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August 13, 2021 3:21 pm
Dr. Chris Hughes is joined by Dr. Scott Colter, Director of Strategic Initiatives at Mid-America Baptist Theological Seminary and co-founder of the Conservative Baptist Network, to discuss the recent Southern Baptist Convention annual meeting, the importance of defending Scripture, and what his organization is doing to combat spiritual warfare in the Southern Baptist Church.
Hi this Roy Jones with man talk radio podcast admissions to break down the walls of race and denomination your chosen truth radio broadcast will be starting in just a few seconds. Thank you. This is the Truth Network and get ready. It's one of America's most important, influential, respected voices on cultural and political issues and apologist Christian political advocate and author here, the founder and chairman of the citizen for America foundation, Dr. Chris, welcome to the Christian perspective were we looking God's word in order to develop a Christian worldview in the modern culture. I'm Chris Hughes I'm honored to have a man with us today that I believe is going to greatly impact the world for Jesus Christ. If you're like me every night will turn on the news. I'm just shocked the things that I hear going on in our country today. The left is truly trying to radically transform the United States. The newest tool seems to be something called critical race theory. They've infiltrated our colleges in our universities and even our seminaries and their indoctrinating our children to school any evening kindergarten and elementary and middle school there already starting to indoctrinate our kids are everywhere you look, and if you try to speak out against them. They will shame you or cancel you when you try to take a stand on the word of God.
I know the devil's nervous because there's always been one institution that is stood between evil and what's going on in the world and that's God's church.
Satan knows that if he can destroy the church that he can destroy America and he said his sites this year on destroying the Southern Baptist convention. The largest Protestant denomination of the world, my guest today is someone who standing against that takeover Dr. Scott Coulter is the former Chief of Staff of the president of Southwestern theological seminary and is the current director of strategic initiatives at Mid-America Baptist theological seminary.
Dr. Coulter is one of the founders of an organization that is standing on the and Aaron and the sufficient word of God. The organization is called the conservative Baptist network Dr. Scott Coulter.
It's an honor to have you on the show today. Thank you Dr. he was so glad to be here with you today my great privilege. Scott is exciting because you know as I mentioned, Satan is really trying to take over were we seen a move in the political system of the schools but but God's church is always stood against that evil, and there seems to be a move we've we've watched to happen to other denominations in a couple years ago the Methodist denomination was attacked in recent years, now we've seen an attack against the Southern Baptist convention, which has done more to spread the word of God across the world and probably any organization in the history of the world and in and I think Satan knows and a lot people see it as a spiritual battle, but I truly and I think you do to see this is a spiritual battle where Satan can take out the Southern Baptist convention if he convince pastors to no longer believe that the word of God is in it. Parent Scripture that it is the word of God and and the Christians don't understand what the Bible says and how to apply that the culture that he can have a great victory and you've done something about that.
So, tell us what the conservative Baptist network is and I know there been a lot of questions in media because a Southern Baptist convention richly had their annual meeting and people are asking, what is this new organization or they try to become a new denomination who started it.
So let us know what's happening you been absolutely.
Thank you. Honor to be here with you today. I'm a proud letter Baptist all of my life. I've never been anything but oh, I can't tell you much about Methodist of the aliens of Anglicans of morning but I can tell you about that on Baptist from Burke. I've been in a Southern Baptist congregation. I'm a Southern Baptist by conviction. We are a the largest Protestant denomination in the world and have done more to stand missionary and more done more to propagate the gospel of Christ around the world than any other group as and affected tremendous opportunity, but there's a lot of stewardship comes with and out.
The Lord had given me some great opportunities to meet pastors across the country.
You mentioned working at Southwestern seminary working in different capacities working for a nonprofit religious foundation in Dallas for several years and had an opportunity to travel around the world and around America and to visit with local church pastors and grassroots churches and congregations all across the country and in recent years, we've heard some increasingly uncertain sounds coming from our denomination. We've we've heard those concerns, but church level we heard them from different organizations that are involved in types of movement and other than a growing concern about the direction that Southern Baptists were heading now but debiting everything they had everything wrong. But if you get off even 1°. If you carry that out several several miles down the road you won't be on the path anymore. You will be off in a ditch in the field and at several people are concerned that Southern Baptist just kind of gotten off a few degrees several years from now we will be pretty far away from our trajectory, which is reaching the world with the gospel and to Christ himself clear that concern all around. I attended the 2019 SBC meeting was in Birmingham and just was a very, very discouraged. There I was discouraged about what I was being an art out denomination with curt hearing from pastors were down in our number of baptisms and people that were leading the Christ were down into numbers that we haven't been the 1940s. She got go back to that time. In American history to find the time that Southern Baptist were performing this poorly. As far as the number of people there leading to Christ and baptizing into our churches, and back then, that number was going out it was increasing it was on the rise today that number is on the decree Scott thing that's happening because I do think that a lot of churches are not focusing on evangelism.
If there are more name claimant are positive thoughts and that kind of thing.
Why are we not reaching people for Jesus anymore will a good friend of mine granted that you can't get go fishing until you untangle your and it feels like right now Southern Baptist are standing on the shore with Arnett entangled were entangled in critical race theory were entangled side disputes were entangled in worship wars were entangled in cultural engagement letter that we need to be involved in that and the mission had taken the get in that if it were not on mission out there than were not leading people to Christ. Also we decided to make everything accomplishment so there's been a movement in recent years that everything is a gospel issue. Immigration policies are gospel issue at church attire the gospel issue. The style of worship you have. There is a gospel issue with the politics of the gospel issue. Chris did everything in the gospel as you asked nothing of the gospel issue and you and I know that the gospel is simple. If you were Kent and believe trust in Christ you will be saved. And yet, that seems delinquent on the back burner put to the side right now. What were doing what we deem to be more important matters, but actually are secondary.
Actually tertiary in our mission is what affected most for that is so true, so you were at that convention in Birmingham. That's the convention where they had something out I believe was called article 9 and many of our listeners are Southern Baptists and they may or may not know what that is. Can you tell us and I don't get off track. Just a second, but I think it leads to where you are today.
What was that what happened you bad outgoing to read and I would most discouraged coming out of Birmingham that year at resolution nine is what you're what you're referencing there not a resolution that was brought forward from the committee. We have a committee that appointed each year by the president of the SBC to deal with resolution underestimated and meant to submit those back to the convention for adoption and that the convention meets on Tuesday and Wednesday every year. By the end of the day on Wednesday. People are going all their time there checked out about what happened this year there was a very small crowd in the room about 430 on Wednesday afternoon and they were presenting many many resolution so they took a bunch of of them or type them and bundled them together and just ask the few messengers that were in the room to adopt that that bundle of of resolutions altogether without really addressing each one. There were a few people in the room that caught on to what was happening there but that was a very politically. To try and bring forward a resolution that named critical race theory as a helpful analytical tool to reaching the world for Christ and that may sound good on the surface like people understand what turning WebEx doing is bringing in a worldly clock speed exactly based on cultural Marxism.
As you look great and where it actually came to bring that into the church into the SBC and thing that this is a helpful analytical tool to understand how to reach people with the gospel.
What that effectively means is that the work that we have in the Bible and the command that we have in Scripture is not sufficient. We now have to look outside the Bible and go adopt a secular Marxist tool to understand how to relate to someone and share Christ, that contrary to Scripture that contrary to what Southern nappy always believe that will be destroyed or we need to get back to the Bible alone. It has what we needed at the prescription for conveyor to reach the world for Christ and as we adopt the biblical ideology that dangerous to our message is getting it off track and accidentally not coming from God in that 2019 SBC annual meeting. That's what you're referencing the resolution nine. We at Southern Baptist call that a helpful analytical tool. There's been tremendous grassroots pushback against that you're saying all across the country that school moms are going to the school board and there standing out there speaking out there getting that right they understand the dangers and the problems that come with critical race theory Southern Baptist should be on the forefront leading the charge against him, biblical and unworldly ideologies we been unable to do that. This was we couldn't meet last year because the coated so this year's angle meeting in 2021 but actually the first meeting of the SBC for an and we we passed a week milquetoast resolution that did not even bring critical race theory forward by name and can combat at Southern God is embarrassing and shameful that we cannot take a clear stand on the word of God being inerrant and proficient but something else across our country can't, and that is so scary and it's arrogant for the leaders who presented that resolution to think that God's word needs anything to be added that this that's really scary.
So I know the mock my blood pressure is going just hearing about that's going up so you're standing there in that room. I guess you decided something had to be done. What did you do that, absolutely, to go back to 2019 with me and there was that there was a debate that years.
Well that was curtained many of us.
We had two prominent equity pastors debating about gender roles and and all kinds of came into that but the issues with LGBT Q and transgender is him and the distinction between gender roles we call complement Arianism in the SBC and in conservative evangelical circles. A lot of discussion about the distinction between gender and all of that work the fork and Southern Baptist shouldn't be having in a debate we should settle the issues a long time ago so that coupled with resolution nine, coupled with minor things that happened in the past like you to Mike pence being at the convention and we can speak about that later, but our cultural engagement and all that just came to a head, and in Birmingham. I was discouraged. Many others were discouraged and the pastor that I have known for quite some time now.
Just that me a message but a man let down and talk, and so II met with a Castro mega church and in Bossier City, Louisiana. His name is Bratcher critics Dr. cribbage and we just that down in the lobby of the convention hotel in Birmingham and began to share her heart. What we believed our denomination needed to be doing what dollies may Southern Baptist leading group in evangelicalism and what concerns we were facing, and we were headed. He and I both said if if something doesn't change it if we don't do something to change the path down which the SBC seems to be added. We will functionally no longer and theologically no longer be able to align with the SBC Beverly or Taft continued and that's what he and I had both heard from across the convention heard pastors that they work formally leaving the convention per se.
Many of them were but not all work, but they were functionally withdrawing. They had quit giving quit porting financially the work and they had quit going just for coming meeting. They were having their voice heard they were participating. They just functionally disengaged and I propose that Hammond and Justin Bradley if if before we walk away from this.
Do we have any stewardship you love the SBC.
I love the SBC we are pro SBC. Do we have any stewardship issued to just try and put down the flag and what weekly backup and if you agree with that. Here's a place for you within the SBC were not going anywhere.
We just have a little place right here where you're welcome or your voice will be great. You could help have a home can we can we make a stand for that.
The Lord uses that he may not we may be on our way. Several years now.
But do we have an obligation because of how this convention has blessed to try and stand for truth trying stand for the Bible and challenge them is that I can do it. It would have to be led by a pastor and also he thought about that for several months. I honestly thought he forgot about it.
I kind of forgot about it and he call me back later and got out.
I want to do what I want stand and what's true and what's right that same day in Birmingham. Roger cribbage introduced me to a man who was there with us as well. Debate on the roles of the pastor and his name was Maude Mark businessman from Florida and that he serves on the executive committee of the SBC different strategic dynamic roles there and I met Ron Mark for the first time that day the three of us just really have the same vision the same heart, the same desires and so we started praying about who could we bring to a table that we've heard sharing the image we all made a list and started meeting with and working with those pastors and talking with them from Alabama to Texas to Louisiana, Georgia, Florida, Colorado, North Carolina, getting out to California in the Northeast. We've been in Vermont, Maine, New York up there hearing all the same thing pastors and so we just started the debtor that group together.
We started with a group of about 30 maidens in different states met in Louisiana met in Georgia met infected and just that together that group of pastors.
Chris went around the table at almost identical concern is Scott they're very concerned about evangelism. I think that was probably the leading concern is that it increased the decreased.
I'm sorry number of baptisms that were sitting there concerned about how cooperative program dollars are being spent and were spending more money than we've ever spent before were planting more churches than we ever planted before and yet were reaching fewer and fewer people every year and that numbers going down second shots is not all of our listeners or Southern Baptist. So when he's saying SBC that mean Southern Baptist convention and ends in cooperative program that's something that is unique Southern Baptist is churches. Each church is independent and autonomous, but they come together as a group called the Southern Baptist convention, the Southern Baptist convention has no power or authority over the individual church. Those churches pool their funds to send missionaries around the world so is cut is not exactly like tithing and Scott might get on you might be oversimplifying this but basically a church takes a portion of their funding the southernmost convention that would they would like to dedicate towards missions and they send it to the Southern Baptist convention and that way they pool that money and take those great resources to train and send missionaries around the world. So when he says cooperative program that is the effort in, and these pastors were concerned about the funds were going to cooperative program. It may never rupture Scott but I don't want to make sure people know what that meant very helpful clarification absolutely and so were spending more mission dollars we ever spent before and were being less and less affected by work work were marginalizing ourselves and so concerned with that we have in the SBC but the Southern Baptist convention and ethics and religious Liberty commission, a group that is is tasked with representing us on Capitol Hill and the public square and out. There's been tremendous concern about how that group is that representing Southern Baptist what their engaging and disengaging in. We've been through the entire code 19 pandemic there's been pastors that have literally been arrested and and charged for meeting their churches and were gathering together.
Our curiosity has been completely silent about real concerns about a lot of what their engaging in what they are not engaging their concerns about the North American Mission Board and the types of churches were planting in the leadership of of quite a bit of those churches in whether or not that conforms with art are bound to state a message which is our our doctrine of faith and what we adhere to what goes entities are called to follow so lots of concerns. There is concerned about critical race theory being taught in the nares in different classrooms and not just that it's hard to get clear answers on that we year that it not being taught and get things clipped coming out classrooms but that are concerned, though Southern Baptist are wanting some transparency there wanting some clear answers and that there wanting to stand for the Bible to wingspan permissions or one cultural engagement in the wanting to stand for grassroots involvement in those kind of become the four pillars of what BS but what the conservative Baptist network. Our group within the SBC is standing boring and hoping to accomplish what you mentioned. The Bible said so those four pillars of the Bible. Evangelism and missions cultural engagement which is so important and grassroots involvement you're not meeting political involvement. Your meeting of the local church being engaged but I know I well look on their website. There's a lot of talk about the sufficiency of Scripture and inerrancy of Scripture, so we have someone here who may not be a Christian this listing or or maybe just doesn't know what that means. Scott, what does that mean what's it happened. What is happening in relation the southernmost convention with that and what is a conservative Baptist network have to say about the inerrancy and the sufficiency of Scripture absolutely. Historically those listeners are today followed Southern bad three are probably aware that in the in the 70s and 80s, our denomination awkwardly called the battle for the Bible or the conservative resurgence and be issue of the day. Then with is the Bible true without ever is.
It is a completely accurate and reliable, and there were there were two different camps and that is the Bible inerrant word of God and and coming from God, it cannot have errors because from him at the divine author, or is the Bible from errant men and have they gone wrong places and doesn't include mistake. If that is true that our job becomes the determiner of what's true and what's not.
And if you're going through the Bible and you choose what's true and what's not true.
You can choose what you want to follow and what you don't want to fall in necessary Scott that I call that cafeteria Christianity the year were you when you pick him want some of this and I don't want that.
Give me some meat loaf and focus has either the Bible is all true or it is none true.
You can't pick and choose it. And Satan is done a great job.
Scott and I know you know this in the world today, particularly with kids.
You're one of the easiest things to attack was creationism no less. Less believers or bang that took millions of millions of years and if we can attack what God starts the Bible with then we can shoot holes in the rest of the Bible and their pastors across the country that teach this nonsense and I'm just so proud of you. The conservative Baptist network for saying that's not it. The Bible is inerrant, it is the word of God. There's not a mistake in it and it is all true, so I appreciate the standard taking their absolutely and you know we brought that fight in the 80s and and and out of that very strong with believing Bible is inerrant. I think the battle for today. This generation is the patient is it what we need to engage in this world to speak to the world to know how to live to know what do is it sufficient or do we need a whole bunch of other stuff that I was most were not Christian comes from actually anti-Christian perspective to influence them to tell us what do end up the conservative diamond network that is absolutely not the Scripture alone is enough and we just need to get back and so that's our position there.
We spoke about missions and evangelism and kind of the need to grow into all of that into increase. What were doing in the words there and cultural engagement.
I know your audience really exit exit near and dear issue that they have it against me in 2018. There was a a I was blessed and excited at the vice president might into our convention and invited to be there and I showed up that morning excited to hear from him a committed evangelical, a leader in the pro-life movement. And there was a orchestrated effort that morning of Southern Baptist to have him silenced from the platform to have him disinvited Ethan that he was coming to have his speech in his remarks, vetted by a committee of Southern Baptist my brother if we think the vice president of the United States will have his remarks vetted by a committee of Southern Baptist. We think more highly of ourselves that we all there was. When he stood up to speak and to take the stage. There was an organized walkout were hundreds of Southern Baptist stood out and left the room in protest of our vice president being there speaking. I was embarrassed.
I was shameful to be a Southern Baptist that day. Ask not what the Bible calls us to do next.what God's word calls us to do that is just disrespectful and Southern Baptist have been a group they have always engaged in culture have stood for biblical truth have stood for a biblical worldview and worked in the public square to be salt and light and to speed that movement going away from that is very very concerning winning Southern Baptist to get involved to reengage to hold the line for what Scripture calls us to every single issue.
We believe the Bible speaks about the political issues of the LGBT Q debate is a political issue and a biblical issue. The gender debate Scripture and what it is religious liberty. All those things. What marriage is between a man and a woman like all those are political issues. Obviously, the pro-life movement.
We have to engage in the cannot withdraw yes and we pastors never preach less than 10% of pastors ever preach on those issues and other issues of sin there in the Bible. They need to be addressed. Will Scott were run at a time and boil your outages go with you for hours so we got about three minutes left it, and we did get to finish all this would tell us real quickly.
So what you see is a future. The southern Bettis convention. How does conservative Baptist network come in and then and if you do all this that quickly and then there's a real question out there.
Are you sure are you trying to split the convention what what is ordinal goal. The end goal force for the conservative Baptist network will. We want to provide a place. It is a place for pastors who agree with theirs networks all across the beleaguered docket name 10 of them for you right now were not any different than any of those others were were a fellowship of pastors, where those who agree with what we propose. What were standing for welcome base. With us we have always and we want to encourage them to reengage in the process. We want them to get involved not withdraw not leave and were very much a progress be diverted were actually the opposite of trying to split that accusation quite a while were encouraging pastors to stay in the plug-in to be involved with in the convention raised their ballots and have their voices heard and to participate in the process of the SBC as the only denomination in the world where the highest authority is the local church and everybody else works for them operational entities. The mission board executive committee. The seminary they all work for the local church.
The highest authority for pastor and local church under the authority of Christ. And so we want those pastors to accept that authority to accept that responsibility and to get engaged in the process. You can learn more about is the conservative Baptist network.com begotten videos there. You can sign up to be part of our networking receive our communications to learn more about us to stand with us to be part of this group almost 10,000 churches and pastors across the country have signed up with us joined in with us were standing together, to stand for the Bible to information and to be salt and light in this culture to push back against dark will Scott, thank you so much again if you will learn more as a conservative can squeeze me. Not that I just conservative bent Baptist network.com, and Scott, I want to thank you for the standard taking we want to encourage pastors to stand on the sufficiency of Scripture. Thank you so much for being with me to skip today Scott. We sure appreciate it for the learning more conservative Baptist network. I'm Chris Hughes and this is the Christian perspective please subscribe like a podcast and share with your friends on social media, Jalisco, tasteful Christian perspective refuse more about impacting the culture for Jesus Christian perspective US.
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