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Medical Cost Sharing for Entrepreneurs

MoneyWise / Rob West and Steve Moore
The Truth Network Radio
May 21, 2020 8:03 am

Medical Cost Sharing for Entrepreneurs

MoneyWise / Rob West and Steve Moore

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May 21, 2020 8:03 am

The pandemic has changed the way people work and some of those changes may be permanent. Many experts say a surge of new entrepreneurs may be in the wake of the COVID crisis. On the next MoneyWise Live, Rob West and Steve Moore welcome Lauren Gajdek of Christian Healthcare Ministries about a new way entrepreneurs can manage their medical expenses. Medical cost sharing on MoneyWise Live at 4pm Eastern/3pm Central on Moody Radio.  

Rob West and Steve Moore
Rob West and Steve Moore
Finishing Well
Hans Scheil
Rob West and Steve Moore
Rob West and Steve Moore

The coronavirus pandemic is changing the way people work and some of those changes may be permanent. That trend is colliding with another. A growing number of workers deciding to start the wrong business experts are saying a surge of likely in the wake of 19 Rob West today speaks guide Christian healthcare ministry is about a way that can manage their medical expenses. That's your calls at 800-525-7000 on anything 800-525-7000. I'm Steve Moore medical cost sharing is that's nice. They were this one Rob Loring guide deck is vice president of communications and media at Christian healthcare ministries. She's been with us before and she joins us now to speak about medical cost sharing and why someone starting a business just might want to consider it.

Well, that's right, Steve. Because the need for healthcare benefits is one of the chief reasons people shy away from starting a business and Lauren were delighted to have you back with us. Absolutely you've heard from some of your members about their hesitation to start a business, and specifically because of this issue of healthcare benefits and talk to us about that.

People are something like Christian healthcare little bit different from what very few. What we find out there's a lot of challenges you know when starting a business, obviously. And you need to have healthcare on that day and age, so Scott Christian healthcare ministries is a solution for entrepreneurs and that you know we definitely welcome on folks who are in that realm, you know, as long as there Christian living by biblical principle states. That's obviously key. You bring up such a great point and that is this when you're thinking about starting a business, you have some excitement. Hopefully you have some unique skills and abilities to deliver a compelling service or product but you gotta think about marketing and you gotta think about the financial side of it and you've got to think about how you're going to cover healthcare benefits for yourself and others and I love this idea of Christian healthcare ministries being a solution to that Lord, are there any drawbacks starting out Christian healthcare and not ensuring we are a medical health cost sharing faith based dilution on a different paradigm shift. I like to say that all the time. You know it's something that I think a little bit to wrap your mind around what did you see that there are so many advantages to being part at Christian community that supports you with your medical bills and also supporting other Christians all over the country with the same need such a key part of this couple times that you do have to be a Christian you have to be a follower of Christ in order to participate in this health cost sharing ministries talk about that aspect of it that this is really designed for believers based on the biblical model important monarch talking about beehive does have some programs for group on however you know that the affordable care act of the national healthcare law has some fairly stringent requirements that what what what were talking about today. I just want to clarify is really about entrepreneurs. You know, at the code to owners of larger business that bite, we are definitely a great solution for your family. You as an entrepreneur, your family can participate in PHM and I realize a lot of spiritual advantages and the financial advantages as well. So the biblical model for this, we see a couple places in Scripture, we have just about a minute before first breaks just talk to us about that aspect of where this comes from God's word right relation to which is very tethered burden and way you will sell the lot crying and we also like to point you acts chapter 2 and four where all the believers that you know in the early church had gathered together they pooled their resources and because of that there was no one in need, and they were able to share the burden like we just talked about in Christian healthcare ministries… On a larger scale with with believers joining from all over the place, just as he was a hostess room was for joining us today. Lord help you find them online at CH ministries.more. Do you know if you have enough money of house. Do you know how much is enough. If not, one blue can help with this book.

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Later in the program. Here's her phone number 805 five 7000 right now we have a great pleasure of having Lauren guide to back with us from Christian healthcare ministries so you want to start a business. Well, you got a lot of things to think about including covering the cost of healthcare for your family and that's just one of a number of things on the list today specifically were talking about how entrepreneurs can look at Christian healthcare ministries is a solution to covering the cost of healthcare is sharing the cost with other believers in a time-tested way. Lauren talked to us for just a moment before we talk again, specifically about entrepreneurs, about the size and scope of Christian healthcare ministries has been around 1981 that we are approaching our 40th birthday were not quite there yet on and we have members, believers from all over the country, you know, we have missionaries in other countries as well on that were in all 50 states that those are primarily the folks we serve and that we've last year we shared over $500 billion. That's billion with a B on and all of this is coming from. You know Christian faith, reaching out and helping one another.

There's no contract which is really quite amazing if you think about it is the body of Christ coming together based on the biblical model. Let's go back for a moment to this entrepreneur who's thinking about starting a business. Perhaps something they've always wanted to do. Maybe even the current environment we find ourselves in with covert, 19 is caused them to say you know what I'm to go and step out. Maybe my hours have been reduced my jobs been eliminated. This is my chance to perhaps start the business. I've always wanted to why his medical cost sharing uniquely suited to someone starting a business. Well help you a lot. I would say that the primary thing you know and entrepreneurs you having to make a lot of the stations. I know it really all writing on your shoulder, that an entrepreneur, but you know that the type of folks who enjoy that independent then you know Christian healthcare ministries is something that really can be taken with you wherever you go. You're starting up a new venture, or even just a new job with a different employer and they don't offer the benefit that you're looking for. You know then Christian healthcare ministries as they are and you know you can receive treatment from any healthcare provider as long as it's within our PHN guideline store because you spoke about this only times we tend to think that everyone has all the details of the sex with the same time we know that there are people listening right now who have never heard Willie may have never even heard this radio program before so quickly some basics and generally the first thing people want to know is will what's the cost for me and my family.

Can you just give us the high points that reprogram gold, silver and bronze and programs range from $78 online on our bronze program all the way up to $516 per family on our gold level and wanted anything that we deal is that no matter how many people you having your family. I know family ever paid more than $516. So even if you have 10K you know you never pay more than $516 on articles programs have 10 kids happy working okay. As you're starting a business is a lot to think about is having to put something like this in place for your family is essential the paperwork.

If we don't have a lot of free time on our hands because were busy getting this new venture up and running.

Is that going to be hundreds.

There is an entrepreneur and I know that that it started and get things running. You know, like I said a little bit earlier, learning Christian healthcare ministries is a bit of a paradigm shift, you know, there are some things that you would be requested to do that, you would necessarily have to deal with different kind of healthcare program by one of the really nice things is you know once you learn it. It's pretty easy shift in how you been thinking before and then also you know, we do have staff. To help you and guide you.

We have educational videos, you know, we have all kinds of things in place to make this an easy transition for you and not put a huge amount of extra work on your shoulder. Still, as believers, we are commanded in first is to provide for families. It says that were worse than an infidel. If we don't provide for families and having a risk like this offset making sure we can get proper medical care, but doing that in a cost-effective way sharing that burden with other believers is really so critical and for perhaps that entrepreneur who starting out on a shoestring budget. This could really be helpful is not true right you have a lot of program you want to start out at the bronze level on $78 per my trip that would be for an individual with a little bit more for a family that you could switch up the silver switch up the gold I you know whenever your budget allows for it. Lauren, when you present when working with physicians. It's the working with physicians part the can sometimes be the hardest are the most confusing, particularly for someone new or your new patient. So when you present your information to the physician.

I presume you guys have a card or something like that. Is there any pushback. Is there any confusion at that level, or are doctors nationwide pretty familiar with Christian healthcare ministries are what what cost-sharing is all about what we find that we get a lot of wheat we get those who are scratching their head that what is this thing you know then we we do try to educate our members. You know how to talk to their healthcare provider and am a member of the health cost-sharing program but they been around for a long time and and you note that we get them talking point and then you also have healthcare provider just love and I can use the word gosh they just gush about lately. They love treating patients to our PHN members on another cost savings had been in a lot of cases paperwork and most important thing I think is its transparency and medical prices because you know our members when their patients. They know how much their cost is that how much their carrot, which is so important's doctor discussing involved just was trying to think of the world has ever been used on our program before know once we were talking about oil wells in Texas, but only time that the term of his glory. Go just a few seconds. Well, so bottom line. Why should someone starting a company consider medical cost-sharing or have a long track record of helping people one on an overnight insurance and there's no contract.

We really help people with their medical bill for a long time. You know where the Better Business Bureau accredited charity program to repay existing condition and don't take my word for it. Go to our website for videos that Lori thinks of it with us to so much for having the website you want to visit is CH listening to me was love that calls just you know the seven things not to do with your money times and would you like to know the 10 ways to trim your budget amid the current pandemic you get those answers and much more. When you subscribe to the new money wise magazine will receive valuable expert articles to follow advice leaving get access to exclusive podcast episodes and your subscription is free, get access to the money wise magazine moneywise than to actually hear his word counting table calculator just like everything the time we you are down to 400,372 sends many times we were Like constantly.

We learned he does not calculate our sin.

He calculates single time we choose to believe God is calculated as righteousness. Leaving credit your account every time we believe him. This is not that the Rochester city credit as righteousness, and you can display God you can do anything you want. You cannot be totally weighed and believed to believe God you believe you really think you are.

You knew what he says you can do what he says I can do more word calculator area where you were some very light in yourself and you come to know Jesus Christ. Scripture only phone microbrews and financial voyages of financial wisdom God's word right now you support moneywise. Not 25 moneywise. was wondering about financially that's fair game today, so will the roots giving, receiving, credit, or maybe buying your first home refinancing that let's talk about those things and more. First you have to place the call 800-525-7000 Roberts begin Green Bay, Wisconsin hi Judy, what's on your mind. I will block it. Think on yourself and I'm thinking about what you think this to set up my long term health care investments for my husband and myself and I was just wondering what you think of this program.

Yeah I'm a little confused by using a long term health care policy. Normally it's done with just a simple whole life right right that's what I want to use it for it is with the whole life policy but I'm doing it is been for correlated for you very good. I understand that I am familiar with the concept think on yourself. I'm not a huge fan but I will say it's it's not a scam it does work for some people, so I'm not going to tell you that it's something you just need to run from, but the reason I'm not a fan well few reasons. First of all, the rate of return within these policies as well. Especially now with really low interest rates. Secondly, you're paying for a death benefit. Perhaps you don't meet because you should already have a less expensive term policy in place that would give you the full value of the death benefit you need. So often, this is, perhaps, in addition to that in your incurring an expense for the death benefit you.

Perhaps it's unnecessary. Of course there are upfront costs with these policies. The agent has to be paid. The company fees typically that in many cases will wipe out half of the first years accrual.

Justin paying all of those transactions and commission costs. And then, yeah, of course, have to have a steady source of income to be able to make the ongoing premium payments, and maintain the policy for the soul to work. So I think given those conditions. I just find it to be a lot simpler if you need term. If you need life insurance just by pure life insurance and get the death benefit and then simply save money for larger purchases at the best rate you can infer a long-term investment strategy. You know, obviously using a tax-deferred vehicle is great which I know is also offered inside the life insurance policy you're talking about but I just find it simpler and a little easier to maintain than we don't have this low rate of return it alongside the fees that go along with the upfront costs and then the ongoing maintenance fees embedded in the policy no get. There's nothing inherently wrong with this other than it being a little more complex and then you know the things that I just mentioned, but for those reasons, I tend not to like these more complicated solutions like make yourself, though, to some extent for long-term healthcare. You just going with an insurance company that offers I would so you instead go out and find long-term care insurance policy that meets the needs that you have been you as you think through what care you might want to have access to.

I realize there's obviously a lot of open questions, you will be able to answer but just in terms of thinking through the various costs from in-home care, all the way to nursing home care and everything in between. Oh, what might you need based on the income you have now is a supplement to cover the cost of the long-term care that fact most Americans will need for you.

Of on average 18 months to three years and by a policy that pays out if that need arises.

Think the key is just to make sure that you do your homework. Find a long-term care insurance company that's committed to this space do a good bit of shopping around. Make sure you have an inflation rider and some of those kinds of things I think are really important and then you've got that that you in place if that situation occurs. Of course it's really important that you also have the ability to work that in your budget because of at some point you have to drop it.

Then you lose the coverage of all the premium that you paid along the way so I would at the very least Judy find a long-term care insurance agent and insurance agent who specializes in this particular area to quote some policies for you and put that alongside this other strategy is a consideration request Judy Ware and were glad that you called us today. Thank you so much. We wish you the best dire Indiana hi Vicki, what you question for Rob and I will like 401(k), combined about money.

With everything going on I don't hardly get out of 401(k) and retirement. I don't know I should take it out and put it somewhere safe still leave it alone.

Couple questions for you here Vicki number one.

How is this account invested is all in stocks or is it in the mix of stocks and bonds. How would you describe the company 2020 2020 okay very good. Well, I suspect you haven't lost a whole lot to keep in mind the S&P 500, which is just a basket of the 500 large US stocks weighted by market, which is a good broad index of how the overall stock market doing. It's only down one better, more more than 1% for the last year. If we go back to April 2020 nineteenths. Although we have a lot of volatility and yes we were down significantly in a very short period of time in the late February or March range. We have recovered quite a bit. If we look at a one year chart. The S&P is is basically flat and so I think the reason that one employer without someone has to hold and we come back. What I'd like to talk about is the need to draw an income from these 401(k)s get a better picture of your income plan for retirement and the will talk about where you and this is how should we as Christians think about what if we could invest our money in a way that aligns with what we believe that Eventide we believe it is to love God and love our neighbor in the very practice of investing investments for performance and better world future with a sense of wholeness and purpose. We call this investing makes the world rejoice. More information is available. Christian healthcare ministries enables believers to show love for one another by sharing each other's health costs through CHL's voluntary health cost-sharing programs members uplift each other spiritually and financially. CHL is an eligible option under the affordable care act and the Better Business Bureau accredited charity interested. Learn more by calling 800-791-6225 or online at CH ministries.more hi I'm Tricia and I went through many radio, the Moody Bible Institute first of the week standing June 2021, building yourselves on training.

Keep yourself waiting for the mercy of our Lord Jesus Christ. 20 and 21 prophecies in the Old Testament authors came from different cultures and different time and different styles, like good friend to bring you the messianic prophecy covers and explain every messianic addiction at all points Jesus the Messiah. Get your copy is a great deal more about our money than most of us imagine Jesus is more about our money and possessions and about anything else, including both heaven and hell in managing God's money on the radio breaks it all down. Simple and easy to follow format that makes it the perfect reference to your interested in gaining a solid biblical understanding of money, possessions and eternity managing God's money is available moneywise live.newsline by Washington sharply divided U.S. Senate has confirmed John Radcliffe as director of national intelligence Democrats refused to support the validation of her fears that he would put the saws intelligence communities work better president Trump, a victory for Michael Flynn's defense he made while the DC circuit Court of Appeals now ordering the judge handling the case against the present former national security adviser Michael Flynn to respond to a request by the defense to dismiss the case. The DOJ two weeks ago moved to abandon its own case against Lamberth US district court judge in the case Sullivan instead appointed a former federal judge to argue against that request and submitted a schedule to allow third parties to submit arguments in the case.

While president Trump says the US is pulling out of a global treaty that allows unarmed observation flights over each other's territory.

This is answering the question or comment for the West today just before the break we were speaking with Vicki and tell your Indiana wondering about her 401(k) as lots of people are these days and she's getting close to 65 years old and retirement. Vicki is your thinking about retirement. What you said is about a year where you're wondering how to handle these 401(k)s that you have one that's current, and then I guess you have some old 401(k)s. Is that right okay one of the two. What's the total of all of the 401(k)s combine the current one in the previous okay and are you planning to draw an income from this 55,000 in the aggregate. When you retire to supplement what other income sources you have or do you envision these accounts continuing to grow. I okay will replay the pullout monthly from this sure about that, whatever.

I mean, I don't know. I will probably be paying rent and now I'm paying time. Okay well I would encourage you to go and put a budget together.

You know your 12 months. Let's try to get an accurate picture of what your income and expenses are to look like in that retirement season based on whatever changes you anticipate and then we need to look at this 55,000 and say what role can, that place usually is a rule of thumb, we would look at investment savings, retirement savings and say that the ideal scenario would be to pull out 4% or less a year with the goal of replenishing that through the dividends and the appreciation in the income coming into the account with a very conservative portfolio with a small portion allocated to stocks which gives a little bit more growth potential in the larger portion allocated toward fixed income. Very conservative investments and the two overtime should allow you to maintain that 4% a year, so you're not impacting the principal but you could continue to draw an income for with 55,000 that would essentially be about $2200 a year about $183 a month. That's just at 4% if that works for you that's great. If it doesn't do you just need to recognize you're either going to need to take more risk with that. So you get up the potential for higher appreciation which means the potential for greater downside as well or you just have to recognize you're going to be pulling money out of the principal each month and therefore this account over time is going to be declining because depreciation on the income of the dividends is not enough to keep up with your rate of withdrawal and so it's going to decline it at some point you will deplete these funds. In either case, though, you're going to have a decades long need for this money. If your health is good and the Lord Terry's and so I think from that standpoint the fact that you were in the 2020 fund a target date fund tells me that it was allocated very conservatively, even if the other account was allocated toward stocks.

You probably are not down significantly from one year ago and you're not to pull it all out one time you're going to start drawing income off of it. So what I would prefer to see you do is step one going build that budget so you can develop a plan as to how much are we pulling out step two might allow these accounts to recover with the market over the next year, as you await retirement and then thinking about based on that budget you to put together how you want to position the investments in retirement to give you a small growth component. But then the majority toward very conservative fixed income investments.

If you need some help with that. I'll direct you to places one would be sound mind they be delighted to help you or you could find a certified kingdom advisor there in Indiana by going to Kingdom advisors, excuse me, moneywise and then click on find CK.

Hopefully that's helpful to thank you Vicki.

We appreciate your phone call today.

Let's quickly move to Miami, Florida hi John, what's on your heart today will wipe down all you ever wear out all and just we were to go realtor that she wanted to do so by back at 360 contract on April 14. So now she will not fund often read about how to someone. It broke so we put $5000. You know the word out that we all house right now. Will you know John, I'm so sorry to hear about the situation. I'm not a real estate attorney, but let's just talk generally about this and talking where you go from here. So I understand correctly is the current owner is the intention to break the contract and not sell it to you and therefore return your earnest money is that the plan by whatever but the real you know all the so your money you confirmed is with the attorney in the escrow account and you have a contract. Is that right that specifies what the earnest money was for in the purchase price that both you and the seller have signed okay and so I think at this point. This is a highly regulated space this. This happens every day where earnest money is returned, but normally it's because the buyer walks away for any number of reasons, but a deal can be terminated by the seller if they have a change of heart you would expect to have your earnest money returned to you. Once the contract is canceled and you know unfortunately then at that point you can't buy the house. You gotta start this process over which I know it's very frustrating right now you need to focus on getting that money returned to you.

So I would call the.

The closing agent back the real estate attorney's office and talk about what next steps you have let them know that you're not getting calls back from your realtor if you can't get anywhere there then I would perhaps reach out if you have a local church.

She can get a referral to a real estate attorney who could give you some counsel on where you go from here.

Obviously it's good news is that money is in an account that it can't be distributed without a contract being performed and it's not to be performed.

If we don't go to closing because there is somebody occupying the residence so the money is safe. You just need to get to the place where the contract can be canceled by both parties in, and the money can be returned to you I'd start with that closing agent's office because that perhaps would get you in a situation where you want to spend any money if they simply can't help you, and you can't get your realtor on the phone, which by the way I show up in his or her office and then tell them you need their help and and perhaps talk to the real estate board. If you can't get them to respond, but perhaps your next step is to find a real estate attorney who could give you some guidance. Somebody who would be on your side of the table and could guide you in this John, I'm so sorry to hear about this. I know this is weighing heavily on you. We do appreciate you checking in will certainly ask him what he was like praying for you John God bless you. We appreciate your phone call.

Unless you listen this is moneywise live stick around calls this you know not to do with your money and ways to trim your budget and you get those answers much more subsequent to the moneywise that expert on description three moneywise the magazine moneywise. My door/I'm here to help you understand God's purpose for you like the eyes of a layman coach you had the longest streak of college history revealed how he trained his players so successfully told exactly what to do then you tell a thousand words in the workplace how often you have to express the idea that people a lot of the early church had one of those things up all top and repeat repeat. Christ came into the world to save purpose and just we do now. Maybe if we set a thousand. Now this weekend said your job is to guide revival outside the walls. By moving everyone's year with today closer to Jesus. If you want to know how easy that is go tomorrow to never waste teaching social media. Many people adopt an attitude toward marriage and finances that it will all work out some. Sadly, it often doesn't financial woes can devastate a marriage but there is a better way. God's way, money and marriage God's way by our date will help you discover God's approach to growing your finances strengthening your relationship with your mate and cultivating godly joy, money, and marriage God's way is moneywise Thanks much for joining us today is not about your finances and what does God's word has to say about it. Let's continue on Inverness, Florida Margaret, thanks for your patience and I understand your wanting to get a patent domestic violence are diverse and we are currently living with an elderly I'm trying to figure out how to make this invention that I have in my head work and type, but I would have to do a search to figure out if it's already on the market. Somewhere somebody already has a patent on my idea yeah Margaret's easiest approach of those can cost a little bit of money would be to hire a patent agent or a patent attorney to just do that search for you appropriately to determine what's out there. Obviously, patent applications, if you decide to proceed and you get counseled that it makes sense to do that require both legal and technical expertise, and even small mistakes can dramatically compromise the value of a patent so that's why I recommend most people.

If you've got the ability to do it financially hire somebody to do it right and about the search as well as filing the patent application. You can do it yourself and plenty of people do, so I could recommend a book to you if you'd like to read up on this.

It's called patent it yourself. It's by David Pressman patent yourself. His last name is Pressman. Just like it sounds, it's now in its 16th addition he's passed away now, but he was a patent attorney and a fellow believer and felt that there was a need to be a good resource for inventors like you to walk through the patent process with as few challenges as possible and so you can check that out. Organizations like LegalZoom, of course, offer do-it-yourself options, but I recommend you start with David's books you have a good overview of what you're doing before you try to go it alone again.

If you have the ability to do it always like getting professional counsel because you're right you do need to do that search and then at some point if you decide to proceed, you want to file the application and that needs to be done right. Margaret over the as we've heard from lots of people who were in the same situation you are. Many of them have come close to being scammed. There's a lot of junk out there on the Internet and people are wanting to charge you lots of money to do things that either don't need to be done or they're just trying to scam you. They either run off with your idea or anywhere my bottom line is to be very, very, very careful. If you dealing with anybody who's on the Internet. Make sure you're talking with professionals don't go into debt to patent debt and again purchasing a copy of this book may be may be your most cost-effective option as you approach us okay yourself there you go you got it right now looking at the library has a copy that's a guessing that's a great idea.

I would start there if I were you, and were glad that you called. We wish you the best. Thank you very much Rob ever invented anything ever know know but I've watched a few episodes of shark tank in Russian Steve would see Belleville, Illinois hi Gloria, what's the situation Gloria, are you with us.

Hello Gloria on all and I'm getting to the point where I'm an up to $12,000 and I am running out of the job completed the work. That work is a lot of work to be done. The problem can be done. I'll work. I think the job I think he really going at it right get paid more. And where do I go from here because I can't afford to have him.because my while the wide open like bird fly through it. But it think time to find time to get it finished. You know, yeah, I'm really sorry to hear about your situation and put you in a really tough spot. I really don't like the sound of what you're describing. I would not pay them any more money and really stop right where we are.

Here's the challenge of this patio. Contractors really put you in the position of being the general contractor with him working for you by the hour that is highly unusual for this type of work your reputable builder who does this type work should be able to come up with a total project cost before the work even starts. And if you're not even close to finishing it out.

You need to really stop paying him and find out what is the appropriate amount for the full cost of the job, perhaps even get somebody else in there to give you a bid on what this project should have costs from start to finish to determine whether something is being done that's where he's taking advantage of you, perhaps, in fact, as you describe running up the bill by delaying the work charging you by the hour which you hesitate to say this but just from the sounds of it probably should never been done in the first place. And certainly you should of been given a bid you in full on the front end and that's just not right. The way this is being handled. So I would try to rectify the situation. If you can get in good faith and understanding that what you are going to pay between now and the end of the job is reasonable for the total scope of the work if it's not that I think you need to confront him about that and you said, at least in my notes and said he's a God-fearing man. And so, as believers, I think the next step would be, according to Matthew to approach him directly and then approaching with others, and perhaps work through the local church if you need to find a resolution to this and you all can't come to a meeting of the minds, but I think the starting point is to say, I'm not comfortable proceeding this way. I need a final price for the total job and I want to know that this is in fact appropriate given the scope of the work and what others are paying for a similar project and if he's not willing to give that to you that I think you need to fire him and you need to try to remedy the situation. At the same time finding somebody else who would come in and do this based on get a full project cost as opposed to an hourly situation which would be more akin to jobs or small jobs. Not a single project of this magnitude working by the hour, which is not be typical and Gloria, if you feel a little intimidated when you speak to them about these things, I'd suggest that you find a man a teacher and elder, perhaps even the pastor of your church to join you when you have that conversation so that you you will feel as though you have some support when that meeting occurs. You don't want to be confrontational, but you wanted to be honest and you want to know that he's being honest with you, having spent $12,000 already and you not even close word which chagrined by that. To say the least. So we will be praying with you about this. Let us know how it works out if we can help you down the road it all. Feel free to give us a call back would have to let you go right now but thank you, Gloria. We wish you the very best Harrisburg, Missouri Beth, we have just a couple of minutes what's on your mind property in order to buy the property on the property and also along the same lines, or can it be, eventually selling a home three times on the sale of the home.

Well that's I love this question. Obviously, your desire is to honor the Lord with these proceeds and if you apply the principle of the time of the principle of the tithe really relates to the increase that you're seeing.

So the way we would handle that with an investment property would which it would be the same way with your primary residence would be to say what is my true profit which would also be my increase. So to get that you would say okay what was my original purchase price. What improvements did I make to the property that increase the value of the property and then what cost that I have as a result of selling this property that reduce my overall profit to come up with a number that's truly your increase and that would be what you would tithe on and then as you take full amount of money you would apply the same idea of the next time you sell this piece of property, you'd start with your cost basis or your original purchase price. Subtracting out improvements in and costs associated with the transactions buying and selling in the year to come up with a net profit so I think that's the way to look at this if you want to apply the principle of the time to the increase to follow that okay very good shank you're very welcome and thanks for calling it.

Thanks, Beth love you see Rob this the question that we get quite often and it happens to be our opening topic tomorrow were going to take a deep dive into what tithing I don't want to get into it in depth right at this moment but I'm going to take a look at Old Testament and New Testament are we under the law, are we under grace. What does that mean what if your Presbyterian with your Baptist what if he I mean you know all the all the critical things that come up will we discussed this topic, but the bottom line is we want you to be generous when it's all said and done we do we want to get you to give with a cheerful heart. We want to give you what you giving proportionately to how God has blessed you. It's an act of obedience and worship but a lot of well-meaning Bible believing Jesus loving people come down on different sides of this and so were to try to look at both of those sides and help you navigate okay. And speaking of inventions. As we were doing a couple of calls ago never came up with anything ever devised anything. You never got creative and I mean well week. I did have that one night yes I know, I know it when we when we had little kids and we were trying to put the car seat in the car and it was pouring rain. I was really for an umbrella that I could attach to the roof of the car cover that particular section while we got the car seat and and situated because you just can't get the car see them and hold the umbrella the same time.

Great idea. What you come up with. Never go beyond would you trust your money to this man that's a question I pose yesterday moneywise live is a partnership between Moody radio and moneywise media thanks to our technical crew together and Rich have a great remainder of your day. Join us again tomorrow for new efficient

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