10 Predictions for 2024

Only God knows the future, but some folks are pretty good at making educated guesses. Hi, I'm Rob West. One of those prognosticators is our friend Bob Dahl, and he's got a whole list of things he expects to happen in 2024. We'll go over them today, and then it's on to your calls at 800-525-7000.

That's 800-525-7000. This is Faith and Finance Live, biblical wisdom for your financial decisions. Well, this is always a fun time for us when we can have Bob Dahl on the program for his annual predictions. Bob is the Chief Investment Officer at Crossmark Global Investments, a faith-based advisory firm that manages over $5 billion in assets, also an underwriter of this program. And Bob, great to have you with us today.

My privilege as always, Rob. Bob, normally we have you join us each week with the market update, kind of reflecting on the past week, looking at the week ahead, but we're going to zoom out a bit and focus in on your sought-after annual 10 predictions for the coming year. But before we dive into those for 2024, why don't we look back first, and perhaps you can just reflect on last year's predictions, how that went, and what your assessment is. Well, in baseball we did just fine.

We batted 500. Five out of ten we got right, Rob, but that's well below our 72% long-term number. It was a tough year. You recall we entered the year not just us, but just about everybody anticipating recession in 2023, and that just didn't happen. In fact, the economy got stronger, the labor market continued to flourish, and inflation with the Fed's help continued to fall.

We didn't get to the central bank targets of 2% inflation, but we made some good headway. And so we would argue at the end of 23, the risks are now more symmetric. That is, the risk of inflation is still there.

It remains sticky and above target. But on the other hand, the risk of weaker economic activity exists also. Unusual for late and an expansion, 2023 saw PE ratios, valuation levels, move up. So it wasn't so much earnings that carried the day, but higher valuation levels, which took those so-called magnificent seven to very high prices. In fact, the average stock at the end of October, Rob, was still down thanks to the November-December rally. That changed, but boy, that average stock lagged those magnificent seven and therefore the benchmarks very significantly. Yeah, and clearly those valuations are going to weigh on us as we think about what might play out in 2024. We'll get to that in a moment. But talk about the narrowness, Bob, of the average stock and whether we truly did rectify that in the last couple of months of the year, or was it really still highly concentrated toward a more narrow range of stocks?

Rob, it was still very concentrated. Despite the catch-up in those last couple of months, the average stock still trailed the averages by over 10%, a thousand basis points. So we've got a ways to go if we're going to close that gap. Yeah, and Bob, the reason why we didn't get that recession that just about everybody expected, do you think it's just because of the amount of cash in the system on the heels of COVID? Are there other reasons? Is it just a stronger economy and job market than we anticipated? What do you make of it?

Yes, all of the above to your first reason. Yes, there was a lot of cash, more than many of us thought, left over from COVID. Either the government mailed you a check or you didn't spend money, and that built up cash balances that helped fuel the economy during 2023. Yeah, and what about the labor market? Obviously, we saw strong numbers even recently in the latest jobs report, so it seems like that piece of the economy is still working. It sure is, and until that weakens somewhat, it's really hard to argue for significant weakness in the economy. And it is a bit of a bugaboo for the Fed because if job growth remains strong and the economy is still okay, wage rates are likely to be stubborn, as they have been in recent reports, and that prevents the Fed from getting debt to that elusive 2% target.

Yeah, all right. Well, we're going to turn the corner and look forward after the break. We'll talk about whether we'll finally have that recession in 2024.

A lot of folks think we'll escape it entirely. We'll get Bob's take on that. Plus, we'll dive into those 10 predictions.

The theme? Goldilocks remains a fairy tale. Bob will explain that and get into some of the specifics on his 10 predictions for 2024. Bob Doll with us today. He's chief investment officer at Crossmark Global Investments, a faith-based advisory firm, and we're back with much more just around the corner.

Stick around. Thanks for joining us today on Faith and Finance Live. I'm Rob West.

With me, my good friend Bob Doll. He's chief investment officer at Crossmark Global Investments, a faith-based advisory firm. You can learn more at crossmarkglobal.com. He's also a frequent contributor on Fox Business and CNBC, and his annual 10 predictions are sought after on Wall Street. A lot of folks wondering what Bob is predicting for the year ahead. We're unpacking those predictions in this interview today, and Bob, just before the break we were talking about last year, let's start to look ahead. As you mentioned, a lot of economists thinking that we are finally going to get that technical recession in 2024. Others think that we'll miss it entirely.

Where do you come down? I think we're going to have a recession. Mild most likely, Rob, but you know, I marvel at how the beginning of last year, virtually everybody said we're going to have a recession, and now the beginning of the new year, virtually everybody's saying, soft landing, don't worry about it.

So I'm not sure it's that simple. I still think we have residual issues from Fed tightening and inversion of the yield curve, among others, that will cause us to sag for our economy in 2024. All right, very good.

Well, it's something we'll of course keep an eye on. All right, let's dive into the 10 predictions for 2024. Let's start with the theme, Bob. Goldilocks remains a fairy tale. Explain that.

Goldilocks, of course, it's a perfect environment, not too hot, not too cold. I don't think you can have it both ways. That is to say, if we have a soft landing and the inflation rate continues to fall, we're not going to get double-digit earnings growth, which the consensus is calling for, and therefore the earnings disappointments will hold stocks back. Conversely, if we have double-digit earnings growth, it probably means the economy is reasonably strong, and maybe inflation doesn't fall like we think.

I don't think you can have it both ways. Yeah, very good. All right, Bob. Well, to that point, your first prediction is that the U.S. economy experiences a mild recession. You just mentioned that. You also say in this prediction, the unemployment rate rises above 4.5%. Where are we today, and what effects will we feel from that if that plays out? We're at 3.7% currently. In fact, we've now gone 25 months, the longest period in over 50 years, with the unemployment rate below 4%. So 3.7% to above 4.5%, that's not a lot, but it would cause a mild recession. All right, number two has to do with inflation.

What's the second prediction? Yeah, we've not talked about inflation until the last couple years, because the prior decade, inflation was between zero and two. We think we're in an environment where inflation is going to be an annual topic, because the inflation feeling of the last decade becomes the inflation floor of this decade. Hmm, interesting.

All right. And does that continue, then, you think, for decades? I mean, where do you think inflation is ultimately headed? So I think in the United States, given all kinds of structural issues, a more normal, long-term structural inflation rate is closer to three than it is two, whereas last decade, the answer to that question was closer to two.

We had a wonderful period where a lot of things lined up. Not so sure that's going to be the case going forward. And that leads us to our third prediction, and it has to do with the Fed. So the question is, Bob, will the Fed just get comfortable with that higher, perhaps closer to 3% inflation rate? And what does that mean for rate cuts in 2024? I think they'll have to get more comfortable with that.

Now, not everybody agrees, and they'll still try to get to two. The expectation by the Fed fund futures curve, in other words, investors, is the Fed's going to cut rates six times in calendar 2024. With the recent strength of the employment numbers, I don't think they'll be able to get started in March, as many people are thinking.

All right. Let's jump ahead a few predictions to stocks. Where will stocks end the year? Obviously, we're coming off of an all-time high right at the end of 2023.

Where do we go from here? Yeah, I think that there's some residual strength from the huge momentum of November, December. So we could go higher for a period, but this Goldilocks not happening tells me that we probably have a sag or a fade in the stock market. And I think there's a better chance that stocks have a minus sign in front of them this year than a plus sign. It means you're going to have to work hard to make some money.

It won't be impossible, but more difficult. Yeah. And would you apply that minus sign just in your estimation to both the S&P 500 and the tech-heavy NASDAQ?

Yes, I would. I think the valuation rise that we saw in both of those is going to be a bit of a fade this year. We may have some catch up in some of the laggard areas, some of the defensive stocks, smaller cap stocks. We've seen that in the last few weeks. I think there's more of that to come, Rob.

Yeah. Let's dive into that just a bit deeper. What do you think are the sectors of the economy and therefore stocks that will outperform this year? Yeah, we always have a prediction that says these sectors over those. And this year that prediction is energy, financial and consumer staple sectors outperform utilities, health care and real estate. I'd highlight energy and financials as extraordinarily cheap.

And if we have an OK economy, both those sectors, I think we'll see not just some earnings growth, but also some valuation improvement. Interesting. Bob, obviously a lot going on geopolitically beyond our borders.

Does that continue and what impact does that have on the markets? Yeah, boy, we could spend hours on this one, Rob. The list is long already.

You know it. I think we will have more hot spots and geopolitical and just domestic political crosscurrents. Let's hope that we have little impact on the markets. Take the Middle East War, for example.

If it expands and the Straits of Hormuz and the Red Sea become a problem for oil prices, well, then that will impact markets. But so far so good. We have to pray to the good Lord that we stay clear of those sorts of things. That's for sure. Bob, you always have a prediction related to the makeup of the political landscape here domestically. Obviously it's an election year.

What do you make of that? Yeah, our somewhat provocative prediction is that all three elections switch parties. That is to say, the White House moves from Democrat to Republican, the Senate moves from Democratic to Republican, and the House moves from Republican to Democrat. All three parties switch.

And this would not be unprecedented. For the last 10 elections, in nine of them, we voters booted out the incumbents as we're always looking for something better than what we've got. And that would mean we're going to see the stalemates continue just in terms of getting things done, I guess, huh? Yes, and the polarization just to increase.

Wouldn't it be great if we really had someone who could unify and be representative and govern for all the people, not just a political party? Bob, just 45 seconds left. Let's finish with faith-based investing. Where do you see that headed in the new year? So the good news is for seven years in a row, faith-based investing has increased its market share of overall assets under management. We think this will be year eight as more and more people of faith are spending time to line up their portfolios and their faith so they're one in the same. We think it's a great trend and thrilled to be part of it. Wow, I love it, Bob. I hope that continues to play out.

Really exciting what's happening in the faith-based investing sector. Well, Bob, great work, my friend. We appreciate you sharing your predictions with us. Have a great year. Bye, Lo, so high.

That's Bob Doll. You can download the complete list of his 10 predictions at crossmarkglobal.com. That's crossmarkglobal.com. Back with your questions just around the corner, 800-525-7000. Stick around. The opinions offered during this program represent the personal or professional opinions of the participants given for informational purposes only.

Any information provided is not intended to replace advice from a financial, medical, legal, or other professional who understands your specific situation. So glad to have you with us today on Faith and Finance Live, where we want God to be your ultimate treasure and money, a tool to accomplish God's purposes. Money is a good gift from the Lord.

It's a blessing. It's to be used to bless others through our giving, to provide for our families, even to enjoy. But when we make it the object of our affection, we make it an end as opposed to a means to an end. We treat it like it's ours and not God's.

Well, it gets out of God's original design, and that's when it can really become problematic in our lives. So we want to help you reset that, see God as your ultimate treasure, as your provider, and money, a tool to accomplish God's purposes. We want to tackle your questions today in light of biblical wisdom, and we'll do that when you call 800-525-7000. Again, that number is 800-525-7000. We only have two lines remaining of the 10 that are available right now, and so you're welcome to give us a call.

If you get a busy signal, just try again. Let's dive in. We're going to begin in Maryland today.

Sue, how can I help? Hi, Ron. Thanks for the ministry that y'all do. We have a family business that we feel we need to be the best stewards possible, and are currently with a credit card processing company that does not really share our values, our Christian values, and so we are looking to try to get direction on credit card processing companies to handle credit cards for our family farm business that you might recommend, or how to go about and find out where to go with that. Very good.

Well, I appreciate you asking. You know, more and more believers, Sue, like you, are wanting to align their business dealings with their values, whether that's a credit card processor, a bank, or even their investing solutions. It's difficult, though, and so where do you go to get this information? One resource that may or may not be helpful, it's really primarily for publicly traded companies and mutual funds, although the processor that you're looking for may be in there, or as you find others by doing just even your own research online, you might be able to run them through this data set. It's at inspireinsight.com. It's a free tool with biblical values data on around 41,000 companies in the United States. Again, focused on publicly traded companies, but you may be able to get research back that shows whether the company happens to align or is misaligned with your values, pulling from a whole host of data sets into one aggregated source.

So that's one. You could also reach out to our friends at Christian Credit Counselor, excuse me, Community Christian Credit Union, I'll get it right in a second, at joinchristiancommunity.com. They could likely recommend a processor. As a Christian Credit Union, they would be familiar with your idea that you want to align your values not only with a banking partner, but with a processor. They may have a suggestion on where you look. I wish I had just kind of at the ready the name of a processor that you could feel good about. I don't.

I love the idea of where you're headed, and so I think I would do a bit more research. Okay, and that website again was communitychristian.com? Yeah, well, so just go to joinchristiancommunity.com. That's joinchristiancommunity.com. That's the website that will take you to the Christian Community Credit Union. That's what I couldn't get out before.

And then the other was inspireinsight.com, and that's where you can access this biblical values data set on about 41,000 companies. Great. Okay, thank you very much, Rob. All right, Sue, thanks for your call today.

Let's go to Orlando. Hi, Leo, go ahead. Ron, how are you doing?

I'm doing well. Thank you so much for taking my call. Yes, sir. Thank you.

I have a question. So I inherited a condo with two siblings where my parents lived, and the condo was rented. It's worth about $130,000. So my siblings, I have to take care of their, you know, pay them off, but I don't want to sell the condo. Yeah.

Because it has income and, you know, in today's world, it's good to have a source of income. So my question is, I have a 401k with about $375,000. I turned 65 already, so I have no early withdrawal penalty. So my question is, it'd be good for me to take money out of my 401k to pay them off, it would be around $60,000 or so, or try to get a loan, which may be a challenge, because the age of the condo at the owner occupancy level, I'm told that the unit, I might not be able to get a lender to lend in the condo. So would taking money out of my 401k be a good idea?

Yeah, I don't like that option. I mean, I hear what you're saying about wanting to hang on to the condo. It's cash flowing.

It's something you'd like to have as a part of your portfolio. And I happen to like real estate as an investment, Leo, but borrowing from that 401k is not good. If you separate it from the company, it'd all be taxable. Plus it's out of your 401k.

And the whole purpose that's there is to grow. And you're not doing that while that money's, you know, redeployed elsewhere. You said that the condo is worth 130. Is that right?

Yes, about 130. But I wouldn't I wouldn't borrow, I would just withdraw the money. And then I actually waited till this year, because I figured if I did it early this year to buy them out, I won't have to deal with a tax consequence, although they'll take out 20%. I wouldn't have to deal with reporting it to my statement till next year. Well, you'd actually would, because when you have a big income influx like that, you'd need to send an estimated payment. So that's a pretty big haircut, you're going to take off that money. And now you've paid the tax on it. So the portion that goes to the government is not compounding, you know, to retirement down the road, which is why I'd rather you not, you know, add that much money 60,000 to your taxable income in this year. I mean, one option would be to look at a hybrid where you take a smaller mortgage, you know, and pull only half of it. So you're only adding in this case, 30,000 to your tax income, 30,000 to your income. But I'd probably start and see if, you know, if you've got good equity, which you would, 30 or 60,000 on $130,000 property, you should be able to get a mortgage.

So I'd check on that first. You could check with our friends at movement.com slash faith, or any other conventional lender before you make this decision, but I'd look at that before you withdraw from the 401k. We'll be right back. Thanks for joining us today on faith and finance live.

I'm Rob West. We've got a couple of lines open today for your calls and questions on anything financial. Anthony is standing by to take your calls today at 800-525-7000. We'll try to get you on the air as quick as we can. 800-525-7000. You can call right now. Let's go to Wheaton, Illinois. Hi, Lucy.

How can I help? Hi, I'm 76 years old and I don't have drive insurance and I'd like to know if you could recommend me a drive insurance that is affordable because I'm an SSI. Okay. Well, Lucy, I appreciate that call and thanks for that background. You know, if you're on a supplemental security income benefits for a disability, it's going to make it more difficult to get life insurance in addition to your age being 76. I think the better question is, at least as a starting point is, do you really need life insurance? So the purpose for life insurance is to care for dependents. If the family breadwinner should die prematurely, do you have anybody depending upon your income that would would be in a hardship situation if you were to pass away?

Actually, you know, I'm helping my daughter because I live with her, but they just to help out to support me anything. But if I die, funeral expenses, you know, that's what I'm worried about. Sure, sure.

All right. Do you have anything set aside that you could use for funeral expenses? I'm trying to say something, but I don't know.

I know you say about $10,000 for funeral nowadays. Yeah. And how much do you have in your savings right now? I'm just starting. Okay. Not much. All right.

Yeah. So, you know, you could potentially, you know, look for a, you know, a small policy that would see kind of be a guaranteed acceptance. You know, you can get life insurance with no medical exam. There's also insurance over even 80 years old with no medical exam. And, you know, you could do it specifically to cover the cost of a burial.

You know, I would have your daughter help you just, you know, look around in terms of some options for that. It'd be a very small policy because here's the thing. I mean, this is going to be an expensive policy if you try to get a substantial amount of death benefits. You know, it's your age and health status. But if it's something modest just to cover the burial expenses, perhaps, you know, you could look at a $25,000 final expense in burial policy or something like that that would basically just cover, you know, these expenses payable to your daughter.

And, you know, that's really the next step for you. So you could use one of the online life insurance tools that would help you find this. You know, there's several websites that would help you find the very best company for your age and health status for this type of policy. So one is a website called Nerd Wallet. And I'm looking at what they say based on their independent reviews are the five best burial insurance companies as of this month, 2024, January. And so you could go to nerdwallet.com and just search for best burial insurance companies. US News and World Report puts out the same thing. So there are some great options. Forbes would be another one.

So I would do some research online, you know, for this and have your daughter help you as well and see if you could find something that is small enough that it would fit your budget, but also give you the peace of mind to know that those final expenses are covered. And the goal would be that if you could continue to save, perhaps, you know, down the road, you could drop this policy as it gets more expensive and then just rely on your savings. Does that make sense? Nice.

Yes. OK, very good. Ask your daughter if she'd help you with that.

Tell her she could take a look at Forbes, Nerd Wallet and US News and World Report and find who are some companies you should get quoted for burial insurance. And Lucy, I hope that helps you. May the Lord bless you. Thanks for calling today.

Let's stay in Illinois and talk to Paul. Go ahead, sir. OK, Rob, thanks for taking my call. Appreciate the financial wisdom that you give to us each and every day. Thank you.

Our situation is that we've been married over 50 years and Lord's blessed our marriage. We started budgeting in the mid 1980s using the home budget book we got at the drugstore. I don't know if you remember those things.

I had a blue cover. Oh, and. It was amazing. And we kept that up and it easily converted into an Excel because it's a grid grid set up days going across the columns and then items going down the road. And and I've maintained that since the 1990s. It fits like an old shoe. I just love working with it.

No one problem. And my wife does know how to read the read the reports for a budget actual invariance both year to date and months to date. But it was pointed out the other day and then I kind of know this all along. My wife is not really much into the spreadsheets like I am. In other words, if I was to pass away from the scene, you know, she'd be high, wide and dry as far as running our budget system. Yeah.

Do you hear me? Do you have other couples? Oh, yeah. You know, and that's typically the way it is, you know, is that the Lord puts a spender together with a saver.

And, you know, we just typically are opposite so often with regard to how we process information. I know Ron Blue, one of my mentors, the the popular finance author from a biblical viewpoint, he said he would sit down with his one of his clients was a well-known pastor. You'd know the name. He was his advisor. They'd meet once a year for dinner. And, you know, he'd go over all the spreadsheets with his wife because she wanted all the detail.

And then at some point, he and the husband would excuse themselves during the meal on the way to the restroom. He'd say, How are we doing? Ron would say, You're doing fine.

And that was all he wanted to know. So, you know, there's there's different personality types, Paul, and we've got to find something that works for both of you. What do you feel like knowing her personality would would best fit for her? Well, I mean, maybe you can make some suggestions as to, you know, some really low profile budget systems that, you know, for the the non-numbered person could get along with. Is she comfortable with technology?

For instance, do you think a real simple smartphone app would work or are you looking for more of a tactile paper and pen approach? Well, you know, my problem is we've tried every dollar and mint and some of those apps. But what I find is that, you know, we we take out $300 a month in cash right at the beginning of the month. And and incorporating cash transactions in your budget, you actually have to manually because a lot of these these systems, you know, you have your credit card tied into it, you have your debit card tied into it. And I get that it makes it simple. But when you add in cash, that's a that's another dynamic.

So that's just a little description. All right, let's do this. I'd like to do an experiment, Paul, if you're on board with it, and I'm going to cover the cost for it. I want to give you six months on the Faithfi app.

It's our budgeting system built on Larry Burkett's envelope system, but in a in a simple format. But I'm also going to connect you with a certified Christian financial counselor, who's really skilled in the Faithfi app to meet with you and your wife, get you set up on it, see if we can make it work for you. And as long as you agree to come on a couple of months down the road, if it works out and tell us about it, we'll cover the cost of the certified Christian financial counselor and the subscription to the the Faithfi app. Would you be open to that?

That's very generous to you, Rob. I appreciate that. Let's do it. All right.

Sounds good. Stay on the line. We'll get your information. We'll be right back after this.

Stay with us. Great to have you with us today on Faith and Finance live here on Moody Radio. Before we dive back into the phones, let me just mention, you know, I mentioned to that last caller before the break about the Faithfi app. And, you know, it's a critical resource. You know, unless you have a plan for managing God's money and then a system to control the flow of money in and out, you will never be able to accomplish fully what God has for you. Because having margin is the key to funding every goal, whether that's increasing your giving, paying down debt, saving for the future.

If you're living right up to the edge every month or beyond it by taking on debt, you'll never be able to accomplish those goals. Well, having that plan and then being able to control the flow of money in and out, making course corrections throughout the month as you spend down your various budget categories and perhaps delay purchases or curtail spending when needed, you've got to have a system to do that. Now, whatever system works for you is the best system for you. I would suggest if you don't have a system, you ought to take a look at the Faithfi app. We've built in three approaches to managing money that, and I'm confident, one will fit your money personality. You can have a hands-on approach with the digital envelope system.

You can have more of a hands-off approach with just our tracking system and everything in between. You can download it today at faithfi.com. Just click app or just head straight to your app store and search for Faithfi Faith and Finance. Check it out today.

You can get a 30-day free subscription and learn more about it, but I think it might be the solution you're looking for. Again, faithfi.com. All right, let's head back to the phones. We're going to get through as many questions as we can before the end of the broadcast. Lynn, you've been very patient there in Huntington. How can I help? Hi.

Boy, am I grateful to be speaking with you, Rob. Thank you so much. My 16-year-old recently started her first job.

It's been about the past six months. She's a straight-A student. She's in the top five of her class. She's very driven in all that she does, so with her paycheck, she's spending every dime she has. She's mainly buying gifts for her friends and for her animals, and this is just such a critical point for me to be able to step in and guide her as a parent, but I don't want to completely take control of her money.

What would you do? Yeah, so you said she's actually earning this money, right? She works for it?

Correct. Yeah, okay. I mean, that's the key is learning the value of hard work and, you know, how long she has to work for the things that she wants to buy. Oftentimes, the missing piece is understanding that, wait a minute, that, you know, out to dinner trip that I just made required me to work for three hours at my job.

I might rethink that next time. Now, obviously, she values the things that she's doing, and I love that she's a gift giver. Obviously, God has kind of hardwired that into her, but we need to balance that with the reality of money is a limited resource, and, you know, we need to have a plan if we're ever going to accomplish our goals. You know, often it starts with taking a step back and really having a values conversation. What's important to you?

What do you want to be able to do now and in the future? Talking about the importance of generosity, which is all throughout the Old and the New Testament, that we're to be generous as a reflection of the generosity God's extended to us, and so we've got to take that right off the top and and give as unto the Lord. We have short-term needs for her that's, you know, enjoying time with her friends and giving gifts, but there's also longer-term goals. You know, does she eventually want to be able to buy a car or get an apartment or, you know, do some things that are going to require her to save and not consume all that she has? Well, making, you know, plans around those, talking about those, and really unpacking what they are and then putting a spending plan together that really reflects that, because the way we spend our money is a reflection. It's really the clearest indicator of what's going on in our lives spiritually and what we value, and so does the way she's spending her money value in total what's important to her?

Well, obviously giving gifts to her friends is important and it reflects that, but what about giving to the Lord? What about saving for the long term for some of these other goals? I think that's key, and so perhaps you helping her to really understand that it's more difficult now for you to model that, you know, just given her age, but obviously it's, you know, you still have some time while she's under your roof. I think there's also another tool that could be helpful. There's a wonderful resource that we ran across a few years ago, and I'd be happy to send you a copy of it.

It's called Open Hands, Open Hands Finance, and basically it's a money course for college students and older teens like you've got, basically young adults, to really teach them basic skills, cultivating a stewardship mindset, building a life of generosity, creating a budget, setting up automatic savings, making a plan for debt, investing for the future, building good financial habits, all of these things, and in each one of the lessons there's a podcast by the author, and she's just phenomenal. She's a lot of fun. She's obviously, you know, younger, and so she speaks the language of young adults, and I think could be, perhaps if she's willing to do it, something that could be a real game changer for your daughter, and I'd be happy to send you a copy of this, the workbook, and then with the workbook she could access the podcast, but give me your thoughts on all that, Lynn. I think this is going to be exactly what we need. Thank you so, so much. Well, you're welcome. She can tangibly watch, and that we can do together. Yeah, exactly. I think that's right, and I think it's done in such a way that it'll really speak her language.

It's not geared toward, you know, somebody in their 40s and 50s and 60s, but really kind of caters to somebody in her season of life. So, listen, you stay on the line, we'll get your information, and we'll send this resource, Open Hands Finance, out to you to give to your daughter. Thanks for your call today. Let's go to Florida. Hi, Lena.

How can I help? Yes, thanks for taking my call. I had a previous job where I had a 401k, and it's been over a year since I left this job, and it's been, the phone is just sitting there. I was wondering if it's wise to take it to a Roth IRA, or what what should I do with that fund? Yeah, it's a good question. Lena, how much is in that 401k? Do you know roughly? About 18,000.

About 18,000. All right, and do you have another 401k? For instance, did you move to a new employer that also has a 401k? I do, but they do not have 401k. They do not have anything that I can invest in. Nothing that you can invest in.

Okay, got it. Yeah, so what I would probably do is, you probably don't want to move it to a Roth just because unless it's a Roth 401k, I'm assuming it's not, is it? I was thinking of a Roth, yes. Right, but is it in its current form, is it a traditional 401k or a Roth 401k?

No, a traditional. Okay, yeah, so if you convert, if you would have to roll it out to a traditional IRA, you could convert it to a Roth, but that would add the whole $18,000 to your taxable income for the year, and then you'd have to pay tax on it. So I probably wouldn't do that.

I'd think probably about rolling it out to an individual retirement account an IRA, and then our friends at SoundMindInvesting.org could help you through the Sound Mind Investing newsletter with some mutual funds that you could pick, or perhaps you have a friend or family member that could help you, but opening an IRA, a traditional IRA at Schwab or Fidelity would allow you to roll that out, and then you could pick a good balanced mutual fund that matches your age and and risk tolerance, and then get that money invested. Oh, that's a good idea. Okay.

Hey, we appreciate your call today, Lina. There is one other thing, let me mention, there's something called the Schwab Intelligent Portfolios. That may be a good option for you. It's very low cost, and it uses ETFs, basically index funds, to capture the broad market indexes, but as you answer the questions about your age and risk tolerance, it would build the right portfolio that doesn't take too much risk, and that would come out as a part of you opening the account. Just in your search engine, type Schwab Intelligent Portfolios.

That might be a great option for you, and again, it would be a traditional IRA that you're opening to roll the 401k into. Hey, thanks for your call today. We appreciate it.

Let's go to Illinois. Hi, Barbara. Go right ahead. Oh, hi. Thank you so much for taking my call.

I love listening to your program. The thing is, I had fraud on my account, and it went into my debit card, which is no longer my debit card, because I got rid of it, because they got into it even today. They were trying to access it, but the thing is, with regard to what happened, it had to do with a big department store and gift cards, okay? And I was duped into doing something that I would never ordinarily have done, thinking that I was getting rid of what somebody was trying to steal out of my account. Okay, well, I'd gone to the bank and the police, and the store where it happened, it was through credit cards, or no, gift cards.

Anyway, they sent me a text and saying, we're really sorry, but we can't get your money back for you. And I was thinking, you know, would it be a good idea? They did it in an email, and I was wondering, should I answer them and say, you know, I'm very tired living on social security and not a whole lot more, and could you just rethink it?

Do you think that's a good or bad idea? First of all, Barbara, let me just say how sorry I am for what you're going through. I know how this is weighing on you, and it's just really difficult, especially given the financial situation you're in.

Unfortunately, no. I would cut off all communication. There's not going to be any sort of willingness to hear you out or empathy on the other end. Any ongoing communication just keeps that door open for additional fraud, for them to try to get information from you, perhaps plant something maliciously on your computer that could further create further damage.

So I would absolutely cut it off. I'm glad you reported it to the police. You needed to do that. You know, there are articles on the FTC website, so if you go to consumer.ftc.gov, there are articles specifically on what to do if you paid a scammer with a gift card, and it explains how it works.

It'll give you the steps to follow, including reporting it not only to your bank but to your gift card company, telling them you were scammed, giving them the information, asking for your money back, and then also reporting the fraud at reportfraud.ftc.gov. That's reportfraud.ftc.gov. So I'd cut off communication and read those articles. Barbara, we're going to be praying for you. Call back if we can help further. God bless you. That's going to do it for us. Faith in Finance Live is a partnership between Moody Radio and Faith Buy. We'll see you tomorrow. Bye-bye.