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Cast Away the Dead Prophets Part 4

Viewpoint on Mormonism / Bill McKeever
The Truth Network Radio
September 15, 2021 9:45 pm

Cast Away the Dead Prophets Part 4

Viewpoint on Mormonism / Bill McKeever

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September 15, 2021 9:45 pm

Area Seventy Richard Neitzel Holzapfel recently gave a talk in Utah and explained to high school students how the church needs to drop the dead prophets and embrace the living apostles. Does this mean any living prophet trumps one who has died? Does this make any sense in the religion known as Mormonism? Bill and … Continue reading Cast Away the Dead Prophets Part 4 →


When sharing your faith with the Latter Day Saints helps to know what their church is taught in several basic topics. For this reason Gorman's research ministry has provided its crash course Mormonism crash course, Mormonism includes concise articles highlighting what LDS leaders and church manuals have taught on issues that will probably come up in a typical conversation.

You can find these informative articles. A crash course that's crash course viewpoint on Mormonism is a program that examines the teachings of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints from a biblical perspective viewpoint: Mormonism is sponsored by Mormonism research ministry since 1979 Mormonism research ministry has been dedicated to equipping the body of Christ with answers regarding the Christian faith in a manner that expresses gentleness and respect.

And now, your host for today's viewpoint on Mormonism. Should deceased LDS leaders like Spencer W. Kimball ignored by today's members of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints. Welcome to this addition to viewpoint on Mormonism on your host, Bill McKeever, founder director Mormonism research ministry and with me today is Eric Johnson.

My colleague at MRM this week we've been talking about a very short video clip that is on YouTube that has a Utah area 70 by the name of Richard Neitzel holds the full talking to a congregation and he's interviewing a couple of young people about their confusion when it comes to the topic of repentance holds a full system interesting comments that we've been discussing the one comment that really catches our attention is how he thinks that members of the LDS church need to get away from the book the miracle of forgiveness. In fact, Holzapfel actually says we don't want to go back into the miracle of forgiveness by Pres. Kimball. He says let's drop the dead profits and embrace the living others all sorts of problems with a statement like that. How do you drop the dead profits but then at the same time have a number of church manuals that do nothing but cite the dead profits. So it seems to me that it's up to the individual to subjectively choose which profits they should listen to that have since passed away. Or do we just get rid of them entirely. Will I don't even think Mr. Holzapfel does that in his daily lifetime. I wouldn't be surprised with all the books that he is written that he is probably cited dead profits on a number of occasions.

I think you bring out a good point as far as the church manuals all through the church manuals we have quote unquote dead profits being referenced but I think about the series they did a few years ago. For with the first 15 presidents of the church called teachings a presence of the church in the name of whichever profit we talked about and it wasn't done chronologically, but was a very important series because most of the books had 24 chapters so twice a month on the second and third Sundays LDS followers had to go and to church and after the service, they had an hour where they would discuss that particular chapter of a dead president. Now they're not doing that anymore. But the question is why would they have done that if these men didn't have teachings that were considered to be worthwhile and authoritative list talk about what Richard Neitzel holds the full has to say about the miracle of forgiveness because if he is saying that we need to get rid of that we don't want to go back to the miracle of forgiveness that raises I think an obvious question when you consider that the miracle of forgiveness written by 12 Pres. Spencer W. Kimball and by the way, I should ask doesn't area 70 really have the authority to criticize the 12th president of the church for what he is written in a book which for years was very, very popular among Latter Day Saints. One of my favorite strategies when I'm out evangelizing is to take copies of the miracle of forgiveness and hand them out.

I highlight the parts that I want people to be able to read I've handed out over thousand copies over the last seven years, 2019. I was at a BYU football game. Two young men came up to me and asked what I was doing and I said I'm given away. This book called the miracle of forgiveness in the just had the biggest smiles.

They were probably 17 or 18 years old and they said well that's our great-grandfather and so I had a chance to talk to them for just a couple of minutes. I have the picture of me with these two boys and I'm one of the webpages dealing with this topic, but what they said was that they are very proud about the book the family loves the book and they thought what I was doing was wonderful to hand out there great-grandfather's book for free because they said it has full truth in it and NII said a lot of people complain with me handing this book and they said there's no complaint to it at all.

You should be very excited that you're handing out Mormon doctrine when you hand those out. Can you imagine if those two young people were in this talk at that time. When this area 70 said that we should get away from that book. I wonder how they would've felt they told me very clearly the Kimball family is still very proud of the miracle of forgiveness that let's be very honest, I hate the book and I can understand why most Latter Day Saints don't like the book.

It's a great witnessing tool that's for sure. And I'm sure that's what you use it Erica so many times that I think a lot of the things that Kimball says, and there are things that no Mormon is ever going to live up to. And I think that's why these two young people in the video that we've been discussing this week are so perplexed they tend to know what's required of them. But the difficulty is living up to it so it's not so much that they don't know the definition of repentance. I think it's more the inability of being able to live up to that definition as it is defined by the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints 16th president Thomas S. Monson. He said some glowing things about the book the miracle of forgiveness in the any said this the year that Spencer Kimball died in 1985.

This quotation is found in Monson's book on the Lord's error in the memoirs of Thomas S. Monson in this citation is found on page 342 by the way, it can be This is what Monson said Pres. Spencer W.

Kimball has always been a prolific worker. He spent several summers working on a book which he later entitled the miracle of forgiveness as one reads the book, particularly the first portion. One wonders if anyone will make it to the celestial kingdom. However, in reading the final portion, it is apparent that with effort.

All can qualify that statement has always intrigued me because I've read the back of the book and I don't find myself being comforted in any way at all. What is Spencer W. Kimball say on the last page of his book the miracle of forgiveness. The third to last paragraph of the final page, page 368 says this what relief, what comfort, what joy those laden with transgressions and sorrows and sin may be forgiven and cleansed and purified.

Sounds pretty good build, but there is this if if they will return to their Lord learn of him and keep his commandments. And how many Commandments do you think they should be keeping. According to Spencer W. Kimball well if the indication out on the street when when we talk to Latter Day Saints is true, then it's all of them and not only all of them but when we ask how often they will say all of the time.

We also have a Mormon apostle by the name of Richard Bill Evans and this statement was made by him. The year after the miracle of forgiveness came out in 1969. He said this, by the way, in a conference message in April 1970 and you can find it on page 16. Many of you would be familiar with Pres. Spencer Kimball's wonderful work on the miracle of forgiveness. I witnessed to you that God is a loving father who will forgive and help us find peace and self-respect as we repent and show our sincerity by the lies we live and there is nothing he asked of us that we cannot do. There is no requirement we cannot keep.

If we are willing, if we want to repentance is a miracle if it is sincere bill on chapter 2 Kimball exactly said what what Evans is saying here he is. Chapter 2 is entitled.

No unclean thing can enter any quotes for Moses 657 you have to do this in order to be able to receive it, and it's possible for a person to keep all the commandments because God does not give any commandments that cannot be kept. I find interesting racism.

There is nothing he asks of us that we cannot do that seems to go along with with the book of Mormon teaches in first Nephi, 37 that God is knocking to give you a commandment, that you cannot keep. So folks what you take away from that is the fact that every Latter Day Saints is not doing what they're supposed to be doing.

They are at fault, they cannot blame anyone else. They have the ability they should be doing it if they're not doing it. It's their fault.

We also have 70 Bruce C.

Hafer and that way is Bruce Hafer an interesting, well he still alive is not a dead prophet but he is a member of the 70 there was an article titled beauty for ashes, the atonement of Jesus Christ which is in the Leona, April 1997. Though this was back while the enzyme magazine was still being published. They had another magazine that was also called the Leona as we've explained many times the insight has been put to rest and now the magazine for adult members is the leasehold April 1997, page 41.

What did Haven say some of us make repentance to easy and others make it too hard. Those who make it too easy don't see any big sins in their lives, or they believe that breezy apologies alone are enough. These people should read Pres. Spencer W.

Kimball's the miracle of forgiveness, which reviews many sins of both commission and omission. And while forgiveness is a miracle.

It is not want without penitent and strenuous effort, and we also have Richard G.

Scott Mormon apostle Richard G. Scott that he has passed away.

But in a conference message and this is found in the enzyme from May 1995, page 76. This is what he said about the miracle of forgiveness in the miracle of forgiveness.

Spencer W. Kimball gives a superb guide to forgiveness through repentance. It has help many find their way back. Why would he say it's a superb guide if it's something that we need to get away from you would think this would be something the members of the church should be running to and not shining as Mr. Holzapfel thinks that we should. But Scott also said this in the October 2000.

General conference and this is in us in a talk he gave the path to peace and joy found in the & November 2000 on page 26. I suggest that you read Pres. Spencer W.

Kimball's inspired book, the miracle of forgiveness. It continues to help the faithful avoid the pitfalls of serious transgression. It likewise is an excellent handbook for those who have committed serious errors and want to find their way back.

Read the last two chapters 1st to appreciate the full miracle of forgiveness before reading anything else were they come up with this formula because when you read the back. It doesn't really help you. It still is emphasizing the same thing all about commandment keeping and truly repenting, but then we have Mormon apostle Boyd K. Packer in this statement is found in the church manual titled presidents of the church student manual religion 345, page 209. This manual came out in 2003, Pres. Kimball himself as an experienced surgeon of sorts.

Not a doctor of medicine, but a doctor or spiritual well-being. Many a moral cancer has been excised many a blemish of character has been removed many a spiritual illness of one kind or another, has been cured through his efforts.

Some on the verge of spiritual oblivion have been rescued by him as written the book literally years in preparation.

The miracle of forgiveness. Many have been protected by the Council. He has written countless others have been inspired to set their lives in order and have experienced that miracle so here we have a number of leaders, one of whom we cited is still living encouraging people that they should read the miracle of forgiveness no clearly this area 70 Richard Neitzel Holzapfel. He doesn't agree with that.

In closing, I think you would agree completely that when we look at the teachings of those living prophets, we find that there still saying basically the same thing. Maybe not as blunt as Spencer Kimball was in his book, but they're basically still encouraging the same thing. If a Mormon hopes to receive celestial exultation and bill. I'm just waiting for the day when a general authority gets up a general conference and tells us just like this area, 70 that the miracle of forgiveness should no longer be read thank you for listening. If you would like more information regarding his research ministry.

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