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Episode one drops on January 1st. Today's version of MoneyWise Live is prerecorded, so our phone lines are not open. Are you a parent in a blended family or planning to be one? If so, you need to get answers to a lot of financial questions. I am Rob West.

Blended families face more challenges for getting the marriage to work, but getting everything out on the table is a big step toward making that happen. I'll talk about that today with Ron Deal and Greg Pettis, and we have some great calls lined up, but we won't be taking your live calls today because we're prerecorded. This is MoneyWise Live, biblical wisdom for your financial journey. So Ron Deal and Greg Pettis are back with us today. They're co-authors of the Smart Step Family Guide to Financial Planning.

And when they were on last month, there wasn't nearly enough time to cover everything on this important topic. So Ron, Greg, great to have you back with us today. Thank you so much. We enjoy it. Thank you.

Great to be back. Gentlemen, last time we talked about the togetherness agreement. That's a legal binding contract that you urge all spouses and blended families to draw up.

I'm a big fan of it, but to do that, you have to answer some really important questions about money first. I know you have a long list of them on your website at familylife.com slash blended. And I want to go over as many of them as we can today. So gentlemen, let's dive right into number one, and that is what are your financial obligations to your ex-spouse such as child support and alimony? This is a really important question to get out in the open, isn't it? Yes, it really is because it represents how you're going to move forward and it's going to have a lot of influence into the life that you have together as a couple. So whether somebody's listening right now and they're dating or planning to get married or already married, if you haven't discussed this, we say, get it out there. Now, the divorce decree, if one of you is divorced or if one of you was widowed, then you may have some thoughts there.

But for that person with a divorce decree, that's going to outline the details that really everybody should be familiar with, you and your current spouse or somebody that you're dating. I want to say, even though there's clarity because of the divorce decree, the moral issue is following through with it. And I have to say this, unfortunately, some parents fall short of paying child support. Sometimes people get into these little, well, I don't like the way they're parenting, or I don't like the way they spend the money that we – that's really not up to you. You have a responsibility and an obligation. The first Timothy 5, 8 passage we talk about somebody that does not provide for their relatives is, especially for the members of their own household, the scripture says, has denied the faith. I think that applies to obligations you have to a former spouse. That's your responsibility and you need to follow through with that. Well, and Ron, these are very significant financial commitments. When they said I do, I mean, child support can go all the way up through age 18 unless the child is unable to receive self-sufficiency, or unless there's attending school full-time up to four years, alimony can last a lifetime, depending on how long one was married and other factors. So these are long commitments. Yes, that's exactly right. And Greg, then there's the question of additional support for children from the first marriage.

What are those? Well, in some divorce decrees, these extras, we call them, could include the education of the child, and usually it's a sharing arrangement. It could be according to the spouse's incomes or percentage-wise, but also extracurricular costs. There are more and more children who want to travel with a sports team or summer camps, and not to mention medical and healthcare costs, dental, orthodontic braces, chiropractic care, insurance, health policies, eye care, glasses, et cetera. There's a lot more that could be piled on.

Yeah, no question about it. Ron, just a minute before our first break, if you're on the receiving end of this, the question is, how should we use what we receive in child support and alimony, and what if we don't receive it? Well, child support, obviously, that needs to go to the care of the child.

You don't get to go on a personal vacation with that sort of thing. You need to provide for your child. Alimony, it's up to you. You're able to appropriate that however you want. Now, if you don't get child support... Now, this obviously breaks into this co-parenting arrangement and what kind of relationship do we have working together as former spouses. When money doesn't change hands, it's difficult. The last thing you want to do is quickly run to court.

I think that just creates more problems, but if there's a habitual problem, then maybe you do need to involve an attorney. Yeah, that's very good. Well, a lot more to come. We're going to unpack a number of questions you need to be talking about as a blended family or if you're preparing to be a blended family.

What about financial plans, retirement assets, parents? That and much more coming up just around the corner. We're joined today by Ron Deal and Greg Pettis, authors of The Smart Step Family Guide to Financial Planning. Stay with us. We'll be right back. Delighted to have you with us today on MoneyWise Live.

I'm Rob West. Joining me today, my good friends Ron Deal and Greg Pettis, co-authors of The Smart Step Family Guide to Financial Planning. If you are a blended family or you're preparing for an upcoming blended family in your life, this is the resource you need to have and you can learn a lot more at familylife.com slash blended. Today, we're working through a list of questions that you need to put on the table as you're preparing to put together a togetherness agreement, a document you can learn more about on that website and gentlemen, as we work our way through these questions, Greg, I want to come to you next. There's this huge question of when one of us dies, who will receive the assets brought into our marriage? How should folks think about that? That is such a powerful question and you know, Rob, no two blended families are the same. So it's so important to sit down and do some comprehensive financial planning with your team of trusted advisors that share your values.

That's important. And when you do so, try to divide your goals into needs, wants and wishes and prioritize accordingly and seek expert legal advice and tax counsel before you implement any strategy. But many financial planners conceptually, they look at the growth assets that you brought into your marriage as possible key inheritance assets. These growth assets get stepped up basis at death so your children could inherit those and not pay income tax because the basis is stepped up at the date of your death. Income producing assets could be key for your spouse and the usage of life insurance is always the great equalizer. I'm dealing with high net worth business owners that say 90% of their wealth is in a business. What are we going to do for the children that are not involved in the business? So life insurance can be a great equalizer.

That's really helpful. Ron, I want to follow up on this with you from a spiritual and a relational standpoint. Is it okay if we decide we want to keep assets that were acquired or accumulated prior to marriage separate to give to our kids?

Some folks struggle with that spiritually, understanding that God's designed for marriage, even a new marriage is oneness. Okay, let me break the question down because on the surface, it sounds like, is it okay to keep my stuff, my stuff and not share with my spouse or my spouse's children? But really the fundamental question here, spiritually speaking, is how do we care for everyone? It could be that we do keep assets within a family line, if you will, from one generation to the next. But like Greg just said, at the same time, we're going to say, but how do we care for the people who are not included in that? It's not like we get and you don't. It's how do we share with everyone something that communicates their value, that it cares for them in a way that's appropriate?

So the answer is yes, some things can stay within the family generational line, but there needs to be that reciprocation or consideration, I should say, for the other family members on the other side. What do they get? Maybe it's life insurance that goes their direction, but at the end of the day, everybody is getting what they need.

Yeah, very good. All right. The next one, staying in this category of financial plans, what are the financial plans for your children if you die or are unable to work? And by the way, if you don't have a plan, you need to get one, right?

Yeah, that's exactly right. This brings us back to the together disagreement that you mentioned at the top, that we discussed a little more detail on the last time we were on your program. In a heartbeat, I want to sum this up, it is, okay, you may have had a plan when you were a single parent and the other person had a plan for their life. Now that you're married, we need to have a togetherness agreement plan that is mindful of each one of us. How do we care for one another should one of us pass away?

And at the same time, how do I care for your kids and you care for my kids should the worst happen? That's essentially the heart of what a togetherness agreement is. We are financing togetherness for our family unit, not separateness, not what I get and you don't, not my kids, not your kids, but a togetherness plan. We really believe, Greg and I believe, we're not just figuring out what to do with money with a togetherness agreement. We are helping blended families form a family identity and a sense of solidarity. That's why we call it togetherness. Because in the negotiating of the plan, if you will, how we care for each other, we are communicating value to everyone. We are communicating all belong, nobody's an outsider, all belong in our insiders to this family unit.

And that is an expression of love at the end of the day that we think over time facilitates more and more togetherness. And on the money side, we really would focus, we would ask others to look at is the ability to ensure your ability to earn an income. So disability income is one of the most overlooked areas. I mean, our income is the engine that drives all the goals, but also life insurance.

I mean, one of the core factors of economic value of a human life is our ability to earn that income. And so looking at multiples of income replacement, if I wasn't here, how many years would my spouse need to replace my income in the form of life insurance? There's rules of thumb, but best to sit down with your planner and let him or her look through your specific needs and your current assets and put together a specific plan for you.

Yeah, that's really helpful. We're working our way through a list of questions you need to put on the table as a blended family, specifically related to finances. Gentlemen, they say you don't just marry a person, you marry their whole family. So this next question that you need to put on the table is, do you have any financial commitments to your parents, siblings or other family members, right?

Yes. And, you know, we sort of alluded to this already. Maybe your children are invested in your family business. And so there's already this notion that it's going to be passed to them. They're invested.

They've been working in it perhaps or looking forward to the day when they are working in it. And now the other side of the blended family, if you will, doesn't have any involvement or investment in that. So there's sort of naturally that commitment. But here's the thing that we want relationally for couples to do. I think it's important for, let's say, a man owns a business and his oldest son is looking forward to taking it over one day. He, the husband, needs to now explain to his wife what that's all about.

What's the story behind my son taking over the business? Maybe this is a generational thing. Maybe there's a, hey, we bonded as father and son through the years about all of this. And there's a relational aspect to the history behind the commitment. That helps give some context to a stepmother, for example, so that she's not just seeing, oh, my husband's greedy. He's holding this for his kid. No, there's a story here.

And I can respect that story and what's involved there and the meaning that it holds. The next question is what we've said previously. Okay, that's great for your son. What are we doing? How are you going to help provide for me and my kids? That becomes the second question and it'll have its own answer.

Yeah. There are tools that you can pull from the toolbox with your financial planning team that are like Swiss army knives, so to speak. They utilize every opportunity to help the spouse and the children at your passing. One of them is a qualified terminal interest property trust. We call it a Q-tip. It would reserve assets for your spouse to live from while you're gone.

And at their passing, it would revert back to the beneficiaries that you chose, which could be children from a previous marriage or charity. A really helpful tool and probably not the Q-tip most people think about when they hear that term. A really helpful gentleman. Hey, so many questions, so little time, guys.

We're going to have to end it there, but we'll have to have you back again real soon to continue to unpack this. Thanks for joining us today. Thank you. Thank you. Greg Pettis and Ron Deal, authors of the Smart Step Family Guide to Financial Planning.

The website again, familylife.com slash blended. Folks, we're going to pause for a break, but we'll be back with much more on Money Wise Live biblical wisdom for your financial decisions. Stick around. It's great to have you with us on Money Wise Live today, but unfortunately, today we're not live. We're prerecorded and therefore won't be taking your calls. However, we've lined up some calls in advance that we think you'll find helpful.

So stay tuned and enjoy the rest of the program. Great to have the team from Family Life blended with us today, Ron and Greg. And I'll tell you that resource, the Smart Step Family Guide to Financial Planning is a great tool. If you have a blended family and you're looking to make God honoring decisions to get your financial house in order and think through some of these wealth transfer in estate planning type issues in particular, using the togetherness agreement, this is a great resource for you. Be sure to pick it up.

You can also find them on the web at Family Life blended. Before we head to the phones, you know, this week we're really excited to share some of the special testimonies we receive every day from listeners like you. We're so grateful when you write to us and tell us how God is using his principles shared on this program in your lives.

We heard from a listener just last week that said, this program is so good. You're helping me to save more and spend less. Your biblical approach to financial health is so needed. Valerie and George just said, your ministry has taught me well over the years.

So many still referencing the late Larry Burkett. We're grateful for that. Valerie goes on to say, I've remembered these principles and I'm working toward being financially free. Thank you for what you're doing.

Greg in Tennessee says you guys are fantastic. The Money Wise app has revolutionized the way I manage the Lord's finances through my fingers. Glory to God and thanks for all you're doing for the kingdom. Folks, if you've followed and applied God's financial wisdom for any length of time, we know that you also have a testimony of God's faithfulness.

And here's my question. Would you like to help us teach and train others? If you do, please consider sending a monthly or a one-time gift to Money Wise by December 31st as we head toward the end of the year.

This is an important season for us as we rely on listener support to not only finish the year strong, but plan for our ministry activities next year. You can simply head to moneywise.org and click the give button on the homepage. Again, give at moneywise.org.

You'll find a way to give securely online through the mail or over the telephone. And thanks for your consideration and generosity. We're very, very grateful. All right. Let's take phone calls today.

We're going to begin today in Pennsylvania. Isabel, thank you for calling. Go right ahead. Hi. Thank you, Rob. And thank you, team.

Sure. I am calling because I have an unresolved issue that started after my mom's death in early 2020. It was a sudden death. I was her custodial on some savings that she had from a lawsuit that she won. And one of my brothers, I have two surviving siblings, he knew about the lawsuit and the money that he received from it through a letter, not through my mother. And there was a reason why she did not want anyone to know because he historically has not known how to be a good steward of his money. And now, you know, since then, there's been a lot of turmoil and I've been accused of this, you know, spending that money and not letting him have, you know, his part, which is not true because I've taken from those savings, I've taken money to cover her funeral expenses, which was actually what her intention was to keep that money for any family emergencies and also have given him from those savings money to survive through, you know, the COVID and the changes, losses of job, health conditions that he experienced.

But that seems not to have been enough for him. Yeah. So what is your main question today, Michelle? So my main question is, you know, what would be the best way to resolve this turmoil that, you know, has turned into more of taking over my peace. And not only is the savings, but we had a small piece of land in our country in Central America that she also left without having any, allocating it, but he has taken the, a self-decision to, you know, start pretty much making it his land without the consent of others. So my concern is mostly he, he has historically abused any money that has come into his hands, you know, with, with women, alcohol addiction.

And, and it's a really, you know, there's a lot of uncertainty around this. Yes. Was she a U.S. citizen? Yes. Okay. Did she have a will? No.

Okay. So when you pass away and you don't have a valid will, it's called dying intestate, which just means it's the term for that situation. And the deceased person's property then is distributed according to the state's intestacy succession laws. So it's supervised by the probate court who has jurisdiction over the estate.

Then the court typically holds a hearing on the petition and if there's no valid will, then they appoint an administrator to serve on behalf of the intestate estate. Has that process started? No.

None of us has taken, you know, this to the courts. I actually thought that it would just be resolved among us. Yeah. Let's do this. I've got to hit a quick break. Isabelle, you stay on the line. We'll pick this up on the other side of it. I'd love to give you my thoughts.

Folks, we're going to pause for a brief break. You know, as we think about handling God's money, it's all about stewardship. And here's the key. We recognize God is the owner and we're the manager. Well, we want to know the owner's heart when it comes to how we're managing his money. Well, that's why we go to God's word and mind the scriptures.

By the way, there's 2350 of them that deal with this topic. We'll continue to apply God's word to your decisions just around the corner. Stay with us. We'll be back after this break. Delighted to have you joining us today on MoneyWise Live.

Let me remind you, our team is away from the studio enjoying the Christmas season. So we're not here, but we lined up some great questions in advance that I know you'll enjoy. Now, before we head to the phones, I wanted to mention the opportunity that you have to participate in this radio ministry. Would you consider sending a monthly or a one-time gift by December 31st? You can head to moneywise.org and click Give.

Again, if you do that by December 31st, that would be very helpful. Thank you for your generosity and it's a privilege to serve with you. Just before the break, we were talking to Isabel. Isabel's in Pennsylvania. She's dealing with her mom's estate and she and her siblings are having some disagreements about the division of the remainder of the assets. After the final expenses, Isabel has been handling the estate since well before her mother's death and providing care. And at least one of her siblings has really made poor decisions, has a history of making poor decisions with financial affairs. And so she's wondering, how do you navigate the relational side and do the wise thing to also honor her mom's wishes as her estate is passed on? Isabel, you know, typically when somebody dies intestate, which is what the term for dying without a will, it naturally can lead to a large, you know, disagreements among family members. And that's why the state's intestate succession laws are designed to prevent that to whatever extent possible by designated how a deceased person's assets are distributed to family members. Once you petition the probate court, then they select a representative to oversee the process according to the state's intestacy laws and those decisions are made. Apart from that, obviously, you've got to deal with both the financial side, which is, you know, you've got someone here that is not making wise decision with finances, but you also have the relational side, which you want to try to preserve as much as possible. You know, I think one option to preserve the relational side would be just to let the probate probate court handle it, and make those decisions. And ultimately, you know, you're not responsible for, you know, what someone does with their portion of the estate. And if you decide not to go that route, and you know, you, you know, eliminate one or more family members from this, obviously, there's going to be a huge relational fallout from this.

So where are you at now today? What are you thinking your next steps are going to be? You know, like I said before, I had already been withdrawing from those savings to distribute to my one of my siblings who has found himself in hardship financially, which is the one that doesn't handle his own finances very well. So I just was already kind of going in the route of, you know, I do have two surviving siblings, the elder siblings that to me, I trust you, I know you will do what is best. But I still am uncertain by your advice is certainly something that I will consider, perhaps, you know, so that I don't have the burden of, you know, carrying on, you know, broken relationship, which is already the case, because we did not grow up together, neither one of my siblings.

Sure, sure. Yeah, I think that needs to be at the forefront here and realizing that you're not ultimately responsible for the decisions that are made once the estate is distributed. And if you can preserve the relationship, I think that's paramount here. And I would perhaps just consider after all the final expenses are made, petitioning the court to go through the probate process or just distributing equally, what remains, recognizing that it was your mom. She was the steward of this. She's left it.

She has these children. And to the extent that was her wishes, I think, you know, you can proceed accordingly and feel good that you've at least done your part, both while she was alive and now after her passing. And let's just pray and trust that the Lord will restore those relationships over time, knowing that that is about most important. Isabel, we'll certainly be praying for you as you navigate this. I know it's not easy. So you hang in there, ask the Lord to give you some wisdom, and I'm confident you'll make the right decision. We appreciate your calling today to Ohio. Hi, Rita. Thank you for calling.

Go ahead. Hi, my husband and I lived in Colorado for 17 years, and then we moved back to Ohio. In Colorado, we made wills, but we have not made wills in Ohio. Do the Colorado ones still work in Ohio, or should we make new wills for the new state?

Yeah, you do want to have it reviewed. Anytime you're moving out of state, Rita, you absolutely need to revisit your estate plan to make sure it's valid and structured in the way your new state requires. Understanding state-specific estate planning laws really is crucial to spare your loved ones any additional grief on top of your loss at your passing. So I would make a relationship with a godly estate planning attorney there in the state of Colorado, or excuse me, you moved to Ohio.

And so perhaps someone there in your new state that could at least review what you have and then update it as necessary. What happens if my husband decides not to make a new will? It's a blended family, adult kids. Okay, so I understand that. So I think the key is for him to understand that you all want your wishes to be carried out, whatever those might be. Are there unresolved issues or questions, Rita, with regard to how you all want your estate handled with regard to the kids that you had prior to your marriage?

Has all of that been discussed and settled? Well, when we made out the wills, we agreed to it. Okay. So, I mean, it includes, you know, his kids for his estate, my kids for my estate.

Actually, I've included his kids too, based on portions of the estate. But I don't know why he's hesitating. Okay. Well, I think the key here is, you know, money issues are hard issues, and they're often symptomatic of deeper issues beneath the surface, whether that's related to trust or could be spiritual issues. I mean, there could be a whole host of things. Often, it's not about the money.

It's about kind of everything else. And if this conversation is really surfacing the need for additional conversation about the decisions you all made when you first put this will in place, perhaps this is a time to revisit that and work through it. That's really the idea. We want to honor one another in love, recognizing two become one, including our finances. But when we have kids from prior marriages and we have assets that were accumulated prior to marriage in a blended family, it does require some additional planning.

And that can be done in love with the utmost of respect and trust. And decisions can be made with regard to how portions of your estate, again, that was established prior to this marriage is handled with regard to distribution to other kids or kids from a prior marriage. And if there perhaps was a change of heart, maybe he wasn't fully on board when the decisions were made, then that needs to be discussed. If not, I think your appeal to him is, listen, whatever we have decided and currently want to have carried out today, we want to make sure that that's in force because we don't want the court making this decision for us. We want to make sure that our wishes are reflected. And the only way to do that is to have a valid will that's up to date, especially in light of the laws of your particular state. So this is really just about a stewardship matter of being a good steward of what God has entrusted to you all. And you can't be a good steward if you don't have a will that says, here's how we want God's money to be distributed.

So make this a matter of prayer and then ask your husband to go visit with an attorney with you. We'll be right back. Stay with us. This is our final segment of a broadcast we previously recorded. Thanks so much for being with us today, and we hope you'll stick around and enjoy the rest of today's program. Before we head back to the phones, let me remind you, MoneyWise Media is listener supported. We're a not-for-profit ministry that relies on your gifts to do the ministry we're called to each day with this radio broadcast, our work in the MoneyWise app at MoneyWise.org or MoneyWise Coaches.

All of the resources that we're providing to God's people are a direct result of listener support. And so if you consider you're part of the MoneyWise community and you benefit from this program and you'd like to give a gift to MoneyWise Media, we'd certainly appreciate that. You can head to our website, MoneyWise.org. Just click the Give button and you'll be able to give one time over the phone. You can set up a monthly gift. We'll even give you the mailing address there if you'd rather send a gift through the mail. But thanks in advance, especially here as we try to stay on budget. Yes, we operate from a budget as well. It would be great to have your support.

Again, MoneyWise.org. Just click Give. All right, back to the phones we go in our final moments of the broadcast today. To Alabama we go. Tom, you're next on the program. Go ahead, sir. Yes, sir.

Thanks for taking my call. I'm 60 years old. I have two different life insurance policies in place. $100,000 on each one. One is term, which is about $48 a month for me at this point. And the other is a whole life policy.

It's costing me $233 a month. And my question is, is it really practical to stay in the whole life at this point? I owe $56,000 to the whole life in order to get the cash value when it becomes mature, which would be $41,000. So basically, I know I'm going to lose $15,000 to keep that whole life policy in place. And I'm explaining to my wife, it's like, yes, but if I pass in the next 15 years before I pay off this whole life policy, you'll get $100,000.

And she's like scratching her head going, is it really worth it? Yeah, that's my question to you. Yeah. What kind of death benefit do you have? You have $100,000 on the whole life and how much on the term?

$100,000 as well. Okay. And you said your age was 60? Correct.

All right. And what is your plan, Tom, vis-a-vis retirement? Do you plan to just to continue to work indefinitely?

Do you have kind of a retirement date targeted? We have a business that will be worth probably $400,000 to $500,000. We have an inheritance home that will bring another quarter of a million when it's dispersed between relatives and myself. So yeah, we've got some assets coming when we decide to sell the business, which is providing our income at this point. And but yeah, the question is this life insurance and if it's really practical, well, and it really comes down to maybe educate your maybe educate your audiences to the difference between whole and term because a lot of people don't even know. No, sure.

And I'd be happy to weigh in on that. I think the key for you is, you know, whether this death benefit is necessary for your wife. So let's say something were to happen to you tomorrow. You know, what is the plan to continue to operate the business and then get it valued and get it sold?

And, you know, is that a reasonable plan? And would there be a period of time until that takes place where she would need some working capital and really needs the death benefit to maintain your lifestyle? Because obviously, we want life insurance as long as we can, or as long as we need it to fill a need that exists for a dependent whether that's a spouse or a loved one down the road. Obviously, there's the difference between whole life and term is that term is pure insurance for a stated period of time, you're simply paying the mortality cost for the death benefit that's a function of your age and at the time of your application, your health status. But at the end of the term, it lapses, it gets way too expensive, nobody would ever plan to keep it beyond that term. But the idea is that while we're buying the pure insurance, which is the least expensive way to have that death benefit to offset that risk of somebody that you're depending on for income, in most cases, going home with the Lord, the cheapest way to do that is through term insurance, but we're saving separate from that, in company sponsor retirement plans or building a business that can be sold through a liquidity event, you know, to convert that asset to and something that can be, you know, generate a passive income stream, you know, and we're doing that in a way that doesn't involve an insurance product, whereas a whole life policy is a combination of the two, it's the death benefit, plus the savings, but you're relying on the insurance company to provide the accumulation and, in my view, it's just not the best way to go. So I think for you, Tom here, the question is, what is the amount of life insurance your wife needs, if any today, and for what period of time and perhaps that $100,000 on the term policy is enough to get you all to the place where you have that liquidity event and then the assets are available to cover her life? If not, perhaps you drop the whole life insurance, take whatever cash value has accumulated at this point and get a second term policy or replace that one with one that's, you know, $200,000 or $250,000, but you're not spending, you know, the $233 a month, you're spending another $50 perhaps or $60. So that's at least, you know, the less expensive way to go just to offset that risk.

What are your thoughts? Well, yeah, well, as you said, makes a lot of sense having assets in addition to offset, you know, a mortgage of $200,000 that we've got at a really low interest, 2.85. We just met with a financial manager a few weeks ago at our bank and he's like, you know, yeah, that's your debt, but it's called good debt because it's such a low interest. Like, why would you try to pay it down? Because I've talked about that too, paying down the mortgage quicker, because it's a 30-year term, we still owe 28 years and it's like, well, but that's good that you can take that money instead of pouring it into your mortgage, you make more by just investing that additional principal amount you might pay into it. That's another question. It's like, well, where do we put that if we're not going to pay down the principal?

So, well, that's right. And you know, I think there's a non-financial side to that equation as well, though, that you have to consider, Tom. Yes, there's the straight financial implications of I've got a low interest rate, I may or may not be able to deduct that because I'm, you know, 80% of people take the standard deduction, but it's at a low interest rate, so I could take that money and keep that invested. And while that's true, what that's discounting is the non-financial side of owning your home and being free and clear and your wife having the security of knowing that we're unencumbered and the flexibility that comes with that, not to mention, if we can sync up the payoff to that mortgage with your retirement date, maybe look at what it would take, run that amortization schedule to say, well, if we're going to retire in the next eight years, what would it look like for us to take that, you know, 23 or 25 year mortgage term and cut it down to eight years? How much extra would we need to send every year so that as we're entering retirement, our expenses are as low as possible because that single largest expense that we have is now coming off the table. So I think that would be another way to look at it as you think about, you know, by the way, I've never had somebody in all the years I've been doing this pay off their house and call me back and say, man, Rob, I just wish we didn't pay off the house.

I've never gotten that call, Tom. There's just something about it, despite what a financial advisor might tell you, that gives you a whole lot of peace of mind that I don't think we need to discount. So I think as you answer that insurance question, it really comes down to what's the period of time you need this death benefit to be able to provide for your wife and her for you, if you're relying on anything from her, probably not in this situation, but mainly so that she has the assets she needs to maintain her lifestyle. And typically we'd look at what's called the DIME method, D-I-M-E, making sure you could pay off all your debt, making sure you've got enough to provide the income that's necessary to get you to where your retirement assets and the business are enough to sustain her. The mortgage, paying off the mortgage, that's the M and then E is education if you still have any kids at home that need college.

And those would be kind of the big four that we'd want to solve for. But I like doing that through term insurance with only the amount of term we need to get us to the place where we're now relying on our own assets and not the insurance company. And by the way, then we can drop that expense that's unnecessary and continues to climb as we age. Does that make sense? Yeah, it makes perfect sense. And yeah, I've done the amortization.

Yeah. If I pay another five hundred towards the principal, I can have the mortgage pay off in like 12 years, which is OK. You know, then I'm 72. And that's, you know, that's a pretty good target. I think that's kind of a nice compromise between, you know, do we try to pay it all off in one year or two years or do we just ride this thing out for the next twenty five years? I like the fact that we'd have a strategy that says we want to get out of debt once and for all in a reasonable time period. And, you know, in the early years of our retirement, we'd like to have that thing gone.

So let's prioritize that now out of extra cash flow so that we can get there much sooner. Well, bless you, sir. I appreciate your wisdom and everything you're doing for others. And I know God is using you.

So. Well, thank you, Tom. And keep up your great work. I appreciate it, my friend. Thanks for your encouragement and delighted to hear from you. It sounds like this is all really well thought through. And at the end of the day, you're trying to be found faithful as a steward of God's resources, as we all are. And it sounds like you're doing a great job.

So God bless you, my friend. Call us back any time. Well, folks, that's going to do it for us today. We've covered a lot of ground. We've talked trusts and we've talked giving and we've talked insurance. And, you know, as we think about all of these issues that we deal with every day, they really fit into four big buckets. There's our lifestyle, that which we live on, that which we give, that which we owe and that which we grow, the save for the future.

And here's the cool part. God's word speaks to all of it. Every bit of it. We can look to his word to get the counsel that tells us the timeless wisdom we can apply to these decisions that we're facing today. It's all there in God's word. So renew your mind.

Be in there often meditating on those scriptures. Well, folks, that's going to do it for us today. So thankful that you stopped by as we together in community try to find God's heart for managing his money. You know, when we think about our role as steward, it's a high calling. We're money managers for the King of Kings.

Well, it doesn't get any bigger than that. So we want to be found faithful and we want to go back to his word so we understand how to go about that. Well, our team is essential to what we do here every day. So let me give them some thanks. I want to say thank you to Amy and to Courtney and to Melody and to Jim, the team serving us today, doing an amazing job, pushing buttons and doing all the things that makes this show possible.

MoneyWise Live is a partnership between Moody Radio and MoneyWise Media. That's going to do it for us, but I hope you'll come back and join us next time. We'll do it all over again. In the meantime, may God bless you. Moody Radio is so thankful for a 2022 filled with biblical programming, impactful messages and relevant discussion. If you'd like to help us start 2023 strong, consider a gift at GiveToMoody.com. That's GiveToMoody.com.