Share This Episode
Viewpoint on Mormonism Bill McKeever  Logo

Christmas Book Citations Discourses of Brigham Young Part 5

Viewpoint on Mormonism / Bill McKeever
The Truth Network Radio
May 8, 2020 2:35 pm

Christmas Book Citations Discourses of Brigham Young Part 5

Viewpoint on Mormonism / Bill McKeever

On-Demand Podcasts NEW!

This broadcaster has 662 podcast archives available on-demand.

Broadcaster's Links

Keep up-to-date with this broadcaster on social media and their website.

May 8, 2020 2:35 pm

We are into the seventh week of a series focusing on books given away to other general authorities and church employees by the First Presidency between 1981 to 2017. If the First Presidency thought these books were worthy of being reprinted using expensive leather covers and gilded pages, they must be reliable and worthy to … Continue reading Christmas Book Citations Discourses of Brigham Young Part 5 →


Answering Mormons questions by Bill McKeever and Eric Johnson deals with 36 commonly asked questions by your LDS friends and neighbors. It's a great resource for Christians want to share their faith with friends and loved ones.

Be sure to pick up your copy today at your favorite Christian bookstore viewpoint on Mormonism program that examines the teachings of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints from a biblical perspective viewpoint when Mormonism is sponsored by Mormonism research ministry since 1979 Mormonism research ministry has been dedicated to equipping the body of Christ with answers regarding the Christian faith in a manner that expresses gentleness and respect. And now, your host for today's viewpoint on Mormonism welcomed this additional viewpoint on Mormonism on your host, Bill McKeever, founder and director Mormonism research ministry with me today is Eric Johnson.

My colleague at MRM continuing our look in the book discourses of Brigham Young compile relation of statements. Brigham Young, the second president of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints made while he was a leader in the LDS church in the 19th century in a book that was given away as a Christmas gift in 1992 by the first presidency of the church and that's why were going through it and other books that were given away as Christmas gifts because of we assume their doctrinal value in the discourses of Brigham Young. There is an interesting heading to a quote on page 97 that Eric. I think this is probably more editing problem than anything else.

But when I read this quotation with this phrase in front of it. You can understand why I drew the wrong conclusion. Let me explain what I'm talking about on page 97 it says in italics. Eternal increase and then it says whenever we get into the kingdom of heaven were God and Christ dwell, we shall find something more to do than sit and sing ourselves away to everlasting bliss that quotation is in quotation marks then it says the mind of man is active and we must have exercise in amusement for the mind as well as the body will remember we been explaining that this book is kind of like a regurgitation of quotations by Brigham Young, and it gives you a reference at the end of the paragraph where that quotation was originally cited, and in this case it comes from volume 12, page 313 of the Journal of discourses that why did I draw a wrong conclusion on this because when you read the phrase eternal increase and you know what that means in Mormonism to procreate eternally in and to explain what I mean by that. Eric, what's that citation from Joseph Fielding Smith attempt president of the church which explains what I'm talking about.

Now this comes from doctrines of salvation, volume 2, page 68.

He said those who attain to the exultation in the celestial kingdom shall have the power of eternal increase of posterity, and they shall be above all, because all things are subject unto them here you see Joseph Fielding Smith is explained quite clearly that eternal increase is this idea of eternally procreating. So why did this strike me funny when you see that heading, eternal increase and then it says that we shall find something more to do than sit and sing ourselves away to everlasting bliss.

I'm thinking he's talking about procreation here and I just thought that sounds so strange that Brigham Young even weeds make a statement like that. But here's the catch folks, this statement has nothing to do with eternal increase. When you look at it in its proper context. If you go to page 313 and volume 12, the Journal of discourses where this quotation comes from Brigham Young is talking about amusements like the theater and even mentions that he says I built that theater to attract the young of our community and to provide amusement for the Boys and Girls Club. Rather than have them running all over creation for recreation long before that was built. I said to the bishops get up your parties and pleasure grounds to abuse the people and then it goes on to say whenever we get into the kingdom of heaven were God in Christ will we shall find something more to do than to sit and sing ourselves away to everlasting bliss.

The mind of man is active and we must have exercise in amusement for the mind as well as the body is not talking about having exercise in amusement. Through the act of procreation. He's talking about in this context something like going to the theater and then even continues after that paragraph that says you go into that theater and what is there behind the curtain that would disgrace the most perfect lady on the face of the earth, not the least in the world has nothing to do with the understanding of it of eternal increase. I think another thing that this does show, though very clearly is the misunderstanding of what heaven is like, and when he says sit and sing ourselves away to everlasting bliss. We have many Latter Day Saints, to whom we have conversations and they oftentimes will say that they think our version of heaven is sitting on a cloud play in a harp and then it won't be any fun at all and wouldn't you rather be with your family and I think that's a complete misunderstanding of what heaven is, according to what the Bible teaches. I think the reason why a lot of Mormons find our understanding of eternity to be boring is because they don't have the same love relationship that we have with Jesus as our Savior, we can find eternal bliss and being with our Savior. For the price that he paid on our behalf. For Mormons that's not a real big deal because let's be serious in a Mormon understanding of eternity. Jesus really plays no role whatsoever. After the judgment. Now, everything focuses on the individual human himself who was fortunate enough in their view, to be exalted and to become a God to rule their own world as heavenly father rules this one. And as we mentioned before with that comment by Jeffrey Hall and how it wouldn't be heaven without his wife and his children. Jeffrey Holland doesn't get it. He thinks heaven is built all around his family.

But that's not what the Bible says it's built around the person of Jesus Christ.

But Mormons don't understand it that way.

So I think you're right in your conclusion regarding that. Here's another quote from the from the discourses of Brigham Young on page 56. He says this is the plan of salvation.

Jesus will never cease his work until all are brought up to the enjoyment of the kingdom in the mansions of his father where there are many kingdoms and many glories to suit the works and faithfulness of all men that have lived on the earth. Some will obey the celestial law and receive of its glory somewhat by the terrestrial and some the tea last yellow and others will receive no glory that goes along with what we said many times in the show and this being that when you're talking to a latter-day St. You asked them will are you keeping celestial law. I've often asked this question of Latter Day Saints and sometimes they don't even know what celestial law is so I have to educate them on what that phrase means.

But this is what Brigham Young is talking about. If you are keeping a celestial law you will receive celestial glory. If however you're not keeping celestial law. Let's say you're keeping terrestrial law. In other words, you're living the life you're believing things that will qualify you for the lower heaven of the terrestrial kingdom, then that's where you will go if you don't qualify for the terrestrial law, but you're not a son of perdition or anyone like that you're probably going to end up in the T celestial kingdom. The lower level. That's what Brigham Young is talking about. How does the New Testament teach anything like this. No, not at all. The word tea.

Last year was a made up word by Joseph Smith to begin with, you do find it in his Joseph Smith translation but it's not found in any other Bible version that I know of. And if I'm wrong on that. I would hope that a Mormon would certainly correct me on that.

Listen to this quote on page 392 what Brigham Young had to say.

The celestial kingdom.

The celestial is the highest of all the tea last yellow and terrestrial are also spoken up and how many more kingdoms of glory. There are is not for me to say I do not know that they are not innumerable. This is a source of great joy to me that is an odd statement because I can't recall ever hearing any leader in the Mormon church, making the comment quite like that now. Brigham Young was known to speculate.

You could say he was like the origin of Mormonism origin, being patristic, and so he did come up with a lot of things that he probably couldn't really justify, but merely they were ideas that he had putting these thoughts together and so forth, which of course makes it very confusing when you hear him say things like this because I've always understood that yes there is a celestial at the bottom there is a terrestrial above it and then you have the celestial now. I I know that Mormon leaders have taught that within the celestial kingdom. There are three levels in their they don't normally talk about the lower and the second level they always talk about the top level. This is known as the church of the firstborn. That is the goal of every faithful latter-day St. to get in the church of the firstborn, because that is where all the perks are given as a reward for an individual's faithfulness and so when you talk about celestial law. However, just getting into that kingdom is absolutely essential. Of course, but it takes living a certain life in order to qualify for that.

In other words, you have to have repented or confessed and forsaken all of your sins and you had to be successful at keeping all of the commandments. That's how celestial law has been defined. I think we had a rep at the show by explaining what a person has to do to be able to get into any of the kingdoms, especially the celestial kingdom. This first quote comes from page 87 of discourses of Brigham Young and he says we are placed on this earth to prove whether we are worthy to go into the celestial world.

The terrestrial or the tea last you'll or to help or to any other kingdom, replace and we have enough of life given to us to do this and then another quote on page 390 that shows how much you have to do listen to what he says if Brother Brigham shall take a wrong track and be shut out of the kingdom of heaven. No person will be to blame. But Brother Brigham.

I am the only being in heaven and earth or hell that can be blamed. This will equally apply to every Latter Day Saints salvation is an individual operation. I am the only person that can possibly save myself when salvation is sent to me. I can reject it or receive it. While those are pretty strong words.

Let's go back to that first quote that you had from page 87 Eric we are placed on this earth to prove whether we are worthy to go into the celestial world the terrestrial or the T celestial or to hell or to any other kingdom knows what Brigham Young is saying here. At least in this quotation he's saying. That's why were here on earth right now to prove ourselves worthy. This is what Mormons call the mortal probation and other leaders like Joseph Fielding Smith have made it very clear that this is the time for men to do what they're supposed to do if they hope to receive celestial exultation in the next life, but yet how many times have we heard some Latter Day Saints say will that's okay. If I don't do everything I'm supposed to do now I can make up for it.

After the resurrection. Does that sound like what Brigham Young is saying, at least in this quote he says and we have enough of life given to us to do this.

I think we need to ask Latter Day Saints were listening to us right now. How are you doing at that.

If you do ask your LBS acquaintance. If they're doing everything that's required for celestial exultation, don't be surprised if they don't know when you were given a long list of things you need to accomplish.

How can anyone know that they've met all the requirements for celestial exultation that is on that list. Thank you for listening. If you would like more information and research ministry.

We encourage you to visit our website you can request a free newsletter research. We hope you join us again as we look at another viewpoint is

Get The Truth Mobile App and Listen to your Favorite Station Anytime