CBS Sunday Morning,

Our CBS Sunday morning podcast is sponsored by Edward Jones. College tours with your oldest daughter. Updating the kitchen to the appropriate decade.

Retiring on the coast. Life is full of moments that matter, and Edward Jones helps you make the most of them. That's why every Edward Jones financial advisor works with you to build personalized strategies for now and down the road. So when your next moment arrives, big or small, you're ready for it.

Life is for living. Let's partner for all of it. Learn more at edwardjones.com. Our welcome to summer comes from the Sons of Sunday Morning editor Joseph Friendino, Austin and Braden Friendino, along with their University of Connecticut trumpet professor Lewis Hanslick. Good morning and happy Father's Day.

I'm Jane Pauley and this is Sunday Morning. To begin today, we'll be in conversation with Governor Andrew Cuomo of New York, who has much to say about COVID-19, racial justice, and the state of our lives. Once the epicenter of the coronavirus pandemic, New York now has one of the lowest infection rates in the nation, and many give the state's governor the credit.

Nobody knows. But with crowds growing, Andrew Cuomo sees a crisis far from over. The federal government should step in aggressively and own it.

In my state, I owned the situation. Ahead, in conversation with Governor Andrew Cuomo. As you might guess, many of the nation's small businesses are facing big problems, and COVID-19 is just one of them, as we'll be hearing from senior contributor Ted Koppel. They trim nails and drive trucks and provide the food we eat. They are old and young, all races and backgrounds, and these are hard times for most of them. Just about set up and ready to pull out, but he decided he wanted to go with the chief of companies.

I'm not that one. Yes, absolutely. I try to call everyone just to give them a courtesy call, say, hey, we're open.

Small businesses are the backbone of our economy, and millions of them are struggling to stay afloat. You do whatever you have to do. Coming up on a Sunday morning. Tim Cook is the CEO of Apple, and on the eve of the Tech Giants annual worldwide developers conference, this morning he's talking with our John Dickerson. Tim Cook says he's happiest among people who share his love for technology, but an important part of his job is putting in facetime with those who don't share all of his values.

There are always things that good people can work on together, I think, that have even people with very different views. It sounds like you're describing your interactions with President Trump. Well, I would, that wasn't where I was going. I didn't think I was going to do that.

Well, that wasn't where I was going. One-on-one with Tim Cook, later on Sunday morning. With Tracy Smith, we take note of new music from Yusuf Islam, formerly Cat Stevens. Jeff Piguet's surveys proposals to reform the nation's police. Michelle Miller tells the true tale of today's black cowboys, plus Jim Gaffigan and more.

Our Sunday morning for the 21st of June 2020 will be back in a moment. He's been among the most, if not the most prominent governors in the land these past few months, which is why I'm in conversation with New York's Governor Andrew Cuomo. The executive mansion in Albany, New York has been home to, among others, Grover Cleveland, Theodore Roosevelt, Franklin Roosevelt. FDR, this is a wheelchair that he used in this home.

And for the past nine years, Andrew Cuomo. It's a lovely home, but it's not homey. Where's the homey part? There is no homey part.

We live more on the second floor, is a little more casual. And familiar, his father, Mario Cuomo, who died in 2015, was a three-term governor of New York. I can see him sitting right in that corner, watching a ball game with the telephone.

He was never more than 10 feet away from the telephone. Today, Andrew Cuomo is having a moment. Good morning. Despite being the global epicenter of the COVID crisis this spring, suffering a staggering death toll of 25,000, it was a silent explosion that just ripples through society. New Yorkers give their governor an approval rating of nearly 80%. COVID arrived with a single confirmed case on March 1st.

Her condition is mild. Three weeks later, infections now in the thousands. New York State on pause. Cuomo shut down the state.

Some say not soon enough. The curve is actually increasing. He marshaled New Yorkers to battle the curve. The virus rate is wholly dependent on what you do.

How high and how steep was in their hands? We slowed the infection rate by our actions. You have a political jiu-jitsu. You and a handful of other governors asked people to do hard things and got more popular. Go figure. When is it over?

Nobody knows. This was a frightening period. People were afraid for their life, literally.

How do I keep my elderly parents safe? You personally? I felt that also and I wanted to connect with the people I was talking to. And talk he did. Today is day 56. From March 2nd until just last Friday.

From worst to first, we are controlling the virus better than any state in the country. 111 daily briefings kept New Yorkers informed and riveted. You picked the 26,000 people who were going to die.

While watching the curve rise. 779 people. The state needed help from the federal government. Just give me my money back, Senator. He called on another New Yorker, President Trump, also from Queens.

Some say that's where the similarity ends. I said to the president, there's only one truth. My state needs help. Every state needs help. This is a federal crisis.

And if you shirk your federal responsibility, I will say that. And I was true to that. The president sent in the Army Corps of Engineers.

We built temporary hospitals all across the state. He sent up the US Navy ship Comfort. He did that. But in Cuomo's view, President Trump could have and should have done more. I know he appreciates it.

He just can't quite get the words out, but that's okay. This was a national crisis. The federal government should step in aggressively and own it. In my state, I owned the situation. For better or worse. For better or worse. It was always a schizophrenia from the federal government.

They would help when pushed to help. There were voices that always wanted to minimize it. This is just the flu. It's going to pass. Because, you know, this virus is going to disappear. And then there was a desire to reopen, reopen, reopen.

I'd love to have it open by Easter. And you know where we are now? Dow Jones tumbles again. Fear of second wave. That's what happens when you reopen and you don't do it intelligently.

You do it politically. After peaking in early April, New York began to flatten the curve. And in May, it started to bend. New Yorkers grabbed that projection curve with two hands and pulled it down.

By June, the state reported the lowest infection rate in the nation. We've been on the decrease for the past 60 days. But at such great cost, is it a wonder that people are weary and eager to move on?

Despite COVID cases rising in more than 20 states, the president is in campaign mode, holding rallies and declining to wear a mask. I would wear one if I thought it was important. Masks became about ideology. Yes, and that was a mistake. Who made that mistake?

Was it the president? The history books are going to have to decide. How will history record you answered that question?

I'll answer for my actions and then history will decide. History turns on times like these. In rapid succession, three seismic events. Global pandemic, an economic aftershock, and then eight minutes and 46 seconds that galvanize the world. In this social movement against 400 years of racism in this country, there's a moment. How do you capture it?

How do you make it last? Here's a great question. Mr. Floyd's murder. That is one in a long list of horrendous situations. You can go back to Rodney King 30 years ago.

I'm gonna do the Alo brutalized. Eric Garner was killed in New York, much the same way 60 years earlier. Outrage, but not the national international outrage. I think because it's the same moment between COVID and Mr. Floyd's murder. We are one. We are connected.

When you killed Mr. Floyd, you killed my brother, my family member, and I stand with the protesters. Just as millions of American families have watched history unfold at home together, so has the Cuomo family in a grand house where old and new memories meet. All the family holidays were here. My mother did the renovation of the whole mansion. So my mother can walk into a room now. She'll tell you exactly every piece of furniture, every piece of fabric.

So there are a lot of great memories. New York's former first lady, Matilda Cuomo, hasn't seen the house or her son lately. When did you see your mother last? Oh, breaks my heart. I have not seen her since this started. I put myself in a lot of situations where I might be exposed.

My mother is still young, but she is in a category where she is vulnerable. So I've literally not seen her since this started. But the governor doesn't lack for company. The COVID lockdown brought his three daughters home. This is a gift. This will never happen again.

Every second I get, I spend time with them. And the boyfriend was here? And the boyfriend was here. The boyfriend is now gone.

No, he's still in the overall. Cuomo was married for 15 years to Carrie Kennedy, the daughter of Robert F. Kennedy, and until last year was in a long relationship with author and TV chef Sandra Lee. But he's unattached now. You are a bachelor. You've got a nice house here. Having a moment and you can't do a thing with it. Is your social life in a phase one relationship possibly?

Is that an unfortunate set of circumstances? Well, I think... Because I know you're a bachelor. I know you've talked about being available. Yeah, the house isn't mine. Sort of like a rental. I will move out one day. I can reopen the economy.

But dating, that's a whole different thing beyond my control. Pity, isn't it? I find it really hard to accept after decades in government, you don't have a political agenda in your future that's on the back of your mind. Four years from now, either Donald Trump will not run for reelection or Joe Biden will be 82. And probably there will be search for a Democratic nominee. And I cannot believe that Andrew Cuomo won't be on that stage. Joe Biden is going to be the president of the United States. I believe that. I believe Joe Biden will run for a second term.

At 82? Yes. And I hope to be the governor of the state of New York. I have something to contribute. This is my home. I love it. And I'm happy. What is it with Cuomo? The fact that your father never ran for president is still, you know, one of the great mysteries of political life.

What does your mother say? We haven't had that conversation. Really? Really. Cowboys aren't just the stuff of movies and old TV westerns.

Far from it. Michelle Miller tells us that for cowboys and cowgirls of a certain storied tradition, their time is now. On a recent Sunday in June, Randy Hooks saddled up his horse to join hundreds of other marchers in Compton, California.

It's not a protest. It's a peace ride. Hook is the leader of the Compton cowboys.

We're not going out there to cause havoc. We're going out there to showcase what it looked like to come together. I'm the only woman a part of the Compton cowboys.

Kiara Monique also rode that day alongside her mother and her three-year-old daughter. We stand out more because this is something that you wouldn't necessarily see in any other neighborhood, especially in Compton. When people think of Compton, I think, you know, there are images of early 90s gangster rap.

You know, Dr. Dre, Eazy-E, N.W.A. And there's also images of violence and death. Walter Thompson Hernandez has written a book about the Compton cowboys, a generation of young black people who learned to ride as children. Their motto, the streets raised us, horses saved us. Each one will tell you in different ways that if it wasn't for these horses, you know, they feel that they wouldn't be alive today. The ranch to me is there's so much more than a horse ranch. It's been oasis and a place where people go to heal and to find meaning. Many Americans first learned of black cowboys and cowgirls when they appeared in recent protests marches around the country. Unfortunately, in the United States is that we're invisible in a lot of different places.

What do we have here? This is our black cowboy walk of fame. In fact, there is a long, proud history of black cowboys in America.

When people come in and see our little house museum and all of these wonderful pictures of actual cowboys, it blows you away. Terry Gentry is a docent at the Black American West Museum in Denver, Colorado. Almost one in three cowboys was black. One in three?

Yes. Among them, Edward Cheatham, Nat Love, and Bass Reeves. He arrested over 3,000 people during his career as a deputy marshal. From what we understand, the stories of the Lone Ranger were based on Bass Reeves' life. After the Civil War, says Gentry, black cowboys played a key role in settling the West. Why would the cowboy way appeal to so many of these formerly enslaved people? There's an incredible amount of freedom with managing cattle.

It's a very, very tough way to make a living, but I would imagine there's a lot of gratification in being out in the open plains, underneath the stars. Maurice Wade learned to ride on his grandfather's farm, but... I used to watch cowboys on TV, and I never saw an African-American cowboy. If we did see one, he was like on the truck wagon on trail drives. Then, the Bill Pickett Invitational Rodeo started up, named for famous rodeo bulldogger, Bill Pickett. And you were like, whoa, there are a lot of us. Yes, I was, whoa.

In fact, I said, where's the spaceship these brothers come from? He still competes, and also champions young riders. Like 12-year-old Savannah Roberts, who won the Bill Pickett Ladies Barrel Racing Championship in Denver this year. Is the adrenaline rush deep?

The adrenaline is more towards the beginning of the run, but once I get going, I don't feel anything when I'm running. And then just let him go to second and third. Her sister, Aaliyah, is her coach. Good girl. And also competes.

Set and look. Every black kid in America should have an opportunity to experience what we experience. Back in Compton, one of the cowboys' main goals is to pass on the tradition that's been a gift to them. We all have a passion for horses. We all have a passion for giving back, and we all want to help our community be able to give them experience that we have gotten from horses. What brings the Compton Cowboys together is the idea that they're going to be a part of the family.

They're going to come to the Cowboys together is the idea that if they don't teach the next generation that they might be Compton's last black cowboys. For small business, the COVID-19 pandemic continues to pose some very big problems. Economists estimate more than 100,000 small businesses have closed for good in recent months.

And as senior contributor Ted Koppel explains, many others are fighting to survive. Jenna Cow is trying to breathe life back into her 13-year-old Atlanta area business. And you're doing gels for your hands too, right? Chateau de Nails. Thank you for calling Chateau de Nails. I can help you. Georgia was one of the first states to reopen in late April.

Okay, 97.3. These days it means limiting the number of people in her salon while coaxing the fearful, those still reluctant to venture out, to come back. So Miss Ellen, we do require everyone to wear a mask when they come in. Cleaning, sanitizing, for their sake certainly. Wash your hands for 20 seconds, both you ladies. But also to stifle her own worries about bringing something home that might infect her daughters, aged three and six.

Jenna's a single mom. I'm going to be very honest, I am still very scared. Every day that I work, I come home thinking, did I do the right thing today?

And I get scared to kiss my kids, wondering if I picked up anything today. David Wood runs a dairy farm outside Amsterdam, New York. He's 78 and that makes him particularly vulnerable to the coronavirus.

He doesn't like it, but he needs to stay away. He can only visit his farm once a week. A milk buyer called while we were there. I can look it up.

I'm up at the farm right now. A lot of cancelled orders lately. We'll figure it out. It's always something. 30 workers care for what is now a herd of 3,600 head of livestock, all oblivious to the coronavirus.

The cows do not care that 40 percent of the milk they produce normally goes to restaurants that are currently closed or heavily scaled back, nor do they care that one of the farm's tractors broke down that day. Turns out we got a bad computer. Tell them the four-wheel drive not to shut off. Have you got what you need to fix it with?

I'll have to see. So we live with it. We've got extra tractors.

I always keep three, four extra just to accommodate something like that. I have no idea what tractors cost or what it costs to fix a tractor. So I sent one of our tractors out to be fixed and that had a price tag of $44,000. I wasn't ready for that.

I thought it might be 20. Rodney Maureen is an independent trucker. He comes from a long line of truckers. His father drove a truck, as did his father's father and several of his uncles. Rodney does almost all his own maintenance. If I have to change the entire head on the engine, I'll do that, head gaskets, pretty much everything. What needs to be done on my truck, I'll do it myself. Home is Opelousas, Louisiana. Business is picking up a little, but Rodney still spends more time at home than is good for business.

Another little cancel. Personally, I believe they just found the carry to do it cheaper than I would. He hauls everything from soap to oil refinery equipment. He hasn't been landing contracts for the essential goods that are helping some truckers and companies prosper.

Tell me what kind of jobs you've had over the last month, let's say. I think I've moved two loads and I've had about six of them canceled on me, simply because I wouldn't reduce my rate. And they just found another truck that would do it cheaper. So in the last month, you've only had two runs? Correct.

Is that enough to keep body and soul together? The avid truck driver? No, but I'm not the avid truck driver. I have additional skills. I changed two transmissions for other people. I just finished a welding job yesterday, actually. I have additional way to make income, but I'm an old school trucker.

I say I came through the old school way of trucking and when I graduated the old school, they locked the door and closed the school. When we read in the newspapers that there are hundreds of billions of dollars now that are being made available for small businessmen, you're a small businessman, right? Yes, sir. I'm a micro business.

A micro business is one that employs fewer than 10 employees. Since we talked, Rodney got $6,800 in federal loan assistance, but that, he says, won't last long. So right now we're using our personal credit to stay in business. So I got to ask you a couple of questions.

Have you or anyone in your family been sick of COVID-19 in the last two weeks? No. Jenna Kao's nail salon is open, but business remains limited. We're only open at this point, maybe two to three days a week. Can you stay afloat financially? If you're asking if we're breaking even, no, we're not.

We're not at all. We need to open every single day, but there's no demand right now. Hi.

How are you? Our clientele is predominantly 45 plus, so a lot of them are still scared. They always call back and cancel, say, you know what?

My daughter says to hold off, and I've gotten so many of those phone calls. Now, just to complicate things further, you were on the verge of opening a second salon, right? Still trying to open the second salon.

So this is my new space. It's in a brand new shopping center that's still under construction. Several of the other businesses, says Jenna, have already folded. Hearing that, it's just really scary because if I don't open this business, then I lose everything that I've already put in. When you say a lot of money, what are you talking about?

So far, I dumped about $40,000 into it already of my own money. So it would be a huge loss for me. And what's your biggest worry?

The biggest worry is just, you know, the business not surviving. Do you drink lemonade in Arendelle? asks the mayor. Because this is how I feed my kids. Oh, did I say that wrong? Oh, okay. This is my livelihood.

Just stay in touch through the summer and see what happens. David Wood's dairy business operates on a much greater scale. For about a week in April, he tells us he was losing about $20,000 to $25,000 a day. Well, the worst thing that's happened is we had to dump some milk. I lost about eight loads, and that's expensive. A load, that is a trailer load of milk, is about 7,500 gallons. Eight loads, 60,000 gallons of milk, dumped over the course of three weeks.

Cows do not stop producing because of a changing market. Millions of hungry people, and you have thousands upon thousands upon thousands of gallons of milk that you have to throw away. Isn't there some way of letting organizations come and pick up that milk and feed people? Well, the milk that we produce is raw milk. And there is a chance that some type of bacteria could be in it. So for us to have somebody come in and take our milk, I'd be glad to do it. It's better than giving it away or throwing it away.

You can't do that for the risk, and it's illegal. The challenges are staggering. But what David and Rodney and Jenna have in common Thank you for calling Chateau de Nils. I can help you. is an uplifting sense of optimism. I don't know. I suppose I could be a negative thinker, but I choose not to. I choose to look on a positive basis and try to be ready for the unexpected, if that happens.

You're going to make it through this all right? Oh, absolutely, because that's what we do. When we break down on the side of the road, and we walk six miles, four miles to get what we need to get back to fix our truck and still deliver our load in the morning and no one knows the difference, that's what we do.

We're the modern day cowboy. How do we wrap this conversation up, Jenna? What's the bottom line here? You know, we're all doing the best that we can. And, you know, for everyone to be kind and everything that we're doing is everybody use their best judgment.

So if you want to come out and get your nails done, then you can use your best judgment on that. The Good Fight, the final season, now streaming exclusively on Paramount Plus. In this time of great unease, we wondered what was happening at Apple with John Dickerson of 60 Minutes. We're about to find out from CEO Tim Cook. As we speak right now, you're full of secrets.

I'm full of secrets and it's hard not to overflow right now, but I've been trained well. Tim Cook will finally get to share those secrets tomorrow when he kicks off Apple's 31st Annual Worldwide Developers Conference. We want to talk about now the next opportunity to transform the world. It's a gathering of programmers from around the world who create the content that fuels what Apple calculates is a half a trillion dollar app-based economy. Well, if you're a consumer, you find out some of your most favorite software features are announced there.

If you're a developer, you get some new technology that you can incorporate in your app and make your app even better. And if you're somebody like me that sort of steps back and looks at it all, you see the intersection of technology and the liberal arts and it really makes your heart sing. So are you among your people there when this happens?

Oh yes, oh yes, I'm among everyone. If it were physical, I'd be right there with everybody else. But the conference will not be physical this year. For the same reason we're doing this interview 2,500 miles apart.

It's a consequence of COVID-19. Apple will host a virtual conference promising more than just a grainy workaround. They're promising to innovate the form. And we are calling it iPhone. Apple's iPhone introduced in 2007 has transformed not just communication, but nearly every aspect of our lives. And the iPhone has helped make Apple one of the wealthiest companies in the world, with a market capitalization comparable to the gross domestic products of Australia, Spain, or even Saudi Arabia.

Apple has a market cap of about $1.4 trillion. What is the role of the CEO in a socially responsible company that has that kind of size in the world? You know, there was a time back many years ago where CEOs were just supposed to focus on profits only and not so much the constituencies. And that's never been my view.

I've never subscribed to that. Cook recently posted a statement on Apple's homepage addressing the death of George Floyd at the hands of Minneapolis police, an incident that may very well have gone unnoticed, if not for cell phone video. Do you ever reflect on the role the iPhone has played in being able to record moments like the nearly nine minutes that George Floyd had an officer's knee on his neck? We are humbled by it. We are humbled by it. We are humbled by it.

We are humbled by it. And if you look back in time, some of the most dramatic societal changes have occurred because someone captured video. This was true about things that happened in Birmingham. It was true about things that happened in Selma. The thing that has changed, though, and we're very proud of this, is that we put a camera in everybody's pocket. And so it becomes much tougher as a society, I believe, to convince themselves that it didn't happen or that it was or that it didn't or it happened in a different manner or whatever it might be. And I think fundamentally, this one will change the world. Tim Cook has been Apple's CEO for nearly a decade now, and he is a product of a very different world.

He was born in 1960 in small town Robertsdale, Alabama. Do you remember your first experience with racism? I remember, John, as if it were yesterday, seeing doors that said, and sometimes it had been tried to scratch through, whites only, and fundamentally not understanding how people could convince themselves that this was right. I do believe optimistically, this is one of those moments that we can make significant progress. For so many things, it seems like there's such slow progress. And then all of a sudden, there's a giant leap. You want to make that leap bigger. That's exactly right.

That's exactly right. Six years ago, Cook took a leap of his own, becoming the first openly gay Fortune 500 CEO. The Supreme Court recently said that there can no longer be discrimination against people based on their orientation. What was your reaction to that?

I was incredibly grateful for their opinion, and I applaud the justices who stood up and did that. Cook's outspokenness on civil rights has put him on what might appear to be a collision course with President Donald Trump. In your interactions with Donald Trump, you have a lot of issues that Apple cares about, but the administration also has policies on immigration, on human rights that are totally antithetical to your personal views. Do you bring up some of these issues with Donald Trump in your conversations?

Of course I do. And on that issue, in my mind, as I said before, all roads lead to equality. I believe that everyone should be treated with dignity and respect. It's basically that simple. And that we start life on this equal footing, and then the people that work hard can get ahead and those sorts of things, but we should start life on an equal footing.

And I long for that day. There is one issue, however, where Cook appears to see eye to eye with the president, keeping corporate taxes low. What is the metric you think about in terms of your desire to be socially responsible and your fiduciary duty to keep basically paying as low taxes as possible? Well, our responsibility is to pay what we owe, just plain and simple. But as you think about it, paying what you owe is kind of, that's the standard.

Every company does that. Is there a way in which the value proposition you've been talking about operates when it comes to paying taxes? Well, you can see that we do a lot more than pay taxes. We turned the company upside down to help the world on COVID and donated all of that hundreds of millions of dollars.

And so I think my own view is you pay what you owe in taxes and then you give back to society. And Apple is clearly doing that. COVID-19 is affecting more than just the company's bottom line. Take a look at Apple's multi-billion dollar California headquarters.

It's nearly empty. And Tim Cook would like nothing more than to get his people back under one gleaming roof. That is the biggest challenge, I would say, in what we're dealing with. The thing that I worry that we'll be missing is the serendipity that we all count on.

And so for that reason, I can't wait until we're all back together again. We are all called in the age of COVID-19 to tolerate extraordinary uncertainty. How has it been managing that, both in terms of products and also your employees, the uncertainty of the world we live in now? Well, you know, people generally dislike uncertainty, I would say, as a general rule. I know very few people that thrive on uncertainty. They try to take an uncertain thing and make it a bit more certain. They do that by estimating where things are going, by predicting the worst that can happen and the best that can happen. And we have done all of those things, I would tell you.

But the most important thing for us is we viewed it as a challenge to overcome. As you might expect, this year, Father's Day has special meaning for our Jim Gaffigan. Did you know that the number one gift that dads want on Father's Day is a phone call from their children?

That's right. Not a tie, not a book, not a bottle of booze, not barbecue equipment, not even one of those ugly and personal world's best dad coffee mugs, which by the way, no dad wants. 47% of all dads just want a phone call from their children. You know what? That makes sense.

That's all I want. See, if I got a phone call from my children, I guess I should explain. I've spent the last three months with my children and only my children. That's 101 days of phone calls. 101 days of quality time with my kids and only my kids. I mean, who's keeping track of time?

If you're playing at home, it's over 2,400 hours of just them. If they called me on Father's Day, that would mean they wouldn't be around me. I wouldn't be able to hear them scream and complain. Well, if they called me, I would know they were calling and I would let the call go to voicemail and then I would text, sorry, I can't talk right now. Call you in five minutes, but I'd never call. That would be the best Father's Day ever. I'm kidding, kind of. Happy Father's Day, everyone.

Call your dad, especially if you live with him. From the President to the Congress to the demonstrators out on the streets, calls for police reform came from many quarters this past week. Here's Jeff Pegues.

The signs are everywhere. Defund, demilitarize, abolish. Calls for wholesale changes in policing that may have seemed unthinkable just a few weeks ago. I think we need to understand that law enforcement is an actual governmental agency that needs to be held accountable and needs to have less power over our communities.

Patrice Cullors is a co-founder of Black Lives Matter, a lifelong activist and recently co-author of a memoir about the movement. We have sort of created this idea that law enforcement is the community and they are not. They have been a deeply repressive force. They haven't just killed black communities.

They've humiliated, they've abused, they've violated over and over again. Black Lives Matter started in 2013 after the killing of Trayvon Martin in Florida. It has become more prominent as the number of killings of black people continued. Michael Brown in Ferguson, Breonna Taylor in Louisville, George Floyd in Minneapolis, Rashad Brooks in Atlanta. When you're saying Black Lives Matter, are you saying that black lives matter more than other lives?

Great question. We're saying black lives matter too. What we're really saying is all lives won't matter until black lives matter. Has there always been this tension between the black community and police?

Yes, yes, and for good reason. Gary Potter is a criminology professor at Eastern Kentucky University who has written about the history of policing in America, which in the south dates back to the early 1700s and the slave patrols. Slave patrols were designed to perform three functions, to apprehend runaway slaves, to provide deterrence against the possible slave revolt, and also to create a kind of atmosphere of terror around plantations so that there were no disorders, no uprisings. In the 1800s, those slave patrols evolved into police departments, while in the north, departments grew out of colonial watch programs. The 1900s saw police in some places with the help of the Ku Klux Klan cracking down on black Americans, enforcing racial segregation and suppressing calls for equality.

That tension between black and blue still exists to this day. The black community is over policed for minor infractions that would draw virtually no attention anywhere else. Statistics show that black people are imprisoned at five times the rate of whites, and three times more likely than whites to be killed by police. So are you calling all police officers racist? No, this is not an issue of the individual. This is an issue of a system that has been in place for a very long time that is wedded to institutional racism. So it's less about the individual. Although many people are asking for individual officers who've caused harm and violence to be accountable, we're talking about systems, and that is very, very important for people to understand.

I think that there are things that we can absolutely do better. Terrence Cunningham most definitely does not want to abolish the police. He's a former police chief in Wellesley, Massachusetts. But in 2016, when he was president of the International Association of Chiefs of Police, he delivered a speech that he hoped would improve police community relations. The first step in this process is for the law enforcement profession and the IACP to acknowledge and apologize for the actions of the past and the role that our profession has played in society's historical mistreatment of communities of color.

It was a bold but controversial acknowledgement that you can't change the future without admitting the mistakes of the past. A police officer, a young officer comes on the job today, and they feel they have complete objectivity, that there's no implicit bias, that there's no racism built into their thought process. And then you've got the lens of the African American community that have been oppressed at the hands of the police for at least since the late 19th century, early 20th century. So when that officer makes that car stop at two o'clock in the morning, they have to understand that history. And when they put that uniform on, they put all that history on with it. If we don't understand that history, then we are doomed to repeat it.

If that's the past, here's how Cunningham looks to the future. We need to change the way we recruit people. Right now, we still recruit like we're 90% law enforcement and 10% social services.

We're quite frankly, it's just the opposite now. It's 90% social services and 10% law enforcement actions that we take. And that might get to the heart of a large part of the Defund the Police movement. The idea that police are spending most of their time not preventing or solving crimes, but on what are essentially social issues. Why is your local law enforcement the first responder to mental health care needs? Why are they the first responder to homelessness? Why are they the first responder to drug and alcohol abuse? And oftentimes, what we've seen over and over again, is people calling the police specifically around mental health care crisis, and then dying because of it. There are actually more police in this country than all the types of social workers combined. We need to fully fund, more fully fund education, mental health services, drug rehab and education, and simple health services so that someone with an alcohol problem doesn't get shot in the back at a Wendy's restaurant. And to do that, we probably need to remove some of the funding from police and move it to other services. Across the country, reform proposals include efforts to reduce the power of police unions, which are often obstacles to change. But activists point hopefully to programs like CAHOOTS in Eugene, Oregon. There, 911 operators routinely dispatch social workers and medics to calls for help, instead of an officer with a gun. We want to release our addiction to an economy of punishment and actually lean into an economy of care. And we believe that our communities will be better off because of it. The Supreme Court handed down a landmark ruling for gay and transgender workers this past week.

Some thoughts on that this morning from one of the plaintiffs in the case. I'm Gerald Bostock, and seven years ago, I was fired because I'm gay. I was in a dream job.

I loved working on behalf of underserved children in Clayton County, Georgia, near Atlanta. For 10 years, I had a glowing record. And then I joined a gay softball league to work on my health after beating prostate cancer.

That's when things changed. Within six months, I was fired. I lost my job and my medical insurance while in recovery after my cancer treatment. My story is just one of so many stories. So many others have lived in fear of being their true selves at work. But along with my fellow plaintiffs in this case, Amy Stevens and Don Zarda, may you now rest in peace.

I fought back, and that fight became so much bigger than anything I could have imagined. This past week, we won. Our nation's highest court held an employer who fires a person for being gay or transgender defies the law. Now, no one has to go to work fearing they'll lose their job because of who they are or who they love. Thank you to the Supreme Court for recognizing basic human rights and sending a clear signal that we should treat each other with dignity and respect. We still have a long way to go to stamp out discrimination. I know that there are people that are uncomfortable right now, and when I say people, I mean everyone. Recent events underscore the injustices in our society and remind us that we have to work harder.

Discrimination of any kind has no place in this world. I hope this decision provides hope to the LGBTQ people everywhere and to all those who work to uphold and support our civil rights. Thank you. I'm Jane Pauley.

Thanks for listening, and please join us when our trumpet sounds again next Sunday morning. This is Intelligence Matters with former acting director of the CIA, Michael Morell. Bridge Colby is co-founder and principal of the Marathon Initiative, a project focused on developing strategies to prepare the United States for an era of sustained great power competition. The United States put our mind to something we can usually figure it out. What people are saying and what we kind of know analytically and empirically is our strategic situation, our military situation, is not being matched up with what we're doing. Follow Intelligence Matters wherever you get your podcasts.