REShow: Michael Wilbon - Hour 1

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Find tech that's right for you by calling a Dell Technologies Advisor today at 877-ASK-DELL. And now, it's Rich Eisen. Yes it is. Welcome to this edition of The Rich Eisen Show. Live on the Roku channel, this Rich Eisen Show.

Terrestrial Radio affiliate, Sirius XM, Odyssey and more. Good to have all of you here on this very busy Monday off of a highly fascinating NBA playoff weekend. The NHL playoffs moving on and we all know the NFL schedule has been out for about four days and we've got a lot on our brain on that front. Todd Bowles, the head coach of the Tampa Bay Buccaneers who just walked in a commencement ceremony to earn his bachelor's degree over the weekend.

That happened. He's going to be joining us on this program. Of course, we're all about education here, but we also want to know who's going to be a starting quarterback for week one. Let's get out of here. And if everything else, we'll try our best to get that out of the graduate when he joins us on this program.

And Michael Wilbon of Pardon the Interruption will be on in about 19 minutes and so much to talk about with him. From the Lakers moving on, eliminating the Golden State Warriors. There will be a new NBA champion in the association this year.

And it's all about the Larry O'Bie for four teams and any of the four teams can win any of them. The Lakers can go and win eight more games by beating the Nuggets four out of the next seven or four out of the next what have you. The Nuggets can absolutely do the same to the Lakers. And I don't need to tell Chris Brockman across the aisle over there who is hoping he didn't see the Heat in the first round of the playoffs, what the Heat can do to him and his team in the third round of the playoffs. And the Heat can absolutely win four games against the Celtics in the next seven and then go and avenge their bubble defeat against the Lakers or pull it off against the Nuggets. And of course, the Celtics can do the same to the Heat. And then, of course, to anybody who wins in the West. No question about it, a wide open field.

You want to call it parody? Fine, go ahead. But this is a wide open NBA Finals, Western and Eastern Conference Finals and NBA Finals field in my estimation. Anybody can go win this thing. The Lakers clearly have LeBron and Anthony Davis. The Nuggets clearly have Jokic and Jamal Murray and the rest of that team that can put shots together. Jimmy freaking Butler, you go tell him he can't. And Kyle Lowry, who keeps finding the fountain of youth, no matter how many times Pat Riley might threaten him with no longer being on the Heat, it's unbelievable and out of bio and the rest of that team. And then, of course, the Celtics and their fake superstar, Jason Tatum. We'll get to that later on in this show. As he's showing off the Celtics socks for the radio audience, the man who called Jason Tatum a fake superstar. At the time, I was right.

I don't shy away from that. Jason Tatum with 51 last night or afternoon or whatever the heck you want to call it. 51-13-5. What a stat line taking the 50 piece that Steph Curry popped on the Sacramento Kings in a Game 7 to set the record for most points scored in a Game 7. Taking that and bettering it by one. Jalen Brown adding 25 of his own. 112-88.

The 76ers scored just 88 points and only 24 of them from Embiid and Harden combined. My sincere condolences to you. Have you lit a candle for your Sixers, T.J. Jefferson?

Have you done that? I'm lighting a candle. I'm pouring some out because my fandom is being tested right now. Like, I want to throw the towel in. Rich, I turned the game off midway through the third. I don't blame you because I just I just wasn't having fun.

So I turned on Wrestle Kingdom 10 and I watched Shinsuke Nakamura wrestle AJ Styles in one of the best wrestling matches I ever saw because I needed something to make me feel good because that game was depressing me, man. Like I was depressed. So I was like, I can't I'm not doing this to myself.

Turn the game off. I don't blame you. You missed Harden walking up the floor a couple of times. And I wouldn't say I missed it, Rich. I wouldn't say I missed it.

Well, you you didn't see it. What did you watch instead? I watched one of my favorite wrestling matches of all time. Shinsuke Nakamura versus AJ Styles. In what? Wrestle Kingdom 10. It's Japan's version of WrestleMania from 2016.

I needed something rich to make me feel good. Do you need to see the first Wrestle Kingdom one through nine to understand Wrestle Kingdom 10? You do not. You do not. Look, man, I don't blame you. As you know, watching Michigan get there, it's ass handed to. It's tough. It by Ohio State, I would I would just get on the floor and play, you know. Play card games with my kids. At least you had that right there.

A great distraction. I don't have I should maybe called over, see if, you know, Zan wanted to watch a movie with me or something. He would have been up for it. You know, he would have been up for it. I know everyone's laying at the feet of Doc Rivers because Doc has 10 Game seven losses more than. Any other coach, it's twice as many as any other coach in the history of the NBA. And anybody who is a Clipper six or sorry, no, no, no. But you've you've had a front row seat for many of these playoff collapses, up three games to one and not advancing losing games seven or in this case, games six and seven, losing at home and then blown out on the road in a series where you took Game one with a forty five piece from James Harden without Embiid.

And you still couldn't pull this thing off. And people were laid at the feet of Doc Rivers. And you know how I feel about Doc, you know how, you know, Suze feels about Doc, I know how you feel about Doc and I know how we all feel about him. Embiid gave a full throated vote of confidence for him, Harden not so much. Yeah, our relationship is OK, he says, but Harden might be out anyway. Embiid is the one who's staying.

Embiid is one of the more. Is he? I think so. Where is he going? Anywhere he wants.

He's not going anywhere. Why? It's broken.

The process is over. It was an abject failure. So why not go somewhere else and try to win? Why not go to Miami?

Why not go to New York? Those teams are close to winning. They're closer than the Sixers are right now. Well, Miami might be. The Knicks aren't. They're out.

The Heat moved on. We'll talk about that on this program. I don't think Embiid is going to go anywhere. He's one of the most populous Philadelphia athletes.

He's the MVP of the league. They're not going to let him walk. It's not it's not up to them. I know that.

Well, I mean, they could they could generationally enrich him and more than any other team can. That's the way that that's the way this thing is. Then he gets the whole Kevin Durant treatment like, oh, you can't win. So you had to go.

You know what I mean? It's like he's not going to go. Well, he definitely made a plea for more help.

I mean, this was potentially fired in the direction of Daryl Morey, who, you know, as you know, is the one who shops for the groceries. Listen to this soundbite from Embiid after again, he and he and Harden went eight of twenty nine from the floor. This is what Embiid had to say afterwards. You can't win alone. I can't win alone.

I can't. Me and James, we just can't win alone. You know, that's why basketball is played five on five. So, you know, we just need everybody to just, you know, try to keep finding ways to get better.

And, you know, we'll be fine. Eight of twenty nine shooting combined. They were a minus fifty eight combined yesterday. Just twenty four points.

Combined. So. Don't don't just look at me for saying. What does he mean by that? Damian Lillard, this is how I saw the soundbite, by the way, when I was going around Mother's Day with Susan, the kids yesterday wound up on my phone. Damian Lillard, who I follow on Twitter, he retweeted that soundbite with just a tweet going, huh?

Damian Lillard. Now you could sit here saying that's a passive aggressive way of saying you think you don't have help. Or like, hey, I'm still here in Portland. And everybody knows.

It's a five on five sport, and I don't say a word like ever or he's just like, what are you talking about? I pray for us to trade for Dame Lillard last year. I know. But Dame doesn't want to go or go because he's staying put.

Look. Again, this will be laid at the feet of Doc Rivers, and I think Doc's about to lose his job because you can't fire the players. You can't fire the players. He does have two years left on a deal. And that's what he said yesterday. I still expect to hear I have two years left on a deal. But Monty Williams is now free because I don't and and and that adds to any hot seat situation in the NBA.

How about when I text you yesterday, any hot seat situation in the NBA, you already said Monty Williams, I hope he likes what, the Phillies and cheesesteak and cheesesteaks. I mean, one of that is not bad. So I don't care about the Phillies.

But cheesesteaks are delicious. We'll find out if he's a wit, wiz, wit guy or wiz without. I don't know. I mean, unless the ownership group there doesn't have as itchy a trigger finger as Matt Ischbier clearly has in Phoenix. I mean, the guy who refused to give the ball to Jokic so famously last week just took it away from a two time coach of the year.

And he's a new owner and he didn't hire this guy and he saw another twenty five point blowout closeout at home. Last year, I don't know, is he is was he a Suns fan or he was just a fan of swooping in and taking off, kicking Robert Sarver's carcass out of the NBA? I don't know. I haven't met him. I haven't spoken to him.

I don't know. Is he a diehard Suns fan who was up there in the state of Michigan? But he might be talking to some people in town or like last year he got blown out. That's a 61 team from last year. And, you know, they decided to keep eight and they decided to run it back with Chris Paul, who once again got hurt because he's pushing 40. I mean, James Jones, the GM there, got Durant mid-season.

And in my estimation, and I was texting you guys yesterday, too, when this happened. Unless Devin Booker went to Matt Ishbia and said. This guy nobody's listening to anymore, you got to get him out of here. I don't get this one. I don't get it because because again, but this may just be me.

But I do like. The coach or manager who you can't tell if they're up by 20 or down by 20. I like those guys who also have a red ass streak who can look at somebody like Durant in the face and coach him or look at somebody like Booker or Paul and tell them on occasion.

They're not doing enough and have the cojones to do that, who can then also turn around in that mid first to second quarter conversation with an on court reporter and talk to them and turn around and go back to their team. You know, a face forward guy who is completely normal, calm, intelligent. And then turn around and be that way with the team face forward, face in.

That's what this guy, Monty Williams, looks like to me. And if I'm the Bucks. Pistons, right? You want somebody for for Team Vic if you get him shortly?

I don't know. Who else? Anybody else who wants a coach right now? I'd be all over him. The Raptors need a coach. You think it's just it's it's just one of that case of these weren't my guys.

I think that's the only thing it can be. I'm talking about people I've never met. OK, and well, I mean, that's what you do, and I know I do that for a living. So I like saying that because, you know.

I'm just sitting on a couch or sitting in a chair in front of a microphone, what have you. So I appreciate you saying that. I don't know why I feel the need to place that as a caveat. It just seems to me like an act of an impetuous owner. Like somebody who's like, I just sat in that seat where I refused to give Jokic the basketball last week. And I'm sitting there and I'm watching these people who are paying money and that is an unacceptable result at home. And that is an unacceptable result. I agree. I would not accept that as a as a governor of a team either. But my gosh, to tell Monty Williams, get out.

What in the world is that? And that adds to the. Trigger fingers, itchy or hot seat temperatures around the NBA right now. I mean, Steve Kerr. Isn't going anywhere.

He's one of the only NBA finals winners in the last four years to not lose his job. That's crazy. Is Tom Thibodeau's seat hot? I mean, that didn't look so great.

It's more Julius Randall's seat is hot with the hot New York fans. And we'll get to that insanity. Steven, they had a lot to say about that. And.

But I'll tell you what. You know, Spoelstra might coach rings around Missoula in the next couple of weeks. And his seat might be hot, too, when it's all said and done. Well, Doc should have coached circles around an interim coach in Missoula.

That didn't happen either. So he got a full time gig now. I mean, he was interim to start.

Well, we shall see. I want to take a break because we haven't even talked about John Moran either. Who was caught on the Instagram live account of a friend who's been banned from his home arena because of their actions together during this playing season.

He was on that Instagram live account brandishing a weapon again. So that's when I when I saw that and the fact that Monty Williams got fired and the fact that the Lakers bounced the Warriors and. The fact that the Sixers lost in this manner in Game seven of the Celtics, I texted Michael Wilbon saying, will you please come on Monday show? And he kindly said, yes, that's next.

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Call clickgrainger.com or just stop by. Just as the man from Pardon the Interruption and the NBA on ESPN and ABC's coverage, the great Michael Wilbon, back here on the Rich Eisen Show. How you doing Michael? Rich, I'm good. How are you?

I am doing well. Let me just jump straight into it with you. What do you take out of Eastern Conference Semifinal Game 7 in Boston? Do you take something out of it for the Celtics ability to move on or you take something out of it that the Sixers need to do something in order for them to move on?

What do you think? Well, I guess there's an ordering of the priorities, right, in terms of what we leave that with. And it's hard not to leave with looking at the Sixers and just shaking your head and saying, wow, again. And it's not that they lost Game 7, it's that they lost 6 and 7.

6 had to be the game. They played a lot better in their MVP, the league MVP. You know, Joel LMB didn't get a shot the last four and a half minutes.

I mean, that was their shot. And so I'm less, you know, I'm not going to say, I'm impressed by the Celtics because I don't think they've been as good, Rich, as we saw them last season. And I think part of it is, I don't know, the head coach's stubbornness not to use the line that they finally used with Rob Williams in there on the court in the starting lineup.

The small balls is not something I'm in love with and so many coaches and players and people in the industry are. But I think that the Celtics, the last two games, that's the Boston Celtics team that needs to show up and play against Miami or else they could be upset. But that came after, you know, Embiid, Harden, and look, I've been aware of Doc Rivers since I was a teenager because we grew up in Chicago at the same time. And people say, who do you root for?

I root for my friends. And Doc and I have been that for decades. And this is a hard one.

This is a tough one. And again, you can't talk about the failure of the Sixers without dealing with game six. That's when you have to put the Celtics away and they couldn't do it.

Yeah. And then Embiid afterwards gave Doc a very significant, I would say, vote of confidence. Harden was the exact opposite. Said, yeah, our relationship is OK. And Embiid was raving about Doc. And one would think he wouldn't if you want to ascribe the lack of shots for Embiid or the lack of, I guess, posting Embiid up when he had the advantages in game six and seven.

He would lay that, I imagine, at the coach's feet and he didn't. What did you make of Harden's, I mean, of Embiid's comments of it's five on five and him and Harden needed some help, is what it sounded like to me in that soundbite? I mean, there's a genuine affection between Embiid and Doc Rivers. And not necessarily so with James Harden. I mean, let's face it, this is not new for James Harden. How many coaches?

A half dozen? He's been difficult. He's been difficult.

In the best of times, Rich, difficult. MVP times, difficult. A failed playoff player. I mean, you know, we've seen Harden. Yesterday was nothing new. That's dotted his career in the postseason, which is double digit years now.

So, I didn't, that didn't sort of jump out at me as much. For whatever failing, and part of the failing of not taking those shots is you've got to go on and beat. I mean, you know, basketball is a player sport. And no matter how much the coach may diagram things for you and overload things for you, we hear great former players say all the time, you've got to demand the ball. And if it needs to be in the huddle, if it needs to be on the floor, him grabbing Maxie or Tobias Harris by the collar of the jersey and saying, give me the damn ball. We know that's what Shaq not only would have done, did. We know that's what Michael Jordan not only would have done, did.

We know, my God, Larry Bird used to call Kevin McHale some names we can't even repeat. That's what he did. And so, if you're MVP and it's your team, it's also your ball when you need it. And it shouldn't have to come down to any coach diagramming plays. I voted for MB this year as MVP.

I did. But that's, you know, yes. Do I want to see Doc do some things to get him beat, freed in those last few minutes in game six?

Absolutely rich, yes. That's the reputation Doc Rivers has had among players and why so many, Harden not included, want to play for him is that they think that Doc is great in those situations. And whatever happened that broke down in game six, everybody failed. But Harden seems to be, you know, I won't say that in the top of my list.

MB is the MVP. But Harden we've seen do this over and over again. It shouldn't really surprise anybody. Michael Wilbon here on the Rich Eisen Show. The sense going into game seven in Boston is that whichever team lost would be bouncing their coach.

And the sense of that was heightened by the fact that Monty Williams was cut loose by the Suns. Matt Ishbia bouncing the two-time coach of the year who also, look, I'm already going to, I've never met him. I just love the way he handles his business.

I've heard nothing but great things about him. And I understand there's a difference between personal and business. But this is a head scratcher for me, Michael.

I wonder what that firing led for you to do. Well, it's a complex one, Rich. More, much more complex than probably any other coach this year that's going to get bouncing. We know it's going to happen.

It happens this time of year. Monty Williams is just what you perceive he is. He's a gentleman, a scholar and a gentleman and a great coach, an astute basketball observer in every way imaginable. I talk about Doc Rivers and knowing Doc all my life. Monty Williams, because I work in Washington, D.C. and cover sports. Monty, I've been following Monty and knowing who he is since he was 15.

He was a teenager in D.C., which is where he grew up. And Monty Williams' reputation is as untouchable as anybody in the NBA right now. And it's been that way for years. And he's coach of the year, as you said, twice. And Chris Paul and Devin Booker love him.

And having said all that, when they were going through that loss in Game 6 themselves, down 30-whatever to Denver at home, it was the second straight year they were getting bounced out of a playoff like that. And I was on the phone between text messaging and actual phone calls with a lot of people. As we do, as you know, you do as well when these things are coming out. And I just said, Monty's going to be gone this week. Really?

And the answer is, yeah, yeah, yeah. I love him. I don't just know him. He's adored here. I'm sitting in Scottsdale, Arizona right now. He's adored here.

He really is. But there's not an outcry, Rich. People are saying they didn't like it or they're confused, like you said, a head scratcher. Rich, they lost at home, back-to-back playoff elimination games, but they were down 30-plus at the half. So something's wrong. Something's wrong.

And I thought that last year when they lost Game 7 to Dallas, Dallas, which they had owned in the first two games of that series, and they lose four straight. And I'm like, okay, what is going on here? This is not strategic.

What is happening? This is not about pick and roll, play or coverage. It's not. When basketball teams with those kinds of talent – and by the way, people who get along – the Phoenix Suns, they haven't had drama.

They don't have that. We're not talking about the Memphis Grizzlies with Ja and his situation. We're not. But they didn't figure it out.

And so they come into another year and they wind up going out the same way. And I'm just like, you know what? Matt Ischpiel, who I'm getting to know here, is a new owner, an aggressive, bold owner. He's not having this. He didn't bring Monty in. And this is not going to work.

And I say that knowing that Monty Williams will get another gig and he'll be good at that too, maybe even great at it. But this situation was like, oh boy, you can't lose back-to-back playoffs at home on your court like that. So, no, no, no.

It was anything but surprising. Now, the one thing they all should have done, and I don't know if James Jones survives this either, and he's been great at what he does and putting his roster together. Honestly, I understand the way of the world, Michael. I understand the way of winning is the most important thing. But it's not like they were losers.

And James Jones put this roster together. I mean, good Lord. I don't understand how, I guess, a different voice will help. I don't know.

I don't know. I think it's better because you can't lose like that with those players. Not like that. Remember, you're in the finals. And you're the number one seed. The Suns last year were the only team in the league that won 60 games.

I think they won 64 games last year. They're the number one seed at home up to nothing to start the series. Now, to me, and so our dear friend Stephen A. has blamed DeAndre Ayton and laid it at his feet entirely.

I'm not going there, but I'll lay it at his feet mostly. But I'm going to lay it at the feet of the people who run the team, too, because they should let him go. When Indiana matched it, they should have either traded him in advance or let him walk. Because he is the only piece that didn't work, DeAndre Ayton, as physically talented as he is. And so they should have traded him before this trade deadline. And I'm sure they wanted to. I know he was definitely included in any offense to Brooklyn for Kevin Durant.

But they didn't want him. And people know, people around the league know both of Ayton's talent, but also his pouting and his difficulty. And so that's the piece where you go, oh, wait a minute. And for letting Ayton still be there in that game, everybody's going to, not everybody, but we've seen one take down, we may see another. Michael Wilbon here on the Rich Eisen Show.

So much more to get to, so let me just jump right into the next subject matter. If you were Bob Myers of the Warriors, you do what coming off of the loss to the Lakers, who are honestly, you know, I know fans are somewhat sick of the Lakers, even though, you know, they haven't done much since the bubble. They are, if you will, the Cowboys of the NBA.

So a lot of folks get fatigued. But what they have done is remarkable. If you are the Warriors, though, you do what now?

What do you do? Well, if I'm the Warriors, I try to make sure that I can keep Bob Myers. That's number one. Bob's going to have, or has opportunities right now. And Dream Martin Green referred to that the other night. He hopes that Bob Myers stays when you're talking about his own situation.

And so, yeah, I mean, Bob's the architect of this. There's no buts about it. Although, you know, they made a couple of mistakes. Who doesn't?

What personnel people don't? In professional sports, in particular, the highest level of Bob Myers has made a lot more great decisions than mistakes. But the first thing you, the Warriors, you keep them unless you have your eye on somebody when you go, this is our next guy.

And you could, you could have that. If you're Bob Myers, you've got to figure out, in terms of spending money, because the owners, you know, the owners have talked privately about that with various people at various times, hushed tones. And look at the luxury tax bill. I'm not sitting in front of that number, Rich, but it's huge already.

They paid Jordan Poole a bunch. I don't know that that's a great decision, as it's going to turn out. Dream Martin Green is up for next, either opting in or being a free agent. What do you do at 33 years old with Dream Martin Green? So you've got a lot going on. Is Klay Thompson, first of all, you're not going to get rid of Klay Thompson, but can Klay Thompson be any more at this age with all the wear and tear on his legs?

Can he be the Klay Thompson who's going straight to the Hall of Famer on the first ballot and is one of the three greatest shooters to ever live? So you've got some big questions to answer if you're still there. And maybe this is when Bob Myers says, you know what? This has been the greatest run imaginable. And I'm going to go over here across the street because here's what they got going on.

And it could just be, he's loud. He can say, I did it. We did it.

We all did it. I love it. I mean, the last dance doesn't just pertain to the Chicago Bulls necessarily. So I don't, I personally don't think these warriors, these warriors, this group will win another championship. I don't. Would I try to put them back to keep them together?

Of course I would try. But I don't. I just think the caravan moves on. There are too many good teams out there, Rich. Look how many good teams.

You mentioned the Lakers. We've never seen in the NBA, and by never, I mean never seen a league where a half dozen teams could win a championship in a year. That's not how this sport is. That's how, that's how pro football is. It's not pro basketball. Pro basketball is about the journey of the two or three best teams. And can someone knock any or all of them off? That's pro basketball in a star driven sport.

And so I don't know the word. There's a lot of people coming, man. There's teams in small markets that are great. Oklahoma City's got a million draft picks and young players who are like a young Golden State probably right now.

And somebody's going to get, somebody's going to get rich with Victor Wembanyama in about, in about 24 hours, too. And, you know, and we haven't even, we haven't mentioned the Nuggets. You know, you mentioned DeAndre Ayton looking the way that he did. Maybe Jokic can make virtually anybody look like that, you know, and the rest of the shooters around him and the rest of that team.

You're right. I mean, anybody, anybody can win it right now. I mean, you really can.

So who do you put... There's so many teams that can. Yeah, the Heat, too.

I'm not going to say nobody paid attention, but we didn't pay attention at that level that we do because we got to get proven first. But Jokic is a marvel, Rich, and you're, you're West. And I know you, you, you can still watch even, even with the hours you keep, you can still see, see the best players across the country. But back East where I am, you know, sometimes.

I split my life now. People don't know Jokic because it's because he's playing it at best at nine, you know, starting at 930 Eastern a lot of nights. And in the West, you know, probably, you know, 50 of his games are later than that. They don't see him. You can't, you can't learn to appreciate Jokic from a sports center.

You just know how it works. You got to see him and people are going to really get to see him for the first time. And I can't wait to see what the reaction is to him. And again, I voted for him B this year. But a couple of years ago, I voted for Jokic. And, you know, right now Jokic is the best player on the planet. But yes, above Antti Kumpo, above Embiid, above Durant, above everybody, Jokic for the way he's played this postseason. Last one for you, Michael Wilbon. And if there was any question whether John Marant learned his lesson from, from the suspension that he suffered and watching his team clearly go down in flames. And again, I know how well the team would frequently perform without him. But we understand his, his value to the Memphis Grizzlies and to the NBA if he plays to his potential without anything else going on. If we thought he learned his lesson, without a doubt, he did not. And I don't get it.

I lay this right to you and say, what do you make of this? Help, help me with this one, Michael. Well, there's not going to be a palatable answer for anybody or from anybody or for anybody because it's sad to see this kid.

And I say kid because what is he, 24? Potentially destroying his career. And, and to start with, hundreds of millions of dollars.

That's what's at stake for him. Remember, Nike went ahead with that launch of that shoe. And I'm just, I don't know what his contract is for with the shoes. But I mean, Derrick Rose made 200 million dollars when he was MVP, you know, 15 years ago.

Not 15, 2011, so 12 years ago. So what is Josh's contract going to Derrick Rose make 200 million? Okay, call it 250. Conservatively. Then he's got a soft drink. Well, he's the face of that.

Powerade. They hadn't had any athlete on the bottle or lead their marketing campaign in years. They just returned to that. Now, they went ahead with those launches after the first disturbing situation. I can't imagine that's going to be the case now.

We're talking about hundreds of million rich. So if there's nothing else, you would say to him, dude, what are you doing? Just what do you what do you think you're doing? You signed your name to this.

I don't care how young you are. You signed your name is what are you doing to yourself? Your career, your life.

And, you know, if you talk to it, I have people in law enforcement and people in security. They'll tell you they're not surprised by yesterday at all. They thought, given who he's with, given what they know about digging into his life, that this is going to happen again and again and again until he fundamentally changes. And they don't know that he will. And the notion that he got it is you perfectly point out, of course, he doesn't get it. He didn't care. Now, I think he gets it in terms of he just thinks he can't get away with it.

He doesn't give a damn, Rich. If you listen to if you listen to him postgame. There's a lot you can learn because you're talking about a really young guy in the moments after. In the moments after when they're emotional or their heads are somewhere else, their emotions are somewhere else.

John Moran is completely and utterly engaged and fascinating in those situations. That requires intellect. OK, so he he's not without it.

He doesn't give a damn. And that's my that's that's my conclusion. And it is my conclusion drawn with the help of people, again, that I've talked to who have access to the information. And you read The Washington Post reporting weeks before this happened.

It's predictable. And going to Florida to be some facility for a week. So what? That's just show. That's just PR. And so he's got to be suspended indefinitely, at least. Will that change him?

I don't know. I don't know him that well. I have a perception of him. And I know the people who really are invested in him have a have a deep perception.

And he's such an asset that the league now like the league should be moving on from LeBron's staff, which is obviously still great. They should be moving on from I mean, talking about promoting and marketing. They should be transitioning to, you know, they've already got on the couple in mid-career to Jokic and to John Moran.

They're bright, shining stars in the 20s. But how can they include they came through John Moran? With handguns, whatever he decides he's going to. And not listening and not giving a damn, basically thumbing his nose at anything and everything. So the NBA is in a sad place with that now. John Moran's in a sad place with that. We've seen sport in general. We know what happened at a particular couple of universities, you know, with that. And it's man, man, what, what, what comes next?

What do you do to ask to try to answer your original question? The league has to start with suspending him for real. Not eight games for real.

Not twenty five. More for real. And then demanding certain things of him. And that starts with the commissioner and it starts with not being lenient on this particular situation. He can't afford it.

The league can't afford it. You are the best, Michael Obon. Truly, truly, truly. It's kind of you. It's kind of you. It's in your voice.

Honestly, you and Stephen A. and watching you guys with the rest of the crew. Awesome. Love it. Make me smarter.

Make me always drop the remote. I'm interested in what you guys say and how you do it. And then when you come on here, I never take it for granted. Thank you. Appreciate it.

Man, I appreciate it. And, you know, as we get ready to hit the road for the Western Conference Finals, which, which, which our network has exclusively, of course, Turner has the East. And it's going to be interesting, you know, a couple of weeks coming up, both on the court with those games and off the court with Miranda. And so, you know, to help people like stop doing what they're doing and just watch this do it.

I think there's a lot of appreciation and a lot of growth from the audience, patron standpoint to watching him do this thing. And so I can't wait for that. I've been I meant I wasn't going to call you a couple of times.

I know how busy you are. No, please. With the Bears, with the Bears being in the position they were in this past this past month. I was obsessed with draft picks and yield trade potentially as I've ever been, because my team never picked that high. I mean, not even they pick nine. Yeah, they picked that high.

But of course, that nine was was augmented by the trade they made. So I'm still you know, I was ready. I was ready for the draft of the way.

I've never been ready for the draft hoping that the Bears become more relevant. I can tell the schedule maker doesn't exactly think they're relevant. Well, I got a couple of national TV games. They did a couple.

They got a couple. I think they may outplay that. I think the field is actually going to take a big jump. Big jump this year.

This season. And look, that's coming from a crazy lunatic fans perspective. But I like what they did. And I love Fielder. I'm glad we kept him and didn't trade him. Agreed. I'm not saying other people in this draft won't be worthy, but I'm ready to ride with Justin Fields for a while. So I'm I'm I'm wired over that.

And now transitioning back into Jokic versus Anthony Bates. Well, I know you're a renaissance man with many friends. When you're here in L.A., let's connect.

That's not an L.A. That is an L.A. thing to say to people. But I truly do mean it. All right. That's going to happen. I would like to. I'm coming out there tonight. Great. We're going to do all the games in L.A. OK, so don't be surprised you get a call. Excellent. Please do.

I'll hit you up. And and best everybody. Thanks for the call. Thanks, Rich. Michael Wilbon.

Check him out on NBA, the NBA, on ESPN and ABC's coverage. And of course, pardon the interruption on the worldwide leader. Lots to get to after what he just said. Wow. So let's take a break. Eight four four two oh four. Rich number two, Todd Bowles, Tampa Bay Buccaneers head coach, joining us an hour to overreaction Monday and so much more. Eight four four two oh four.

Rich number to dial. I just played drop three that we have here because Chris is wearing a Hawaiian shirt just to bring everyone in the radio up to speed. I asked what's with the rich eyes and show the what's what the rich eyes and show wearing of the Andy Reid collection. You said you were celebrating the Philadelphia Sixers trip to Cancun. We stink. It's over. That was last week when you were down three games to two.

Wish that were true. And we have just confirmed from the NBA that Jason Tatum's fifty one point game in game seven is not the record for most points scored in an NBA game seven by a real superstar. That still belongs to Steph Curry.

Got it. Well, he's he's won a race. Stephen A said Kawhi is the biggest fake superstar. No, right now, Tatum is the biggest fake superstar. So that means in terms of most points scored by real superstars in a game seven, according to Chris, still belongs to Steph Curry, not the fake superstar we're seeing on the screen here. Stephen A said Kawhi is the biggest fake superstar.

No, right now, Tatum is the biggest fake superstar. By the way, did you notice the two key words in that sentence? Right now. Thank you.

Not anymore then, huh? Thank you. You're writing out him. You're writing out him. Hey, if you're going to get me, get me real. OK. Don't get me with this fake stuff. Come on. Your pre-pro drops from my rant last week.

My rant was dead on last week. When you were down three games to two. Exactly.

And Tatum looked like me out there. OK. Drop two. Show up. What are you doing? Show up.

What are you doing? There you go. Hey, am I good or what? You're good. Come on.

Am I good or what? You're just you're you're OK. I understand that. But that the root of fanatic is fan.

I understand that. So wait. So he's now back. He's back.

He loves him again. Tatum had 50 yesterday. Fifty one. Fifty one.

Oh, I didn't see that because I was watching Shinsuke Nakamura give AJ Styles the good vibration because I wasn't watching that game. OK. And watch it. Don't take don't take it. Please just let let let him sit on the griddle here for being a guy who totally abandoned ship. We stand on three. We think it's over. It's over. You sink. It's over.

That sounds like you have abandoned ship. You were you were you were going to your equivalent of Wrestle. What?

What is it? Wrestle Kingdom. You were going to Wrestle Kingdom 10. That was your version of it. We stink. It's over.

And now I'm talking about Philly. Look at this. Oh, OK. OK. Fantastic moves.

I win. That's it. T.J., you missed. Tatum's 50 first point came on a step back over and beat. Oh, was it? Yeah. Yeah.

Like I said, at that point, there was a boomerang by Nakamura. Congratulations to Steph Curry. You still have the record for most points scored in the game seven by a real superstar. You love Lala Kent on Vanderpump Rules. Now get to know her on Give Them Lala with her assistant Jess. What you did not see is when Raquel arrives and she wants to talk to me, I made her sit in a corner, explain, sat in a corner booth all by herself in the dark, waiting for to talk to you, waiting for me to finish dancing to 50 Cent. It's my birthday. Sit in a corner. Give Them Lala wherever you listen.