Leveraging Net Worth Giving

. Then it's on to your calls at 800-525-7000. That's 800-525-7000. This is Faith and Finance Live, biblical wisdom for your financial journey. Well, I'm delighted to have Dr. Ken Boa and Russ Crosson here again today. Ken is the founder of Reflections Ministries.

Russ is Executive Vice President and Chief Mission Officer at Ronald Blue Trust. Gentlemen, great to have you back with us. Rob, thanks for having me. Thank you.

This is our third and final interview on the great book the two of you co-authored. It's titled Leverage Using Temporal Wealth for Eternal Gain. It's such an important book that we want everyone to have a copy, literally. So that's why until the end of the year, we're making it available to folks for a gift of any amount to Faithfi. Just go to faithfi.com and click on the Give tab. Now, for folks who may not have heard the other episodes we've done on this topic, Russ, would you give us just a thumbnail sketch of this idea of biblical leverage? Yeah, it's the idea that we know about leveraging a house, you borrow money and use leverage to buy a bigger house. Well, if you leverage your giving, you get involved in what God's doing around the world, you can have an incredible impact on eternity. So it's the idea that you take yours, invest it now, and see what God does to multiply it.

Yeah. Well, you know, one question folks struggle with a lot is, where should I give? And some even ask, is it okay to give somewhere other than my local church?

Ken, how should folks answer those questions? Yes, I think that this issue—in fact, the church was the one that was collecting the revenues for then the distributing of those things—but Paul talks about those who share in the benefits of the gospel should share all good things with those who presented it. So it has to do, as we can see in the epistles, with those who have taught them, those who have discipled them, those who have mentored them, those who have been evangelists as well. So there's a wide array of things, but it has to, in my mind, involve something to do with the gospel.

It seems to me that that's a critical component where there are different kinds of things that we can give in different areas. But I think that the gospel needs to be included. More specifically, though, the great commission of making disciples.

And so that's what we're told. So this ministry of God's word that you can give it away, and then God's mercy—we talked about this in the appendix—and then ministry of God's justice. So they're different—the Spirit will guide us in what to do as we look to Him and use our wisdom—use His wisdom and combine it's a synergistic process. Ken, what would you say to those who say, well, wait a minute, we're not under the law of Moses anymore, we're under the law of Christ, and therefore the tithe doesn't apply? Yes, in fact, I think of the tithe as an actual working minimum, because to give proportionately is going to be—it's really giving according to your ability. And so while we're not giving it an exact amount, it would be well for us to realize that it's grace-giving, and it is based upon who much has been received, much will be given. So that whole idea that you receive and then you give. So it's a perspective of holding on to God's perspective of what's going to last, what's going to endure.

What defines me is what it comes down to. See, Rob, we wish the New Testament gave us a percentage. That would be a lot easier. That's why the instruction in 1 Timothy to rich people, because we wish it told us a percentage—23 or 62 or 49. Give me a number, because to Him it must have been given, it must have been required, and the more you have, all right, what's that mean for me? And that's where it gets to be real challenging and why you have to really listen to the Holy Spirit, because rich people can be way more generous than they realize. And when we talk about rich people, we're not necessarily talking about those that have an ultra-high net worth, although they're included. But really, we can all think of ourselves as rich, Russ, because we have more than we need, right? Yeah, if you define rich, which is the way we define it, as having more than you need, because God promises to meet our needs, then some people have way more than they need. Some people have just enough to meet their needs. That's where it's really easier for the person that just has enough to meet his needs, and the person has way more than he needs.

It gets way harder for him to answer the question, how much is enough? That's really helpful. We're talking today with Dr. Ken Bola and Russ Crossan, the co-authors of Leverage, using temporal wealth for eternal gain. When we come back, what about asset-based giving, and how do we test where the Spirit is leading us?

Also, what's the proper mindset for our giving? Following this interview, your questions today at 800-525-7000. Stay with us. We'll be right back. Great to have you with us today on Faith and Finance Live. I'm Rob West. Joining me today, my good friends, Dr. Ken Bola and Russ Crossan, co-authors of the book Leverage, Using Temporal Wealth for Eternal Gain. We want to put a copy in your hands, and we can do that when you make a gift of any amount, and we mean that, any amount at faithfi.com, that's faithfi.com, just click the Give tab.

Now Russ, our friend Ron Blue calls Dr. Bola, Dr. Dr. Bola, because he's actually got two doctorates. How did you feel writing a book with a guy that smart? Well, it was very intimidating, and I hope the readers, when they read the book, they'll know the part he wrote and the part I wrote. Remember, you have a theologian on one side and a practitioner on the other side, so have grace when you read the way I wrote versus the way he wrote, and you'll be able to tell the difference.

I suspect you will. Dr. Bola, how do we test where the Spirit is leading us as we think about our giving? I think it has to do with risk-taking. There's no growth in the way of knowing Christ and discipleship apart from taking of significant risks. And the more we grow, the more he will invite us to take risks. So that's why the proportionate principle is so incredibly high, because the more we have, the more we're actually going to be having to say it's going to be more and more, not less and less. And so the way we grow in our faith is to commit ourselves to an action that will fail unless God shows up. Yeah, we've been talking about the where of our giving.

Russ, let's talk about the how. That's, of course, another important question to address. You talk in the book about cash flow versus net worth giving. How do we decide which, or is it both? Well, I would say for potentially the wealthier people, it's both. For most folks, it'll be cash flow. They give out their salary or their dividends off their company or whatever, and that's what we mean by cash flow giving.

They're writing checks or giving cash. But if they have a net worth and have assets that are growing, once you've kind of answered the question, how much is enough, you need to say, why is that still growing? My retirement plan is going up. My business is going up. My real estate is going up.

And so you have to look at that. If you're going to answer the question and be able to stand before God and he says, how did you do with what I gave you? You have to look at the asset side of your financial life, I think, as well, because I don't think it's going to be a good answer to say, well, I kept giving out of my $200,000 salary, but my business grew to 20 million under my watch and I didn't give according to my abilities.

I went along. So I think the wealthier you are, the more you have to look at the asset side of your situation, in addition to the cash flow in order to give according to your ability. Yeah. Is it your experience that when you challenge folks around net worth giving, that requires a bit more of an act of faith? In many cases it does. But quite frankly, Rob, because we live in a great country, many times they avoid capital gain tax.

They get to write it off. So quite frankly, the gift of an asset sometimes is even better stewardship than a gift of cash because you avoided some taxes, you get to write it off at a fair market value. And so it does take faith.

It takes some time for people to kind of grasp that. I think the biggest thing is to understand that you can actually give assets that you can. And that's where the use of foundations and things like this come in, but you can give assets.

And then it is harder sometimes, but sometimes it's really good stewardship to do that. Mention a few of the specific opportunities for asset based giving that our listeners may not be familiar with. Well, the first one would be if you have an appreciated stock in your portfolio that's got a built in gain, you ought to look at anything that's appreciated, appreciated land, appreciated real estate, anything that's gone up, LLC interest. So anything that is appreciated, you might want to consider giving it before you sell it. If you're thinking about selling it, maybe even give it in lieu of giving cash because you avoid that capital gain tax. So it's anything like that that's that's got appreciation in it on your asset side. You know, you don't give a obviously you can give over 70 and a half. You can give one hundred thousand out of your retirement plan.

There's some other cool things you can do there. But anything that's appreciated would be what you look at first. Yeah, and that's why we love the Donor Advised Fund. It becomes such a powerful tool to facilitate the kind of giving that Russ is talking about.

Dr. Boa, help us with the mindset that we should have during the act of giving. The mindset, I think, should be one of privilege, not duty. It's actually an opportunity of freedom that I've been given to have some eternal impact during this temporal arena and to transmute the lead of what's passing away into the gold of what will endure forever. So it's a mindset of doing that. But part of the thing that tethers us as well is the bottom line.

How much do we have? And often we want to hold on to it, even in this life. And my own thinking more and more, I have to say, Rob, is that I'm finding I'd rather die poor at the end. I want to live in such a way that I have no more than I actually need to get along because it's going to be asking me these questions later on.

What did you do with what I gave you? And if I invest it now and put it in the lives of people that will have an incalculably diffusive impact, there's no way of quantifying that. But it's hard. You have to treasure the unseen over the seen and the not-yet-over-the-now. So you can't take it with us, so you're going to give it away either now or when you die. And so I think many people think, well, I'll just give it away when I die.

But there's a both-and. You give currently, as we've already talked about earlier, reverse compounding, but you also give through your estate plan. But it's both-and, not just give it all at the end. Yes, when we're talking about current versus deferred giving, the old phrase, if you're giving while you're living, then you're knowing where it's going. There's something to be said for that because the sooner we give it away and not hoard it and hold it, but rather let it be used.

If it can be used now out of the abundance God's given me, I'm going to be invited to invest in that which is going to endure forever. I can't quantify it, so there's a risk involved. But the more I have, the more I should give proportionately.

We're told that. The more I have, the more I should give sacrificially. It should affect my life. And I have to be willing to actually give it away more and more. So it's not just something I'm going to hold onto after I'm dead, but rather giving with a warm hand so that we actually can experience that grace of knowing that it's being used now and not just deferred later on. Ken, do we actually get credit for gifts we give at death as opposed to while we're living? If you're not careful, you're going to try to name your land after yourself and your wealth after yourself and have an identity that you try to continue to have this is done in my name and so forth. But to be perfectly frank with you, I think the future value of our giving declines every day we wait on it.

And don't give it away. That's a big idea, and I know you've said that reward is based on faithfulness to opportunity, and we can send this on ahead, so eternal rewards are an appropriate basis for our giving? Is that right? Absolutely. I think that we're told that if you want to receive, have a heavenly portfolio. God's not against us pursuing profit. He just wants us to define it according to how He defines it. And profit isn't money and wealth and power. Profit is relationships. It is a right relationship with God and a right relationship with others. That's where a wise person will pursue that which is going to endure forever.

So Rob, we don't go to work in the Peter Pavilion or the Pauline Plaza. Those first century apostles invested in people, and that's why we're here. And so Psalm 49 talks about that. You can build buildings and buy land, put your name on it, but it's not going to endure. People endure. Yeah, we've got 30 seconds. This has been a fascinating conversation. Russ, tie a bow on it for us. Well, I think that what I just said would be how to leave it. You know, we all have a choice. I mean, they'd be wise with their money and be sending it on ahead now, or we can be a fool and try to sit on it and hold it, and you don't know when your life's going to be required of you.

So I'd get started sooner than later. That's well said. Well, Dr. Boa, Russ Crossan, so thankful for your ministry, your friendship, and for this incredible work. We're grateful for the time you spent with us today. Grateful to be with you.

Thanks for having us. That was Ken Boa and Russ Crossan, the co-authors of the book Leverage, Using Temporal Wealth for Eternal Gain, a fascinating conversation. Folks, we want to put a copy of this book in your hands, and we can do that when you make a gift before December 31st of any amount at faithfi.com. That's faithfi.com. Just click Give. Your calls are next, 800-525-7000.

That's 800-525-7000. This is Faith and Finance Live. We'll be right back. The opinions offered during this program represent the personal or professional opinions of the participants, given for informational purposes only.

Any information provided is not intended to replace advice from a financial, medical, legal, or other professional who understands your specific situation. Great to have you with us today on Faith and Finance Live. I'm Rob West. All right, it's time to turn the corner and take your financial questions today, whatever you're thinking about financially. We'd love to tackle it with you, help you apply God's wisdom to your decisions and choices.

So what are you thinking about today? Give us a call. 800-525-7000. That number again is 800-525-7000. You can call right now. Let's dive in and begin in Winter Haven, Florida. Hi, Robert. Go ahead.

Yes, Rob. Thank you so much for taking my call. My mother-in-law is 92 years old and she's been in an assisted living home. And now they said that she's going to have to go on to a nursing home.

And so that's going to be some cost. Now, she has about $4,000 in income a month. And now they say the cost of that nursing home is going to be around $8,000 a month. So now just today, they closed on her house.

She's selling her house. And so we wanted to know what to do with that money, maybe to help make up for that deficit she'll have each month. Yeah, OK.

I certainly understand. And so you're trying to solve for a gap of about $4,000 a month. Is that right?

That's right. OK. And what is the proceeds of that home sale? It's $260,000.

OK. All right. And, you know, I think the key is going to be, obviously, how long we can allow this money to last. You know, what did what are you thinking about just in terms of how much you believe you need to be able to, you know, how long you'd like to see this extend at $4,000 a month? Yeah, maybe just say five or six years just to kind of come up with a number. OK. Well, I mean, that's right about where it would come out at, because if you take, you know, $260,000 divided by $4,000, that's 65 months, you know, that that that would last. Obviously, that could be invested.

And so then, you know, that would extend that out for a longer period of time. You know, the key would just be if we're looking at a five year time horizon, we're kind of right on the edge of where, you know, we'd probably that short enough where we need to be really careful. So, you know, one option would be we look at, you know, just using like a CD or something like that just to try, especially right now, while interest rates are higher, to be able to guarantee the money so we don't have the risk of loss. But, you know, we can still get a decent rate of return. What are you all thinking, though, just in terms of how you want to treat this money related to investments? Yeah, we were thinking along that line.

I wanted to call you and see if I wasn't thinking along the right lines. But I have seen in the ads that CDs that were, I don't know, the last time I looked some time ago was, I don't know, four or five percent, something like that. Yes. Yeah, exactly.

Yeah. So, I mean, you right now you can get five point six percent with a one year CD. You could get a five year CD at, you know, four point six percent. So, you know, that would obviously be a fairly healthy rate of return. And then you could take, you know, that four thousand a month out. And, you know, we would see that would probably last, you know, that would probably get her, you know, through six years, I would say. It would probably add an extra year with that four point six percent, you know, annualized on two hundred and sixty thousand, pulling out, you know, four thousand a month. So, you know, that's obviously not ideal, but at the same time, that's why the money's there. And I guess the question would just be if the Lord tarries and she lives longer than that, what would be the plan after that? Yeah, we've never faced this. So I just wonder what in the world would be what would happen at that time?

I don't know either. Yeah, well, you know, at that point, you'd have to, you know, put her in a Medicaid facility if somebody wasn't able, you know, to cover that gap for her. And I realize that's a significant sum of money.

So I'm not saying that somebody should, but essentially we'd be talking about, you know, getting just a little over six years. And at that point, you know, her assets would have been spent down at that point. And therefore, you know, she would have to go someplace that would be willing to accept Medicaid once she got below those levels. And so you could look into a facility that would cover that, you know, and, you know, begin to explore your options.

So you knew where she'd be headed and you all could take the time to research it and feel good about it. But, you know, I think that's about the best option. I wouldn't feel good about taking a lot of risk with this money. I think the key is to probably go and lock it in at the four point six that, you know, the challenge is you could get a one year CD and get an extra percentage point. But then, you know, what if a year from now rates are down, you know, considerably, at least you can lock in the four point six for five years today and know that that's going to get you at least that extra, you know, year and a quarter or so versus just, you know, pulling that money out, you know, without an invested. So that'd probably be the direction that I would go put it in FDIC insured CD for five years.

And, you know, I think the key is, is she going to start drawing on this immediately, though? Because if she needs the money right away, or at least, you know, a monthly starting now, then obviously we're going to have to ladder those CDs. Otherwise the money wouldn't be available. Yeah, I guess is it good thinking that we should just leave some of it, a portion liquid in?

I don't know what you call a money market like that. For sure. Yeah. So this starts right away. Is that right? Yes, sir.

Okay, yeah. So what I would probably do is take it a year at a time, probably put the first year in a high yield savings account at four point six, and then you could put the second year, you know, in a one year CD at five point six. So that comes due, you know, to start the second year, and then you could ladder it out from there and stack them on top of each other.

But yeah, for year one, I'd be looking at an FDIC insured money market account or high yield savings. Robert, thanks for your call, sir. God bless you. We appreciate it. We'll be right back.

Great to have you with us today on Faith and Finance Live. I'm Rob West. We're taking your calls and questions today. 800-525-7000.

We've got some lines open. That's 800-525-7000. You can call right now.

Let's go to Chattanooga, Tennessee. Dan, thanks for calling. Go ahead.

Yes, sir. I'm due to retire here in the next month or so, and I have an option on a private pension of taking an 18 percent decrease in my pension to keep my wife covered at the same rate until after she dies, if I die first. Or I can take the same amount of money and get a $1 million life insurance policy on a 25-year term, which will get her about 20 years if I die before I'm 84 years of age.

I'm just trying to figure out which way is the best way to go. So are you saying that the 18 percent is equal to the premium on the life insurance? Within a few dollars, that is correct. Wow. Okay.

Yeah, that's really interesting. Okay, so you get the reduced amount for both of your lives, or you get the higher amount, but you're essentially left with the same amount because you're going to direct the equivalent of 18 percent to that life insurance policy. With the life insurance, that would cover, you said it's a 20-year policy?

It's a 25. 25-year policy. Okay, so that would get you to age what?

84. Okay, so if you live to be 85, that policy's gone, and then you pass away, and now she's without any of your pension income. You need a pension, but she has other retirements too. Right, but how would that impact her lifestyle at that point? I don't know. That's the gamble. Yeah, it seems to me that the, and I'm just thinking through this with you here for just a couple of moments. This is probably something you need to connect with an advisor on, just to run some analysis a little deeper than we'd have time to do today. But just at face value, Dan, I'm struck by the guaranteed pension for the rest of your lives, both of you, versus you still having the same net amount, but taking a risk with the insurance policy that you live one day longer than the 25-year term.

Right, that's the problem. Yeah, so I feel like it'd be one thing if you had the 20% extra per month that you could sock away, but you're just basically collecting that and then turning around and writing a check to the insurance company. So it doesn't help you in any way to take the higher amount. It'd probably be better to take the lower amount and know that it's guaranteed, and she can count on that for the rest of her life. Now, if she were to say, you know, this is really your pension is surplus beyond what I think I might need because I have my retirement and my Social Security, that'd be one thing. But even then, I think her ability to have that check, even if it is kind of a cushion each month, gives her the ability or both of you the ability to just sock that away so that you're building up even more of a nest egg that could cover either of your or both of your long-term care needs, that type of thing. So I think my just kind of first blush is take the reduced amount and know that you've got it guaranteed for both of your lives. That's what I'm thinking because originally it was about $3,000 a year less.

That's why I was originally quoted, but they raised the rate on me. Oh, interesting. Okay.

Yeah, but if you're saying it's a wash on that 25-year policy, then I just don't see any upside if you've taken that higher amount. Yeah, the more I look at this, the more of what I'm thinking too. Yeah, very good. All right, Dan. Hey, listen, all the best to you. What are you guys looking forward to in this next season of life? What do you think God has for you? I do not know.

We're free to do things. Yeah, I like it. Hey, I want to send you a book. It's a book by my friend, Jeff Hainan. It's called An Uncommon Guide to Retirement, Finding God's Purpose for the Next Season of Life.

I think it might be a blessing to you just to think and pray through kind of where you're headed from here and perhaps approach retirement a little differently than the culture would have you to do. So if you stay on the line, we'll get that in the mail to you, okay? Okay.

All right. God bless you, Dan. Thanks for calling today. 800-525-7000 is the number to call. Again, that's 800-525-7000. We've got some lines open.

Let's go to Ohio. Hi, Debbie. How can I help you?

Hi. My husband, his mom just passed away and she was 97 and his dad had passed away a few years ago. They decided to put their house in my husband's name a year ago just to make things easier when they passed. The issue is he has 10 siblings and the house is going on the market today. He does not plan on keeping any of the profit from the sale. He plans on just letting the 10 siblings divide it up.

We're okay. We don't need it. But we also can't afford to pay a ton of income tax or capital gains tax or whatever will result from it being in his name. So what I'm wondering is how do we find out how much that will be before we disperse? It's only going to be worth probably $160,000, I'm guessing, at the most.

It's kind of out in the boonies in New York. So that's my question. Yeah, it's a great question, Debbie.

I appreciate that. So here's the challenge is that a lot of people go down this road thinking that they're helping and making things simpler. And then they end up inadvertently creating a taxable event where there didn't need to be if we were to have put this into a trust or a transfer on death deed.

That's neither here nor there, though, because it's already happened. So essentially, did they gift the property through a quitclaim deed to your husband? That I don't know how it was put into his name. I know we didn't give any money or anything. He has a nephew that has a wife that's a lawyer and she did it for us. Okay.

Yeah. So she probably did a quitclaim deed. Now, you all would have needed to file or they would, I'm sorry, a Form 709 with the IRS to let them know that they made this gift. But essentially, by quitclaiming the deed to your husband, it was a gift of that asset to him.

Now, he's taking the asset that's his and honoring their wishes for it to be split 10 ways. The challenge is when they did that, he inherited their capital or cost basis. So do you know what their original cost basis is for this property? They bought it 65 years ago, I think about $18,000.

Okay. So let's say you sell it for $160,000 and you take away $18,000. That's $140,000 in profit, capital gains. You can subtract any kind of major improvements.

You may try to raise that cost basis by improvements, not maintenance, but improvements that improve the value of the property. But let's say there were none and you have $140,000 in capital gain. The long-term capital gain rate, if he's owned this for more than a year, are you all married filing jointly? Yes. Okay. And do you have income between $89,000 a year? Income, not capital gains. Income between $89,000 and $550,000? Oh, yes.

Okay. So you'd be at a 15% capital gain rate. So essentially, and I'd check with your CPA, but essentially just what's going on here is whatever that profit is, because your husband didn't inherit it, which would have included a stepped up basis to the date of death, if it was gifted to him, he got their cost basis. So all this profit over what they paid for it is going to be for you all to pay a capital gain rate on, and that's going to be at 15%. So if it was $140,000, and again, we're just talking rules of thumb here, you need to have your CPA do this, it's probably $21,000 or so in capital gains tax.

So I would say have your CPA calculate exactly what it is, set that aside, net it out, and then he can divide it from there. Does that make sense? Yes, it does. Thank you. Okay. You're very welcome, Debbie.

All the best to you. We're going to take a quick break. Back with much more on Faith & Finance Live.

Stay with us. Great to have you with us today on Faith & Finance Live. Hey, we've got some lines open today. I'd love to hear from you with your financial questions. We'll tackle those together. 800-525-7000 is the number to call.

That's right. You can get through right now. 800-525-7000. We'd love to hear from you today.

Let's go back to the phones to Wisconsin. Hi, Sunny. Thanks for calling.

Go right ahead. Oh, hi. How are you today? I'm great.

Thanks for calling. Okay. Well, I have a situation where I inherited from some Treasury notes that were overdue, about maybe $25,000, and I'm looking for a safe haven, a safe place to put them in, to invest in. And I was wondering if you could possibly help me out. I'm a widow of four years and just recently turned 71, and I don't know what life holds, you know. Sure, I go invest in churches and things like that, and I go to church, and I do believe faithfully, and I do my donations, you know, and so I'm kind of lost now what I do from here. Maybe you have some advice? Yeah, I'd be happy to, Sunny. Let me first ask, do you have kind of a trusted counselor, advisor, family member who's kind of journeying with you in some of these decisions? No, I do not.

Okay. You know, I think that would be a great first step to connect with what we call a certified kingdom advisor. So there's 1500 men and women across the country that have met high standards and character and competence. They've had pastor and client references. They've been trained to bring biblically wise financial advice, but they've met significant experience requirements as well, and they signed a statement of faith. So the idea would be that this would be a competent financial professional, probably someone who's, you know, offers financial planning services, but you would know that you'd have a values match and that they could really help you accomplish your goals and objectives, but also be a sounding board to you around things like how should I invest, looking at your income and expenses and creating a plan to make sure that you know, you've got a budget that balances on a monthly basis and that your assets are being protected. So we're not taking unnecessary risk, but you're also, you know, making steps to grow what you have because we know with inflation you're losing purchasing power, you know, for any of the money that's not earning, you know, a reasonable rate of return with inflation still today and, you know, more than 4% annually.

So I think that would be a great step for you and the way you'd find a CKA in your area, again, Certified Kingdom Advisor is to go to our website, faithfi.com, click find a CKA and you could interview two or three. Now, just as kind of some ideas though, you know, with this $25,000, let me ask you a couple of questions. Apart from this money, do you have, Sunny, what I would call an emergency fund, which is just kind of a liquid savings account for the unexpected? Yes.

Okay. And how many months worth of expenses do you think you have in that emergency fund separate from the treasury note you called about today? In the liquid fund, is that including the IRAs and CDs and all the other things? No, ma'am, just that you'd have readily accessible in savings. Oh, okay.

Maybe about $10,000. Okay. And what do you, do you have a budget that, you know, has a detailed listing of all of your monthly expenses?

Yes. Okay. And what do you think that totals roughly per month? Oh, gee, Louise, let's see.

Well, it changes, you know, it fluctuates, but I would say no more than $2,500 to $2,000. Okay. Yeah. You know, what I'd love for you to do, and I'd be happy to provide someone to do this, is really get that dialed in so that on a monthly basis you know not only the things you get a bill for every month, but also we're factoring those things that don't happen every month. So, for instance, if you have a quarterly insurance payment, we can set aside, you know, one, you know, the equivalent of one month's worth of that payment, you know, away into a savings account so that when that quarterly payment comes due, you're ready for it.

You know, the same thing with your taxes. If you pay the homeowners and you don't screw that through a mortgage, you know, you put one-twelfth of that aside, maybe a certain amount for gifts. I mean, we want to look at all of these both recurring and non-recurring categories and find out what it truly costs for you, you know, each month to both cover your current bills as well as save for those things that don't happen every month. And then that would give you kind of an all-in number, and maybe that number is not $2,500, maybe it's $3,500 or $3,000, you know, whatever it is.

That way you'd have it there so you don't ever have to wonder, oh, man, this bill's coming, it's a little bigger than I thought, do I have the money? Then I'd love for you to have six months' worth of whatever that number is. Let's say it's $3,000 a month. I'd love for you to have $18,000 in a liquid savings account. Earning interest, you can get four and a half percent on savings right now with FDIC insurance, but that way you'd know that when the unexpected comes, you could fall back on that first. And if you weren't quite there yet in terms of having that much in savings liquid, not your CDs and IRA, then I would say one of the first goals from the money that came from the Treasury note is to get that savings account up to six months' worth of expenses. Then I think we could look at, you know, what the rest of your investments look like and determine how to invest anything that remains from the Treasury note. I heard you say CD, I heard you say IRA. Do you know what investments are inside the IRA? Well, quite a lot, but, you know, quite a lot. I've got good interest through them over a 15, 20-year period, you know.

I've had them for a while. Sure, yeah, and that's great. Do you feel more comfortable just continuing to manage all of this yourself, or would you like to find somebody that could work alongside you to help you make the investment decisions? Oh, sure, that would be great too, yeah. Because I'm not a perfect person, you know, and I don't have all my ducks in a row. Well, none of us are, but we can all benefit from wise counsel. The Bible's clear about that.

You and me both. So here's what I would say. I'd be hesitant, other than saying I like the idea of you getting your emergency fund up to six months' expenses. Apart from that, I'd be hesitant to weigh in on where to put the balance because I just don't know what other investments you have, and really, any investment allocation should be in light of your overall financial plan so that we know you're properly diversified, you're not taking unnecessary risk, we've got, you know, the income that you need to cover your bills, and we're, you know, growing it for the future because if the Lord tarries and you're in good health, you might need this money to last decades, you know, or more.

You know, you could live 30 more years, you know, if that's the Lord's plan, plus. So, you know, I think having that advisor to weigh in could be a real help to you and give you some peace of mind at the same time. So let's do two things.

Number one, if you're comfortable with this, I'd head to our website, faithfi.com, click find a CKA, an interview, you know, two or three certified kingdom advisor in your area and find one that could really become that trusted advisor to help you with financial decisions and the money management. The second thing I'd like to do is have you hold the line because I want to send you a book. It's just my gift to you.

It's called Wise Women Managing Money. It's from our friend Miriam Neff, who lost her husband and wrote this book for women who were put in, you know, in a position where all of a sudden they were managing the family finances. And I think it'll be an encouragement to you. I think it'll be insightful and a real blessing to you. So if you hold the line, we'll get your information and put that book in the mail to you as our gift.

And then I would encourage you to reach out to an advisor with anything left over out of the treasuries after you fully fund that emergency fund. Thank you so much for calling today and may the Lord bless you, Sunny. We appreciate you being on the program.

Let's go to Esther, Chicago. How can I help? Hi, how are you doing today? I'm good.

I've got just about a minute and a half. How can I assist you? Yes, I wanted to ask you a question about my whole life insurance. I was trying to get some money out of my either my cash value or my dividends. And I had this insurance since 1999. And they said if I take some money out of the insurance that I will still be able to keep it.

But the problem is I need. I need an insurance broker to help me with that because I have met life insurance. And I don't quite understand why I need a broker to help me with the insurance policy to try to get some money out. And I don't know if I want to do the cash value or the dividends.

Yeah. Are you looking to borrow against the policy or just take out some of the cash value? I wanted to borrow some of the money out, but I didn't want to do the cash value and I didn't want to have the penalty get penalized for that. So I just wanted to borrow, get some money out. And yeah, unfortunately, Esther, I'm not going to be able to advise you on that just because and here's the one of the challenges with whole life insurance and annuities, frankly, they're just really complicated.

And there's a lot of fine print and we're going to have to really have somebody who can help you analyze what is your cash value, what can come out without any penalties or surrender charges. And there's a difference between just taking the money out and borrowing it out because you can borrow against a whole life insurance policy and they add interest to the loan balance. And if it goes unpaid, it can cause the policy to lapse.

And obviously you wouldn't want to do that. But with permanent life insurance there, it does build cash value and you can borrow against it. So what I would do is either reach out to somebody at the life insurance company and have them explain to you what your options are or go to a third party advisor, a certified kingdom advisor and have that person analyze this for you.

You have to pay them for their time and advise you on what's possible. And you can do that at faithfly.com. Thanks for your call today, Esther. Faithhood Finance Live is a partnership between Moody Radio and Faithfly. I'm grateful for my team today, Dan, Amy, Robert and our call screeners. God bless you. We'll see you tomorrow. Bye bye.