Jesus and Politics

The following program is recorded content created by Truth Network. Welcome, welcome friends to the Line of Fire broadcast.

Michael Brown so blessed to be with you. Here as always to infuse you with faith and truth and courage. I'm going to be talking in a moment with our guest Bunny Pounds. I've really been looking forward to this interview. Her brand new book has just released called Jesus and Politics, One Woman's Walk with God in a Mud Slinging Profession.

Alright, Team Truth, that's it. Get our guest on the air. We're not waiting for her to call us. We're waiting for you to call her.

Slight miscommunication with our team there. So, this is going to be a really interesting interview because Bunny's been there and done that. She's run for office. She's worked with the Republican Party.

She's seen the good, the bad, and the ugly, and she loves Jesus. So, we're going to talk about that. We're going to talk about her organization, Christians Engaged, and what a time to talk about this in the beginning of this election season in 2024. Before we get to our guest, we are about to send out our frontline newsletter, our second one ever. This will be coming out literally in the next day or two. You'll be getting it via email. So, if you're not getting our emails, sign up today.

You don't want to miss this. The lead article. We talk about dreaming God-sized dreams and take you into a mosque in the Middle East where one of our grads, one of our spiritual sons, preached the gospel of Jesus. We share another amazing testimony from a Palestinian Muslim who came to faith at Libyan America with the help of our ministry. We've got an extended excerpt from my book, How Saved Are We, talking about Jesus, the radical. So much there for you.

So, go to thelineoffire.org, thelineoffire.org and sign up today for the frontline newsletter. Alright, without further ado, we go to our guest, Bunny Pounds. Hey, Bunny, great to be with you today. Hey, Dr. Brown, it's awesome to be with you, brother. Alright, and congratulations on the release of your book that I am holding in my hands, Jesus and Politics, One Woman's Walk with God in a Mud Slinging Profession.

Alright, there's a lot to talk about in the book, but let's kind of go on your journey with you. You're a follower of Jesus, you're a committed Christian. How in the world do you get involved in politics? Well, I went to a little Bible school in Dallas, Texas called Christ for the Nations that I know you're very familiar with. They taught us how to be world changers, to go out and change the world, and I thought I was going to be a missionary to Latin America.

And then my best friend proposed over pancakes one night at an IHOP, and all of a sudden I'm in America running a pest control company and having babies. And so I started looking, you know, God, what is your calling for me in this country? What are you doing right now that I can impact in this country? And I started listening to some people on talk radio and realized that I really had a passion for the unborn and the sanctity of life issues specifically, and then started getting involved. I started adopting a candidate, I started volunteering in politics and government, and then went back to college at Dallas Baptist University and kind of the rest is history. Alright, it's a history we're going to unfold and that you talk about in your book, Jesus in Politics.

I've got a beautiful card that you sent me of appreciation right in my hand, so thank you for the card in the book. I could basically spend the entire show reading the endorsements from political leaders, from congressmen, from former governors. I could read the forward by James Robison. I mean, it's kind of a who's who of people endorsing Christian leaders.

Friends, trust me, Bunny's been around and knows a lot of people and has come out of all of this with a passion for the Lord, with a commitment to honor Jesus, without having to get out of politics. But the first chapter of the book talks about darkness. It's actually called The Darkest Place on the Planet.

What's that about? Well, Dr. Brown, I really believe that Washington D.C. is one of the darkest places on the planet. There are so many enemies, pride, anger, fear that try to attack people's lives, control.

You know, we want to be somebody and the powers of control and the spirit of the age is really alive and well in Washington D.C., I'll say that. And so I want to make the point to Christians that we have an obligation to walk into some of the darkest places on the planet, that God is big enough to hold our heart and to protect our souls in those places. But we have to walk with God in them. So Christians kind of fall on two sides. Either they're like, well, you know what, I don't want to get engaged in politics or government. It's an ugly, mud-slinging profession. People do horrible things in that.

I don't know if I want to be corrupted, right? So they just kind of go away and they don't really participate in the process. And the country suffers, frankly, when Christians don't engage in our culture, specifically in government and politics. On the other side, there are people that get involved in politics and government as believers. They're very passionate about it.

They get, you know, really on fire for helping the country, protecting liberty. You and I have talked about this, you know, a lot, but they get misguided and they forget that they have to stay in the place of prayer, stay in meditation with the word and forget that they have to walk with Jesus. And so pride, anger, offenses, bitterness, the spirit of the age takes over in their life. And man, they become people that really, frankly, were like, is that a Christ follower? I don't know if that's a Christ follower or not.

And so that also becomes a major problem. And so the book is really my testimony of somehow, by the grace of God, I've spent 16 years in politics and government and I still love Jesus. And I hopefully I've retained my witness that I love him.

I love his word and I love his people. But unfortunately that is not the testimony of some. And I want to encourage people that are involved to go back to that place of simplicity with Jesus and know that God wants to use them in those places of influence, but we have to walk with him. So, Bunny, we all know believers, some I'm speaking to right now, and they've completely disengaged because politics is too dirty, politics is too corrupt, politics is too evil.

It's dog-eat-dog world. No party is God's party. No candidate is God's candidate. We have a heavenly kingdom. Let's just lead people to Jesus, make disciples live our lives, and let politics do its dirty thing.

I may be speaking to many people that feel that way right now. On the other hand, we've seen many candidate with a strong Christian testimony by the time they really come into a place of authority or power or influence. It seems they've compromised along the way. What types of negative things have you witnessed just with Christians that you knew to be strong Christians, but over the years involved in politics they lost their testimony in different ways?

What kind of things did, what happened to them and how did this happen in their lives? Well, I think one of the things that's most concerning to me right now in the political movements is just how we name call and we just blab on social media, right? It's just like we're just vomiting on each other. And this is coming from federal members of Congress. It's coming from our state legislators, people in authority calling each other names constantly on social media. And so the activists and people that get involved or that follow the news, they think, well, you know, if these people do this, then it's okay for us to do it. But we forget that when wherever we go, even on social media, we are representing Christ. If we put in our social media bio, you know, I'm a strong Christian, I love Jesus, and then we are totally just destroying people.

What kind of testimony is that? I've seen some great men and women, Dr. Brown, that really started getting involved 10, 20 years ago that really had a heart for this nation. And they've become such ugly, hateful people on, you know, on social media, on the internet that even the people in their own church don't want to associate with them. That that should not be right. You know, control comes in when people get the cell phone of an elected official or they get a bill passed that they worked on or they get somebody elected or, you know, somebody gets elected and then they become a powerful, more powerful person.

Right. They get influence. Well, this little subtle thing called pride starts coming in our hearts and I've seen it so many times. It's so subtle and we think, oh, I can handle that.

I don't think I'm better than other people. But that subtle pride just starts eating at that person until all of a sudden they really do believe their own reputation. They do believe that they know more than other people. They do believe that they have more insight information and if they're not careful as Christ followers, they start filtering over to the place where they become, they think they are God.

They think that they have full control and it's a subtle thing that we have to watch as believers. So for me, I share in the book, you know, I remember when I got my first business card and I was the campaign manager for a U S Congressman and man, everybody said, bunny, what are you doing right now for a living? And I'm like, I'm a campaign manager for a U S Congressman and I just wanted to say how powerful I was.

Right. And until finally one day the Lord said, what are you doing? Why is the first thing out of your mouth that you're a campaign manager for a U S Congressman? Am I not big enough?

You know, am I not enough for you to brag on me first? And, and I think as believers we have to constantly, especially those of us that start engaging in this space, constantly watch out for those things. Uh, and I have a chapter in the book called the enemies of our soul.

And, um, I, I take on all those enemies and believe that if we watch our hearts, we can really be effective. All right. We're going to take a quick break.

We come back. I want to go through some of your, your, your own political history. Uh, we'll, we'll talk about that together. Uh, quite an interesting journey.

You've been even running for political office, but then we want to get everyone engaged. You can find out more at christiansengaged.org. That's plural S and then a D at the end. christiansengaged.org. We'll talk about this important initiative, how you can be part of it as well. The book, Jesus and politics by bunny B U N N I bunny pounds.

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Here again is Dr. Michael Brown. Can you book Jesus and Politics by Bunny Pounds, one woman's walk with God in a mud slinging profession. So, Bunny, as we go on your journey, tell us about what you did. Start as campaign manager, your journey through politics, and how you ended up starting Christians Engaged. Yeah, I was a homeschooling mom that got really involved in the early 2000s. I testified in front of a platform committee on a school choice bill and really got hooked that I could have a voice and I could make a difference. I went back to Dallas Baptist University, got a degree in political science, and landed a job with a US Congressman, Jeb Hensarling, who soon rose up the ranks of leadership.

He became conference chairman in the US House and then financial services chairman. And so I worked and ran his campaign, did all his fundraising in Texas for 10 years. And then I launched my own political consulting firm in 2015.

There was a movement happening called the Tea Party movement, a whole bunch of social conservative, fiscal conservative candidates were getting elected. And frankly, they didn't have a home. A lot of Christian candidates didn't have consultants.

Nobody would take them or work for them. So I kind of gathered them all up and started supporting them. We really quickly grew into one of the largest consulting firms in Texas, running candidates from county, state, and federal.

Had 32 clients, nine people in my office. In frankly, three years, it was a hard and long ride. And then 2018, my former boss, Jeb Hensarling, announced his retirement from Congress. And we thought we had three people that would run that we really wanted in that spot. And they decided not to run.

They thought they couldn't, they could do more in Texas than Washington DC. So all of a sudden, we had some people running that frankly, I didn't think should represent the people at the time that were not good enough, that were not conservative enough. And so I, at the last minute, jumped into a race I never thought I would ever do. And I showed up at my boss's house, asked for his endorsement, and went through an eight-person primary into a two-person runoff in 2018. Million dollars I raised for that race.

Almost won, lost by 2,700 votes out of 43,000 votes to a sitting state representative. Congressman Lance Gooden is now the member of Congress. And I share in the book the recovery from that race, and all the things I had to do to get over failure, offenses, bitterness, and unforgiveness. And Congressman Lance Gooden was the first member of Congress to sign off on my book. We're very good friends now, and it's exciting to see what God does.

He puts us where, exactly where we're supposed to be. All right, so again, the subtitle of the book, Jesus in Politics, is One Woman's Walk with God in a Mud-Slinging Profession. So how do you run for office without mud-slinging? Because there's going to be mud coming against you, an attack against you, or an attack against your character, or whatever.

And basically, here's a strong campaign, attack against you, you got to hit back, and a lot of Christians end up compromising their values here. How did you navigate that? Well, it's really difficult, because you don't get into a race to lose. You get into a race to win.

And so there's decisions that you have to make along the way. One thing that we did was we always cited everything. If we talked about my opponent's record in Austin, where he was serving as a state legislator, we always cited exactly where the bills were, where the website was, if they could look that up. We never hit him without good citations and making that very clear.

Sometimes it's like in minuscule point, right, on the end of the mail piece, where you can barely see it. We made sure it was clear. But yeah, it's difficult, because you have to talk about the issues. We tried to stay on the issues only and on his record, not talk about him personally.

And that's something that people have to, you know, they have to really make a decision, I'm going to go this far and I'm not going to go this far. But yeah, I got called a Never Trumper, even though I voted for Trump twice. I got called a Never Trumper because I voted for Ted Cruz in the primary. I got called a Carpetbagger because I moved two miles down the road to get back into the congressional district that I lived in for 16 years.

I got called a swamp breather because I worked for members of Congress. So, you know, it just, it is the game, unfortunately. But what I want to understand as it relates to this topic is, really, you need to, if you have Christian brother or sister that's deciding to run for office, whether it's even a mayorship, or council, some of the local races are even worse than a million dollar congressional race as far as how it affects their life and their family. And just be with them. Don't abandon them in those moments. I had friends that were all in for me and were block walking and they were so supportive. And I had friends that were like, is this really what you should be doing? I don't know if this is really, you know, what you're supposed to be doing. And they didn't support me really.

And at the end of that season, the ones that were in that fight with me in the battle are the ones that I'm still friends with right now. And it's really important for people to understand how difficult that is for our Christian brothers and sisters that get involved in it. All right, we're going to unpack a few things in the book. You have a chapter, Politics is Not Inherently Evil. Another chapter that asks the question, can God speak to politicians? So we'll get into all of that. And the question is, does God call Christians to actually run for office, be involved in politics?

We've got just a couple minutes before the next break. Tell us about Christians Engaged in terms of why you raised it up. And then we'll let people know how they can be involved as well. What is Christians Engaged all about? Yeah, well, we're a Christian nonpartisan ministry. We started four years ago and it really, I really started because I was very upset about the apathy of Christians when I ran for Congress.

I spoke in 16 churches. Pastors were real excited about a Jesus loving woman who understood federal public policy running for office, but they didn't have a grid. They didn't know what a primary was. They weren't voting in runoffs.

They weren't voting in local elections. So we created a ministry to fill two gaps. Number one, thousands of Christians around the country now have taken our pledge to pray, vote and engage. We send a scripture with a video and a prayer every Monday for them to pray for their city state nation. We send voting reminders from a nonpartisan Christian perspective.

They get four texts and four emails around every election so they never forget an election again with a simple, a guide, five step guide to print off their ballot, research the ballot. And then we are teaching Christians how to engage in civics and really understanding the Bible and biblical worldview topics. So we have a massive get out the vote system, over 200,000 Christians in that system now, and we're scaling to a million before the presidential election. And then on demand video curriculum to teach Christians how to engage and get involved in federal, state and local government. Now, friends, Christians engaged dot org, so plural Christians engaged with the deity and Christians engaged dot org.

Go there now. Sign up, get informed, get equipped, learn how to pray again. This is nonpartisan. This is just going to educate you and help you understand the issues, help you to pray effectively.

We come back. I want to address some of these other issues with Bunny pounds, her new book, Jesus and politics, hot off the press, literally just released one woman's walk with God in a mud slinging profession. And buddy and I have talked about these issues in some depth because we know how fraught with danger the whole political world can be. And yet if Christians just drop out and don't engage, don't vote, don't get involved in the political system, then we basically leave it for those with different ideologies, different worldviews, different viewpoints to go ahead and govern and make the laws. And that affects our lives. That affects our kids.

That affects our grandkids. So politics is not the great commission, but politics is part of our involvement here in the world. Can we get it right? Can we get it right for the glory of God? We'll be right back.

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Thanks for joining us, friends on the line of fire. Michael Brown, delighted to be with you speaking today with Bunny Pound's author of the brand new book, Jesus in Politics, One Woman's Walk with God in a Mud Slinging Profession. Hey, Bunny, question for you before we dive into more of the content in your book. There are books I read just to enjoy because my life is very intense and I'm always pushing and writing and studying and praying and ministering. Sometimes I just read a book to enjoy it. And then other times I'm reading a book just for edifying content or to help teach or instruct others and gather information. What are you hoping that readers of Jesus in Politics will get?

Because it's enjoyable in that you've got so many stories to tell. What are you hoping that readers will get out of the book? Well, I hope they get surprised by Jesus, first of all.

No, I laugh at this. I actually say this is an intimacy with Jesus book disguised as a political book because I really want wherever Christians, wherever we are in our walk with the Lord, I pray that this book takes you deeper. I want to inspire young people to go live their life. I remember when I was a Bible school student, the only people we saw in the pulpit at my Bible school was people in full time ministry, right, that were in pulpits. And so when I got into business with my husband and we were, you know, doing other things than just preaching in a pulpit, I didn't have a grid for that. I was thinking maybe I didn't fulfill the call of God on my life, even though I know I had a teaching gift on my life. And so I want to inspire people to go out into the culture and be those fivefold ministry gifts wherever you are. Be disciple makers, um, to go deeper in the Lord right now in this season because we frankly need to, I mean the times are dark and we need to know him even more. So in my crazy way of sharing all these stories with Congressman Lee Zeldin and Congressman Sean Duffy and Vice President Mike Pence and Ted Cruz and everybody that's in the book, um, I hope that people just see that God can use us, if he can use an ordinary woman with a political resume for his glory, he can use anybody, believe me.

That's my hope. I love that. And friends, that's why I have Bunny on, not just to tell her story, but to encourage you in terms of what can happen in your life and the impact that you can have. And we've compared notes on these issues. We see things in a very similar way, even though my life has been lived and the ministry and your life has been lived in a, in a way that intersects more with politics, but same heart, same goal, same vision. You say in your book that politics is not inherently evil.

Sometimes we feel like that. It's, it's, it's evil. It's dog eats all. It's corrupt. It's about power. It's, it's about control and whatever it takes to get to the top. It's ruthless. It's dirty. But you're saying it's not inherently evil.

So unpack that for us. Well, in my American government textbook at Dallas Baptist University, it said that politics is who gets what, when and how. So frankly, Dr. Brown, we are lobbying each other for things all the time. You know, if you go to a local church, you've got people in that local church, whether it's elders, deacons, Sunday school teachers asking the pastor for what they want, right?

Does anybody have children or grandchildren? Because when you leave church on Sunday morning, you're going to get a whole bunch of lobbying on where you want, they want to go to eat after church, right? So asking for things, pursuing what we want as far as righteousness, legislation that we think is backed with a biblical worldview, making sure that our our cities are safe and that we're not having lawlessness run rampant in our cities, in our communities, making sure that drugs are not running out all over, making sure the unborn is protected. There are things in our culture that Christians need to be standing up to and pursuing and asking their elected officials for. And that in itself is not inherently evil. What what happens in politics is, again, the corruption that happens when people shift their hearts from the word of God and from a biblical worldview into a place of ultimate. They just want power.

Power corrupts completely. So if we stay before the Lord and we pursue him in this place, we can make a huge difference in our in in our government. And we frankly, government will impact our life whether we want it or not. So we better wake up. And I think a lot of people woke up in 2020 specifically.

All right. So if we don't engage, if we just throw in the towel, the world's just getting more evil. Politics is corrupt.

Why even bother? Our vote doesn't even count. If we get that mindset, then what happens to America and what happens to the next generations?

Well, what happens to America is what we're seeing right now. Frankly, there is no difference statistically between the body of Christ, people that call themselves born again Christians, whether they're Protestant or Catholic and the general public. You know, 50 percent of this country does not vote. Fifty percent of the body of Christ does not vote. In 2016, we saw a little bit of a shift where there was like two percent more believers that voted than the general public. But believers are not voting in primaries when the primary elections are when the nominees are picked for the political parties.

We're not participating in that. Only eight to 12 percent of Americans are participating in the primary process. Only one to six percent are participating in city elections where really the most power is impacting our families. And so I like to say one church in a city can take an election. If we started running people for school board, for city council, for mayor, if we started putting believers as the president of the Chamber of Commerce in our community, man, we could see huge impact. And so we so often look at national politics and just throw up our hands and go, man, I don't want either of these candidates.

I'm just I'm not going to participate. But we're missing the greatest opportunity we have to put in righteous leaders. Proverbs 29 to says, when the righteous are in authority, the people rejoice.

When the wicked man rules, the people groan. There's a direct reaction to how it affects us when we have wicked leaders in power over our lives. And we, frankly, as Americans and American Christians, can make a huge impact by just taking what the founders of this nation gave us to elect righteous leaders. And we need to stand up and stop being apathetic and do that.

What if someone says, but, Bunny, you're missing the whole point. We have separation of church and state here in America. You're just trying to take over. This is just Dominionism. This is Christians trying to impose their religion and everybody else. You've heard that before.

How do you respond? Well, I say that the founders really wanted to protect the church from the government, not the other way around. And so we have a responsibility to let our voices be heard. And, you know, the unrighteous are doing that in force, really. If you see really only one percent of Americans give to political campaigns, one percent. Well, on the progressive liberal side, it's become like their religion.

I mean, that's their church. They give to candidates. They give to politicians. They're giving massive amounts. It's almost like they're tied into government.

Right. So you see a lot of times in races that people are, you know, being outspent 30 to one. The Christian candidates being outspent so much.

They're participating. We're not. And it's not taking. I don't believe that we're going to take over things and Jesus is going to come back. I'm not a Dominionist at all. But I do believe that we, as the believers, should stand on the wall, that we should be repairing the walls like Nehemiah, that we should making sure our defenses are secure and protecting our families. And when you have government officials indoctrinating our children, pushing gender modification surgeries, when you have just faith being removed from the public space, then we have a responsibility to do something.

Got it. So it's not a matter of us trying to impose our faith on others. It's a matter of saying that we want people that we believe will be godly and righteous, caring for everyone, not trying to impose their faith on others, but making good decisions in the best interest of the nation. And if we don't and things go the other way, you know, more and more parents getting involved in school boards and you're frustrated. You go there year after year and there's this is crazy agenda being pushed on your kids and you're frustrated because you speak up and nothing happens. Like, well, why don't we run for school board and try to do what's best for our community in that way?

She's saying we often overlooked that grassroots local elections set aside for the moment that the big events, you know, the presidential elections, all that counts and just on a grassroots level, we can make a difference. Why should those with a different agenda put their agenda forth? Why is that okay? Why it's okay for there to be a secular leftist or atheistic agenda or any other agenda, but an agenda that affirms Christian values or family values, that's not welcome.

No, that's not America at all. But you've actually seen God work, though, and God speak to politicians, God intervene. Could you give us an example out of your book, Jesus in Politics?

Yeah. I mean, my father, and I'll go back to the politics being inherently evil. My father was a pastor. My family, we were very apolitical. We weren't really involved.

We never had yard signs in our yard. I don't remember my parents ever talking about voting. And so my dad really thought when I went into politics, he thought I was abandoning the call of God in my life. He knew I had a bit towards theology. He knew I loved to teach the word. I was a worship leader. And he was like, what are you doing?

You know, going to work for members of Congress. And it wasn't till later on in my, in his life, right before he died, where I was able to share some of the stories in my book. And I told him a story about being on a Southwest Airlines flight with my boss, Jeb Hensarling.

We were going down to San Antonio for a fundraiser and we didn't travel a lot together. We were sitting on this plane and it was early in the morning and I had my Bible open. I was reading Luke 12 about the wise and faithful servant. And you know, I was just, you know, kind of the rule of thumb with staffers is you don't disturb the member of Congress. They have breathing papers to read. They have to prepare speeches. So if they start talking to you, you talk to them, but otherwise you kind of leave them alone and respect their, their time that they have so little of.

Well, he started chatting to me and started complaining. Really. He was a fourth and leadership under speaker John Boehner at the time. All right, hang on, hang on to that thought. Fourth and leadership under speaker John Boehner will be back on the other side of the break to hear the end of the story and tell you more about Christians Engage.

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These statements are not intended to diagnose, treat, cure or prevent any disease. This is how we rise up. It's the line of fire with your host, Dr. Michael Brown. Get on the line of fire by calling 866-34-TRUTH. Here again is Dr. Michael Brown. Shout out to our co-sponsor TriVita. This conversation I had about TriVita was right before the broadcast with one of our staff members in our larger ministry offices here in our missions department just talking about the great benefits of these health products.

1-800-771-5584 is the number to call to find out more. Alright, Bunny, you were right in the midst of your story talking to Bunny Pounds, her brand new hot off the press book, Jesus and Politics, One Woman's Walk with God in a mud slinging profession. Okay, back to you. Okay, so I'm on a Southwest airline flight and I'm reading my Bible and my boss starts talking to me, member of Congress. He was fourth in leadership and as conference chairman under speaker Boehner and he started just complaining about how he was the only conservative at the leadership table and he was frustrated. He didn't know what he was supposed to do. Was he supposed to keep going up the food chain to be speaker? Should he retire? Should he look for something else?

How he can make another impact? But he was just at his wit's end, right? And I just looked down at that scripture I just read and this is what came out of my mouth, Dr. Brown. I just said, sir, I just really want to encourage you.

I feel that you're right where you're supposed to be. You're doing what you need to do, telling the truth to the speaker behind closed doors and then being respectful in public. And if you keep doing that, I just see that God's going to give you your own field to take care of soon. This is what the scripture says here in Luke 12 about the wise and faithful servant. And I knew it was like, you know, it's one thing to have a word from God or prophesize over somebody when you're at church. It's another thing to do it on the job, especially with a person of influence. And I knew, man, that was something I couldn't have come up with on my own.

Um, I knew it was something that the Lord gave me for him. Well, three months later, um, I didn't even know this was on the radar, but he decided to step off of that leadership position and to ask his colleagues to vote him in as chairman of financial services. And for the next six years, he was chairman of financial services, taking care of his own field.

Everything banking, housing insurance in this country went through his committee. And, you know, even 10 years later, um, I, that story just gave me so much validity as a staffer. And there was so many, so many times that I was able to speak into the lives of elected officials that I walked with, pray for them for healing, pray for their families, encourage them, counsel them, disciple them in the word. Um, but when I went to my boss and asked him to sign off on this book, um, I said, I need you to look at some of the stories that are in here.

And he instantly said, 10 years later, please tell me the Southwest airlines flight is in the book. Wow. And, and, and that just was just like God's kiss to go, you know, what you did made a difference.

My father, when I told him some of these stories on his deathbed, um, responded to me with tears in his eyes and he just said, bunny, you're exactly where you're supposed to be. Who else is going to disciple these elected officials if you're not there? Wow. And so I want to inspire people that wherever they are, dr Brown, whether they're public educators, whether they're have a business, whether they're in a restaurant, um, wherever they are, there are people all around them that need their words of encouragement, that need prayer, that needs the gospel, that needs a love that comes in there out of their eyes toward them. And if we walk with Jesus every day, man, in those simple moments on airplanes at business meetings, God can move and shift the course of people's lives and I hope that's what they get out of this book.

Yeah. I mean, I love hearing that because you just look at politics and you see the outward stuff and don't realize behind the scenes. This one's a believer. This one's being influenced by believers.

This one's being witnessed to. These are just people and God wants to impact these people and these people could then impact the nation or the world. The book, Jesus in politics, one woman's walk with God in a mudslinging profession, the website where you can get engaged, where you can get informed and inspired Christians engaged.org. But let me ask you something that would be of interest to our listeners on a broader level. When you reached out to me initially as I speak at Christ for the Nations, teach there pretty much on a monthly basis during the school year for us to connect and then I was thrilled to hear about your background and ministry.

So, here's another part of Intersection. I have the role that I have speaking addressing cultural issues from a biblical perspective. How has the work that our ministry has done impacted you and helped you do what God's called you to do? Well, your books through the years have been deeply impacting for me.

I mean, I've listened to you Dr. Brown for years. But your first book, one of your first books on our hands are stained by blood just totally, just really solidified again my love for the Jewish people, for what God is doing with the Jewish people and his heart for them. Your book on anti-Semitism and then specifically one of your recent books on the political seduction of the church was just such a clarion call and really put language for me of things that I knew being in government and politics and things I was seeing within the body of Christ that I was concerned about.

Just adore that book. I know you got a lot of flack for it, but I just think it's so balanced because we have to be engaged. You and I have talked about this.

We have to be engaged. We have to do the work of the ministry in politics and government. Every Christian should be praying for their elected officials, voting in every election and engaging outside the church in their communities. But if we don't guard our heart and we don't watch some of these things that can come in, we are going to lose our witness.

We've got to do both. It is both and by God's grace some are called to one emphasis more than another, but we've all got to be involved on some level. Hey, one last call to our listeners and viewers to get engaged at ChristiansEngaged.org.

Take a minute and give one more invitation. Yeah, go to our website ChristiansEngaged.org. Step one to get engaged with us is to take the pledge to pray, vote and engage. You'll get a weekly email with a prayer video, a scripture to pray for your nation. Pray for your elected officials. We educate you while you pray. And then we send voting reminders around every election.

You'll never forget an election again. We have an incredible platform comparison on our homepage of our website on what the Bible says on the issues, what the democratic platform and the Republican platform and Marxism says about the issues. And then also we want to help you with our on demand video curriculum, our on-ramp civic engagement seminar, our local government curriculum and our biblical worldview curriculum on biblical economics, biblical justice and so many other products that we have. We'd love to help you get engaged and become leaders in your community. Alright ChristiansEngaged.org, the new book, Jesus and Politics, One Woman's Walk with God in a Mud-Slinging Profession. Hey, I'm scheduled to do some recording for you folks next month, aren't I?

We are. We're going to have you on our biblical conduct class and we're going to film some podcasts and really Dr. Brown, it's been such an honor to get to know you personally and I've been such a fan and just to have you in my life at some capacity endorsing this book and we get to write for the stream together every week where we all both have articles on thestream.org as well. Just been an honor, sir. I just adore your ministry and thank God for your life. Well appreciate it.

Teamwork, we each have our place in the body making an impact. Thanks for joining us and friends, get the book, Jesus and Politics, find out how God can use you where you live, where you are. Blessings to you and look forward to seeing you next month in Texas. Thank you, Dr. Brown.

Alright. Friends, I hope that encouraged you. In particular, just a takeaway for you is you never know the impact you have right where God has placed you. You know, we think I'm not an influential person, I don't have this reach, I don't have a big platform, but that doesn't necessarily mean you don't have impact or influence and some of the most influential people in the world today are people whose names the public doesn't even know and some of those who are making the greatest impact on the largest numbers of people are hidden and some of it's through prayer and some of it's through other types of influence and not only so, we each have our role. So think of it like this, if I didn't do my little part, you didn't do your little part, someone else didn't do their little part, the whole thing collapses.

And you know, if you look at say the Super Bowl, the recent game where the Kansas City Chiefs beat the San Francisco 49ers in overtime this past Sunday, there are a couple little plays with a couple little things that happen or a couple little decisions that affected the entire game and ended up who won and who lost. But that's the reality of life, that's the fabric of life. So don't despise where you are. As I've looked back over my life and from the early days of preaching and congregations with 30 or 40 people and teaching numbers of students in small groups and things like that, I look back and pray and I think each one of those was important. Each ministry engagement was important. It's not that it becomes important when it reaches a certain number or your influence on social media becomes important when you have this number of friends or followers or your church ministry becomes important when your congregation is a certain size or your giving is important when you exceed a certain amount per year.

No, every one of us plays a distinct role right where we live and where we are. All right, reminder, if you're not getting the Frontline newsletter, it's going out tomorrow or Friday. Sign up right now.

Don't forget so you don't miss the next one. Go to thelineoffire.org, thelineoffire.org. Get signed up. We want to get this out to you. You'll love it when it arrives. Another program powered by the Truth Network.