JJ McCarthy: Trying To Soak It All In

Green 18! This is the Rich Eisen Show. You guys ready to get started? From the NFL Draft in Detroit, it's the Rich Eisen Show. Earlier on the show, NFL insider Adam Schefter, NFL draft prospect, Terry and Arnold. Still to come, NFL draft prospect, JJ McCarthy, CBS NFL analyst and NFL Network draft analyst, Charles Davis, ESPN NFL analyst, Louis Riddick, 2024 NFL draft prospect, Romo Dunsay, NFL Network insider, Tom Pelissero. And now, it's Rich Eisen. That's right, we're back here on the Rich Eisen Show Draft Week special, live from Detroit at the Total by Verizon Studio.

It's hour number two of day number one of our three-day residency here in Detroit, Michigan. We are thrilled to be here at the NFL Draft. Charles Davis, one of my colleagues who's going to be sitting on the set with me for three days and two nights on NFL Network is going to be joining us shortly.

Louis Riddick of ESPN later on in hour number three. We just said goodbye to Terry and Arnold of Alabama and Adam Schefter, my buddy from back in the day at the University of Michigan. And speaking of joining us to kick off hour number two of this program is one of the best of the best in the history of Wolverine football.

He is one of the top prospects available in this draft in Detroit and a national champion. Great to see you, J.J. McCarthy. Honored to be here, Rich. Really appreciate you having me.

Come on. Right back at you. Right back at you. So what's going through your brain right now, day before the draft here in Detroit?

Oh, it's really the calm before the storm. You know, I'm just trying to soak it all in because you only get to do this once. Obviously, you know, making my rounds with Schembecker Hall and you're just going to every coach and just telling them how much I appreciate them for everything they've done throughout this process. And, you know, I was actually just talking to Greg Hardin the other day, a huge fan of the show. He tells you or tells me to tell you that you're one of the greatest human beings and true Michigan man. And yeah, we're just going through this whole process of, you know, becoming a GM, a grown ass man. And it's a fun process, but I'm ready to get going.

That's why you already that as far as I'm concerned. But so who have you taken personal visits with? So I've taken personal visits with the New York Giants, New England Patriots and the Washington commanders. Now, was that personal visit the one with 21 others? Well, yes, it was like a little, you know, back in the day college recruiting visit.

It's because what was that? What was that like? It was it was a lot of fun. I enjoyed it. You know, being around the guys, the coaches, like it's such a laid back setting. And, you know, you get to show off the golf game a little.

I heard about that. So what is your handicap? What is it?

I don't have an official one, but I'm say I'm around a 10. Yeah. So but so you're a top golf, though, with all these guys, was it some sort of alpha male who can drive it the longest?

I'm gonna lie, Dre and I are going back at it just doing the trying to get it over the net. That was the goal. That was. Yeah.

Did did we succeed? No, no. You know, with those, you know, shafts, they're nice and flimsy.

So they don't like you get over the blame it on the equipment. I like it. I like it.

Because it just from from those on the outside looking in, it just felt like a unique way to take a look at prospect before the end of the journey. It was the last one, right? Yes.

Yes. But supposedly, Adam Peers was talking about this was something they did back in San Fran. So right. Wasn't super well, as you need me and to the guys there, because it's obviously, you know, first time going through this. But it was a lot of fun. And I really liked the way, you know, he went about that whole process, because, you know, the owner was in for two days, and he wanted to get everyone there in those two days.

So it was pretty special the way he handled that. And now it's kind of the end of an era for you here in this state, you know, obviously, and an end of, you know, a prep slash college career for you getting ready to go to the pros, man, like this is, this is it. This is it. Everything you worked for everything you dreamed of. Yeah.

In terms of working and dreaming about it. You sent me a video before I boarded the plane to get here. Yes, sir.

And this video is what, JJ? It's pretty much long story short, my dad manifesting my entire life. And, you know, it was right before I was born. And him just kind of saying, you know, going through the names and with your mom, yes, with my mom.

And, you know, he was just like, it's gonna be daddy's little quarterback. And, and we have that video, you were, and you've not shown this, haven't shown it, you know, he only showed me it like six months ago. Really? Yeah. So I was just like, Oh, well, how come I didn't see this earlier? And he said, I was just waiting, you know, for the time.

Well, everybody, it's gonna get dusty wherever you are here is. So your dad's shooting it on a camcorder. Yep. On the day of your birth. Yes, sir.

Which is January 20th, 2003. And you'll see the timestamp in the lower right. Your mom, Megan is, is sitting in the hospital bed. Yes, sir. Having a conversation with your dad. Check it out.

What other things? I like Jonathan James and I want to call you JJ. You were there for your life. I like those names. I'm calling you JJ.

It's gonna be daddy's little quarterback. I know. But if not, that's okay. It's totally okay.

I can't see your room. Daddy's little quarterback. Yeah. It's crazy, right?

Crazy. And then there's the after photo right there. It's a big dog right there. There's daddy's quarterback right there.

And mom's too. Dude, man, I'm getting all misty just seeing that. Yeah. I'm not gonna lie. I got a little bit too, but you know, it's a lot, you know, from then to now that took place and, you know, so much they sacrificed and, you know, just unconditionally grateful for everything they've done for me. And, you know, it's only in the beginning.

It is that. And just in terms of the journey, I know you had your own journey yourself about finding yourself and the number of times that we've seen you meditating before a game. What, what's, what's the story behind all that? So the story behind that, I, my senior year of high school, it was during COVID. So, you know, a lot of people had similar experiences and I, I went through a little form of depression, you know, straight up. And, you know, I was sitting there on campus, you know, miserable, not, you know, my normal self.

And I had to figure out a way to pull myself out of it. And I started looking up, you know, great practices to improve your mental health and meditation was the first thing that popped up. And, you know, once I put it into practice, once I started studying it to a great extent, I started realizing the benefits and I started understanding that, you know, you have the ability to change your thought processes, change the way you view the world and your perspective on things. And once I started, you know, having that awareness and growing that awareness, it just was a practice that I can never stop because of the benefits that it gave me on and off the field.

And when did you start drawing a smiley face on your hand? That was, yeah, that was sophomore year of high school. It was my first loss against our arch rivals, the Marist Red Hawks. And, you know, I had a bad game. And this little girl came up to me after the game when I was signing autographs. And after I finished signing a newspaper, she was just drilling me with questions. Why were you so mad? Why did you look like you're not having fun out there?

All this good stuff. And I just told her I was playing a bad game. And then she goes like, you need to smile more. And then drew the smiley face on my hand. And I was just like, wow, that's pretty profound for a seven-year-old. And then, you know, it's just like the nature of it, the more you enjoy something, the better you're going to perform.

Whether it's here, whether it's, you know, whatever business, whatever profession you do. So I kept it on my hand the rest of the year. We went undefeated, won the state championship.

So I was like, maybe this is a little something I should keep going. Yeah, there you are throwing it. So how many games did you lose in high school though? Just only two, right? So only one other than the one that caused her to draw a smiley face. Yes, sir. And I know the answer to three.

Okay, okay, got it. And I know the answer to how many games you lost in college. Yes, just the one.

Just one. And so the amount of winning that you've done and the amount of growing that you have done, how do you respond to people who say you weren't asked to do as much as a quarterback in the NFL needs to have done to lead a team to a championship? What I was asked to do was to adapt to coach Harbaugh's system.

And it was a hard pill to swallow. I'm not gonna lie to you because I know the work I put in. I know the confidence that I have in myself, but you know, this is a system that has worked for him ever since he got into coaching at USD. So like being able to put my personal motives aside and do what's best for the team and follow my coach's orders because that's what, we're soldiers on the football field.

We follow our, you know, top of the command and we do what they say. And you know, at the end of the day, you know, having that experience where, you know, I'm not thinking about myself, I'm thinking about we instead of me is going to just carry over so much easier to the NFL because, you know, there is that out there but not as much in college. And being able to have that experience in a pro style offense, being able to understand, you know, situation of football, how to control the game, how to win the ugly games, that's going to transition to the best because it really comes down to those two minutes at, you know, the end of the game, right before half, all the little stuff that, you know, I learned playing at University of Michigan. When you said it was a tough pill, give me some examples. Seriously.

Yeah, Penn State, you know, the one that everyone talks about. That was really tough pill to swallow but, you know, going into it, it was a monumental part of the quest to where we wanted to get to. So, you know, whatever we had to do to win is, you know, what I'm signing up for. And Coach Moore told me in the receiver, it's going to be one of those games and you didn't hear a peep out of us, you didn't see us, you know, stutter at all. It was just, Roger that, let's go to work. And, you know, I got in there a little bit with the running game and stuff like that but, you know, afterwards I asked Coach Moore like, hey, what was it? Do you not trust me? Was it, do you not have faith in my abilities to help play?

And he said, absolutely not. I just felt this number 44, Chop Robinson, was going to tee off and have a game. So, we had to adapt and, you know, do what they have a hard time stopping, which is, you know, nine on seven football and just keeping it between the tackles and just, you know, willfully moving the chains.

And, you know, I totally get it with his, you know, all the pressure he was under. Everything that led up to that game, you know, with Coach Harbaugh being suspended, you know, right when we touched down, it just, you know, at the end of the day, it was a hard pill to swallow but we won and that's all that matters at the end of the day. Exactly, and you wind up winning at the end of the day as well and I just, I have not heard you say, by the way, JJ McCarthy here on the Rich Ozzens show at the draft in Detroit, I've not heard you say, you know, it was a tough pill to swallow. I didn't hear a boomer peep because I am assuming you thought this could be my last run here and you know your draft stock is going to be in the balance in such a way. Yes, sir.

And that's what we're hearing so much is like, well, you know what, he wasn't asked to throw so he can't. Yeah. Not that you haven't complained about it and just on, you know, on behalf of everybody at Michigan, I saw you throw it in the horseshoe and the game kind of flipped when you started throwing it around. Yes, sir. So, but when you hear Jim basically say you're the best that's ever done it here at Michigan, that had to remind you, right, of the plan, the program?

Yeah, and that just, you know, jogged my memory. It was my, it was week four after we beat Maryland and I was worried about the stats and I was calling them and saying like, hey, like, I wish we could, you know, just, you know, open up the playbook just a little bit more. But he told me, hey, I just want you to know that the most important stat of a quarterback is wins and losses.

Tom Brady, yeah, obviously he's got great stats, but his most important stat is that seven rings he's got on his fingers. So just being able to hear that at such a young age and understand, you know, this is what football is all about. It's winning and, you know, with the whole, he can't throw and all that. It's just, all this is just projection.

We have no idea who's going to turn out, who's going to be great. So it's just all based off of, you know, the intangibles and the tangibles. And, you know, I feel like I've done a great job, you know, leading up to this process to make sure that those are dialed into a T. Have you spoken to Brady at all? Not during this process, but I have over the years extensively for sure.

But not during this entire process you're saying? No, I actually spoke with Peyton Manning. He was kind enough to reach out and, you know, give me some pieces of advice going into this thing.

You're willing to share? What do you say? You know, not to, you know, obviously this was the biggest thing he said, respect the NFL, respect the speed, you know, changes, respect the just immense amount of talent that's on the field every single day, but don't over respect it. Don't like, he got in trouble speeding up his footwork and trying to make decisions too quick and not being patient enough. Understand, you know, CJ Stroup, perfect example. He was that great balance of respecting, but not over respecting. So that was something that was huge because going into it, I'm already over respecting everyone on that field, you know, whether it's at practice or on game day. Yeah.

Wow. I kind of know how it feels to be in your shoes with Jim Harbaugh a little bit because I had my charity run at the Rose Bowl this past Sunday and, you know, you know what it's like to win at the Rose Bowl. And so I was having, I was having a good day getting ready to run my 40 yard dash. And Jim was there cause my wife had reached out to him to be, to shoot a video in support of the run to help promote it. And he with Sarah and his kids showed up, they were there.

And I'm like, Hey, would you mind taking part in this thing? And Chris was there as well. And you watched him basically grab a bullhorn. He took over. He took over and I said, do me a favor before I run.

Can you treat me like you treated JJ bites, you know, slamming me on my, on my shoulders and whatever. And, and, and here's that, here's that moment that you're going to see on NFL network this weekend. I want to show it to you first. Ready to go. Yeah. Let's go.

You got this mind in a good spot. Yeah. You're the greatest. You're the best of all time. All right. I'm the greatest letter.

Rip, let her rip, let her rip. Hey, identical. Is that right?

Identical. Although I got to tell you when he was jabbing me like, Oh yeah. He really was jabbing me. Hey, that's one thing about coach Harbaugh.

He's not going to half-ass anything, anything. So that reminds you of that. Oh yeah.

That's the real deal. Yeah. Him saying that, did that get you fired up or you're just like, I'm good coach. I got it. I mean, his whole thing with that is, you know, when he was in Chicago, he was super nervous before his first game and Walter Payton goes up to him and say, Hey, just get hit.

You'll be fine. And all the butterflies will go away. And that was always his thing. You know, get that first hit and he tries to get ahead of it. You know, he tries to give you that first contact to kind of cool the butterflies down, but you know, you're already so locked in before the game. That's just like a routine thing that it's like, all right, it's time to go.

It's kind of more for him, I guess, than maybe it is for you. Plus, it's also pretty cool that you could say, well, Walter Payton once told me, I would love to start any story with that. So you were here on behalf of Sleep Number, which is the official sleep and wellness partner of the National Football League.

This is, this may be awkward and weird, so be quiet guys. My sleep number setting is 60. What's 60? Mine's 50.

Not too far off. Damn it. I wanted to have the same sleep number as JJ. Is that weird? You gotta experiment with it. That's what they're telling me. So yeah, it could change. It could change. I'm more on the stiffer end too. It's adjustable. It's adjustable. And so you're hanging out with Sleep Number and being part of their, their sleep and wellness program.

Yes. It's been amazing. You know, such great people with Sleep Number, obviously thousands of former and current players, you know, sleep on a Sleep Number bed and, you know, just the quality of sleep is so key to your performance on the field and just being able to make that partnership and get rolling with one of those smart beds.

It's going to be amazing. Well, I'm sure they're rooting for the Vikings drafting you because that's where they're located. They're probably, you know, before they hit their sleep number at night, praying to the football gods that you go to the Vikings. Do you have any sense at all before I let you go where you're going? Any idea you think?

I mean, I have somewhat of an idea. New York Giants I've spent the most time with, you know, they're a phenomenal staff. Love Coach Dabel.

Love, you know, Mr. Shane. Love Coach Tierney, Coach Kafka, Chicago guy. Just being able to go in there, pretty much know like most of the install because he came, Coach Dabel came from Alabama and Coach Gaddis came to Michigan from Alabama.

So, it's similar formations, motions, plays, all that stuff. So, being able to get that install in has been great. You know, I met with them twice. It's been amazing just throwing on Easter. Never done that before but that was sweet. But then, you know, New England and Washington just came from there and just love the energy that's in that building and you could tell the sense of urgency to rebuild and be on top and be competitive and obviously Minnesota and Denver, you know, tremendous coaches.

Coach Payton, Coach O'Connell. It would be an honor to play for any of these teams but it's just going to come down to, you know, this funny thing about this process. They get to choose and, you know, I'll be grateful wherever I go and make the most of it. Brother, you are the best. I'm so thrilled that you're here on this show. It's a thrill for me to look you in the eye and say thank you. Seriously, thank you for everything you led and the way that you carry yourself is exactly what we talk about from my end of the thing with the alumni base is being a Michigan man. So, truly appreciate you and thank you for coming on this show and I cannot wait to see what's next for you. My man.

Thank you so much. You brought him so much joy. You have no idea.

No, he does. It's the former Michigan men that paved the way for us. So, thank you for always having our back throughout this past year and thank you guys for, you know, always just, you know, kind of rooting for us.

Obviously, he's rooting for us like crazy but, you know, that's great. That's what I do and thanks for being here and again, we'll see you down the road. Thank you so much. That's JJ McCarthy right here courtesy of Sleep Number. That's Charles Davis getting ready to join me next before we hang way too much together over the next three days. That's next.

This is the Rich Eisen Show. Hey folks, it's time for the NFL Draft which means for me, I need a good night's sleep because if I don't have one, I'm just not myself. You know the deal. You know exactly how important it is to have quality sleep.

It's a game changer for all of us. So, Sleep Number helps me. My Sleep Number setting is 60.

My wife's setting is 70. We both get a great night's sleep because we could adjust the firmness of our mattress on each side. Improve your quality sleep because Sleep Number learns how you sleep thanks to their smart beds and provide personalized insights to help you sleep better. JD Power ranks Sleep Number number one in customer satisfaction with mattresses purchased in store and now save 40% on the Sleep Number limited edition smart bed for a limited time.

For JD Power 2023 award information, visit jdpower.com slash awards only at a Sleep Number store or sleepnumber.com. Our house is a mess. Come on in. I'm Amber Wallin, internet comedian and host of your new favorite podcast, Fly on the Wall.

Okay, that's pretty presumptuous to assume that this is going to be their favorite podcast by the way. Anyway, that wasp that you just heard interrupt me is my husband and co-host, Benjamin Wallin. Listen in as we discuss relationships and keeping our sweet baby kid alive.

Fly on the Wallin wherever you listen. Back here on The Rich Eisen Show on the Roku channel. Joining us here live, first of two times I say hello to this man because the radio audience will rejoin us shortly, Charles Davis of CBS Sports and also my colleague from NFL Network. Good to see you, sir. Great to see you. I love doing the draft with you, man. It's so much fun. Rich, I'm fortunate to be able to do it with you and obviously DJ and Joel and Peter now, but think over the years, a number of people have come through and I've been fortunate to finally join up with you guys for the full go.

So I'm pretty happy. It's been so long. I forget what was the last, what was the first one you did? The first one I did was probably Radio City Music Hall, 2007? Okay. Eight. And my first assignment, I actually sat in the crowd.

Yeah. And they were supposed to come to me for hits. I did one hit that day, but you know why I remember it?

So we'll know exactly what it was. It was a Brady Quinn, didn't go to the Dolphins draft. And I was sitting in the crowd and as you well know, Radio City Music Hall was always the Giants are on the clock, the Jets are on the clock, and that's when the noise went up. I don't remember too many explosions when Brady didn't get picked at nine, like that one. That was pretty wild.

That was pretty wild. And I remember Roger Goodell took Brady Quinn out of the green room and said, you go in mine because I'm sick and tired of watching you on camera. And I will always commend the commissioner for finally recognizing, because somewhere Leland McElroy, remember him, Electric Leland?

Sure. Where was Commissioner Goodell or whoever? Aaron Rodgers, where were they then? Because I really feel for those kids when it happens, because we can't ignore the story. You know, it's happening, but the number of times they have to sit there and try and hold it together and watching their dreams change and alter, that's tough to watch a kid go through that. Because you can't tell them at the time, hey, you dropping might actually be better for you.

You're going to a better team and things of that nature. But I remember that draft. I totally remember that moment for sure. Back on the Rich Eisen Show radio network, sitting at the Rich Eisen Show desk, furnished by Grainger with supplies and solutions for every industry. Grainger has the right product for you.

Call clickgrainger.com or just stop by. One of my favorite humans on the planet, not just because he's sitting here, but I just love your work with Iron Eagle on CBS, calling games and obviously with us together on NFL Network, Charles Davis here on the program. You agree? Oh, let me, I shouldn't say this.

Let me start this way. The can't miss prospect in this draft is, fill in the blank. Ooh, the can't miss prospect in this draft.

Wow. I really like the Futano kid from Washington. I just think his versatility and ease of play makes him a guy, but it's not spectacular. It's an offensive lineman.

But no, but those are the guys who go to the hall of fame and make sure quarterbacks go to halls of fame. I just love the way that he plays. What throws me about all of it is, remember Aaron Curry. He's doing a really nice job as a coach in the college level now.

Doing an excellent job. Every time we talk about the safest pick in the draft, he's going to do this, this, and this. Right. Aaron Curry's name now comes up and I hate that for him. I think he went sixth the year that he came out, but we always said, ah, it doesn't matter. He may not be a superstar, but he's going to be safe. He's going to play.

And it just didn't work out. And it kind of helped me in evaluation because he was an outside linebacker. Outside linebackers that don't rush the passer. Yes. I have to tamp the brakes on because rushing the passer is the name of the game. So we had Aaron Curry, remember Dion Jordan coming out of Oregon.

Of course. Much more of a drop linebacker than a rush to passer guy. He went really high.

Didn't really work out. I kind of lean more towards the guy that comes forward as opposed to the guy that goes backwards. It's just the way the game is played. But you don't mention either of the quarterbacks don't leap to mind. None of the wide receivers leap to mind.

I always struggle with them just because of nature of position. Sometimes it takes a while. Alex Smith took a while to find his way. Now, the interesting part with your guy, he found his guy, Harbaugh.

Right. He found his Svengali later, but your guys already had him, JJ McCarron. By the way, I've got to sit here and watch him. How impressive is that young man?

It's not just because he's a Michigan guy. He's just a wonderful young man. Well, he's very present. You know what I mean? Like he's very present. And he gets it. Have you heard him anywhere say, talking about it, it was a tough pill to swallow, to adjust to hardball.

No, no. That was really interesting. And specifically mentioned the Penn State game that everyone keeps talking about. Well, Childe Robinson was about to do damage.

And Charon Moore had to make a, and that tells you a little bit about Charon Moore is now going to be your head coach. On the spot. Okay.

Things change, guys. How are we going to win this game today? Yeah. And what's interesting to me about that is the best quarterbacks that ever played.

How does my team need me to play for us to win today? Those are the best ones out there. And they're not usually 20 years old.

No. And so for him to figure that out. And not say anything publicly or, you know. I'm glad he asked the question later though, because he got a great answer. And now his process continued in understanding. Because he had to go ask the question.

Which is like, do you not believe in me, coach? Exactly. Because it was in his head and I'll guarantee everyone around him.

There's a lot of that. Hey, what's going on? I mean, JJ. He had to ask the question. I'm glad he did. He asked a person who gave him the answer. No worrying about it. No getting around it. Boom.

And he learned the education. Because Patrick Mahomes, last year, he went to Apex Predator as a quarterback in my mind. Because last year's team was not the swashbuckling Chiefs.

Last year's team was, I'll be darned. My defense is not built to play with a 14-0 lead. My defense is built to play. Right. Oh, we can turn and hand it off to Pacheco.

And Andy Reid kept calling running plays. I don't have the big threat out wide. So I play small ball. Maybe I should take a sack here instead of playing hero. Because my defense will pick me up.

Because he figured it out. To me, all the records, all the great play, all that is phenomenal. But watching him grow as a quarterback over the last six games, the playoffs, and ascend to that level. What does my team need from me this week to win?

Not to pad my stats? That's why I said he went to Apex Predator as a quarterback. That's why he went to the legendary status, even though he's still playing.

Because that's how the greats do it. And it's amazing that here we are at this draft, Charles Davis, NFL Network, CBS, right here on the Rich Eisen Show. It's amazing we're at this draft and we're looking at Caleb Williams' wow plays as the next Mahomes.

And you just described how Mahomes has taken his game to a whole other level of not either having the guys to give him the wow plays or swallowing your pride, if that's such a thing, because of the wow plays. We're seeing that. We're also seeing potentially three quarterbacks going to start in a row. Last time that happened, two of the three, as of right now, are now on other teams. The two taken after them are on other teams. We might see five in the first half of a draft anyway in this draft. Also, deep at wide receiver, here we are the day before the draft and the most well-paid wide receiver in the NFL as of this morning is a fourth round, 112th overall selection in Amman, Ross, St. Brown. It's wild how things develop in the NFL. And yet we're still drafting the same way. You got to take these guys to the top because they could be the next such and such and such and such. And it'll never change.

No, it won't change. And Rich, our colleague, Bucky Brooks, former NFL scout, he has said to us, and I listen to these guys, I listen to him, I listen to Daniel Jeremiah, I listen to all these guys who've done it and been there. You grade the flashes. Remember, you've heard that from him before. Well, those flashes of all these players we're talking about are really bright. What determines whether you're going to be the great pro and a continued long-term pro is what you're doing when it's not the flash time. How many times we had a coach talk about a great offensive player in the NFL.

He does so many things without the ball that help us. And after a while you roll your eyes like, what are you talking about? Well, they do the decoy, right? They block, right? They run the route to keep someone open. They do the fake thing that now the ball goes somewhere else and they make it all happen. They rally their team on the sidelines and in the locker room.

They keep their mouth shut when the adversity hits and only talk when it's supposed. Those are the guys that sustain. The flashes are going to happen because these guys are super talented.

But are you going to be able to do all the other things that allow the flashes to occur? And you do the other things that help make your team win ballgames. That's why I went back to Mahomes on that. To be able to say to yourself at this stage of his career, wow, I might not throw for 5,000 yards this year, but I'm going to win two straight rings and make it happen and work with your coach. Look, Andy Reid had evolved. How many times you think Andy was always throw it, throw it, throw it, we'll run it late. Not anymore because his team wasn't built for it. And he had a seventh round running back who was a bowling ball with knives and he had to hand it to him.

And Andy did it and did it and did it. I thought he evolved as a head coach last year. It's kind of wild. Charles Davis here on the Rich Eisen Show and the few minutes I have left with you here, your latest mock has New England sticking and picking, but picking the guy who just sat in that seat, JJ McCarthy, not Drake May. Why is that?

A number of different things. I mean, you sat with the young man and just stuff of the small sample you would get when people see him, you see the maturity, you see all the things there. But I comped him to CJ Stroud last year and it's not an apples to apples comp. Normally the comp is play style, body type, all that.

Forget it. Last year this time, Rich, were we not as a public and a media saying, yeah, we really like CJ Stroud, but we haven't seen this. We're looking for that. Is he capable of doing this? The answer is yes. And the answer is huge yes on everything. Yes. Are we not asking the exact same questions issue of JJ McCarthy?

It's the exact same grilling. Well, we haven't really seen him do that. He hasn't carried a team. Well, fourth quarter comebacks. Well, it only means fourth quarter comebacks when you're mashing people. Okay.

Be about to keep that in mind. You know, they ran it 28 times, 32 times against Penn State in the second half, the discussion we're having. Well, they were trying to win a football game, but if you watch the tape, in my mind, and I'm just speaking for myself, I see the layered throws. I see the plays that are necessary. The Rose Bowl against Alabama, that was fourth and one in their own territory.

Oh my word. So if anyone was questioning whether someone believed in a quarterback, if you don't believe in your quarterback, you don't give him the ball fourth and one in your own territory against Alabama. You punt the ball away and hope your defense holds. Harbaugh sent in a play and that kid executed it to a tee. The throw that Roman Wilson made the catch on. If he doesn't make that play, Alabama wins the football game. Multiple times that when it was that time, JJ McCarthy showed up.

That's why I'm a big believer. The other part is I had to kind of break a tie with him and Drake May. Two things break the tie. Robert Kraft loves Tom Brady and Tom Brady came from Michigan and this kid came from Michigan and he wants a quarterback and he made very well, said Elliott Wolf, you know, that Michigan kid's pretty good. We're going back to the Wolverine store. So we're going to run it back.

You know what else? Came from Michigan, weather can get a little dicey. New England, weather can get a little dicey. Drake May's at North Carolina.

Can't say it doesn't get dicey, but not like New England and Michigan. Sometimes you're just taking a shot, Rich, and I really am, but I believe he fits that New England culture and what they're trying to do there with Jerrod Mayo. And by the way, they have a talent evaluator there now that no one's talking about who's really good at it and Alonzo Highsmith. You won't hear his name as much as you should, but he'll be in that room with Elliott Wolf. No one better evaluating talent. I have not talked to Alonzo. I haven't talked to anyone there.

It's much more of a feel. And I put McCarthy there at three. And if that happens and Drake May's available at four, then Monty Asenford's phone is like crazy. And so where do you think May winds up if Minnesota and Minnesota comes to go get him? I would imagine they will. I, you know, my mock, I didn't do any trades and I still have Drake May go into Minnesota at 11, which isn't really likely, but I think he goes there. And to me, that's central casting. And frankly, I think that's what Minnesota wants. I think Drake May's their target.

That's just my, my sense of what I'm getting is that he's the guy that they want anyway. And can you imagine, I mean, Kevin O'Connell last year, remember I'm mentioning how people evolve and change? His first year was 13 and four. Now it was a high wire act 13 and four, because how many games did they win by one score? Set an NFL record that year. You knew they'd take a step back last year.

I thought they'd take a big step back. He kept them competitive all year. And all of us got turns at playing quarterback last year. That was impressive. What I saw last year from Kevin O'Connell, who knows how to coach quarterbacks. Heck my man, Josh Dobbs came and did a great job.

Right. But that first week he was coaching him through the headset. Because he just got there and Josh executed and Kevin did it. I just think Kevin O'Connell is ascending himself into an elite level of coaches.

And Drake May, if he gets with Kevin O'Connell, I think that'd be a big win for him. Before I let you go, you think Pennix fits best where? Not winds up, but where you're like. Las Vegas.

He fits Las Vegas because it's a cultural thing. Mark Davis is the son of Al Davis and he can still hear his voice in his head. Throw deep, baby. Throw deep, baby. The quarterback must go down. He must go down hard.

All those things. Warren Wells flashes in his mind. Cliff Branch flashes in his mind.

Unfortunately, Henry Ruggs, that's why they picked him. Because Mark Davis saw that. Right. These are the types of things they'd love to get back to. DNA. You don't mess with these.

It's hard to throw DNA out. Mark Davis still owns that team. And he'd sure as heck love to see somebody throwing that bad boy deep. Now they got to get people for him.

Davante Adams, can he go deep? Yes. But you don't have that super burner. They got to get that. But this kid Pennix, you don't even have to get the feet set. And that bad boy comes up with his hand with dispatch. I know. And it also looks like the NFL film spiral every single time. Oh yeah.

Just slow it down and put a little music with it. And somewhere John Fescenda starts to speak. Great to see you, Charles Davis. Looking forward to the few days. It's going to be good. I can't wait. We got a rehearsal tonight. And you got the mock draft with Daniel Jeremiah on NFL. Yeah. Looking forward to seeing DJs.

It looks like it's going to be pretty strong. Good to see you, Charles Davis. Good to see you, Rich.

When we come back, look who's chilling out on our guest couch coming up next. The great Lewis Riddick. One second. One second. I'm glad I got in ahead of him.

Because then there's no reason to have me here. Back with Lewis Riddick in a moment. America starts the day with America in the morning. First of three pushes of storminess. Hi, I'm John Trout, your host for the latest news, politics, entertainment, business, and weather speech with political overtones. Our staff of correspondents provide a fast paced look at the world with specialized reports from where news happens.

This decision was based on finding there is a central bank appears to be threading that concise, accurate, and fresh each day. America in the morning, the podcast available wherever you listen. All right, back here on the Rich Eisen show on the Roku channel, our radio audience will rejoin us.

Joining us from ESPN, Lewis Riddick, good to have you in the flesh as opposed to in a zoom box for change. Yeah. You know, the world's changed, right? Like that's how we meet people now.

That's how we get computer screens and little boxes. I feel like I know everybody here, like all the signage and stuff. This is so familiar to me. I love it. Fantastic. And TJ, you were telling Lewis, you watched him play at Pitt.

Yeah. Back at Pitt. I think it was, well, the 87 season, I guess it was your freshman year. I had a friend who lived a block up for me. I'm from Altoona, Pennsylvania. It was a big Pitt family.

So his older brother, you know, graduated, went off to start his life and his dad still had an extra ticket. So they start taking me to pick games and I can remember, I still have my ticket stuff from the Halloween game, your Syracuse squad in with Ironhead. Yeah, man. I was playing, I was playing running back then. I was the fullback for Ironhead Hayward.

Wait a second. Like I said, I got to tell him, Rich, look, when I was in the game, it was an automatic giveaway. We weren't, we weren't running the rock.

They were throwing it to me because I wasn't blocking nobody. I was like 210 pounds, 208 pounds. Iron was like 285. And he was like, he led the nation in rushing.

I think that year was close to it. Unbelievable, man. What's it like blocking for Ironhead Hayward? Yeah, I know. I like, again, Rich, if they called anything that involved me blocking, I was like, well, I'll give it my best shot.

We better, it better not be pass protection. That's for sure. Carrier.

That's what I am. Wow. Yeah. I had 1,800 yards that year. He was unreal. What was he? You had 175. Yeah.

But you know what? That Boston College game, I had a couple nice catches. Let's see that year. We also, we played Notre Dame at Pittsburgh. The great Tim Brown came into town, fourth ranked. They thought they were all, we busted them right in the head too. And we, and we knocked them off.

We had a good year my freshman year, and then I moved back to DB. So, all right. Well, that's fantastic.

I love it. Louis Riddick of ESPN here on the Rich Eisen show live from Detroit. We're having a lot of fun. We got a whole third hour coming up. Roma Dunze is coming up to lead us off the next hour and a moment. And Louis, you're going to be part of ESPN's NFL draft broadcast.

All three days of the NFL draft appearing on all their studio shows throughout the draft. It is good to see you here. So, are you now, day before the draft, still of the mindset that Jayden Daniels is worthy of the first overall pick? Absolutely. Absolutely.

Nothing's changed. Look, you know, we've had these discussions over the years, Rich. You know, I don't, you know, I don't necessarily kind of like follow consensus for the sake of following consensus.

I never have. Jayden is just someone that, as we've moved through this process, when you watch how repeatable his mechanics are, how consistent his feet are, how consistent his upper body is, how consistent he is with throwing the football and putting it where he needs to put it. Change arm angles when he needs to throw the football short, intermediate, deep run when he needs to.

People say, well, you know what? He's one of those guys, this is what's interesting about Jayden Daniels. This is kind of one of the things that's come up about him. Well, he doesn't throw outside of the pocket and throw out of structure enough. But last year we used, we used to say the same thing about CJ Stroud too, right?

That he doesn't create enough. And that's why everybody loved Bryce Young because he could create outside. And you talk to coaches in the NFL, they don't want quarterbacks to live in that environment anyway.

They want it to be something you can do, not that you have to do. Jayden can do it. He just doesn't have to because he can win from the pocket.

And so I think with him, he's got, to me, he has got the perfect skill set for today's game. Coaches want you to win from the pocket, be able to threaten all three levels of the field and take off and go 70, 80 like Lamar, if you could, if you needed to. We've seen him do all that. He accepted the challenge of transferring from the Pac-12 to the SEC when people were telling him not to do anything.

He was ready for it to go down there. You see the jump from year one, the year two at LSU that this guy made. Yes, of course, you know, he, Malik is a good wide receiver. Brian's a good wide receiver down there.

They all elevated one another. Jayden had some fantastic, and I'll tell you what, this is what, this is kind of what topped it off for me. You cannot get a true evaluation on players unless you see them in person up close and you kind of stand next to them. That's kind of what did it for me when I went to see CJ Stroud last year, when I was around Jayden and I saw him interacting with Malik and interacting with Brian Thomas and he kind of, and how he was running his workout and watch the ball come off his hand. I'm going, that's the one that, that's the guy. And that's not to say I didn't like Caleb because I loved Caleb. All that crap that I had heard about him and people say, I was like, forget all that. I like this kid.

And because you like one doesn't mean you hate the other, although in our world, that's what it is. Right? Sure. But I just, I got this feeling that I got very similarly to CJ Stroud when I saw him in person was around him. I said, that would be the one that if I was picking first, that's what I'd take. So do you think him going to Washington? Cause that's where it seems like he's going to go. Unless do you, do you think that's possible that he doesn't? Yeah, I do. I do. I think anything's possible. Look, I, I think it, I think it's likely that that's what winds up happening.

Yes. But I think also, look for, for Adam Peters in the, in the ownership group in Washington to want to take one last look at all these guys together, you know, on the same day, in the same kind of environment, like took him to play top golf and all that, spend some more time with them, like back to back to back. Like if you were comparing things, you'd love to have it fresh in your mind, a one to one comparison, like on the same day, like the same minute, right. You wouldn't want to like look at one thing and then 20 days later compare it to the next thing. Cause you, you'll forget a lot of things that to me signifies that it's not just a slam dunk, that it's going to be Jayden. Otherwise, why would you do that? This close to it? I have no idea, man.

Why would you do that? I mean, you're the evaluator. I'll tell you this. I'll tell you this.

I tell the story all the time. In 2004, when we drafted Sean Taylor in Washington, yes. The night before the draft, he was not number one on our top 100 board.

Who was Kellen Winslow Jr. Was. That was who it was going to be. We went into the room the night before the draft scouts, position coaches, ownership, Joe Gibbs, everybody. And when we got after it, it was, it was darn near 50, 50 down the middle who we wanted. And everyone had a chance to say, you know, what they felt. And I went home that night thinking, man, we're going to draft Kellen. Cause Joe was adamant. He thought he could just be special. Came back in the next morning. I remember walking into the draft room and looking up at the top 100 board and there's Sean Taylor at the top. What happened?

Somebody's argument was pretty compelling. I know I was pretty, I was adamant about it. Greg Williams was our defensive coordinator at the time. Yeah. Greg blush was our defensive line coach.

Jerry Gray was there as one of our DB coaches, Steve Jackson. I mean, we got after it with the offensive staff. I mean, it was one of those very productive, but heated debates. So it can happen at the last minute in the last hour. You know, last minute in the last hour, you could wind up changing your mind. So I think anything's on the table with Washington, although it seems likely it makes sense that Jayden would be the one for me. Like he'd be the number one pick. So we wouldn't even be having this discussion, but what about, I mean, in all straight up, let's, I love this Lewis Riddick here on the Rich Eisen show Ryan polls though. I mean, in Chicago where, and I know he wasn't there.

He wasn't there. He had nothing to do with Trubisky and he had nothing to do with Justin Fields, nothing to do with him, but for him to now potentially switch up and go Jayden Daniels and follow. Which won't happen.

It won't. Right. Because there. He's just, he's set on who he wants. Okay. And that's, you see, you know what, like I had this discussion with someone, I said, well, you know, I w I would like to, at this point, have my mind made up. Like I wouldn't, I wouldn't, even though I understand what Adam's doing in Washington, I would like to have my mind made up. And they said, well, why don't you think about it this way? Why does Ryan have his mind made up already? Why isn't he taking this to the, to the very, why, why is he so dead set on Caleb being the first guy? And I said, well, you know what? I mean, look, if you're convicted, you're convicted. If you believe that that's your guy, then you believe that's your guy.

And of course, a lot of Chicago bear bears fans got upset with me for even suggesting that going, you don't know what you're talking about. Caleb is generational. Caleb is Patrick Mahomes, et cetera, et cetera.

I'm just like, oh, whatever, man, look, whatever. But the point is like, I remember Paul said this, he said he is, he is dead sure on being able to evaluate the player, the skill set, the traits that he thinks are befitting of a guy who's the number one overall pick. It's getting the person right.

And the person as it relates to fitting into your environment. That's always the real challenge. Obviously he feels as though Caleb fits and checks every box for him as far as being that number one overall pick. And in Washington, they're making sure. And that's why I'll tell you after Caleb goes off the board, I'm gonna be sitting there going, okay, folks, let's see what's happening here now. Cause I think anything can happen. Cause everybody thinks four is kind of when things get started.

Well, why, why not three? I mean, Elliot, well, it's funny cause Elliot Wolf says, Hey, we might move up. We can move down. We might sit here. I mean, I know, I know it doesn't make any sense. It doesn't make any sense, but I think that that position, that spot is open for business too. I really do think the one thing I think we all know is this, just when you think you, you know, you don't know. That sounds very Jim Morris senior.

There's no, and you never will know full Morris senior on me right there. Where's the best spot for Pennix. Where do you think if he, if you could personally place him somewhere? I think stylistically because of how Vegas has said they want to play, which is run play action, live in, not live in the pocket, but really execute from the pocket and push that ball down the field. That's Michael's thing, right? Quite honestly, it's Jayden's thing. That's why, that's why Antonio wants him. Well, I mean, they go back to our, that's right. But my phone blew up all weekend long from people saying Jayden's telling, you know, or, or his people are trying to get them out of DC to go somehow wind up with Antonio Pierce. I mean, I mean, I guess if they pull Mike Dick could move and just say, here, take all of our picks. That's what it would require.

And we'll come up there. Yeah, exactly. Or, or it'd have to be something more like this, something weird where for some reason, Jayden fell, which he's not going to, he's not going to slide like that.

Right. So, but I know this, look, no one, Antonio, like I do and talking to him, like I have, he loves the kid. Pennix or Jayden. Jayden.

Okay. He believes that this young man will be, you know, a top five, top three, top two passer, you know, probably two, three years into the league. I heard they're like, I heard they're like family and that's what they want to be together. And you know what, what's interesting about that? Like we, we know that, right. We know that the real, the real special ones in the league, regardless of position, usually have that kind of relationship with the staff, with the head coach, or with a play caller.

Like it takes something unique in order for you to really get unique in order for you to really get unique level results. And maybe that, maybe that's the kind of thing that would really spur Jayden to, to really maximize his potential. I mean, why do we think CJ, CJ Stroud right now? Do you think as good as he is? I mean, I know we talked about him last year. That was my number one guy. Him in Houston with D'Amico is perfection. Absolute perfection.

Those relationships are the, that's where you find the inches. That's where you sit. Those are the separators in Jayden in Vegas. Oh man, it ain't happening, but you could book it. But you think panics in Vegas is, I think that would be real nice. 13. Absolutely.

Absolutely. Look, I, I know that it's so wild to me that we find the things to not like that quarterbacks haven't shown that they can do to kind of hammer them with, even though we know this, the more you run, the more you move, the more you live outside of structure and outside the pocket in the NFL, exponentially your risk for getting injury goes up. But now we're dinging quarterbacks who try to live in the pocket and the greatest quarterback of all time lived in the pocket.

But now we're going, but this guy can't create outside. It's like, well, this guy's just too good in the pocket. That's all he does is stay in the pocket. It's just like, come on now. Isn't that the Mahomes effect though?

Of course it is. See, Patrick's changed the whole game. He's changed everybody's brain. Like you, you think, unless you can do what he does, you're not that good. You know, you're just not, it's like what happened with Brock Purdy last year, by the way, have you seen pictures of Brock Purdy this soft season? Is he yoked? Oh my God.

I don't know. Let's look dude. He doesn't look like he's going in campus. He's coming out.

I'm telling you what I guarantee you in 2024, he's coming out fire. And this dude looks like a bodybuilder playing quarter. I mean, it's unbelievable. He's always been built like that anyway. But anyway, another discussion, but yeah, the Mahomes effect is real unless you look like that, which is another reason why people are so enamored with Caleb.

But you know what's funny about that? Caleb at his pro day, he didn't throw one pass outside the pocket. He didn't do one roll out. Didn't do one roll to the left, throw back to the right. And I, and I was sitting there watching it going, I'll be damned. He's not thrown outside the pocket.

And afterwards I asked him, I said, was that on purpose? He goes, absolutely. He goes, I'm tired of people thinking that all I am is the highlight player. I can live in structure. That's where he wants to like, learn to be better, but it's the, it's the, it's the area where everybody feels as though he has to stay in order to be productive.

And he doesn't. Well, it's great to have you here, man. Like I said, when I texted you the other day, it's like good to have you in person, as opposed to just in a little cube and I'm thrilled to have you here and look forward to doing a draft.

I don't know where our set is in relation to yours. We can usually see you guys. We always, we can see you all over the way. We do it like a friendly way every now and then.

And check out again, Lewis Riddick on the ESPN draft coverage. Hour three, Rome a dunes egg and a lead it off right here in Detroit. Still right here on the on the Rich Eisen show on the Roku channel. How are you Rome? Good to see you.

Rome's already sitting in our, on our couch. Looking good too, man. The pilot. Yeah. Right there. Good to see her. Safe and sound, sir. Yes.

Thank you. By the way, we saw all the back and forth with you and Caleb. Did you see that yesterday? I did not. I was in route here. So what did I miss? Caleb ain't here, man. Okay. Okay. The more you can do, you never know what you needed on football field.

That's true. We saw that that Caleb tweeted out, you know, I'm, I'm a big fan of Roman dunes. He's on my plane. And then you, you read tweeted it, right? Yeah. What'd you say? I said, I'm actually the pilot this morning. So I'll get Caleb to Detroit safe. Yeah.

Hashtag was what, what was the hashtag? No souls. Yeah.

No souls have perished. Well, you know what? It'd be nice to see y'all to hook up. Yeah. We'll see. Level with it.

How about that Chicago Chicago be losing their mind. I'll tell you that for sure. That's right. Yep.

Yep. I know some people are mocking it. We'll see what happens. We will see what happens.

I know. So you're, do you do mock drafts at all? I did one one year, but you know what, like people go get so like, I think, I think people attack mock drafts more than anything in media.

Every single pick is so, I know what it is. So, you know, this isn't even worth the angst for me. I don't do them anymore.

I don't do them anymore. That's it for our number two right here on the rich eyes and show Roma dunes, a Tom Pellicero coming up hour three, the rolling stone music now podcast gets inside the biggest stories with rolling stone, senior writer, Brian Hyatt. Now here is my conversation with Jacob Knoll. Your story is, is an amazing one. And obviously you lost your dad when you're only one year old.

It was definitely a screwy way to grow up. I think that a lot of people never heard of who I am. And then they see me join this band and they must think this kid must have just been handed everything. Or nepotism kid is a gift that I have an opportunity to sing in such a big band like my father and my uncle's band sublime rolling stone music now, wherever you listen.