 has been better than what anyone could have expected this year. It is typical Pac-12 because USC was well on their way to go into the college football playoff and they still could.

It's still on the table here. It's not in the realm of possibilities. You got to win out though. You got to win the Pac-12 championship, but we're starting to see or what we're getting the sense of.

And it's been this way for the majority of the season. The SEC is going to get two teams. Now you throw Tennessee into the conversation.

So it could be a combination of any of the three. Just pick two Tennessee, Georgia and Alabama. You know, either Ohio State or Michigan going to win the Big 10 and we'll get one of those spots. That last spot, it's going to be fascinating because I didn't think with what we saw early from Clemson that Clemson would have got through this season undefeated. But now you look at their schedule and Syracuse has been a pain for them the last few years. If they get past Syracuse, and I don't think you should be shaking in your boots.

I know Syracuse has been a wonderful story this year, but hey, on any given Saturday, anything could happen. But it's starting to get the sense that Clemson is going to run the table. And if they do run the table, unless you have an undefeated Big 12 or an undefeated Pac-12 champ, you're not going to have a spot really for the Big 12 or the Pac-12 to get into the college football playoff, assuming Michigan, Ohio State gets in and two SEC teams get in and Clemson runs the table. So if you're the Big 12, if you're the Big 12 or the Pac-12, well, UCLA could still go undefeated and Dorian Thompson-Robbins is a tremendous player.

For the Big 12, it's TCU with Sonny Dykes and their quarterback now, Max Duggan. If you guys go undefeated, you may have a better case to make than Clemson. Now Clemson, if they win this weekend, they get three top 25 wins.

I know they aren't the strongest opponents. ACC is not having a good year, but if you have a case to be made, you're going to need to be undefeated unless you get Clemson suffering a loss and still finding a way to win the ACC championship. So you need Clemson to go down because the odds probably of UCLA and both TCU, one of them going undefeated the rest of the way, I would not think are in their favor of UCLA and TCU.

It's good and bad. It has its drawbacks of being in a competitive good conference. And for the Big 12 and the Pac-12, that's one of the tough areas is just, there's a landmine every single week. Whereas look at the ACC, it's another weak year where there's not a lot of true teams that are going to stand in the way of a team like Clemson. And now you're looking at encircling a team like Syracuse to kind of make it easier for other schools across the country to kind of open that door a little bit. Do you think Syracuse continues to be a pain in the ass for Clemson? I think we'll be close. I don't think they win.

Right. DJ started instilling some confidence in you, DJ on the line. And not only DJ, we know that defense is good.

Shipley is a heck of a player, the running back. If that game was at Syracuse, I would say, okay, Syracuse is going to have a shot. I think Clemson is going to win by 10 points this weekend. I think they're going to win by at least 10 points this weekend.

And sometimes you just got to admit when you're wrong on a team. I was wrong on Clemson before the start of the year. I didn't think DJ on the line was going to play this great. You know, their defense was going to be good. And even against Wake Forest, that defense struggled. And that was the game, the stretch of Wake Forest and NC State. We kind of thought they would drop one of those games with how they looked. I know the Georgia Tech score is misleading, but how they looked up against Georgia Tech early, the fact that they got unscathed from those two games, Wake Forest and NC State, I would be surprised at this point if Clemson's not in the college football playoff.

I really would. And you may have the Big 12 champ and the Pac-12 champ may be better than Clemson, but if you have Clemson undefeated as the ACC champ, they're going to get it. They will get in the college football playoff. Is there a way that we only get one SEC team in? Is there a chance that we only get one SEC team in? I'm trying to think what the scenario would be.

Would you know what the scenario would be then? Yeah, Tennessee loses two games. Georgia loses once for the SEC title game. Alabama loses another game.

It's still by far out there. It's still half a season to go. But right now, you would assume that Alabama's still going to be the SEC title game. Ole Miss?

That's something too. If Ole Miss beats Alabama, and they're sitting there undefeated, you can't just swap teams, but it's still three teams. But then you basically just swap teams, and let's go into that operation, that Ole Miss is undefeated going into the SEC title game.

If they lose that game, you would think they're still going to get in if they have one loss on the season, right? It'll be interesting. What happens if a two-loss Alabama makes the SEC title game? Two-loss Alabama makes the SEC title game and wins. They would get in.

It'll be interesting. Well, who would be the team that they'd be going... Would it be Georgia, Tennessee with how many losses? One? Or maybe none?

It's actually none. But if they lose, it's one. You would think that... Well, you would think if they beat Georgia, Tennessee, and that's Georgia, Tennessee's first loss, you would still get two teams in. But if you have a two-loss Alabama... Do you think it's out of the realm of possibility that Alabama loses again before... Out of the realm of possibilities? Before December. Before the SEC title game.

I don't think it's likely, but I wouldn't say it's out of the realm of possibilities. I would say the first game that jumps out is Ole Miss. They had Mississippi State coming up.

If they can't quickly flush that game from last week, who knows how these kids are going to respond? Alabama has not looked right. They didn't look right against Texas when they got the break when Quinn Ewers went out. They still had to grind out that game.

Texas A&M, I know that they were without Bryce Young, but they still didn't look right in that game. What were they, like a 27-point favorite still? The game was 24 to 20?

24, I think it was? Yeah. And last week kind of just captured what this Bama season has been. They came back, they had a fight, they had a chance to win the game, and they missed the field goal.

And Saban after the game... What did he say the other day? That they just looked nervous? They didn't seem like themselves? They didn't have the same juice. They didn't have that confidence.

That's my big question. You'll know early what type of Alabama team this is up against Mississippi State. But their stretch for the end of the way, Mississippi State, LSU, Ole Miss, Austin Peay, come on. And then Auburn, they could lose the game. They could. They could lose another game. It's not out of the realm of possibilities. I'm not going to tell you, though, it's like a lock that it's going to happen.

Because here's why. Bryce Young is phenomenal. He's sensational. He may be the first quarterback taking in the draft this year. I know everyone's going nuts over C.J.

Strad, and people love Will Levis. And Bryce Young is not large, but he plays like a big dude. He has a big time presence on the field. Like, he wasn't the reason they lost that game against Tennessee. He was great. He scored 49 points.

And you even said it, right? Even if he plays coming off that AC joint injury or a sprain, who knows what he's going to be? And he didn't look injured to me.

He did not look injured to me. So just like last year, and you recall, remember last year, how difficult it was in the Iron Bowl. With their season on the line, it looked like it was over. And it looked like they were going to get another loss. And with their season on the line, he not only stepped up, he balled out.

So this is going to have to come down to Bryce Young taking them on another magical ride. And you want to take a glance at the difference between this Alabama team and years past? These receivers? Dude, these receivers are not good.

There's no receiver that really makes you shake in your boots. And how many times you see receivers get hurt last year? They still had like guys that were unbelievable.

The Alabama receivers the last decade have been remarkable. So they are basically asking Bryce Young to save the day. And he saved the day up against Texas. He was about to save the day up against Tennessee. And a kicker let him down.

There's no wiggle room. And then the defense let him down. That's the part that no one's been, people haven't been talking about enough, a hot take Kiki, is that that field goal misses with 15 seconds left.

15! And your defense can't find the way to get their asses off the field? Or not basically look like Swiss cheese or be butter as Clemson is the hot knife and they go right through you? It's up to all the other players in Alabama to do their job. Because you know the quarterback, Bryce Young, as long as he's healthy is going to do his job. Can the other guys step up?

That's the question. And you saw last week, those other guys, they didn't step up. And you mentioned Bryce Young kind of doing what he did last year, taking on a magical ride.

I don't even know if that's even enough. I mean, we saw last week, scored 49 points and lost the game. Like Bryce Young could ball out even this week. Like Mississippi State is a bad matchup. This is a bad matchup for Alabama. They throw the ball all over the yard. That secondary is awful.

And now you're going to have to basically do it all over again. It's not good. Well, that's the thing last week. We can talk about checks and balances. And we know Bryce Young's the executive branch, but the defense can't have a pulse in 15 seconds.

Like I'm not asking them to reach for the stars here. I'm asking you to get the damn game to overtime, right? Like, weren't you shocked that that game didn't get to overtime? That was inconceivable to me how that game didn't get to overtime after that missed field goal.

Now, I think Henson Hooker is a great quarterback. You know, this is not Patrick Mahomes against the Bills in the playoff game, but that's what it felt like. It was a 50-yard field goal. They get the ball back.

There's 15 seconds. Make a play. How about the field goal kicker for Alabama? Make a kick when Bryce Young coming off an injury is balling out like that. Throws the ball 52 times, 455 yards, two passing touchdowns. Gibbs getting three rushing touchdowns. You couldn't have your kicker or your defense, I don't want to say bail you out, but help you out?

In a game where, look how many points are already on the board? You can't make one lousy play in 15 seconds. That's brutal.

It is brutal. And Saban, he called out his team this week, and now we'll see how they respond. But let's just say if Alabama gets another loss and then doesn't win the SEC championship game and almost doesn't either, if Georgia and Tennessee, when they're on that collision course to play each other, if that's just the one loss, like let's say Georgia wins and Tennessee has one loss. All right, is it one loss like then in that scenario?

Let's just say that's a scenario, Ryan. Tennessee, one loss. Or you want to go Georgia because Georgia is the bigger name.

Which one do you want to have not win the SEC championship under the scenario real quick? Doesn't matter. I don't think it matters this year.

Okay, so you don't think it matters anyway. One loss, Tennessee, one loss, Georgia, would then- Tennessee's resume is what it is right now. They lose to just Georgia. Would still get in. What happens if you have a one loss, Tennessee?

No. No SEC championship, but one loss, Tennessee. And you have an undefeated TCU and an undefeated UCLA. I do think the edge would still go to Tennessee.

Ah, I don't know. You're undefeated. The big 12 is deep. The Pac-12 is deep.

You have a nice, especially if it's TCU, you have a nice resume of four or five. Do you think TCU is going to be on the feet at the end of the year? No. Um, I don't, but I mean- Do you think UCLA is going to be on the feet at the end of the year? I would say no as well.

You do? Probably not. I think there's a good chance of it, but I guess still I'll say no now, but- Okay, so if you have a one loss, Tennessee, against let's say a one loss big 12 champ and a one loss Pac-12 champ, and Tennessee doesn't have an SEC title, well, I would still think the committee's going to go Tennessee's way. Depends how they lose to Georgia. If they do, you know, if that's the one loss we're giving them. They lose by a field goal.

Easier. They lose by a touchdown. Less than a touchdown. Touchdown to us.

Handled. Tougher to make the case. Also, I think it also depends on how Alabama does. Alabama spirals and they have like two more losses.

I think it's all of a sudden the Alabama loss or win gets less important. Eh, I would be stunned, stunned if we don't have two SEC teams. So really with the College Football landscape, we're looking at two SEC teams. We're looking at either Michigan, Ohio State, and then it's who's going to get in and Clemson, the big 12, and the Pac-12 as well. If I take a guess right now, if I had to give you my four teams right now, no order.

Georgia, and you know me. I've said this all throughout the year. I will not pick against Alabama even, you know, until they lose. And even then, like if you would ask me to get in weak, I would probably tell you I would still believe in Bama. But I'm starting to get concerned by those Saban comments.

So I'll give you this right now. Georgia, Tennessee. I give the slight, slight edge to Michigan, to Ohio State. And then I think it's going to be Clemson.

That's what I think the four teams are going to be this year. I know we got to get to Jeremiah Trotter Jr. just real quickly. I just want to go through the Tennessee football schedule the rest of the way, and the Georgia football schedule the rest of the way. You know, it's good scheduling. After Alabama, you get T.N.

Martin. Like if there was ever a letdown, that's not the case. You get Will Levis in Kentucky. Then you get the big game on November 5th. Georgia, Tennessee, Missouri, Tennessee, South Carolina. The only two games that you really circle are Tennessee, Georgia, and then Tennessee, Kentucky, right? The rest of the way. Not Tennessee, Martin? No respect to UTM?

I thought you were going to make like a South Carolina or something like that. Jeez. Overlooking it. That's Upset City, right? They're on Upset Alert. You're talking about a prime letdown spot this weekend.

They have no goalposts. How are you going to play the game? They'll get them up. Forfeit the game. And then for Georgia, they play Florida this week. Then Tennessee. Or Florida next week, excuse me.

They're going to buy this week. Then Tennessee. Then Mississippi State. Then Kentucky. And then Georgia Tech. That's a good three-week stretch. A four-week stretch, really? Florida, Tennessee, Mississippi State, and then Kentucky.

I'll say this now. Is Georgia going to beat... I do think Georgia beats Tennessee. I think Tennessee's one losses to Georgia. I think Tennessee's in the college football playoff. Georgia in the college football playoff. And you'll get then Clemson.

And right now, give the slight edge to Ohio State over Michigan. Jeremiah Trotter Jr. joins us next from Clemson. It's the Zach Gelb show on CBS Sports Radio. Wherever you get your podcasts. Wherever you get your podcasts. You're listening to the Zach Gelb show.

We continue. It is the Zach Gelb show coast to coast on CBS Sports Radio. Clemson takes down Florida State last weekend to remain undefeated. Jeremiah Trotter Jr. in the game. Had 13 tackles.

And next up for number five Clemson as they welcome in number 14 Syracuse. And now joining us is Jeremiah Trotter Jr. from the Clemson Tigers. Jeremiah, congratulations on the win last week and a heck of a performance.

Appreciate the time. How are you? I'm doing good. How are you?

I'm doing fantastic. So last year for the Clemson standards, as you know, the season wasn't up to par. What was the vibes like this offseason?

And take me through what you guys did in the offseason to get back this Clemson train moving in the right direction. Well, I definitely feel like doing the offseason, our workouts, everybody had a different mindset. It's kind of like a redemption type year.

Just trying to work hard, make sure you're doing what you're supposed to do. But I feel like that mindset has been all year. And even last year we had that mindset. But you know, even coming off a season like that, we came up with a different vibe and just like our workouts and what we were doing, our preparation. I feel like there's a lot more focus coming into this year.

When you say a redemption season, what are you guys trying to prove? Just trying to prove that Clemson didn't fall off or to like the noise of people saying that Clemson isn't the Clemson that they used to be. But just try to quiet that down and prove to people that are doubting us that Clemson is still here. Clemson is still that team. You believe this group this year could win a national title?

No, I definitely do. I feel like we have the key players and I feel like we have the talent that we need to be able to do that. Jeremiah Trotter Jr. One of those key players is DJ Unglele, your quarterback. He was doubted off the season he had last year. Does it at all surprise you, the season that DJ's having? Because he's not only bouncing back, he's bouncing back in a big way.

It didn't surprise me at all. I know DJ, even since I got here my freshman year, I saw the way that he worked and I saw the way that he prepared. And I knew it was just only a matter of time before he showed that to the world and he's doing that right now during this season. Jeremiah Trotter Jr. here with us from the number five Clemson Tigers.

They host number 14 Syracuse this weekend in an ACC showdown. When you get to your running back, Will Shipley, we know how imperative he is to your team's success. You being a linebacker, potentially going up against him in practice from time to time, what do you learn from him and how does he just make the team better? So I learned, you know, just like his work ethic every day, I know he's going to bring that energy. He's going to challenge me and I feel like that makes me and as well as the defense better when you're going up against a running back like that, as far as tackling, pursuit to the ball and just, you know, just creating that competition every single day in practice.

Where is your game at now? In your sophomore season, you just had a big game against Florida State, 13 tackles. It seems like everything right now is really coming together for you.

Yeah, I feel like I'm really getting it, getting down and I'm just trying to make better, get better every single week, try to clean up mistakes that I've had in previous games and just try to put it all together. But, you know, the coaches always have a great game plan that I trust in, I try to study and just execute on getting it. Why did you pick Clemson a few years back? I'd say just because of the values. You know, Coach Sweeney is always preaching about, you know, being a man of God, being preaching about, you know, being a man of God, he preaches, you know, just caring for his players, a family mindset and just like the people that they bring in, not just as far as the coaching staff and all the guys that they have already have here, but the players that they're bringing are all really good people.

And I feel like that's just somewhere I really wanted to be. Jeremiah Trotter Jr. here with us. You come from a football family. We know what your father did in the National Football League.

He's a Philadelphia Eagles Hall of Famer. Just how big of a resource is your father in your development? Yeah, I feel like he's a big part because, you know, he's sharing all that knowledge that he gained while he was in the NFL. And I feel like that really helps out as far as me developing in my game and trying to, you know, just execute what I got to do on the field. And, you know, he's always giving me tips after the games.

We're watching film. He's, you know, being critical of the things that I need to get better at. And I just try to work with that in practice. And so on game day, it shows. I know you grew up around football, but how'd you really fall in love with it? Because just because your dad played in the NFL doesn't mean you had to play football.

But clearly you elected to take that path. Yeah, definitely. I always love the game of football. I mean, my dad being in the NFL and playing football was really extra because I just had a mentor ever since I was young to help me go on that journey and go down that path.

But that love for the game was always there. Was your dad your favorite player growing up? Did you like some other players? Yeah, yeah, I'd say he was. He's definitely my favorite player. You know, just what I can remember. I was really young when he played. But what I can remember, he was out there just wreaking havoc and doing his thing. But he's definitely one of my favorite players. So my dad also worked in radio.

And you obviously have a father that played football. I'm just wondering because now I try to write my own path. You're trying to write your own story as well. How are you trying to write the own Jeremiah Trotter Jr. story?

Oh, shoot. Just trying to go out there and ball every single game and just do what I got to do to show that I got it too. But I'm really just trying to focus on every single day, every single game, every single opportunity I have to go out there and show my abilities.

You know, I'm just putting in that work and hoping that the work plays off. When did you realize you were pretty damn good at football, though? I feel like, you know, ever since I was young, people say how talented I am and just telling me the type of player I can be. And my dad also telling me that. So whenever my dad's just reinforcing that into me, telling me, like, I can really do this, that really solidifies that I have the talent and I have the ability to be able to do that because I know he's always going to shoot me straight. He's going to tell me the truth. He's not going to sugarcoat anything. So I feel better about myself. When you guys are in the backyard, do you blow your old man off the ball now?

I may a little bit. You know, sometimes I blow him off the ball. You know, he's getting a little bit older, but he's still got it, though. You know, he's a pretty big guy, as well.

So he's not intimidated of you yet, is what you're saying. Wrapping up with Jeremiah Trotter Jr. from the Clemson Tigers. They're fifth in the nation. They go up against Syracuse this weekend. When you look at the film of Syracuse, they're having a nice surprise season. What stands out to you about the Orange Men's squad? I'd definitely say the quarterback and the running back, the very two key parts of their offense.

I know all around their offense is very good, but those two guys definitely stick out on tape as playmakers for them. Is this group satisfied so far, or is it still okay? We still have things to prove to get Clemson back to where they need to be. Yeah, no, we're definitely not satisfied. We're going to stay hungry throughout this whole season to prove the type of team that we can be and that we are. So we're definitely going to stay hungry. Well, Jeremiah Trotter Jr., good luck this upcoming weekend.

Noon Eastern on ABC. We're looking forward to the game Clemson against Syracuse, and keep on kicking ass. We appreciate the time.

All right, thank you. Good stuff right there with Jeremiah Trotter Jr. as Clemson has restored some faith in people right now for their college football playoff chances. They should be able to run the table the rest of the way in the ACC. Good game this upcoming weekend against Syracuse. And you would anticipate they'd be able to not only get to the ACC championship game, but be undefeated and win the ACC crown once again, especially with the way that one, DJ Wengolale, is playing. But as we've realized, week in and week out with college football, it could change all in the span of one game. We'll come on back. We'll do a little proper reaction or overreaction. Humanity has been shaped by moments in which one person approached a crowd with something important to say. I'm Jon Meacham, and this is It Was Said, Season 2, a creation and production of C-13 Originals, a Cadence 13 studio in association with the History Channel.

It Was Said, Season 2. Listen and subscribe for free on the Odyssey app or wherever you get your podcasts. Subscribe to your weirdest fears on the Odyssey app or wherever you get your podcasts from.

Listen and subscribe for free on the Odyssey app or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm currently watching this Tampa Bay Flyers game. My Rangers last night, Tampa's up 2-1. My Rangers last night got another victory. Mika Zbenijad is starting to look like Alexander Ovechkin on the power play.

I don't know how to contain myself. You got college football coming up this weekend, NFL this weekend, and obviously you got Major League Baseball playoffs, which are now going to be in the league championship series tonight. Already underway, Phillies and Padres. That game going to the bottom of the second, scoreless so far between you, Darvish and Zach Wheeler, and the Yankees win today. And that series will open up tomorrow because of the rainout last night. That series will open up tomorrow against the Houston Astros. So Yankees will get the Astros once again. At this point, Hickey, Yankees, Astros, I'm taking the Astros once again. Until the Yankees beat the Astros in a big series, in a big spot, I'm not going to believe it. So I'm rolling with the Astros.

Are you the same way in that series? Can you do me a favor here? Can you take your animosity out of this picture and just do who you truly think is going to win? Because I know you hate the Yankees. I know you take the Phillies. I want your genuine thoughts on who are going to win the ALCS and the NLCS. But in the ALCS, I'm going with the Astros. I mean, Tim, I can't pick the Yankees.

No, I'm not even saying hatred alone. Just how they play, how they match up. That clear, because usually when you get this late in the game, you let your fandom overtake and go, oh, I just hate that team. So I'm going to root against them and the other team's going to win.

Like I want your genuine thoughts, separate fandom and then your analysis. Let's just starting pitching lineup, bullpen, defense, all favors the Astros. And also the Astros haven't won since the whole cheating scandal. They've been a great team. It feels like they're due to win again.

It really does. Like I would be I don't want to say surprised at this point, but my expectation is with this being the final four Yankees, Astros, which that wasn't a surprise. That was inevitable. You could have never told me a month ago or even before the start of this post season that it would be the Phillies and the Padres not only both getting out of the wild card round, but then both getting out of the divisional round.

You would have thought for sure. Now the Mets, they go down to the Padres to take them out of the picture, but you would have thought for sure that either the Braves or the Dodgers would be sitting here. Now in the last series, I thought Philadelphia, just with the timing, the way they played up against the Cardinals with their pitching, their bats, that the Phillies, Girardi was a disaster, which I was surprised by.

Rob Thompson just injected new life in this team. The Phillies, other than the bullpen, are really built to win in October. So I wasn't surprised that the Braves lost to the Phillies, but I would have thought that one of either the Braves or the Dodgers leading with the Dodgers would have found their way to the NLCS.

The fact that none of them are there, oh, ah, man, that one's a stunner. This is a tough series to predict who's going to win between the Phillies and the Padres. I really thought the Braves are going back to the World Series.

I was convinced of it. I'm shocked they forget just not even get to LCS. Not even getting out of LDS. Well, they snatch your soul when they won the division. That has to play a factor. And I try to give them credit, calling them a good team. Well, they celebrated too much. They celebrated too much in the Mets demise that I don't know if maybe that did impact them up against the Philadelphia Phillies.

Who are you taking? Phillies and Padres. Padres close.

I think it was like six or seven. It's really tough series. That's a spite pick. No, but like I think the Padres have the better pitching and the bullpen. But with that said, the Phillies are playing like they are the hottest team in baseball right now.

And that's dangerous. I'll take the Padres though. I think these lineups are so good. Both of these lineups are excellent.

You know what? With the way that hater is pitching right now, I'll lean San Diego as well. I will lean San Diego as well in this one. I think this is going seven. I think that's going seven. I think the Yankees, Astros, let's say it will be six. What are your official predictions in terms of the numbers? Padres in six, Astros in five. Oh, wow. Okay. I'm going Astros in six and the Padres in seven.

And Astros win the World Series? Are we in agreement there? Oh, yeah. Yeah.

Fade, fade, fade, fade, fade, fade, fade. Let's get to a little overreaction or proper reaction. Another NFL week is complete, which means it's another week to freak out about your favorite team, which tanks are truly crazy. But sometimes a game can be so bad, it's almost good. You know what I'm saying? No.

And which are so crazy, they might be right. He's 6'5", he's 245 pounds. He's probably a Popeye's biscuit away from being a tight end. Zach lets you know in this week's edition of overreaction or proper reaction. All right, Zman, let's start with last night's game. That was excellent production. That was. Doug did a great job. Doug did a great job. Now, I gave you two weeks to come up with this hot take, Hickey, where I'm like, oh, two weeks ago, let's get some production. And then we finally get it. I'm not surprised about Doug, but I was hoping that the wait was going to be worth it. Usually Doug gets these things turned around like 24 hours for you. I think it took a little extra time to write the script, I guess. I don't know, but man, that was stellar stuff. That was spectacular. There's also moving parts. I get a voice by the people.

It's well worth the wait. Doug did a 10 out of 10 job. I could never say a bad word about Doug. Doug is one of my... You know, when I told Ricky Ricardo, he's a top five favorite person of mine in the company, and then he goes, oh, who are the other four? And I go, I can't tell you that.

I'll give you another one. I'll slowly reveal this list. Doug is definitely top five in the company.

Ricky Ricardo as well. So if you want to figure out who the other three are, go ahead and be my guest. What do you got for me?

All right. So coming off of Doug's tremendous, tremendous intro, let's go with last night's game. The Broncos lose again. Look dysfunctional, disorganized.

That is the fat lady that just ran to the studio was singing. Fat lady ending the Bronco seasons. With that said, overreaction of proper reactions act. Nathaniel Hackett should be fired by the Broncos by the bi-week. Two games. Is there a way to agree with this and then say it's not a proper reaction because he should have already been fired?

Yeah, that's a proper... I would fire him right now, you know, it's inevitable. You know, he's going to get fired at the end of the year and their next, what, two games where the buyer, the Jets and the Jaguars, the Jets are playing like a damn good team right now. Jacksonville has showed more of a pulse than the Denver Broncos. You know, it's nuts. If I told you for the year that when you go up against Jets and the Jaguars, you'd be hoping to split.

You would say I'm crazy. The Broncos would be lucky to split at this point. And then if you go into the bi at two and six, how do you defend that guy? And the only way he keeps his job is this way. Russell Wilson says, I don't want him fired. And it would actually benefit Russell Wilson to keep Nathaniel Hackett there for the rest of the season. Because the moment Nathaniel Hackett goes, right now, some people make excuses for Russ that Daniel Hackett related, but I think now a lot of people started to turn on Russ. But the moment that Daniel Hackett goes, it's all of the eyeballs on Russell Wilson. But yeah, I would get rid of himself.

I have no problem with that reaction. Let's stick in the AFC West then come into the era. We thought this was going to be the best division in the NFL, possibly a scenario where all four teams get into playoffs. Now, one third of the way through the year, Zach, on overreaction or proper reaction, two teams from the AFC West will make the playoffs from the AFC West, from the AFC West. Can I tell you who's not going to make the playoffs from AFC West first?

Sure. Raiders, Broncos, Chargers will, they're four and two, they haven't looked like a actual really good four and two team, but you got to think they're going to start to get healthier. Hopefully Keenan Allen can play again.

Hopefully the ribs heal for Justin Herbert. I am concerned about Staley, but I do think the Chargers will make the playoffs. And I also think that the Kansas city, how about them cheats, will make the playoffs as well.

So yeah, that is a proper reaction, right? That two teams from the AFC West will make the playoffs at least. One of the biggest surprises this year, so far through six games, the Atlanta Falcons, they are three and three.

And for those betters out there, a perfect six and O against the spread. So through six games is an overreaction or proper action to say the Falcons are playoff contenders. Contenders? So not that they'll definitely make the playoffs, they'll just be contending?

Correct. Well, here are the teams that will make the playoffs. Eagles, Giants, Cowboys. I'm a big time believer that all three make the playoffs there. Then, Minnesota's going to win their division. You have to have a team from the NFC West win their division.

And I do think the Bucks will win their division in the South. So that's six teams right there. The Falcons are scrappy. They probably will finish with the second best record in the NFC South, because I don't like the Saints, they're not healthy, and the Panthers stink. Packers, they're going to be in contention for a wildcard spot.

Rams are 49ers, one will win the division, one will be in contention for a wildcard spot. I don't think the Falcons are great. I don't even think they're very good, but they're scrappy. They're scrappy, and you may just need to be scrappy this year to make the playoffs in the NFC eight, nine wins in that range. Can the Falcons get there? Yeah, they believe in that coach, so I'll put them in the playoff contending conversation.

They're not going to make it, but they're in the conversation, so I'll go proper reaction. Through six weeks, there's one unbeaten team remaining as the Philadelphia Eagles. They moved to 6-0 after taking down the Cowboys on Sunday Night Football the other day. Over-action or proper action to say the Eagles right now are the best team in the NFL? I thought you were going to say you were going to go undefeated. No, no, we got to get to week 12. Have you looked at their schedule though?

I have not. Bi-week this week. Can't lose that one. Pittsburgh, Houston, commanders, Colts, Packers, Tennessee, Giants, Bears, Dallas, Saints, Giants, Giants, not Murderers Row. They'll lose.

Very manageable. They'll lose some games like maybe two, maybe three max. I don't think they're going undefeated, but you asked me, are the Eagles the best team in the NFL? They're the second best team in at number one.

I know they have a loss, but it's the Buffalo Bills. They're the most well-rounded team in the league, and then Philadelphia is right behind them in at number two. So the question was, are the Eagles the best team in the NFL? See, my answer would suggest that it's an overreaction, but like that's not like a crazy take. If you tell me that the Eagles are the best team in the NFL. So I'll answer this. Yes, it's an overreaction because I think it's Buffalo, but like that's not like nuts.

If someone makes a case for Philadelphia, because it is close. And finally, Packers have lost two games in a row now to the Giants and to the Jets. There are three. No pack, no. Yeah, pretty much. That's what they've been allowed. That's what a fan should be chanting pretty soon.

Oh no. Boy, oh boy, the offense has stunk. So is it a proper action or overreaction to say right now the Packers will miss the playoffs?

Overreaction. They're not going to win their division, but they're still right in the hunt to go snag a playoff spot as a wildcard team. And they have a gift this weekend.

Oh, it'd be even more of a gift if Carson Wentz was playing, but he's not. They have the commanders. You have the commanders, then you have the Bills. Okay, you lose to the Bills. You play the Lions. You should take two out of three there.

You got to think. Then they enter a tough stretch, a really tough stretch. After that for the Packers, Tennessee, the Eagles. They had the Cowboys actually before Tennessee. So it's Cowboys, Tennessee, and then the Eagles.

That's a tough three-game stretch. Then after that, you play the Bears. Rogers going to Chicago.

He'll dominate. And then to end the year, LA, Miami, Minnesota. The final game of the year is Detroit.

It's not an easy schedule. You got to beat Detroit twice. Got to beat Detroit twice.

And you got and you'll beat the Bears. So that's three wins right there. The other games and they'll beat the commanders. That's four wins. They have three wins right now.

So that's seven. Got to have Rogers show a pulse in some of those other games. And lead them to victory.

It's not easy. It's not a lot that they're going to make the playoffs. But I still, I'm not ready to say that they're going to miss the playoffs yet.

But I'd be concerned because you don't have the safety blanket of just winning the NFC North this year because the Vikings are already five and one. Zach Gelb here with you on CBS Sports Radio. We will take a time out. We'll come on back and we'll chat a little Russell Wilson and maybe also discuss some Dan Snyder. Podcasts.

I'm Jon Meacham. And this is It Was Said, Season Two. A creation and production of C-13 Originals, a Cadence 13 studio in association with the History Channel. It Was Said, Season Two. Listen and subscribe for free on the Odyssey app or wherever you get your podcasts.