Welcome to Truth Talk Live. All right, let's talk. A daily program powered by the Truth Network. This is kind of a great thing and I'll tell you why. Where pop culture, current events, and theology all come together.
Speak your mind. And now here's today's Truth Talk Live host. Joey Hudson in with you today. What a beautiful Thursday afternoon it is in the Carolinas. There is a bit of a smoky overcast in upstate South Carolina where I am.
And for those of you listening on 96.9 here in the upstate, you probably have seen this. Of course, we have some wildfires that are burning in the area. So let me ask you to pray for upstate South Carolina. And western North Carolina where there's some wildfires burning there. Pray for rain, number one.
And I think we have some coming this weekend, but it could come a little early. As these fires are burning thousands of acres and starting to threaten some homes. And pray for the first responders, the firefighters who are out there trying to keep people safe, trying to contain these fires.
And that they'll be safe and be able to do their jobs and that we can get some relief. The one particular in northern Greenville County started near the Table Rock Reservoir, which supplies water to the upstate area, primarily the city of Greenville. And it started with just four teenagers who were out hiking and started a fire and unfortunately it got out of control, started at a few hundred acres and then spread to a few thousand acres. And then, as of earlier today, it was just over four thousand acres and a separate fire that spun off of that, that is known as the Persimmon Ridge Fire, is in a separate area of northern Greenville County, kind of climbing the mountain towards Caesar's Head and Cedar Mountain, North Carolina and potentially moving into that western North Carolina area too. Of course, Polk County and others are being hit by these two. So the conditions are perfect as Hurricane Helene left a lot of debris on the forest floor and just really it has served as kindling for these fires.
So the Carolinas need your prayer that people will be safe, their homes will be safe and of course the responders will be safe too. Before I forget, let me invite you to join me on my daily podcast, Just the Truth. Just search for Joey Hudson, Just the Truth, wherever you listen to podcasts. You can also visit my website, joeyhudson.com and subscribe there too. In just a few minutes, we'll be joined by South Carolina Representative John McCravey. He is chairman of the National Association of Christian Lawmakers, their legislative council, and we're going to talk about Christians running and serving in elected leadership roles and legislation that's being debated in legislatures around the country that protects the sanctity of life. So in a few minutes, we'll be joined by Representative John McCravey.
I think you're going to enjoy getting to know him. Of course, you're welcome to join the conversation as well. 866-34-TRUTH, 866-348-7884.
You can email me directly joey at joeyhudson.com. So let's talk a little today about politics. Now that's a topic I love.
It's a topic that I talk about every day in my show in the Upstate, in my podcast. But how does politics intersect with our faith too? Can faith survive politics? Maybe the better question is, can politics survive without faith? According to a 2023 Pew research study, 60% of Americans believe religion is losing its influence in public life.
But here's what's fascinating about that. Over 70% of those people think that's a bad thing. They don't want religion and faith leaving public life. They want its influence in public life. They think that government is run more efficiently, that it's more fair, less corruption when there is an element of faith among the leaders. Deep down, even in a society moving away from traditional faith, and boy have we seen that, haven't we?
People still recognize the value of a godly influence. Yet many Christians see politics as too dirty, too divisive. We can't get involved in that. We have to keep our faith separate. So we back away, we stay silent, and we settle for being spectators instead of servants, instead of being leaders. But what if the very reason that politics feels so dark and so dirty and so divisive, what if the very reasons of that is because the light has been pulled out? Because we don't have enough Christians serving in the right places. In Matthew, Jesus said, You are the light of the world.
A city set on a hill cannot be hidden. Let your light shine before others. That wasn't just about church on Sunday, I believe. That was about living out our faith everywhere, including the public square, including school boards, city councils, county councils, state legislatures, at all levels of our elected offices, of our bureaucracies. Let our light shine.
This isn't about grabbing power. It's about carrying purpose. It's about stepping into leadership roles, not to dominate, but to serve the people that we serve, to shape policy, and to shine, and to let Jesus' light shine in a big way. Have you ever thought about that? Today we're going to talk about why Christians actually belong in elected office, I believe. And as I mentioned, Representative John McCravey is a good example of that, and I'm so happy that we're going to be able to spend a few minutes with him, and I can introduce you to one of my favorite members of the South Carolina legislature. But we're also going to talk about, and I want you to think about, maybe God's calling you to lead where the world needs it most, where your county needs it most, where your state, city, where your school district needs it most.
Have you ever thought about that God may be calling you to serve in some type of elected office? We're going to get into all that, and I'd love to get your feedback, your comments. You can email me directly, joeyhudson.com. Of course, you can call 866-348-7884, 866-34-TRUTH.
I'd love to get your comments. Email us, joeyhudson.com. I'm Joey Hudson, in with you today. Thank you for listening to the Truth Network and truthnetwork.com. We're continuing this Thursday afternoon edition of Truth Talk Live. I'm Joey Hudson, in with you today. Appreciate you spending a few minutes of your afternoon with us.
Your comments are welcome. You can email me directly, joeyhudson.com. Your calls are welcome, of course, 866-34-TRUTH, 866-348-7884. As I mentioned, I'm happy to be able to introduce you to a good friend of mine, Representative John McCravey. We're going to get to him in just a moment. Susan is in Spartanburg, though, and I think Susan is agreeing with me that it's time for Christians to step up and take leadership roles.
Oh, I sure do. When government policies start infringing upon our rights, upon parental rights to protect our children, upon even our borders to protect our citizens, then who is the ultimate authority? Is it the state and no longer God? The right to life, the right to our freedoms, the right to raise our children the way we are, even when we're in these public schools? And one of the big threats today is really this transgender ideology. The women's rights to totally discriminate against women, allowing men to come into our bathrooms, our children's bathrooms.
It should be women and men. I mean, this is when, if we don't stand up and be people of courage, and we have to. That is our duty now. That is our duty.
Exactly. That's how we've gotten into this somewhat of a mess, I'll say, because we have allowed this to happen. And look, this is the best time ever for Christians to step up and take leadership roles so that we can, because we're in a fight here. This is war.
This is war, and it's going to continue, and we can't just depend upon Trump and just his small cabinet. We have to get behind him 100 percent, and I really would like to see churches get off the fence and more pastors and more churches get together united, because the fight is here and it's real, and it's not going to go away. Amen. And we are in a fight for really our rights and really the authority of God's ultimate authority, his kingdom.
Or we're going to allow the dictators, we're going to allow the voices of the state authority that may not be a godly people, and so that's the way it is, and that's our duty. Susan, you are so right. Hey, I appreciate you listening this afternoon. Have a blessed afternoon. I appreciate you, because you're one of those voices of courage, and we need voices like you, so thank you. Well, thank you.
You're very kind, yeah. John McCravey serves the people of the 13th district in the South Carolina House of Representatives. He's a good friend, has been over the years. Representative McCravey has been a tireless advocate for the protection of life. He sponsored and fought for the passage of the fetal heartbeat bill in South Carolina, and is presently working towards the passage of the South Carolina Human Life Protection Act. Representative McCravey is the founder and chairman of the South Carolina Family Caucus, and just recently became the chairman of the National Association of Christian Lawmakers Legislative Council.
From Greenwood, South Carolina, Representative John McCravey is on our guest line. Welcome, sir. How are you?
I'm doing great. It's an honor to be on today, and I agree with Susan, who just called. We appreciate you and all you do to get the word out and to be a Christian conservative out there in the world.
Well, thank you, sir. Look, you're in the trenches every day, and the reason Susan called is our first segment there. I kind of challenged our listeners today, and we talked about in Matthew 5.14, you are the light of the world. The city set on the hill cannot be hidden. Let your light shine before others, and my argument is that's just not in the church.
That's in the public square as well. That's so true, Joey, and it's time for Christians to stand up and stand up for our faith and stand firm for what's right. Well, and you've been in the heart of that battle in the South Carolina legislature. If you will, take just a few minutes, Representative McCravey, for our listeners who are not familiar with South Carolina's fetal heartbeat bill. Give us the history of this law, which took several years of multiple court challenges, and then, if you will, kind of give us an overview, too, of the Human Life Protection Act and what it does as opposed to the heartbeat bill and furthering those protections.
Yes, Joey. Well, we started really around 2018. In 2017, we formed something we call the Family Caucus in South Carolina. We're a group of Christian conservatives who banded together in the House of Representatives and the Senate to organize.
And, you know, we had a situation, much like our nation, where we have Christians, but they're not organized. And so we wanted to organize our legislators, and we've been very successful in South Carolina. But one of the very first bills that we promoted was the heartbeat bill.
This was way before Dobbs. It was before when they said we couldn't get this passed. We got it passed in South Carolina.
It took a lot. We've been sued numerous times by Planned Parenthood, but we've survived all the lawsuits, and that's the law in South Carolina now, the heartbeat bill. Once Dobbs was overturned, we certainly wanted to go further than just the heartbeat. You know, we still have, even though the heartbeat bill is the law, we still have 2,400 approximately babies every year that are still being killed, even though we've saved thousands. So we need to, and this is the same in every state, so we've got to keep fighting for these children, and we want to pass the Human Life Protection Act that would take it back to the time when a woman is first known to be pregnant, that baby would be protected. So that's what we're trying to do in South Carolina.
It's an uphill battle right now. I think, you know, the populace is, we had such a fight on the heartbeat bill, I think people are taking a breath right now, but I'm not stopping, and we're not going to stop. Our family caucus is going to keep promoting this in South Carolina, and so this is, you know, and the Human Life Protection Act as a segue into our National Association of Christian Lawmakers is one of our model bills, and so we've adopted that in the National Association of Christian Lawmakers, which we organized that about the same time as the family caucus in South Carolina. It was the vision of Senator Jason Rayford in Arkansas, and man, I was so encouraged to see a national organization, it may be the first of its kind, where we have Christian conservatives from almost every state joining together, legislators, federal legislators, state legislators, and local lawmakers, and we gathered together, and we're now sharing legislation with each other, we're having great conferences. You know, we've got a conference coming up, I know, at Liberty University coming up June the 5th, and everybody's invited to it. If you want to join and join our effort, you're welcome to do so, and we'll talk later on in your program if you want to about how they can do that, but does that answer your question?
It does. No, no, no, that's all good, and I do, before we leave today, I do want information for our listeners on how they can become involved, because as I understand it, obviously, you want elected officials at all levels, not just in legislatures, but city councils, county councils, school boards, but you don't have to be an elected official either to be involved, but you're right, we'll get into that in just a moment and talk about that. Coming up, I'll continue our conversation with Representative John McCravey. We're going to talk about Christian legislators, Christian elected leaders, and why we can't shy away, why we have to be bold and profess Christ's name in everything that we do.
We'll be right back. You're listening to the Truth Network and truthnetwork.com. Continuing this Thursday afternoon edition of Truth Talk, I'm Joey Hudson in with you today. Love for you to join the conversation, 866-34-TRUTH, 866-348-7884. Of course, I love your emails, joey at joeyhudson.com. I invite you to join me on my daily podcast, Just the Truth, just search for Joey Hudson, Just the Truth, wherever you listen to podcasts.
You can check out my website, joeyhudson.com, too, and subscribe there. We're talking today about Christians being leaders, taking leadership roles in their communities at all levels, local level, state levels, national level. Representative John McCravey is from Greenwood, South Carolina. He represents the 13th district in the South Carolina House of Representatives, and I can say that John McCravey is the epitome of what a Christian leader looks like, and I'm glad to have him on with me today. I appreciate your time today, Representative McCravey. Well, thank you, and continuing our conversation, Joey, thank you again for what you are doing. You're a Christian leader yourself, and I really appreciate what you do.
Thank you, sir, I appreciate that. Earlier, I mentioned a 2023 Pew research study. It shows that 60% of Americans believe religion is losing its influence in public life. That same study shows that a smaller amount of people identify as Christians.
It has decreased steadily over the past few years, over the past few decades, but here's what's kind of fascinating about that. Of those 60%, 70% of those people believe that it's a bad thing. I think 70% of those actually want people with godly values to be involved and hold leadership roles in our government at all levels. I was looking at the website of the National Association of Christian Lawmakers, and you have a quote on there from the first Chief Justice of the United States, John Jay. He said, Providence has given to our people the choice of their rulers, and it is their duty as well as privilege and interest of our Christian nation to select and prefer Christians for their rulers. And that's our role, isn't it, Representative McCravey, as voters, is to seek out people, men and women, who are Christians, who are running for office, and support them, vote for them, support them monetarily, and get them elected.
It certainly is, and we have to support them after they're elected as well. So we've got the National Association of Christian Lawmakers once again, that's what they do, and that's been such an important part of my service in our state. I'm encouraged, when I go to these conferences and I see people like Charlie Kirk and the Speaker of the House, Mike Johnson, who's not afraid of his faith, and we listen to Coach Kennedy speak up in our last conference. And you know, we've had heroes to me like Mike Huckabee, he's one of our board of advisors, we've had others, so many others, that we've had to come and encourage us. At the same time, we've been inspired by a lot of faith leaders like John Hagee, Andrew Womack, and Tony Perkins.
I got to see inside Tony Perkins at our last conference, and so I was so encouraged by that. And we've got so many supporters, anybody out there that's listening can join our group, be a part of what we do, come to a conference, and see what's going on. And so it's exciting to me, the progress we've made, and so many legislators from all, you can meet legislators from Alaska to Florida.
These are legislators that are dedicated to the Christian faith, that see our world with a Christian worldview, a biblical worldview. And so we've got our upcoming conference coming up June the 5th at Liberty University, we've been there several times now. And it's in Lynchburg, Virginia, of course, and it's not too late to sign up, it's not too late to sponsor this event. And if you'll go to our website, www.Christianlawmakers.com, and you can find all the information there and sign up, join.
It's not expensive to join, it's really cheap. We've got so many leaders that you can meet and be a part of something great that's going on in our nation. So I did want to get that out. Absolutely.
Let me talk about that a little bit. Sure thing, that's Christianlawmakers.com. And look, Liberty University is just beautiful. I had the privilege years back before Dr. Falwell left us, and Mike Gallagher and I actually were at a book signing at the Barnes and Noble in Lynchburg, Virginia, just down the road. We could see the university up on top of the mountain there. And so this big Cadillac comes pulling in, and this guy walks out, he's got cowboy boots on, and he says, Dr. Falwell would like to meet you guys and give you a tour of the campus after your book signing. And I found out later that the guy's name was Duke. I forget his last name, but Duke had been a successful construction person in Georgia, sold his business, had moved there, and he kind of volunteered at the school. But Duke picked us up and took us for the tour, and we met with Dr. Falwell, and we saw at that time they were constructing a new student center and a new chapel. I mean, it's just a great school.
Well, it is. It's a great venue, and they roll out the red carpet for us, Joey. They believe in our mission. Their president has come and been with us, and they've just done such a fantastic job of hosting us, and we're fit. Liberty University obviously is a great faith-based university in our nation, and they like what we do.
So it's a really good fit for us. And talk about training Christian leaders. Now, they are training future Christian leaders at Liberty University, for sure.
I want to go back to something you mentioned a minute ago. You mentioned Charlie Kirk, my colleague with the Salem Media. And, you know, I've been to a number of Turning Point USA events over the years. I've watched Charlie just really grow that organization. And isn't it encouraging to see young men like Charlie Kirk, and when I'm at his events, literally, there can be 10,000 young people from all around the country.
They're enthusiastically wanting to be involved in government, and they're conservatives, and they're Christians. Oh, man, it is so encouraging, so encouraging. He has such a great, really, I call it a ministry going on, and he goes on to these campuses, and they get excited. I'll tell you another group, Joey, just like that, that we have involved and that's been to NACL is Students for Life. Kristen Hawkins is the leader of that.
She's on our advisory board as well. But these young people on campus, they get excited about saving lives. And they are out there working, and they are so enthusiastic for the cause of life.
It's just very encouraging. So that's another group, but yes, yes. I'm hoping and I'm praying, and I see signs of it, that our next generation is going to not be maybe as much like the millennials, but they're going to be a majority of Christians that are going to influence our country for the good. So we're looking forward to that. South Carolina Representative John McCravey with us today in our final minute or so together here. You know, Republican candidates won.
We had a good year in 2024, of course, you know, re-electing Donald Trump for another term. But, you know, in the end, across the country this month has been reorg. People have been going to their precinct meetings for the Republican Party. And reorg is such an important part of the process because just because we won, and I've been hearing stories from around the country that attendance has not been as good as party leaders would like, people are saying, well, we won, we won. Well, yes, we did win, but the fight continues, and it's more important now than ever to be involved, isn't it?
It sure is, Joey. Because we have a president who is now freeing up Christians from persecution, that doesn't mean that's going to last. We've got to elect Christians from the grassroots up, and there's no question.
You could have, you took the words right out of my mouth. We've got to be involved from the ground up, and everybody's got to be involved. You know, we're not going to be assured of having a Christian conservative government unless we elect people all across our nation who agree with that. So I can't, you know, I can't encourage people enough to get out, be involved wherever you are, even if it's in a town, even if it's in a county, even if it's with your state, or even federally.
Get involved, you know, your school board. Please get involved out there, and I like the challenge that you threw out earlier. You know, we have got to challenge ourselves. Everybody needs to step it up a little bit, because there's no guarantees.
Absolutely, yep. Rep. John McCravey, it's always a pleasure. I pray for you all the time, because I know you're in the middle of the fight. Keep it up for us. Thank you, brother. We appreciate you.
John McCravey, South Carolina representative. Joey Hudson, end with you today. Hope you'll join the conversation. Continuing today's show, I'm Joey Hudson, end with you today. 866-34-TRUTH, 866-348-7884.
Hope you'll join the conversation in this final segment of this beautiful Thursday afternoon. You can email me directly, joeyjoeyhudson.com. Let me invite you to join me on my daily podcast, Just the Truth.
Just search for Joey Hudson, Just the Truth. Wherever you listen to podcasts, you can go to my website, joeyhudson.com, and subscribe there as well. Why don't you there, too, subscribe to my email newsletter, so we can stay in touch. I love getting your emails, and find me on social media, too.
Just search for Joey Hudson on Facebook, Instagram, X, and we'll stay in touch. We were talking earlier with South Carolina representative, John McCravey, and again, he is a great example of a Christian man running for public office and serving, and that's what we need more of. Yes, Republicans won in 2024 at all levels, but that's just the beginning, because over the past four years particularly, but this has been growing for decades now, the left has slowly pushed faith out of government. They'll always argue with you, well, we've got to have a separation of church and state.
Well, that's not true. We need Christians serving in our government. Too often, Christians step back from government and politics because they say it's too corrupt. That's not spiritual enough. But the simple truth is, we need Christians shining the light on the darkness that can exist in government, right?
It's not that the world got stronger, it's that the church got quieter. In 2023, Gallup reported that only 9% of Americans trust Congress to act ethically. 90% believe that members of Congress will act ethically when they're governing. That's not just a political crisis, it's a moral crisis. We're watching what happens when integrity is optional and faith is seen as a threat. When Christians disengage, what fills the vacuum?
It's neutral. It's often policies, platforms, personalities that don't reflect the heart of God, and that's how our country has gotten where it is today, where we're literally having debates on how many sexes there are, gender identity. God made man and he made woman, period, end of sentence.
But all of this is not new. The Bible shows us, let's take Daniel for example. He didn't serve under a godly king, he didn't live in a theocracy. Daniel was thrown into this high-level government job in Babylon, a nation famous for its idols, injustices, for its pride.
Daniel didn't run from the opportunity, he stepped up, not back. And through his integrity, through his prayer life, and through his wisdom, even pagan kings came to honor the one true God. And in more recent history, we've seen Christians do the same. Representative McCravey cited a number of examples earlier of leaders that we've seen in the Christian faith. Mike Huckabee was a Southern Baptist pastor before he became governor of Arkansas. He didn't abandon his faith for politics, he brought it with him.
Whether advocating for pro-life policies, whether working for religious liberty, Mike Huckabee's decisions were shaped by scripture and his past as a minister for the people. So here's a challenge for us today. We have to be involved more than ever. We can't change what we're unwilling to be part of, so we've got to be a part of it. God never told us to avoid the world, he told us to go into and make disciples.
That doesn't stop at the ballot box, that doesn't include not being a part of this. God intends for us to be in the boardrooms, in the courtrooms, in the classrooms, and yes, in our state capitals, in city council chambers, in county council chambers, in school board chambers. In Proverbs chapter 29, 2, when the righteous rule, people rejoice, but when the righteous refuse to rule, people suffer. A lot of Christians think that ministry only happens behind a pulpit in a church. But scripture paints a much broader picture. In the Bible, some of God's most faithful servants weren't priests or prophets, they were public officials. Joseph was second in command over all Egypt.
Nehemiah served as governor and rebuilt the wall. Daniel, as we mentioned a minute ago, as we saw earlier, held top-level roles in a pagan empire. So here's the key, and here's what we have to keep in mind. Their leadership wasn't separate from their faith, it flowed from it. Modern politics often feels like a power game, but biblical leadership is something completely different. In Mark, Jesus said, whoever wants to be great among, you must be your servant. That means leadership at its core is ministry.
It's shepherding people, it's creating laws that protect the vulnerable, defend the weak and promote righteousness. But sadly, a lot of churches don't talk about it. A lot of churches think, oh, we have to stay out of politics.
There's no place for that. Pastors shy away from talking about politics at the pulpit because they're afraid that they're going to upset someone in the congregation. And again, I go back to the study that I talked with Representative McCravey about a minute ago from the Barna group that shows 79% of pastors believe the Bible speaks to political and social issues. Only 10% say they preach on those topics regularly. So why the gap? And again, it's that fear, fear of controversy, fear of division, fear of being misunderstood.
But isn't the cost of silence too high? I mean, when we don't disciple people for public service, when we leave them to be discipled by culture, we get where we are today in a lot of different situations. We don't get the Christian leaders who embrace their public role as a ministry, as something that God called them to do. And this isn't about the left or the right. It's about right and wrong.
And it's not even necessarily about Republicans versus Democrats, although typically Republicans tend to be more conservative in their beliefs. But Christians led by the Spirit can bring a voice of wisdom. They can bring the healing. You know, Joe Biden went into office saying he was going to be the president of unity. He was going to bring the country back together.
But because of the divisiveness that he allowed and even promoted among the left, among the woke, he did the exact opposite. We've got to get back to that healing, don't we? We've got to get back to not being afraid to profess our faith and put that righteousness and that healing and that wisdom and that faith back in the public square and not be shy about it. When we view leadership as ministry, we stop asking, Do I want to be in politics? And we start asking, Where does God want to use me? Does God want me to be in politics? What role does God want me to play? Because there's this dangerous idea floating around the church, one that sounds spiritual but actually keeps believers sidelined, is the thought that says politics is secular.
The gospel is spiritual. Let's not mix the two. Yes, we do. We do want to mix the two. Am I wrong?
Email me, joeyjoeyhudson.com. I'd love to hear from you if you think I'm off base here. And we'll talk about it again the next time I'm sitting in with you.
Because here's the truth. There's no part of life where Jesus doesn't belong. The gospel was never meant to stay within the four walls of a church. It's meant to go into every sphere, media, education, business, family, and, yes, government. Again, the public square.
We need it there more than ever. This comes back to where Jesus and Matthew said, Go therefore and make disciples of all nations. That word nations means more than just people. It means systems. It means cultures. It means communities.
It means government bodies. We're not called to retreat from these things, from culture, from the public arena. We're called to help renew it. We're called to support it and be a part of it. When Christians view politics as a mission field, it's going to change everything.
It's no longer us versus them. It's about salt and light. It's preserving what's good, revealing what's true, and resisting what's evil.
And I believe the world's hungry for it. A LifeWay research survey found that 63% of churchgoers believe that elected officials should base their decision on biblical values. Even in a polarized world, people still long for leaders who lead with conviction, who lead with compassion and that Christ-like character. And there's a lot of examples in our history, in our country's history, because, as you know, our country was founded on those Christian principles. It was not unusual then, back in the day of our early leaders, they often talked about their faith. The Bible and their faith was a big part of it. And that's where we have to get back, folks.
That's where we have to elect people who are not shy of talking about their faith, who will serve with purpose, who will step into public leadership, not for the power, but to serve others. I'm Joey Hudson. It's been great being with you today. Email me, joeyjoeyhudson.com. Have a wonderful day.
