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Formula One Racing Comes to America and and Comedian Gabriel "Fluffy" Iglesias

Sunday Morning / Jane Pauley
The Truth Network Radio
October 23, 2022 9:48 pm

Formula One Racing Comes to America and and Comedian Gabriel "Fluffy" Iglesias

Sunday Morning / Jane Pauley

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October 23, 2022 9:48 pm

Hosted by Jane Pauley. In our cover story, Kristine Johnson talks with Formula One racers about the sport's increasing popularity in the U.S. Also: John Dickerson and Bob Woodward discuss the Washington Post reporter's conversations with former President Donald Trump, now available in an audiobook; Rita Braver interviews novelist John Irving; Anthony Mason sits down with rocker Nathaniel Rateliff; Tracy Smith talks with comedian Gabriel "Fluffy" Iglesias; Martha Teichner explores the legacy of New York City urban planner Robert Moses; and we look back at Ed Bradley's 2004 "60 Minutes" report on the murder of Emmett Till.

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Today's CBS Sunday Morning Podcast is sponsored by Ameriprise Financial Services, LLC. For more information and important disclosures, visit Ameriprise.com slash advice. Ameriprise Financial Services, LLC.

Member FINRA and SIPC. The Young and the Restless has been the number one daytime drama for 35 consecutive years. Now, in its 50th season, fans can enjoy their favorite soap in podcast form. Every week, hear all the rivalries, romances, hopes, and fears from the Emmy Award-winning series delivered directly to your ears.

Join the Restless weekdays on CBS, streaming on P+, and listen wherever you get your podcasts. Good morning. I'm Jane Pauley, and this is Sunday Morning. Ernest Hemingway said there are only three sports, bullfighting, mountain climbing, and motor racing.

The rest said Papa Hemingway are merely games. NASCAR is king of motor racing in this country, but a challenger is roaring down the track. Christine Johnson looks in on the fast and furious world of Formula One. The fans are revved up, and the cars are on the track in Austin, Texas, this weekend. And the biggest name in the sport, Lewis Hamilton, is in the house.

You get into the zone, and you're in a different place, and you're just like, oh, you come alive. Formula One is coming to America, and coming up on Sunday Morning. Journalist Bob Woodward this week is releasing hours of taped interviews conducted with our 45th president, Donald Trump. Woodward is in conversation now with our John Dickerson. Mr. Woodward, the president.

Hi, Bob. Back in 2020, whenever the phone rang at Bob Woodward's house, he reached for a tape recorder. The phone would ring. Is it a robo call, or is it Trump? Often, it was Trump.

Sixteen calls, eight hours of conversation. I bring rage out. I do bring rage out. I always have.

I don't know if that's an asset or a liability, but whatever it is, I do. Later on Sunday Morning, Bob Woodward and the Trump tapes. For better or worse, a New Yorker by the name of Robert Moses refashioned much of this city in the mid-20th century. Martha Teichner speaks with Ralph Fiennes, starring in a new play about the power broker.

Robert Moses, whose very enemies would say that he more than any other person is the man who built New York. That's no exaggeration. Ralph Fiennes stars in a new play about him. He has an extraordinary inner conviction that he is right. Is he arrogant?

Yeah. He's still controversial, though. A reminder why ahead this Sunday Morning. Rita Braver talks with best-selling author John Irving. Anthony Mason samples the soulful sounds of Nathaniel Rateliff.

Tracy Smith introduces us to standout stand-up comedian Gabriel Iglesias, better known as Fluffy. We'll revisit the late Ed Bradley's extraordinary account of the 1955 murder of Emmett Till. Plus, a story from Steve Hartman and more this Sunday Morning for the 23rd of October, 2022.

And we'll be right back. It's become the proven formula for success at the Raceway. Christine Johnson gets us up to speed.

Formula One racing roared into Austin, Texas, this weekend. So does that protect your ears? Uh-huh. It's the rush of adrenaline. It's just pumping in your heart.

You're like, yes. Formula One dates back to 1950. Its equal parts speed, triumph, and danger. Up to 230 miles an hour, usually on tracks like the Circuit of the Americas in Austin, where later today they'll race 56 laps.

What is the draw? We're all fighting for glory, all fighting for chasing time and perfection. There's crashes, there's carnage, there's crazy emotions. British driver Lewis Hamilton is this era's king.

With the most wins of all time, he is tied for the most championships at seven. This is how we control the engine. There's multiple different settings for different power modes. An F1 steering wheel is more like a game console. You're keeping track of all of this information. You're driving over 200 miles per hour, and you're like this close to your opponent. Yeah, there's a lot going on. It is kind of crazy. I think the great thing about our sport is that you really, really go into a different place.

You activate a different part of the brain when the visor comes down. 2022 has been disappointing for Hamilton, with no wins so far. But he's become known for more than what he does on the track.

He stands out for his sense of fashion. More significantly, he is the only black driver to ever race in F1, and he has been outspoken about increasing diversity in the sport. When I was a kid, me and my family were watching this sport, and we didn't see anyone like us, but we thought that maybe we'll get there and we'll be able to change that. You faced discrimination when you first came into this sport. Yeah, well, I mean, through my whole life, to be honest, in England, I was told a lot to go back to my own country. There was a lot of racial abuse, both in school, but also at the racetrack.

And my responsibility here is to be that thorn in the backside of any of those that are complicit, who are not holding themselves accountable, who are not doing the work. Formula 1 races are held across the globe. But F1 is just beginning to pick up speed in the U.S., where Austin and Miami host races. While Europeans followed F1, Americans were traditionally fans of Indy and NASCAR. With big money at stake, Formula 1 CEO Stefano Domenicali has worked to increase the sport's appeal. Maybe in the past there was just this attitude of being maybe too much arrogant to say, this is Formula 1, this is it, take it or leave it. It's an almost fighter pilot mentality.

Anything can happen. He says F1 is reaching out to fans by personalizing its drivers, such as on Drive to Survive, a huge hit on Netflix. We need to stay close to them. We need to stay close to them. And this is really... You see? That's amazing.

Maybe Americans haven't been so much into Formula 1 because there are no American drivers. Our feet come all the way down to here. So you're laying down, basically. Yeah, you're pretty laid out, to be honest. Meet Logan Sargent. We have a seat made which fits our body perfectly to hold us even tighter in the car. Talk about custom made. Yeah, it's fit to perfection.

How's it going? Sargent is 21 years old and races on the F2 circuit one notch below Formula 1. He's the only U.S. driver on the tour.

But to get there, he had to move from his native Florida to London. I've spent my whole life in Europe since I was 12 years old chasing this dream, and I just feel so at home now. His fans are hoping he could move to Formula 1 as early as next year. Have you thought about that moment when you're going to be able to race in America?

As an American kid, this is a dream. If you had told me that when I was 6 years old beginning to race, I would tell you you're crazy. Formula 1 is a man's world. Only two women have ever started an F1 race. And the 18 talented female drivers leading the grid. But on a new tour, the W Series, all drivers are women, including one American, the only American, Chloe Chambers.

This year I've just graduated high school in June. Chambers is just 18 years old, and racing was clearly in her blood from an early age. This is my Porsche. At 8 years old, she was racing go-karts, winning national titles. She now races for the Jenner team, as in Caitlyn Jenner. As to why there aren't more women like her in racing... It's not a matter of women not having enough talent, it's just not having enough experience.

And that just simply comes from not having enough funding. To underscore that point, the W Series recently cancelled its last three races of the year, including Austin, because an investor pulled out. They're hoping to get back on track next year. But also next year, sources confirmed to us, F1 will launch a series featuring young women drivers. What's your goal?

My goal ever since I started racing is Formula 1. We are going to interview Lewis Hamilton. Are you ready to go up against him? I would totally be up for going against Lewis Hamilton, yes. A challenge.

We had to run by the man himself. I love that. I have a feeling that he would be in total support of that, though.

I love that. This is The Takeout with Major Garrett. This week, Marjorie Dannenfelser, president of Susan B. Anthony Pro-Life America. What would you say about the reporting and the rhetoric that's come from Herschel Walker? I cannot see into his heart and know the whole truth.

Yes, I can see that it would be most seriously disturbing about if any of it is true. We've dealt with a lot of imperfect candidates. For more from this week's conversation, follow The Takeout with Major Garrett on Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm Mo Rocca, and it's been a while.

But I've been busy digging up even more stories about the people and things of the past that are fascinating me now. What did your father think of the label of the whole idea of the Latin lover? From the screen idols who redefined Hollywood's leading man. I think it was a love-hate relationship. My dad hated the word macho.

That's what I call the Latin lover type of a role, which is one-dimensional. To the dog who introduced millions of kids to classic literature. I remember like on my 10th birthday, I think it was, we were going to go mini golfing. And I insisted, but we had to stay home for Wishbone first. Listen to Mobituaries, wherever you get your podcasts. Journalist Bob Woodward has become the author of record about the modern American presidency. Now Woodward's releasing an audio book allowing us to listen in on former President Donald Trump, in his own words. Woodward tells our John Dickerson all about it. For nine months back in 2020, when the phone rang at Bob Woodward's home on this leafy Georgetown Street, there was a good chance it was a call he didn't want to miss. Mr. Woodward, the president. Hi, Bob.

President Trump, how are you? Sometimes Woodward's wife, journalist Elsa Walsh, answered the calls, which came day or night. So we joke, and I sort of say there's like Princess Diana, that there were three people in this marriage, Bob, me and Donald Trump.

And it was sort of never ending. The phone would ring, is it a robo call or is it Trump? Go ahead, Mr. President, you are connected. Hi, Bob. Sir, how are you? Woodward scattered tape recorders around the house to be ready for the surprise calls.

I'm turning my recorder on here as I always do. And Donald Trump would talk. I respect Putin. I think Putin likes me.

I think I like him. And talk. I said to the king, King, you got to pay us for protection.

On the pandemic, North Korea, Russia, race relations, just about anything. I bring rage out. I do bring rage out. I always have.

I don't know if that's an asset or a liability, but whatever it is, I do. There were 16 phone calls, 20 interviews all told, eight hours of conversations, which Woodward has compiled into an audiobook. The Trump Tapes, out this week, published by Simon & Schuster, part of our parent company, Paramount Global. In many ways, it's the missing piece of the Trump story. We've heard a lot of Trump. He's said a lot. But what did he do in the presidency? And having the time, I could go back and ask questions again and again. Woodward has written about the calls, but hearing Trump in his own voice, he believes, is enlightening. I reported on this in the book I did, Rage, but I then went back and listened to these tapes and said, my God, there is a whole new Trump that emerges. We got a long grade.

We've always gotten a long grade. His tone of voice offers insight into why Trump may have kept totems from his presidency at Mar-a-Lago, like the letters from North Korea's Kim Jong-un. It's clearly a relationship he cherishes. You meet somebody and you have a good chemistry, and there is a lot of stress to it. You meet a woman. In one second, you know whether or not it's all going to happen. We have very good chemistry together.

The topics veer from the humorous. I said, did you ever hear of the song Rocket Man? He said, no, no. Did you ever hear of Elton John?

No, no. I said, I did you a great favor. I called you Rocket Man.

He goes, you called me Little Rocket Man. To the deadly serious. Have you given Kim too much power?

No. Because if he's defiant, if he shoots one of those ICBMs, what are you going to do? Let me tell you, whether I gave it to him or not, if he shoots, he shoots. And if he shoots, he shoots. He says about the North Korea leader, if he shoots, he shoots. How did you react to that? I really froze because Trump said it in a way of if he shoots him, you know, kind of cavalier. And of course, it would be unthinkable.

One theme runs throughout all eight hours of tape. Trump thought the presidency was a one man show. I get people, they come up with ideas, but the ideas are mine, Bob. They're not mine. You want to know something?

Everything's mine. But a presidency based on personality was overmatched by COVID-19. One of the most stunning moments I've had 50 years in reporting. Woodward learned that on January 28th, 2020, just days after the first COVID-19 case was confirmed in the United States, Trump's national security adviser, Robert O'Brien, had given him a grave warning. I think the exact phrase I used was, this will be the biggest national security threat you face in your presidency. I was pretty passionate about it. Yet at a rally two weeks later, Trump said this.

Looks like by April, you know, in theory, when it gets a little warmer, it miraculously goes away. Well, that's true. When Woodward learned about that disconnect between what the president knew and what he said, he asked Trump why he didn't sound the alarm. I wanted to always play it down because I don't want to create a panic. Was there a moment in all of this last two months where you said to yourself, ah, this is the leadership test of a lifetime?

No. When you hear this voice and the way he assesses situations in himself, he's drowning in himself. And at one point we're interviewing him and I just offered the commentary.

I feel like I'm talking to a drowning man when he's talking about the virus. And he says, we've got it under control. Taken as a whole, the recordings paint a revealing self-portrait. Is it that he thinks of the presidency as a possession? Yes, I think he does.

I think it's a trophy and he has got it and he is going to hold it. Which leads to one of Woodward's biggest regrets, the question he didn't ask. There was one point where I asked him, I said, I hear that if you lose, you're not going to leave the White House.

Everyone says Trump is going to stay in the White House if it's contested. Well, I don't want to even comment on that. I don't want to comment on that at this time. Hey, Bob, I got all these people.

I'll talk to you later on tonight. It's the only time he had no comment. And this, of course, was months before his loss and kind of slapped myself a little bit.

Why didn't I follow up on that a little bit more? At the end of the book Rage, you said that Donald Trump was singularly unfit to be president. And now, listening to these tapes, you draw a more grave conclusion.

What is that conclusion? Trump was the wrong man for the job. I realize now, two years later, all of the January 6th insurrection leads me to the conclusion that he's not just the wrong man for the job, but he's dangerous.

And he is a threat to democracy, and he's a threat to the presidency because he doesn't understand the core obligations that come with that office. Take a little soul, mix in some rock, country, and blues, and you have the unique sound of Nathaniel Ratliff. Anthony Mason makes the introduction. For the Colorado-based band, Nathaniel Ratliff and the Night Sweats, taking the stage at the Red Rocks Amphitheater is always a kind of homecoming. It was another one of those places that seemed like a dream if we could ever even play there.

And now I'm not even sure how many times I've played there. Success has come late for the 44-year-old Ratliff and his band. He's sung with Paul Simon at the Newport Folk Festival, with Willie Nelson at Outlaw Fest. Nathaniel Ratliff.

And then the musical guest on Saturday Night Live. I just didn't think it was ever going to happen. How come? I don't know. I'm sure somewhere in there it's because I don't feel like I deserve it.

You know, like experiencing joy is not always easy. Nothing has come easily for Ratliff, who was raised in a deeply religious family in Missouri, his hometown tattooed on his arm. Yeah, right there. So where did you live exactly? A little town called Herman, which normally is this red dot right here. At 18, Ratliff moved to Denver with his friend Joseph Pope III. What was it that brought you to Colorado?

We moved out here to work with a missionary organization. But they were quickly disillusioned and started playing bars like the high dive at night. This is where we really cut our teeth. By day, they both got jobs at this truck depot. I'm sure he wasn't stoked about hiring us. We looked like ding-dongs. We've come a long way. It was a great way to write, like just singing to yourself in the truck or singing on the forklift.

Yeah, I would have my tape recorder when I worked in the yard. Ratliff and Pope had started collaborating musically back in Herman. I was in fifth grade, he was in sixth grade, and we were in honors choir. And we didn't really know each other yet, but it's the first real memory I have of singing like, What shall we do with the drunken sailor?

What shall we do with the drunken sailor? Pope has played in all of Ratliff's bands. What's it meant for you to have each other going through all this? You know, I think at times we used each other as a crutch to make it through and just kind of limp through whatever tragedy we were going through. In 2002, it was Pope's testicular cancer. I was going through chemo and we were rehearsing in the back of this house down the street and I remember my hair started to fall out and we stopped practice right there and at the end we shaved his head. In solidarity.

We made it through, yeah. Their first band, Born in the Flood, built a big following in Denver. I think one of our songs was like 40 minutes long, so.

But Ratliff tired of that sound. I actually turned down a record deal for it. You turned down a record deal?

They were offering us like $150,000 and I told my manager, it just doesn't feel right. He went solo for a while, then at 35, decided to start another band. And the way was The Night's What's kind of at your sort of Hail Mary?

That was it, yeah. I was like, well, I was like, I'm going to lose my hair soon. Nobody wants to see a bald rock star, you know. And I was like, I've never been thin, so there's that. Released in 2015, their debut album would go gold behind the salty lead single, S.O.B.

The video has 86 million views now on YouTube. But the rousing chorus foretold problems for Ratliff. In the middle of making the second record, you know, I was struggling with alcoholism. I was going through a separation that would later be a divorce. So what was that period like for you?

Because that's a lot. I thought I was going to have a nervous breakdown. He went on a health retreat. Then his producer, Richard Swift, died.

He kind of lost his struggle with a lot of that stuff. I imagine it was very emotional. It was.

I didn't have any intentions on working with anybody else. We were very close. Was it a wake-up call to you in any way? I think the real wake-up call was when I was at his memorial service and his wife was just like, we're not going to do this for you.

I didn't want anybody to have to bury me either. So, like my mother or my friends. Yeah, you know, I think about Richard. I think about him most days, you know. You can hear it all in his music.

I'm not a great showman. I just care about what I'm singing. Nathaniel Ratliff is trying to live cleaner now, but keep his music on the edge. With rock and roll, it's always best when it's about to fall off the tracks. And you're just like, I can't believe that just happened, you know.

But that's what makes it exciting, you know, when it feels like it's about to fall apart and it doesn't. With his first bestseller, The World According to Garp, John Irving joined the ranks of great American novelists. But just how he sees himself may surprise you.

He's in conversation with Rita Braver. Why do you think of yourself as a 19th century writer? Well, because those novels have always represented the model of the form for me. I loathed Hemingway. I thought Faulkner was excessive.

Fitzgerald was OK, but lazy at times. I was enamored of the kind of novel all of my classmates in school despised. I thought, oh God, Dickens, I've got to read Dickens, I've got to read Hawthorne, you know. But while John Irving's favorite 19th century novel, Moby Dick, was first published in the U.S. at around 600 pages, Irving has just released The Last Chairlift, which goes for almost 900 pages. I know, if only it had been three novels, I could have been paid three times as much. If you write a novel that encompasses a whole lifetime, well, it's hard for that to be a short novel.

Irving has written 15 novels, including some blockbusters. His latest, published by Simon & Schuster, part of Paramount Global, our parent company, revisits some of his recurring themes. I was a mysterious mother, an unknown biological father. This is not a new premise for many of my readers. I was warned against asking you if your books are autobiographical, yet that is what happened to you.

You were not raised by your own birth father. I try to have a little fun with my autobiography, and I often begin a novel in those very familiar scenes. And then I utterly change what happens. So what do you like about living in Toronto?

I like being back in the city again. Now 80, John Irving holds joint U.S.-Canadian citizenship and lives here with his Canadian-born wife, literary agent Janet Turnbull Irving. But he grew up in Exeter, New Hampshire, and, like the narrator of his new book, attended the prestigious Phillips Exeter Academy, where his stepfather taught. As with many of the characters in his novels, wrestling and writing were John Irving's early passions. You don't get to choose your obsessions.

Your obsessions choose you. Irving worked as a teacher and wrestling coach while writing three little-noticed novels. Then one hit it big in 1978. The World According to Garp, which won the National Book Award. When the success happened, I knew how fortunate I was now to be able to do this thing, the only thing I ever wanted to do full-time.

In the 1982 film, Robin Williams played aspiring writer T.S. Garp with John Lithgow as Roberta Muldoon. I hate to use a corny line like this, but haven't I seen you before? You like football? Oh, yeah, I used to watch you quite a bit.

Well, you might have seen me. I was a tight end with the Philadelphia Eagles. Number 90, Robert Muldoon. And there is one person who truly appreciates how revolutionary it was for Irving to create a trans character so many decades ago. It's such a blessing to be able to have that kind of relationship with my dad, to know that he was writing about trans people in 1978. And you were born in? 1991.

John Irving's daughter, Eva Everett Irving, actor, filmmaker and writer, grew up as the youngest of Irving's three sons. She came out as trans in 2015. When I came out, I just knew that you were going to be accepting.

I didn't have to worry about that, and so many people do have to worry about that. It was instinctive for me to say, whoever you determine you are, the more difficult, the more people who might be intolerant of you or hurt you, the more I love you, the more I support you. In The Last Chairlift, the narrator is the only major straight character.

I wanted to turn the scales so that I could see a loving family of queer people who were trying to look after this straight guy who's the last guy to know. The last guy to know everything. Yes. It's a perfect narrator. It is a perfect storyteller. Irving always writes his first draft by hand and always starts with the ending. When I first read Moby Dick, that was the novel that showed me how you foreshadow an ending.

If you really know exactly what's going to happen, you can do it this way. I wanted the sperm whale. In fact, Irving has the last line of Moby Dick tattooed on one arm. Only found another orphan.

On the other arm? Good night, you princes of Maine, you kings of New England. That's the last line from The Cider House Rules.

Irving's screenplay of the novel won him an Oscar in 2000. It was fun. It was gratifying. Michael Dwyer plays a young man who grows up in an orphanage run by a doctor, played by Michael Caine, who also performs illegal abortions to help desperate women.

I came as a physician to the abandoned children and unhappily pregnant women. Do you feel that your role as a writer is in part to speak out on political subjects? There is a political subject. I don't back away from it, but it is never the foundation of why I write a novel.

John Irving says his next novels will be shorter, but he has no plans to stop writing. And he says he often forgets about his age, as at live events when he spots an old friend in the audience. Here I am, an 80-year-old croc sitting on stage, and I look at him and I say, oh my God, he's gotten older. It doesn't even occur to me.

That person's probably looking at me and thinking, oh Jesus, John doesn't look very good. What happened to her, Mario? How could she simply disappear after she was with you? I don't have answers for that. The powers at CBS News present... I'm just going to ask you straight out. Did you kill Kristy Wilson?

No. I had nothing to do with her disappearance. Another season of My Life of Crime with Erin Moriarty. Award-winning correspondent Erin Moriarty brings you face-to-face with killers... I will never say that I'm a cold-blooded killer. I will never say I'm a murderer. ... and the people they took from... John died running, running for his life.

This season, follow the evidence with Erin. Beyond the speculation, including in the death of boxing legend Arturo Gotti... My gut says I don't think he would take his life. I know my husband killed himself. Listen to My Life of Crime from 48 Hours, wherever you get your podcasts. They have a different set of rules for Negroes down there. Are you listening? Yes. You have to be extra careful with white people.

You can't risk looking at them the wrong way. I know. Till is the new film about the 1955 murder of 14-year-old Emmett Till... a crime that helped spark the civil rights movement. The movie has opened to rave reviews... and got us thinking about the 2004 60 Minutes report on Emmett Till's death... from our late colleague, Ed Bradley.

We wanted to share some excerpts of that award-winning story. He was 14 years old when he was kidnapped, tortured and killed. The failure to punish anyone for the crime made headlines across the country and around the world... exposing the racial hatred and unequal justice for blacks... that was pervasive in the segregated South... where laws dictated where blacks could eat and drink and where they could sleep. But, Emmett Till wasn't from the South. He was from Chicago... and just visiting relatives in Mississippi in August of 1955... when his nightmare began.

Emmett's 16-year-old cousin traveled to Mississippi with him... Wheeler Parker Jr., now 65 years old. He loved pranks. He loved fun. He loved jokes. You know, he just... was there in the center of everything.

He was kind of a natural born leader. Why would that be a problem? In Mississippi, why would it be a problem? Did anybody say... look, here are the do's and the don'ts about going to Mississippi. You do this, you don't do that.

Oh yes, that's routine. You're always prepared to go to Mississippi to stay alive... because, you know, once you got to Mississippi, you had no protection under the law. For Emmett Till, the trouble started here... at Bryant's Meat Market and Grocery Store in Money, Mississippi. The store was owned by a white couple, Roy Bryant... and his 21-year-old wife, Carolyn... who was behind the counter the afternoon that Emmett Till and his cousins... came in to buy some candy. As he was leaving the store, Emmett Till whistled at Carolyn Bryant... and she went to get a gun. Simeon Wright, Emmett Till's cousin who lived in Mississippi... was 12 years old on that day. We ran, we jumped in the car and we got out of there. Just because he whistled?

Oh yes. It's like if you're a kid and you're through a rock and break a window... you don't hang around to see what's going to happen. Emmett Till and his cousins raced home that day... and hoped nothing would come of what Emmett had done. But three days later, Carolyn Bryant's husband Roy... and his half-brother J.W. Milam... went looking for Emmett Till in the middle of the night... and found him and his cousins at the home of Reverend Mose Wright... Emmett's late great uncle, Emmett Till and Simeon Wright, Mose Wright's son... were asleep together in one room. I woke up and I looked. I saw two men standing over the bed with the... one had a gun which was J.W.

Milam. I saw Roy Bryant and he ordered Emmett to get up and put his clothes on. And, my mother was pleading and begging with him not to take him. My dad was pleading with him. And, my mother then at that time offered to give them money... to leave Emmett alone. And, Roy Bryant kind of hesitated, but J.W.

Milam... he didn't hesitate at all. I'd have been scared to death. Not only afraid, but there was a... a sorrow, sadness over the whole house looked like. It looked like you could cut the grief in the house.

Because, after they left, no one said anything hardly. On August 31, 1955, three days after he'd been abducted... Emmett Till's mangled body was found by a boy fishing in the waters... of the Tallahatchie River not far from Money. His body had been weighted down by a 75-pound fan from a cotton gin... attached to his neck by barbed wire. He'd been badly tortured. An eye was detached, an ear cut off... and he appeared to have been shot in the head. The local sheriff, H.C. Strider, a plantation owner and ardent segregationist... tried to have the body buried immediately... hoping no one in the outside world would ever find out what happened to Emmett Till. But, Emmett's mother, Mamie, battled with Mississippi authorities... and was able to have her son's body returned to Chicago... so she could identify him before she buried him. I looked at his teeth because I took so much pride in his teeth.

His teeth were the prettiest things I'd ever seen in my life, I thought. And, I only saw two. Who were the rest of them that had just been knocked out? Some 50,000 people, nearly all of them black, turned out for Emmett Till's funeral... Mamie Till ordered the funeral director to place her son in an open casket... and permitted this shocking photograph of Emmett's corpse... which was seen across the country. I said, I want the world to see this... because when people saw what had happened to this little 14-year-old boy... they knew then that not only were men, black men, in danger... but black children as well. The same day that Emmett Till was buried, Roy Bryant and J.W. Milam... were indicted on charges of kidnapping and murder. Their trial was held in the small Mississippi town of Sumner... billed as a good place to raise a boy. The star witness was Emmett Till's late great uncle, Mose Wright... who bravely stood up in the courtroom and pointed his finger at Milam and Bryant... as the ones who had come to his home and abducted Emmett Till at gunpoint. Another key witness was an 18-year-old sharecropper named Willie Reed... who said that on the morning after Emmett Till was abducted... he saw Emmett on a truck with six people... Roy Bryant, J.W. Milam, two other white men and two black men who worked for Milam. Soon after, Reed said he saw the same truck parked in front of a barn... managed at the time by Milam's brother... and heard the screams of a young boy he presumed was Emmett Till. When they found the body, did you put two and two together... and think that what you had heard going on in that barn... that that was Emmett Till? I'm sure. I was sure then. Fearing for his life after testifying against Milam and Bryant... Willie Reed was smuggled out of Mississippi.

He went to Chicago where he suffered a nervous breakdown... and was hospitalized. You're a good man. You had a lot of courage for an 18-year-old. I think there were a lot of people who would have walked away from it. Wouldn't have said a word. No, I couldn't have walked away from that like that... because Emmett was 14, probably never been to Mississippi in his life... and he come to visit his grandfather... and they killed him.

I mean, that's not right. It took the jury just an hour and seven minutes to return a verdict of not guilty. One juror said it wouldn't have taken that long... but they stopped to take a soda pop break to make it look good. Milam and Bryant were congratulated by their many supporters... and kissed their wives in celebration. Four months after the trial, knowing that double jeopardy protected them from being tried again... Roy Bryant and J.W. Milam admitted to a reporter from Look Magazine... that they had in fact tortured and murdered Emmett Till. They were paid $4,000 for their story. Emmett Till's family has had to live with that for nearly 50 years... that his killers confessed and nothing ever happened to them.

J.W. Milam and Roy Bryant confessed that they killed Emmett. The people of the state of Mississippi said they didn't. We need to reconcile that statement... and we need to send a message to those who are committing crimes against blacks like this... that you can get by but you can't get away. This is Intelligence Matters with former acting director of the CIA, Michael Morell. This week, University of Chicago professor Bob Pape joins us to talk about political violence in the United States. I think our democracy is at a precarious moment, Michael. We're used to thinking of the two-party system as the shock absorber. Now, you have political support for violence at the top edge of the leadership of one of those two parties. Follow Intelligence Matters wherever you get your podcasts.

The Good Fight, the final season, now streaming exclusively on Paramount+. Anyone who has gone on a diet knows how hard it is to change your eating habits for one week. You're going to lose weight.

I lost weight, patience and friends. They call him Fluffy, though his actual name is Gabriel Iglesias. It may not surprise you, he likes fast food. He's also a collector of vintage Volkswagens. Most of all, he's very funny.

Tracy Smith catches up with Fluffy just for laughs. It takes a pretty big name to fill L.A.'s Dodger Stadium. The Beatles didn't quite manage it in 66. But Sir Elton John did in 75. And last May, this guy became the first comic ever to sell out the famous ballpark. All for a comedy special that's streaming now on Netflix.

He's Gabriel Iglesias, known to his millions of fans as Fluffy. Such an amazing night. I still tell everybody that is the single greatest night of my life. So far.

So far. The week is young. I don't talk about politics, religion or sports. Because all three will divide people. That's why I talk about food. Because food brings people together. That's right.

Unless you're vegan. Okay, so where did Fluffy come from? It's a nickname that I got many, many years ago. The joke was, I told my mom, I said, Mom, they keep calling me fat. Oh, mijo, you're not fat, you're fluffy. And I'm like, fluffy? Okay, fluffy. And then it just stuck. And I hated it. I hated the fact that people were calling me fluffy, not calling me Gabriel.

And right now, if you Google or you go to any search engine and you put in Fluffy, my face pops up. And so I tell people I own the word. Because literally, I do. My dog loves me so much, he cannot control his own bodily functions. When I would go home, I would immediately pick him up before anything.

And then my girlfriend would get mad. How come you don't come to me first? Because the dog loves me more.

How do you know I don't love you more? I said, I don't see a puddle. He also owns a reputation as one of the most successful comedians working today. And by choice, one of the least controversial. Everyone has opinions. And I tell people, I got strong opinions.

But I don't put them on stage. I go, you want to know how I feel? Buy me a drink. Let's hang out at the bar. Leave your camera in the car, all right? Let's just talk.

As a comic, though, I just want to keep the show fun and friendly for everyone. The youngest of six, Iglesias was just a kid when his parents split up. So he was raised by a single mom. Was she strict? Not strict. She was fair. And I did. I tested her many times as a kid.

Fortunately, I learned quickly that I don't like pain. Yeah, because back then you were allowed to, yeah. And it was encouraged. An occasional spanking or two? Spanking is like, no, my mom had a belt. She had a nail that she put in the kitchen, in the wall, and then she would hang the belt on the nail. And she'd go, I'm your mom, and that's your dad.

Let me know when you want to talk to him. And I'm like, okay. Had anybody got them mothers that would hit you with a shoe? I had a mother that would throw a shoe at you at the drop of a dime. Even as a grade school kid, young Gabriel was a stand-up comedy fan. This one, Eddie Murphy's Raw, was his favorite.

My mom was going to be gone for a couple of hours, and so I got a couple of hours' worth of videotapes, and that's what kept me entertained while she was gone. And Eddie Murphy Raw. Eddie Murphy Raw is what I saw and what inspired me to want to do comedy. Next thing I know, I did a school talent show, and the rest is history. Apollo, please welcome comedian Gabriel Iglesias. Like most new comedians, Fluffy's early gigs didn't pay much. I know a lot of you are probably wondering right now, Gabriel, are you related to?

Who? Ladies, you better believe it. Hey, trust me, after a six-pack and a shot of tequila, I look a lot like Julio. So he took side jobs to scrape by. I knew a contractor, and I called him up and I said, hey, do you have anything I could do for cash? And he goes, well, all I got are guys that are digging ditches. If you're not too good to dig a ditch, I'm like, I'll go dig a ditch. And so I did that just to get cash. So you'd be digging ditches by day when you had to. Digging ditches by day and doing comedy at night.

Well, listen, if we don't leave right now, they're going to close McDonald's, and you're going to have to eat at the airport. But it got better, and within a few years, he went from making a living on stage to making a killing. No one ever gives me a hard time for driving one of these, or 20. Now, with a net worth reportedly in the tens of millions, Fluffy Iglesias can afford to indulge his lifelong passion, Volkswagens. So it went from one VW to how many? A few. Yeah, I don't have a problem. His office in his hometown of Long Beach, California, looks more like a VW museum.

Each one is pristine and drivable. Listen to that. But if you don't struggle, if you don't know what it is to have to earn something, then will you really appreciate it?

How will you take care of it? But it's a hobby that takes a back seat to his career. Fluffy's been known to spend 44 weeks a year on the road. You've had a few health issues that I don't know whether it's due to the relentless pace.

No, it's due to drive-throughs. I'm a heavy guy now, but I used to be 100 pounds heavier, and so it's easy to do it when you're younger, but time starts creeping up on you. You've got to adjust, or it will adjust for you. Did you have alarm bells? I mean, you got diagnosed with diabetes.

Diabetes, yeah. For example, I wear a monitor right here that keeps tabs on my blood sugar and lets me know when I'm acting a fool. But you wear this long enough, you already know. I already know, just looking at something, yeah, that's going to, yeah. It's like a little extra relationship, like, you know you should be doing it. I know. Don't even think about it. I know.

So do you listen to it? Sometimes, but if there's an opportunity for a moment, I feel like I still need my little moments, so yeah. We did it. And few moments are sweeter than his Dodger Stadium gig.

In fact, the day before it happened, Fluffy said he knew it would be a hard act to follow. How do you top this? That's been a question.

What do we do after this? Because like for me, the first thought was after 25 years, maybe I hang it up. I've saved my money. I've paid all my bills.

I don't owe anybody anything. I could actually just ride off into the sunset, and I think nobody would hold it against me if I made this the last show. But then there's also the conversation of, well, if you could do one of these, maybe you could do another one.

And so I think that's more so what we're leaning towards. Yeah, you can't walk away. Come on.

I'm too pretty still. Steve Hartman this morning has a story about small gestures that make a big difference. Just outside Salt Lake City, 46-year-old Shawna Austin is about to let you in on a secret. I've never talked about it, ever.

When Shawna was 20 and single, she got pregnant, says she wasn't ready to be a mom, so she made the decision to place her baby for adoption. It wasn't easy. Do you remember holding him the first time?

Absolutely. What was that like? He was perfect. And I knew I would have him for a short time, so I made every minute count with him. She called the boy Riley and says she held him for 72 hours straight until the time came to let go. Her Riley was now somebody else's Steven. And at this point, like with most closed adoptions, a firewall went up between Shawna and Steven's new parents, no communication whatsoever. And this went on for about a week.

It was like, okay, this is the way it should be. She is part of our family. Adoptive parents Jennifer and Chris Schobinger say they had no interest in excluding the birth mother.

You know, you can't have too many people loving you, right? Why couldn't he be both of ours? So, year after year, they sent Shawna piles of pictures and these bound books detailing Steven's every major and minor milestone, like this complete list of his vocabulary, all so that when Shawna was ready and Steven was ready, they could pick up right where they left off. The two reunited when Steven was seven. Shawna taught him how to fish, and they have been reeling in the memories ever since. I was blessed beyond words.

I kind of got best of both worlds for sure. Steven is now 26, married with a brand new boy of his own, much to the delight of Grandma Shawna. That was really special. It just brought that full circle around. Especially when she heard the baby's name, Riley.

It felt like that name was just supposed to be in the family. I think the lesson we've learned is that sometimes we create barriers, where barriers don't need to be. And when we pull down those barriers, we really find love on the other side.

Words of wisdom to help us all live the life of Riley. Oh my gosh, he is so huge. Ralph Fiennes is an accomplished actor appearing in a new play about a New Yorker, both respected and reviled. Urban planner Robert Moses.

Martha Teichner now on progress and its price. If you don't know who Robert Moses was, this picture of a scowling giant straddling New York City's vast sprawl will give you a hint. And then I did what no one else could do, and it stands, providing a frame for the way New Yorkers live, giving them a structure that's going to last. Actor Ralph Fiennes stars in a play about Robert Moses opening this week. In the city that is what it is even today, the good and the bad, because of the nearly unchecked power RM had for more than 40 years to shape it.

This is such a half-witted bunch of people, my God. The play Straight Line Crazy is by British playwright David Hare. What I like about the play is the provocation of it, is the provocation of a man who challenges you to like him. He does stuff for people.

He's also done terrible stuff to people. Robert Moses, whose very enemies would say that he, more than any other person, is the man who built New York. From this 1963 CBS reports, a partial list of Robert Moses' public works in New York City and beyond. To the east, the United Nations building. Hurts to stride one of those incredible Moses peripheral highways. Then the Whitestone Bridge and the Frog's Neck. Including more than a dozen great bridges and roads, 627 miles of roads. When you were in his presence, one of the things you saw was genius.

The other thing that you saw was, don't get in my way. Robert Caro interviewed him seven times for The Power Broker, his Pulitzer Prize-winning biography of Moses. He's raised to power by the first Irish Catholic governor, Al Smith. He was the first person who listened to Robert Moses' ideas. Al Smith, the popular cigar-chomping product of New York City's immigrant slums, in 1924 began appointing the Yale and Oxford-educated Moses to commissions that enabled him to start accumulating the power to build an empire. Backed by the governor, Moses set his sights first on Long Island. I'm in a hurry and I'm in a hurry to help the millions out there who have no access to a good life. And if a few fences get kicked over in the process, does it really matter?

Please! Moses strong-armed his way across the island, seizing land for two scenic parkways. At the end of those parkways, he built his first public works masterpiece. The tall spire in the center of this picture is the Jones Beach Water Tower. And eight great parking fields like this one can accommodate over 17,000 cars at a time.

Jones Beach opened in 1929, packed with recreational facilities along 6.5 miles of white sand, but accessible essentially only to the white middle class who could afford cars. Moses made sure there would be no train to Jones Beach and deliberately built the overpasses on his parkways so low buses had to get there another way. The first of Moses' commandments for progress is, thou shalt drive. For Moses, that meant constructing more and more expressways. It's like Picasso in front of a canvas.

He sees this whole area with whatever number of people as one picture. But over time, every time he built an expressway, it was overcrowded the minute it opened. And did he ever change his vision to reflect the change in the times and the circumstances?

The answer is absolutely not. Nothing stood in the way. The human tragedy caused by that one mile out of all the miles that he created. In The Power Broker, Robert Caro documents what happened when Moses slashed through a one-mile stretch of the East Tremont neighborhood to build the Cross Bronx Expressway, leaving thousands of people nowhere to go in what looked like a bombed-out war zone. He's saying he's relocating the people humanely. In fact, he's doing nothing to relocate the people. He's just throwing them out. He did it over and over again, threw out of their homes 500,000 people.

Just think what that is. How come nobody stopped him? They couldn't. Moses was appointed, not elected, to positions of enormous power that put him beyond the reach of the eight New York City mayors and six governors he outlasted. In a democratic society, his power had nothing to do with democracy.

With that anti-democratic power, he shaped the greatest metropolis in the Western world. Don't pay too much attention to the critics. Never build anything.

No critic ever built anything. And that was just it. Robert Moses did build things and not just roads. Moses-style urban renewal was copied all over the United States to people whose neighborhoods he didn't destroy.

He was a hero until he wasn't. The need is there, clearly, for three elevated expressways here, here, and here. The obstacle in his path this time? Manhattan's historic Washington Square Park. Traffic would come down Fifth Avenue and then it would continue right through here, right under the arch. The park would become, in effect, an on-ramp to his planned expressway across lower Manhattan.

He would have completely destroyed it. But instead of poor people who had no clout, the opposition included Eleanor Roosevelt. Visible and vocal among its leaders was activist Jane Jacobs. We need war, full out and flat out, to stop this hideous violation which Moses is planning.

They did stop it. They are joined by a fair president... Robert Moses ran the 1964 New York World's Fair, but it was a financial failure. By 1968, he had been maneuvered out of power.

He died in 1981 at 92, embittered. Now, of course, suddenly fashionable to dislike me because I'm the dirty bastard who pushed through the things democracy needed but which democracy couldn't deliver. And secretly people know that. They know I'm necessary. But was his creation worth the cost?

The city that we're living in today is still, for better and for worse, his city. Thank you for listening. Please join us when our trumpet sounds again next Sunday morning. With Paramount Plus, the time has come to dance, laugh, sing, stand up and celebrate.

From original series like Cecilia and Star Trek Discovery. We are your family. To family favorites like Dora the Explorer and the Casagrandes. Now this is a party. To new movies like Secret Headquarters and Beatriz at Dinner. Nice to meet you. Let's rediscover who we are, how far we've come and where we'll go next. One Mountain, Una Familia. Stream the Hispanic Heritage Collection on Paramount Plus. A popular college professor found dead in a hot tub, accident or murder, suspected her boyfriend. Then a stunning act from their host, a sudden shotgun blast.

There's something he's hiding. Follow and listen to the 48 Hours podcast on Apple Podcasts, Amazon Music, wherever you get your podcasts.
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