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2021 vs 2022

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January 6, 2022 8:53 pm

2021 vs 2022

The Steve Noble Show / Steve Noble

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January 6, 2022 8:53 pm

Pastor Problems with BJU

Steve brings Exc. VP Alan Benson on the show today to discuss the problems of being a pastor for Theology Thursday! 


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Steve is an ordinary man who believes in an extraordinary God it on his shoulders, grace, and lots of three no sacred call Steve Bell 86 34 true 866-34-TRUTH or checking out online, Steve Noble now here's your host Steve Noble okay okay okay trying to get back into the ring of things in the spirit of the new year. I have been fighting it have been excited about 2022. For whatever reason, I think that a nice long break and it's been hard to get back on and just finished teaching again this week. I was six classes and adjusted 3 classes today.

So just kind of struggling to get back into the swing of things as we come to the new year and so setting that aside to setting aside any personal challenge might be having with getting into the new year. It's not exactly exciting a lot of different ways. It's been interesting to gauge from people I feel about 2022. I think there's a lot of trepidation. People just don't know what I think for a lot of people. If you're politically involved looking forward to November but we don't know what's going to happen you got omicron rip its way through everything. I know so many people that are faxed, that have omicron and that's all over the place, not just here in America and around the world and say of shutdowns you look at Chicago. The teachers refused to go back to school so that's a big mess. There inflation. If you notice that I was just talking to my students in class this week my government class.

We are talking about fiat money that power the US dollar dollar goes far today, as did three years ago. And these are 16, 17-year-olds, and I like no I think they get it because inflation is on the rise at the big deal, then let's turn on our Christian worldview for a talk about moral truths, God-given identity, I call Truman was on the show earlier last year. I think it was in August incredible book. How do we get to the point, basically in our culture, and the worldwide culture where a guy says hey you know what, I'm a woman trapped in a man's body and a good chunk of the population just goes now okay what whatever how do we get there.

So you got that going on God-given identities. Those are continuing to dissolve America's polarized pretty much every which way you can think socially, racially, politically, not inside the body of Christ. We have a lot of issues there. We separated ourselves quite well over COBIT and masking vaccines. And on top of that into our topic today on theology Thursday with their friends at BJ's seminary we got a major brewing pastor shortage of burn research that George was on just couple months ago. 40% of pastors have considered leaving the ministry of got a whole lot of pastors that are aging out this like a really bad farm system so the NFL would collapse under the system. The major-league baseball would collapse under the system you get all these great players but are to be out here soon is combined so will master Pat a massive pastor shortage and that's a problem. So overall if you don't have a sound worldview. If you're struggling which is normal for most of us men. It seems like Satan roaring lying is gaining territory.

Okay, it seems like it's going his way. We know that in the end, it doesn't.

But in the meantime, most of us struggle at that circumstances seem similar to those see if this sounds familiar with Paul say this is in second Timothy 3125 men shall be lovers of their own selves, covetous posters, proud, blasphemers, unholy, without natural affection. You know what that means truths breakers, false accusers, incontinent fears despises of those that are good lovers of pleasure more than lovers of God. That just sounds like an average hour on Facebook, Twitter and YouTube, and Instagram so there's a lot of problems out there. Welcome back to the Joe Dr. Alan Benson is the executive vice president at the Bob Jones University as well as heading up many of the ministry efforts at the Bob Jones seminaries great to see a buddy happy new year. Welcome back, happy New Year's Eve.

It is great to be back.

What a description you get out Roseville lactic but not altogether. I can see where you you I don't have rose-colored glasses yes no I do not mean it's a really difficult circumstance and in I appreciate the first time you and I did radio earlier last year and in the late spring we were talking about something that I really wasn't aware about. I was not aware of this major pastor problem that we have which of course is a big initiative. The 500 x 5 x 5 vision of Bob Jones seminary and I just wasn't aware of it in our mutual friend Stu Epperson said they will you interview this guy from BJ you and Michael sure fine, which led to our our relationship which I think God for but I don't know that many of us understand the depths of this problem. It is as you mention, I love the illustration of the farm system is not. I think that's where the problem lies. So what what are we facing today are facing. As you mentioned, 40% of current pastor saying when I see my way clear and I can feel responsible and remove myself from my church. I'm leaving you got the scenario where right now there are more pastors over 70 and there are under 40, she's which means that's the next wave just just people that without problems need to retire you is going to create a greater need, but then I I add to that that third part, the farm system where where are the young men who first Timothy three desire the office of a bishop took to fill the ranks are. Are they jumping into seminary and ministry training early preparing for ministry. Are they looking that way and that that's that's actually the question right now that that we feel we need to begin to focus on an answer and that is who's coming next Yahoo we believe God can do it can mean look at the end of the second world war to face the same thing. We had a war.

People come home from the war and every seminary it fills right so so God can and maybe out of a crisis like this you can identify problem.

We didn't realize we had and raise up an army, but we just need to make sure that proactively were praying the Lord of the harvest to send forth laborers into his harvest.

Yes, organ unpacked this problem and the solution and things that can be done and kind of unpack what Jesus was talking about as well.

In Matthew nine in talking about praying for labors to send out to the harvest as I think were all well aware the fact that the harvest is ripe and the fields are ripe on to harvest and in I mentioned George Barna couple times and it had him on last year Alan several times in one of the visits was talking about the reality that only about 6% of Americans have a convictional operational biblical worldview, so you have a massively lost culture. That's why the country looks the way it does. And really the only answer that these the same answer that's always been, which is the gospel and shifting a culture by seeing hearts and minds shifted in the oil in the Gospels. The only answer that sorted out a lot to unpack today on theology Thursday, but were coming up on the first break Alan but generally it's a brand-new semester things are just kicking off the beginning of the school year. Howard, how are things down at the BJ you in the seminary students actually come in on Monday while start the semester so we are gearing up, get ready this week and were excited for the semester. Part of that is because it Lord allowed us to finish really well. The end of the semester. Everybody knows Christmas and the brake introduced us to widespread on the cross. You what's that look like when everybody comes back are student bodies coming from all 50 states and 40 countries. She's working to have quite the soup and were preparing for that and and what that mix brings but were really excited student body is healthy. Where have I think as of this morning, 50 to 60 brand-new first-time students on our campus outside semester which is really cool and a lot going on in the seminary at the core conference coming up right at the end of this month beginning of February what's going to talk about. That's a great opportunity. If your lay leader if your pastor do you tell your pastor coming down to Greenville South Carolina core conference talk about as well will be right back and look back at Steve Noble the Steve Noble show theology Thursday with our friends at BJ's seminary talking about pastor problem.

We've got a problem with pastors. And I'm not speaking specifically about what pastors are teaching were just talking numbers right now that there's more pastors over 70.

Then there are under 40, 40% of them that are operating today, 40% pastors in America that operating today if they had a way out. Tomorrow they take it they'd be gone so as I mentioned what Alan Benson is Executive Vice President also involved with the BJ's seminary. That is kind like a farm system and the major league baseball and you have a bunch of great players, but most of them are about to retire and you look back at the AA's and AAA's and you're like there's not enough guys there, and soon enough we can even feel the team that's of reality that were facing and something that's a big part of what's going on at BJ's seminary in NY will talk about the 5 x 5 x 5 which is a direct engagement of the problem in the core conference coming up whiny.

How did we get to the situation now talk about that. The pathology thanks again for spending time with us today.

But how do we get to the point where we have a a lot pastors that want to leave we not have many young men that want to come in to be pastors at all. I think I think there's been a brewing storm. A number of factors, one.

I think we've seen an interesting development as our our culture before any of COBIT and all of that work.

Where were we. And I think we saw an aging pastorate because people lived a little longer. They felt a little better. They managed a little different. There were a lot of crises so I think we set the stage with a lot of guys who are pastoring longer and older that then they have before. I think now is this crisis hits and one of the things that is happened is every church virtually went virtual and a bunch of people haven't come back during that time, I think you've had people say we never really thought about shopping for a church were already out. Maybe this is a good time. What should you not when we watched online or whatever and I think what you seen is shrinking. Churches and and you put all of that together, and were facing a scenario where you got guys retiring or guys just dropping out and the churches there leaving any longer to place they can support a full-time pastor. So where did they go to get one.

I talked with her man yesterday whose entire job for ministry organization is helping interim pastors like he is working with people and getting interims to go into churches to help to supply you while they're looking for a pastor. He has 15 couples that he has that are doing that and he said they can't come anywhere close to keeping up so so there's all these places that that are there.

Can't get an interim to commit and cover while the process so I think there's a number of factors, and then you add to that the level of of discouragement and complexity in our culture. I think you've got a lot of guys that are like little logo. I'm not prepared for this. I didn't sign up for this.

I'm not sure how to answer this, you turn that around and you had the division in the church and there's one tip to the spear in a church with one pastoring, which you know church 100 hundred 50 is pastor of the average church. Most people don't know this Alan, the average church in America still about 95 people go to church at 500 you think I am the decent size church is not a mega-church.

Yes, it is the average size church and is about 350,000 churches nationwide.

The average size is still less than hundred 95, barely hanging on, so one pastor division in the church on whatever vaccines mass whatever.

He's the one guy. And so it all points at him from both sides and there's a lot of them say in my mouth I can think of better things to do.

What about young people like what you see it BJ you seminary about John seminary in terms of the influx of pastors because I think that's the other end of the scale is that we have fewer and fewer men when we say men that's because were just being biblical here. Okay, so we call men in the pastorate so the senior pastor so fewer and fewer young people considering it what you think's going on there. I just think some of it is is is somewhat generational meaning here we are two years into a crisis.

Crisis typically is what generates our ministry thinking. Unfortunately I mentioned coming in the second world war to you a minute ago. There's a real need we saw people say will okay we got to go help. We saw an uptick in in at least spiritual thinking coming out of 9/11 so so up until then, we haven't had a whole lot in there like churches need me you look at the statutes generally on on Jen Z Gen X before a millennial's we've seen decreasing interest, at least in church does she take the percentages and you just have less people than interested in doing ministry right out of. That group so that's been the trends leading into this crisis. Yeah, and that's that. And that's the challenge that we have the face and again we do the same thing with the federal budget. We don't really think much about what can happen to sector the next generation. I'll be 56 next month. I know the odds are I've got be based on family lineage, maybe 30, 35 years left in the number I go to be the Florida not here and so none of the stuff a lot of these things are can fall on my hat. I'll be with the Lord will be out that we have to start thinking about what's happening behind us in so many people out on that say that they love the country they're worried about the country. What you better be aware of the fact that we have a spiritual drought of leadership on our hands and and if you want to see the country going the right direction.

You gotta have strong spiritual leadership so that kinda takes us into and by the way were basics of our conversation day off at the brand-new blog post.

The seminary viewpoints blog which I put up at just earlier so you can always check that out of all the things that we do here on on the show with our friends it BJ you at the seminary are all on the special page that they set up for seminary.BJ\radio okay all the different posts and podcasts, and blogs that we talk about with the guests each week that we have from Bob John seminary are all right there.

And again today were kinda basing it on one that Allen wrote called God is on the move in 2022.

Investing in pastors to advance the gospel.

So how do we look at this biblically down because this is a huge hill to climb. It's a huge challenge. How do we look in the Scriptures, particularly in the New Testament and say okay what's God calling us to do you like to think it's obvious but I want to make sure we understand the biblical underpinning. Yeah so I am convinced that there is something going on in raising up next-generation preachers in the pastoral epistles right there.

There's something different there than there is Satan Ephesians or Galatians or whatever. Paul writing to Timothy, Paul, writing to Titus. So when you look there. You get all the screws that's there but but throughout it you get these word says, but you my son. My son in the faith. If you got this connection and and you I want to be careful with the strength with which I say this you know so because I don't want to make absolutes that things that are, but I guess I'll say it this way, we can only disciple into what we are. It's really hard say hey you know what I'm knocking to be the stronger disciple you to be that so I really think there's something going on there that there is a uniqueness to Paul's understanding of ministry and then what that meant, and him discipling Timothy to be a minister and I am convinced that part of what needs to happen is that those who are pastoring need a fresh view of who am I actually bringing behind me is is there somebody I'm actually talking like you look at what Paul does with Timothy.

He says you know, and he talks about his life. You know my struggles and where I suffered and there is a personal relationship that somehow Timothy knew exactly what he was facing our pastors doing that with anybody right younger guy says hey look, this would be really, really, how to talk to you about what's going on about what ministry is in the struggles and the fact that it's worth and so I see three things going on kinda there, particularly in in first Timothy where I think this kind of relationship needs to happen as young as he pastors. But that's another's lives. Just think of replicants to break working on pack that with Dr. Alan Benson only come back somebody pastors are even talking to their congregations and saying hey guys I need some Timothy's.

The following will talk about that when we come back to back and Steve Noble to see Noble show theology Thursday with her friends it BJ you seminary Bob John seminary and by the way we always have. There's all kinds of resources is great resources for people like me people like most of you as laypeople just regular Christians trying to live out the life as best as we can and try to make a difference in the people's lives that are around us, but there's all kinds of great resources that were sharing every week on theology Thursday, so the center set up a special page for us where you can land on all these different resources. The blog post that we discuss each week with our awesome guess all that stuff there, plus links to other things like core conference which will talk about here in a second. The website same as always seminary.BJ\radio okay seminary.BJ\radio.

The easiest way just be on Facebook go to that the Steve Noble show Facebook page and you'll see the links there. Also, the link for the days blog post which were working through a certain degree with our good friend Dr. Alan Benson from the seminary and then also things like core conference coming up which directly to what were talking about today Alan were talking about this. We have a bunch pastors want to leave. We have a bad farm system. We have a bunch of players on the field right now but we don't have many coming up behind being trained. This is that that really at the center of what BJ you seminary is working on with the 500 x 5 x 5 program which will touch on, but it's also about the about the core conference. This is when you think of the word court specially think of CR and EE away proclaiming truth to a broken culture. This really is an incredible opportunity that we live in, and as screwed up as this country is right now and is dark it is this right now man that makes our job and our opportunity all the more exciting still. So what about the core conference coming up at the beginning of February. The core conference you mentioned the CRE is about connecting about refreshing and about getting equipped. It is a time when we focus on lifting up arms on helping on answering questions on building relationships and this year we've we've picked this theme up awake proclaiming God's truth to up to a broken culture because of what were facing and and then the head scratching moment of what do I do with all of this so we are really focusing on some of the issues of the day and and helping people know how to take God's truth into clear to this kind of world chess and and so the idea of of awake, obviously were talking about being woken culture.

While I do think there's that there's a being awake to righteousness, and the truth of God and and were focusing on helping people understand what God says and how to take it rightly speak that truth into this culture at an end that that really is. So how do we deal with with CRT.

How do we really deal with with critical theory in general is the truth. God speak to that, how do I interact with people in in regard to the hopelessness that's going on in our culture is our hope to be offered how to make gospel connections in a world that has a different Norse on their moral compass than I have on mine.

How can I relate to that and and and yet find the pathways to speaking God's truth and into a culture like that and so it's really going to be a time of I think incredible equipment.

I think I think those that come will will get the opportunity to hear from experts. How do we actually do this. Where do I find answers were all will know were supposed to give her minute and answer for the whole right lies, nice work were trying to get help get that answer, it'll be at time I really I really believe for those who are struggling right now to be encouraged this conference. In particular, every session is going to finish with a prayer meeting because we need to hear from God you were using the little expression we don't want this to be a moment. Who needs another conflict, no kidding. We want this to be the beginning of the movement of God, not our movement God working in us pastors were to go back home so you know what church let's get our knees before God.

Let's ask God to do something special. Let's ask God to us to help us see our own souls revived and and our community reach for Christ. And so, starting in the sense of prayer movement that says God we need you God. The church is your church and in the church doesn't need me.

It needs you and got after me to need other pastors and I I want to be a part of, but I can't get of you do you call these men ministry and you help us equip them and so really beginning of a movement of the church being stirred to being awake to what God is going to do in this moment. Yes, a primarily. Obviously, the focus on pastors but lay leaders in early anybody that's got a trying to have a serious mission mindset is a Christian is that the opportunity to come and be a part of this. It's all day Monday, January 31 and I think it's half a day on the next day, Fairbury first. Is that right Alan. Yeah, that's correct yeah and so you've got that the special early bird registration is not an expensive thing to go to like $75 early Bird and that special price for spouses and it's down in Greenville and the campus is beautiful so make sure you check that I got the links up on Facebook live and I'll continue to share that plus shall be hearing you hear the ad on the radio show during the week, each day during the week and I just really encourage share this with your pastor, specially the leadership of your church, but if urine and leadership at all lay leadership. This is something you should seriously consider doing because this is a it's a great opportunity. We see this with COBIT and how fear has driven so much of the American response to this in an American's willingness to come to go along with the narrative, because fear is everywhere. Darkness is everywhere and it's just a really exciting time for us to forget about heart heart for the lost friend of the same kind of heart that the Lord has that's not going to just happen. This has to be really strategic and really intentional. I appreciate you saying about the focus on prayer because we need God to be the first and main mover analysis we can conference ourselves to death, but of God's not moving, you're wasting your time. You just pat yourself on the back so I appreciate Sharon. I will talk a little about it before he finished the show again but we are talking about. You mentioned Paul ministering to Timothy to mention three different areas that you really want to invest in the next generation of preachers and Rick make sure that this is on front and center on the radar screen proclamation personal holiness in prayer. So let's start with proclamation yeah you know God work is done through God's truth. You think about what what Paul says to Timothy about the word it's it's a Timothy that he says this is a God breathed word that that it is sufficient for the man of God for all that God is called them to do to know what is right to know what is wrong to know how to turn from what is wrong and how to embrace what is right. He is commanded to preach the word. Be instant in season and out of season. You see Paul talking to the Ephesian elders went when he knows he's leaving them and he encourages Timothy and them with regard to the ministry of the word that it's essential for faith in its essential for further growth and obedience and so we really are are going to focus on even at our conference.

The proclamation of the word one to build us up but but then how do I proclaim the word. I think in seeing our pastor shortage addressed on the human plane. I think our young people need to understand that were not resource less like were we got it. We've got a tool and we've got the answers and I think somehow we need to be able to be communicating to the younger generation. We have God's truth and God has asked us to declared into the culture will you do that please sign up for that. Yeah, let me just stop you right there Alan because that was one of my comments and questions.

I think one of the challenge and being in the modern age.

In the digital age and everything is so well packaged. We were all digital snobs. At this point and so I think we have a problem as Christians in general, but perhaps in the pastorate as well and believing that if you just preach the accurate word of God that you that it doesn't require digital marketing. It doesn't require the right lighting and the right sound. Those things can be important, and they can help, but the real powers and just the simple proclamation of the simple truth of God's word.

I think a lot of us are like, you know that that's kind of old-fashioned that you think we've lost.

Maybe our belief or our trust that just proclaiming the word of God's going to have an impact.

II couldn't agree with you more Steve are seminaries tagline is is proclaim the word serve the church advance the gospel and that very first statement is actually the source of everything that we are going to do you get it. Why have a seminary right what is the church. It's a pillar and ground of the truth and and I believe yes we should do everything we can within a given culture to accurately stewards outward. Yes, all the tools you have good but when you turn to the tools and don't declare the word you've made yourself a light show that has no substance.

While yet and I think again is go ahead. Faith comes by hearing and hearing by the word of God, and that's where we have to go.

Okay, I'm in. I have faith that the same thing that's been true for the last few thousand years is still true today in the digital age that the word of God, in and of itself, without the lighting without the cool music without whatever still has power as a woman to share Christian worldview. But I'm not can you Scripture well okay hate nice for Ari but got no gas in the tank and I think we have to remember that that and trust that it's just the word of God because when I got saved. Alan it was months of deep conviction of the Holy Spirit. I was listening to Bill Hibel's was the pastor of Willow Creek, some listening to seeker sensitive preaching, but there was enough of the word of God there that it was just the word of God that cut me to the quick. I didn't have a single conversation with anybody face-to-face in that nine month run up to me given my life to Christ to be born again. That talk to me about my sin. It was all the Holy Spirit in the power. The word of God thought was and we have to remember that hate actually that is where the do them is that is with the dynamite that is with the powers absolutely see one of my burdens is weak, we tend to see the big outlets right so were seeing Christian radio overhearing preachers on all of that sort of thing.

What I don't believe we realize is that the master Geordie of the percentage of where the word is actually heard taught and invested in people, is in the small church you spell my hundred people got somebody labors and stands before them, they might not is not the speaker you will be back roughly right back back at Steve noble to see Bill Bushell theology Thursday with our friends at BJ's seminary, Downing tearful Greenville South Carolina. By the way, a core conference coming up. That's on Monday, January 31 and half the day on Tuesday, February 1 and that's whether your pastor if you're on staff at a church or a lay leader are you just serious and in need to, you know that you need to get more equipped to engage this darkening culture and a culture that's so hopeless. Hope it is shown that fear running rampant this this country that we say we love desperately needs Christians to be Christians.

They definitely need us to listen to the teaching and the leadership of Paul to become Timothy's and that's why were talking today with our good friend Dr. Alan Benson in his the executive vice president at the University as well as on staff at the seminary at Bob Jones in such an important topic as we talk about what's going on with pastors in a way to reach them and train them and encourage them. I which is going on again at the core conference but you mentioned proclamation. The word which we have to get back to believing that that actually is the power so we gotta get the board of got out there, but also in terms of tent Paul and Timothy, personal holiness, which can be a real challenge in this world that we live in this digital age. It's crazy as well as prayer so let's talk about what Paul called a holy manner of life.

Yeah. So when you look at first of the three right we see all these qualifications for for ministry at and it's not like go somewhere, sit on a pedestal in order to be used actually live a life of being usable. Are any of us perfect in all of those qualifications.

It is actually to strive to live a life of being qualified to be used by God that that's what he's laying out there. It's living with a heart of of ready repentance unlimited in a dirty world and I get dirty. Gotta want to be right with you and I have this heart that runs to God and in repentance, you see that in Paul and Paul in Romans 7070 wretched man that I am right.

He he looked at his own like to call himself the chief of sinners.

You see Paul also saying in the grace of God was abundant for an and I realize I'm forgiven, we need to model a life of ready repentance to the church.

I think the days of of this picture of ministry being I'm in a model perfection for you.

You know I'm not but only give you models you can strive for it and then I live fake in front of you and you look fake in front of me and and we all pretend while we're together. I think our culture is so broken.

All that is gone now and then when you pull your hair out when Ravi Zacharias explodes correct yeah exactly you know it we walk into church. When we walk into church and we we say hey how are you I'm great good. So my nice to see you always. God and and it is time it is time for us to to say hey you know what God did not call me to run a solo race every New Testament letter is filled with one another's encourage one another love one another, sort or another challenge one another. We need this dynamic relationship of fortifying each other in our walk with God and and and communicating to one another. You know what I am not perfect and I long to be right with God, and I need help can we pray together.

You keep me accountable. Can we talk together when you get discouraged. Can you come to me. I want to go to you and part of what core conference is going to do is help with the connection I want to throw something out, Steve. I think this is an opportunity for a deacon or two to say hey you know what pastor we never done this before, we want to take you core conference conference will be great but we want to go so we can be together. The drive there. The drive home the time we stay together were hearing the same truth were praying for our church. If there are church leaders like that out there, a layman adjusted ball. I would hate this is a time you may not even know your pastor discourage trike grant. I'm saying you know what this is conference going on. I would take it. Let let's go let's go do that together we would we would love to see those people come that way and and it be about effectiveness for ministry, which isn't perfection, it's about striving hard after Jesus dealing with sin when it comes to getting help with discouragement that is described to personal holiness. I think Paul's communicating Timothy got such an important point, and that's a great encouragement reminder. All of us. Again the links up a Facebook live so you can check that out on the Steve noble show page seminary.BG\radio. Just follow the link at the easier because I will take you there early bird discount right now for the core conference coming up January 31 and February 1 $75 to attend $25 for spouse. It's a great early bird discount than the general public hundred 25 bucks for you 50 for your spouse and the net for BJ. Can you community. Of course it's free for the factly staff and the students. But this is the thing just gifted to your pastor. Give it gifted to staff members and their spouses because I can guarantee you they need it. I think a lot of us. Alan mistakenly think our pastors have it all together and that everything's fine, because their spiritual giants, but that's not true. Most pastors are struggling your pastor is that you think that's a legitimate observation on my part, I think we as pastors become really really good at hiding our description I did I just do like okay I can't get up in the pulpit and preach 45 minutes let everybody see him open right so what so what do we do. I think we cover really well. I think too often we say with a high I communicate to the church. Boy I'm struggling right now. They may say I'm struggling to sunny to be with a guy that shrugged her other son of the church across town where people are struggling because I'm struggling I need to help and that just isn't the New Testament model of the book of Christianity like but but somehow we fall prey to that relationally now. I think that's why I prefer visually my mind about them.

A visual processor and movies factor in life and how I think and right now I'm just envisioning scenes from saving Pvt. Ryan. When everybody's in the war, and an injured geyser carrying other injured guys there all limping their way through it and some of them are leaders, but even you see that with Tom Hanks character far from perfect and so that's the deal you should the pastors be ahead of us.

Yet of them are knowledge, yes they called yes but they struggled to and that's why I think this is a great opportunity to just encourage them do something form and get them to the core conference. I don't miss this Parkinson's is a big part of the core conference as well, but the role of prayer pulpit devoted himself to prayer and obviously he left Timothy with that charge as well. What I love about prayer. The New Testament particular the setting of the church. If there's anything that eliminates any sense of professionalism church prayer does it right because it reminds us that this is this is a God thing like the church is God's idea that Jesus is the head of the church is one that walks in the midst of the candlesticks. He's the one that said I will build my church and and that we are we are called in dependence upon him all that the church is supposed to do the wonderful thing about prayer is.

It is our primary source of encouragement. I get to go without a priest through Christ and talk to the God of the universe and and I think this is a time whenever prayer needs to become more real to us. We all have our prayer ease. If this is prayer language.

It somehow comes out that actually detaches me from actually talking to God. And when really hard times come. Somehow the conversation gets more real and I think this is a time for the church in general. To get more real in its conversation with God. I don't understand God. I don't want to do. God, I know all this truth about you and I do believe, but I need your help and and and I think it's time for us to actually connect with God, commune with God and call out to God for the work of God to be done in our lives personally and in his church and and and Paul reinforces with Timothy prayer when you you read through okay Timothy or lead this thing. Now I'm on leave intact.

Timothy three. I'm leaving the tent. I'm gonna be gone. You need you need do this work.

What should you do. He instruction call the church to prayer and adheres the way the church should be praying evangelism. You better pray about evangelism what's going on in the community leaders. You better pray about your leaders everything calls us back to praying for God to do what only God can do in the church needs to recognize that today what we do with COBIT, we better pray you elections better pray what we do with a culture that's got a different worldview. Pray and and and I'm not sure that right now. That's where everybody's mindset is an and we need to get there yet. I think we can oftentimes just to be in survival mode.

I know a lot of us that are conservative Christians evangelicals can easily fall into the trap of political idolatry. And we look to Washington DC in the clinical system to be the answer. We know ultimately that that isn't the answer over so conditioned to approach it that way and with prayer again use of the go hate this and all these problems are too big for us. What if this is always a disrupting reminder for myself.

Alan and my own prayer life. What if got God's only going to take you seriously ill take you seriously based on the amount of weight you put in your prayer life. On any given subject is a man I'm really concerned about what's going on in America regarding this that the other thing. Oh really think that God steers his constraint basins in OKC. Do you want to know in the last three and 65 days. How much time you've actually been in the prayer on that particular subject. No, I don't think I want the is that it's 22 minutes so you're whining about it, but you've in the last three and 65 Dave you put 22 minutes and praying over the loss or whatever so who are you, are you trying to kit.

I mean, that's a brutal way of looking at think it's accurate. Yeah, and Steve, I think. I think we really need to bring this right down home husbands. Are you praying for your wife. We feel the weight around us.

We feel the discouragement we see what's happening.

A culture we all watch the news together give her walk away from that and say will what that left my wife feeling like I do pray for my spouse. You know what I'm feeling this. My kids are younger than me what they feeling are we praying for our kids that way. I think that is the New Testament God, would you make yourself a real in the midst of the circumstances to my kids. They need to know you are God. Would you help them to see what our world help them to know, and I think that such a great point that in and nine you listen most of us, you and I are about the same age we see struggles with their kids we write raise in the right way. They're not always taking on our worldview and again God looked me square in the face and said Steve I understand you're upset about it.

Understand your concern. If you're all that concern and all that upset wire to praying more about. That's a very good question and maybe if we understood that that would unlock a lot of these answers we would do it more. Such a great conversation is always Alan God bless you, thank you for your time and all your efforts and again talk about the core conference will be touching on that over the next few weeks. God bless your friend thanks for being here.

Thanks so much you're welcome, God willing, I'll be with you guys again, not tomorrow, but on Monday the mean time like my dad always used to say ever for another program powered by the Truth Network

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