Democrats Pursuing Impeachment with 12 Days Left in Trump Presidency

Today on Sekulow Radio with 12 days left in the Trump presidency, the Democrats are pursuing impeachment and some Republicans are joining them. We'll talk about that today on JSekulow Live.

684-3110. And now your host, Jordan Sekulow. I mean, yes, you heard that right. With 12 days left to go in President Trump's term and after he released the video yesterday saying it'll be a peaceful transition of power and, you know, Joe Biden will be the next President of the United States in very kind of simple video terms, straight terms to the American people. Because of the actions that they believe he incited and it's mostly Democrats who are floating this idea of impeachment but it's got Republican public support from at least one House member, Adam Kinzinger, and one U.S. Senator, Ben Sasse, has said he would consider, remember the House impeaches and the Senate tries and then convicts or acquits and Ben Sasse has said that he would consider voting to convict. So that's a Republican U.S. Senator.

Right now the makeup of the U.S. Senate because you've got one seat, a couple of seats that aren't filled, so 51 to 48 because that one seat and so two-thirds would be 66. When that seat is certified it would be back to 100 and it would be back to the normal number of 67 to actually convict. Now you may be asking the question could this even happen in 13, right now 12 days? And Dad, I mean, we've been, usually that would not be the case in a normal impeachment because you would have a long period of time in the House and then a trial but they don't have to do that.

Right. They can bring articles, first of all, I think it would be a gigantic mistake to institute articles of impeachment when the President is going to be out of office in 12 days. So why divide the country so significantly when the President in fact is going to be out of office in 12 days? So that to me is whether you have the constitutional basis to start an impeachment proceeding which Congress as long as they vote it they can have the authority.

But then you have to ask it is that a good idea for whatever the purpose is? And then getting it over to the Senate for a trial, if they passed articles of impeachment on, you know, Monday, are they even in session fan Monday? They will be Jay, they will be on Monday, yes. Okay, so maybe if they're in session Monday they passed articles of impeachment, are they going to get them over to the House, the Senate?

What's the rule on that? So in the House of Representatives, Jay, I mean they could bring them up and vote on them basically as soon as they wanted to if Speaker Pelosi would push that. I mean she probably has the margins in the Senate. But look, I think the Senate could bring them up as soon as possible.

I mean you know typically what a Senate impeachment trial looks like better than just about anybody. But I think here the key message here, Jay, is to Democrats. The call has been for the President of the United States to pursue healing. The question for Democrats is, does introducing articles of impeachment now, 12 days before the end of the term, does that advance the goal of healing?

I think there's only one answer to that. But listen to the Assistant House Speaker, Democrat Catherine Clark, speaking on behalf of the Democrat parties in the House 17. We can use procedural tools to get articles of impeachment to the floor for a House vote quickly. We have already had Chairman Jerry Nadler, chair of the Judiciary Committee, say that he will use those tools to bring the articles as fast as possible. When is that? Well that will be as you know early as the mid next week. You know if I was Joe Biden, okay, I would say don't do it.

I would say don't do it. It's going to divide the country even more. The country is unbelievably divided. And the risk factor of you're going to impeach him, but he's never going to be there for the trial. Because they'll never have a trial in the Senate with four days to go. Well, that's the other question I guess we discussed with Dan too as well.

What could happen there? Because again, some senators are expressing on the Republican side, I don't know if they would get to 65. He's still entitled to due process. Right. So we will take your calls, conference 1-800-684-3110. The challenges facing Americans are substantial at a time when our values, our freedoms, our constitutional rights are under attack. It's more important than ever to stand with the American Center for Law and Justice. For decades now, the ACLJ has been on the front lines protecting your freedoms, defending your rights in courts, in Congress and in the public arena.

And we have an exceptional track record of success. But here's the bottom line, we could not do our work without your support. We remain committed to protecting your religious and constitutional freedoms. That remains our top priority, especially now during these challenging times. The American Center for Law and Justice is on your side.

If you're already a member, thank you. And if you're not, well, this is the perfect time to stand with us at ACLJ.org, where you can learn more about our life changing work. Become a member today, ACLJ.org.

Only when a society can agree that the most vulnerable and voiceless deserve to be protected, is there any hope for that culture to survive. And that's exactly what you are saying when you stand with the American Center for Law and Justice to defend the right to life. We've created a free, powerful publication offering a panoramic view of the ACLJ's battle for the unborn.

It's called Mission Life. It will show you how you are personally impacting the pro-life battle through your support. And the publication includes a look at all major ACLJ pro-life cases, how we're fighting for the rights of pro-life activists, the ramifications of Roe v. Wade 40 years later, play on parenthood's role in the abortion industry, and what Obamacare means to the pro-life movement. Discover the many ways your membership with the ACLJ is empowering the right to life. Request your free copy of Mission Life today online at ACLJ.org slash gift. Welcome back to Secular Radio.

This is Jordan Secular. So this is what we're telling you. It's serious. This is not something that's just a possibility. I think at this point, I would say it seems very likely, unless, like you were saying, Dan, unless someone like President-elect Joe Biden really put pressure on Nancy Pelosi to not take this because of the risk of, one, violence, the risk of further dividing the country, kind of playing into the, almost maybe playing into the hands of the other side.

You just tried to look for any ways constantly to punish President Trump and even the last 12 days because you don't like what he said at his speech, which again... It won't be 12 days. I mean, if you look at it, though, it would be, the earliest they could do with this thing is midweek. So you would be talking about, let's say they pass them on next Tuesday or Wednesday, it would be six days left.

Yeah. So, I mean, Dan, I want to go to Dan because obviously the House could impeach, but how would it get to the Senate in any kind of time where there would be a trial, even if it was a shorter trial? I really don't think it can, Jordan, for a couple of reasons. And let's start with the political one, just the logistical reason of when would Leader Schumer theoretically take control of the United States Senate? You've got the two races in Georgia that are now both conceded, but Jordan, they're not certified. And until those new senators can show up in the United States Senate... Certified by January 15th.

January 15th is the deadline for counties in Georgia and the Secretary of State has until January 22nd. Now that could move quicker. You're absolutely... I would suspect it would. You should be prepared like it was. No question. I agree with that.

Yeah, I agree with that. But until they show up with their certificates in the United States Senate, you have a Leader Mitch McConnell. So he's the one that would have to determine when those articles of impeachment arrived, when they would be on the floor of the Senate.

Now, I mean, Jay, we went through this during the last impeachment trial. There are certain requirements the Senate has to take them up the next day, but then they work through that formal resolution process to govern the rules of debate. Do you think that Leader Schumer and Leader McConnell are gonna be able to come up with a set of rules with, I don't know, 8, 9, 10 days left in a session to govern impeachment quickly?

Because I don't. And so until Leader Schumer has control of the Senate, I just do not see the Senate being able to get up and rolling on this quickly. So I think you have to ask the Democrats the question, what are you looking for? Are you looking for an impeachment trial or are you looking to incite more unrest? Well, here's what they're looking for. They're looking to remove the President of the United States. Let's not kid ourselves. They're looking to remove Donald J. Trump as President.

Yes, that's what they're looking for. Where I usually would 100% agree with fans saying like, there's no way they can come up with rules. Mitch McConnell's wife resigned from President Trump's cabinet because of what he did or what she believes he did and caused with his speech.

And so she resigned. So there is some, again, I'm not saying this is right or wrong. Let's just talk facts here. There are Republicans who, especially in the Senate, who believe because of President Trump's actions over the last six weeks or eight weeks since the general election cost him the US Senate.

And I don't think it's always about that. I think the candidates have to all run their races. And in Georgia, again, it was candidates who got beat, but certainly you could say that there was a lot of weird stuff happening, that call that was released with the Secretary of State saying, you got to do this or you might face crimes. And I just wonder if you get enough upset Republican senators to where things might move quicker. Well, and then you look at this, look at the timeframe of the Georgia counties. Just to be honest with you.

Yeah, I think you got to be honest with people. So they have to certify by January 15th. So technically, which is what day of the week? January 15th is a Friday. It's next Friday. Next Friday. Today's the eighth. So then the question is going to be if they certified it on Friday, could they, I'm seeing if McConnell could be out of leadership.

And like you said, that may not matter. They have until the 22nd, but they don't have to go to the 22nd. No, they can do it. The state could certify the Secretary of State. Once he receives the certification from the counties on January 15th, could certify that very day or the next day. It could be the 16th. And then they could take their oath, the 16th or the 17th. And at that point, Mitch McConnell is no longer the majority leader.

That only gives two and a half days. I mean, that, that would be, that's another point. Then even if it was on its quickest timeline, a Senate trial, unless again, Mitch McConnell and Schumer, while McConnell was in charge, agreed and got this moving. If it had to wait until Schumer was in charge, I don't see how you could set up the trial. Well, I mean, I mean, how would he have a defense in the trial in the Senate? They have to allow the President time to have a defense. I think that would be really not right, but here's the problem. Then the President is impeached. And it just hangs there. And it just hangs there. So there is, I mean, the problem here is if they're trying to, if they, here's the problem with the whole thing.

Number one, to move it in that space of time, to me, just seems a bit reckless. Regardless if you think these are impeachable offenses or not, because there's only 12 days left for the President to serve. So, and they know they can't get it together until at least next Tuesday.

So then you're a week out. So why would you put the country through that when the man's term is over with and you got the ultimate victory, your candidate's going to be the President of the United States. This is an interesting question from Eric in New Mexico, because like it goes to this point that what if you impeach, but you're never acquitted or convicted. Eric, welcome to JCQ Alive.

Hi, thanks for taking my call. My question is how is all this going to affect Trump's reelection efforts in 2024? Well, if he's not convicted, it just means he was impeached and not convicted. And it does not a bar from serving in future federal offices. Although there is this talk van that there is some way of doing some kind of censure or something that could bar him from federal office. I saw that being floated yesterday or this morning.

Yeah. I don't see any constitutional morning for that, Jay, just to be real honest with you. I mean, yes, if you're impeached and convicted, you are barred from seeking federal office. And that very likely could be the motive here for why you push this. But again, I come back to the stated goal of healing the nation. Jay, I don't agree that that is the goal. If you are going to pursue either impeachment or even look, look, let's say it honestly, even the 25th amendment, that doesn't heal the nation. If the President is saying I'm committed to a peaceful transition of power and that's what I'm working towards, Jay, in my view, anyone who would bring this up and try to push it rather than letting the President do what he has said he is going to do. That is someone who's not looking for healing.

That's looking for someone that would want to stir it up again. Well, and the nation's divided. This will divide us even more. It illustrates to me just how tone deaf the Democrat leadership is to where the nation is. They need to quit dividing us politically, racially, and every other way. As long as they seek revenge and one-upsmanship, which is what this really is, it's going to continue to divide America. It's like they're tone deaf to where half of the nation is.

Yeah. I mean, look, I mean, the problem that you got here is that a impeachment is not a legal argument. I mean, you make legal arguments, but it's a political process. And because it's a political process, it's just handled completely differently. And we've been through one, we know.

And I mean, there's no way you could adequately prepare a defense. Well, we have a question about what is, I think Mike's, because what would you be defending, Mike in Nevada online for? I think we should explain it. Obviously, they say they're drafting these.

We don't see those yet. Mike, welcome to JCECO Live. Yeah. Thanks guys for taking my call.

Yeah. So it's just kind of baffling to me because I heard President Trump give the speech and there were, he wasn't inciting any violence in his speech. So what grounds are they trying to impeach him on? Well, they're going to say that their argument will be, remember Mike, they don't have to reach a legal standard. Their argument will be that his statements and actions while in office incited an attempted takeover of the United States Capitol, which resulted in five people being killed, including a Capitol Hill police officer. And they will assert that when the President said, what was the line in the speech? Well, do we have that? We don't have the audio, but we'll go down to the Capitol.

Yeah. It says go down to the Capitol. They're going to try to turn that, I'm not saying it's a valid argument. They're going to say all of this and the speeches that took place before he spoke were inciting all of this.

And I think somebody said, it's combat and there were others that said something else. I think they're going to go, it would go back to, I think it would go back to since the election. It's been building up to, and then holding the rally, deciding on that to bring people to Washington DC. Again, I don't think there was anything in his specific speech, the words that he used, I mean, going to say, go protest outside the Capitol in support of what Republicans were planning to do, which was to object to some of the states. He didn't say go invade. He didn't say go inside.

He didn't say break the windows. If no Republicans, if there was any tie for any kind of rule changes right now, the tiebreaker would be Mike Pence from our friend Ted Groves. I mean, if they were trying to change the rules so they could do it quicker. And I don't know if that has to go through 60 votes or not.

We can get into that coming back in the next segment. But I'm telling you this folks, the talk is not just talk. I mean, I expect that they're serious. I think it's dangerous for the country what they're proposing, especially with just so few days left. But nevertheless, that's what they're proposing. And I think the person who could step in here is Joe Biden. Joe Biden could step in, and it's probably the only person Pelosi, they would stand down. Because of it just causing too much division. He wouldn't want to start off his presidency with war in the streets. Only when a society can agree that the most vulnerable and voiceless deserve to be protected.

Is there any hope for that culture to survive? And that's exactly what you are saying when you stand with the American Center for Law and Justice to defend the right to life. We've created a free, powerful publication, offering a panoramic view of the ACLJ's battle for the unborn.

It's called Mission Life. It will show you how you are personally impacting the pro-life battle through your support. And the publication includes a look at all major ACLJ pro-life cases, how we're fighting for the rights of pro-life activists, the ramifications of Roe v Wade 40 years later, playing Parenthood's role in the abortion industry, and what Obamacare means to the pro-life movement. Discover the many ways your membership with the ACLJ is empowering the right to life.

Request your free copy of Mission Life today online at ACLJ.org slash gift. The challenges facing Americans are substantial at a time when our values, our freedoms, our constitutional rights are under attack. It's more important than ever to stand with the American Center for Law and Justice. For decades now, the ACLJ has been on the front lines protecting your freedoms, defending your rights in courts, in Congress, and in the public arena. And we have an exceptional track record of success.

But here's the bottom line. We could not do our work without your support. We remain committed to protecting your religious and constitutional freedoms.

That remains our top priority, especially now during these challenging times. The American Center for Law and Justice is on your side. If you're already a member, thank you. And if you're not, well, this is the perfect time to stand with us at ACLJ.org, where you can learn more about our life-changing work. Become a member today. ACLJ.org.

Welcome back to JCECCO Live, and we're taking your phone calls 1-800-684-3110. So it's true because we had callers call in on this impeachment talk, and they've asked you what would the specific articles be. Ilhan Omar has released, like, kind of like a draft of what her articles be.

Hers start with the allegation of the President trying to overturn the Georgia election based off the phone call with the secretary of state that was released. Chris I think that would include that. Chris Yep.

And then Article 2 is inciting violence Wednesday, which is what we expected. Chris Did she serve on the Judiciary Committee? Chris I don't know if she currently serves on the Judiciary Committee or not.

But again, I'm just pointing you to, no, but we've already got it from the speaker. Nancy Pelosi said if the 25th Amendment isn't used, we're doing it. Chris Yeah, well, and the other problem is... Chris And then the deputy house speaker, which is a Democrat, also we just, we played that sound frame by saying they could do it by midweek. Chris But the other problem that we have is, we have Republicans, Andy, in the House of Representatives willing to join in on the impeachment. Chris That would be a terrible thing. Chris Well, that's what they're saying. Chris But they are saying that, and I'm hearing Ed Kitzinger, I think, was a... Chris Yep, he's in public, he's in public, but supposedly there's others.

Chris He has a very public and vocal about it, and I thought I read about someone else together. But this would be like what happened with Nixon when finally it was too late because the Republicans went over with Hugh Scott from Pennsylvania to the White House and said, Mr. President, it's time for you to resign. We have lost support among the Republicans. It could be such a groundswell that this would happen and the leadership of the Senate with McConnell and others would go over to the White House and say, Mr. President, it's time for you to go. But who knows? Ed I don't think that is where it's at. I mean, look, the political winds can change.

I'll go up to fan on this the way I'm reading it right now. It's not this groundswell of support. There are Republicans that think that what he did was so egregious that it violated his oath of office and that would probably go along with an impeachment. But to say we're at the number where Nixon and Nixon was midterm, I mean, it's a whole there's a whole lot of differences. I mean, there's just a whole lot of differences here.

But are you getting any sense from the Hill where this is? Because the 25th Amendment issue, which was what they're tagging out there, fan, if you know, if the President, if the Vice President doesn't initiate a 25th Amendment removal, we're going to do this. That's not going to happen.

Chris Yeah. No, Jay, I think the groundswell of support in D.C. is actually behind the statement of the President from last night, where they did think that the President needed to say two things. He needed to say that the violence was totally unacceptable and that Joe Biden and Kamala Harris were going to be inaugurated on January 20th.

And he said both of those things, Jay. So I think that gave Capitol Hill, at least on the Republican side, a great deal of comfort. And I think that's the date that they are aiming for. Look, I, you know, I don't put anything past Speaker Pelosi, Ilhan, Omar and those in the House. I think those articles probably will be put forward and considered. But but assuming the President sticks to what he said last night and there's no reason to believe that he wouldn't, Jay, I think that's where the vast majority of Republican members in both the House and Senate are. You know, the Democrats want to accuse the President of inciting on Wednesday. Well, I think the same accusation would come back at them if with 10 days left or eight days left or whatever it is, they put forward articles of impeachment.

I can guarantee you, Jay, the city. With one caveat, I think, one caveat here and where we try to be, you know, realistic here. Mitch McConnell's wife resigned her cabinet post. She just, she wasn't going to wait the two more weeks. She resigned. And I wonder how that calculates in, Than.

I think it does calculate in. I mean, I think it lowers the ability actually to invoke the 25th Amendment because she's no longer a member of the cabinet. And look, I go back to what Jordan talked about on the logistics of this. The only way you get a Senate trial going is bipartisan cooperation, because honestly, regardless of whether it's Leader Schumer or Leader McConnell, in order to be able to receive those House managers, you're going to have to have bipartisan cooperation to get it going. Jay, I don't think it's off the table.

That's not what I'm saying. But what I am saying is I think the members who are concerned here, what they wanted out of the President was what they got from him last night. So if the President stays in that lane, Jay, I think we'll get to January 20th. That's the, that's kind of like the interesting point is if President Trump stays with that message, should we play it? Pete, I don't know if we, I think we should.

Because, yeah, because we keep talking about it. I think, yeah, this is the message. And what Than says is important.

If you stay on this message, he's going to Camp David this weekend, so it should be a fairly quiet weekend. And you stay on a mess, that kind of theme, and you're not trying to call people to protest. And you're just kind of, again, it's wrong or right.

You're just, I'm talking about why they wouldn't do it. Take a listen. I would like to begin by addressing the heinous attack on the United States Capitol. Like all Americans, I am outraged by the violence, lawlessness, and mayhem.

I immediately deployed the National Guard and federal law enforcement to secure the building and expel the intruders. America is and must always be a nation of law and order. The demonstrators who infiltrated the Capitol have defiled the seat of American democracy. To those who engaged in the acts of violence and destruction, you do not represent our country.

And to those who broke the law, you will pay. We have just been through an intense election and emotions are high, but now tempers must be cooled and calm restored. We must get on with the business of America. My campaign vigorously pursued every legal avenue to contest the election results. My only goal was to ensure the integrity of the vote.

In so doing, I was fighting to defend American democracy. I continue to strongly believe that we must reform our election laws to verify the identity and eligibility of all voters and to ensure faith and confidence in all future elections. Now Congress has certified the results. A new administration will be inaugurated on January 20th. My focus now turns to ensuring a smooth, orderly, and seamless transition of power. This moment calls for healing and reconciliation. 2020 has been a challenging time for our people. A menacing pandemic has upended the lives of our citizens, isolated millions in their homes, damaged our economy, and claimed countless lives. Defeating this pandemic and rebuilding the greatest economy on earth will require all of us working together. It will require a renewed emphasis on the civic values of patriotism, faith, charity, community, and family. We must revitalize the sacred bonds of love and loyalty that bind us together as one national family. To the citizens of our country, serving as your President has been the honor of my lifetime. And to all of my wonderful supporters, I know you are disappointed, but I also want you to know that our incredible journey is only just beginning.

Thank you, God bless you, and God bless America. So that's where we're saying, Than, that kind of message, and we got a second half hour coming up. Paul, I know you've been hanging on the line. We're going to get to your calls.

A lot of phone lines are busy. We're also going to be joined by Georgia State Representative Vernon Jones, who just officially yesterday became a Republican. And I think it's probably the kind of Republican that we need across the country, but especially in a place like Georgia, to kind of, remember that Senate race, that seat that Warnock won, it's only for two years, because it was a special election to fill the vacancy left. So there'll be another Senate race in Georgia in a couple of years, and Warnock will be up.

So we'll talk to a new Republican, State Representative Vernon Jones of Georgia, and we'll take more of your phone calls explaining these issues as we try to walk you through what could be happening these last 12 days before the next President is inaugurated. Check out ACLJ.org, as always. We'll be right back. For decades now, the ACLJ has been on the front lines, protecting your freedoms, defending your rights, in courts, in Congress, and in the public arena. The American Center for Law and Justice is on your side. If you're already a member, thank you. And if you're not, well, this is the perfect time to stand with us at ACLJ.org, where you can learn more about our life-changing work.

Become a member today, ACLJ.org. Live from Washington, D.C., Jay Sekulow Live. And now, your host, Jordan Sekulow. Alright, welcome back to Sekulow Radio.

We are taking your phone calls at 1-800-684-3110. Let me take Paul's call right off the bat, because we are talking about, again, it's been clearly put out. I think you've probably heard about it in the news, but in case you're just joining us for our second half hour, I should reset it. Nancy Pelosi, Speaker of the House, said basically this. If the Cabinet, along with the Vice President, who's a member of the Cabinet, does not invoke the 25th Amendment and remove the President, the House will move forward with impeachment.

That doesn't take very long in the House to do that. Remember, you get impeached by the House, and then you're tried by the Senate. So then we played for you, the Deputy House Speaker, a Democrat as well, saying that they think they could get it on the floor for a vote to impeach by midweek next week. So we're talking like Tuesday, Wednesday of next week, and then it would be over to the Senate now. Would there actually be time for trial? That's a huge question mark, and it looks unlikely because of the number of days left, just to get the logistics down, because there has to be a trial.

There has to be two sides making arguments. But again, she said it by 11. If the Vice President and Cabinet do not act, the Congress may be prepared to move forward with impeachment.

And then her Deputy House Speaker doubled down on it. We can use procedural tools to get articles of impeachment to the floor for a House vote quickly. We have already had Chairman Jerry Nadler, chair of the Judiciary Committee, say that he will use those tools to bring the articles as fast as possible. When is that?

Well, that will be as early as the mid next week. Well, let's talk about fundamental due process here for a moment, Andy, because what, let me tell you what's not fundamental due process. No matter what you think of the President's actions, or whether you think it was wrong or you think it violated his own, whatever you think it might be, if the articles of impeachment are delivered on Wednesday or Thursday and he is leaving office on Tuesday, which he said he is, well, how in the world do you have due process? Well, you don't.

You simply don't. And regardless, as you say— I think that would be a stain on them. As the rightness or wrongness of the cause of the President, the fact is that anybody accused of a crime or here a high crime and misdemeanor, which is, according to law, what the House says at any given time it is, you nonetheless, as the defendant and the accused in the case, have the right to prepare your defense. And one day or two days or three days may not be enough to talk about it. This is the defense of all defenses, the defense to remove from office and convict the President of the United States. He's certainly entitled to have time to have his counsel prepare his defense. I'll tell you what also is not right. It's not right that they would impeach knowing that they will never get to a acquittal stage.

I think you were talking about that. And that, again, will just incite the country. Oh, it absolutely will. You know, not everyone despises President Trump. And even those who do not like some of the things he's done or his personality would not be for this. And I think there are even some Democrats who, for the good of the nation, would see the folly of doing something like this. But many of the Democrats, especially their leadership, they live in an echo chamber. They assume, they assume incorrectly that most Americans are going to go along with this and agree with them.

And it's totally false. Yeah. So let's, again, I think when we come back, we're going to have State Representative Vernon Jones. He is a new Republican, just officially became a Republican, and in a state in Georgia where certainly the Republican Party is looking to rebuild and figure out exactly what happened. And obviously, the state's changed. But did it really change enough to where it's going to be Democrat forever? I mean, that it's a blue state?

I don't think so. I'm not even sure that it's really a real purple state if you have good candidates. But we'll talk about that with him. He was a Democrat.

He supported President Trump, though, earlier, but officially became a member of the Republican Party as a state representative, which he is right now, in the Georgia House of Representatives. So we're going to talk to him about that and as well, because also it's important to look forward now as we're kind of seeing what is taking shape. We know what the makeup of the Senate will be. We know what the House is going to look like. We know that there's elections in two years that will determine the House and the Senate and the majorities there. Election in the Senate and Georgia in two years. Right. And taking even that seat back.

So we'll talk about that when we come back when we come back with Berta Jones. The challenges facing Americans are substantial at a time when our values, our freedoms, our constitutional rights are under attack. It's more important than ever to stand with the American Center for Law and Justice. For decades now, the ACLJ has been on the front lines protecting your freedoms, defending your rights in courts, in Congress and in the public arena. And we have an exceptional track record of success.

But here's the bottom line. We could not do our work without your support. We remain committed to protecting your religious and constitutional freedoms.

That remains our top priority, especially now during these challenging times. The American Center for Law and Justice is on your side. If you're already a member, thank you. And if you're not, well, this is the perfect time to stand with us at ACLJ.org where you can learn more about our life changing work.

Become a member today. ACLJ.org. Only when a society can agree that the most vulnerable and voiceless deserve to be protected is there any hope for that culture to survive. And that's exactly what you are saying when you stand with the American Center for Law and Justice to defend the right to life. We've created a free, powerful publication offering a panoramic view of the ACLJ's battle for the unborn.

It's called Mission Life. It will show you how you are personally impacting the pro-life battle through your support. And the publication includes a look at all major ACLJ pro-life cases, how we're fighting for the rights of pro-life activists, the ramifications of Roe v. Wade 40 years later, play on parenthood's role in the abortion industry, and what Obamacare means to the pro-life movement. Discover the many ways your membership with the ACLJ is empowering the right to life. And request your free copy of Mission Life today online at ACLJ.org slash gift.

Welcome back to Jay Sekio Live. We're trying to connect with State Representative Vernon Jones, and we'll keep working on that. But let me go to Paul's call from Georgia. And I think that, again, all these calls have been very interesting today because people want to know, one, logistics, but also I think that no one wants more violence in their country. They've heard from the President now.

If you're a strong Trump supporter, he's going. He is not contesting anything. Every lawsuit, there was one, I think, remaining in Georgia that got pulled.

I mean, it was dropped. He said he fought it as long as he could into every place that he could, and that was that. That wasn't successful. So, again, I want to go to Paul, Georgia, line three. Hey, Paul.

Hey, how are you? Thank you for taking my call. Good. I just have an observation. I've been listening to you and to Jay speak, I guess, common sense, that why would they want to divide the country further?

Why would they want to try to take any action now? The President's leaving in less than two weeks. But it's just my personal observation, and I'm not a pundit, that at their best, they wouldn't care if the country was divided further, and at worst, they would be looking for an opportunity to do so. It's just an observation. You know, Paul, I just wonder if this is a moment where Joe Biden, as the incoming President of the United States, says, you know what?

And he could be strong. He could say, I disagree with what the President said. He has said that. I think it was wrong. I think it was inciting. I think it was horrible.

He lists all the horribles out. But he said, but for the good of the country, we're not going to put the country through another impeachment, and we're certainly not going to put, since the President did receive 75 million votes, so half the country basically supports the President, we're not going to have what would become a sham impeachment. And it becomes a sham impeachment, not because they can't draft articles in the House and pass them, but he would not be able to defend himself adequately in time. Yeah, it'd be a miscarriage of justice in the name of seeking justice, which is absolutely crazy. You know, I think if Vice President Biden, the President-elect, does not come forward and step into this and show leadership and call off the other Democrats, I think it makes his promise of bringing healing and unity somewhat hollow.

Yeah, I don't know, again, where Biden is on this or Kamala Harris is. I would think, I would think that you would not want to start with another war in the streets. Now, I'm not 100% that it would cause that. Maybe people, after what happened to the Capitol, have kind of said, okay, enough is enough.

But I'm not 100% convinced that if they make moves like this, that you don't start seeing that build right back up again. And that, most Americans, I mean, I don't care where you are politically, the most conservative to the most liberal do not want violence in the streets. And this could very well cause that. If the President still has enough backing for people to go and become violent in the streets after, or even take to the streets, then would maybe potentially, I'm not saying they would all go to be violent, but would protest erupt? They could turn violent.

Does he have enough support to even have people show up for a protest? I don't know that either, but I do think you'd be risking severe division. And maybe, again, the Democrats could be risking their majorities in the House and the Senate.

Yeah, that's true. You know, the idea is, and Joe Biden really needs to step up right now as the President-elect and no doubt the President, who's going to have to step up right now, who's going to be inaugurated on January 20th and say, look, if we're talking about healing a divided nation, and it is a divided nation, folks, the President received a substantial number of votes. A lot of people don't see that his, and we have to look at his legacy, the tremendous things he has done in the Middle East, Jay, the tremendous things he has done for the economy, the judges that he has appointed, the conservative courts that he has created in the circuit courts of appeal and the district courts, the speed with which we were able to get a vaccine, all of these spearheaded by a man with foresight and vision and who has done a great deal. Do you really want to divide the nation in a last-ditch effort to repudiate him and to impeach him when you can't really even do it within a period to give him due process to complete his defense? Is that healing the nation? Is that dividing the Commonwealth?

Is that rather uniting the Commonwealth or dividing it? I think that's wrong, and I think that we ought to put this behind us and move ahead with a new administration and a new look on what the United States has got to be, and going back and getting revenge, because that's what this would be by the Democrats on the President, is not the thing to do. Regardless of what he may have said, regardless of what the natural improbable consequences of his acts may have been the other day, the idea is not to divide but to heal and to unite. That's the important thing that we have got to do. An impeachment proceeding here at the 11th hour and the last days of the administration of President Trump will not do anything to heal and to bring together.

It would be wrong, I would think. Yeah, I think that, again, even if you strongly believe that the President should be removed from office, even if you take all that, I think that the 25th amendment option, the cabinet, we just see more resignations, so the votes don't seem to be there. And also the vice President has put out through, it's basically been reported that he's not going there, it's not something he's interested in doing with this amount of days. And then, so there's that option, and then that really doesn't seem like an option anymore. And then you look at the timeline on this, just like it doesn't really, again, whether you think it should happen or not, I think you have to look at the ramifications.

What are the ramifications of doing this in the House and then not having enough time to even mount a defense and be acquitted or convicted? I mean, it's bizarre to say we're just going to let that hang over in someone, regardless of how strongly you may feel if you feel like he should be impeached. So talking to both sides here, is that the kind of precedence, do you want to set these precedents? We're talking about not setting precedents where a vice President tries to take away electoral votes, that that would be bad to try and we wouldn't want vice Presidents picking who the next President is. So again, it's that exact same kind of thing to me. It's that he said Congress certified the results.

A new administration is going to be inaugurated on January 20th. Have we played it? Yeah, we played the full bite.

We can play the shorter bite again, bite six. I think people need to know this. Now Congress has certified the results. A new administration will be inaugurated on January 20th. My focus now turns to ensuring a smooth, orderly and seamless transition of power. This moment calls for healing and reconciliation. And that's a two-way street, in my view. That means that he has to do that and not, you know, not stoke anything up. And the Democrats should be cognizant also of not stoking. It's kind of, Wes, what you were saying.

Everybody needs to take it down a notch because we just went through a horrific 48 hours. Yeah, for the good of the nation, they need to do that. And I would think, you know, Nancy Pelosi lost a significant portion of her majority in the House, and many of the moderate Democrats felt betrayed by her and AOC and the others, and many of them lost their seats.

I think if they don't look at the political calculation and they were to go through with the impeachment, even if it only stayed in the House, in two years, I think she would completely lose her majority in the House because moderate Democrats would pay the price and the American people would not support this by and large. You know, folks, I think that Joe Biden, though, is also, you know, he kind of encouraged this in a sense. I mean, he hasn't said to impeach yet. He hasn't said that. He hasn't said not to.

But take a listen because he did kind of throw some flame, some, if you will, kind of put the, raise the fire up, if you will, take a listen, by 15. Not only do we see the failure to protect one of the three branches of our government, we also saw a clear failure to carry out equal justice. That was talking about comparing that the people who invaded the Capitol were treated differently than the Black Lives Matter protesters.

Now, I think one of the reasons why is because we now know that the Capitol Police said they rejected support. Can I say something about that? Can I say something about that? I'm gonna tell you something. I don't know what the, and I, with all due respect to the Capitol Police, and my office was across the street, our office.

What the heck was that? Can I ask, and I don't want to be nasty because they have protected us in the past. So I respect it. But I don't think it's the guys on the line. It's not the guys on the line. Why in the world were they opening up the barricades?

Why in the world were they letting people do selfies? I think they were overrun. I mean, they had their guys get killed.

Well, good planning. They had their guys get killed. Well, suppose... That's a problem. And they're all resigning. But I wanted to point out, they refused the National Guard weeks before. They could have had the National Guard there weeks before. No one would have gotten killed. No one would have been able to invade. And it would have probably looked like some of that, how it did with the Black Lives Matter protest. Tear gas fired, pretty tough, you know, National Guard troops in. Did they ever fire tear gas here? Yeah, but it was like, I mean, that was after the National Guard came in to clear it.

Yeah. But they were willing to be there and the Sergeant at Arms refused. I mean, it does look like a double standard, though, when you look at it. It does. Well, yeah, a double standard.

And also, I mean, it led to death. It doesn't, you know, it's not protecting the US Capitol. Only when a society can agree that the most vulnerable and voiceless deserve to be protected is there any hope for that culture to survive. And that's exactly what you are saying when you stand with the American Center for Law and Justice to defend the right to life. We've created a free, powerful publication offering a panoramic view of the ACLJ's battle for the unborn.

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ACLJ.org. All right, welcome back to JCEC Here Live, the final segment in quite a week. I mean, it's like, you know, people said, you know, 2020 and it's 2021 started off pretty rough as well, though I do think, again, even listening to the President saying, you know, again, transition, smooth, there's going to be a new administration. So for all of you out there that were, you know, two days ago, call us traitors. We can call him a traitor. I mean, you know, he said it's a new administration.

He will be gone. And again, you can like that, not like that. It's part of politics. And you can believe, as many of us do, that there were a lot of wrongs in the election, things that were not done correctly. And it could have turned the other way if the laws were followed as they normally are. But we were not successful in court. Other attorneys weren't successful in court. And it was tried all over the country. State legislatures did not seat new electors. They could have. They didn't have to wait for courts or Congress to act.

And now it will be a President Biden. So we have vaccines going out. Hopefully by, you know, fall, it will kind of feel normal again in the country about school and things like that and homework. But it's not right now. We're still a country that's pretty locked down with COVID, pretty raging, actually, throughout the country. And that, of course, affects the economy and affects people's ability to work and affects just people. Is school going to be open? It's always a huge question. We still are dealing with those cases at the ACLJ on behalf of parents at no cost to them because literally it keeps changing constantly.

Especially students have any kind of special needs at all. So I think it's a time where, listen, you don't have to like Joe Biden's politics at all. But I just hope that after a very tough campaign that Joe Biden, as President-elect, has a big role to play here, too. And he can either keep throwing oil, gas on the flames, or he can tell everybody to calm down. Now, some of that will also be, you know, they're only going to do that if the President continues on that.

I mean, I think that's— No, I think it's a two-way street. And I want to be clear that the President has to do that, too. The President and the President-elect could do this together. The language that he said about smooth transition, orderly transition, time for healing, that is what the message needs to be by both the President and the President-elect. And the President-elect has said that. Now he's got pressure coming in from his flank. This is what we were worried about, that you worry about. He's got the left flank that's going to push very aggressively here.

So the question is going to be, can he withstand the pressure? Because I think Joe Biden, in his heart of hearts, knows that impeachment would be a mistake. Yeah, he does not want to start off his administration still focusing on the former President. No, they want to make it a footnote.

Because it's not good for—it's just, again, look what it did to President Trump, because he was forced to with Mueller and Obama, what Obama was doing and what Joe Biden was doing and spying on his campaign. And then impeachment. So, I mean, he was kind of forced to have this overshadow him for three years.

Joe Biden does not have to have Donald Trump overshadow him at the beginning of his term or for his four years. But if it starts off like this, I think it does. And you may be, in a sense, recreating the movement that you just, you know, you just were able to beat.

And you may be recreating it and then have to face it again. So in the midterm elections in two years and then in four years as well. So I think that's where, again, I think it's language like this. If the President, whether it's Twitter— He's got to stick with it, though.

It's language like this by date. We must revitalize the sacred bonds of love and loyalty that bind us together as one national family. To the citizens of our country serving as your President has been the honor of my lifetime. And to all of my wonderful supporters, I know you are disappointed, but I also want you to know that our incredible journey is only just beginning. Thank you, God bless you, and God bless America.

And let me just say something right here, and I want to get Wes and Andy to comment on this. And that is, that's a good statement, but that has to be not only the statement, it has to be reality. So you can't have a tweet in an hour that says they stole the election or stoking it back up again, because that's just going to stoke it back up again, in my view. Yeah, he doesn't need to ever go back to that kind of rhetoric and those kind of tweets again. He needs to use these next 12 days to stick with what he said and to let the nation heal. The other thing I think about, Jay, though, in all of this drama over possible impeachment, our foreign adversaries, to say nothing of our terrorist enemies, they're watching this disunity and distraction for the next 12 days.

That alone should move Biden and Pelosi and Schumer to back off and to let this transition take place without further drama. I think President Trump has done a fantastic job in the four years he has been President of the United States. I think that he would and may go down indeed in history and retrospect as a great President in terms of the judicial appointments that he has made, in terms of the peace process in the Middle East. This is a huge thing in terms of his relations with Korea, which we haven't heard from, the defeat of ISIS, the kinds of things he has done with the economy. The stock market is now over 31,000 points yesterday. He's still the President.

The creation of jobs, the fact that America can hold its head up high in the world again as a power and a leader, those things cannot be forgotten. And he cannot fall back again into the rhetoric that got him into the mess in the first place. Let's not divide, let's unite. Okay. Let's go back.

I want to go back to Thanh on this because, Thanh, my view is clear. I thought Mike Pence did what he had to do under the constitution, the only thing he could do. I said that, it was the right thing. I disagreed with those people that were saying that the vice President could basically determine the election. Does that not seem like a hundred years ago?

I mean, that's like a hundred years ago. Now we're dealing with this. Realistically, on the Hill, and I know you've got limited staffs and they've got limited staffs and what is the vibe you're picking up about this impeachment thing? Jay, the honest truth is it depends on exactly what you were just saying. I think the vibe on the Hill is that there is a significant shared duty, not a duty on one side or the other. There's a significant shared duty on the part of President Trump and President elect Biden to say, look, there's a transition of power coming and we are going to jointly move in that direction. Jay, you had a caller a minute ago, I think his name was Paul, who said that he doesn't think there's going to be that leadership from leader Schumer or speaker Pelosi.

Jay, I agree with that. I think we've already seen that they are not capable of carrying that mantle. This has to be President Trump and President elect Biden. And I think Joe Biden has a big role to play here. I think he should echo the President's remark from last night. If both of them continue on that track, Jay, I think the vibe on the Hill will be, we're going to get to January 20th and we're going to have a peaceful transfer of power as we always do in the United States.

Yeah. I mean, listen, this can go either way. There's, I continue to say this. I leave people with this today for the, you know, to just consider, I think a lot of what happens next week, will there be an impeachment? Will Joe Biden kind of say to Nancy Pelosi, you know, behind the scenes, knock this off? Cause she's also gave herself room not to do it. Um, and if you listen closely to her words, she doesn't have, she didn't say we are definitely a hundred percent, but it was pretty close, but, but, but there's room there. Uh, but I think it's a two way street and that the President has to also continue the same message he's used since last night.

It has to continue with that messaging. And if I think that's the way you can kind of move on as a nation and we can all move forward for the battles that we will be fighting against each other, but battles that we fight in, in legislatively through debate and through elections, not in the streets. For decades now, the ACLJ has been on the front lines, protecting your freedoms, defending your rights in courts, in Congress and in the public arena. The American Center for Law and Justice is on your side. If you're already a member, thank you. And if you're not, well, this is the perfect time to stand with us at ACLJ.org where you can learn more about our life-changing work. Become a member today. ACLJ.org