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Spirituality in All the Wrong Places

Understanding The Times / Jan Markell
The Truth Network Radio
April 6, 2019 8:00 am

Spirituality in All the Wrong Places

Understanding The Times / Jan Markell

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April 6, 2019 8:00 am

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Today, our assignment is to be light in a very dark place. Are you prepared? Witchcraft is growing like no other religion.

I mean, there's articles like this. The number of people practicing Wicca paganism is growing dramatically, written on October 12th, 2018. We're the fastest growing religion in the States, Wicca. Today on Understanding the Times Radio, Jan Markell welcomes two guests who specialize in informing Christians about the dark side. First Jan talks to Jill Martin Rishi.

The progressive movement in America and Europe want to do away with God, but they are fine with welcoming every form of evil. Jan and Jill share some stunning details with you in our first segment today. We encourage you to represent the light of the world in these troubling times. And welcome to the program. So glad you can join me today, and you often hear Jill Martin Rishi on this program as a radio guest, and I consider her an expert on cults, paranormal, the occult, apologetics, and more.

And she's following in the footsteps of her father, Dr. Walter Martin. She also handles the social media of Olive Tree Ministries, and she writes for us, and she recently did an e-newsletter for us. And Jill, thank you for coming in, by the way. It's good to be here, Jan. And I'm going to read a few paragraphs from your e-newsletter.

And folks, you can sign up at our website,, and go to resources. I want to read a few paragraphs, and then we're going to discuss a little bit of what you've written, Jill. And again, this was on the rise of the occult and the rise of, well, just some of the things that I think are very haywire. And you say, So many know nothing about how great civilizations fall. They don't connect the historical fact that the rejection of God always leads to the rise of evil. Today we turn on our TVs or computers and see the glorification of everything vile that crushed ancient Israel and Rome. So true.

Everything awful that destroyed 17th century France and 20th century Germany. And then you say the lure of secret power is irresistible. And though far weaker than the power of God, they choose it being darkened in their understanding, excluded from the life of God because of the ignorance that is in them because of the hardness of their heart.

Ephesians 4 18. Where the occult thrives, there is no hope. Malevolent evil always breeds despair.

I want to stop here. Who could have guessed that the 21st century would bring a witchcraft boom? Its biggest cheerleaders are the media who glorify it as good practice when all the evidence of history tells us it has always been evil. How do you fight a media blitz raving about Super Bowls, supermodel wives and their cute little habit of closet witchcraft? And here's where I'm heading, because then you say Patriot quarterback Tom Brady thought he was doing something good when he shared special moments with his wife Giselle in an interview after his fifth Super Bowl victory.

Okay, Joe, I mean, I found this shocking in light of what you wrote that Tom Brady admitted that his wife is a so called good witch. Yes. And he actually quoted her.

Yes. She said, You're lucky. I'm a witch.

I'm a good witch. Can you imagine? This is like their level of media attention is beyond anything I think we can comprehend. They literally cover the world. I don't think this is real shocking only because half of America, almost every progressive in America has rejected God, they've rejected faith, they've rejected Christianity, to them government is God and that has consequences.

Europe tried this, they threw God out 50, 60 years ago, we can see what's happening to Europe. And I'm going to play a clip in just a minute of Tom Brady. I mean, what were your thoughts? Well, like you say, it's, it's not surprising. It's a shock to hear it mainstream like that from probably the top quarterback, and he's a role model.

Yeah, he's a role model. So it's a shock to hear it on that level. But it's not surprising considering her background. So I believe that she really was steeped in witchcraft in Brazil, because it's almost like a state religion in a way. There are so many different forms of it in Brazil, and people just take it for granted. When they cast spells, a lot of times, they'll do it right out in the open.

And then people climb on fences and sit there and watch them actually do the spellcasting. She is from Brazil. Yes, yeah. So this probably is something that she was very familiar with as a young girl. Let's play Tom Brady talking about all this. Any superstitions going into the game? Any special thing you carried into the game on Sunday that you had tucked away somewhere?

I did. I always, you know, I've learned a lot from my wife over the years. She's so much about the power of intention, you know, and believing things that are really going to happen. And she always makes a little altar for me at the game, because she just wills it so much. So she put together a little altar for me that I could bring with pictures of my kids. And I have these little special stones and healing stones and protection stones, and she has me wear a necklace and take these drops she makes. And I say all these mantras. And I stopped questioning her a long time ago.

I did. I just shut up and listen. And at first I was like, this is kind of crazy.

And then about four years ago, we were playing the Seahawks. And she said, you better listen to me. This is your year, but this is all the things you're going to have to do to win. And I did all those things.

And by God, you don't work. It was pretty good. And then in 2015, it was about early January. And she said, You know how much I love you? And I said, Yeah. And she said, I just want to let you know, this is not going to be your year. And of course, we lost I said, What does 16 look like? And she said, 16 is going to be your year.

So it was early January this year. And I said, babe, I asking, like, do we have a chance? And she said, Yeah, but you're gonna have to do a lot of work.

And you're really gonna have to listen to me. So, man, I listened to her. And right after the game, she said, See, I did a lot of work.

You do your work, I do mine. She said, You're lucky you married a witch. I'm just a good witch.

Tom Brady, who's a quarterback of New England Patriots, if you don't follow football again, a role model, I'm sure to millions, millions of younger people celebrating his wife being supposedly a good witch. Jill, I don't know that there's a good witch, but we're going to hear from another one here in a minute. Yes. And I think, you know, if you look at her intent, she feels like she can control life. This is what she's drawing on is power that she can count on.

So I think she's been doing this for quite a while. And there probably is some power there that's connected to her. And there probably is some power there that's connected to her. And we know where that power comes from. But you know, the witches when they cast their spells, they say so mote it be so so must it be so they are willing it to be done. And that's exactly what she's doing. Oh, here we are, you know, mainstream right out there in the open on the probably the biggest platforms, one of the biggest platforms you could ever go to worldwide.

That's exactly right. And here we have witchcraft just rising up, Folks, that's why I do these updates every couple of months. Because honestly, some of this is trying to take over our culture and society and in parts of the world it has.

I think it has pretty successfully taken over parts of Europe and other parts of the world that are very dark. This has moved in and when they throw God out, this is what happens. And you're right, Jill. And so we see as front page news, the worldwide image of two gorgeous human beings with a family of small children relying on potions, spell casting and soothsaying of a wife and mother consumed by the power of the occult. I want to move on. Similar story.

Valerie Love. Okay, let me just go back to your article because you write again, see newsletter folks sign up at my website, go to resources as if the Brady propaganda were not enough. The Christian witch and oxymoron if there ever was one has arrived on the American scene. This is their redefinition of witchcraft, a new and improved label since the Bible clearly teaches that all witchcraft is evil. Okay, so there's no good and bad.

There's no white and dark. It's all evil according to the Bible. And then you say, Jill, but it is nothing new for Satan to present himself as an angel of light. Now you talk about Valerie Love, an ex-Jehovah's Witness turned Christian witch.

I said that right, folks. Ex-Jehovah Witness turned Christian witch is simply marching to the same ancient drum. She believes in white witchcraft, just like the Brady's, even though biblically and historically, there's no such thing as a good witch. And this Valerie Love is again trying to pass herself off as a Christian witch. In 2013, she published the Christian Witch's Creed, which has amassed a large following in her Christian Witch's Creed. She writes, I am a Christian witch.

I love my cross and my wand. I consult my tarot deck and my Bible. I adore and am devoted to Christ and the goddess. Is it possible, Jill Martin Rishi, to be devoted to Christ and the goddess? Who's the goddess?

Well, that depends, I guess, on which day of the week it is and which particular goddess is currently being worshipped. In paganism, which is what this is, sorcery, paganism, there are just many, you know, you could even go up to thousands of gods and goddesses that have been worshipped down through the centuries. Unfortunately here, she's not familiar with 1 Samuel 28, and King Saul visited a medium, visited the witch of Endor, and his punishment was death.

He wasn't expecting to see Samuel, but God sent Samuel to respond to him and to condemn him to death. So there we have our first instance of how God feels, and it was a very detailed encounter, so how he feels about witchcraft and any kind of connection to him. And then we have Paul, of course, in 1 Corinthians warning against ever mixing any kind of pagan practices with Christianity. So he spends a great deal of his time in Corinthians warning us that these things cannot mix.

So you have basically an approach that Satan always does, where he takes something and redefines it. She is trying to redefine witchcraft. There is nothing historical, no evidence that ever points to a good witch down through the centuries.

But of course, evidence, as we know today, Jan, evidence doesn't mean anything. Well, she says, again, this is Valerie Love, she says, there's no conflict in what I do, what I say, or who I am. She says, whether I'm walking in nature and hanging out with fairies, or in high consciousness communication with angels, or commanding demons and spirits, or stirring a healing remedy in my cauldron, or pulling herbs for a tea, or speaking a spell, or dressing a candle, wherever I may be and whatever I may be doing, I'm never confused, and I am never in denial. And then she says, the creed goes on, I am clear and certain I was sent here by God for God's good purpose.

This is her creed. You're going to get, first of all, Monday through Friday, we're going to be at school. The Covenant of Christian Witches Mystery School is in session, boys and girls.

Yes, kiddos. On Saturday, we have a reader's studio. You can get readings or you can even register to be one of our vendors or one of our readers at our readers hall. Saturday night, we have a witch's ball. The witch's ball is themed, and the theme of the witch's ball this year, boys and girls, American Horror Story Apocalypse. I want to see someone come as Michael Langdon. Now, yes, he is the seed of Satan. Yes, he's the devil's spawn. However, I like him, and I'd like to see someone come as Michael Langdon, or maybe his very witchy mother. His mother wasn't witchy.

His mother was a servant of Satan in the Satanic church. So anyhow, that's Saturday night, a witch's ball themed American Horror Story Apocalypse. Get your witchy gear, get ready for food, fun, dancing, all of it on Saturday night in Salem. Next, Sunday morning, Resurrection Sunday, Easter Sunday, the first ever that we've ever done, Christian Witches Church Service. And this is probably the heart of the whole convention for me, bringing a word to you from the pulpit, Reverend Valerie Love at a Christian Witches Church Service.

We have a musical guest that you will love, and we have all the inspiration and a powerful word, especially for Christian witches. Again, ultimate in delusion. We get that.

Absolutely. And of course, Satan is always the angel of light, right? I mean, you have mediums like Jonathan Edwards, who claim he was sent here by God.

They all claim they're sent here by God. In fact, we have records of seances that took place in the eighteen hundreds, and they would literally open a Bible in the middle of the table. If you can believe that, Jen, they would put an open Bible in the middle of the table, and there are records of hands appearing above that Bible and pointing to a Bible verse. So that's in the middle of a seance. So this is Satan's modus operandi. It's worked so well for him.

Why should he change it? You're listening to Understanding the Times Radio. Jan Markell here in studio with Majel Martin-Rishi. You've heard her often on this program. She manages our social media, so you might be talking to her on Facebook as well. We're giving a paranormal update, and you can learn more at her website,

She's the daughter of Dr. Walter Martin. And check out her 700-page book found at, The Kingdom of the Occult. And I think, Jill, you're updating your father's book, The Kingdom of the Cult. So you've been doing that for the last many months? Yes. And we have a brand new edition coming out.

Also, Jen, we're doing something new. We're doing a handbook on the cults. It's a mini version of The Kingdom of the Cults and includes a study guide. So that will be out in 2020. 2020.

For that one. But The Kingdom of the Cults is coming out right now. And folks can get that most conveniently at? They can visit or their local Christian bookstores. And most of them are going out of business. Most of them are going out of business. They're local online Christian books. Unfortunately, that's all that's going to be left, folks.

So time to get a computer if you don't have one. I want to move on. I want to hit just a few more things because we just have a short segment today. In the article that you wrote, we also talked about Walmart. And I don't think folks are aware that it used to be family friendly. Sam Walton would never go along with what's going on. Used to be totally family friendly.

The whole Walmart empire. But now there's an online link. You click it on and it takes you over to online ordering options where you can request anything of an occult nature.

I mean, there are pictures there. You can order pentagrams. You can order Masonic imagery. The Baphomet is on everything. Baphomet jewelry, T-shirts, anything you can think of. And that's the symbol of Satan, folks.

Everything that celebrates evil, that celebrates the devil. It's in Walmart. Who would have thought that we'd ever see the day? I'm surprised. I've seen it before. Not to this extent, but I have seen witchcraft manuals for children in Target before.

But this is something that is totally, they've upped the ante. In fact, Jan, they have, I think, allied with the Satanic temple. The Satanic temple, this is their merchandise. In fact, that image of Baphomet that you were mentioning. And that is basically a goat man that looks like the ancient god Pan with big long horns.

And I'm sure all of us have seen some version of that. But the Satanic temple, which is currently the flavor of the day for Satanism, but they have specific images that they use and no one else can use these images. And that, Jan, is the image of Baphomet that is being sold at Walmart. So I think that they have a contract now with the Satanic temple to sell their merchandise. Okay. I wonder if this will spread then to some other retail outlets. Oh, I'm sure. Well, the Satanic temple is very aggressive and they are out to stop Christians.

They say that they just want fairness and freedom of speech, but they're out to stop Christians in their tracks, in my opinion. Well, this is why we try to bring you these updates, folks. The Bible says, in the last days, evil will wax worse than worse. 2 Timothy 3.13, Revelation 9.21 talks about the escalation of evil in the last days. 2 Timothy 3.13 and Revelation 9.21, other references too.

Those are pretty obvious ones. So we're seeing the fulfillment of the Bible, fulfillment of Bible prophecy right before our eyes. I want to touch on another item, Jill, while we have time here. Amazon Prime original show called Good Omens. It tries to paint, get this, folks, the Antichrist as a savior, saving the earth from the apocalypse and the end with angels and demons working together.

Now, here's the blurb from YouTube about this movie. It says this, with Armageddon just days away, the armies of heaven and hell are amassing and the four horsemen are ready to ride. Arizaphale, an angel, and Crowley, a demon, how appropriate, Crowley is a demon after Aleister Crowley, agree to join forces and find the missing Antichrist and to stop the war that will end everything based on the best selling novel by Terry Pratchett. Neil Gaiman, Good Omens follows an unlikely duo and their quest to save the world. The new series is going to premiere again.

Apparently this is on Amazon Prime, May 31st, 2019. So again, we got Good Omens. What next?

I'm sure it will do very well too, because as you and I know, anything dark sells very well. I mean, the irony here to me is just incredible. Who are they looking for? The Antichrist. Yeah, they're looking for the Antichrist. To solve all their problems.

Isn't that ironic? Yeah. Again, the world of the unbeliever doesn't understand that that will usher in all of their problems. Exactly.

As they're going to be left behind and they're going to have to deal with literal hell on earth. You write this. I'm going back to your article, Jill.

This was our e-newsletter several weeks ago now. And you write this, and this is a good note to close on. We must be salt and light in a very dark place, giving him all the glory. The power of the occult is strong, but it is far weaker than God's power when it seems like all hell is breaking loose. How wonderful to know that this world is not our home. We have an eternity of incredible joy to look forward to a new heaven and a new earth.

What will it be like? The lion will lie down with the lamb. There will be no more tears, no suffering, no evil people, no Satan, no death. And then you refer to Dr. Kirk Koch, a 20th century pastor and 40 year warrior against the occult, puts it all into perspective. Satan and all the hosts of darkness are a defeated foe. The triumphant theme of the New Testament is that Jesus has disarmed the principalities and powers and made a public example of them triumphing over them. Colossians 2, 15.

Why don't you expound on that if you would. The early Christian church, we have records that the early Christian church called themselves soldiers of Christ. And even though we are in the midst of a very dark place, we should put on our armor because we fight against the invisible foe in Ephesians six. Put on our armor and go out and fight. Keeping in mind that incredible hope that you just read, the hope of what we have coming, Jan.

I mean, we are going to be done with this world in a very short period of time. We want to stand before the king and be told, well done, thou good and faithful servant. And so we must fight. We must occupy until he comes. But we have this incredible hope and that hope should light our hearts every single day, even though the world around us is growing darker and darker. OK, folks, again, you can learn more at Walter Martin dot com.

Jules, the daughter of the late Dr. Walter Martin. Many of you listen to him on radio some years ago now. Don't go away. I'm not quite finished with this topic. I'm going to be joined in minutes by Carl Teichrib. He and I attended a local pagan festival called Paganicon.

Happened to be held here in the Twin Cities, but I promise you it's in your neighborhood as well. You need to learn about these issues. Folks, we need to be salt and light and delay the decay and push back against the darkness. We'll talk more about it in just a minute. Don't go away. Don't go away. In our second segment, Jan talks to Carl Teichrib about the rise of paganism. They both attended Paganicon in the Twin Cities a few weeks ago. How can we push back against this kind of darkness?

It's in your neighborhood, too. That's next. What do you think the state of the world is going to be in right after the rapture?

Well, with the Restrainer gone, I think it's going to be... We think we have anarchy now and chaos now. We haven't seen anything yet. Just what are the seals of Revelation? We are carrying a 10 DVD set, 20-part study, produced by Pastor Billy Crone on the seals. This documentary takes you on an in-depth journey through the first half of the tribulation from which the church is absent. Featured in the production are Jan Markell, Dr. Dave Reagan, Pastor J.D.

Farag, and Nathan Jones. Find it in our webstore,, or by calling us at 763-559-4444. It will also be available in our print and e-newsletter.

The cost is $45 plus $6 shipping in the U.S. The Seals, a panoramic view of the first half of the tribulation, 20-part study, would be ideal for your small group or adult Sunday school class. Check it out today. It already gravitates to the pagan mind. Whether you consider yourself a pagan or not, the pagan worldview is imbued within our culture.

We love hearing from you. You can always contact us through our website, That's Contact us by mail at Olive Tree Ministries, Box 1452, Maple Grove, Minnesota, 55311. That's Box 1452, Maple Grove, Minnesota, 55311. Call us central time at 763-559-4444.

That's 763-559-4444. This program is posted electronically to our website, to, and to our YouTube channel, Early Saturday Morning. Now here's Jan Markell. And welcome back. Moving into a little bit different topic here, my guest for the next two segments is Carl Teichrib. He's a researcher, author, speaker, and over the years, he has attended a range of internationally significant political and religious events in his quest to understand sort of the historical and contemporary forces of transformation, including the Parliament of World Religions, Burning Man in Nevada, and the United Nations Millennium Forum, and Paganican in my hometown. Now let me just say a word about that, because both Carl and I visited the local pagan pride event in the Twin Cities, just a few weeks ago now, and all those such events are held literally around the world.

One of the headquarters of it all happens to be my hometown, Minneapolis-St. Paul. The annual Paganican event is at a local hotel, and it's for people who identify as wiccans, druids, pagans, heathens, shamans, psychics, New Agers, and a lot more. And there they meet, they exchange ideas, and they sort of, well, they celebrate the darkness. Participants are encouraged to renew their spiritual life, but this spiritual life does not include the God of the universe or His Son, Jesus Christ, some I talked to, had been raised believing in the basics of Christianity. One told me, quite frankly, he said, I read every book ever written by the late Grant Jeffery. Obviously, he had heard the Gospel in those books, rejected it all. And now they celebrate earth worship, witchcraft, and all things dark. I could not help but think of the biblical references that state that someday every knee, including every knee attending this Paganican event, will bow before the Lord Jesus Christ. Carl Teichrib, welcome to the studio here of Understanding the Times Radio.

And John, it's good to be with you. Welcome to the land of 10,000 lakes, 10,000 New Age shops, 10,000 witch covens. You've apprised me of some of this, and I mean, I got a national, international audience, but I happen to live in the heart, sort of the heart of evil here. Well, the Twin Cities area is very unique in that it has a very vibrant pagan community, and that pagan community has been alive and well since the 1970s. And in the last, over the last 20 years or so, it has really grown in size, and it's spread out. It's not just here, Jan, it is all across the Western world.

It's all across the Western world, I get that. You and I were both at this event, you were there for three days, I was there for an evening, I was in a hotel not far from here. We won't go any further in details on that, but at first glance, it might appear like this was just a weekend Halloween party.

People were in costumes because they were having a costume contest. But there were concerts, there were art shows, there were meditation sessions, they were speaking about the people I talked to, about honoring nature, honoring trees, talk of crystals, reiki therapy, intuitive readings, healing rooms, tarot cards, magic, holistic living, magical art of baking. New Age, not a big deal, this has been going on forever, nothing unusual to see tarot cards. What made this and what makes this so different? What makes this event different is that it really draws together a diverse pagan community and it celebrates the diverse forms of paganism. It's a time for networking, it's a time for their own community to grow and to find places of connection. And so this event, because this is an annual event, and this year was the ninth year by the way, this year was just under 800 people who were registered for Paganicon. There's a lot of rituals, the event begins with a ritual, it ends with a closing ritual. There are numerous rituals all throughout the day, a lot of workshops, a lot of networking opportunities.

There's workshops, I attended a workshop on blasphemy as a healing tool. There's workshops on a variety of pagan subjects. As the pagan community itself recognizes they are growing, they have more of a social voice, more of a cultural voice now than they've ever had before.

They're experiencing growing pains and growing challenges and also looking to see how can we bring legitimacy and authenticity to what we do into the broader world around us. It's a recognition really, Jan, that we live in an age now which already gravitates to the pagan mind. Whether you consider yourself a pagan or not, the pagan worldview is imbued within our culture. Well, and you said to me, more and more Christians are ambassadors in a pagan world and both you and I felt like ambassadors at this event here in the Twin Cities.

We also commented that, I mean, God is far greater, far bigger than anything, any practice, any pagan belief system demonstrated at this three-day event. But you're right, we were ambassadors. I mean, they didn't know your background or identity. I was just there for a couple of hours interacting with some of the attendees. Two of them sitting next to me were druids.

They seemed to be a very normal couple, very friendly as a matter of fact. I said, may I ask you some questions? I said, absolutely. And so I did. I quizzed them for at least an hour. Sitting by them happened to be a rather aging male witch who seemed to be like he needed some psychotropic drugs.

But the two druids were very normal folks, very cordial. Right. And this is important for people to realize is really this is a cross-section of society. These can be your neighbors.

Absolutely. These can be your children, can be your doctor. These are educators.

The list goes on. It's not people just from the margins of society, though sometimes that's a part of it. People looking for community, people looking for a place where they belong. But at the same time, this is a spectrum.

This is as broad as your neighborhood in terms of the type of people you'll meet. I spoke to some of them about the eternal consequences of their actions. And of course, they weren't impressed. They were looking for spirituality, but in all the wrong places, which you don't have to go to a paganican convention to look for spirituality in the wrong places. I mean, you can find that in some of our weaker denominational churches.

They were certainly were looking for it in the wrong places. But there were children there and there were teens there. Right. There were workshops for children and teens, and you said to me, for the kids, they're raised in pagan homes. It's sort of like going to Sunday school for them.

Right. There were teen and children tracts, teen and children workshops that could be attended. There was a room specifically set aside for their children. You know, this may be more of a surprise or a shock to Christian thinking if we would have introduced this idea maybe 20 years ago or 30 years ago. But now there is an entire generation brought up within a pagan worldview. For them, this is just a part of their world, and the children are very much a part of that.

Yeah. Again, earth worship, witchcraft, silly rituals. We're not going to get into some of the details here. Again, some told me they were formerly evangelical Christians. They chose to reject the truth for a lie, were not interested in the eternal consequences of that.

And one had been raised being talked about as it concerns eternal consequences, didn't care. You know, one of the workshops, Jan, that I attended, a question came up. What is your background? What is your religious background? What are you bringing to the table in terms of your previous religious culture? And there was people there who said, hey, I come from a Southern Baptist background, I come from a Methodist background, a number of them from a Catholic background, from Lutherans, Orthodox, evangelicals.

One of the speakers I know has a background where he was a youth leader in an evangelical church. So there is a lot, and I mean a lot of interesting carryover between the pagan world and the Christian world in terms of where the people have come from. And as Christianity is being rejected in Western society, there is a move towards things like various pagan communities. And your city is just—it's the Petri dish. It's where it's all— It's the Petri dish. Yeah, it's where it's all kind of congealing together. Well, apparently the Twin Cities is called the paganistan.

Yes, and it's been called affectionately paganistan by the pagan community since at least the late 1980s, early 1990s. There's a whole book by that title, which you happened to pick up, a hardbound book. And then we have the publishing house that publishes products like this that's drawing— I'm not going to name them—that's drawing folks here.

You're listening to Understanding the Times Radio. Jan Markell here. I have in my studio today Carl Teichrib. You've heard him on the programming before. We've actually shared some conferences together. Recently we did one in Oklahoma City. And I was able to meet Carl and his wife there.

Carl, as I said in my open, visits some events. Parliament of World Religions. We'll talk about Burning Man in just a moment. United Nations Millennium Forum. Paganicon, which is here in the Twin Cities.

Lots of events like this. He writes about them. You can find more in his book. And I have the book in front of me, Game of Gods.

The Temple of Man in the Age of Re-Enchantment with an introduction by Gary Carr. And best place to find this—well, actually your website, I think, Carl. And that's, correct?

That's correct. You can read excerpts of the book there. Go through just the bibliography is online on the web page and then order it through there. It is a thick book. It's sort of an encyclopedia of these kinds of events and issues.

It's way over 500 pages, softbound. You can order it on Amazon if you want as well. You can communicate with Carl at That's not dot com.

You won't get it if you do dot com. It's Carl's a Canadian. Carl, what was the most stunning—you were there three days. I was there less than three hours and I had to get out because my spirit was grieved. It was troubled. I think more than anything I was grieved. We read in the Bible how God actually hardened the heart of Pharaoh, and it seemed as though God may have hardened the hearts of these pagans.

Obviously, they hate him because their God is nature, the trees, creation, et cetera, but not the God of the universe, and our spirits were in conflict. What was the most troubling thing you saw? One of them was a ritual. I won't go into the ritual.

There was a certain ritual that took place called the marriage of heaven and hell that had some really disturbing elements to it, and it was understandable. I mean, it is a disturbing thing. This is serious.

What we're talking about here is really serious. It demonstrates, and it should demonstrate to the Christian church, look, the reality of spiritual issues is here. It's in our face. It's time for the Christians, for us, to, first of all, know what we believe and why we believe and stand firm on that. The other thing I think is important for Christians to realize is that while this is all around us, and indeed we have a pagan worldview that's absolutely saturated through our culture in many different facets, and the book brings that into play, we need to recognize that at the end of the day, every knee bows, every person, every power, every principality bows. I think sometimes we tend to gravitate towards fear, whereas the only one that we should be fearing is God Himself, who is greater than any of this, who is greater than any one or any person that was at paganicon or that's even in the room with you and I right now. He is the one who is over and above all things, and that's so important.

If we don't grasp that, we will be ruled by fear, and there's no reason to be ruled by fear. Concern? Yes, absolutely. Well, actually, you gave me some flyers from events coming up around the country. Folks, this goes on all over the Western world, and Carl handed me a flyer, pagan spirit gathering 2019.

This is coming up for one week. This one will be over the summer solstice. The one we're talking about was over the spring solstice.

This is important to these pagans, is the solstice. So there's one coming up, and this is going to be, is this in Ohio? It's in Ohio, yes. Ohio, we've got another one coming up, I think, in June in Wisconsin, but you said this is all over the Western world, all over U.S.?

Yes, it is, absolutely. In fact, you have a few other pagan events, pagan festivals that happen in your state beyond the one I attended to. There's 300 witches' covens in the Twin Cities.

That was the last count, and I have that in the book documented. 300 covens and circles, roughly. Now, covens and circles change. That number shifts around because covens come, covens go. The lifespan of a coven is usually three years. Oh, really?

What happens? People move on, people change, people physically move. The one thing, though, that was of interest in terms of myself coming to this event was to see how what's considered the left-hand path, how that's being embraced more in the pagan world. The left-hand path being Satanism, Luciferianism, and I went to a couple workshops where that was brought up. In fact, we had a Satanist who came as a representation of Satanism and Luciferianism. In the past, the pagan community, the Wiccans and other pagans, druids, would not necessarily have embraced that. Right, so this was the first year they invited someone from this stream of thought because now they're going extreme. Right. As far as I know, Jan, this was the first time that they've had a Satanist come and do a workshop. And the Satanist had a workshop on Satanism 101.

What was interesting was, and this is something I think is important for Christians to think about, as I'm listening to these people in their private conversations, as they talk about Christians, the one thing that really bothered me, and I mean it bothered me a lot, was when I heard how Christians have reacted to them. Okay. Not in love. That's right. Not in mercy.

Very important. Not in grace, but chastising them, swearing at them, calling them down. The one Satanist I was listening to was talking about how a man had come over to her with a bag of trash and literally threw trash on her. I'm sorry, that's not Christ-like. And so if we're going to be ambassadors in a world of darkness, we can't take approaches like that. That helps nothing.

All that does is demonstrate that we ourselves are bound by the problem of sin, too. But there are folks listening and they're thinking, my goodness, if I bumped into, or my neighbor turned out to be one of these people, if a family member turned out to be one of these, how do I even talk to them? What do you say? What do you say?

I know. And you will. You're going to be running into people on the street and running into people in your own community. The beginning point, and this is really an important thing for people to grasp, is to go to the basics. And the basics being, I mean right down to the core, how is reality fathomed? How is reality put together? Is it oneness?

And my friend Dr. Peter Jones puts this together beautifully. Oneness or two-ism? Let me explain quickly. Oneness is paganism. Oneness says God, man, and nature are all essentially the same. They share the same essence. They share the core. The biblical worldview is, no, it's not oneness.

It's two. God, distinct, holy, completely different than the creation. He is above the creation. Isaiah chapter 40 brings us out beautifully. Romans 1 brings us out.

So reality, from the biblical worldview, is God is different and distinct, and then there is the rest of creation. I've had talks with Wiccans. I've had talks with pagans where we've brought that into play and brought that as kind of the forefront where we can begin a conversation, because you have to start somewhere. And that really is as basic as it gets, but also it is a powerful place to begin. Well, you said to me that Christians need to have a mind to engage these folks.

I mean, our nature would be to run away. Even though the folks I spoke to, again, they were very open to anything I had to say. We shook hands when we parted. They smiled. They just couldn't be more gracious. Right, right. And I'm sure you encountered this this weekend yourself.

Absolutely. And I walked away, you know, feeling, oh, there are lovely people there. And I've interacted a lot with this community.

There's some wonderful, good-natured, wonderful people, but their spiritual worldview and what they've bought into is the exact opposite of what Christ wants to give them. Well, I want to ask you about Burning Man, because this is a huge festival in Nevada. You go down there with a tent and a sign.

You hang outside of your tent, and you engage in more of this. And maybe Burning Man is even more extreme, but I think my audience needs to get acquainted with exactly what's out there. Now, I don't think my average listener is not going to attend Burning Man. But they need to know, I think, that this is kind of mainstream now. At least it's mainstream.

It's a little fringy yet, of course, but just about everybody knows something about Burning Man. And I think that Christians need to better understand it. They can at least battle it in the spirit if in no other way.

Maybe they physically can't. When I come back, folks, we'll talk about this, and I'll wrap up my hour today. Don't go away. We are available 24-7 on our website,, where we have an active online store, conference information, our print and e-newsletter, donation links, daily headlines, and other article categories. You can now text to give. Call us or visit our website. Jan and Carl Teichrib will be right back to wrap up today's program.

Why not save the date of Saturday, September 21 for Understanding the Times 2019? Tickets go on sale June 1st for $25 and include lunch. We will be selling general admission seats only and no assigned seating. Speakers this year include Dr. Robert Jeffress, Amir Sarfati, Pastor Jack Hibbs, Pastor J.D.

Farag, and Jan Markell. They will help you understand the times and become watchmen on the wall. Location once again is Grace Church in Eden Prairie, Minnesota, just outside of Minneapolis. The teaching is timely and the fellowship is unparalleled as you make friends for life. Save the date and visit our website's conference page for a list of hotels and other pertinent information.

That's, We hope to meet thousands of you September 21 just outside of Minneapolis. We set up a sign at our tent and there's a small team of us and the sign simply says, Camp of the Unknown God, which comes out of Acts 17. All right, how do we proclaim Christ in a pagan culture? Well, how did Paul proclaim Christ in a pagan culture? Paul, when he was at Athens, the paganism of Athens was raw compared to the paganism we have now. We have politically correct paganism.

Back then, it was very, very raw and very open. It was the worldview that everybody lived under. We don't talk about the dark side to focus on negative information, but to encourage you to push back against these forces. The Bible says that in the last days, evil will wax worse and worse.

That is why the Christian is called to take a stand and defeat it, and the enemy is a defeated foe. Here's Jan Markell and Carl Teichrib to wrap up today's program. There are many reasons for this massive and global paganistic or cultist revival, but who exactly is a pagan? What do they believe in and where do they live? Keep in mind, this video is obviously not trying to promote any religious belief, merely an analysis of a growing and fascinating demographic trend that is impacting millions worldwide.

According to some estimates, European neo-paganism is the fastest growing religion in the United Kingdom, France, Portugal, Denmark, and, you guessed it, the United States of America. And welcome back. And I'm wrapping up an hour where we're talking about some things that are a little on the dark side.

Remember, the God we serve is far, far greater than any of these entities that we're talking about. But we spent the last segment discussing paganicon, which was held in the Twin Cities, happened to be over the spring solstice. And I was attending. I attended for an evening. Carl Teichrib, my in-studio guest who's from Manitoba, attended for three days. It was at a local hotel not far from the office here and had 800 participants in all things dark.

I talked about all of those issues in the last segment. At first appearance, might seem rather harmless, kind of a New Age festival, a little bit like they might have been celebrating Halloween, which frankly, folks, isn't innocent. Concerts, art shows focused on meditation, holistic living, holistic healing, magic, tarot cards. But then they got into some extremely dark things as well because it was a pagan gathering, 800 pagans gathering because the Twin Cities is the hub of this kind of activity.

I'm not a member of the Minnesota Chamber of Commerce for lots of reasons, this being one of them. Now, just a quick comment here by way of an announcement or two. Remember, this programming is posted because you lead such busy lives. It's posted to our website Saturday morning. It's also posted to our YouTube channel under Jan Markell, where we now include photo illustrations of everything we're talking about.

We'll have some photos of this event. So, if you want to watch visually, you need to watch on our YouTube channel. The channel is Jan Markell, so look that up. Saturday morning, posted to our YouTube channel.

Otherwise, it's to our website,, plus about 830 radio stations around the country, actually around the world. Carl, thank you for driving all the way from Manitoba to be a part of this event and then to be a part of the event here at the studio. Speaking of Canada, I will be speaking in Canada with Amir Sarfati. It will be Saturday, May 11th, awaiting his return conference, participating Amir Sarfati, Pastor Barry Stagner, Pastor Jack Hibbs, myself, Church on the Queensway in Toronto, May 11th. You need to get tickets at, I hope to meet Canadian followers of Olive Tree Ministries. We're still waiting to see if the event may be live streamed.

I can't answer that at this point in time. Carl has a book. It's called Game of Gods, the Temple of Man in the Age of Re-enchantment. I think I said that wrong the first time.

It's the subtitle is The Temple of Man in the Age of Re-enchantment. Game of Gods. You can contact him at Did I get that right?

That's correct. You can get the book there.

You can get the book at Amazon. I happen to read the pages where he's written here about Pig Anacon, and he's a regular attender of it. Carl, does anybody know your background when you're there?

No, no, not at this event. I had an opportunity to talk to a new thought minister probably for about two hours, and yeah, we went right into it. You did? Yeah, and that was good. It was good.

There's places and points in time when you keep your mouth shut, and there's other times when you open it, and you have to figure out and be discerning regarding that. Did you make any inroads with this gentleman? We had a good conversation. Read the good conversation.

Came from a Catholic background. At the end of the day, all I can do is hope and pray that the words that were said will cause his heart to stir at some point. I would say the same for those I spoke to. I gave them the gospel. As I said earlier, I talked about eternity and the consequences of being there in the wrong place.

Right. Some of your listeners might be wondering, why even go? Yeah, why do you go? I've been going to events like this since 1997, including the political side, interfaith side, the list goes on, primarily because I do real research, boots on the ground research. I'm constantly trying to know, how is the culture being changed? How is it moving forward? How is it going to be challenging the Christian community?

And then present that to people like yourself and others who can take it and disseminate that to a broader audience. Well, you actually have a tent at Burning Man Festival. It is in Nevada. Am I right there? That's right.

Yep. Northern Nevada. Northern Nevada, Burning Man.

It's late summer every year. It's more paganism. I think you have a tent. I've seen a picture of it. And then you have a sign outside of this tent. It says, Camp of the Unknown God. Come and ask questions.

What happens when you do that? Well, first of all, Burning Man is about 80,000 people that comes together. It's a huge event, okay? And it's pagan in that it expresses that worldview of oneness, that worldview that we're all connected.

We're all one. It's not pagan in the large P sense of the word, as in like a religion, like Wicca, which is different. There are differences here. Nonetheless, we want to know, okay, is a biblical model relevant for a modern pagan culture?

Can we take a biblical model and move it forward into the age we're living today? So unlike paganicon here in the Twin Cities, you don't talk about your background, your purpose in attending at Burning Man. You not only talk about it, you put a sign out front and say, come and talk to me about this because I'm here to tell you about the truth. Right. I'm going for two purposes. I am doing research at Burning Man. There's all kinds of things there, workshops, lectures, meetings, things like that that happen. It's not an event. It's hundreds of events under one umbrella. How long is this?

Eight days. Okay. And then we set up a sign at our tent, and there's a small team of us, and the sign simply says Camp of the Unknown God, which comes out of Acts 17, all right? How do we proclaim Christ in a pagan culture? Well, how did Paul proclaim Christ in a pagan culture? Paul, when he was at Athens, the paganism of Athens was raw compared to the paganism we have now. We have politically correct paganism. Back then, it was very, very raw and very open.

It was the worldview that everybody lived under. What did he do? He goes to Mars Hill. He sees these monuments and statues and altars to various deities, including the one that says to the unknown God. Then he launches into a discourse with these people. He's brought before their council, and he uses that as leverage to launch into the gospel, quoting their own philosophers. He understands their own worldview. He understands it well enough that he can be able to bring the gospel message to them in their place.

And so when we set up that sign, Camp of the Unknown God, people come up to us, and this is what they say, Jan, who is the unknown God? Well, that's an open door. Here's some water, have some food, have some Gatorade. It's hot. It's just boiling hot. Most times, it's really hot. We have windstorms.

It's a very harsh place. And then we'll have conversations, and we'll let them talk, and we interact, and we'll have a conversation for 20 minutes, 30 minutes, two hours. Do you persuade anybody that this is not a good lifestyle? It's not so much an issue of persuading. It's more of an issue of here's the truth of Jesus Christ. And we use the oneness-to-ness model, and we've used that to help people see things very differently. And in fact, last year, we had people coming to our camp to talk to us multiple times. People say, hey, you know, I've got to run. I'd like to come back tomorrow to talk some more.

Absolutely. In fact, last year, we had 12, 15 people that interacted with us fairly frequently all throughout the event. At one point, one of the fellows that I was hanging out with, and he'd been with us right from the beginning of the event until almost the end. On Wednesday, I just said to him, I said, hey, I mean, you're at Burning Man. This is your first time at Burning Man, and you have every carnal pleasure under the sun. There's all kinds of avenues to explore spirituality, and you're hanging out with a bunch of Christians.

Like what's wrong with you? You're at Burning Man. You're hanging out with Christians. And he just looked at me and says, he said, I'm just learning so much from you guys. Okay.

So those are seeds. Are there others like you there? I don't know.

I don't know. What prompts 80,000 people to come to steaming hot desert, 100, 120 degrees, probably very few showers, probably limited bathroom facilities, et cetera. Just inconvenience all around, uncomfortable. What prompts them to come out to something like this and spend a week? The community, the spectacle, the energy and excitement of the place. There is a lot of things there that draw people in, in terms of just the overwhelming nature of what's happening. It is unlike anything else. Really?

Yeah. What's the age group? The demographics are broad. They have children. They have a children's village area set up so that families with young children have a place to go.

And the demographics are as broad as any community. And what is the meaning of Burning Man? Well, at the end of the week, we burn.

I'm saying we because I go there. Burn a human effigy. Straw man? Not a straw. It's made of wood. Wood? Yes, and it's quite tall.

In 2014, it was over 100 feet tall. And then they also have temples set up. What's the significance of burning this piece of wood? Birth, death, rebirth, birth, death, rebirth. And the co-founder of the event, Larry Harvey, he's passed away now, but he has made it very clear. It's about you finding your own sense of spirituality. He's really a self-service cult, and that's how he described it.

You wash your own brains. And this is a place where you come and experience some sense of spirituality, not that you are looking for a supreme being, but as what Larry would say, being is supreme. And so it has a very self-motivated sense of spirituality. Interesting.

You can learn more with Carl's book, Game of Gods, The Temple of Man in the Age of Re-enchantment, called Tycrib, and you can find it at That's CA stands for Canada, Carl, thank you for what you do. I mean, I'm not sure a lot of people can fully appreciate it. I do. You're going back to Burning Man the end of August, correct? We're going to try.

We're going to make sure we get our tickets and go back. You're going to plant a tent and a sign, and you're going to share the gospel again. Well, hey, Paul's model works.

It does open doors. You know, when you look for spirituality in all the wrong places, you will always find a counterfeit God in belief system. And while the devil is going about like a roaring lion, seeking whom he may devour, the Bible says in 1 John 4, 4, that greater is he that is in us, and that would be the God of the universe and dwelling all true Christians, than he that is in the world. We can slay the devil and his angels with the name of Jesus. Call on him today, make him the Lord and savior of your life today.

Tomorrow may be too late. I want to thank you for listening. We'll talk to you next week. If you find this programming helpful, think about a tax deductible gift to Olive Tree Ministries. Call now to Box 1452, Maple Grove, Minnesota, 55311. That's Box 1452, Maple Grove, Minnesota, 55311. You can call us, Central Time, at 763-559-4444, that's 763-559-4444. Contact us anytime at In a world characterized by fake news and false teaching, thank you for trusting us and for making Radio for the Remnants, also called Understanding the Times Radio, your weekend destination. We'll see you next week, God bless you, God bless you, God bless you, and God bless you.
Whisper: medium.en / 2023-05-07 09:07:21 / 2023-05-07 09:31:02 / 24

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