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That's public.com/slash podcast. Paid for by Public Investing. Brokerage Services by Open to the Public Investing Inc., member Finra and SIPC. Advisory Services by Public Advisors LLC, SEC Registered Advisor. Generated Assets is an interactive analysis tool.
Output is for informational purposes only and is not an investment recommendation or advice. Complete disclosures are available at public.com/slash disclosure. Yeah. Uh And we continue with our American stories, and up next, a rule of law story which takes us to Memphis, Tennessee, and a liquor store owned by Doug and Mary Ketchum called Kimbrough Wine and Spirits. Their quest to own their own business is a horror story of sorts.
as it was necessary for the Supreme Court of the United States to make a ruling as to whether or not this couple would be allowed to pursue their American dream. Let's take a listen. Mary and I met in Salt Lake City, Utah shortly after my wife passed away in 2009.
Well, Doug and I had a lot of similar friends. We kind of knew about each other. I knew who he was, but we'd never really talked or been close. After my wife passed away, she opened up her house. for our funeral memorial dinner and just got to know her then.
That was actually really nice for me because I met all of Doug's family.
So, when we finally did start dating and decided we liked each other and we were going to get married, I already knew everybody and they already knew me. And so, it was, there was no, you know, nobody was scared of anything. Yeah. We got married, and Mary was working as a telephone technician, as a network technician. She used to climb telephone poles, just to give you an idea how.
Cool, she is. First, when I would go to people's houses and I'd say, you know, I'm the telephone man, it would be funny because you get this odd reaction from people. They'd sit and look at me for a minute, their brain couldn't quite put it together. We were in a position where she could take a little time off and. I have a handicapped daughter that was with a previous marriage and When we got married, she says, I want to be here to take care of Stacy.
So We moved Stacy in with us. Stacy has cerebral palsy. She was born in 1984 and November of 1985, she suffered a drowning accident in my sister's swimming pool in Arizona. And that left her with severe cerebral palsy. She is completely quadriplegic.
She can't talk. She can't. Sit up by herself, she can't walk, she can't do anything by herself. From the first The first year after her accident, she was in a coma. It took her an entire year to come out of her coma, and I used to have to walk her to sleep outside.
She couldn't fall asleep if she was in the house.
So every night for three years I would take her outside for a walk And walk her until she'd fall asleep. And usually it took about between a half hour to an hour. Didn't matter if it was raining or snowing or what was going on. She couldn't fall asleep unless she was outside. Um but After she slowly came out of her coma, she used to have a um A gastrostomy tube, a tube in her stomach that we had to feed her through.
As she slowly came out of her coma, she started, she had to relearn everything. She had to learn how to swallow, how to eat food, and things like that.
So It was it was quite a process and um spent a lot of years taking care of her and worrying about her. But she is um she's an angel. She Um You know, the light of our lives.
So having somebody that was willing to take that on. And marry me knowing that I had a handicapped daughter that required so much attention and so much work to take care of. Um that's a pretty big deal to me. I You know, I um overwhelmed every day at you know, the amount of love that Mary has for her. and how willing she was to take something on.
I don't think that many people could do that. In my mind, that just makes her a rock star. We got married, we moved in, we moved Stacy in with us. And Mary became a full-time mom to a handicapped daughter. She was so sweet, and I could see her just giving me the eye.
Are you good enough for my dad? I said to Doug later, I said, She really needs to come and live with us because I can tell her mom's burned out and she needs a break, and she's been taking care of her for a really long time. And I says, I don't, honestly, I don't know if I can marry you unless she comes and lives with us because I thought that she needed a little better care, and I thought I could do that.
So when she first came here, I had a little bit of a learning curve the first, I don't know, three months or so. But after that, it's really easy, and it's pretty obvious now that she should be with us. But in Twenty fifteen Stacy caught a severe case of pneumonia and We spent about a month and a half in the hospital, and the doctors told us that the air quality was so bad in Salt Lake City, especially during the wintertime, that we needed to find a. better environment for Stacy or they didn't expect that she was going to last more than about a year.
So we started a search and started looking for someplace to move that had cleaner air and cleaner water. um someplace that would uh provide us with some kind of opportunity to um own our own business and Allows to have a little more free time to spend with Stacy because we don't know how long she's. you know, going to live. We ran across an opportunity in Memphis, Tennessee, and found a liquor store that was for sale. We spent, I don't know, about six or eight months looking at it and negotiating with the previous owner.
about a sales price and trying to get all of our licensing and all that kind of stuff worked out. In June of 2016, we planned to move. We had come to Memphis, we found a house that we liked. We had made an offer on the business. Everything looked like it was going very well.
The ABC board told us that All of our information looked fine. They were going to approve us for a license. At the next hearing at the end of June. And we got our city license. And we got our city license at the same time, yeah.
June comes and they Called us, our attorneys called us and says, Oh, the ABC board says they lost your paperwork. We're gonna have to refile it. going to have to push it out till the end of July.
So, in the meantime, we'd closed on our house here and moved all of our. furniture and things out. Thought, Okay, it's just a month away. you know we can we can make it in another month so We packed, you know, we had everything packed up and we moved here. And the end of July comes, and our attorney calls us again and says, Uh, the ABC board said there's a problem, and they're putting a hold on all licenses this month.
You're going to have to wait till August. We're great. I knew something was wrong. Yeah, we knew something was up. They were stalling.
We didn't know why.
So August comes along and they said. We put a hold on licenses. We're not giving you a license. And not only that, we filed a lawsuit against you. in court.
So the issue was, and we didn't know about this at the time, but the issue was. They had a rule that said you had to be a resident for two years in order to get a license. But in order to renew the license, you had to have been a resident of Tennessee for 10 years, which effectively means that you could not get a license, a liquor license in Tennessee unless you'd been a resident for nine years. No one told us about that rule. Yeah, it took us probably six months to realize why we were getting sued.
Yeah, we were completely in the dark, had no idea. Why no idea why we were being sued. And as Mary said, has said numerous times, they could have just said no. They didn't have to sue us. I thought right from the beginning we shouldn't quit our job until we move.
And when it came time to close on the house and we hadn't gotten our liquor license yet, I said, Are you sure? Maybe we should postpone buying the house. And he goes, No, no, everything's going to be fine. They've already told me it's going to be great. And I said, Okay.
So we flew out here, we signed on the house, we packed up our house, delivered all the stuff here. And we flew back home, and they said, Well, we're going to do it next month.
So, when Doug said, Well, a month, I said, Well, can you keep your job for another month? We'll just stay here so that we have an income because I just didn't want to lose that safety net. You know, I wanted to make sure we had some income. And he says, Yeah, I'll stay here.
So, he stayed one more month. We stayed a month longer, actually, two months longer than we thought that we were going to. Because they kept postponing us. And he said, You know, we gotta go. We just, we gotta go.
So he did. He came out here in August all by himself with Stacy without a van. And that was before grocery stores delivered. And I would talk to him on the phone sometimes, and I would think, oh my gosh, how is he doing this? How is he doing this?
What a piece of news to learn that the arbitrary power of a state could deprive you of a livelihood, and for no rational reason. And we're going to get into that in our rule of law story. The Story of Doug and Mary Ketchum. The story of Kimbra Wine and Spirits. and so much more.
Here. on Our American Stories. Support for the show comes from Public, the investing platform for those who take it seriously. On Public, you can build a multi-asset portfolio of stocks, bonds, options, crypto, and now generated assets, which allow you to turn any idea into an investable index with AI. It all starts with your prompt.
From renewable energy companies with high-free cash flow to semiconductor suppliers growing revenue over 20% year over year, you can literally type any prompt and put the AI to work. It screens thousands of stocks, builds a one-of-a-kind index, and lets you back-test it against the SP 500. Then you can invest in a few clicks. Generated assets are like ETFs with infinite possibilities, completely customizable and based on your thesis, not someone else's. Go to public.com/slash podcast and earn an uncapped 1% bonus when you transfer your portfolio.
That's public.com/slash podcast. Paid for by Public Investing. Brokerage Services by Open to the Public Investing Inc., member Finra and SIPC. Advisory Services by Public Advisors LLC, SEC Registered Advisor. Generated Assets is an interactive analysis tool.
Output is for informational purposes only and is not an investment recommendation or advice. Complete disclosures. Available at public.com slash disclosures. This is Martha Stewart from the Martha Stewart Podcast. Ever wonder how to make hosting look effortless?
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Paid for by Nitza. And we return to our American stories and to the story of Doug and Mary Ketchum. A couple that had to fight all the way to the Supreme Court. just to run their family business. Let's pick up where we last left off.
We had initially had negotiated an SBA loan with Wells Fargo, and it was guaranteed for a certain amount of time, but because of the lawsuit, We lost the SBA guarantee, and when we finally won in court, we had to go all the way back through the Authorization process to get a new loan. We lost our good interest rate, and because of all the problems that we'd had, they thought it was a greater risk.
So we had to take more money out of our retirement account, and we had to double the amount of down payment that we put down on the business.
So that was the money that we had Allocated really for operating capital and to come in and do renovations and things like that. uh that put us in a a tight spot financially also because We no longer had that. you know couple hundred thousand dollar cushion to run the business with um we had to put it as a down payment so That's the other reason I had to really have a job, is we didn't have much leeway after that.
Now we got the business, but we've got a really limited amount of capital to run it with, and we have to. you know, be very careful how we spend our money and how much income and overhead we have.
So Mary's the one who's handled that and she has done an amazing job with it. We're not the kind of give up kind of people. kind of people to kind of dig our heels in so We dug our heels in and went to court, and it took us. I think about a year. We won our case and that was in federal court.
And at that point, The state Basically, it was required to give us a license. They still didn't want to. They didn't want to. They stalled again. They stalled, and we.
uh actually went to a hearing at the ABC board where the Opposing attorneys got up and said We know that the federal judge has ruled that this is illegal, that they can't withhold them a license, but you can do what you want. You don't have to give them a license if you don't want to. And the the uh commissioner Ask his attorney, he says, tell me your opinion. If I don't give them a license, What's my um liability here. He says, well you're breaking the law.
You could go to jail. And he said, So you want me to break the law? and risk going to jail by not giving them a license. And the attorney says that's that's Your prerogative. That's exactly what we think you should do.
Yeah. So he says, I'm not doing that.
So We were granted our license. They told us they would send it to us. And we still never saw it. We had to get our attorney to call the state attorney general to go get the license.
So there was just a lot of. Reluctance on the part of the state to grant anybody from outside the state a license.
So the Retailers' Association decided they were going to fight it. took us to the Supreme Court. We felt like we had to have representation. And at that point, we had an attorney called my wife. His name was Michael Bendis, and he was out of Seattle, Washington.
is with a group called the Institute for Justice. He called her and told her, We heard about your lawsuit, and we have a vested interest in this case. They had fought a case. In the Supreme Court in 2005, that they had won that was very similar based on similar rulings. And they wanted to make sure that that case stayed one and wanted to know if they could represent us pro bono.
And so Mary. I started crying. Yeah. Well, at first she called me and she says, There's somebody going to call you, and he wants to take our case, and they want to represent us pro bono. And I'm like, is this a joke?
Because nobody ever calls you and says, we want to go to court and we'll pay all the costs. But the Institute for Justice was, you know, we met with Michael Bendis. He flew from Seattle down here to meet with us. to talk to us about our case and tell us what they do and how they do it. They were Phenomenal.
I can't say enough about the Institute for Justice and how how great they were and what they did for us. They took the case on, they Head. an army of uh attorneys working on our case. We went to DC and met the people in the um In the Virginia office up there, there had to be at least 100 people. that were involved working on our case.
It was pretty overwhelming to walk into a room and see all those people that were behind the scenes that helped us, that we had no idea. Yeah, it was. It was overwhelming, actually. The Supreme Court case itself, we were able to fly to. DC and go up and sit in the Supreme Court and listen to the arguments.
And that was also A really amazing experience.
Well, we were really lucky because we got to bring Stacy with us. Honestly, for me, when we walked in there, it was kind of like being in church. It was very reverent. And there was a lot of respect. When those judges come out, I mean, you can just see everyone in there is 100% focused on what they're saying, what's going on, trying to see the innuendos and the cues and the questions of everything.
It was really intense. We got to listen to a case before ours. When they did finally get around to talking about us, I just had this wow moment where I realized they're some of the smartest people in our country. are up there talking about me. and what's going on with us.
And in that moment, I just realized what a really big deal it was. Before that, I just knew that we were treading water trying to make a lives for ourselves and take care of our daughter. But in that moment, and when I was looking at them, I was thinking, wow, this is going to affect the whole country. This is a big deal. Yeah, it it is a big deal.
We had one of the attorneys sit with us and Talk to us about The process and what was going on. If we had questions about what the judges were asking. We could whisper to her and she'd explain it to us. But the whole thing was really phenomenal. But sitting through the hearing in the Supreme Court, it became obvious.
to us or fairly obvious to us. that uh the judges were We're not very happy with the way the laws were written and the way they were being handled in the state of Tennessee. And that our rights were being violated. And that our rights were being violated. With no just cause.
So, they ask a lot of questions about that, and ask a lot of questions about why. you know it should be legal to Make somebody have a residency requirement when the Constitution says that everybody should be able to go to any state and work and have gainful employment without any kind of restrictions. And so we eventually won the Supreme Court case, which was great for us because we have invested every penny of our savings into this business. Picked ourselves up, sold our home, quit our jobs, moved across the country. And Kind of felt like we had The Rug yanked out from under us.
Uh Twice a week, vendors come in so that we can place our orders for our liquor. And every time something new comes in, they usually bring an open bottle and say, taste this and see if you like it.
So it's really fun because we get to try every new product that comes out on the market. Not to mention, over the holidays, some of those things are really nice.
So these are gift ideas, and so I get to drink wine and some scotches and bourbons that you'd never think you'd get to. You get to try all these different things, and it's really fun. You know, honestly, if I'd had any idea how much fun this was gonna be, I would have done this a really long time ago.
Well, number one, everyone who comes in the liquor store is either in a good mood or in a bad mood, and they're in a good mood when they leave. If someone had told me what was going to happen to us when we first started doing this, I said I would have said, No, I don't ever want to do that. That would have been too hard. It's been very, very challenging. But I have to say that now that we're on the other side of it, I'm really glad we stuck it out and we did it.
I tell everybody the smartest decision I ever made in my whole entire life was when I decided to marry Doug. And I just feel so lucky that when we got here, I was with him when this happened because I knew. That we could get through it, and we did. And I'm really, really glad the way it worked out, that justice was served, and I'm grateful for IJ. And a terrific job on the production, editing, and storytelling by our own Monty Montgomery.
And what a story. And we love bringing you these rule of law stories. Because it matters. And for people who've lived in other countries and come here. simply for property rights and the enjoyment, the quiet enjoyment.
of owning something you own. and not having the state just take it from you in many parts of the world. That is how people live. From day to day. There is no rule of law.
And in the end, it's very hard to proceed with a business or any other enterprise. And what wonderful people we met: Doug and Mary Ketchum. You just love 'em. They're the heart and soul of the country. And look what Mary did.
Marrying Doug and taking on the responsibility of that beautiful girl, Stacy. And then just moving everything. On behalf of their daughter, that's why they end up in Memphis to begin with. And here come these state laws that say nine years. And what's that about?
Well, it's about protectionism. And it's about, well, the thing that many people hate in this country, which is crony capitalism. and big companies or big interest groups stopping a small person from doing their business. And thank goodness for places like the Institute for Justice who fight for the rights of property owners who can't afford to litigate against these bigger interests. And my goodness, imagine being in the U.S.
Supreme Court and having your case matter not just for you. but for every other small business that gets bullied. by some state board or from some silly state law. The story of the Ketch'ems, and in the end the story of rule of law prevailing. Here on Our American Stories.
This is Chelsea Handler from Dear Chelsea. After the big game, like most people, I kept thinking about the commercials, and there was one that stayed with me. It was from the Blue Square Alliance Against Hate, and it wasn't loud or flashy. It showed a Jewish kid being targeted at school, and another student who chose not to ignore it. As someone who is Jewish, that moment felt very real to me.
Not dramatic, just familiar. And what struck me was how clearly it showed that hate doesn't always announce itself, but the impact is still huge. If you saw the blue square spot during the big game, it's worth thinking about. And if you want to show support, sharing the blue square is one small way to do that. Ever wonder how to make hosting look effortless?
Here's a secret. getting ahead of the mess with new Reynolds Kitchens countertop prep paper. Just lightly wet the counter beforehand, so the paper grips and stays in place. Then lay down the Reynolds kitchen's countertop prep paper so drips and spills stay on the paper. not all over your kitchen counter.
You can roll out dough, prep a party spread, or cook alongside family. When you're done, cleanup is as simple as lifting the paper and revealing that clean counter underneath. Effortless. You can use it for cooking and baking prep, and even crafting, especially when you need extra working space. Because when the mess is already handled, you can focus on what matters, the food, the people, and the moment.
It may look effortless, but now you know it's Reynolds' Kitchen's countertop prep paper. Take a tip from me. Wet it, set it, prep it, done. Make it easy. Make it with Reynolds' Kitchens Countertop Prep Paper.
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