The Lie That God Has Never Suffered – Part 1 of 2

Let us run with endurance the race that is set before us, looking to Jesus, the founder and perfecter of our faith. Pause a moment to ponder perhaps the deepest mystery of all. How was God affected by the sacrifice of His own Son? Was He passive or did He weep? Today, why the emotions of God really do matter?

Stay with us. From the Moody Church in Chicago, this is Running to Win with Dr. Erwin Lutzer, whose clear teaching helps us make it across the finish line. We're in a series on ten lies about God and why you might already be deceived. Pastor Lutzer, don't some theologians maintain that God is beyond emotions and teach that God has personally never suffered?

Dave, you're absolutely right. As a matter of fact, this message is controversial because there are some very good theologians who are going to argue that if God actually becomes angry or has emotions, God is changing. And if you look at the unchangeability of God, you conclude that indeed He does not have emotions, certainly not as we do. And yet at the same time, when I look at the cross of Jesus Christ and I think of how Jesus as God suffered, I have to ask myself the question, is God really untouched emotionally? We don't understand it, of course, because it's very complex. But the point that I want to make in this message is that God really does show compassion. And to say that means that He really is touched as Jesus is by the feelings of our infirmities.

Well, it's complicated, but we need to try to understand it. At the end of this message, I'm going to be giving you some contact info because I've written a book entitled Ten Lies About God, and one of the chapters has to do with the suffering of God. I want to begin today with a question and ask you, has God ever suffered?

I think that's a question that the Jewish people would like to have answered when they think of the Holocaust. Christians would like to have that question answered when they think of the slaughter, for example, of the Armenians, the civil war in their own country and the atrocities that were committed. And you and I would like to have an answer to that question when we see a young mother come down with cancer, when we see the despair of a child that has been abused. We want to ask the question, we suffer, we say, but does God ever suffer? Because we know intuitively that a God who cannot suffer is a God who really cannot love. You know, when you look around this world to try to find proof that God cares, it's difficult to come by. You say, well, you know, He sends rain and sunshine and we get crops. Yeah, yeah, nature, but it's a very mixed bag, isn't it, with tornadoes and earthquakes and tidal waves and hurricanes and what have you, and we've been having our share of those. You say, well, I see God in people that when there's tragedy, there is some good in us. Yeah, there's some good. It's interesting that when we have a snowstorm or some tragedy, how the media plays up the fact that there's some good in people, it actually makes news.

Somebody actually shovels the walk for somebody else, and that is news, isn't it? The problem is that people also are a mixed bag, because for every good person, you know that there's a lot of deceit around and there's a lot of dishonesty and there's a lot of cheating and there's a lot of hurt and pain and there's a tremendous amount of abuse. So you can't prove that God cares about the world just looking at people. Where then do we turn?

C.S. Lewis said that he was on the verge of deception. He said, not that I am in danger of ceasing to believe in God. The real danger is to believe dreadful things about him, and that's my danger. I have no danger about ceasing to believe in God, but I do. I am sometimes tempted to believe dreadful things about him, considering the suffering that is in the world.

Is there some reason why we don't have to be cynical? Is there a reason why we don't have to think dreadful thoughts about him? I think the only place where we can find hope to resolve this is on the cross, because when Jesus died on the cross, this was God's farthest reach. He came to our side of the chasm.

Here love burst upon the world. God was in Christ reconciling the world unto himself. Those nine words give us hope. As you know, this is a series of messages titled 10 lies about God and how you already may be deceived. We've talked about the first lie that God can be approached in any way by anyone. The second one that he's more tolerant than he used to be, and today we come to lie number three, which is that God himself, the father, has never personally suffered.

I think it's a lie, and you have to hang in with me so that I get a chance to prove my point. But before we talk about that specifically and talk about the cross as an example of God's suffering, let me back up a little bit and speak first of all briefly about the self substitution of God, which leads to the cross. The idea of substitution is found throughout the scriptures all the way from when God killed animals to clothe Adam and Eve. Then Abraham finds that ram that is caught in the thicket, and then the Israelites put blood on the doors. The lamb dies for them, and that's the whole basis of the sacrificial system.

There was a problem. God looks around and he finds that all of these sacrifices cannot pay a price that he will accept, and he realizes what he always knew, namely that if man is to be redeemed, God is going to have to pay his own price. And that's why the scripture speaking about Christ says, surely he hath borne our griefs and carried our sorrows. We did esteem him stricken of God and afflicted. He was wounded for our transgressions and bruised for our iniquities. One theologian Canfield puts it this way, God purposed to direct against himself in the person of his son the full weight of that righteous wrath which we deserved. Calvin said our guilt was transferred to the head of the son of God.

Please listen carefully. The essence of sin is man to put himself in God's stead. The essence of redemption is for God to put himself in man's stead. We always like to substitute ourselves for God. God comes and substitutes himself for us and dies for us, the self-substitution of God.

We're leading to the cross, but first of all we must stop at one other juncture, and that is the submission of God. The scripture says again in Isaiah regarding Christ, he was oppressed and he was afflicted yet he opened not his mouth. He's led as a lamb to the slaughter and as a sheep before her shearers is dumb.

He does not open his mouth. Here is the son submitting to the will and the purposes of the father. But I need to caution you, don't ever think to yourself that a very benevolent and loving Jesus had to convince an angry reluctant father to redeem humanity. That's wrong. It's easy to think that way, but that's wrong.

It's a distortion. The Bible itself speaks about the tender mercies of our God, and then we think for example of the most popular verse in all the Bible, for God so loved the world. So let us keep in mind that there was agreement within the trinity. In fact, John Stott said the father did not lay on the son an ordeal he was reluctant to bear, nor did the son exact from the father a salvation.

He was reluctant to be stole. The trinity though playing various roles was unified. Jesus died by divine consent. Now that background, now let's speak about the suffering of God at the cross.

Take your Bibles and turn to the story that we are very familiar with, but I'm using the Matthew version of the story of the hinge of history. Here we come now folks to the greatest mystery that we could ever ponder. Paul said great is the mystery of godliness. God was manifest in the flesh.

The cross is the centrifugal force. It is as it were the hub in which all of the spokes of God's purposes converge. Matthew chapter 27, we come to the death of Jesus and let me read at verse 45. From the sixth hour until the ninth hour darkness came over all the land and about the ninth hour Jesus cried in a loud voice, which means my God, my God, why have you forsaken me? When some of those standing there heard this they said he's calling for Elijah. Immediately one of them ran and got a sponge. He filled it with wine, vinegar and put it on a stick and offered it to Jesus to drink.

The rest said now leave him alone. Let's see if Elijah comes to save him and when Jesus had cried out again in a loud voice he gave up his spirit. Let me answer three questions and this is somewhat theological but you're going to stay with me to the end.

I know you are. The first question is can God suffer? The second question is did God suffer? And the third question is does God still suffer?

The first one is can God suffer? Throughout the history of the Christian church there was much debate upon this. In the early centuries it was believed that God was impassable, not impossible but impassable meaning incapable of feeling pain.

You even have the Westminster Confession of Faith written by marvelous wonderful clear-headed theologians saying that God is among other things without passions. Wow, now why would good theologians say that? First of all because they wanted to preserve the immutability of God, his unchangeableness. I am the Lord and I change not.

They wanted to preserve that. They thought what kind of a God would we have if he would be and listen carefully now what kind of a God would we have if he would be moody? What kind of a God would there be if his moods were to change? Somehow that seems inconsistent with the with the nature of God.

That was argument number one. Argument number two was this we want a God who is self-existence whose pleasures and pains in no way are determined by something outside of him. The argument was that God is always in a good mood. He's always pleased. Our God is in the heavens.

He has done whatsoever he has pleased. Nothing stands in the way of his purposes therefore he can never be frustrated and therefore he can never feel really pain or deep disappointment because he has within himself all the resources he needs to stay in a wonderful wonderful mood. Is that biblical?

With all due respect I'm going to challenge that in today's message. I'm going to challenge it because you read the Old Testament for example you find that there seems to be passion almost on every page. Frequently we read and the anger of the Lord was kindled against the people of Israel and the anger of God was hot against them.

That sounds like a lot of passion to me. We read in the book of Hosea God says how can I give you up Ephraim? How can I surrender you? And God is there speaking about Israel as his son and saying don't you know that I am consumed within me because of your behavior. It's the words of a father who finds a son being wayward and the father is going through agony. You know you may think that one of the advantages of being God is that you never have to be frustrated because you have all the power and all the wisdom and everything at your disposal but as we shall see in a moment God chose to be frustrated and hurt.

Let me give you a little bit of points that will help us. First it would be dishonoring to God if we thought that he was something like we are subject to our emotions, subject to our passions and therefore sometimes out of control because of our anger or elated with things that would be the wrong things that would give us pleasure. Let's make sure that we never never fall into that trap. Secondly let's not think that God is a victim. See that's what I think the framers of the Westminster Confession were afraid of. God isn't a victim who suddenly discovers that he's having a bad day. God chose suffering. He is still the sovereign one. He is still the king but he chose to suffer and therefore he suffers because he willed that he suffered. John Piper in one of his books talks about the infinitely complex emotions of God.

I love that phrase. Infinitely complex emotions of God. On the one hand of course God is always pleased with what is happening because he has everything under control. When he looks at it and he sees it and he sees it and he sees it and he sees it from the long range point of view. But when he looks at it more narrowly there are things that displease him. There are things that make him angry and all of these emotions are not contradictory.

You and I if we really feel happiness we also know what it's like to feel sadness. Now you think of God who what shall we say fills the whole universe from end to end. He has a multitude of different emotions not in conflict but in harmony and I want to say today that one of them is even disappointment and sorrow. One day Martin Luther wrote a letter to Erasmus and said Erasmus your God is too human and Luther was right. In the next message in fact I'm going to talk about very critically about modern conceptions of God that are far too human. But I want you to know that it is also possible to have a concept of God that is not human enough.

God created us with emotions and because we're created in his image we can see in the scriptures that he has emotions too. And with all of that background now we look at the text that I read just a moment ago. We take a look at the cross. First of all what was happening here in the passage that I just read? When the sixth hour until the ninth hour darkness comes over the land and Jesus says my God my God why hast thou forsaken me?

What's going on there? First of all remember that Jesus became legally guilty legally guilty of the sin of the world. He was made a sin for us the one who knew no sin. Well my friend this is Pastor Luther and I want to emphasize that when I say that God has emotions he is not reactionary. He certainly is not surprised by anything that ever happens. He is not controlled by his emotions like human beings frequently are. He's above all that and yet I want us to understand that God is a God who sees, he knows, and he understands. And it is this God that is revealed to us in Jesus Christ. I've written a book entitled 10 Lies About God and I wrote it to correct some of the notions about God that exist in popular culture and in some evangelical churches.

Ideas about God that are unworthy of him. I believe that this resource will be of great help to you. Here's what you do go to rtwoffer.com that's rtwoffer.com or call us at 1-888-218-9337. For a gift of any amount we're making this resource available let me give you that contact info one more time.

You go to you go to rtwoffer.com or call us at 1-888-218-9337. Let us never forget the words of Tozer, words attributed to him that the most important thing about you is your view of God. It's time now for you to ask Pastor Lutzer a question about the Bible or the Christian life. What do you do when you hear the doorbell and suspect what's coming?

Nola got in touch with us at Running to Win and has this question for you Pastor Lutzer. From time to time we have Jehovah's Witnesses come to the door giving us literature. They know from being here before that I'm a Christian attend church and teach Sunday school. I know from study that their religion is a cult and even though I take the literature and they know my Christian background I need to know what to say to them. They never pressure I don't want to be rude as they seem to be very kind and thoughtful.

How should I handle this in the future? Thank you so very much for your question and I should be up to date on this because quite recently just in recent weeks I spent about three quarters of an hour with a Jehovah's Witness, a very knowledgeable Jehovah's Witness. Jehovah's Witness that studies the Bible in several different translations, has commentaries, and spends a great deal of time in God's Holy Word and yet in my opinion very much deceived on a central point. And the central point has to do with the divinity of Jesus because in Jehovah Witness theology the divinity of Jesus is denied. Jesus is a creation and this of course affects their whole understanding of salvation. When I asked him how he intended to get into heaven he referred to his faithfulness.

He never said a word about Jesus until I got that out of him through discussion. Now when you get into a debate about the divinity of Jesus he will bring up some verses which in their mind disprove the divinity of Jesus. For example in Colossians it says that Jesus is the firstborn of God's creation. Well we know that that doesn't mean that Jesus was born first.

Firstborn means first in rank and that he is above all of creation. But those debates sometimes get nowhere so let me bring this right to a conclusion. Here's the bottom line where he didn't have an answer. I want you to remember this now. Ask him this question, do you worship Jesus?

Very critical question. If he says yes as one Jehovah's Witness said to me that he did then I point out that that's idolatry because you are worshiping a created creature and he didn't have an answer for that. If you say no as this most recent encounter this man did, no he doesn't worship Jesus he only venerates Jesus. Then you take him to Revelation chapter 5 where it says that the lamb is on the throne and the one who is on the throne and the lamb and the bottom verse that is to say the last verse of the chapter I think it's verse 14 says, and they worshiped him. So there you go. If he says no I don't worship Jesus in heaven Jesus is going to be worshiped.

So what's wrong with this picture? Only way to understand that is that Jesus is entirely worthy of worship because he is God of very God. Hope that helps. God bless you. Some words about what to do when the doorbell rings from Dr. Erwin Lutzer. If you'd like to hear your question answered go to our website at rtwoffer.com and click on Ask Pastor Lutzer or call us at 1-888-218-9337.

That's 1-888-218-9337. You can write to us at Running to Win 1635 North LaSalle Boulevard Chicago Illinois 60614. Running to Win is all about helping you find God's roadmap for your race of life. Some theologians hold that God is without passion that he has no feelings and therefore cannot personally suffer. While theologians theorize let's see what the Bible says and what it means to you and me. Join us next time as our series on 10 Lies About God continues. Erwin Lutzer will tell us how God actually chose to suffer. Thanks for listening. This is Dave McAllister. Running to Win is sponsored by the Moody Church.