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Theology Thursday: Redeeming Affliction

The Steve Noble Show / Steve Noble
The Truth Network Radio
January 27, 2022 9:20 pm

Theology Thursday: Redeeming Affliction

The Steve Noble Show / Steve Noble

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January 27, 2022 9:20 pm

Theology Thursday: Redeeming Affliction

Steve brings Billy Gotcher, from Bob Jones Seminary, on the show today to discuss the Theology of Redeeming Affliction.

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The following program is recorded content created by the Truth Network mobile show where Christianity meets the everyday issues of life in your home, at work, and even in politics. Steve is an ordinary man who believes in an extraordinary God it on a show, there's plenty of grace and truth. No sacred cows call Steve now 86 34 true 866-34-TRUTH or check them out online, Steve Noble now here's your host Steve Noble everybody. You may recall, Ben, listening to Joe for a while are watching the show for a while Facebook live YouTube live back in August I had just one of the most intelligent guess I've ever had of this element is off the charts.

Carl Truman's great theologian incredible writer. He wrote a book called the rise and fall of the modern self, but he's increasingly the last few years been speaking to cultural issues and what's going optically here in America and we go back two years. If you can believe that almost 2 years almost to the day and when Colbert started so back in March 2020 cultural and write an article.

Any any." The article from Philip Reif once commented in past times, people did not go to church to be made happy us right you got go to did not go to church be made happy.

They went to have their misery explained to them anything about that. Okay, it's a little dark. It's kind of a bummer but isn't that the fact that that sooner or later were all going to experience misery.

This world is a real mass whether we look at it and a 30,000 foot view in the entire world. We talk about things in America. We talk about things in your state or my state. We talk about things at work in the culture and politics or just in your family. Maybe in your marriage with your kids with work with the job with bills with your health. And there's affliction seems to be waiting around the corner for all of us. That's like kind of that old saying you're either going into a trial or coming out of a trial you're in between ranges can't avoid it. So the question becomes how do we kind of redeem these times of affliction when were suffering when you're going through really difficult things and I'm not saying that the most pious thing you can do is try to figure out a way to extend it to the glory of God.

But what you do while you're in it and oftentimes we try to run away from it. I saw today on theology Thursday based on the blog that are a good friend of Billy doctors back in the house. He was with us before handling some some theology of some difficult topics in today redeeming times of affliction for effective ministry where you do it that a reading from the blog of the church is increasingly facing misery, most notably shaming right from our fallen culture where's the abortion issue or sexual ethics or even the masks or vaccine mandates, whatever. That's we got all that stuff, this time of extended affliction. He writes has expose one of the chief idols of our hearts. Comfort and convenience.

Can I get an honest amen when comfort and convenience are shaken. We want to look for something to make us feel better that's for sure. Then you got James on the other side saying, hey, count it all joy brothers and sisters, and you're like yeah yeah I know how you do that what you would you do with your affliction. How do you kinda turn these difficult times into a ministry time and right now. Personally this is on my radar screen. Many of you know that shared it on Facebook. Live a little bit on the radio here and there. My mother's 90 my dad went home to be with the Lord a little over three years ago in my mother's 90 and she's been battling for the last five or six months. Serious health issues and in the last four weeks. I really just became at home and I can win this battle and then you just want as she knows the Lord, you want the suffering to go away. You don't want this lingering it's taking so long.

What's the Lord up to mice. This is happening in Chattanooga Tennessee. My mother went to be with the Lord this morning at about 6:30 AM and I my two sisters are there, one sister lives in Chattanooga.

The other sister just visiting different parts of the country for a couple years and so she's been there living with my mother and so very, very difficult. If you've ever had to care for an elderly parents or family member, especially as they they neared the end of life.

It's very very difficult. That's a huge burden to bear. It's a great affliction, and so while reports in your pray Lord please please take her in their suffering. Get her out of here. Why does she need to linger like this. You have to realize in and trust that the Lord's got a reason and there's ministry and there's opportunity even in the midst of affliction, so this today as we talk about it very personal. This very fresh for me but praise the Lord a 90 years as it is an incredible life to live in.

My parents lived it fully. So while it's sad it's not tragic so would be sensitive to you that out there that have experienced tragic loss and and only wish and hope and pray that your parents and live to 90 and 91.

Mike might so I'm not looking to get Thorson about anyway Billy at the superlong introductions, great to see a man how are you it's great to see Steve and I really my heart grows to a loss of life in some sense tragic gift of life is precious.

Okay, then certainly praying for God's comfort for your family. Thank you I appreciate that and I look forward to seeing you face-to-face.

I'll be down at BJ you seminary come up on Monday after the core conference which will talk about later.

We've been talking about it for several weeks until he speaking at that, but this isn't exactly happy-go-lucky kind message Billy so affliction.

Why is this on your radar screen. Why did you want to talk about it today. What I honestly think through the part of it is part of the journey in teaching and learning for yourself, even as a pastor pastoring or our church just some of the personal afflictions and that kind of word all went to terms that thorn in the flesh just going through that experience in different ways with it was external affliction, or whether it was some of the personal ones that come through your own health crisis that kind of thing. I think God use those greatly to help shape and be compassion for the people that I pastor understanding of their affliction, and how to better shopper and so I fish think it's super important topic for us to think about yeah and so that that's kind of on a personal level but you mentioned in the blog post and I'll share that on Facebook live today on Facebook. See you guys. These are always excellent and there's a blog post every week that goes along with theology Thursday so BJ you seminary just really doing a great job of thought leadership.

So these are things that you should read yourself. Don't just listen to the shoulders in the podcast watch the show. That's great, but study and dig in a little bit more.

That's why these blog posts exist in just such a great resource, but but also a kind of as a church or even Billy is a Christian in America is now. We got canceled. Culture were not exactly the popular kids on the block so not just personal affliction but now affliction just being a body part of the body of Christ and that's a real issue as well. We deftly seen that the last two years of cold, absolutely.

And it is where we are facing that. Just trying to say even as church. So as an individual and as a church of the lessons.

Both directions meet my individual lessons God's teaching shape Christ in me. Also, the is about how do we as a church respond to. When the culture is increasingly hostile. It's not as comfortable in a sense, being a Christian in the public speaking in public space.

So how would we want the breaker just about 30 seconds how we generally define affliction.

Well, I mean it's a broad category being we deal with afflictions, and you got the different kind you can be the external pressure from an external tube with her in silence.

Your push you aside and in some afflictions rise internally from the fact we face our weaknesses. Whether that's a physical ailment or the inability to do something in front of us trying to accomplish. Yeah, you face on multiple layers of affliction and and I and it just presses each of us back to those things we hold most dear.

Yeah so what you do when that time comes, because it comes for all of us, and for many of you right now you're in it right now, so this will be the Lord speaking to you directly from his work to pay attention America and noble show theology Thursday with our friends at BJ seminary talking to Billy culture today as we are working through a subject that's a difficult when we suffer. Trials are affliction hard times generally. You know were kinda looking for a way out right. We pray that it will end soon. Sometimes we ask, why are you doing this, Lord, is opposed asking what are you trying to do here right now and we can really struggle with affliction. We struggle with it on a personal level we can struggle with it as a couple or as a family and I could be internal things are dealing with mentally, emotionally, it could be physical things job things, but then as a church in America. You may have noticed this.

We can't really if you're gonna be outspoken or will our carrier faith on your sleeve and sucking hard to fly under the radar. So we can were starting to, and we will experience more affliction. Just as church as church people as Christians in America. So the question becomes what we do with it. How do we redeem these times of affliction because you're knocking to avoid them. They're going to happen all of us, and for many of us, myself included, maybe you're going through it right now and you just feel afflictions very difficult time. But that's always great territories. Always very fertile soil for what the Lord is going to do, not only in your life are in my life but can do outside of our lives. Oftentimes all remind people I've known people Billy and again thanks for being here today have a friend from church years ago sadly died when he was 39 they had stomach cancer and that was that the battle for about a year and 1/2 terrible affliction, but during that in this word itself towards the end when I had a chance to talk to him. I said Mike you know what you've just been an incredible steward of your infliction of your affliction and that because that's how we lived it out. He's like okay this is the deal.

This is what's happening to me has a terribly painful cancer.

He knows he's knocking a beat.

It. And so it decides that I'm use this as a ministry platform and is an opportunity to proclaim the word into text to reach out to people of the gospel and he just became this incredible steward of his affliction, and you saw all kinds of fruit, for that but unfortunately I don't think that's the norm. I think that's kind outsider, nor are my just being a cynic of the real synagogue think we tend to just part of the our own.

We kind of personalized distance we see a you appalled by me and Paul's example there is a saw that thorn in the flesh, you don't know exactly what was but we know it hindered what Paul's thought is his ability to advance ministry.

It was a hindrance. It was something needed to go and he's crying out for that be removed and so I think we can once it's take comfort. They are the were not that different than Paul but we also need to learn what to call Lord truth because that that was do we get too wrapped up Billy and trying to figure out what the actual thorn was in Paul's flesh or thinking about you know that was tormenting thing from the devil. Should we. We spent too much time focusing on that, we kind of missing the forest for the trees. When I talk about affliction.

I mean I think Paul was intentionally vague on me and we talked about the thorn in the flesh. She wasn't want to say this was exactly what I was dealing with. So that is how Satan is going to go after you. He is dealing with the fact that affliction that actually he saw as a hindrance in his life.

This progress needed to be removed in order him to be effective and God had to teach you mean he learned through this that really it's not our strength, our energy is the key to ministry. It really is God's power and that doesn't demand that we weave lack affliction actually means we have the humility to seek God's God's power rather than our own wheat. The Scripture doesn't really give us any indication that God was that Paul escapes that affliction right right now, no heat, he didn't. It wasn't removed. He's asking. I don't think means literally just asked three times. I think it's thing I asked Rios and I was desperate for this to be removed as an II continue to plead with the Lord and the Lord answered noble. This is my my grace is sufficient. So is it so it then we can infer that it's not wrong to ask God to relieve us of us are affliction as it is that like a weak faith thing Billy and my bad? Mike okay Lord enough. It's enough.

I think we know why I'm not that I wouldn't say it's wrong.

I think we need to think sometimes we get so tied up into it.

It's either like to say Lord get rid of this. If you love me get rid of this or I want to know the exact lesson you have for me and teach me now you want to drive to version right now so rather than understanding that we do live in a fallen world. This world is not our home. It's not supposed to be comfortable in the afflictions of life.

Help us come to the end of ourselves and at the end of self. I actually find my dependence on God and find a place where I didn't really begin to rejoice in God's grace in my life, rather than you know.

I want a little injection of power a little, you know so that I can go to some pray that's and that's a point where am also working through Billy's blog post today, which were was up on the website so you can get that for yourself up at the links up redeeming times of of of affliction for effective ministry that that Paul had successive ministry that was dependent not on his own strength, which we all tend to think we have a lot to do that but I God's grace and his weakness but like when you flip over to James so rejoice in weakness.

You wrote in that in the blog but that that's I get it. I know what we need to do, but why should we like I'm that I'm like a petulant for your okay I'm always asking why why should we rejoice in weakness or affliction. I think we rejoice because it does help us come again to that place of that humility and dependence that and then it also takes some of the pressure that we sometimes put on ourselves ministry like it's up to me. You know, and so it it's not just that you are not going out looking for afflictions, but I'm reminded that I I am fallen I am in sufficient but God's grace is never insufficient in that in that place weakness and humility where II go really to the throne of grace asked for help, I receive it in the God gets magnified and we really do rejoice in seeing God working in and through our life, even in the midst of her affliction or weakness and I think that's that that's a great point. That's usually what I end up with it personally in my own life and situations going okay. I'm in a rejoice in this weakness because I know that God is doing something in me. I know this isn't for nothing. It's not a waste of time. It's not just some kind of goofy happenstance that I know because of God's character, then I can trust his Providence and his prominence tends to show up pretty could be pretty effective in in a difficult soil as opposed to things going well on the timeout think we ever learn anything and not get back to just like you said that theology of God and the theology of self understanding may understand and and then that help suspend begin to respond rather than out of this will be emotions to the afflictions. I'm feeling out of the truth of who God is what God is doing in the middle of those affliction yet because he read it yet, just like I mentioned with with my sisters tickly. One sister who is living in up in my mother's house so it's 24 seven. Then my other sister lives nearby, so she got plenty of it to any just like okay what's the point of all of this but when you have your theology of God's character right and understand his Providence. You know there's a point at the asked that question I know he's doing something.

The only question is what is he doing and how can I participate in that which is why Paul with his thorn in the side of such a great lesson for us to really appreciate you bringing that end of the block was put second party mentioned this earlier talk about cannot kinda cancel culture ministry advances amongst opposition. Now we go to war right yet we've gone the war over the last two years over a mask over setting a store down over vaccine mandates and so oftentimes I think again missing the forest for the trees. This opposition comes in instead of looking at as and as a opportunity to advance ministry we look at as an opportunity to advance our personal freedom and that's that's important lesson we live in America we have all kinds of freedoms.

Paul took advantage of his freedom as a Roman citizen it's okay for us to do that, but that's all we think about working on this all kinds of ministry opportunities really talk about that next so much that the Scripture has to say about that really cultures here with SBG seminary and theology Thursday. This is Steve Noble will be right back to back and see Noble to Steve Noble, show theology Thursday with their friends at the seminary walking through as we do every week. All the professors and our friends at BG of justice set such a great resource because every week where these great conversations in the deep end of the pool theologically but also very practical. Great thought leadership is always a blog that goes along with it. Every week the same things true today with Billy culture viewpoint blog redeeming times of affliction for effective ministry. These are always there seem go back several months. At this point and see all these blog see the topic we talked about read him and then listen to the show because this is kind of like this is my job if I many call it a job as I'm kind of a go-between.

I'm a little bit of a mediator. I'm not your typical person sit in your pew I'm not the typical person sitting up in the pulpit. Some somewhere in between.

So I act as a mediator and I try to think on behalf of the audience because I can kinda run back and forth. I have a perspective from the pew, but I also her perspective from the pulpit and try to mediate in between. And so that's why listen to the show is adds a whole another level and whole other layer than just reading the block so it's a great one to punch the website you go to any time is seminary.BG\radio can you get into the college world and stuff you always get hear that EDU in there okay so just remember that seminary.BG\radio I put this up on Facebook right now and that'll take you to Billy's blog that were working through the day as well as all the other blogs we've done over the last several months with the great great resource, not just for you. By the way share with your pastor share with other believers shared in social media share the podcasts.

It really is a great resource to go deeper and to have more understanding and to gain wisdom in the things of the Lord.

So a bit again, Billy. We thank you for your time today.

It's always great to be here so I'm reading from the blog. Today's blog post is strange that seems to us ministry advance often happens best when we face opposition. This is why Paul had to learn this and you stick to God's glory thorn in his side, living in an increasingly hostile culture. We may try to hunker down to weather the storm, but the cancel culture wants to shame us in the silence capitalizing on comforts and pleasures our flesh naturally craves. When I read this Billy immediately thought. I hate masks right from the get-go.

My my freedom loving Americana site hated it.

I didn't want to submit to authority, whether I agree with that or not and that it was just bugs the tar out of me.

It's uncomfortable, it's obnoxious and like things driving me nuts. And so my flesh is craving comfort and I didn't even think about what it will not going into the angle of the area better Christian for where one or not wearing them, but I didn't really think in terms of ministry or trying to deal with a lost and dying culture. I mostly dealt with my my comfort and isn't that is that, normal problem or my just really a subpar Christian, though I knew I like to see what you thought about a lot of things I thought about well and had to think about. Also from a pastoral perspective then then draws me back and thinking from the ministry is pretty pretty normal that we think for yourself oriented yeah and so that's why you mention this when we finished the last segment. That's what we have to kinda turn our eyes towards the Lord and you know it's character that makes it a lot easier to trust his sovereignty and none of this stuff is a waste. It's not like he's capricious or bored or doesn't care what's happening to you is going to use it for the kingdom, as well as for our good and you mention this on the break Billy I sometimes will see some of that stuff now so that we won't get to see, until heaven, but you'll get to see it and it'll all make sense, and especially when were in heaven will be able to glorify the Lord all the more. I wanted to ask about you mention something about a privilege.

You had wants to work with Chinese pastors and kinda how that folds into this whole conversation about affliction yes or I taught in China number of times but one of those occasions was teaching and we they asked me to teach specifically on the doctrine of God and we walked through that and then we were walking through. Also they just lost with Chinese leader and then I am at the moment will even when I was there been through just the personal time of great affliction ministry wise and just how God kinda brought that together and and really helped me but also I think helped me help them think through this.

The truth of who God is, in light of and then as a circumstance of life actually come from what I know about God and thus my response to my circumstance begins to flush out my theology. I really believe it or or whether I don't and that how that theology begins to shape my understanding of my circumstances rather than my circumstances shaping my theology of God. Yet if you look at who's facing difficulty in ministry.

It would seem almost preposterous to try to compare what we can deal with as Christians in America to what these people were dealing with. As Christians and pastors in China when I was that the Decca factor into that whole experience for you. I mean yeah I mean I met with number of the men that I've met with been imprisoned for their faith. Several multiple times back one time went with the Chinese pastor to a to a place he took us to a locations cover troops to location. I'm walking in with the translator and the guy disappears is gone for an hour. We don't know where is he later comes up and said well I had to disappear. There was a cop that came in a police officer that was there with the rest of me before. Soon as he saw me with you. He would rest the dustbowl so we didn't know was going on birds, wandering around, wondering where the guy that took us there went so that because you know we talk with the underground church in China, but there is a visible church there as well said Dave have some of the same kind of problems that they would start to kinda crave comfort that we see that the big issue for us with the other three self church, visible legal church as certain parameters put around by the Communist Party. Those would become increasingly I mean things like, even she's your portraits gotta be there now mean there's a lot of new things to come. Recently, even with the three self church there minimum freedoms of been pretty much eclipsed now as well, but the Gospels flourished home church movement and really the underground churches were explorers throughout China and talk about affliction were actually tomorrow. I've got some people coming to the studio that were involved back in 1999 when they went after literally about 100 million people. The following gong movement in China and they just started capturing people thrown in jail torturing him the summer students, and this wasn't like this was some oppressive thing was, like tai chi in meditation and thinking good thoughts and intolerance and kindness and goodness like that's going to harm society.

Actually, the situation over there grew up in like nine years. There were 100 million followers in crime rates and stuff are going down.

It was good for the culture but the government didn't like it's it's subversive to them in a communist country and so they went after him in and that's that.

I think it's a lesson we need to take from China when it comes to affliction as you sit there and go okay but the gospel advances tremendously in China under affliction right so isn't that we should look at that I most like a convection oven. That's good things happen even faster. Yet when Mel came to power, the rule like it was said the words around 10 million Christians in China 50 years later there's over 100 so I mean that persecution that Mel sought the brain did not crunch the gospel actually made it shine all the brighter. Yeah. So this kind of that perspective we face all the difficulties we are now in doing ministry will do the same things we always did.

It's uncomfortable, it's difficult know I think maybe you know we we kind in some sense wanted to live normal came again. What is normal and when we face the difficulties of ministry in a broken culture will really have an opportunity for the light shine even brighter.

Yeah, we've that's been kind of a consistent theme on theology Thursday since we started our relationship with PG seminary keep coming back to we can, laments and moan and groan to a certain extent whine about the shape of the culture what's happening in the country. Politically, culturally, this that the other thing, as opposed to going okay you know what things are dark but the candle shines all the more brightly in the dark and seasonal. Okay, this is an awesome ministry opportunity frustrating.

Yes, maddening yes disappointing yes, but from a ministry perspective, you should be like wow this is awesome but I think we struggle to get there. Yeah why me Paul statement. Second Corinthians is one that's very convicting BME comes at the end of and says I delight in my distress and my afflictions and and I mean I can also say I'm there there when I first based affliction.

Your first response tends to be why now, why me about why the theology hopefully kicks him sooner than later and I begin going out. God is good and doing good. I know that you not send in acting on what you know so that even happens to somebody that's a pastor and seminary teacher is that we have attention trying to live it out absolutely mean we're still sinners saved by grace in my flesh is like your flesh and it's going to fleshly about.

That's why you know that's where daily walk with Ward so important getting a mean, it's amazing God invites us to the throne of grace and promises to meet us there. With the help why I need and I need it and afflictions remind me of that. Remind me I'm not sufficient. I don't have all the answers. I don't need to. But I swear to God, and yet I think that such an important point. You said that earlier and don't gloss over that everybody went when Billy just said I don't need to. We want to understand so that we can make some sense out of it but unpack that. Just looking at the commercial break in the mobile finish at the thought, but that statement I don't need to understand what God's all up to just unpack that a little bit Billy because Eddie gets a super important point why I mean I think partly we understand God's ways are higher than ours and God is working according to his characters purposes and he's working all these matters that again are far more complex than we even begin to fully comprehend these. He is working throughout all of that to accomplish his good so while I want to understand my understanding is so finite. He's infinite, you Will never be. Every my long now that that is because they have reminds me your dad.

I'm a dad, your grandfather. Now my grandfather reminds me that you tell your kids and they want understand why why we do this because it's for your good. You just have to trust me, we do with our kids. We need to do with the Lord will be right over the Steve Noble show theology Thursday with our friends at BG Yosemite.

By the way, for all of you pastors out there or for all of us that attended church have a pastor with that bus to talk about this in just a minute. The core conference coming up that a PG seminary just come up this coming Monday okay Monday, January 31.

The full day and then about half a day on Tuesday, February 1, especially for pastors in South Carolina, North Carolina, and Tennessee. The core conference were to talk about this, but this is one of those things that this in your pastors busy Billy cultures here with us today from BG seminary's been a pastor.

He understands that and and often times we don't minister to them very well. We assume their fine every things going good, but you just don't know.

And so when you throw an opportunity at them and perhaps if you have the ability use paper and is not a lot of money to go to the core conference but just pay forms the are they available.

Can I send you down there and will be blessed by this as they need to continually clipping into dealing with their own relationship with the Lord. Pastors need sanctification like the rest of us. So let's set route I will talk about this in a second over talking to Billy today about the blog post and redeeming times of affliction for effective ministry personal ministry corporate ministry. Our witness in the church. You never know watching you. So when we go through afflictions trials of any kind.

You can have all kinds of people around you. Maybe it's in your small group. Maybe it's your neighbor. Maybe it's at work. Maybe assist people in Facebook or social media there watching you so that is a ministry opportunity. So how we handle affliction really has a big impact on our witness to a lost and dying world.

So Billy again, thanks for being with us today.

Thanks for taking the time to prepare the blog as well. Absolutely.

So I wanted to ask you this question will talk about what's gonna happen next Monday and Tuesday at the core conference, but as when were struggling and I think at some level were all gonna struggle with our afflictions, they are difficult at times of trial and tribulation affliction. And then I think it's normal in our fallen state to struggle with that. If we really struggle with it. We get angry or super confused. We just crying out is gotta be over were not releasing any point in it. Is that essentially kind of up issue Billy with how much we know God. So we understand his character, maybe we don't know him all that well, so it's hard to trust. Going back to some I said on the break with like when your kids on the diving board and you're trying to get them to jump into you. You know you go to Salem even if you have to die in a safe up there in the family pool or whatever but you just your like it's frustrating because you like, listen, you can I'm your dad. You know I'm knocking to let you drown. I probably know me let your head go underwater so you can trust me when we struggle with affliction is that part of the problem for us. We just don't know our dad very well. Well, I think your illustration helps with the many ways because at that moment is not that your child know you is not. They don't believe you're there, dad, and you love them and you save his friend.

Elder sings her fear and so we can be a lot like that in the midst of affliction over seams or affliction. Our eyes are not lifted much higher. And because in the midst of that we were overwhelmed emotionally and then that's where we really, you know that's where we obviously want week of the spirit to cut kick yeah yeah and begin to feed on the word of God. Again, that's where were going to need to go to begin to quell those emotions back with truth and I've often told our pastor to the years often reminder folks listen. Nobody talks you more than you do. And when we allow the emotions of that event to be what were saying to ourselves, we become overwhelmed by that because it's all we can see it in the midst of that affliction.

We gotta learn to preach truth to ourselves what we know to be true about God and as we begin to preach that truth to ourselves. That's where the spirit takes the truth and then the emotions begin to be quieted, and I mean it is ultimately rest is a gift from God that quieting of our own spirit is something the spirit uses the word to do so, you know, I wouldn't say because somebody's overwhelmed by their trials are necessarily disbelieving guy a great point. Their mother's. The focus shifted. They just looking at just the fear of the trial rather than the focus back on the ground at such a great grace .2 and then I just wrote that town if you notice that nobody talks to you more than you do and I thought I create my own echo chamber and then that's why yet that that's why you gotta come crawling back to the foot of the cross and the gospel and to God's word because while emotions are can be productive. God's emotional they shouldn't be.

The thermostat patient take control of everything and that sometimes you have to overwhelmed the only cut through my own echo chamber is like you said only talk to me more than I do and that's definitely true that yes okay I got it I get to get myself out of this trap. I gotta get out of this echo chamber again to get back to the source of all truth which is God. I think it's a great point that because I'm such a negative person is a little well is it my problem. I just don't trust the Lord.

No, I think you just get controlled by your fear. You change your perspective or change of focus and that's what God's word does spirit does through the wording helps shift our focus away from the temporal circumstances are ever-changing and frustrating to back to the God who is in control. Working this together for good. Yeah, and now I can minister out of the context of hope rather than fear and anxiety yeah such a great point and and again everybody a moment to share this again on Facebook live scene go to the Steve Noble show page on Facebook and grab the link or you can just go directly to the radio page at BJ's seminary. It's just seminary.B\radio I wanted asked him to circle back around. I mentioned something about pastors in the core conference coming up Monday and Tuesday down to PGA seminary in Greenville South Carolina for you as a pastor want to speak to other pastors it to us as as laypeople or parishioners tell us about pastors need to to come to be exposed to things like this to come be ministered to and to learn from a pastor's perspective, Billy.

How important is it that pastors go to things like the core conference or other things like what I mean when you think about the pastoral shortage in the discouragement on pastoral ministry. One of things I think we may not of done well pastorally is just those ministry partnerships with other pastors. Those friendships that really be go deeper than just a surface level hi you know you best from the inside down or were we actually have friends and ministry that when we face those times we have other people that will actually help speak truth that no work know what were going through the route they literally a walking shoe so conferences like this help us to connect with others and ministry helps to be in a place were we are not the ones giving out but actually receiving and the one of the great blessings were seeking to accomplish in choruses spinning a little bit more time in a conference in typical were we are praying together and asking God to do unique things her own life and ministry in our culture. Yet such a powerful perspective and and I can just share I I got into kind of cortical Christian activism going all of it back to 2004 and started to do a lot of events and where we need the churches help because we gotta get to church members that we can build an email list yada yada yada so I was running around a lot, Billy, and I was meeting with a lot of pastors in dealing with a lot of churches. I was always surprised how few of them knew each other not get to know all these pastors at one point I probably knew 90 or hundred pastors here in the area by me and I say oh I was talking so it's over there.

Do you know him know and after while Mike G do you really know many pastors around town and most of them don't you guys are. Most of the time.

You're busy. You're dealing with your own people and you don't really hang out with people that know what it's like to walk a mile in their shoes that that's I'm so glad you mentioned that. I think a lot of us tend to forget that were not really very in tune with your life in the past and I were just help where help to get together's men seeking to serve our God in and to know one another in even in that context, we we can truly help carry one another's burdens and be equipped and I we got a phenomenal lineup of guys speaking the plenary sessions that are going today are pastors and leaders in ministry context or they're going to be a blessing to us to be there to be together of the word and then spinning shoulder shoulder time in prayer is always sweet. Yeah, that's gotta be awesome and so what you can be sure what you be talking about their Billy well blissful, what were dealing with right here this this redeeming affliction that dealing with it on a personal level and can you suggest some illustrations for my own life in God's walking me through. If you will. My own kind of thorn in the flesh kind of walking through and learning from the Lord and then dealing with in a ministry context. How to weed out weak flesh on life and ministry. Just if you do me a favor I'll put on the spot a little bit and that bio everybody dimming. This would be a good one to share at your pastors, or even just the question about asked Billy but speak directly to pastors on talk to me. Billy talk to pastors and just encourage them why they should come and why this is a good thing for them individually and personally as a pastor as a person as a follower of Christ to speak to pastors for a minute about the core conference at the right will. Where would we want to say to pastors what I want to sit about a we know what to walking through the middle of the difficulties ministry. We know both the joys the highs and lows.

We know the difficulty were facing in addressing these issues and culture our burdens to help you answer some of those questions for your congregation and to come alongside and encourage you pray with you, encourage, we want to encourage by the goodness of our God and his Billy what he's doing in the midst open up and want to start seeing the rather than the obstacles of what were facing the opportunities God is giving just such a wonderful word so again I'm up at the links up here, but you can go to seminary.B GU.ED you\core. In this case could go take a right to the core conference webpage you can still register, you can still be a part of it still share this with your pastor, especially if you're maybe down the Charlotte market. If you're in Greenville. If you're in the area south your North Carolina route a lot of different stations a little easier for them to get there and even if they can't go on Tuesday they can go on Monday that you do not know you don't know what you don't know so that's where most of us just share it. Just send a note to your pastor tag on Facebook.

Send them the podcast whatever send them a link when you see him this week and even mention it on Sunday when you see your pastor and just you, even if they can't go you reaching out to them. Billy been a pastor for years if if somebody in your congregation comes up to you and says hey, there's this thing I heard about. I think it would be a blessing to you maybe go.

Maybe you can't make you feel as a pastor what interest it helps you know that your phone that people they care, they understand your caring burdens as well. Not just there to carry their general partner there to help share their shepherd them through it. It's an investment in that it speaks volumes say a pastor. We love you we care about you go you get some fresh such a great point. Go to seminary.B\core I'll put it up on the Facebook life he right clicking on my regular Facebook page when were done seminary.B\core this coming Monday and half a day on Tuesday. Get all the information at the website Billy think so much for your time today for leading us in this conversation something that we all deal with. So, some will need help with. Thank you so much my brother you will see look forward to seeing absolutely. I'll be there in just a couple days.

This is Steve Noble and the Steve Noble shelf, God willing, I'll talk to you again real soon and like my dad always used to say ever forward another program powered by the Truth Network

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