This is the Truth Network. Welcome to Passion for Christ, a ministry of Utah Partnerships for Christ. In Acts 26, 18, Jesus said, Paul's purpose was to open their eyes and turn them from darkness to light. and from the power of Satan unto God. That they may receive forgiveness of sins, and inheritance among them which are sanctified by faith that is in me.
We hope you'll join us for today's testimony of lives changed by the gospel of Jesus Christ.
Now let's begin today's episode. Welcome back to True Talk Live. This is Bruce Beast, your host. Speaking to you from our new office here at 2417 Grant Avenue in Ogden at the Coffee Compound. Would love to set up a time with you and just show you some of our cool Bible history museum pieces here.
We'd love to come out to your church too. Youth group, church setting in the lobby between services. Got some great things to show about how the Lord has preserved his word and.
So I'm just talking with my friend Ryan Westover. He's the chapter director for Trail Life USA here in the Ogden area. We have one over in Tulilla, just kind of west of Salt Lake City. But we're trusting the Lord to see a boys ranch get started and just more churches get involved. You know, Ryan, when I was newly saved, I was saved in 79.
out of the Mormon church and then in 85 or around 80, maybe 82, 81, something like that. Um I went to to Utah and on a little like a mission trip with my youth group. And guess where we did ministry at? We did ministry at Kaysville Bible Church. That church was still started, had been going on.
way back then. And that's the church that I think that you you shared with me. has kind of joined arms with you. For the Davis County, Weaver County area for trail life. Is that right?
Well, we have a couple of gentlemen out of the Cayesville Bible Church that we're real excited that are that are on board with Trail Life USA. The way Trail Life USA works is you have to have five dedicated men To start a chapter. And there's all kinds of reasons for that. And you can get caught up on their website with that. But yes, they're out of Caysville Bible Church.
I haven't had the honor to meet the pastor of the Cayesville Bible Church, but I have had the honor to meet a couple of his men that and they are really looking forward to starting this trail life USA and getting this thing up and rolling. Absolutely, absolutely.
So, where did we leave off? We were just talking about, yeah, what were some of the things. that you remember growing up Like, just even like doctrine-wise, things that you had to scratch your head and ask some questions, and just give us, like, and we'll get more into the trail life in just a second, but. Just help our friends that are listening today to get us kind of an empathy for the kind of teachings that you had. Does anything jump out at you?
the three levels of heaven or Jesus being you know um I don't know, you know, that he was not truly God. He was. He was not considered. in the same way as as Christianity teaches about About who Jesus is, the devil being the brother of Lucifer, being the brother of Jesus and so forth. What jumps out at you?
That you tried to make it.
Well, there's a lot of different things. A lot of things that at that time that jumped out at me. And I'll tell you one thing that jumped out at me when I was a young child. And I was I think I was around eighteen or nineteen when they when the Mormon church changed their their um Their way their their What they wanted to be associated with. But one of the things that I remember being told when I was going to school, the Sunday school class there, that at that time we were not Christians.
We were Mormons and we were to stand on Mormonism. And I do remember being taught that. And then, like I said, when I was about 18, 19 years old, I do remember them coming out and saying, and this is when we weren't part of the church, part of the Mormon church at that time. And I remember them coming back and saying that they do want to be Christians. They do want to be another.
And so those are some of the things that make me scratch my head. And like I told you, I struggled when I was 23 years old and I was upset with the Lord about my daughter having this brain injury at birth. I struggled. I struggled. I didn't know which way to go.
And so you're right. A lot of the things that I struggled with, I had to go back and I started visiting some of the old bookstores around Utah at the time. And there was one in Salt Lake, and I can't remember the name of it. Utah Lighthouse Ministry, I believe that's what it was called. Oh, yeah.
And yeah, and years ago, I went to some of these stores and I picked up these old books that were from the Mormon church. And once I started studying those things and seeing the The contradictions and the way that the Doctrine of Covenants would say that God was once a man on his own earth and he gained celestial exaltation. Correct me if I'm wrong in any of this because it's been so long. But then you go back into the, I believe it's in Nephi when Nephi explains that God was never a man, never a flesh and bone. And so those were the things that really stuck out to me and made me realize that maybe what I had been taught even up to that young age, you know, that it needed more looking into.
So that was one of the reasons where I got to a point where I was comfortable with saying, okay, I'm going to put this behind me. Amen. Amen. Yeah, we're. We're so much wanted to see our friends who are Mormon come to know Christ as Savior.
and just see who he is.
Well, hey, as we continue to talk about this exciting new ministry that is just getting butted started right here in Utah Trail Life USA. Uh There's a verse here in Psalm 148, 12 to the 14. I'm going to read it. And Ryan, I think it's going to spark some more of your passion for what God has called you to do. And I want to ask you out there listening to pray for this man.
Pray for Ryan Westover. If you feel led that you'd want to get in contact with him or us through Truth Network, maybe you want to even help support a ranch that can be used. Maybe that's something that's close to your heart. And just helping young people get out, helping these guys get away from the screens. And video games are fun to a degree, but.
You know, we gotta, we gotta. Engage, you know, we got to go back to some things that maybe we've forgotten, you know, I think. But listen to this verse, Ryan says, both young men and maidens, old men and children, let them praise the name of the Lord, for his name alone is excellent, his glory is above the earth and heaven. He also exalteth the horn of his people. The praise of all his saints, even of children of Israel, a people near unto him.
Praise ye the Lord. Psalm 148:12-14. You want to see Dads and their sons. Get like tight. You know, and serving the Lord, right?
And bringing. bringing this all into like a continuity that maybe we've lost a little bit. Yeah, tell us about your mind. Tell us about your heart and this. Amen.
Amen. My heart is for boys. I said this to Stu Epperson when I met Stu Epperson. I realized when I had an opportunity to enter into a boys' ranch opportunity when I was in my late 20s, I knew that that wasn't the time. I knew I wasn't the person.
I knew that was not for me at that time. But I knew that we were facing a problem, and this was clear back then. And I realized that we were facing is fatherless boys. And I've had a heart for fatherless boys. I've had a heart for a lot of these kids that are growing up with no dads.
And, you know, as I've gotten older, I'm seeing that society has changed a lot in the last.
Well, about 20 years, that well, over 20 years now, but that we're seeing a lot of these men who are being disconnected from their sons and the sons that are just disconnecting from their families. And we're seeing more and more of it. And my heart is bleeding, I'm bleeding for that. And so, as God has put, things on my heart. I love this Trail Life USA.
This is something that we've been trying to get going for five years here in Utah, up in this northern area of Utah. And this Trail Life USA is not a youth group. It's more the Trail Life USA even explains it's more like a men's ministry. It's a ministry that. That these boys can get out.
And you're right when you say, Russ, we've got to get back. We've got to get back to the basics. We've got to get back to the basics and get these men out with their sons and get them away from the screens and get them away from the hustle and the bustle and get them out into those raw moments where we can see God's creation and we can bond together as men and gain that trust between father and son again. And it is changing, people. And I'm so excited to get this thing going.
It has been a long time coming. We have struggled and struggled and struggled to get this up and going, but we're finally here. And boy, we just praise God for where we're standing right now. Excellent. Hey, well, there's the music for another break.
So stay with us. Call us at 866-348-7884. Maybe you'd like to contribute in the program today. Maybe you have a tip on being a father. There's a young father out there that might be listening and he needs to hear from you, who's been a father for 10, 20 years.
You've got some tips, you've got some hacks that can help the young fathers. We'll be right back for the rest of today's testimony. Please know we at Utah Partnerships for Christ have been planting seeds of the gospel in Utah for over 24 years. We welcome any questions you may have and invite you to visit our website to obtain a list of words and definitions that would help you understand how Mormons think and how to be able to better witness to your friends who belong to the Mormon Church. That website is www.upc.org.
That's upfc dot org. We'll be right back. Welcome to Passion for Christ, a ministry of Utah Partnerships for Christ. In Acts 26, 18, Jesus said Paul's purpose was to open their eyes and turn them from darkness to light. and from the power of Satan unto God.
That they may receive forgiveness of sins and inheritance among them which are sanctified by faith that is in me. We hope you'll join us for today's testimony of lives changed by the gospel of Jesus Christ.
Now let's begin today's episode. Welcome back to TrueSpot Live. This is Brus East, your host for today. Today's Mission's Monday we never want to forget. the importance of reaching our own Kids.
and and our neighbors and and everything, you know, to to introduce them to Christ. And Trail Life USA is a great way to do that. I've been talking with Ryan Westover. He's the chapter director for the northern Utah part of Trail Left USA. It's up in Idaho, and it's in a lot of places around the country.
But I was thinking, Ryan, about how we have a model that's been kind of set forth. I mean, we know that Jesus. Had twelve younger men that he for three years spent time with. And it was a unique time. What one of the things Trail Life does is that it probably gives you some, it affords for some activities.
in the mountains or at the lake to learn the ways of survival. It probably just bonds you together like building a fire, and just kind of share some of these different things that you guys might be doing on a typical outing or meetings and things like that.
Well, yeah, you're right about that. And and you know, it's I we we don't have our uh uh activities up and rolling yet. In fact, we're going to this weekend, we're going to take the boys and we're going to go to rodeo for our first activity this week and take these kids and let them go see some dirt stomping. But But, you know, what we're excited for is those activities, like you say, Russ, the camping and the building the trust with each other and getting out into God's creation and helping them understand how to build a fire, how to get these survival skills. These men that have chosen to dedicate themselves for this are amazing men.
They've all got something different to offer. I have something different to offer. You get us all together and we've all got something that we can offer. I've got lots of people who want to teach the boys how to fish. They want to get out and teach the boys how to use a saw.
They want to be able to help. You know, with cooking breakfast and taking the kids to different events.
So, you know, these are all different things that all these different men can come together and help these boys understand. And it's something that's real, real valuable to these kids. And this Idaho group that has been helping me, they have just had amazing things. North Carolina came out and went with them on a white water river trap or whitewater river. And in the Snake River in Idaho was nine days, and I just can't imagine what you could learn about each other in nine days, Stu.
Man, I'll tell you what, yeah, that sounds like an awesome experience. I'm going to read a passage from Luke chapter fifteen. Uh, this is a passage of scripture that we're all familiar with, but you know, I might be speaking to a father or a grandfather. who might be able to identify here. And so Ryan, when I'm reading this, if you wanna just jump in, just interject.
Just do it, okay? But this is this is where I'm at is Chapter 15. Verse 11, and we're talking about dads, we're talking about sons. But listen to this. It says in verse 11 of chapter 15 in Luke it says, A certain man had two sons, and the younger of them said to his father, Father, give me the portion of goods that fall to me.
And he divided unto them his living. And not many days after, the younger son gathered all together, took his journey into a far country, and there wasted his substance with riotous living.
Now, just we'll just kind of stop there, right? Because, Ryan, there might be dads out there that have a son, and Maybe they kind of resemble this particular example of the sun. That's going to be difficult, right? I mean. Uh we we want everyone listening who might be a dad out there Yeah.
Sometimes it's a two-way street. We don't know exactly what was going on between this father and the son. Maybe the father dropped the ball on some things. But we're going to keep reading. But do you have any thoughts so far on this passage?
Just thinking about what if a son. Said this to his dad, basically saying, I wish you were dead, so just give me all my inheritance now. What comes to your mind on this? That That you know, that I am that bad. I've I've got a son now that's that's aged out.
Uh well, he he he could still be in Trail Life USA, but he chooses that he doesn't want anything to do with Trail Life USA. And so I do have a son this way, and I do pray for his heart. And I pray that he comes back to Christ because he does know the love of Christ. He knows. He did get baptized at a camp down in Oklahoma.
And so I say to any of these fathers and these grandfathers out there who are watching your sons or your grandsons struggle, get a hold of us. Get a hold of us. You could call me any time. You could call me at any hour and let us try to help you. There's going to be opportunities in this Trail IPSA for fathers and grandfathers to be able to help lead in this.
And we want that. We want leadership. We want people to get behind this. But let's see what we can do to help you restore that bond between that grandfather and the grandson or the father and the son. But we can't turn our back on these young boys.
We've got to do whatever we have to do to get these boys saved. Right, right. There's so much that could be said for You know, maybe regrets that we might have. We all have things where we've said maybe things to our sons, and we wish we could take it back. I know I love my son so much, and there was one day when I said something to him that wasn't very nice.
And it didn't help. But things are good now. But we're going to pray for your son, Ryan, and that we'll see a miracle happen, that we'll see him come back. Because as we read on this passage here, it says, And when he had spent all, there arose a mighty famine in that land, and he began to be in want. And he went and joined himself to a citizen of that country, and he sent him into his field to feed swine.
So you know, there is a time when sometimes You know, our our sons have to go through some stuff. Again, they have to go a little bit deeper. And it's hard, it's difficult. But then we continue reading, it says. And he would fain have filled his belly with the husks that the swine did eat, and no man gave unto him.
But then it says, and when he came to himself, came to his senses, he said, How many hired servants of my father's have bread enough and to spare? And I perish with hunger.
So there's a turnaround. We've all had, I think, probably, most of us have had.
Some level of a turnaround, you know, like even like the road to Emmaus. I've got a picture of these guys that Jesus is talking to, he's walking with them for three hours patiently. And then it took a while. And then they had a big turnaround. They went back to Jerusalem where they were supposed to really be, but they were afraid.
They were down and they were kind of away from. from from what was happening in the city of Jerusalem. Um but as we continue on, do you have any thoughts to add to this, Ryan? Just thinking about uh where where we're at in the story how this turnaround moment. I'm sure that Boy, I can just imagine, like, you know, the the times I've been to camp before and you have those camp fires.
Have you ever experienced that before? I mean, great Christian camp experiences. And you have some singing going on, and you've had a good Bible message. And that's what you guys are going to do in it. And that's what you're looking for.
here with Trail Life USA here in in in Utah. You're trying to find these people, right? Yeah. US N, US S E. You're right about that.
And what you're saying there, Russ, is I think I was that young man too. And I think that a lot of us fathers and grandfathers were that young man. But, you know, these sons, these boys need to hear from another man. And, you know, I was this way. My dad would come at me and he would tell me all about Jesus.
And, well, I didn't want to hear anything. But when another man talked to me about Jesus, my ears perked right up and I listened. And I think that happens so many times in so many different lessons in life. And that's the one thing about if you do let your son go to one of these, sit back and watch as some of these men will crowd around these young boys because these men are these men that I've only known them for a short time, but they've got a heart for these young boys. And I'll tell you, I'm so excited to watch God move in this.
From what I've seen in the last five years of studying Trail Life USA, I'm so excited to watch what God can do with these. young man. And I want to just give the number out again. Maybe you're driving around and you're in a safe place and you can make a phone call to us. Maybe you're in Lynchburg, Virginia.
Maybe you're in Dayton, Ohio, Toledo, Ohio. Maybe you're in Charlotte. Maybe you're in Raleigh. You're in Winston. You're in Salt Lake City.
You're just listening and you have like maybe a question for Ryan about this. Or maybe you have something that you'd like to share. Maybe a moment when you were a young man. And you experienced a kind of a camping kind of a experience with your dad or with your grandfather. You're out fishing, you're out hunting, you are.
Building a fire, you were setting up the tents, and you just got to know your son or your grandfather in in just a very kind of a unique way without a lot of distractions. And Jesus did that. And he took the the disciples out to a a solitude place and they prayed and they got away from the hustle and bustle of everything. But the number is 866-3486. 7884.
That's 866. Three four eight. 78.84. We'd love to hear from you. Maybe you have, like, I call it a hack.
You know, maybe a tip on On a way that we can be the kind of fathers that we want to be. What kind of advice would you give a young father today? Or if you had to give advice to yourself, younger self side of you, what would you say being a father? What does that entail? How have things changed?
And we know a lot of things have changed. With the dynamics of phones. A lot of good can come out of using our phones and the internet and such, but But there's a lot more competition for the minds and the time of our young men. And so this is a great opportunity that we have with Trail Life USA to partner with a group of men that Really want to instill biblical principles into the lives of young people. And just be accountable to each other.
Sharpen each other, you know. Sharpening each other is a very important concept. That we have as men, and we should do that.
So, we're going to continue on reading here. Let me get that number one more time: 866-348-7884. I'm reading about the prodigal son, but I think there's a lot of things going on here.
So then we have verse 18 of chapter 15. It says, He the the the young man, he says, I will arise and go to my father. and will say unto him, Father, I've sinned against heaven and before you. and am no more worthy to be called your son. Make me as one of your hired servants.
And he arose and came to his father, but when he was yet a great way off, His father saw him and had compassion. and ran and fell on his neck and kissed him.
Now that's that's a picture that But boy, I have some thoughts on that. Ryan, do you want to jump in first and just share any thoughts that come to your mind when you imagine this father? Who's supposed to be kind of like Back in those days, you know, you weren't supposed to be like running around, I guess. It wasn't as. uh dignified or something like that to do is what I've what I've been hooked.
Hold on to your thoughts, because there's the music again. We have one more segment of Truth Talk Live. We'd love to hear from you. We need to hear from you. We want to hear from you.
866-26666666666666 348-7884. Is it worth it to invest into our son? I think it is. Before we sign off for today, please know that all of us here at Utah Partnerships for Christ appreciate your prayers and support. We are also available to do Zoom call workshops or personal coaching on reaching Mormons for Christ.
Contact us today at upfc.org. That's upfc.org. Thanks so much for joining us on another edition of Passion for Christ.
