A Conversation with Stu Epperson

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From Alex McFarland Ministries, this is Truth for a New Generation Radio. And now the man who preached in 50 states in 50 days, speaker, writer, and advocate for Christian apologetics, Dr. Alex McFarland. Maybe you've heard the old song, Up from the Grave He Arose, with a mighty triumph for his foes. Think about what Jesus did that first Easter morning. He arose a victor from the dark domain. He lives forever with his saints to reign.

Hi, Alex McFarland here. Welcome to TNG Radio, Truth for a New Generation. And Jesus rode into Jerusalem on Palm Sunday, fulfilling Zechariah 9 and Zechariah 13. They shouted Hosanna and in only a few days, the very same people that had once praised Jesus would be shouting for his condemnation. They would be saying, crucify him. He did go to that cross.

He was nailed to the tree of Calvary. He rose from the dead for you and for me. And how we rejoice in that Jesus not only paid our sin debt, but he conquered death. Well, I'm so excited about the program you're listening to. And the friend that I want you to meet, truly one of my best friends ever in life, a ministry colleague of more than 20 years now, and the author of an incredible book called The Last Words of Jesus, First Steps to a Richer Life.

His name is Stu Epperson Jr. You know that name because you've heard me reference him so many times. And we're just going to gather around his book and learn about the last words of Jesus from the cross. But also we're just going to fellowship around that great reality that our Savior is alive. And Stu, now at the time of the whole world is very concerned over this pandemic, isn't that a message that more urgently than ever needs to be heard, that Christ is alive and all who know him will live forever too?

Amen. That's the greatest message, the greatest message. The only words that have ever changed anyone's life are the words of life, the words that came out of the mouth of Jesus. And we have the written Word in the Bible, we have the living Word, the Word made flesh, the Word was with us and dwelt among us, and we beheld his glory. The glory of the only begotten of the Father, full of grace and truth, John 1. And that is who Jesus is, and that's what my book really, and I know all of your books, Alex, which I love, and I've interviewed you countless times for your books, and everyone needs to own every one of Alex's books.

I'm just a little, he's the Jedi Meister, I'm just a little guy here learning from the feet of godly men like him. But we are trying to point people to Jesus, because no one has ever come in contact with him and his words and been the same. Before the resurrection, before that empty tomb on that first Easter morning, before even the cross, give us kind of the story leading up to what happened, the most significant week in all of history, in Jerusalem, the one known as the Bread of Life, the Son of God. How was it that the crowd so quickly turned against him, and ultimately he would be executed on Mount Calvary?

Give us the larger story of what was going on here. We call it Good Friday, and we were trying to figure out, you know, this paragraph in the introduction. The introduction of the book is entitled Seven Words of Life from the Tree of Death. And honestly, you can't have life without death. Jesus said it the best. He said, unless a grain of wheat falls on the ground and dies, it will not bring forth life.

But if it does, it will bring forth a huge multiple of life. And that's what we have in Jesus at this Passover event, Holy Week, Holy Sunday. So we start there, and we go into his actual moments dying on the cross, and those seven statements, seven pithy-pointed, well-measured, divine statements on the cross as Christ died, he opened his mouth. It says in Isaiah 53 that he opened not his mouth, he was led as a sheep before his shearers.

He was led as a sheep to slaughter, literally, the Lamb of God being slain for our sins. And he didn't open his mouth, he was in the trial. They're all marveling at this. They're all beside themselves. This man did no wrong, he's on trial.

This is your chance, sir, to defend yourself. Punch after punch, blow after blow, stripe after stripe, and not a word from the one whose word spoke the world into existence. Colossians 1, by him all things were created.

Without him was not anything made that was made. He said the light of the world is the one that said, let there be light. And here, he's everything but speaking, he's everything but verbose. There's no words coming out of the living word until he's thrust on that cross, and he says these seven profound statements that have literally changed my life. Getting into forgiveness, getting into care for the widow, social justice from the cross, and all these things. And they're all in this book, Last Words of Jesus, Alex, and I can't think of a better time of year to really lean in to that death of Christ and lean into what he did for me, and what he meant when he said, it is finished, than right now. Before we get to the words, it is finished, and he yielded up his spirit, in Luke 23, 34, Jesus said, Father, forgive them, for they know not what they do.

Give us a little bit of explanation of this. Forgive them, for they know not what they do. What were they doing that needed the Father's forgiveness?

Wow, great question. Alex, there's actually five sermons in that one statement. The first one is Father. Let's talk about Father. Let's talk about who Father is. Let's talk about why Jesus opened with Father. The second one's on prayer. He opened up in prayer.

The one who is familiar with his Father, it says in Luke 4, 5, and 6, it says he went to a remote place to pray all night, right? So he's opening in prayer, he addresses his Father, then he says forgive. What does forgive mean?

Can you imagine that word in our culture being actually employed, being used? Imagine the power and the freedom that would ensue if forgiveness was simply explored. What the Bible says about forgiveness, Jesus said, Father, forgive. And then what about this other one, them?

Who are they? Who is he praying forgiveness for? His haters. I mean, the first thing that I do when someone offends me, attacks me, is the first thing I do to jump in and say, Father, forgive them.

These are people that were gambling over his clothes. They were the ones that were executing him. They just drove these 12-inch nails through his hands, through his feet, and his first words out of his mouth, after all the beating, after all the hate, the spit, and all that, and the mocking, is, Father, forgive them. And then this statement, for they know not what they do.

And in the book, I get into answering this question, do we have any idea what our sins do and have done to the Savior? Alex McFarland here with Stu Epperson, Jr. We're talking about the last words of Jesus from the cross. Truth for a New Generation Radio will be back with more after this. Don't go away.

From I Am a Watchman Ministries, here's today's I Am a Watchman Minute. The coronavirus has impacted almost every nation in the world. Several of my family members have contracted the virus.

An extended family member has passed away from the virus. I know what it is to have fear and anxiety. I also know what it is to have peace. Because I know Jesus, the Prince of Peace. I don't have all the answers, but I know that God does and I trust Him. I know He loves me and I know He loves you. Trust God today.

Find peace in Him today. The troubles we're facing now foreshadow the great tribulations that are to come. But know this, Jesus promised to return to rescue sincere believers from this world in an event known as the rapture.

Are you ready for the rapture? Visit Iamawatchman.com to learn more. Be bold, be faithful, be a watchman.

Iamawatchman.com. We care about justice and aren't afraid to ask hard questions. In fact, we care about a lot of things. We have passion for truth. We are EngageMagazine.net, an online group of millennials brought together by a common goal to share truth, apply scripture, and to get involved in our lost and hurting world. EngageMagazine.net, host discussions that help you apply a biblical worldview to your daily life.

EngageMagazine.net. Alex has written many books to help you defend your faith. One of them answers questions from skeptics.

It's cleverly titled, Ten Answers for Skeptics. Today's skeptics are looking for authenticity, integrity, and straightforward truth. And in the book, Alex McFarland identifies the ten most common types of skepticism that plague doubters' minds and offers believers proven strategies for connecting intellectually and spiritually with those who are skeptical about the claims of Christianity. Learn how to answer intimidating questions, identify the root issue behind those questions, and dismantle the spiritual bombshells dropped by atheists. Plus, find encouragement to face hostility by persevering in love. The ultimate apologetic Christians can offer as a witness to our loving God.

Check out Ten Answers for Skeptics when you visit alexmcfarland.com. You don't need to have a Bible degree from Liberty University to love, serve, pray, worship, or obey God, but it can make life more vibrant when you do. When you're ready for a religious studies degree, you'll find more than 60 ministry degree options, from a bachelor's to a doctor of ministry. And you'll pay one low block rate for divinity courses at Liberty University, where we train champions for Christ. Go to liberty.edu backslash explore to learn more.

That's liberty.edu backslash explore to learn more. I love old gospel songs, especially the song where it says, O the love that drew salvation's plan, O the grace that brought it down to man. Now listen folks, O the mighty gulf that God did span at Calvary.

Welcome back to Truth For A New Generation Radio. We're talking with my friend, brother, and colleague, Stu Epperson, author of the book, Last Words of Jesus, published by Worthy Publishing. Hey, by the way, Stu, I want to get into this, but where can people find this book? My name, my website is our website, stuepperson.com.

We were fortunate. The publisher said, hey, get a website that's your name, and that way they can find out about this book. First Words of Jesus, maybe more of a Christmas book as well. And just about our ministry, our podcast, all that stuff.

And you might even meet some friends of mine like Alex McFarland there too, because we love showcasing godly men like you and all the stuff you're doing. Well the forward is by David Jeremiah, beloved around the world, Dr. Jeremiah, so many others. Ann Graham says that this is a deep, insightful book, and you want this book. I want to thank you for writing a book that inspired and moved me. But, you know, the love that drew salvation's plan, the mighty gulf that God did span.

What does that mean, Stu? What gulf was spanned as Christ stretched out his arms and those hands that held the sick and comforted the hurting, and the words that were spoken that created the universe, and yet those hands were nailed to the cross, that savior was put to death. What was the gulf that God was able to bridge through Jesus? Such a profound question. The gravity of what you just stated, the depth of that, is practically incomprehensible, to the point where even the prophet Isaiah, a thousand years before any of this stuff happened, asked this question.

Who hath believed our report? But to whom has the arm of the Lord been revealed? And he goes into this beautiful, what they call the gospel of the Old Testament, you know, Isaiah 53, where he talks about how he was wounded for our transgressions, he was bruised for our iniquities.

The whole weight of our sin on Jesus. And really, Alex, that's the beauty, and that was the hardest part about writing this book, Last Words of Jesus, because when you journey into the words of Christ from the cross, those seven statements that he made from the cross of Christ, it really, you're studying the words of Christ, but let me tell you what happens. They end up studying you.

There's people doing this in small groups. There's churches that are giving these out as like a little Easter gift for people to come to their church, so that people can be exposed to the words of Christ, and we go deep in each one of these. It's not a long book. I'm a basketball player, man. I'm not the brightest knife in the drawer, however that goes.

But I want to put something simple, because I myself was looking for something simple as I was journeying. And I didn't know if Jesus said, you know, 20 statements from the cross. I knew that he said some profound things, and I remember the Father forgive, I remember there's something about into thy hands, I commit my spirit, these other things.

So I started digging deep, and I started, so in this book, what you'll have, I guarantee you, you'll have this. You'll have everything Jesus said recorded in the scripture, that is, as he died on the cross. You'll have every scripture verse that, where did he make these statements? You'll discover, like it took me a lot longer to find this out, that three of the statements are in the book of Luke, three of the statements are in the book of Saint John, and the seventh statement, or which is the fourth statement, but the one, only one of the statements is in Mark, and that same one is in Matthew. And that happens to be the most profound one of all of them. So it took two Gospels to record the most profound one, and then three in Luke, three in John. So those are little things like that, but then every prophetic verse in the Bible pointing to those words of Christ, and the implications of those words, and his words are the words of life. So when Jesus speaks, you want to hang on every word, and that's, we're hoping that people will read this, and it'll point them to know Jesus in a better way.

We're hoping people will give this as a gift to someone this time of year, or any time, to point them to Christ, because everyone's fascinated by last words. You know, hey, what did such-and-such say as he died, you know? And we're listening closely, right, as Abe Lincoln's taking his last breath, what's he going to say?

And then someone's going to write that down, and that's going to be the title of the whole book. So we decided to write a book that showcased the greatest one ever, and the only one, as you alluded to earlier, that conquered death, and up from the grave, he did rise, and he is coming back again. Jesus was crucified between two thieves, and one of the thieves said, Lord, remember me when you come into your kingdom, and Jesus, in Luke 23, 43, says, truly, truly, I say to you, today you will be with me in paradise.

People talk about deathbed conversions. I mean, if ever anybody really cut it close to the last second, it was that thief on the cross, but he did put his faith in Jesus. Now, unpack for us, if you would, Stu, Jesus' response, today you'll be with me in paradise.

What did that mean? Well, his response was to probably one of the weakest sinner's prayers ever contrived. You're an evangelist, Alex, and you've led thousands. I've been there, where you've led thousands in a sinner's prayer to pray receive Christ, and hands go up, right?

People come forward, and I've been part of the counseling team that's there, we know, when you do your big events. But this guy, man, he went off script really bad. I mean, he wouldn't have made this, you know, how many of our gospel tracts, after you read about the gospel in the gospel tract or the book, at the end say, okay, now pray this prayer to be saved. Lord, remember me when you come into your kingdom.

Well, so everyone's like, well, that's not going to cut it, bud. Well, let me tell you something that did cut it, because Jesus said to him, powerful response. And this is his second statement from the cross. So after he said, Father, forgive them, his prayer of forgiveness is answered in the thief. Because Jesus says, today, what a great statement.

Not yesterday, not in a few weeks, not after you clean yourself up. Today, you, it's personal, salvation is always personal, will, that's a statement of fact, de facto, it's a statement of absolute guarantee, it's not maybe, might, be with me. He didn't say be like me. He didn't say get right, get down, get cleaned up, get in a bath, get dunked under water, go to catechism class, go to new believers class, go to discipleship class, go on a missions trip, no. He said, today you will be with me, eternal life is being with Jesus.

It's in relationship with him, right? In paradise. That's the end game. That's where I'm going to take you. Where am I going to be today?

I'm going to be in paradise, which is another word for heaven. So he's basically said, look, I've seen, I've heard your words, but I, like no other, can look in your heart, because I've built your heart, and I'm taking you straight to heaven with me. The only one that could save anyone happened to be hanging at a cross just a few feet away from the only one who could save anyone, that's Jesus Christ. The most ruthless sinner, the thief in the Greek means terrorist.

This guy was a murderer, this guy was bloody. Him and his partner in crime both were blaspheming Christ, according to Matthew's account, and here he comes up in Luke 23 and he rebukes the other guy. He says, man, don't you fear God? So all of a sudden he shows that he fears God, he rebukes him, and then he jumps in and prays this prayer, and Jesus saves that man, the only person Jesus saved on that hill. We know the centurion made a great proclamation, we don't know if he was saved or not, he made a great statement, but we know for a fact that Jesus said to this man, today you will be with me in paradise, and he was saved. As a deathbed conversion, a death cross conversion, and just like lifetime conversions, you don't ever know for sure, you know, God knows the heart, of course you see the fruit. We didn't have time to see this guy's fruit, but when Jesus Christ declares you saved, buddy, let me tell you something, you're saved. A real Lord, a real relationship, and a real heaven. Today, you will be with me in paradise. This is Truth For New Generation Radio, Alex McFarland, Stu Epperson, the last words of Jesus from the cross.

Stay tuned, we're going to come back with more after this. Christians don't necessarily agree with one another when it comes to questions of religious pluralism, homosexuality, the role of government, abortion, and war. Too often, we manage these disagreements by ignoring them. Yet, we're called to engage the world for the sake of Christ.

How can we be effective if we avoid society's most pressing questions? In 10 issues that divide Christians, Alex McFarland challenges us to drill down to the biblical core of 10 current issues, such as social justice, evil and suffering, pornography, and environmentalism, as he echoes the biblical invitation, come, let us reason together. Only by engaging the scriptures deeply, thinking clearly, and speaking truthfully, can we in God's family address our differences and discover the peace that comes with unity of purpose. 10 issues that divide Christians.

Find this book and many others at alexmcfarland.com. If you're a Christian parent, you of course want to instill a biblical view of life in the hearts of your children. If you're a pastor, you want to offer ministry that draws young families to your church. This is Alex McFarland encouraging you to check out my new book and video curriculum, The 21 Toughest Questions Your Kids Will Ask About Christianity. Why do bad things happen? I interviewed hundreds of children, ages 5 to 12, and we address actual questions from actual children, the spiritual issues that are on the minds of your kids.

Did Jesus ever sin? The book and video lessons are great for groups of any size and was produced with the goal of equipping kids to stand strong for Christ in any situation. The 21 Toughest Questions Your Kids Will Ask, the book, study guide, and video series. You'll find it at afastore.net. That's afastore.net. In the midst of a culture obsessed with relativism, Alex McFarland is a voice you can trust to speak the timeless truths of Christianity in a timely way. You're listening to Truth for a New Generation Radio. Hey, we're back on Truth for a New Generation Radio.

Alex McFarland here. So glad you're listening, and I just want to say I hope that you and your family have a blessed Easter. Even though the economy is rough and our hearts go out to those people who aren't getting to work and get their hours like they need, but you know something that is untouchable by circumstance or changing situations, that's the reality that Christ is alive. And I'll put it this way, folks.

The tomb was left empty so that your life could be made full. And so at Truth for a New Generation, we've got a lot of content that we're creating. My website is alexmcfarland.com, and we're putting up videos all the time now that the whole world is quarantined, and I've got almost four months of speaking events all around North America that are now postponed or canceled. Please keep us in prayer as we, though, are maybe going to have the most fruitful month for evangelism in the history of the ministry because nearly 100 people a day are emailing and saying, �How can I know that I'm saved? How can I be right with God?� And it's ironic, and we give God the glory. We're not traveling, we're not on airplanes, we're not doing events like we normally do, and yet via email, Internet, correspondence, some phone calls too, we're able to see people pray to accept Christ. So please keep us in prayer, stay engaged with alexmcfarland.com, and listen to all of the great programming that we have the privilege of being a part of, and we praise God for all of this.

And I'm talking with my dear friend, Stu Epperson. Stu, I just want to say you've done a great work for the body of Christ and for lost people. To explain the last words of Jesus, Jesus said to that thief on the cross � they call it the penitent thief because he repented � �Today you'll be with me in paradise.� But let's talk about what Jesus said to John and Mary, �Son, behold thy mother, mother, behold thy son.� Christ is on the cross. He's nailed to the cross, he's been beaten, crown of thorns, the wrath of God that we deserved is being poured onto Jesus, and yet he's thinking about others. What all is in these exchanges of Mary and John and the Lord from the cross?

This is a great picture of, like you said, the care. He was a caring, compassionate Savior, and he cared for his mom as a Hebrew writer, the firstborn, to take care of mom. And then in the event of his untimely death, which would be the case of Christ, he would turn that care over to someone else like John. So in the book I get into that, really how in the Gospel we find the greatest message of social justice. The country, what's going to heal our country, is not racial reconciliation, because if the races get together, they're going to find out that they hate each other for other reasons.

They're going to find out someone's a Yankees fan, someone's a Red Sox fan, and there's plenty of people of the same race that hate each other. So the deeper need, really, systemically, is the Gospel of Jesus Christ. And Jesus answered that on the cross when he brought those two together, who would be two real anchors in that early church.

Mary is a real mentor to John, and a muddly figure to so many, and John is one of the leaders who God will use in the day of Pentecost all the way through Acts in a mighty, powerful way, and to pen a big chunk of the New Testament. Well, also, from Psalm 22, verse 1, my God, my God, why hast thou forsaken me? Psalm 22 was written about 1000 B.C., and it's interesting, Psalm 22 contains the words, they pierced my hands and my feet. And Jesus quotes Psalm 22, 1 from the cross. My God, my God, why hast thou forsaken me?

Now, why from the cross would the Lord quote a psalm written a millennial prior? Well, you'll find in these words, and I go into every prophetic verse in there, from the first to the last, these are all deeply scriptural, deeply Hebrew concepts. The last one, into the hands of the commandment of the Spirit, is from a Hebrew bedtime song that moms and dads would sing as they tuck their babies into bed.

And that goes much like we sing, now I lay down to sleep, or we say those things, or rockabye, you know, so on and so forth. That one, in particular, is the toughest one. Chapter 4 of this book is one of the hardest chapters I've ever had to write. It's the hardest thing I've ever even currently studied, because this idea threw Martin Luther into conniptions. He studied that statement from the cross, which is only found in Matthew and only found in Mark, and it's the only statement from the cross found in those two gospels, by the way.

All the rest of them are in Luke and John. Jesus said those words, Martin Luther studied them, and he had to go into prayer and fasting, away from everyone, for a long period of time in a room. And he prostrated himself on that floor, asking God, what in the world does this mean? He came out and could only say these words, God forsaken by God, how can this be? And it's like that song that we sing a lot of times, even this time of your amazing love, how can it be, that thou, my God, shouldst die for me?

Jesus, it says it pleased the Father to bruise Him in another psalm, in another psalm, in another Isaiah, but another part of the Old Testament body of prophecy, it said it pleased the Father to bruise Him. God poured out the wrath of Himself on His Son. So Christ in a very real sense was forsaken, so we could be accepted, He was rejected, so we could be adopted and made His own. It's a brilliant picture of the great exchange. So the imputation of our sin was upon the righteous Lamb of God, the imputation of His righteousness was placed upon us, He died at my place, and I was given His righteousness, so I am a son, and you, young lady, if you know Christ, are a daughter of the King.

Isn't that awesome? Is there anything greater than the treasure of having life because of His death and His resurrection seal the deal, which we celebrate on Easter Sunday? This ties in with Romans 5-8, God demonstrated His love in that while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us. And you know, it is amazing, the wrath of God poured on God so that we who were deserving of that wrath could be delivered from wrath and declared righteous. Now, Jesus, from the cross, He says, Father, into your hands I commend my spirit. I think about John 19-30, it is finished. And He bowed His head and He was dead. Stu, what's going on there?

What does all that mean? Well, it's a great statement, and I call that a word of peace, because Jesus Christ was the Prince of Peace, and His death came to bring peace. And on Palm Sunday it started, when He came into Jerusalem on an unbroken beast of peace, a donkey, into the city of peace, Jerusalem, shalom, rode the Prince of Peace. We've been talking with author and broadcaster Stuart Epperson Jr., he's the writer of the book The Last Words of Jesus, and I would encourage you to get this book, but even more importantly than that, I would encourage you to think about your relationship with Jesus. Do you have a relationship with Jesus?

As toxic as the coronavirus is said to be and so many other things in this world that are dangerous and even deadly, the most toxic deadly thing in the world is sin. But Jesus can thoroughly, completely, eternally deliver you from sin. And we encourage you, if you've never trusted Christ, do that today.

As we always say, Jesus is as close by as a prayer, and if you will turn to Him now, He will save you, and we hope you do that. If we can help you in any way, in your walk or witness, if you want to come to Christ or come back to Christ, let us help you. Alex McFarland here saying God bless you, pray for America, and take your strong stand for Christ, and it's our honor to help you do that.

Thanks for listening. TNG radio is made possible by the friends of Alex McFarland Ministries, P.O. Box 10231, Greensboro, North Carolina 27404. That's P.O. Box 10231, Greensboro, North Carolina 27404. Call us at 877-Yes-God-1.

That's 877-Yes-God and the number 1. Or give online at AlexMcFarland.com. While you're there, listen to Program Archives, read Alex's blog, invite Alex to speak at your event, or contact Alex with a question or comment, AlexMcFarland.com. Thanks for listening today and join us again next time as we bring you more truth for a new generation on TNG Radio.