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The Narrow Path 6/17

The Narrow Path / Steve Gregg
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June 17, 2020 8:00 am

The Narrow Path 6/17

The Narrow Path / Steve Gregg

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June 17, 2020 8:00 am

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Welcome to the narrow path radio broadcast my name Steve Greg and were live as we usually are for our with an open phone line so you can call it.

If you have questions about the Bible or the Christian faith or if you have a different view from the host want to talk about any of those things. It looks to me like our lines are full at the moment that I give the phone number anyway because if you have the file Patty you will be able to get in later in the program as lines of course to open up in the course show the number is 844-484-5737 that's 844-484-5737 and that we must go directly to the line since their fault. This scholars from Tennesseans either Cole or Coley, depending on the language Tennessee.

I welcome to the narrow path on Mark J. Howard limited by human well it can be.

It can be because it's not as if faith is itself some kind of magical power, but it is the case that God often holds out for faith before before doing something. For example, he would like everyone to be saved but not able to say why not look as they don't believe the lack of faith prevents the blessing of God from coming to them and whether this is just because God has chosen that it would be that way or or that God is somehow you know limited in his policies that he cannot do you know much. If there's not much faith would be perhaps a debated point. I suspect it has more to do with God's policies because God does do miracles on people who don't have any faith.

I know this I mean I've I remember back when Catherine Coleman whom I had great suspicions about selling the truth that her ministry but when she would have meetings that people come up and testify that they got healed in the meeting and they say I didn't believe this. I didn't believe you know it is real then I felt something healed. Now I believe so.

It's like if their testimony is true, then they got healed without believing I know one woman who was a personal friend that I know the story to be true, who had cancer throughout her body and she was had no faith that she be healed, that she said she felt the Lord told her she didn't die of cancer that she's got a day there was a date that she knew.

She said she was going to die and the she didn't want to be prayed for.

She wanted to go be with the Lord. She was glad to glad to die for the Lord our God died of cancer because she felt was Lord and shoulders. His will and she had no confidence that she be healed and get on that date when it counted to date came she was healed she had her body, and although I lost track of her years ago I did see her and her husband.

Five years later she was still cancer free. So I don't and come back in five years. So here's here's a woman who had a zero phase that should be healed and you got healed anyway so I know God can heal. Whether it is faith or not and therefore that probably stacks the deck in terms of the argument to say that God didn't heal because people didn't have faith. It's not so much that God can't, God can heal unilaterally if he wants to, but that he chooses not to now, and says that Jesus could do no mighty works there course, Jesus could do nothing more than what his father had him do so. If the father didn't want to reward faithlessness with miracles. Then Jesus couldn't do that because Jesus can do anything except his father said to do so I would say there are times when, for lack of faith God will not do something that he could do, or that he would otherwise do remember James said you have not because you ask not. That is if you don't have the faith to ask God for something, then you won't have it even though you would have if you had asked us what that means you don't have because you didn't ask me, and she would have if you did so. You know something God can't do whatever he wants to unilaterally with your faith or not, but God's has a policy with people that he wants them to trust him and he rewards faith okay.

All right. Thank you for your cover.

God bless you I Jacob from Lakewood, Washington. Welcome to the narrow path. Thanks for calling. I have been The evidence of payment and all right Jacob.

Well, as far as unfulfilled messianic prophecy. I don't know of any except those that Jesus himself and his disciples made his first Old Testament messianic props at another I think I think Jesus fulfilled all the Old Testament predictions about the Messiah, but there were new predictions.

He made in his disciples made that have to do with his future second coming. So I believe that his second coming is still future, and of course there's predictions about that going back to well.

I believe Matthew 25 verse 31 through 46. The parable of the sheep and the goats would would pertain to that. I think perhaps is the prophecy about the wheat and the tares and the harvest at the end is probably reference the second coming strikes me as such, the Angels predicted that Jesus would come back in acts chapter 1 he said the same Jesus, whom you start go will come back in the same way you saw him leave was a prediction.

And of course Paul repeated these this hope also in places like first Thessalonians 4 and other places. First Timothy six prescriptive 15 and other places. I believe these are the prophecies about Jesus second coming.

In these prophecies.

I think are restricted to the new test. I don't think these proxies were made in the Old Testament, and I realize there are prophecies in the Old Testament lots of people apply to the second coming of Christ like. Zechariah 14 and Zechariah 12. Things like that but in my opinion those those have their fulfillment in A.D. 70, but but I do believe there are unfulfilled prophecies in the New Testament of the second coming of Christ.

Okay Jacob, thank you cobra Ryan from Des Moines, Iowa. Welcome to the narrow path.

Good to hear from you. I'm well thanks. Good question today. Have you heard of work and maybe speak to the idea that 2334 normal or Jesus father forgive them for they know not what they do is not included in some of the oldest manuscripts or has been omitted, the manuscript can you speak to that might look up online and it way over my head all degree talk so sure that's the simple truth that some manuscripts have it and some don't. And it's been argued that the oldest men's groups. We have do not have that line father forgive them. They don't know what they do and therefore they say since later men's scripts do in the earliest ones don't.

That perhaps Jesus didn't say that, and the older the later men's trips added, but it's very difficult to know if Jesus didn't say such a thing.

Why anyone would add it unless they had either some old older manuscripts at the time that are not available to us that contained or else because it was so remembered from some other reliable source and then they would write it in, but I think it's more likely it's not the kind of thing. I think that they would fabricate in fact, Bart Herman, who of course is not a Christian but he brings this point up and he says that's he thinks that earlier transcripts had it and it was left out of the main scripts that are our oldest manuscripts because he said that he thought that someone was anti-Semitic and they didn't want that verse enter because because it looks like Jesus, forgive the Jews and so he's suggesting it would seem he's suggesting that older than our oldest man trips are man trips the didn't have it, or did have the did have it and then I got left out of the Alexandria tax and then it was found again in the later management and it's a very complicated theory, but we don't really know more than we know and what we do know is we have some very old manuscripts and some that are not quite as old. There's probably a couple centuries between the oldest ones in the next oldest one sent the very oldest ones do not have that prayer in them and in the sum of the monster couple centuries later. Do not again many times people reason. Well, it is not in the oldest manuscripts, then, is not authentic and was added later.

But we have to realize that the oldest manuscript we have are not the first main scripts that existed and there's there's a number of cases where church fathers quote something or another.

That's not in our oldest man trips but are in later transcripts of ours but the church fathers are themselves older than our oldest main scripts so our oldest man trips are the result of copying several generations, and it's impossible that this prayer was in fact in the vehicle very original fluke and a couple manuscripts left it out by accident.

For some reason maybe. Maybe their coffee they were working from the smeared and they couldn't read or whatever, but that other copies preserved and that's why it shows up in so many of the later manuscripts because it was preserved through another line of coffee.

It's a textual criticism is a complex thing and you know it's it's many people oversimplify it and say well if the oldest man will just go with the oldest manuscripts if they differ in any particular with the ones that were made later will assume the ones were made later art are the ones that were corrupted by something being added, but that's not necessarily the case, and we've got far more of the main scripts that included that of those that don't. Even though the ones that do include are quite as old but there were manuscripts older than the oldest ultrasound and perhaps implement scripts that abundantly preserve the same may well be root representing a true original that we don't have any more sites.

It's unknown you know we do know that to forgive your killers is something that at least is supported by right even Stevens testimonies that we also if Jesus did or didn't say this. Stephen did and therefore and he is an exemplar for the faithful. Chris yet to so we have the same thing him. I read a lot about how you was a writer and that you could pick up on very similar similar expressions and sayings and in the teachings and other writings and acts and things like that so that it was consistent with with with the teachings of Christ, like that so that's helpful to get think yes okay I appreciate your call. I'll my screen did something strange studio. I seem to have lost sight of last of the screen. I don't know if you just have to reopener what there's something missing for hit cancel their something of I'm talking to student here.

Something a box appeared on my screen that covered up what the yes okay I'm back I got it back somehow on some window popped up and covered up the information I needed. Okay, we have it now. Strange things happen on computers so okay thank you Ryan for that call. If rain friend. I guess it is from us from somewhere online. He's a truck driver is next. Welcome to the note neuropathic for calling. I think it was my question is the 12 names of the disciples. Matthews began to then email it to Dan aware users name disappear. He took his life. And then Peter waited in the first seconds I'm in third or fourth chapter and act. What is the name that is today. I mean if I was going to memorize the names of the 12, but I'm always I mean I had not been able to. I need help with the will would it be the whale today right well that the 12th one is Matthias and we have that acts 126 it says they cast line in the lots on Matthias and he was numbered with the 11 apostles he replace Judas so I numbering the 12 apostles.

Matthias is numbered with the $0.11 so he be the 12 foot okay that's what I was nothing.

He almost did nothing after that. Well, let me clarify that some people say, well, Matthias was not God's choice and that they think may think maybe Paul was but they say it wasn't his choice because we never read of Matthias again after that book of acts. That's not entirely true, because in chapters 2 and four we read that great signs and wonders were wrought by the apostles meeting the 12th and and that the and that they can the 12 gave testimony to Jesus resurrection with we find these kinds of statements and later an action and were already told by Luke that Matthias is in that group so we really don't have any information after chapter 1 we don't have any of the apostles named by name, except Peter and James and John and then of course Paul and his and Barnabas is also referred to as an apostle, but yet Paul was certainly not possible to he is not a replacement for Judas, the 12 I believe Jesus had said to the 12 you'll sit on 12 thrones judging the 12 tribes of Israel being that their ministry is primarily as it says, and asked in Galatians chapter 2 the 12 had a mystery to the circumcision or to Jews where's Paul and his team according to Galatians 2 were recognized as another apostolic group directing their efforts toward the Gentiles, so we have a team of apostles that are going to be related to the Jewish mission and a team related to the Gentile mission and Paul is on the second team Matthias made up Judas's deficiency there on the first guided all right at think I know you got fired because I will get you that I think because in the past. I think I was gonna follow our teachers in our church that seems to be confusing that we're putting all is the number 12 are the one that took the place and and I want and I wanted to make sure that what happened to Mattias within the know I will. I think I'm a huge fan of Paul. He's on I'm right front on the present of his fan club but so is Luke and his a look was Paul's biggest fan you can tell by the fact that he wrote a book about the early church and the second whole half of the book is about Paul so know that Luke loved and admired Paul but Luke doesn't tell us that Paul was a replacement for Judas, which is interesting if you thought if he or Paul thought that that was the case that that Luke would simply write they chose Matthias and he was numbered with the 11 and and it never mentions, but they really kinda jumped the gun because God had Paul in my did. I mean there's no question in Luke's mind that Paul is an apostle and so is Barnabas's companion, but they are not numbered with the 12 yeah okay thank you so mad and you are my hero. I hope you never go away. Well, you truck drivers are my hero because I can't eat food if you guys on drive or can get you continue we all play a role okay. God bless you brother. Let's talk to Joe from Tacoma, Washington Joe, welcome to the neuropathic for calling. Probably one of the greatest calls and I question and I was reading the Gospel of John. I got to verse and I thought repetitive something else like extra or else. In the beginning the Word and the Word was with God and the Word was God in the beginning with God sight always hanging over my head like you know to me and I was wondering if you had some something that while I sit together is repetition in this opening prologue of John and we have numbered Jewish writers often use repetitious phraseology that's very common. For example Jewish poetry for emphasis and he says okay that the word was with God, then says he was in the beginning with God. He's already said he was in the beginning and the news of Kaiser. It is a repetition. But then it shouldn't surprise skittering. I don't know what that's was causing that approach on hold so we don't have those things that the third verse has repetition introduces all things were made through him and without him nothing was made that was made. So it's kind like him the same thing twice and it's a fairly Hebrew way of of writing to emphasize things by repetition and I think that's probably all that's really going on in verse two, we can see that that's pretty much the case in verse three that there is repetition of the same thought twice and it looks to me like verse wanted to repeat one of the thoughts of one of the thoughts of first chapter of verse 1R is repeated verse two. I don't know that I don't think it's trying to add new information if that's what running it is, it does have some additional meaning that we don't know about that, and in my opinion it's it's just a stylistic thing that many Jewish writers use in repetition and I think the gospel John actually is quite a lot of that in it.

That's just kind of the way John writes I believe, all right, brothers, hazard your phone cut out. I'm sorry good talking to you see Bruce from Whittier.

Welcome to the neuropathic for calling my call.

I don't know I really have a question that dad yesterday. APS came up on your show and I'm just really really sick and tired of these APS that are offended by something that they believe doesn't exist. We had that guy up in San Francisco 10 years ago was able to get the cross out the California shield his name escapes me right now but I tried to call the governor's office many times to see how much it cost to change all that stationary course California. What a weak state. They could've just said that across the + get out.

It's a done deal. A true atheist cannot be offended by something that doesn't exist.

Well I II would tend to agree with you, I would say that they would probably say something like this is not the God offense and since God doesn't exist. It's that so many of our countrymen who vote on policy and have something to say about education and things like that and who therefore have an effect on our culture. So many people are foolish enough to believe in God that this is what we were trying to eradicate the return get rid of religion and I think that's how they would answer.

I think though that you are probably more correct than they are out of it, and given that answer the probably telling the truth but I think that in many cases the bitterness that they exhibit is.

It exhibits something more than just your concern because frankly I don't really see why anyone should be emotional in their disagree with Chris Chase's Christians never heard anything as matter fact leaf in the Bible has made us the strongest, most prosperous, and frankly, I think the most one of those virtuous nations. I don't know if there's any more so, but we give more to the poor. We've reflected more out of poverty we sent more relief to disasters. I mean we are weak we build our enemies up after a war like you know we rebuild Japan and so forth. And I mean there's frankly America has its faults, and I certainly don't have any opinion that is a perfect nation because the promise is made up of people and there aren't any perfect people, but it seems to me that where Christianity has had actually her America has done a lot of good. It's when it follows Christian principles of mentality and where does harm.

It's when it doesn't follow them mean any objective observer would notice that when you read the teachings of Jesus. If a country or a person or family or any other group of people if they follow Jesus said, it can be a better world and a little later a big way. Depending on how much they follow Jesus there is no question the Christian has done nothing to to hurt the world. Jesus is harmless to even to sinners.

The Bible says holy and harmless and separate from sinners, but you know when people get really angry at Christianity or Christ or the Bible. It seems to me that they've kind of stepped out of their social concern of the faith they claim to have an into irrationality and hatred and yet when you read Richard Dawkins or Christopher Hitchens are some of these atheists that made a lot of bucks writing books about atheism background 2006 there's bitter and angry that they're not just there, not just disagreeing basic people who aren't atheists very office, especially Christians and the other people believe in God choose Christian so forth.

They usually are glad to have a rational and hitless conversation about the existence of God with an atheist I don't if an atheist called me. I certainly have no I would get excited about them and I wouldn't have any hate toward them, but when you find atheist do have hatred toward religion. You just know that there's something more than social concern here. There's more like a personal grievance they have and I think probably that's that's the point you're trying to make. Also here. I appreciate your call. Richard from San Diego.

Welcome to the neuropathic for calling. Thank you so much. I just want to show you on Facebook and you and your wife make a lovely couple and I have a question concerning the missing years of Jesus from the time he was born at 12 those missing years and the time when he was 1230. What is your take on that was not like the years are missing is not like a time warp insist that the record doesn't see any reason to record what Jesus did. From age probably about eight show one to age 12. Apparently there wasn't anything that was worth recording for the purpose of mimicking the gospel he just wrote was raised as a child in the home after age 12 course we have that one incident of him talking with the teachers in the temple which is pretty interesting, but after that he didn't do anything worth mentioning it in terms of the kingdom of God. Apparently until he was about 30 and that's when he started his public ministry. Until then, the Bible indicates he worked in the carpenter shop in an obscure town so there wasn't a lot to report, so it's not like the years are missing. It's like the record just everyone who writes history has to decide what what's worth mentioning was not worth mentioning. And apparently unless you write, you know, in the same endless amounts of paper and ink and time to write you want to see you want to be selective and say okay what's what's the most important thing for you to communicate here so I think the thing that those years which is not very important. Nothing happened worth repeating shapes are called. I need take a break here but where we have another half hour ahead were not going away. So don't you go away if you want to calling in the second half hour.

We now have lines open and were able to talk to at that time to be about one minute from now in that minute I want to take some time to let you know the narrow path is listener supported now. I've been telling you this week not to contribute through PayPal. We've been receiving gifts through PayPal for years and then last few weeks they've been messes up but we just were notified that that things may be getting better as we may have hope for PayPal in the near future. I will let you know more as we know more if you like help us down there you go to our website. The narrow path.com and look at the tablets is donate and help us out.

I'll be back in 30 seconds. So don't go away.

Hebrews tells that do not forget to do good and to share with others and share the near at hand with family and friends. When the show is over today until one and then there.com they can learn and enjoy your teachings blog article teachings and archives of all the narrow path, radiation, and be sure to tell them to tune into the show here on the radio chairlift noted the narrow path and do good luck back to the narrow path radio broadcast. My name is Steve Greg and we are live for another half hour taking your calls. If you'd like to be on the program with your questions about the Bible and the Christian faith or your points of disagreement with the host. Feel free to call me at 844-484-5737 that's 844-484-5737 and I might just add that in the last week or so, a couple of given a couple of lectures that have been videoed in their heart and they are printed on our Facebook page are posted. Not printed but posted on Facebook pixie. I'm an older generation with user terminologies discussed but there's a video lecture of me talk about Bart Urman, whom I mentioned in the previous half hour. Who is the agnostic Bible scholar who trusted her debunk.

Basically, the reliability of the New Testament I gave a lecture about him and his ideas and that's posted is video at our Facebook page and there is also a lecture I gave it somebody else's request on justice and social justice and what's the difference between real justice and the movement of social justice and that's, I believe, up there to the Facebook page. If you have never been there. It says Steve Greg, the narrow path that's what you're look for Steve Greg. The narrow path and in those videos are there at last time I looked I don't I don't really post things like that very much side but I don't pay attention, but I believe there posted now our lives are full story, go ahead and talk to Neil from Nelson in Fort Worth, Texas hi Nelson, welcome to the narrow path. Thank you to call. I just never question hang up at the last question we assume Jesus was a carpenter he knew about the death of gap.

Or whatever. You know that unaccounted detail in line. You know, we assume is a carpenter because later on when he was doing ministries that is not the carpenter's time right yeah and that from right writing Mark says the carpenter, but I think Matthew says the carpenter's son right yeah now the Lord carpenter's on anyway. Thank you also to them. Jesus grew up in favor and in something else with mankind and with favor with God you know says he grew in and, in wisdom and stature and favor with God and man.

Now that's helter-skelter form and then it many first read the Scripture. There this date is fulfilled in your ears.I sale you know that as his custom lots. I believe writing he was read the Scriptures so so as a Jewish boy we can Polident assume that he did this very 18 hears you 1230 now you mean you every every every Sabbath, from trading on mean every Sabbath yeah and he's doing his routine every year, and he was doing. I doubt everything. I doubt that that was true because I don't know that the rabbis and the synagogue presidents would have a young boy doing that when it says in in when he grows up and is 30 years old says as his custom was he winning the synagogue and read. I think that was that was the custom of his ministry after he started his ministry.

He went to bed to what you know, I'm really not sure how far back the bar mitzvah goes, but if if it was still, it has been practiced by the Jews at that time that I would expect.

He did one more final question is the carpenter concept. He was really a stonemason as well because that's all he had not been for houses, no houses made of wood except furniture but the headstone houses. Maybe Jesus was a boat builder to concept carpenter would comes in. You think he was a stonemason read some of the commentary that he used to go over to another city where they were always doing stonework masonry think it was Capernaum or some city that speculation. We don't know, on average, in honor of Kay. I've read a number of people try to tell us what the word carpenter in the Greek means apparently means a craftsman who could do a lot with a few tools and he might've worked with stone in my work with wood, but the tradition from the second century from Justin Martyr is that he worked with wood and that his that his shop according to Justin Martyr, a specialized or my mentor. Truly Justin Martyr, one of the very early church father said that Jesus shop, specialized in ox yokes which would be a wooden bar fits over the neck of oxen to attach them to the job of pulling a cart or something so there is some testimony from the early church that Jesus made ox yokes in the shop which would be wood, but most possibly quite capable of doing. You know, and a number of of other kinds of projects as well. It would be speculative. Okay.

Thank you for your call Derek from Detroit, Michigan. Welcome to the neuropathic for calling so my question relating he would hold the life story and make a choice on what they record what they don't currently during those times. There was nothing of consequence to say no more about roaming we know about more more about Roman civilians and we do not know about more about Peter Roosevelt and we knew about you so I'm just wondering how the it seems like it very easy for you to to know forgo that and I'm just wondering if you just like Satan, the word end and that's why it little consequence to something greater. Well, I'm just I just answered. According to common sense and author is writing simply story includes the things that he thinks are important to the story.

Now Luke is the only person gives us anything from Jesus, youth, and that is the single story of one is 12 years old having a conversation with them in the temple, and that's in Luke chapter 2 and we know that Luke had access to Mary because she was in the church and frankly that the birth stories that he gives of Jesus in the first two chapters are from Mary's point of view if if Mary felt like there was some more historical information that was value or she told Luke more information and he didn't think it was suited to his purpose. Then then that would just an author has to make choices that's that's not my opinion that's anyone who knows who writes you can't write everything that ever happened so you choose what you think is important your purpose. It seems clear that the three of the four Gospels didn't give us anything about the childhood of Jesus really and only and two of them did he mention his birth, but all four of them talk about the three and half years that he was in ministry. That's apparently what they all agreed was the most significant thing to report. Yeah right.

We do have more information at the childhood of certain people.

Probably we probably know Martha childhood of Sir Winston Churchill and Abraham Lincoln, George Washington, that we do of the childhood Jesus that does mean the more important just means the things in their adult life didn't so greatly eclipse the importance of things in their youth that are, or maybe just have biographers who write longer biographies include more but I knew the importance of Jesus to be determined by the things that are recorded of him and that would be largely a few years at the end of his life.

And of course a couple of the Gospels include his his birth stories, but that's just an observation is not a theory you know it. Young Jesus was under son and know it makes it easier to relate on the new lease for me and needed a tangent that I can go on record about looking at things that don't have answers.

I know Don know when. If you do. Carpenter right.

I'm sure he met him with a hammer now know intruding curse, but you know like unite finale. Anecdotal account like he had a sense of humor.

You know, like those kinds of things that are no earthly lot out of story Internet need what makes you more human correct about. I mean, when we meet Matthew and Mark and Luke and John maybe can raise a complaint with me then demanding that the they didn't, they did what they did and we have what we have it on something else. It is interesting people.

People are often curious about those things and not enough so that some second and third century writers who were called the Gnostic gospel writers are they actually created stories of Jesus childhood their goofy stories and medications even have them striking some of his childhood friends dad because of their in impiety and their lack of belief in him when he was a child so I mean you people can make up stories. I'd rather have no made-up stories, and all you even if I don't have any filler for the years he was a carpenter. I just to make sure that I had stories about his adult life that are true and but it's a temptation. Many have the right appreciate your call and talk to Cedric from Corvallis hi Cedric, good to hear from you again. I've always been not listening to your recorded shows are not able to list so calling and asking about divorce and I was surprised by the answers that you get your answer and I wonder if these factors in his call were would've made a difference in how you answer you asked him whether or not it is his wife was leaving and he said yes. Lung unbeliever and that he was the adulterer in the relationship and that 10 years earlier and asked the question is Mary and didn't sound like he had any communication with her in those 10 years, nor did he think that she had been involved in some wondering within 10 years, or with the length of time have precluded him, tell him go back and ask her now is a good thing to include yeah I mean I I consider that she had grounds for divorce. He was the adulterer she divorced him and therefore she had grounds in there for the marriage was over. If she had wanted to. She wanted to stay married to him. She could have that she didn't you know and therefore I believe that she had the right to dissolve the marriage.

I also believe that if a marriage is rightfully dissolved. If it's if it's justly dissolved. Then both parties are single.

It's I believe when remarriage is forbidden is when the first marriage is not been dissolved adequately or justly so that if a person leaves their spouse for no good reason and remarries are committing adultery because they're still married and got site to be to the original marriage but when there's been fornication as Jesus called it in in a divorce based on that. I believe that's a legitimate divorce in a legitimate divorce dissolves the marriage and I believe it releases both parties from that marriage you can't really have a covenant relation for only one person's bound to it and the others not so if if if one party's list from the coven. I think both are and you're right, I think you did a great thing for him to make another attempt to make another pass. 10 years later with Chris I don't I did, in essence, I don't know how many contacts he'd had with her during those 10 years, but whether there are more things together more things he could've asked for more information gotten from her right.

Your answer was state but question seemed to be in it because talked about getting taken for all for all of his money in the first divorce and everything seemed to be avoiding going to the states so that that wouldn't happen again struck me. He was already before even remarrying. He was already divorce.

Yeah, poor, and I was surprised that you say to him early suggest to him. Maybe primary concern. He shouldn't be thinking about marriage. Yeah, well, you're right. I don't remember the call.

I don't member any part of because I don't know what I said what he said that I'll trust you under represented correctly yeah I agree with you. I don't know what I said to her didn't say that II that's my impression too if he's thinking about divorce already before the remarries he's not ready to remarry. April 17 about the nine minute mark. The last thing you talked about church takeover issuing marriage licenses and that if someone breaks the marriage outside of God's word that the offending party with the close-knit toothbrush you know any churches or fellowships that are actually doing well II don't think they don't know very many churches that I think are doing much biblical manner, but I mean, some may be. I know that there are churches. The first ones I heard about many years ago were in the South that are yeah Covent Garden covenant marriage is not, I don't know how those are working out. I just know that they were trying to approximate something more biblical in licensing marriage is in preventing wrongful divorce self-worth. It seems to me the one weakness of the of the churches alone licensing their marriages is that they can say okay were not to grant the divorce in this case, because there's no grounds for divorce or there is grassroot yes yes that's on me that a person is still good to say so it seems like if the church did something like that, they might have to do something illegal.

Additionally, like you have some kind of a some kind of contract is some kind of content other than what we have is a traditional marriage contract is the traditional marriage contract is the only contract the state won't defend you know it is it is a contract with the state can care less about defending appellate people break it and and the reward them for breaking it.

So something other other than a marriage contract more like you give it another name and have a contract where were both agreeing to do such and such and and then in I don't know how this might not work at all might not be good idea at all, but I haven't worked out all the ways that this should be done disagree something for the churches to work out but I just believe it's it's the domain of the church is not the domain state in this matter, but I think that you note if if you know the families goods I could be somehow held and are in some kind of an escrow so that they have access and use them, and so forth but but if somebody leaves the marriage.

They can't take it with them. I don't know how that I have no I have no legal knowledge of anything said or how they'd work that kind of thing out but yet you mean there's a sense in which the courts would still have to be in play.

But you know because of someone who violates a contractor. Some like that them that could be prosecuted in court that the point is that the court, the courts would not be deciding who's married and who's not married, and I think that the church should decide who at least of their membership very willing to recognize is married and on what grounds him and who is not an and to give some kind of a licensing know how to put legal teeth into that I'd I don't know. But again, you're right me this man who said I don't.

I want to avoid the courts because I got taken to the law and to the cleaners by my last wife and know that having an he's obviously anticipating divorce before even gets married. You should you should never get married, anticipating divorce, and frankly, if you do love your spouse and you get married. There should be a sense in which you love your spouse so much that even if they cheat on you, even if they abandon you. You don't begrudge the material goods that they take with them and I don't you know not cut testing of children's another story that's I don't really know how that would always be legally enforced and adjust rates as the court. Courts today do not generally care about justice or the welfare of the children they care about the mother getting the child and the husband being penalized in 95% 97 for consent of the cases are so you know, the husband usually gets the short end of stick, regardless of his qualifications or his worthiness to keep the kids in the mother almost always gets the kids dependent. Regardless of her willing to hurt worthiness.

Something has been reformed in the courts because not not because Christianity is not the courts, but because marriage and custody has been taken over by the courts and therefore thickened and insist on having authority in the matter then they did better. They better start being just and sensible in their decisions couldn't agree more lasting research about a year and 1/2 and sadly 10% marriages states that offer actually getting married hundred covenant marriage.

I am I being said I would be interested in knowing how those 10% marriages were faring. I don't think I do not be doing better not because depends on how seriously people take faith now it really. I mean marriage a great deal of marriage failure. I can relate to the feet of people not taking their Christian faith seriously.

Really appreciate you taking my call and it's always good to talk it. You said it. Thanks for your comment about by slow seawater talk next to Beverly from Dallas, Texas, a Beverly plug into the narrow panic yet, turn, turn your radio down. I'm hearing it and you okay okay yes thank you I'm kind of confused about the people painted can have the house dictate you know thinking, and didn't tear down my life thinking that they that they had been against other stated that the only time you have a speaking town.

I'm still hearing that good radio or something in the back of it got no no speak in tongues is never the Bible never says that that's the evidence that you have the Holy Spirit and you and you are quite correct in saying that there are many gifts and speak in tongues is not the only one so you know if there's a church telling you that the only proof the of the Holy Spirit is speaking in tongues. This is a church that doesn't know the Scripture very well there. Probably I mean, they're obviously a Pentecostal church and I'm not nestling against Pentecostal churches, but I think if the guy go with their traditions rather than scripture. They're not to be very able to nurture the church as they should. The people of the church.

The others many different gifts. I'm sure that if you don't speak in tongues or some other gift that you are operating in. Because you are Christian walk in the spirit and it may never be that you would speak in tongues, nor is it very important that you should. God gives you the gift of tongues that I guess it's important enough that you should speak in tongues, but if he does not, then it's not necessary it's a start.

There's no reason for a whole denomination or for a whole movement like Pentecost women to emphasize speaking in tongues to the exclusion of other gifts as if it's the most important. There's nothing in the Bible it says it's the most important gift or that it's universally given so I I'm on your side about this and of course when people tell you things like that.

I asked him to show you in the Bible because so you don't have to believe anything a church says if it's not something the Bible teaches appreciate your calling. You get one call in the form done here Sunday from Bremerton, Washington looking pleased. Please turn your radio down okay okay great. Go ahead and that we call that we have an intermediate body. After we got one question anything but people here on Eric what going on and I well knew that neither of those statements have any scriptural support is the author the book will Randy Alcorn. I've read the reviews of his book and read his book. I'm actually he doesn't know me, but I've heard him speak life when I lived in Oregon yeah I Randy Alcorn wrote a book about heaven and he says anyone, anyone who writes a book about heaven. If it's going more like a page and 1/2 long is good have to either make stuff up or is going to have to apply Scriptures to heaven that are really about something else. Like for example about the new Jerusalem or something like that. There's not very much in the Bible said about heaven as a place for people to go to there's reference to heaven is a place where God lives in the Angels live and so forth, or Jesus is now awaiting his return and that we go there.

What I believe we go there when we die now. Apart from that information were not told much at all. He may say we have an intermediate body in heaven because of Paul said in second Corinthians 5 where he said that we are in this tent and were longing to to depart and to and have our house which is from heaven. That's from heaven is not in heaven but I believe the house from heaven is the is the glorified body that will have when Jesus returns. I don't think it's talking about the condition where and when were in heaven, but I don't know that anything would be at stake in the matter. Notice if someone says I think we have some kind of a body in heaven. And I say I will. I don't think we do is is not any of argue like I can imagine what difference would make as far as people in heaven watching us here. I don't really see any biblical evidence of that trestle, but by way Randy Alcorn is a good evangelical writer and he's written many good books. I yeah I would.

I'd have to say that writing a full-length book about heaven with reference to Christians being in heaven. You've got to go to milk a lot of things out of verses that are really necessarily about heaven. I think I am sure that everything the Bible actually does say about heaven is probably in his book, but there's gonna be an awful lot more. There, that's not necessary stated in heaven, which is either like is it a lot of times two people taking visions of the new Jerusalem or something from revelation in the they apply not to pearly gates and golden streets and things like that. They think that's heaven but that's not target heaven so and I haven't read his book. I can't critique it. I have, I certainly have read some things from the dead are that came from somebody else's review of and I know that I would agree with everything in the right bright and sunny I guess to cut off I'm I'm good to be cut off.

30 seconds so I can't really hear anymore about it. I hope that's helpful to, and maybe call again to talk more about that sometime in the narrow path radio broadcast. My name is Steve Greg. We are listener supported.

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