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Government vs. Christians

The Steve Noble Show / Steve Noble
The Truth Network Radio
April 15, 2021 5:31 pm

Government vs. Christians

The Steve Noble Show / Steve Noble

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April 15, 2021 5:31 pm

Government vs. Christians

Today Steve talks with Barronelle Stutzman and Matt Sharp of Alliance Defending Freedom.  They discuss the terrible legal battle of Mrs. Stutzman against the Washington State Government and how the Government is attacking the rights of Christians. 


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The following program is recorded content created by the Truth Network. Everyone just ties with his noble show where biblical Christianity meets the everyday issues of life in your home, at work, and even in politics. Steve is an ordinary man who believes in an extraordinary God it on his show. There's plenty of grace and lots of true no sacred cows calls 866-34-TRUTH 866-34-TRUTH or checking out online, Steve Noble now here's your host Steve Noble word and what were moving in a direction where I sit up you are talking about persecution and I think were sensitive to that of only think about persecution as Christians you can going to the biblical record you can look at that you can look at what happened to the original disciples to Jesus himself.

You can look at what's going on around the world were not there. Praise the Lord with some of the things that we see in other parts the world, but in the American context persecution of Christians in the church is getting more extreme all the time and I talked about the story just the other day up in Canada and you can be my two guests are just second match of zero Senior Counsel ABF manual know about this up in Canada there's a church up there where they decide they complied for a while with the COBIT stuff in the decided not to do and then the, the pastor ended up in jail for 35 days and then we got out just recently like a week ago 10 days ago they actually put up fencing and closed off the entire church and secure the location so that they can going there, even if they wanted to. So they met somewhere else, and there is a large crowd that showed up. And so you have these scenes in Christian life. Now that perhaps you never thought would happen. And so today you'll hear another one of those stories I've been talking about the subject for a while as we talk about Christian bakers Christian photographers Christian, a wedding location. Owners that because of their Christian convictions when it comes to a wedding in participating in that the United States Supreme Court would agree that your artistic ability as part of your speech and if I do not want to lend my artistic ability or my free speech to something that violates my Christian conscience well based on the first of the U.S. Constitution. I should not be forced to do that but that's become an issue.

I think probably for the last maybe 10 years will talk to Matt about the patrol's meet Baron L.

Stutzman Stutzman my saying this correctly@Stutzman substitutes men students know well what an sentiment in the original motherland because is this Germany and some going on on one area it get this What would you say in the originally would-be students, men or Stutzman students met judgment which sounds more children so it's great to have you here. Welcome back to North Carolina have ever been here before lunch before once before, so it's great to have you here. You can learn about parallels story and her our shop. Arlene's flowers, which is in which Richland Bridge, Washington, and what she's been going through and the will brought it out because this is an issue for all of us in the from a legal perspective, Matt Sharp, the senior counsel with the lines defending freedom. Matt welcome how are you it's good to see you very good. Thanks for having me on steering welcome and when did all these kind of stories. Matt start to really come up because ADS been at the forefront of these religious freedom battles for years I've know Mike Johnson.

We were just talking about earlier, is now a representative from Louisiana and Congress in and we were we were dealing with this kind of stuff back in 2004 and 2005.

Because of this direct affront on Christians in the business environment dealing with free speech and their conscience rights. How long is that been really heating up here. You said at least 10 years is when we started seeing efforts to use these sexual orientation and gender identity lost to go after people faith and to tell them people that serve everyone that walks into their shop whether it's a floral shop or cake shop but there's just certain events like weddings or certain messages that they don't want to be forced to communicate to do or to participate in, and so we've seen instances years ago. Where was in a photographer and then we had Baron L doing floral arrangements Jack Phillips doing custom design cake so seen it expand beyond that, but it's more and more of a government that's more and more using these laws as weapons to go after people faith and tell them you must participate or you must speak a message regardless of the fact that it violates their convictions and it's just something we've unfortunately syndrome, or more, and that is become more and more what ADF is Dina standing for that freedom to not be forced by the government to speak messages you disagree with and for the most part, this is still mostly limited to state government. But now it's pushing into the federal government because you have not one but the second time now deal with the US Supreme Court. In this particular case, but it's kind of been bottom-up local state government help.

Do you think were to see it from the federal government from the top down.

Well I think one of the big threats were seeing right now is is the equality act.

It's been bubbling up for a while and so it's the same law that we seen in Washington state or Colorado with with Jack Phillips and others now becoming a federal law, and so it's not just going to be limited to Washington or Colorado.

These other states, but something that here North Carolina.

Whatever your state is that you could be subject to the same government coming after you because of your faith Baron L 10 years ago. Just running your flower shop right just minding your business. How did you get into that world floral arrangements might have a great aunt who own to flower shop down in Daytona and I'm very artistic.

I mean just passionate and look like a really fun way to make a living back to get involved well. I was never to be a florist that my mom bought a shop and asked me if I would deliver for her, which I said yes it was a bad idea because I don't know, North, South, East and West Texas. I go turn right where the three shrubs in the Barking dog in selfish Maya my delivery was very shortly so that then I started working for mom in the shop and I start sweeping floors and cleaning bathrooms and and eschewing girl Friday work and then I was initially trained by five excellent designers back to school and became a full pledge floors. Now it's called Arlene's so why is it called Arlene's and not bear no well first of all, nobody can spell or pronounce it that it was Arlene's when my mom bought it's okay, she just kept the name now widget would your would your average floors, something that does floral design consider themselves an artist will absolutely absolutely so that kinda flows out of who eat who you are for you and your creative mind yeah you know you're weird, minus some people say that you think of it that way. Originally, like I'm an artist arose from.

Now I know I know I didn't. I just, you know, just flower arrangement and it wasn't a big deal to you get into the personal things of the weddings and that the creativity thing for celebrations and parties and how long have you actually own the shop we bought the shop from mom when she we found out she had Alzheimer's, so we had it for 24 years long time. So what will unpack this because we we have some time over the course of the show to talk about what's happening but did you was it on your radar screen at all because what would like Matt was talking about. We started here 10 years ago 15 years ago started here about photographers in Florence was this issue on your radar screen is all at all is a Christian is running a small business until Washington passes same-sex marriage, yet then now it's on the radar screen print story where to pick it up there because things got very interesting very quickly. Prepare now and with her friend Rob who you'll get to know a little bit about Rob. Fascinating story is something that we all need to be aware of and by the way, if you just think the passing things, it isn't. And even though you might think you can't do anything about it. This is one of those that praying about regularly. There will be right back, go back and Steve Noble to Steve Noble so very today, something that I hope that your radar screen as things in America are changing rapidly.

For those of us that Jesus Lord and Savior, and whether you own your own business you work at a business or you just try to live out your faith context of her everyday life that that's starting to rub up against the forces here in America that we no longer agree to disagree. Now we bring a lawsuit and we use the power the government to come after things and and match match our picture with a list of any freedom. And then there now Stutzman is here who runs and owns Arlene's flowers of Richmond, Virginia that her name might sound familiar to you.

Just because there's a lawsuit and she was exercising a person writes with a friend actually were to talk about that her friends name is Rob without same-sex wedding and what you do in that circumstance, and you try to love people well and serve them and we talked about this for years, Baron Allen and Matt, thanks for being here again I don't know a single Christian in that circumstance, who was checking people at the front door to the business being a copy shop or a bakery or a or floral shop and saying all you can buy flowers. You can buy flowers but you can't mean we don't operate that like that, as Christians, but when it comes to using your artistic ability to participate really and wedding things get different so let's let's best work as you mentioned in the state of Washington when the marriage issue came up Dawes and he started to get sensitized to what's going on.

So what was that like for you is a Christian business owner why we paying attention. Well, when they talked about passing along Washington state.

It was simply it was put out very simply that this will not affect anybody other than the same-sex couples that want to get married when you get married fine, but don't affect anything else and we truly believe that. And then when Washington state passes same-sex marriage, then when Rob came in to talk to me about his wedding. It definitely changed yeah and and that's one of things when we look back at the overfilled case that you noted this nationally. One of the things that the court warned about this at this is to happen.

It's good to become more even, you know, whispering these things in your home is about the only place you can do them. And so even the Supreme Court was recognizing when we open this up and and created this new so-called right to same-sex marriage that it's Consequences. Baron owes one of the many examples of that. Unfortunately, as you could look at the entire wedding industry just talk about marriage, about my weddings and then what is that involved and there's a lot of moving parts I got married almost 29 years ago I stay still scars from that there's a lot of moving parts and others. A lot of people involved in salsa and always opportunities for that clash, but in this case, most the time and this is where we need to check ourselves as Christians. Just because somebody is living a different lifestyle. You may be a homosexual doesn't mean that they look at you with disdain. Oftentimes we do that we do the same thing with Islam. We do the same thing with these things ago because I knew of many because we fought for the marriage amendment here in North Carolina. Okay, we did the first rally for it back in 2005. Finally got it passed in 2012 and of course the sprinkler decision came in 2014 but there were other P there were other homosexuals that I encountered in that process that really didn't were interested in the same-sex marriage argument. They didn't want the attention they weren't my enemy.

So oftentimes we have to remind ourselves just because someone is on the other side and assume they're out to get you but tells about Rob because this is something that you relationship with the friendship. Rob Rob is one of my favorite customers and I waited. I am almost 15 years now and the thing that drew me to Rob was his concern for his employees. He always came in to make sure they had birthday flowers or or funeral or sympathy. Whatever it was, and I knew Rob was gay from the beginning was never an issue and he had been in twice before to tell the girls that he was getting married want to talk to me so when I found out he was coming in that day I went home and asked my has been ordering to do here and Darrell says very, very clear what the Bible says about marriage in Christ relationship to his church.

So when Rob came in to talk to me about his marriage. I just took him aside and I gently put my hands on his and said Rob I'm sorry I can't do your wedding because my relationship with Jesus Christ. He said he understood.

We talked about his mom walking down the we talked about why they decide to get married after so long.

We just chitchatted for a while he asked me if I would recommend another florist which I did. I recommended three and one of those he got his flowers from and we hugged each other and Rob left and I was so grateful that he accepted it as gracefully as he did like a good French yes and he went home and told his partner Kurt and Kurt put something on Facebook that simply said there now has every right to believe the way she does that she hurt her feelings and from then it went viral and and the Atty. Gen. sued me and in the ACLU that hold Rob and Kurt and suit me both personally and corporately and so oftentimes it gets out of the realm of a personal relationship and then other forces get involved.

It is not especially true unimagined state like Washington and all the states that are better. Face it heavily liberally control Democrat party and you have that agenda there yeah that's unfortunately what we saw play out in Baron else case you normally when some of these other ones pop up for some human rights commission. The dozen investigation but here in really an unprecedented move, the Atty. Gen. of Washington state came against Baron L directly brought the full force of his office against him or with him and sued her for all of this and and what was interesting as we contrast that where he comes against Baron on this way with there was a story from a couple years ago you may have seen it with her as a coffee shop and I think the Seattle area is owned by a gay man.

And there was some students that had been in the area that we had been handing out pro-life Eli or something like red and he confronts them very vulgar terms when they came in just to grab a couple coffee and kicks them out will that's what is. Examples were someone was denying service to those students because of their beliefs because of who they were and you contrast that with Baron L, who serves everyone including Rob for years is all she's asking is, don't force me to be a participant in a ceremony that has so much sacredness to her and her belief system and that just shows the hostility that the Atty. Gen. show 20 Baron L versus other individuals and was all based on disagreement with Baron else beliefs not from a legal perspective when she when he asked and she told him there's some other places that you can get flowers that's an issue here.

I think maybe we use the phrase a reasonable accommodation that you don't you don't have to go to one shop and if another shop offers. It is that a legal issue that is other places you can buy far right end and in this particular case, Rob and Kurt had over was it 20 2020 offers to do their wedding for free for free while free yeah and so this is not an instance where of not being able to access a florist on this one had militant plenty of options but are nonetheless suing her along with the Washington Atty. Gen. to force her to create these custom-designed arrangements and be a participant in the ceremony when you talk about create so what they what Rob wasn't looking forward to buying stuff off the shelf that it already been made. That's one issue then hey Baron I we want you to actually create new stuff using your artistic ability, which is another form of your speech to then make this for our wedding night and that was with different yes absolutely it and it's a sacred sacred ceremony at rehab represents Christ and the church. And that was just something as much as I love her. That something I couldn't and and so does that does that matter, from a legal perspective buying off the shelf versus your asking me to create a very much as a it's the weather it's creating floral designs or a custom cake like Jack Phillips.

That is all expression protected by the First Amendment affect the Washington Atty. Gen. admitted that in the Washington Supreme Court that what Baron L does his speech, but nonetheless thinks the government ought to allow to force her to do it. I think it's interesting Baron element that the level of involvement she has in a wedding it's it's really different than yeah many times have I'll spend months with the bridegroom finding out what they like what they don't like the colors but they argue that out and then they tell me what they want to convey in the wedding and once I find out all that information then it's my job to create something that represents them.

Yeah. So when we do that we go to church we set up. I'll have to break your interest. Only time will your participant absolutely for us as a Christian to be a participant in something sacred is a big deal such as this is Steve Noble will be right back here in the studio literally I don't.

I love you. It's cool but it's good to give a video if you just go to Facebook you can do it there Facebook live at the Steve Noble show page and go to YouTube. We have a page there as well. YouTube watch live there and by the way during radio which we praise the Lord for Christian radio. That's how I got started in all of this in terms of broadcasting and that still just an amazing tool for the Lord to use around the country. But you guys listen to commercials which we praise the Lord for commercials as well, but I'm on Facebook and YouTube when you guys on the radio when you're listening to the radio commercials were having a sidebar conversation hit the pause button some knots robbing Peter to pay Paul Hyman to cover the majority of over talk about today with Baron now with Matt during the radio show. But we can have sidebar conversations go a little bit deeper. That's another 20 minutes really of time in the hour between 4 and 5 PM Eastern time, so make sure you check that out of it is great to have Matt and Baron L here in North Carolina and for being a thanks for taking the time do you get tired of talking about the Smyrna no you don't know what it so important. Our freedom is so important.

We have to start standing up speaking out so when you first find out how did you find out that all of us on the Atty. Gen. and in your own state of Washington. Washington state was going to come after. How did they let you know that we were at home with some friends and we got a phone call and the person on the other end said hey you're being sued and I go to get your being sued is that for what it Atty. Gen. filed a suit against you, and I did you write on just about that time there was a knock on the door and we were served paver surface of the phrase we use. There may have extra papers that focus. So let's go back to talk about this up here, but I want to make sure we all go there with also and that happens it's hard to imagine what that would be like. So from a an emotional standpoint of an intellectual standpoint. Could you grappling with the realities of adjuster your intellect and then from a spiritual standpoint, what was that like for you in that moment when I didn't leave it like we did nothing wrong. So I sorta thought it was like a joke type things you set for the paper. Some I have for you, then you know you think it Atty. Gen. suing me and he's using our many to sue me. So I went to kick back on my income tax. So you're one of those in the form taxpaying the trouble you informed people look out that you know spiritually is just one of those things. Like I say we never came out and asked for this, but when the time came to draw the line.

Then God had led his word is his word unless he changes his you know word, then I can change my but I think it happened so we can stand firm so what did you ever have kind of a why me moment just accept this this platform that he was getting really, why me was that I didn't think I did anything wrong that I never I never really said you know white meat other than in a large unit can assist this position this opportunity to speak and I'm you know not sure that's why me, you know that my sound a lot like Moses don't send me Lord, I'm not really a flip about the public severe don't don't work going, Moses Olson, Erin, when you go really stuffy. It's really funny because Aaron doesn't really say yeah I got junk sitting here cool and I couldn't see anything.

Talking to Pharaoh. That's Moses, so, so, did you with that. Now, in this case, you know you're married your husband with you so this is as a couple, and employees. There's more people involved in this than just you absolute what was that like the kind of your the epicenter of it in God's allowed it, but other people get to be impacted if your business goes under. You have what 78 employees that are going to be gone. Yes or so how do you handle that.

In terms of it's not just Baron Elvis of the people will firstly God gave me a godly husband. He has been my rock and he said from the beginning.

You know wherever you need to go to speak this word then were going and that's what we been doing the employees were absolutely awesome. So member Christian semi marked that the ones that were Christian started reading their Bible started having prayer together and the ones that were Christian said you know will stay here and wash up you go do what you have to do so. What was next. Like what you do. I know what I would do what I been at this for a while. What first well you know what to do because I've never been sued before so we had a customer that came in and recommended we call ADF and that's what we did and without them it would been totally nauseous. What a gift, save all of us into the country as a whole because the country does better when the Constitution is followed the rule of that's good for the whole country often say that God's way works every time. Stride, not necessarily immediately, but it's always good in God's way is good for my neighbor even if my neighbor doesn't see it or agree with. I know God's will is good for my neighbor and for my country and so ADF in that position. So when when somebody calls ADF and tells little about ADF because I really want people to understand this because I know when I get on the air like you'll appreciate this Matt because you guys been doing pulpit freedom Sunday for a while which is essentially dairy. This is me, not Matt on behalf of ABS me this is Steve Noble does the steeple show and sure the Lord's interruption. I pretty much say whatever I want us okay so this is ADF and I've done this myself. A pastor compares to candidates based on the biblical standard and says based on the biblical standard.

This candidate lines up more Scripture than this one. That's a sermon they meant to basically film it send it to the IRS is basically a dare. So every two years on the show all say about a week before tuna next Tuesday. Listen to me break an alleged federal law and I did.

I tell people who to vote for in this radio show and obviously I'm not afraid of saying it is a 501(c)(3), I've exact same stacks tax status as church you want to sue me, go ahead. It'll be good for the show first ball will glorify God and I'm in a call ADF because I know I know the laws on my side and the Johnson fall if it ever gets the Supreme Court.

I think it's toast, but you have to challenge so tells about ADF because you guys are super important huge blessing to this country 08 you brought up a great point is one of the things ADF stands for is our protecting our First Amendment rights, and that includes freedom of speech, whether it's a pastor from a pulpit, whether it's a florist who creates expression through her floral designs.

Whether it's a student on a college campus that just wanted to push back against some of the crazy ideology being pushed by their professors and so we are a nonprofit law firm that we every case we take with her. It's Baron, else it's been going on for years now or whether it sometimes just a simple letter to resolve some complaint, we do everything we do, free of charge and what were standing for is for marriage for family for free speech for life and making sure that those values are defended in court that were getting legislation that defends that that's honestly one of the reasons why were here North Carolina this week is the same law that Baron else facing that there is no risk of that happening in North Carolina, heads popping up in cities and we think there's a power to not just me traveling and telling the legal arguments, but letting people hear Baron L letting them meet her face to face hear her story and then when some legislator City Councilman is considering one of these laws so you know what, I met Baron LI should not be supporting a law that strips away freedom that is going to be used to go after people like Baron L and others that are just wanting to serve everyone but not be forced to participate in certain events that we talked about this up here and I tell my students this all the time. The law for the most part is still on our side. But if you don't know it you're just to feel helpless and if you don't stand up against it. The nothing.

It's like you can have a speed limit, but the police never pull anybody over the speed limits effectively built. There's nothing to do whatever you want, but in this case you have to stand up. By the way, what ADF representative noxious guy by the microphone.

We have represented a lot. I did a lot of people that do not want to be forced to speak message. I disagree that is a resounding yes and I'll grab Matt's car before you leave the studio so I so what happens you talk ADF and how did that make you feel is all sudden ADF is an amazing organization and you're not alone. Maybe we'll totally relieved time and they were right there and they have been with us through everything and they are our second family. Now that's so cool here and then so how does it proceed from there.

Matt legally what's happened yet. So after the lawsuit was filed. It made its way through the Washington Supreme Court Washington state court system and eventually made its way to the Washington state Supreme Court, where as I'd mentioned earlier, the and of the Atty. Gen. even admitted that what she does is speech well. Sadly, the Washington Supreme Court ruled against her, ruled that the yeah yeah she can have her religion but it can't be something that influences the type of events that she's participates in.

So we appealed her case to the US Supreme Court to surprise you at all that they rule that way you know I think we had the oral argument and some of things are going to saw the writing on the walls you eliminate or to get lemon juice Yahoo it's been it's been unfortunate because again the principles were standing for any court in the country out of the room in favor of, but we appealed to the US Supreme Court and that was around the same time that Jack Phillips case was going up there and says a lot of people don't know that spring forgets thousands of request for cases every year and only takes 80 to 90 so they took Jack's and we got a good ruling for Jack that the hostility that they show towards Jack's faith, comparing his views about marriage to the same views that it justify the Holocaust and I'm just despicable.

They ruled in favor of Jack and so we thought well maybe that's the signs are normal for Baron L. Will they sent her case back to the Washington Supreme Court again. That's usually assigned when the Supreme Court does that of lower court, you got it wrong you need to remedy this well. The Washington Supreme Court basically copied and pasted almost verbatim their original ruling against Baron L handed it to her again.

Sorry, Baron L, you lose again.

So were now killing her case a second time to the US Supreme Court's we know could be a matter of weeks or even in the next you will get word when the speaker push that back down when was that first time was was about 2616, 28, going things in case you notice things that change that the United States Supreme Court a little bit since that's all talk about that where this goes. Next, how we can pray for them and how we can support them. Vera Baron else here in math here talk about this really really important case just trying to make flowers and use your gift in the name of the Lord in trouble.

Beware will be right back Virginia. Richmond. Richmond but Richland Washington Washington looks like a beautiful state just looks actually spectacular and running a business family owned and running a business and that her friend Rob.

She had a long-standing relationship with friendship with you is a regular customer good customer he and his partner decide to get married so they asked Baron L to make custom floral arrangements for the wedding because of her Christian convictions and what Crist what marriage means to us. She politely said she could and that was a really would you describe that sound like that exchange between the two of you was really kind and friendly.

Let's arrive really wasn't the issue here is the state government and current in the Washington and the Atty. Gen. and so it goes. The up through that system to the Washington state Supreme Court ends up you appeal to the US Supreme Court.

They push it back down when they push the case back down to Washington's jurisdiction Matt today give them any leak any leading to they write an opinion whether they send back down with that yes and only what they do is this is right after Jack Phillips and so court gave direction of reconsider Baron else case in light of our ruling for Jack Phillips and again that's normally clear sign here's another creative professional in the wedding business. How does will be forced to be a participant user expression, but in the Washington Supreme Court ignored that and doubled down in its ruling on Burnell yeah and so where does it stand out. So now we are waiting to see if the were back in the super US Supreme Court seeing if they're going to take her case.

And so there's a couple of other religious liberty cases, the one involving an adoption writer in Philadelphia. It's kind of a similar thing where the governments trying to force them to violate their beliefs about marriage so we don't know if the courts waiting for that or if they're just wanting to know consider Baron else case of our prayer in all of this is that they do take her case and give a clear ruling that people like her. The can't be compelled by the government to violate their convictions. You think it will matter that the makeup of the Supreme Court's change significantly since the last well you know my encouragement is obviously you know who's on the court changes things, but it was Justice Kennedy that was on the court and rolled for Jack and obviously a wasn't as far as is some of said it hoped but I think when even you know liberal justice looks at this and and ought to be holding fast to if the government can force Baron L to speak this message. Why can it force a message that's on the other side or an end. The giving the government that power to be something that all of us have great concern about including all nine members of the Supreme Court. It's interesting friend of mine, and on Facebook live said how is MLB or the NCAA, refusing to do business in the state based on different values different than a florist or baker not doing business. It's an interesting book, but Tom your front, your thinking logically and you can't do that and I love to do that anymore. That doesn't fly very well. What's at stake for you Burnell in this case what's at stake if we lose Supreme Court doesn't take our case and because of the ACLU attorney switches can be well over million dollars. We can lose our business or life savings or retirement everything report for four kids and our grandkids, our employees would lose her job.

The city would lose its taxes are vendors would lose us as customers and we couldn't serve the people in the Tri-Cities that we been doing for 47 years yeah so devastating yes or but you don't look like you look like yellow some else going on besides just material world. So how does your faith absorb this another source.

There is a song that says Lord, I offer my life to you everything I been through user for your glory. What do I have that you have not given what do I own that it is already years. It is entirely whatever we have is Lord if he chooses to use it that way. Then he can certainly do that concealment and how has the local church and the church around the country respond to churches depriving our biggest disappointment and they don't want to get involved. They don't want to lose their typing money and when upset people that we do have churches that have supported us and been very graceful gracious to us and let us speak there and have been have been standing up how much of a problem. Matt met favor from ADF as well.

How much of a problem are we as Christians in America not willing to come to step up the plate or be willing to sacrifice everything is as Burnell was so eloquently saying and when I talk about were sacrificing everything, what are we sacrificing the tires. Nothing that's helpful to remember that. But are we a part of the problem because when we were to sheepish you know I is set always remind people of these rights require someone willing to stand up for that the prices of freedom is vigilance and that means we all have to be willing to put something on the line to be willing to be the person that files a lawsuit. It's encouraging you know I'll go there. Robert had a lot of churches and others that have not. There's also I think I a younger generation that is recognizing more and more the need for this.

It's one of Burnell's favorite things to do is to talk to college students because were seeing these more more.

They're the ones on campus talking about her case, talking about these freedoms and I think there's a courage there that I hope becomes infectious really spreads to the soldier when you need it. All shot in the arm to say be willing to speak out because these are fundamental values that ought to unite us and that matter for all of us in the ought to unify us. Well, I think it's it's going back to some things that happened during Nazi Germany, or they came for the Jews, but I was in a juice care in the nick that eventually they come for you about it in the confused yells and it's encouraging to hear that younger people because I think you keep pushing that line. Keep pushing that line is, like what happened with the tea party once they got involved with healthcare.

Okay, that's close enough now working to engage.

We when we screamed blood he murder to try to get people engage Christians with a life issue with the marriage issue, but now not so working a dip in your pocketbook to the office and come out of the woodwork and that's the tea party so tell me about that because that's interesting that you see younger people how they respond to the story that your time really seemed very receptive and there sort of shock that type of things going on but they're pretty bowl your young people are pretty bold in their willing to step out and met just had a little gal that came up to him last night. She's 12 years old and she wants to be an attorney well yeah it's awesome. Pray for her parents but that's what we need to be willing to get in there and engage we do and I think this is again going back to when these young kids get to meet someone like Baron L that is arming showing such courage and strength in all of this. I think it in him and emboldens them and that's it was neat seeing that the young lady come up and was inspired and she liked it.

I want to fight for the Constitution, just as I will be needed. Issue sitting there thinking I am a homeschool but I like to go to Harvard. I just don't us like if God wants you to Harvard to go to Harvard and your to help be the next generation to take these cases and expand these freedoms they need some Daniels and Nebuchadnezzar's court. And we don't run away right, how can we somehow can we help can we support outgoing pray for both well.

We can pray that since Supreme Court will see how important this is and take our case and you can pray for Rob and Kurt.

The two people are suing me and just that we stand strong.

We have courage and it that hearts are open, and minds are open to what we have to do freedom. This cost is a cost and if we just sit quietly and don't do anything. Pretty soon you consists be as silent as you want because you won't have any rights of its right to grace wasn't cheap and freedom of the gene that how can we pray for what you guys are doing and ADF in general. Yellow obviously effort for Baron Ellen for everyone involved in this case and the attorneys that are in a world litigating it in your nose lot hours put in preparing a case for the Supreme Court, and he is the final one, you know, obviously were nonprofit. Everything we do we do free of charge and and it's one of the best things about my job is never absent. Ella Billy never doing things to defend your pro bono units of those that you want to support the efforts and be able to help us with the legal defense of Baron Ellen others like or they can visit ADF legal.Oregon learn more about her case and and if they got their own situation is over here to help them as well). I put links up on the Facebook live feed are ready for ADF ADF is the website will quickly just a couple minutes. Burnell tell everybody about what you been doing with your flowers during the cold.

This is a really cool story is told you the story. It was from the Washington Times, not that long ago, but just really shows the heart of Christ and how you're using now and when we close down.

We had a lot of flowers and are cooler so consider throwing away. We made bouquets and sent them to the nursing homes and we also sent to the first responders the firemen in the placement and it wishes just a cool way to not have to wait flowers, but it was more important, it was reaching out to the community know because they've done so much for us and we were so grateful and what was the response to you guys doing. It was all good. How good you you Wasko Lee were supposed to be firebreathing nasty people delivering flowers of all things. What's it been like for your employees well they fit. They been so cool the employees.

Like I say Cinemark Christians that when they receive some of the phone calls that we've received and see what's really going on. I think their ISA been open to how important this case is very gracious to let me coat on traveling by those phone calls. I would assume that a lot of them are not nice not nice enough. Not really shocked by the level of vitriol and darkness that's out there. Although I was shocked by the words out of people's mouth and the anger and that how many breaks your heart you know they're there hurting and that's the proper response gently because were so political. Our first reaction is emotive in its anger as opposed to lament. I was the you saying that it's in the thinking Jesus is looking out the masses and he weeps as he sees it, like sheep Shepherd. He thinks of their soul, for he thinks of their position. It was only calls in and they talk to you that way. I believe that kind of message you know there broke and you know they probably don't know the Lord.

That's ultimately more important than their position on this particular issue, so I really appreciate you saying that what's got talk about himself. About a minute please. Extremely faithful, and he has to hit me with a 2 x 4 play offense to my place enough urges willing to be obedient and do what he asked no heat, he gives us perfect peace on this. We just want to be out of his will so well you can trust him absolutely how to deal with fear when there is an SL fear.

We have been given a spirit of fear but of love, power, sound, sound mind part of the best you that bless you, thank you for your work being worth the lines were great.

My obnoxious prayer print out the pleasure and honor to have you often remind people that when we need Christians like you like my well also amazing.

Actually, it should be just as Christian darkness pointing us in the right direction.

Everybody, this is the nobleness Steve Noble shall, God willing, I'll talk you like my dad always is ever another program powered by the Truth Network

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