Canes Funeral

As neither rider was all over him, Clifton for Kasha, through the middle to Brusk, to Brusk sneaks in for a chance, he scores! What a goal! Jake to Brusk!

There's the lifeline for Boston! Gardner, checked by Wagner, Joaquin Nordstrom, he'll circle, lay it a lot for Clifton, he scores! Connor Clifton has tied the game with 9.50 left! Give it away again, the crew back out, lead pass, look out, and alone it's Marshawn!

He scores! Brad Marshawn has turned this one all the way around! Boston with a 3-2 lead!

That one hurt. Robert, it looked like the Canes were gonna tie this series up. That perhaps my fear, that this series was going to go Boston's way, was overblown. They weren't getting shots on goal in the first, but Justin Williams still found a way to score a baby skin soft goal. With Marty on the top line scoring, seeming to avenge the loss of our beloved Andrei Svechnikov.

Mr. Svechnikov! After that dirty slewfoot by that giant bear Chara, it looked like it was going to go our way. But much like Cam Newton and the Panthers this offseason, it just wasn't meant to be. The Canes, they can't have nice things. So now we mourn.

In the same building Zamboni driver David Ayers brought us life. It's likely tomorrow gonna give us profound darkness. Take warning, Robert. That's the saying the Canes have. Take warning.

And I agree with that. Take warning of what's to come. And protect your hearts from the pain of another playoff loss to Boston. For not only are we bound to lose this series, we've already lost our quarterback to that city, and a Super Bowl to that city. Well I hope you enjoyed Super Bowl 38, Boston.

I hope you enjoyed this series win. And Cam Newton. And your clam chowder. We'll stick with our Bojangles and our cookout. That was a tough loss last night. About as painful as it gets.

But whenever I'm in pain because of sports, I suppress it and turn to other sports as a distraction. Let's try college football. Where yesterday, North Carolina had a number of clusters on campus, which if you don't know is a term for five or more coronavirus positive tests. So North Carolina decided to take all of their classes online. All the students were not gonna be on campus any longer.

They're not gonna have in-person classes. They were all gonna go online. That led many people to jump to the conclusion college football might be in danger in Chapel Hill.

This is something I expected to happen. Dabo Swinney, he hinted at it last week when he said, and I'm quoting, You can be a student and be virtual, but you can't be an athlete and be virtual. You can't be an athlete online. Mac Brown, he's saying a lot of the similar things now in Chapel Hill.

He spoke to the media earlier this morning, and the way he's making it sound, the fact that this is all going online, it's actually a good sign for the Tar Heels. It's time college football, if you plan to get it in this fall, to go all virtual with classes. Build an on-campus bubble.

That's what needs to happen. Athletes, they are begging to play. They are begging us with the We Want to Play movement. Heck, I think that the root of the We Are United movement is still they want to play football.

So let's tell them away how. The turning point of basketball getting the bubble done wasn't anything that Adam Silver did organizing things in Orlando. It was Chris Paul, LeBron James, and the Stars getting on a call saying they were going to play. At many points in the NBA's history, the players pushing forward is at the heart of it.

When I think JFK passed away, or actually, excuse me, Martin Luther King passed away 50 plus years ago. There was an NBA playoff series going on, and Bill Russell, among others, decided that they were going to play, so everybody followed suit. So there's a deep, rich history of the athletes pushing forward, making their voice heard, in order to push the game forward in difficult times. We saw it to a degree with Major League Baseball.

It was an ugly summer. It shouldn't have been a labor dispute, but it was a labor dispute. But the turning point is when the players just said simply, when and where. When and where, the owners, they were boxed in at that point, they had to find a way to get it done, and they did.

It hasn't been as smooth as other sports, but they got it done. In college football, I think the We Want to Play movement, that was the version, that was the college football version of when and where. You tell us. I think an on-campus bubble is how.

Nobody wants to say it, because then you're opening yourself up to Twitter and social media and columnists who will suggest you are hypocrites. How can you say these guys are student athletes when you're treating them like professionals? The players, they know what they signed up for. They want to play.

Now tell them how. Let's not forget either. Most football players, they're taking online classes anyway. Listen to Mac Brown specifically on this, talking about the idea of all his players taking virtual classes. There'll be fewer people on campus, and our guys will not be in the classroom. And they're already used to this because they had it in the spring, and they had it both semesters of summer school.

So for our guys, sadly enough, this is more the norm right now than it would have been going into the classrooms. There it is. They're used to it. That's what they did in the spring.

That's what they did all summer. Robert, you've covered sports, college sports mostly, as have I in North Carolina for a while now. Most athletes I knew. The more and more you progressed through school, the more and more you wanted, you preferred to take classes online. This is not an abnormal thing for an athlete to take online classes. Now I know you can insert your North Carolina AFAM joke wherever you want here, but I don't think it's that abnormal to have a football team taking all their classes online. What do you think?

No, not at all. I mean, most athletes, depending on their schedule, probably do have to take a lot of virtual classes. I think it basically comes down to how that athlete learns the best, and if they feel like they need to be in class to take those classes, then they should do that.

I would think on a large majority scale of those athletes that they would not mind taking virtual classes. On Twitter, if you want to chime in, at sportsubtriand, 336-777-1600 is the phone number. I put out a poll question earlier today that I want to get to in about five minutes.

Should Cam Newton's jersey number be retired by the Panthers? Pretty staggering results in that poll right now. 61% saying no, it should not be.

We'll get to that in about five minutes. But just like it's a fact that most football players tend to prefer virtual classes anyway, I feel like I'm beating a dead horse when I say that they're going to be safer virtually. They're going to be safer by being on an on-campus bubble, being on campus, not having to go to in-person classes. Because when it comes down to it, unless students are required to be tested, they're not going to get tested. The players, they have to. So if they're around people who are asymptomatic and then they get it that way, well, that's tough nuggets, right?

That's tough luck. But I don't see many 18 to 20 year olds wearing masks if they don't have to, nor do I see them getting tested unless they get sick, which is another thing that Mac Brown talked about earlier today. And here's how that sounded.

You can tell somebody all you want to wear the mask and wash their hands, but until they get sick or have a friend get sick, it's probably not going to hit them as easily as it does after it becomes reality. Bingo. Student athletes, they are different than other students. They just are.

We need to call it what it is where regular students aren't going to be required to get tests unless you're talking about really small campuses, which isn't the University of North Carolina and many of these public schools. That's one way they're different. Secondly, they already arrive on campus a month or so before the year starts when nobody is there, essentially, and nobody dots an eye at that saying it's unfair. It's just something that's been part of the deal. We all have to adapt in 2020, all of us. We've all had to change things, whether it's working from home, getting familiar with Zoom, you name it. We've all had to adapt in some way, shape, or form. Why is college football different? They need to adapt, too. The players they're saying they want to play, tell them how to play. It's time for college football to work in reality here, to adapt, and to go all virtual with classes and, in a sense, build an on-campus bubble. Because one thing we know, based on the NHL, based on the NBA, bubbles, they work.

They work. And I am interested to see what's going to happen over the next few weeks because we're seeing clusters arrive. Clusters, they are continually getting created at different campuses. I think East Carolina is dealing with that right now. I expect to see a lot of that over the next few weeks.

I expect a lot of schools to go virtual, and I want to overreact to that. That's another thing in COVID, in the age of COVID in 2020. Don't simply overreact to one headline. Don't do it.

Because odds are there are two sides to every single story, just like there are two sides to every coin. Coming up though, there are several, a handful of Panthers today, spotted wearing number one jerseys. Should that jersey number be retired moving forward?

We'll discuss it next on The Drive. Pete Carroll won a Super Bowl with Seattle, and now he's had the Seahawks a consistent contender. The idea of a rah-rah coach in the NFL was always questioned.

There always seemed to be a ceiling on it. Hey, if you're a rah-rah guy, good luck relating to veteran players. But the NFL is changing, and we're seeing how college football is being translated to the NFL. We're seeing all the influences there. There was a time in college football even where you got Nick Saban winning a ton, and Urban Meyer, there was questioned, hey, is there any room for a coach that looks like they're having fun winning these championships?

Insert Mac Brown and Dabo Swinney. So I'm interested in what's happening with Matt Ruhl at his practices, because according to everybody who's covering it, who's covered Ron Rivera before Matt Ruhl, it's in stark contrast. It's almost like it's a college practice that they're watching, with guys sprinting to every drill, players having to do push-ups if they slip up in certain areas, Coach Ruhl even working a defensive line drill and hitting practice dummies.

The veterans I've talked to, they're responding to it. Trey Boston says he likes the accountability. Teddy Bridgewater says he likes the energy and the uptempo-ness. But I'm interested in what Darren Gant thinks. Darren Gant's joining us from profootballtalk.com.

Just from face value. Obviously, Pete Carroll, as I mentioned, rah-rah coach in college, a lot of people doubted whether or not he'd be successful in Seattle as a result. How many coaches run practices in a similar manner to the way I just described Matt Ruhl's practices looking?

Oh, you know, it's funny. I was just having this conversation on Twitter with Jon Cahn, who covers Washington. You know, they were talking in Washington about how much more higher paced and faster tempo and more energetic and urgent practices are under Ron Rivera. And I was like, well, they're saying the same thing in Charlotte after Ron Rivera just left. I mean, part of that is the natural, hey, the new guy is going to do things differently. And every coach who comes in to a bad situation or a different situation says, we're going to be more aggressive. We're going to create a culture.

And they're ball coaches, and they don't get fired up. I think it'll be interesting to see. It's so hard for me to decide what it's going to look like five years from now or anything. I mean, this year is such an unusual, I mean, this year almost doesn't count because of the pandemic. Nobody knows what to expect. Nobody's had an offseason, any of that kind of stuff. This year is just kind of its own experiment without a control group. And we'll see how it manifests itself three, four, five years down the road. But for right now, things were bad.

Then there's a new guy and people respond to it. And that's true of both Ron Rivera and Matt Ruhl. Because if there's no fans at games, and you're talking about this year kind of being a throwaway anyway, is there a better year to have as much dead cap money that the Panthers do leading the NFL right now?

Right. I mean, and if you assume, I mean, listen, they are high energy and they're optimistic and they're not tanking or anything like that, or they won't say that out loud. But, you know, realistically, they're not going to be terribly good this year because look at that defense.

It doesn't have a lot of dudes on it. And, you know, those rotated out a lot of competent older players and plugged in a bunch of guys who are either rookies or guys on rookie contracts or guys who are back up to another places and they're going to make the best out of it. But that, you know, Matt Ruhl's background is going to come in handy because they're going to play a bunch of big 12 games this year.

They ought to be able to score a bunch of points, but they probably are going to be involved in a bunch of 42-38 kind of games, too. What do you think of Russell Okun as a person and how thoughtful and critical think, how critically he tries to think about things, how outspoken he could be on Twitter, while also being probably the most talented left tackle Carolina's had since Jordan Gross? Yeah, well, that's not a high bar to clear necessarily. But, you know, at the same time, I mean, Okun's an old pro, and, you know, I get it. People aren't crazy about trading Trey Turner for him. I think if you want to look on the bright side, you say left tackles are more valuable than right guards.

And, you know, he does play into what you mentioned a second ago. The payroll flexibility is something NBA types talk about, but that's a real thing with the Panthers this year. I mean, they've got a lot of bad contracts and dead money sitting on the books now that's going to be gone soon. And Okun's in the last year of his deal. We'll see what happens and see if he's here more than one year.

But, yeah, I mean, when he's been on the field and been well, he's a player, and that'll certainly help. And like I said, they need that offensive line to be good. And, you know, I'm willing to consider that it could be okay, and it needs to be, because Teddy Bridgewater's got a lot of, you know, interesting offensive pieces to work with. And if they can give him a little bit of time, there's a reasonable expectation that they're going to score some points. It's Darren Gantt, profootballtalk.com, with us.

Follow him on Twitter, at DarrenGantt, with two Ts. I want to talk a bit about quarterback, because you mentioned how the offense, it can actually look pretty good if they solidify things at left tackle with Okun. I think a lot of people, because of the popularity of the quarterback that preceded Teddy, I think they're checking out because they think this season's not going to be really good. They're looking at Trevor Lawrence, who they're hearing is the best prospect since Andrew Luck at the position. But as that's happening, I look at Teddy as somebody at 27 who could potentially be a franchise quarterback, in the same way Jimmy Garoppolo became a franchise quarterback with San Francisco, and many other examples I can bring up as well.

He's 27, not 31. How do you think success should be measured for a quarterback who's on a team that isn't going to win a lot of games this year? I agree with you in that I think he's a lot more Jake Dahome than Rodney Peet. He's not just a veteran placeholder.

They think there's upside there. We'll see. Once upon a time, this was a first-round quarterback. This was a guy a lot of people thought was going to be a long-term success in the league. Unfortunately, he had the injury, and he came out and played last year pretty well in a system conducive to playing good offensive football.

So I think it will be interesting. I think with Kay Bridgewater and so many guys on that roster this year, again, you don't want to call it a free year or a wash or anything like that, but you definitely know that this year is an audition for 21 and 22, and finding out who can be a part of a team when it's going to be decent a little bit from now. I mean, if this year's a struggle, you know, I think he's got to be more efficient than, yeah, I just talked off my head, like Jameis Winston last year with the Bucks. Put up through for a million yards with 30 interceptions.

They want him to be more efficient than that, obviously, but if he can put up good, petty numbers and continue to play efficient football, I don't think there's any reason to think they couldn't be in that 6-7 win range. Two things I want to get to before we let you go. Darren Gant, profootballtalk.com, is with us. You're a Hall of Fame boner.

We've noted that a number of times. Somebody you've been pushing to try and get into the Hall of Fame is Sam Mills. He is the only Carolina Panther who has his number retired. Do you think when it's all said and done, Cam Newton should be added to that list?

Oh, you took me in a direction of anticipating there. I think certainly on his merits, and listen, I've said before probably on this show, if Cam Newton never played another down of football, I think there's a reasonable case to be made for him being in the Hall of Fame someday. I mean, what he's done is so unique and at such a high level, and again, I think about so many players we've had in that room, had those discussions about when you talk about the cast he's had around him. I mean, the longer we move away from it, the more we're going to marvel at the cast of characters Cam Newton dragged to a Super Bowl in 2015. I mean, it's just unbelievable that he was able to do that, and that's why I'm so curious to see what happens with him in New England, because he's got the best coach in football working with him now, and certainly not a star-studded bunch of receivers and skill position talent around him, but it's a capable team.

So I'm curious to see the second act. I would think it's probably a little bit like the Steve Smith situation. There's some hurt feelings. Time's going to pass, and there will come a point when they'll want to rebuild that bridge and probably do something nice for him. See, I am somebody that believes if you're the best at something, at any specific thing, you should get into the Hall of Fame. I'm a believer that Steve Tasker should get in. I'm a believer that Adam Vinatieri, kickers and punters, should get into the Hall of Fame. Cam Newton is the greatest running quarterback we've ever seen. You talk about the uniqueness. The greatest red zone threat we've ever seen in the history of the NFL, no?

Yeah, I think so. I mean, absolutely. I mean, it's such a unique player, and the one thing that people have always struggled with, Cam, is how do you define him? I mean, he's not this, and he's not that, but he's all these other things, and that's why I think partnering him with Bill Belichick and Josh McDaniel is so fascinating because there's a couple of coaches in the league who are better at what I believe is the simple job of football. Let's find the things you're good at and ask you to do those things.

Let's find the things you're not good at and not ask you to do those things. Those two guys have been better at maximizing individual abilities than anybody in the league, so that's why it's a fascinating thing for me. I think he's got an extremely strong case when he gets in that discussion five years after he's done playing. So it's going to depend probably on what he does.

I mean, listen, if he goes to New England and wins the Super Bowl, then I think it's a lot, but I think even if he doesn't, there's a very strong case, and I wouldn't have any problem arguing it. Last thing for Darin Gantt, Charlotte Tien, Pro Football Talk.com, Hall of Fame voter for the NFL. I know you're a big music guy. What's been your soundtrack during the pandemic? Give me two or three artists you've listened to a lot during the pandemic.

Yeah, I think I've mentioned this to you before. Frank Turner is an English punk rocker turned folk singer who I've dug on a lot. I saw him open for Jason Isbell a couple times in a couple of his solo shows in Charlotte and Nashville. He did, like a lot of other people, a lot of the weekly streams from his living room, and he went through and did all his albums, different things, and he's done a lot of fundraisers for the independent venues throughout England and Europe, and he's a guy I've enjoyed a lot, and it's one of those things people like.

It's a subculture thing, obviously, not a big popular guy, but the people who are into him are really into him. I've listened to a lot of that, but I try to listen to a lot of different stuff. I mean, just put stuff on Pandora and let it ride a lot and see what direction it takes you. I mean, honestly, I've got a couple of different channels that carry me through a lot of old punk rock and stuff like that, depending on what kind of mood I'm in over the course of the day. So, yeah, Frank Turner's a guy I enjoy a lot, and this has given him a lot of room to sort of stretch out and try different things.

I mean, he did a set of Disney songs one day, and you've seen an English punk rocker-turned-folk singer doing an acoustic version of Under the Sea. You know, have you really lived? I'll let everybody in the audience decide whether or not they have. Darren, it's good to hear your voice, man.

I hope things are safe in Charlotte. We'll catch up sometime soon. Absolutely. See y'all.

There you go. He's on Twitter, at Darren Gant. I'm thinking about my pandemic playlist. If I have to narrow it to three, and if you have a really good pandemic playlist, three artists you've been listening to a lot, 336-777-1600, I think I would narrow it down to these three. John Prine, who unfortunately passed away due to COVID. The Avett Brothers, who I brought in 2020 listening to at the Greensboro Coliseum. And, yes, Robert Taylor Swift. Those are the three. I enjoyed that new album. I've been listening to it a lot.

Yeah, I saw the plays were going up. I assume you're the one doing all that. If you had to narrow it to three artists, who would be on your pandemic playlist?

Probably the same people that are always on it. All the same as mine? No, definitely not.

Never. Listening to the Avett's and Taylor Swift? You could shuffle my playlist all day and you wouldn't find not a single song from any of those people you named. It'd probably be the same people I usually listen to.

Drake, Kanye, maybe mixed in. Actually, I've been listening to a Joe Diffie playlist that's all 90s, early 2000s. Also R.I.P.

because of COVID. I was going to get to that, but yeah, out in a jiffy. What's your favorite Joe Diffie song? Is it Pick Up Man? Oh, yeah, definitely Pick Up Man.

R.I.P. No doubt. All right, speaking of the Panthers here, and also potential leaders. Cam Newton, he was the captain for the Panthers for a very long time. One of the captains. Carolina only has one captain returning from last year. So who are the rest of the captains of the Panthers going to be?

Well, I have a criteria here and some choices that I think are locks. Next on the drive. We're now the opposite of the front of sports talk because we're, well, we're back to it. Get it? Well, that's not funny. Back to the drive.

That's moronic. With Josh Graham. It is time for our weekly NFL trading card war, where Robert has come up with five superlatives that he just passed along to me. And we have to open up a pack of trading cards. We don't know what NFL players are going to pop up, but based on who we have, we got to put them into these five categories. And then me and Robert will argue who is in a better, who's had a better player in that given category.

And since there's five, you know, best of five wins here, right? And that's what we're going to do right now as we go to war in our NFL trading card war. This means war!

You're a tough little guy, aren't you? This means war! Hey, hey! It's cool!

It's cool! This means war! What?

Does it have to? Does it mean something else? Okay, you dirtbags! This means war! Finish him! All right, open up the pack of cards.

All right, as I'm looking over these cards, let me give out the five categories real quick. Would be the best supervillain. Which NFL player would be the best supervillain? Which one doesn't eat their vegetables? Most likely to be in a Drake music video.

And got two more here. Most likely to be modeling in modeling pics on Instagram. Would make for the best DJ at a party.

All right, those are the five categories. Let's start with would be the best supervillain. Robert, do you want to go first or should I?

It doesn't matter, whatever you want to do. I've got Gerald McCoy here because he's huge. He also, he wears these different types of shades, these spectacles that look like something Dr. Octavius would wear. Got the big beard too, a very imposing defensive lineman, bigger guy. I feel like Gerald McCoy would make for a great supervillain. I'm going to raise you Cameron Jordan from the Saints. He's got a supervillain-esque mustache that I feel like if he planted a bomb somewhere, he could just be twirling that mustache like, the panthers will never stop me! So I've got Cameron Jordan.

That's an easy win for you. I was worried you might have Cameron Jordan because he actually is a real-life supervillain. I remember going in the Saints locker room after the Monday night game. He had this tan jacket on. He also had spectacles kind of like Gerald McCoy. And he flipped them open to answer a question that I asked Robert. He flipped open the spectacles to answer something I asked about Cam's shoulder and suggested that Cam wasn't actually injured. He said, injured air quotes. I'm like, did you just give the air quotes? He goes, I mean, I hit him on his shoulder and he shrugged me off.

That's all I'm saying. That's something a supervillain would do. Cam Jordan, he likes playing that role. So that's a really good pick on your part. All right, up next, doesn't eat their vegetables. I'm going to start off with Gardner Minshew. I feel like that dude strictly drinks out of a beer bong, whether it's protein shakes or whatever. That guy hasn't seen broccoli since his mom made him eat it and mushed up on his little kid play seat. So I've got Gardner Minshew.

I've got Amari Cooper. He's a turd. He has a weirdly shaped body. I don't know. Is he strong one time at one time?

Is he just a rail? Like Amari Cooper, that's a guy. I think if you come out of the SEC, you're not eating a lot of vegetables.

Probably not. That's my hot take. I think Amari Cooper has the pick there. Gosh, Gardner Minshew is excellent though. I think I'm going to give that to you.

Gardner Minshew is a better fit for not eating vegetables. Woof, up to a 2-0 start. 2-0 start? I just need to play better cards here.

Most likely to post modeling picks on the IG. I got you beat here. I got you cornered. I got Jimmy Garoppolo.

Oh, yeah, I could definitely see that. I had Zach Ertz here. Just because his wife is very attractive, he is very attractive. They're both physically fit. I figured they could post a bunch of workout picks, but yeah, you definitely won that. Jimmy Garoppolo looks like a Greek god. There you go.

So it's 2-1-U. Most likely to be the best DJ at a party. I've got Derwin James because his initials are DJ, and I think he would be the best DJ at a party. I was hoping I would get David Johnson, but I'm going to make Derwin James Jr. work.

I'm going Clyde Edwards Hilaire. Here's what I've always found about DJs. Younger people are more in tune with what's cool, and LSU might be the greatest party school there is in America right now. So Clyde Edwards Hilaire, I've seen the TikToks for LSU football players. He's more in tune on what's cool.

If you give him the ox, he will know exactly what to do with it. He went to LSU, so he knows how to party. There's just something about those purple and gold schools. Clyde Edwards Hilaire, that's my pick there. I'll let you decide.

What do you think? I'd probably give it to Clyde. He went to a cooler school than Derwin did. Florida State? Ah, Derwin... Nah, FSU is lame, man. I'm sorry, Tallahassee.

If you've ever been to Tallahassee, Florida, not a lot there other than FSU. I think it's different if it's you going to FSU and it's Derwin James going to FSU. But either way, I'll give you Clyde Edwards Hilaire. I don't think... See, I've talked to Derwin James once or twice.

He... I don't have that vibe from him. But I haven't talked to Clyde Edwards Hilaire. You got that vibe from Jamis Winston? I know he got around down there. Oh yeah, he did. He does. I don't get the vibe that he's a lazy man. If it was Jamis Winston, then it's a different conversation.

Derwin James, I don't think so. So it comes down to this. Our NFL trading cardboard. I got two, you got two. The deciding card, the deciding superlative, most likely to appear in a Drake music video. I've got Deshaun Watson. You've got to be a star. He's a quarterback.

He's got some flair, got some swagger. I think if you're talking about most likely to be on that stage, that level, it's got to be a quarterback. It's got to be a star player. And I think Deshaun Watson fits that bill. I don't know if it needs to be a quarterback because Odell was just in his music video. That's a good point. But I'm going to agree with you that it needs to be a star.

I've got Lamar Jackson. There is no bigger star in the sport right now who has the swag that he does. He just won an MVP. Who's swaggier than him? That's a good point.

Big Truss, my dude. Cam Newton. If Cam was going to be in a Drake music video, he missed his opportunity. But Lamar, he would be in there. They would get a nice big Truss in, maybe a little Mark Ingram action, too, because Drake loves to have those little conversational pieces, and I think Lamar would excel with that.

I think this is incredibly split right now. I'm going to put this on social media just to figure out who is most likely to appear in a Drake music video. Lamar Jackson or Deshaun Watson, because I think this is as close as it gets.

I'll even go to the phones. 336, 757, 1600. Who is most likely to appear in a Drake music video? Lamar Jackson or Deshaun Watson. I just put out a poll on social media.

You let me know what direction that's going in. Let's go to Michael and Winston Sale, and I'll ask him this question, because it could decide our NFL trading card war. Most likely to appear in a Drake music video? Lamar Jackson or Deshaun Watson. Right now, I'd say Deshaun Watson. Lamar, he's too focused, but I wouldn't be surprised to see Des Bryant in the video either.

Wow. I didn't have the Des Bryant card. I think these are players that played last year. But who do you think won the trading card war, Mike? Deshaun Watson. All right, there you go. Deshaun Watson won the trading card war, which means I won the trading card war, according to Mike. There you go.

336, 757, 1600. I think this is up for debate, Robert. This is incredibly close, because I think I'm leaning Lamar Jackson. I think Mike's way off base.

I think you might be right, but this is close enough to present to the audience who's more likely to appear in a Drake music video, Lamar or Deshaun. So just put it up on the poll, and we'll update that at like 550 before taking it to the house to see who really won trading card war. That's what we're going to do. I think that's fair. That's just. That's democratic.

Everything we love about America represented in the NFL trading card war. I don't think I'll ever be in a Drake music video. You don't know.

They might need extras. He did one in a high school one time when throwing it back to the Degrassi days. You could have been like the nerd in there.

Then again, you never know. There's different roles. Like Drake had the Doris Burke sweater with her face on it. That really changed the narrative on Doris Burke. I remember roughly 10 years ago, we had Doris on the David Glenn show when I was working there, and I thought she was just terrific, really friendly, really knowledgeable.

And from that point on, I love Doris. She was my favorite basketball analyst. But 10 years ago, saying that Doris Burke's your favorite college basketball analyst, college basketball or pro analyst, not a popular thing to do.

And some just suggested, oh, you're trying to be contrarian. Oh, you're just trying to do the thing where you're saying the woman to get attention. I went, no, I actually think she's really good. And it really started to turn this idea that Doris is the best at calling basketball out of anybody out there when Drake put on that sweater.

When Drake put on that sweater, it became mainstream. It became cool to love Doris Burke the way that I have for a very long time. I actually will say this confidently. Last year at the NSMA, when she was given the sportscaster of the year, the first woman to win a national sportscaster of the year award, it was the most nervous I've ever been meeting somebody.

And remind you, hall of fame basketball coaches, future hall of fame, NFL players, whatever. I was more nervous to meet Doris Burke than anybody else I've ever met. So nervous. And she couldn't have been nicer.

And she was kind enough to come on the show too. All right. Coming up.

It's happened in Chapel Hill and in order to get college football in this fall, it might have to happen everywhere else too. Keep it here on The Drive. You wanted to hear some great sports talk? Well, here it is. Oh, what an appallingly ironic outcome. The Drive with Josh Graham. It's not ironic.

It's just coincidental. Sports Hub Triad. So let's go out to Toronto, one of the NHL's two bubble sites. The Hurricanes last night. Looks like they were going to be evening up the series against the Boston Bruins in game four. Up two to nothing in the third period.

Then the wheels completely fell off. Jon Forslund is now with us from NBC Sports. And Johnny, just being in the building, what piece of last night's game, how things transpired in the third, was most shocking to you? Well, I think what's shocking, Josh, about the majority of these games, and certainly last night, is the way the pendulum swings and momentum can shift without the benefit of the crowd. You know, normally in a playoff series, the change of venue does a lot of things. You know, it provides energy, obviously, for the home team. It can play a role in how the game changes. And in many cases, sometimes the players have past histories in those arenas, either good or bad, and it might play into their mindset.

In this generic atmosphere, where everybody plays in the same facility over and over and over again, you know, everybody kind of wondered, you know, what would you see? And we're seeing normal playoff-style hockey because the game is so good, and the athletes have bought in, that the nature of the sport takes over. And what we saw last night was pretty historic, the way the Bruins were able to completely dominate the Hurricanes, earn their way to victory, and it was just an assault, you know, the definition of the ice being tilted in one direction. But again, that's usually what can happen in a playoff series.

The only thing missing was it wasn't played in front of 20,000 people and that adrenaline rush. But other than that, the league has done a remarkable job of this environment. Does that make you feel differently about Carolina's ability or inability to rally from 3-1 down like they were a year ago against the Caps, the fact that they do not have to go on the road for two out of those three games?

Yeah, I really think that, you know, it works a couple of different ways. I think for the Hurricanes, they miss the atmosphere that they get in Raleigh. They miss PNC Arena because they're a younger team and they played with a lot of emotion last season. It took them to the conference final, as you know. And if it were the case this year, I think they play into the hands of that environment.

It helps them. But so do the Bruins, and the Bruins have a remarkable home ice record. Philadelphia has the best home ice record of any team in the league this year.

So there are teams that, you know, utilize that. But in this situation, under these conditions, you know, the best team will win over the course of seven games. Other than the last change for the home coach, there isn't much that a team can do unless they're completely on point. And to be fair, the Hurricanes have not been on point in this series, not nearly as efficient as they were in the three-game sweep over the Rangers.

How big of a mismatch do you think this has really been? Of course, you have the double overtime game. The Bruins have outshot the Canes in every single one of these games. Last night, you can even look at the fact Carolina wasn't getting shots on goal in the first period.

They got the one from Williams. And in the third period, we saw how lopsided it was. How mismatched do you believe this to be, Carolina and Boston? Well, the mismatch that I see in this series is that the Hurricanes are being completely outplayed in the interior of the ice at both ends of the rink. So offensively, they have not been able to get to the front of the net with any clarity, any consistency. And defensively, they've allowed Boston to have clean looks. And in both cases for both goalies, Peter Mrazek and last night with James Reimer, it's unfortunate what happened to Reimer in terms of that meltdown.

It really wasn't on him except for maybe the decision he made on the Nebraska, which made it 2-1, and the Bruins were able to cut the lead in half. But really, the goalies have been asked to perform outside the boundaries of what they usually do. So that, to me, is how this series has been determined and will be determined.

And if the Hurricanes don't change that, it'll be over tomorrow. So that's an area of concern, I think, for them moving forward. They're going to have to be better at that.

You're going to have to change some of their personnel, I think, in the offseason. They have a lot of the same, great skill, lots of talent. They miss Svetchnikov, there's no question, because he brings what I'm talking about. But they need more than that. That's what wins in the Stanley Cup playoffs.

And if you want to be a really legitimate contender, you have to have all that skill, but you have to complement it with a level of grit. And I think the Canes come up short in that regard. Sean Forslund's with us here from NBC Sports, watching tonight on the call for Capitals, Islanders, 8 o'clock on NBCSN.

And he will also be on the call 4 o'clock tomorrow for Canes Bruins, Game 5, as the Hurricanes try to stave off elimination. What you're saying right there, though, looking ahead to the offseason and what Carolina needs to do to rebuild, it reminds me of conversations we've had in the past after eight or nine consecutive seasons of Carolina not making the postseason, always looking ahead and how to build and all that. However, I'd much rather talk about a team that's in the playoffs and is competing than one that isn't there. It just seems like this has been such a turnaround in such a quick period of time, what Rod Brind'Amour has done as the coach and even Tom Dundon turning around things in the organization. Well, that's true. And it is good to talk about a playoff team.

And I think this group will learn from whatever happens here. If they're able to climb back in and get to their game, they have enough. It would be a lot better with Andrei Svechnikov, but they should have enough to overcome one injury. Let's be fair, the Bruins are playing without David Pasternak, who co-led the league and is a finalist, co-led the league in goal scoring with Ovechkin, and is a finalist for the MVP, and Tuca Rask, who opted out of this tournament and is a finalist for the Vesna Trophy as the league's top goalie. So those are two pretty big misses right there for that team.

So you have to overcome all of these things. But I do think as a group, if they fail here, the season is not a failure. The season is a good one.

It's not as great as the previous one. But the pieces are there for this team to be very good for years to come if they do a good job surrounding it with different pieces, in my opinion. They're probably going to have to show up the goaltending.

I talked about the grit. I think they're deep enough on defense. They're going to have a couple of contracts coming up. Svechnikov will be a restricted free agent after the coming season. So when do they get to negotiating with him? Will it be another situation like they got into with Sebastian Ajo last summer? And Dougie Hamilton will be a free agent after the next season. So there's going to be some things contractually that Tom Dundon and his group are going to have to address, and the proof will be in the pudding.

But they do have the makings of a team that should be knocking on the door and be in the playoffs for the next few seasons. And I've gone on with you before and have spoken volumes about how I believe so much in Rob Brimleymore's coaching. So they have that one.

They have that box checked off. There's no question. I love closing things out with you, Jon, talking a bit of baseball because you see another instance last night in the unwritten rules of baseball coming to a head.

Fernando Tatis Jr., he's one of the more blossoming stars, one of the great prospects in the sport. He hit a late grand slam on a 3-0 count against the Rangers, and even his own manager had issue with him ignoring the sign for taking and going deep to right center field for a grand slam. What do you make about baseball's unwritten rules just on a basic level? Well, I grew up in a different era, and we're in an era now where unwritten rules get scoffed at a little bit. I think they're there for a reason. I'd like to show a little bit more respect to those unwritten rules. Every sport has them. In society, I think we have unwritten rules, too, that are sometimes disrespected. But I think the key here is he ignored the sign, and I don't know why everybody gets a pass for that. He's not the first guy. There have been guys who have ignored a 3-0 take sign, hit the ball in the ballpark, and everybody's happy.

That's happened. But he's a young player in a blowout game. It's still the seventh inning, I believe it was, and he ignored the sign, hit the ball in the ballpark.

So I think his side seems to be the one that everybody's on board with here. I think the manager has a history with the Texas organization, too, and I think he was just trying to be classy. It's like a team in hockey loading up with their best players in a blowout, and they get a power play with a couple minutes left.

And to pad statistics, here come Ovechkin and some of the great sharpshooters. It doesn't happen. That's an unwritten rule that the other coach will respect. So I think somebody crossed the line there.

I think it's the ballplayer. But again, that's me, and I just think that's the thing that we're missing here, is that he was given the take sign. And where I'm at is if the manager gives you a sign, you do it, and it's on him if it doesn't work.

But he elected to ignore the sign. Follow Jon on Twitter, at Jon Forslund. Watch tonight as the Islanders face the Washington Capitals, 8 o'clock, NBCS, and he's also going to be on the canes tomorrow. And as Jon mentioned, he's going to be doing a double duty tomorrow afternoon and evening. Thanks for doing this, Jonny. It's good to hear your voice. Stay safe, as always. Thanks, Josh. Take care. Thanks for having me.