The B-I-B-L-E. Is It Really the Book for Ye and Me? Part 1

The B-I-B-L-E. Is it really the book for ye and me? Today is part one of that topic right here on the Christian Worldview radio program where the mission is to sharpen the biblical worldview of Christians and to proclaim the good news of Jesus Christ. I'm David Wheaton, the host, and our website is thechristianworldview.org. Thank you for joining us today and for supporting the ministry of the Christian Worldview. Thank you also to our national sponsor, Samaritan Ministries International, who provide a biblical solution to healthcare as Christians pay one another's medical bills.

You can find out more. I'd encourage you to do so at our website thechristianworldview.org. Now today in the program, we're going to speak later on with Jamison Taylor, the president of the Center for Political Renewal, and Rob Chambers, vice president of policy and legislative affairs for American Family Association, about the Dobbs versus Jackson Women's Health Organization case that is before the U.S. Supreme Court right now that some are saying could literally lead to the overturning of Roe v. Wade.

That's in the second half of the program today. But before we get to that, we're going to talk about the Bible. Is it really the book for you and me? On the Christian Worldview radio program, we often use terms like, think biblically, or the Bible says, or scripture is the basis for truth, or Jesus Christ and his word are the same yesterday and today and forever. In other words, what we're saying is the Bible or God's Word or Holy Scripture is the foundation and lens through which we can understand God, the world, and ourselves. It's the foundation and lens to discover how to be reconciled to God through faith in Jesus Christ, how we can be right with God. It is also the foundation to gain wisdom for how to live in a way that honors God.

So if the Bible is this foundational for truth, the question really needs to be asked, is the Bible trustworthy? What exactly is this long book of books? What is it about?

Who wrote it? What does it mean that it's inspired by God? And what place should it have in our lives and the church? Well, recently Pastor Alistair Begg of Parkside Church in Cleveland, Ohio, and also the teacher on the Truthful Life radio broadcast, did a sermon series on why bother with the Bible. We're going to play some portions of that series today so that we can have a rock solid confidence in the truthfulness and sufficiency of scripture to be the final word on all matters of life and faith. Now, the Bible makes some incredible claims, as no other book does. Of course, we know it's the bestseller of all time, but the claims that it makes can only lead to the conclusion that the Bible is true, or it's just a book full of man's words and full of lies. But look at some of these claims the Bible makes, starting in 2 Timothy 3, verse 14, where Paul writes to his understudy Timothy, he says, "...you, however, continue in the things you have learned and become convinced of, knowing from whom you have learned them, and that from childhood you have known the sacred writings," this is scripture, "...which are able to give you the wisdom that leads to salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus." In other words, that's what scripture does. It gives one the wisdom, the seeing life from God's perspective and living as He intends. It gives you the wisdom that can lead to salvation, being made right with God, which comes through faith in Jesus Christ. And then this well-known passage in verse 16 of 2 Timothy 3, all scripture, not just some, all scripture, is inspired or God-breathed, and it's profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, for training in righteousness. Verse 17, "...so that the man of God may be adequate, equipped for every good work."

So this is saying a lot. Scripture leads, gives you the wisdom that leads to salvation. It's inspired by God and it's profitable for all these things. Let's look at another passage before we get to those sound bites. And Peter chapter 1, another well-known passage starting in verse 19, "...so we have," Peter writes, "...the prophetic word, the scripture made more sure to which you do well to pay attention because as to a lamp shining in a dark place." So scripture is like a light in a dark place.

"...until the day dawns and the morning star arises in your hearts." Verse 20, "...but know this first of all, that no prophecy of scripture is a matter of one's own interpretation, for no prophecy," or no scripture, "...was ever made by an act of human will, but men moved by the Holy Spirit spoke from God." And this is saying that the Bible is not just the words of these human authors.

It's not just the words of men. Yes, men wrote the words of scripture, but they were inspired by God. They were moved by the Holy Spirit. They spoke from God. So it wasn't a dictation.

Alistair Begg will get into this today. It wasn't a dictation, but God came over them and inspired them to write exactly what He intended for us to know through the personalities, the unique temperaments and so forth, the life experiences of the writers of the books of the Bible. Here's a short one, John 17, 17, where Christ is praying to His Father. He says this so succinctly. Verse 17, "...sanctify them," He's talking about His disciples and by extension believers, "...sanctify them in the truth," and here's the four words, "...your word is truth."

That pretty much says it all. Your word is truth. And then finally, one more passage that is so comprehensive in showing that the Bible is so foundational and just all the incredible attributes of God's Word. In Psalm chapter 19, starting in verse 7, it says, "...the law of the Lord is perfect, restoring the soul. The testimony of the Lord is sure, making wise the simple."

And all these different words, law, testimony, precepts, commandments, fear, judgments, all these things are just different names, different terms for Scripture, the Word of God. So the law of the Lord is perfect, restoring the soul. The testimony of the Lord is sure, making wise the simple. The precepts of the Lord are right, rejoicing the heart. The commandment of the Lord is pure, enlightening the eyes.

The fear of the Lord is clean, enduring forever. The judgments of the Lord are true. They are righteous altogether. They are more desirable than gold, yes, than much fine gold.

They're sweeter also than honey and the drippings of the honeycomb. Moreover, by them, the judgments, the Word of God, your servant is warned, and in keeping them, there is great reward. So these are just a few of the passages of Scripture that make these incredible claims about Scripture being inspired, about being able to give you the wisdom that leads to salvation, that no prophecy comes from man himself, but God moved men to speak from God, that God's Word is true, all of it's true, and it does so many things in the life of those who read it and believe it. So let's get to some of these sound bites from this series that Alistair Begg did on Why Bother with the Bible. If you've been attending Parkside for any length of time at all, you will be familiar with the steady drumbeat of biblical exposition. You know that it doesn't matter who is standing behind this pulpit, whether it's myself or one of my colleagues or perhaps a visitor, but in each and every instance it will be apparent to all that the Bible is afforded a central place in all we do. And indeed, some who, when they initially visit, are surprised by this and find themselves asking the question, Why does the Bible have such a central place in all that you do at Parkside? Well, because we suggest it is important.

But, says the individual, is it really as important as you seem to suggest? You may have heard of the group of individuals who organized a pickup game of football at a local field. They all got together, and having assembled, somebody said, We don't have a ball.

And one of the group replied, Forget the ball, let's get on with the game. And in many cases, that is exactly how it goes in a church service. Forget the Bible, let's get on with the service. And you can worship in a variety of places where it very quickly becomes apparent that the Bible is not being read, it is perhaps not even being referred to at all, and if so, only tangentially. And some are actually asking, Why bother with the Bible at all? Indeed, that may be the question that's on the lips of some of you who are here today. Why do we even bother with the Bible?

You have acquiesced to the notion that we spend time with it, that you come routinely. But if someone were to say to you, Why do you actually spend so much time on the Bible in that place? I mean, you seem to spend longer with the Bible than you do with any other part of the time in the room together.

Why is it that you do that? Okay, so what Alistair Begg just said is so typical of what goes on in the evangelical church today. The Bible should have a central place, should have the central place in all a church does. His example of a football game, whether he refers to football as soccer or American football, either way, doing it without a ball, like you don't have a game, is just like trying to conduct a church service without the Bible at the center.

You just can't do it. But this is so prevalent today. There's just a huge emphasis on, quote, praise and worship music. Half the service is about the music and the band and the lighting and everything else. Lots of thought goes into appearing relevant to the people who are coming. But there's very little reading of Scripture, maybe a verse plucked here or there, a little proof text to the inspirational motivational message that the pastor is giving. There's not a consecutive reading of, say, a chapter of the Bible, like, let's say, reading the word of God for five or ten minutes while the congregation is at attention. And this is because they have a low confidence in the word of God to do its work.

They think it's not going to be compelling for people. So therefore, let's just do it minimally, if at all. But the truth is, reading the word of God will be the only perfect part of your church service. This is where you're going to hear directly from God. No other part of the service, even the sermon, is going to be perfect as it will be when you hear directly from God's Word. So if your church isn't reading the Bible weekly during its service, you need to encourage your pastor or your elders to do so and get someone who reads it well with the authority and emphasis the word of God deserves. Because what this does is it puts God's Word in the place it deserves in authority over the people, and they hear it directly as God inspired it, and it puts the congregation under the authority of God's Word. And this is exactly what God designed His Word to do. And then as the pastor preaches, he preaches from the word of God, he reads it and explains it and helps people apply it, and then repeat.

It's the acronym REAR. Read, explain, apply, repeat. That's all you need to do. Keep it simple. That's how God designed His Word to operate.

Let's get to the next soundbite. First of all, the Bible is a library. It is a collection of books. It is one book, but it is one book encompassing sixty-six other books. Anybody who takes a Bible and opens it up will notice that it is apparently broken into two disproportionate pieces. There is a part which in the table of contents is called the Old Testament, which goes from Genesis to Malachi, and then there is the New Testament, which goes from Matthew through to Revelation. The Old Testament is made up of the books of the prophets and of the law and of the psalms. In the New Testament we have the Gospels, Matthew, Mark, and Luke, and John, and then we have the Acts of the Apostles, the minute book of the early church, or its history book. Then we have the letters written by different individuals to different gatherings of God's people. And then we have the book of Revelation.

Not the revelations, plural, as it is sometimes mistakenly referred to, but rather the revelation, the apocalypse, the insight into a realm yet experienced that was granted to the apostle John. The Christian worldview with David Wheaton returns in just a moment. The original stalwart souls who created a colony in the howling New England winter just so they can worship according to the dictates of conscience had far more influence on world history than they could have ever imagined.

You see the seeds of liberty, both religious liberty and civil liberty, and the idea of self-government and rule from within, all these are within that body of pilgrims. The preceding is from The Pilgrims, a 57-minute documentary of the inspiring story and faith of these Christians who greatly impacted our nation. You can order the DVD for a donation of any amount to The Christian Worldview. Go to thechristianworldview.org or call 1-888-646-2233 or write to Box 401 Excelsior, Minnesota 55331.

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Now, back to today's program with host, David Wheaton. Now, this may sound like Bible 101 basic class by Pastor Alistair Begg here, but I think it's helpful to have an overview of what the Bible is and the structure of it. So going from the Old Testament in the first five books, the Pentateuch in the history of Israel and how God created the heavens and the earth, going on to the judges and the kings, getting into the history of Israel and then the poetic books, Psalms, Proverbs, Ecclesiastes, Songs of Solomon. Then you move into the prophecies of the Old Testament. You see how these come true in the New Testament, specifically with Jesus Christ. Go to Isaiah 53. You read that.

That's incontrovertible. That's referring to who Jesus Christ is and the sacrifice, the Messiah, He would be offering Himself for the sins of the world. That's the Old Testament. Then you flip over to the New Testament and the narrative continues with the four biographies of Christ and the four gospels and then the start of the church in Acts and then the letters to the various churches and the doctrines of God laid out to the various believers in the first century and so forth. And you get to Revelation and then again, prophecy about what's to come in the future. It really is all very connected and it's helpful to know this structure so you can see that there's a certain flow to it. And he mentioned this in the message, and I won't play the soundbite, that it's a good idea to read the end of the book because then that will make more sense about what's predicted earlier in the Bible.

Okay, let's get to the next soundbite. What did the ordinary people do for a Bible in the ninth century or the tenth, eleventh, twelfth, thirteenth, fourteenth, fifteenth century? No pastor in any of these centuries ever admonished his congregation to make sure that they were reading their Bibles every day. He couldn't, because they couldn't, because they didn't have a Bible. And not until the Reformation and the great triumphant statements of Luther, here I take my stand, I can do no other, suggesting to the Roman church that the future of the church is to be found in the people having the Bible in their own tongue in a way that they can understand, which of course was an anathema to the pope at that time.

Luther stands and does this. The printing presses get alongside him, and all of a sudden the ordinary Christian is able to take up this library and read it for themselves. Sixty-six books, written in a variety of languages, mainly in Hebrew and Greek, over a period of more than a thousand years, originating in places as far apart as Babylon and Rome, and penned by as many as forty different individuals. Well, that's what the Bible is. It's a library.

It's a compendium. All right, so Alistair Begg mentions what it was like back in what is called the Dark Ages. And you wonder, why was it called the Dark Ages? Well, because people didn't have the light of Scripture during that time. Only the Roman Catholic Church had the Bible in a language that the regular people could not understand. And so they had no idea what the Bible was said, and you can see how that just creates a condition for false doctrine, for control over people, because people have no idea that the Bible would say something differently than what they're being told by the priests. And this is why the Reformation was so important, starting in the early 1500s, because Martin Luther started to read the Bible for himself and realized that the Roman Catholic Church was teaching things that were not so, that were wrong. And then the printing press came out, and the Bible began to be printed, and men died over printing the Bible in the language that people could understand. The Catholic Church did not want this to happen, because again, it gave people the ability to read the Word for themselves. And of course, as they began to read the Word for themselves, they began to realize that what they were being told by the dominant church was an error. The Bible we have today, perhaps the many Bibles you have in your home, we should be incredibly thankful that we have the Word of God in our own language that we can read for ourselves and study it to accurately handle this Word of truth.

Let's get to the next soundbite. It is a book like no other book, because it is a book about Jesus. If you lose your way around the Bible, always take your eyes back to Jesus, always look for Jesus, and it will gradually bring you back to an even keel. I've made almost a mantra here, or I have tried to, my own Sunday School instruction, so that you would have it as well if you didn't get it when you were small, that in the Old Testament Jesus is predicted, that in the Gospels he is revealed, that in the Acts of the Apostles he is preached, that in the Epistles he is explained, and in the book of Revelation he is expected. Now this may be the most important soundbite of the day here, to realize that ultimately Scripture is about Jesus Christ. The Old Testament looks forward to the coming of Jesus Christ, the New Testament reveals who this Jesus Christ is, and now in the church age we look back with the record of Scripture to who Jesus Christ is and what he did for us on the cross, and oh, by the way, that he's coming again in the future. Well that's the first question.

What is it? Second question is, who wrote it? And the answer to that is that Scripture has a dual authorship.

A dual authorship. On the one hand, God wrote it. On the other hand, men wrote it. Or, if you like, God spoke and man spoke. We read here in 2 Timothy 3 this great statement in verse 16, All Scripture is God-breathed. And it is this which provides Scripture with its reliability and with its authority—that God has spoken, revealing truth and at the same time preserving the human authors from error, and doing so in such a way so as not to violate their personalities. So it's accurate, then, to say that God spoke but also that men spoke. And men spoke using their faculties freely and doing so without distorting the message.

Did you get those two points? That God uses human personality without violating it and keeping men from error, and men, using their own human faculties, write things down without distorting the message. Now, there's perhaps one classic reference to this. It's in 2 Peter 1, 21, and there, speaking of the work of God in Scripture, it says in verse 21, Our prophecy never had its origin in the will of man, but men spoke from God as they were carried along by the Holy Spirit. Now, of course, Alistair Begg's point here, based on Scripture, is incredibly important. The Bible says that God spoke in his Word through the men who spoke in their own personalities and their own experiences, but they were directly led by the Holy Spirit. It wasn't dictated to them—they didn't just write down what God spoke to them—but God came over them and led them so that their writing would not veer away from what God intended his Word to be. Again, this is to be believed by faith, but the evidence for it in the connectiveness of the Bible, in the unity of the Bible, and how it's put together, and how different authors written at different times in different areas are all writing the same themes, and the same thing about Jesus Christ shows that there was one Spirit guiding all these different authors of Scripture into having one unified theme. So who wrote this Bible? Well, ultimately, God wrote the Bible, but men wrote the Bible.

B. B. Warfield, in a very helpful quote, says if God wishes to give the people a series of letters like Paul's, he prepares a Paul to write them. And the Paul he brought to the task was a Paul who could spontaneously write such letters.

But here's the issue. The church did not write the Bible. Prophets and apostles wrote the Word to the people of God. And the reliability of what they wrote lies in the fact that behind them is the work of the Holy Spirit. And this is the reason why the church has no right to rewrite what God has written.

The church has no right to rewrite what God has written. In the Scriptures, God was and is speaking to us. He was speaking, and he is speaking. If you want to listen to God, open your Bible. The safest way to hear God speak is to read your Bible and beware of every other notion about how you're going to hear from God. The mystical ideas that have come out of the dark centuries, understandably so, when they didn't have a Bible to guard them and to keep them, they came up with all kinds of notions—the trivial ideas of contemporary modern writing, which seem to suggest that somehow or another we can hear from God absent what he has said in his Word.

Again, Luther helps us. What more can he say than to you he has said, to you who to Jesus for refuge have fled? I warrant you that some of the craziest people you will ever meet are the people who have decided that the Bible is insufficient for them when it comes to hearing from God. And some of the bypass meadows of contemporary evangelicalism are directly related to a willingness to listen to books no matter how influential the author may be, which suggests that the answer to your quest is to be found over here in a corner somewhere listening for something, finding out where God is going, finding out what God is doing. My dear friends, if you want to know where he's going and what he's doing, read your Bibles.

This is so well said. And by the way, this issue of the inspiration of Scripture, that God inspired the authors of Scripture to write his divine Word, is why many people will say they don't believe the Bible. They just think men wrote it and it's just a book like any other. They won't believe in the supernatural, but they will believe in the impossible. They'll believe that nothing became something and exploded into an order to everything. They'll believe that, but they won't believe that the Holy Spirit came upon these men and directed them what to write to reveal God's Word.

And then he gets into the fact that it's so common today for people to say, I'm sure you've heard it, God told me this, or I felt God leading me in this. If you want to know what God has said, read your Bible. You have the whole book industry today, just countless books out of the evangelical book industry.

90% of them, that's just a rough estimate generalization, are not worth the paper they're printed on. It's not worth you taking the time to read these humans' take on some spiritual issue. Read your Bible, like he said at the end of that soundbite. Beware any other notion how you hear from God, but directly from his Word. You see why this is so important? And this, incidentally, is the importance of the sermon, is it not? Some of you are saying, well, I'm sure you were building to this to justify your employment or something. I mean, you have to say that, don't you? Who wants to come and listen to somebody pontificate?

Somebody give you his ten cents' worth of information that he's gleaned, a few ideas, a couple of jokes, an illustration, and a how-do-you-do? What's the point in that? I have no interest in that.

I have no interest in being a servant to that kind of objective. But to be made the vehicle of God's truth through the Bible, to be simply its servant, to be underneath it, to be holding it in one's hand, to be offering it afresh, that's something very different. That right there is the mark of a faithful pastor who puts himself under the authority of God's Word with full confidence in Holy Scripture to supernaturally transform people, to save them, and to sanctify them. He doesn't come to the pulpit trying to think, how can I make this more compelling with some of my own personal stories, and how can I be some kind of motivational speaker to keep people's attention? He trusts in God's Word, and all he has to do is unleash it from the pulpit every Sunday.

We're going to get more into this next week, part two on the Bible, with more sound bites from this series by Alistair Begg. But I wanted to spend the remaining part of the program on an issue that is taking place right now in our country that really hasn't been getting very much attention, and it has to do with the Dobbs versus Jackson, Mississippi Women's Health Organization case that the U.S. Supreme Court is considering right now. And our guests to do this are Jamison Taylor, the president of the Center for Political Renewal, and Rob Chambers, the vice president of policy and legislative affairs for American Family Association, both from Mississippi, where this law was put into effect but is now being challenged and has run all the way up to the Supreme Court. Some are saying if this Mississippi law is upheld, it could lead to the overturning of Roe v. Wade.

Rob and Jamison, let me start out by reading a short blurb from a column from American Family Association. It says this, the U.S. Supreme Court will hear arguments, and they've already done so, on Mississippi's 2018 pro-life law that bans abortion after 15 weeks of pregnancy. The case is titled Dobbs v. Jackson Women's Health Organization.

And this is the line that's a big assertion here. It could very well lead the court to overturn its 1973 ruling in Roe v. Wade. For the first time in nearly 50 years, there is great hope, the article goes on to say that the United States of America could return to the biblical and constitutional view that unborn children are human beings created by God, and that the federal government has no right to sanction their abortion.

One more paragraph in a brief to the court filed by Mississippi Attorney General Lynn Fitch. She says, quote, the national fever on abortion can break only when this court returns abortion policy to the states. It is time for the court to set this right and return this political debate to the political branches of government. So just to summarize, Mississippi, where you're talking to you today, the state of Mississippi has made history with a 15 week ban, 15 week abortion ban. So any babies, unborn babies over that cannot be aborted anymore. The previous law banned abortions after 20 weeks. And this makes Mississippi as the article goes on to say the most protective state for both the unborn and the baby's mother as well. Now, with that as context, reading how this case has the potential to overturn Roe v. Wade, who is challenging, first of all, this Mississippi law that came out in 2018. And why does this case have such far reaching implications compared to other legal challenges that have been made against Roe v. Wade?

This is Jameson. One thing to look at with this case is just where we are historically. A lot of things have come together to make this case possible.

For instance, the election of President Trump. I mean, without the Supreme Court justices that we now have in place, this case probably would not be heard. And the case sat out there, you know, as you mentioned, the law was passed by the Mississippi legislature in 2018. And that was due to efforts of groups in Mississippi, like AFA, like myself working behind the scenes to get this done.

But this law was passed in 2018. And then it went to a federal district court where it was struck down. It went to the Fifth Circuit Court of Appeals, where they were sympathetic but also declined to uphold the law because they said, look, the Supreme Court has said that we can't allow states basically to regulate abortion pre viability.

I think listeners should really think about how this is really something to the glory of God that this has happened. And I can say that with a great deal of confidence is someone who worked quite a bit on the legislation, who literally circled the Capitol in prayer during the debates. This bill was not passed with a lot of fanfare.

It was not passed with a multimillion dollar lobbying effort. We have that one abortion clinic here in Mississippi. They're being represented by basically the national pro abortion groups, for instance, the Center for Reproductive Rights. And these groups are seeking to raise a lot of money on this case. A lot of these groups, they kind of just exist to raise money for themselves. Certainly they're pro abortion. But what they're really looking out for are themselves. They're not looking out for women's health.

They're certainly not looking out for the well-being of babies and children. So what will happen then if this Mississippi law is upheld by the Supreme Court? The beauty of kind of what's happened is we've seen our Attorney General Lynn Fitch has really decided to swing for the fences and ask the court to overturn Roe v. Wade and to send abortion policy back to the states. Because that's, I think, one thing a lot of people don't really understand is that even if we overturn Roe v. Wade, that does not mean that abortion is suddenly illegal throughout the United States. What that means is that each state will go back to deciding their own abortion policy, which was the case before Roe v. Wade. So that means that the abortion fight will come to every state house in America. And so you're seeing states like California saying that they're going to be sanctuary state for abortionists and abortions, which is kind of horrific if you really think that through. But you'll have states certainly like California and New York, which will continue to have abortion.

But you'll have other states like Mississippi, like Louisiana, like Arkansas, that will move to, I think, restrict abortion quite a bit and especially for the sake of protecting women's health and protecting life in the womb. The Christian Worldview with David Wheaton returns in just a moment. Recent guest Cal Beisner defines economics as moral philosophy applied to marketplace relationships. So it makes sense that as our nation's judgment of what is right and wrong has moved away from biblical morality, our economic policies have gone the same wrong direction. So what is the Christian Worldview on economics? Cal Beisner has written an insightful 56-page softcover booklet titled Biblical Foundations for Economics that shows how economic principles and policies need to be based on the Bible to achieve the greatest human flourishing. For a limited time, we are offering Biblical Foundations for Economics for a donation of any amount to the Christian Worldview. To order, go to thechristianworldview.org or call 1-888-646-2233 or write to Box 401, Excelsior, Minnesota 55331.

Again, the website is thechristianworldview.org. When it comes to your health care provider, what are some words you would use to describe your experience with them? Comfort? Peace?

Confidence? Well, at Samaritan Ministries, those are just some of the words our members use frequently, like Samaritan member, former long-term board member and now staff member Jamie Piles uses to describe his 24-year relationship with Samaritan Ministries. It's hard to put words into the comfort and the relief and the peace that you have as you've come to terms that Samaritan Ministries is real, it's viable and it's working and it's there.

We just thank God that He's allowed us to have that kind of peace to be in a situation where I can focus on things that are far more important than what are we going to do about health care. Want to be part of a growing, caring community of Christians who faithfully share each other's medical needs each month all without the use of insurance? Find out more at SamaritanMinistries.org slash TCW.

That's SamaritanMinistries.org slash TCW. Thanks for joining us on The Christian Worldview. Just a reminder that today's program and past programs are archived at our website, theChristianworldview.org.

Short takes are also available and be sure to share with others. Now, back to today's program with hosts David Wheaton. Jameson Taylor, President of Center for Political Renewal and Rob Chambers, Vice President Policy and Legislative Affairs for American and Family Association joined us today in The Christian Worldview. I haven't noticed very much mainstream media coverage of this case before the Supreme Court. Is it being covered very much in the mainstream media? Because I would think this is the sacrament of the left, the quote, freedom to kill babies in the womb.

This is right at the top of the list of what they stand for. And I would think they would be jumping up and down and screaming from the housetops that their very existence is under threat if this Roe v. Wade gets overturned. So has there been a lot of coverage in the mainstream media on this? There's been some coverage in the mainstream media, but I don't think there's been a great deal of effort to provide accurate coverage. There has been kind of narratives of how this case is going to limit abortion in Mississippi. This case is going to limit abortion for low-income women and for minorities and things like that. I mean, we shouldn't be surprised, right?

Because the mainstream media is not providing accurate coverage on many, many, many issues. I think you hit the nail on the head when you say that this is a kind of sacrament of the left, almost literally in a certain respect. Overturning Roe v. Wade is truly revolutionary. It would represent a kind of sea change for America.

This is very, very, very important. We're looking for the court to issue a decision in June, and we'll kind of see what happens under the Roberts court. Chief Justice Roberts has been very careful in his previous decisions of some would say conservative, but it's not conservative in terms of ideological conservatism. It's a kind of judicial conservatism in which he hasn't really sought to break with previous precedents. That could end up limiting what the court does in terms of it might not be as aggressive as we would like to see them go, but we'll see. And we've seen that Roe v. Wade, along with another case called Casey, have shown that just abortion jurisprudence makes no sense. So the court just needs to kind of press the reset button on Roe and Casey. And that's what we're hoping that this Dobbs case is going to do. Again, Rob Chambers, the vice president of policy and legislative affairs for American Family Association is with us today, as well as Jamison Taylor, the president of Center for Political Renewal. Both of them are heavily involved in this case that percolated up out of Mississippians before the Supreme Court right now.

So just quickly tell us what the procedure here is. There's been oral arguments, but the decision on the case isn't actually made till next June, next summer. And then part two of that is you mentioned a couple of times there that Roe is just a very bad constitutional decision, you know, kind of made out of whole cloth. Why is that? The defendants in the case before the court had a hard time arguing even their points because there is no basis.

There is no constitutional basis. I think that's one thing that's that's really interesting here is that the culture has overwhelmingly changed. The demographics tell us that the younger generation, the Generation Z, the Gen Y, or millennials, that they are overwhelmingly pro-life.

And so I think that's one thing that's really significant. Of course, the court should not look at culture to determine what should be upheld or not. But I think the media knows that the culture has shifted on this. So that works against the left in the court. And they're also fighting against science. As more medical technology shows, what that is in the womb as a human being is just incontrovertible. That abortion is the intentional murder, killing of a human life. Rob Chambers and Jameson Taylor with us today on the Christian worldview radio program. I'm going to read a couple of bullet points from the actual bill that came out of Mississippi.

This was in the bill. An unborn human being begins to move about in the womb at approximately eight weeks gestation. So eight weeks after conception, the baby begins to move about in the womb. At nine weeks gestation, all basic physiological functions are present. Teeth and eyes are present, as well as external genitalia.

Next one. An unborn human being's vital organs begin to function at 10 weeks gestation. Hair, fingernails and toenails also begin to form. Keep in mind that this bill is for abortions, banning abortions, anytime before 15 weeks. All this is taking place before 15 weeks. At 11 weeks gestation, an unborn human being's diaphragm is developing, and he or she may even hiccup. He or she is beginning to move about freely in the womb at 12 weeks gestation. An unborn human being.

I like the way they use that term over and over. An unborn human being. It's not a fetus.

It's not a cluster of cells. We need to humanize it. An unborn human being can open and close his or her fingers, starts to make sucking motions, and senses stimulation from the world outside the womb. So we know all these things now with medical science and development ultrasounds and whatever they do, imaging. Yet despite all this over the last 50 years, and some of this has come, let's say, more in the last 20, 25 years.

So we don't excuse what happened for the first 25 years after Roe, but we know so much more now and it's just incontrovertible that it's a human being viable and so forth. There is supposedly a six to three conservative majority in the court. And what I heard you saying earlier is that you mentioned President, former President Trump's name a couple times that was really important as a result of his Supreme Court nominees that were appointed. There were three of them. There was Neil Gorsuch, Brett Kavanaugh, and there was Amy Coney Barrett. He actually had three.

That was a major thing. Recent cases have shown that some of these who we thought were conservative appointees to the Supreme Court haven't adjudicated that way. So as you look at this case, the six that you would say that would be at least assumed to be more in the conservative side would be John Roberts, the Chief Justice, which I think there's a lot of doubt there, Clarence Thomas, Samuel Alito, Neil Gorsuch, Brett Kavanaugh, and Amy Coney Barrett. That's six. And we know how the other three are going to choose.

It shouldn't be based on political ideology, but unfortunately everyone's got a worldview. Stephen Breyer, Sonia Sotomayor, and Elena Kagan, they're going to for sure vote against this case, I would say. So which of those six that are supposedly conservative do you think are most trustable in voting the way they should in this? And which ones are you concerned about?

This is Rob. What I think is how strong are any of those number of justices going to be in anchoring the court to protect life and be willing to overcome not only precedent, but what would be considered super precedent, which would Robby Wade would be argued as being super precedent. I think that someone like Justice Amy Coney Barrett and Alito and Thomas could serve as what I would say may be an anchor on the court and even provide guidance to the other justices, perhaps even Roberts and Kavanaugh and Gorsuch. So I think what we have in Amy Coney Barrett is a strong scholar, a strong woman that understands the science, if you will. As you were reading the legislative findings or the findings in the Mississippi's 15-week bill, you were describing all these things, hands, fingernails, hair, beating heart, all of these things. The Bible tells us the heavens declare the glory of God and look in the womb of the mother and we see the glory of God.

And God is opening up His own majesty, His own creation for all people to see. And I think that is what is so fabulous about the Mississippi law is that there's no mention of fetus. It's about the human being throughout. It doesn't mention clump of cells.

It humanizes again from conception on as what a human being is or a baby is or unborn child is a human being. It still takes quite a bit of effort to get legislation like this through. There are still forces like the medical lobby that you have to contend with and they even speak to and influence the would-be conservatives in the Mississippi legislature. Well, I just applaud you for all the work you've done. And Jamison, do you have anything that you want to add here at the end, how listeners can be praying for this? A lot can happen between now. Here we are in December 2021.

This won't be decided until summer 2022. Lots of time for influences on these justices, lobbying efforts, money, all these different things going on. Tell us what we should be doing going forward here. Yeah, number one, certainly, please pray and fast for this case for an end to abortion.

But I'd also say just start where you are. Don't just kind of pray and think about being pro-life in the abstract. Go to the abortion clinic and be a witness there. Pray on the sidewalk.

Maybe it's supporting foster care or adoption or whatever, because at the same time this bill passed, another bill called the Children's Promise Act passed in which the state of Mississippi provides significant resources to support foster care and adoption. This current law of abortion and 62 million unborn children being murdered, killed in this country since Roe v. Wade is not only a blight on our country, but it's a great offense sin against God. And God will not deal softly with a country who continues to disregard his clearly instated command to protect life from conception. So we will be praying that these justices will rule in a biblical, God-honoring fashion.

Thanks. Hey, let's pray right now. Lord, we just come before you and we lift up each of these justices. Lord, your word tells us that evil and wickedness is taking place, Lord, that there is a battle even in the heavenly realms and places that we can't even see.

And it becomes manifested in the decisions that people make. Lord, the decisions like Roe v. Wade in 1973, a decision, Lord, that opened the way to murder as many as 60 million of your children, Lord. So, Father, we pray for these justices. Lord, your general revelation, Lord, even we look up to the heavens and we know that there is a God.

Lord, we open into the window. Thank you for your science, Lord, that even those that would not have even had an opportunity to know what is even within the womb, what is developing in the womb, that through science, Lord, it's almost like looking up into the sky, that looking in these 3D sonograms, Lord, and things like that, Lord, that we can see the developing child. Lord, what an amazement, Lord, that these children, your children, are fearfully and wonderfully made. So, Father, we pray a hedge of protection about these justices, that they would decide on a righteous decision, Lord, that you would cause them to think on deeper things, Lord, that you would help them to put aside their own biases, Lord. And, Lord, that all life is worthy of protection, Lord, because they are created in your image, Lord.

They are your children. So, Father, I thank you for David. Bless him and bless his ministry.

Lord, bless these lawyers that have argued in favor of the Mississippi law. Bless them, Lord, and bless A.G. Lynn Fitch. Bless her efforts, Lord, and the legislators that work hard to get this bill onto the desk of the governor. Bless our leaders. In Jesus' name, amen. Thank you so much for doing that. This is the power of prayer and the power of God to act.

It really has been seen so far in this case, and we'll be praying that it will be God's will for this to go even further and undo this terrible, wicked law that's been across our land for so many decades. Thank you guys again for coming on The Christian Real View. We are out of time today on the program, but just to thank you for listening.

You can always go to our website to hear all of our archived programs and get transcripts. Thank you for your support of this ministry as well. And as always, if you have never repented of your sin and put your faith in Jesus Christ, go to our website and read the column, What Must I Do to Be Saved? That is the starting point of being right with God in the development of a Christian worldview. Let's remember, Jesus Christ and His word are the same yesterday and today and forever.

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