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Debt Consolidation: The Easy Way Out

MoneyWise / Rob West and Steve Moore
The Truth Network Radio
May 9, 2022 5:00 pm

Debt Consolidation: The Easy Way Out

MoneyWise / Rob West and Steve Moore

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May 9, 2022 5:00 pm

Debt consolidation can seem like the best solution to lower the interest rates and payments on your credit card debt. But can that strategy lead to more complications and new problems? On today's MoneyWise Live, Rob West will talk about how debt consolidation can get you into worse trouble than when you started. Then he'll answer your calls and financial questions.

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Once every solution breeds new problems, but I can think of 1 Solution Like Easy Way out can definitely lead to problems that get you in worse trouble than when you started talk about that first today that it's all your calls at 800-525-7000 800-525-7000. This is moneywise live biblical wisdom for you okay about is debt consolidation.

I've made no secret that I'm not a fan of debt consolidation and that's for two reasons. One, it's dangerous into there's a much better option and will get to that shortly. Let's talk about the danger. First, the tantalizing idea behind debt consolidation is that you'll reduce your overall monthly payment by refinancing several debts into one big one.

But in order to make that one payment smaller.

You may have to sign up for a longer-term loan. That means you'll probably end up paying more in interest in the long run than you would be by paying off the debts individually. Now you might think that having a lower monthly payment will give you a chance to pay more on the principal each month to get rid of the combined debt faster and that's certainly true. The problem is too often that's not what happens. Having that extra cash on hand leads to lifestyle creep and folks just end up continuing to pay the minimum amount each month. That's how the debt gets stretched out over several years, which costs more in interest. The next problem with that consolidation.

I wouldn't say is a danger, but it's something to think about consolidating your debts could temporarily lower your credit score in two ways. First, whenever you apply for new credit card to transfer balances to it or you apply for a home equity loan to consolidate that gets reported to the credit bureaus as a hard inquiry and it will lower your FICA score. Second, if you get a new card or loan and you close out the old accounts it lower the average age of your credit which also lowers your score. But again, if you're struggling to pay off the debt you arty have.

Let's not worry about a low credit score hampering your ability to get new credit, and even more into debt. Okay, so the greatest danger of all the debt consolidation.

The easy way out is that it's really just slapping on a Band-Aid when you really need a tourniquet. It doesn't fix the underlying problem which is living beyond your means. In most cases granted. Sometimes you can be overwhelmed with a financial emergency, like medical bills, but that's usually not the case when someone consolidates debt more often, it's because they're simply overspending. Their lifestyle has gotten out of control and that's how debt consolidation becomes really dangerous, instead of reining in your lifestyle you continue to overspend and if you don't close the account. You paid off well. You can now continue to charge stuff on them. Then you find yourself having to make payments on those accounts plus the consolidation loan you took out it seemed like a good idea at the time but you've only managed to double your problem. Okay, so what's the solution that doesn't breathe new problems. Well obviously you have to attack the underlying issue not just the symptom you gotta reduce your spending and there are two great sources to help her that the first is to sign up with one of our when you do a coach will work with you to prepare a written budget that will enable you to meet your monthly obligations without using credit cards. There is no charge for this service, except the minimal cost of the workbook. Our coaches are all volunteers who love to help God's people get control of their finances that takes care of the problem of overspending now to address your outstanding debts you can get help from our friends at Christian credit counselors that they'll put you on a debt management plan, not debt consolidation, and they can help you pay off your debts up to 80% faster than going it alone. They have arrangements already in place with most major credit card companies and lenders to lower your interest rates. You only have to make one monthly payment and you solve your debt problem with out taking out a new loan to keep in mind that one monthly payment will be fixed. The entire time. Your repayment so as those balances come down the monthly payment does not come down with it that alongside those lower interest rates will help you get that debt paid off quicker and by the way, they're all believers of the work with you.

Don't pray with you. They'll help you come up with a plan and help you get out of debt once and for all.

You can find them on the web. Check them so those of the dangers of debt consolidation and better solution for you. Let us know how it turns out your calls or next. 800-525-7000. I'm Rob Weston. This is moneywise live.

Thanks for joining us today, I minimize my wisdom. Your financial decisions. I'm Rob West Rose were glad to have you along with us today. We got slides open would love to hear from you the number to call today's 800-525-7000.

That's 800-525-7000 you know, we began today by talking about how you can repay debt and as I shared I'm not a big fan of debt consolidation that is taking out a new loan to solve your debt challenges. Often times we extend the term even with a lower rate. We end up paying more.

But the bigger issue is we often don't solve the underlying problem. So whether it's debt management or perhaps just doing it yourself with the tried-and-true debt snowball method that is lining those credit card balances up smallest to largest balance paying the minimums on all but taking all of your margin and that presumes that you have a budget with some margin that is money left over at the end of the month taking all of that surplus and going after the debt with the smallest balance. Once that's paid role that minimum payment plus that margin over to the next one and keep going right down the line and don't forget to celebrate along the way, doesn't have to be extravagant, but perhaps establishing that rhythm and beginning to see some progress will allow you to have the motivation to keep up with it so that you can get it paid off once and for all.

And when you're done let's get that emergency fund all the way up to six months worth of expenses and now you're really good to be in a great spot to increase your giving and thinking about even saving for the future.

So give that a shot. Let us know how it goes. Along the way I we got four lines open today looking forward to hearing what's on your mind, financially speaking at 800-525-7000 will begin today in beautiful Hilton head Island South Carolina panga redheads are Rob, thank you very much for being able to take my call. I have a 96-year-old that that we finally have him in an assisted living facility where it's going to be much safer for we saw his townhouse and the proceeds were a little over $250,000.

Hi, I have his financial politics. Bernie and I and I am trying keep using the facility is in cost around $7000 a month so obviously what I'm trying to do is get have the money last as long as possible and then given or how things are going with the markets and the downturn in stocks demanded, trying to get some advice on where to put this money. Well, I think the challenge is given.

What you're describing here go this money is going to be spent down in three years or so is that about right. Write about right yet like I did forget to include he gets about $1900 a month in Social Security and pension my calculation, after deducting that and unfortunately the runways and just increased so it's gonna be probably about 16 months or maybe a little less I have to redo that calculation yeah yeah yeah because I see that 23,000 or so will be what you spend first, but then you can have to be pulling from those assets of were talking somewhere around four years, certainly less than five. With this increase, and you'll probably see a few more. Those this monies can get spent down fairly quickly and I think for that reason, especially in light of what you're describing.

It would got a lot of stock market volatility going on. We got some real headwinds. The drumbeat of a recession is getting louder than ever. That's not that something to be scared about, but it does take us back to this reality and we need to be properly diversified with a long time horizon if were invested in risk assets and that's not a situation you have that you have the luxury to take advantage of here.

Despite the inflation you need to protect this capital so that you we have it available to make it last as long as you can so I'm thinking you know we could take 10,000 and put it in and I bonded get about 10% for the next 12 months, but abortion that's only 10,000. Beyond that I be looking at the old laddering CDs as these rates go up, and perhaps a high-yield savings account is not to get you a whole lot, but at least it's something you you can get one to 2% and have this money available as you needed and then as rate set up, you'll actually have the ability to take any of that money that's maturing were available in a high-yield savings account and rolled over at a higher rate just to get something in the way of a return and then obviously once these assets are spent down that at that point, you would be looking for Medicaid to provide assistance and obviously depending upon the state. There is a different approach to Medicaid in terms of, you know, this type of assisted living but I think the key as they all will provide assistance for personal care services and transportation and homemaker services. If you're relying on Medicaid though to pay the facility.

If it's living there.

Obviously, you're gonna want to call around well in advance and find out who has availability if they even accept Medicaid assistance. Many of them don't.

Those that do will have a limited number of beds that they will allow just given that the compensation is is coming through fairly low so I think doing a lot of your homework in preparation for that to understand what options you would have in the meantime protecting these assets and allowing them to extend as far as they possibly can. I yeah I I thought about the high-yield savings, but interest rates can increase thought know. At least it'll be some benefits and on were also trying to get him some VA benefits to which is been an issue so that hopefully would be able to sustain him, at least in this facility because I hate to put them into a Medicaid assistance facility which I don't think you would get kinda carries getting now. I'm sure he wouldn't.It is in higher in place and I realize you want to allow that to extend as long as you can.

That's a blessing that he's has access to VA benefits.

I would absolutely try to take full advantage of that because anything will help. In terms of extending the assets that he has so that he doesn't have to rely on a Medicaid facility anytime soon so I think you're doing all the right things. He's blessed to have you, Paul, and will certainly be praying that will give you some wisdom here.

I appreciate Robin very very much appreciate you and your program and the financial advice you give to a lot of people who may not have that knowledge and exposure.

Well thank you very much for appreciate this kind remarks, she serves to Aurora, Illinois, W MBI hey Kevin, thanks for calling circular and get up and showed me going to protect my call about 11 shortly and went China come up with a budget and I just can't seem to wrap my head around it. I just want to know any kind of available resources. Most of my RN collection their medical bills that all medical bills. My job went on strike lasted for about a month so you and on, still I China come recover from that minivan. I had to get on a payment plan with my electric bill company selling agent is just all over the place yeah yeah loving the starting point. Kevin is just take a step back to do two things. Number one is get an accurate picture of what your spending plan needs to look like today look at your income versus the fixed expenses that you have and then you know whatever discretionary spending you're doing currently and include that not only a list of all of your debts and if you don't have that list somewhere below.

It's easy when those collection notices come in just gotta stick them in a drawer. Really don't want to pay much attention, but it's really important that you get an accurate listing of everything you owe and to whom they require you pulling credit reports from all three bureaus. Just make sure you got everything, but I'd love for you to have that and then the key would be as you build out that spending plan on keeping it as lean as possible at start with the big four.

You gotta keep a roof over your head gas in the car to keep the utilities and food on the table but everything else is kinda gal as it's available.

The key would be to free up as much margin as you can see, you can do one or two things.

Either one enter into a payment plan that negotiated with these lenders or creditors and or do some settlement along the way and I wouldn't do any of that into you have any of you know those agreements in writing from any of these creditors prior to starting a payment plan.

But I guess first things first. Are you back to work and do you have enough income to cover your bills at this point, not counting those debts work now for several months. I'm I'm literally just living paycheck to paycheck today.

I did and made a partial payment on my rent and and Friday. Gotta make a partial payment to get my electric bill reinstated sure payment plan among with them okay well I got get that and I think that's where we gotta try to break the cycle realize it's easier said than done. Glad to hear you're back to work key is to try to chip away at some of these and then as quickly as you can get to a place where you know you have enough income to cover the minimums on all of the fixed expenses that you have the a lot of those debts or be 30 in collection. They can sit out there if you not getting notice that somebody's filing a judgment against you or anything like that.

Those will just continue to sit there ill. Hopefully you can get the utilities back on. Keep the rent paid, keep food on the table gas in the car seat and get to work and you know begin to make some progress. Do you have the opportunity to seek some overtime or second job temporarily something like that normally do work overtime, but for the past two weeks because of wanting out of part of working in manufacturing facility them in assembler, they have not had overtime so hopefully this week or the following week they will, on average, we work Monday through Thursday next to two hours and then Saturdays I can make my choice between 48 hours so Monica pushed myself to work those eight hours and were getting a small increase on the 24th is only about $0.50 is not much.

Every little bit helps. Yeah, but here's what I want to do, Kevin. I'd love for you to sit with a coach, you can come alongside you to pray for you to encourage you, but also to just give you another set of eyes to look at that spending plan perhaps get year's plan moving forward. So you stay on the line when you get your information.

One of our coaches reach out to free of charge sent right back up moneywise lives. Thank you for joining us today and moneywise line wisdom for your financial decisions around West euros. We got two lines open today you got a question we'd love to hear from you. 800-525-7000 back to the phones we go Tampa, Florida Joseph, thank you for calling circular and had my call Rob. I have student loan which I need to repay back 60 creepy 64 this year dear looking to retire at 65. How am I gonna be able to pay that student loan back yeah you know that. Interestingly, Joseph's Americans over 60 are the fastest growing segment of the population with student loan debt that what we read from the consumer financial protection Bureau. It's literally quadrupled in the last decade, and the average debt for higher education is about $23,000. Many folks have debts a lot more than that, but obviously that's quite a bit of money. Yeah, I think the key here is for you to recognize this.

This is going to take a while to decide 65,000 yeah and so this is something you're going to be living with.

Which is just a great reminder to know the younger folks listening today as to why you just really want to limit your borrowing. Do whatever you can do to help pay for that education with work-study or grants or scholarships and don't borrow money you can pay back within 10 years and make sure that it fits with the job that you're seeking, but when you get to this stage of life. Joseph, I realize it can feel like well I'm never going to pay this off and you just can't have to recognize it's good to be around for a while now could government legislation come in and wipe this out that's being talked about, but who knows right so I think the key for you right now is just to continue to keep it paid and then look for whether you know you qualify for any forgiveness options.

Do you happen to work in the public sector with the nonprofit or government job I was working for public service organization I was making payment consistently for about four out of the 10 years that are required for the forgiveness loan, but then I got laid off because the coded COBIT so that was a hardship and I'm really frustrated and stuff to get back into another public service or nonprofit organization so I can continue the program.

Yeah. And I think that's key you keep in mind. Back in 2021 last fall, the US Department of education came out and said that they were not really overhauling this program to try to broaden the types of loans that were eligible and to try to get more folks to be able to qualify as long as they work for a full-time work full-time for qualified employer you make those hundred and 20 on-time payments for the full amount due on your bill that you have direct loans were consolidated into a direct loan and that you repay your debt with an income driven repayment plan.

Feel it was really difficult for folks to qualify for that. The most recent data would see is that only about 5% of student loan borrowers who applied have actually gotten the relief which is why they've come in. I tried to offer this in the giving waivers and really try to help folks get back on track. So I think it's a good time for you, especially given COBIT and what's happened there. You given the department of education knows the reality of what that did for many folks who were able to qualify for it and had to you know get out of the 120 payment so I think Joseph that's probably your best option yelled moving forward is to see what it would take for you to get back in. Make sure you do your homework and understand what needs to be done so that he could perhaps have that forgiven beyond that critical to keep your body budget as lean as possible so that you can continue to make these payments and then over time get to a place we could even pay off more than just scheduled, but I think if you can do your homework on the public service forgiveness program that best option. So don't lose heart. Just stay out it and let's see what happens in the days ahead with this is moneywise live all the phones are laid out.

So we got a lot thanks for joining us today and moneywise live biblical wisdom decisions were glad you like to find a certified kingdom advisor in your area that is a financial professional at the high standards to be considered a certified kingdom advisor experience in character requirements met extensive training in the application of biblical wisdom to professional financial decision-making you could find a CK on her website just click the button that says something find the CK and you could do a ZIP Code search and interview two or three before you make your final selection provided will head back to the phones, Carlisle, Pennsylvania Delano, or, thank you for calling the redhead's daughter was having a little trouble hearing yet. Let me just if you can adjust your phone, maybe move to the left or right slightly, and let's try again okay that's much better.

Yes or no okay once or now. It might take all five years. My life.go Street on and I don't pay the amount I statement every month so that my dreams yeah we lost again for second but I think I heard the question, your benefits are really based on your what's called your high 35 which is going to include your highest 35 years of earnings now if part of the estimate is based on you continuing to earn at a higher level therefore replacing lower years of earnings. Perhaps in your early working life, then yes, you wouldn't get the benefit of perhaps what they're estimating, you may receive. And so it might be worth a call to the Social Security Administration just to say if in fact my high 35 was already established. Therefore, all my future working years are going to be lower. Can you run a new estimate based on what you expect that I will receive and they can give you that number you're not gonna penalize yourself in terms of, you know you'll still have those highest 35 there were already locked in, but again, if some of the estimates of what you would expect to receive down the road are based on you continuing to earn at the level you have been and you don't.

That's where an adjustment could take place. Does that make sense.

Why not you think it start all day; like all say $1000 Nicole Walker saying that Martin might get to my well yeah well the coal is going to factor in each year.

As you take your benefits once you receive your benefits, you know, you'll see the increases each year. That is the Social Security administration approve.

So for instance the other benefits for about 70 million Americans right now are going to be SCN about a 5.9% increase in 2022 is a result of what were seeing now with inflation but that's for those currently earning benefits, and so everybody would receive that: adjustment each year. Whether you're working or not. Okay. Thank you for checking in with us us or Freddie's in Missouri.

Freddie go redhead hey thank you for all you my question is about goal about rolling my 401(k) into gold. Gold backed IRA where you will they put the money in that unit in account what it would have money in account like a workable unit stored at whatever Sunil is your registered plate or the coins at many low yielding 401(k) that I haven't contributed to it by ear like doing the union and so I would know how to contributed more okay without met yet to be the case moving forward you that that account is not going anywhere. Where did I left it with the company and and it has increased over the last five but decreased 2000 and last two months when you have an there was a total balance. Third, had 38, 36, one, 100 now okay alright well it's not surprising that this is declined.

I don't think I would move that's what I wouldn't if it were me move it to the gold strategy that you know folks in these times when we got market volatility and obviously there's drumbeats of recession going on right now about 40% of economist, I just read earlier today think of recession within the next two years Bob dollar Goodfriend markets economist and analyst will be stopping by in the next segment will ask him that question, but regardless a lot of folks think that's what were going to see here in the next year or two. So what we do with that. Well, the key is to think beyond the next recession whenever it will come because we know it will is just a matter of when.

But we need a long-term plan. We gotta stick with it because recessions are always temporary market downturns are temporary as well. And so that's why we properly diversify with the appropriate time horizon and we ride out any of these market gyrations because we can't pick the top of the bottom and so trying to time the market is just not an effective strategy. Lot of folks will look for safe haven type investments in gold would be one of those it's a hedge against inflation and in theory it moves opposite of the market, but not always.

And so for that reason I think just given that the long-term performance is and is good in stocks and bonds and because you do have more volatility in it. I would keep it as a smaller part of your portfolio. No more than five or 10%.

The idea that you should kinda sell out of everything and move just to gold just because you know where to have the we could have a recession here in the next year or two. I don't think is the right move that would be shortsighted and I think that'll end up coming back to bite you, because then the question is at what point do you move out and then you are in a guessing game of trying to time you know the appropriate time to get back into the stock market before the next, got a leg up like we see in the last decade and more. Does it make sense so yeah so basically you're able to write it out. Let your throne by you went from 27 to 38 with nothing done. So now I did what I do not you hear the deer that and I have been purchasing some the mountains of gold with you not go I will pick up our by the goats. I got about 40,000 and in ounces of gold right now that I can hang onto that other it right. Okay.

And that's certainly something you can do, but I think with this money, I'd stay long-term just recognize you're going to see more you know it wouldn't be surprising that then at the bottom of this thing. You would be down 30% from its high.

But as long as you know that you realize you got a long time arising and not retiring anytime soon and you know the investment allocation is right.

You stick to stick with now before we get to recession.

If you're if you've been to passive in your portfolio doesn't match your time horizon. Well, you might want to make some tweaks, but if not, I'd say you let it go. Entrusted to the long-term evaluation and growth of this thing is far away your ability to try to time the market's ups and we appreciate you checking in Freddie all the best to use or cause or bring more of your questions just around the corner 800-525-7000 with us today and moneywise live 800-525-7000 hear from you before we head back to the phones Bob Dole joins us each Monday, Bob is chief investment officer Russ Martin investments with long tenure on Wall Street is also somebody was a student of the Scriptures and can bring a biblical perspective to what were seeing Bob volatility is the order of the day what you make of these markets.

So you just today doubted out down 2% S&P down 3% and epic down 4%.

Big coin was down 15% oil down 6%.

Can you find any good news, and this makes her up if some beginning in my view to see the signs of some capitulation, which for those that don't follow markets closer.

That means we may be reached bottom that has tradable rally on the other side of it. Is it the bottom.

That's a lot harder to tell. I think were going to have to bounce around in both directions for a period here, but some of the key levels were breached today and that let's all technical fundamentals. Rob, you know what they are, the problems are we getting Ernie's girls concerned that the Fed will continue take rates up to fight what has to be fought as inflation grows concern from the China lock down the list goes on.

No question about it. And so you know you would say that really not a whole lot has changed. Given what we've been talking about the last couple of months and yet the market is just kinda catching up with it or is the market telling us something that perhaps is different. Great question is the market telling us that a recession is in the offing, and I don't think so. I'm in one of the key lead indicators robbed you know is the shape of the yield curve. The difference between to entertain your yields in a fact actually got deeper back to where we were in January.

Listeners may remember there was a brief inversion where two-year yields were higher than 10 year yield. That was that you month and 1/2 ago, and that's corrected itself to some degree. I think this is just selling exhaustion from people who've gotten scared because they they made so much money over the last three years and they're taken some profits and that's that.

What these these bare squalls are all about spot you mentioned bitcoin once the learning here from the crypto see a lot of folks rethinking these works uncorrelated assets that would be a safe haven of sorts, and when the market volatility came in. We certainly haven't seen that. No, not at all. You and I talked it. My view still is bit as speculative as that which you don't know enough about it and expect speculative things technical up a lot but come down even harder. And that's over witnessing. But what about the rest of the world you mentioned China and obviously more lockdowns could cause them to fall into a recession. What else are you seeing around the globe. This can obviously have ripple effects back to the US China is a big one also flirting with recession toward higher oil prices have not helped them one bit, and their economies were all little the weaker side going into all this. So that's part of why the US is reacting we could escape the recession. But if much of the rest the world is in one unit will be effects of that next part of the struggle here to give the other side story were down under 17 times earning 17 PE that number last year was in the low 20s we came into the year 21 1/2 we've not been blown up at 17 hello but it's more normal for several years now and that is the price of the stocks versus the actual earnings there. Realizing this is accompanied Bob since we were together. Obviously the Fed hiked interest rates by 50 basis points one half of 1%, what would you what do you make of German pals comments anything noteworthy. There will be remembered. Market went up a thousand points roughly the day of said meeting and the announcement amount market latched onto what is the chairman basically saying 75 basis points three quarters of 1% probably off the table in the market, said a few side of relief. He talked to kill us was 75 still 50s the next day the market went down the thousand point that was on a productivity number that was not good which gave people more concerns about inflation. Those two days in the days around them.

Just one more time_the volatility in both directions is taking place obviously for long-term investors. Bob we know recessions are temporary market declines are temporary and that well for once we get to dollar cost average into cheaper investments right absolutely affect your common stock buyer and have been doing so the last couple years. You should be stepping up now because stocks have not been this cheaper for couple years, I came across a step today Rob. It helps a long-term investor.

There is no twenty-year. Since the Standard & Poor's 500 was creative hon. Sorry hundred years ago.

No twenty-year period were stocks of gone down well splotches underscores that we need to keep that perspective right stay emotionally in shacks. Let's not try to move wholesale inner out of the market trying to time it because while Bob buys, I'm sure you can attest, no one can pick the top of the bottom right thing in the saying of course is not timing the market time in the market exactly right. Bob always appreciate you my friend will talk to you next week by RA Bob Dole, chief investment officer crossed more global investment you can find out more across more hi back to the phones we got. We have a few lines open today and I'm good to stay after today to answer a few extra questions. So if you've got something that's pressing on your mind you love to chat about it. Well, I love to hear from you.

800 525 7000s number to call Illinois were headed next Patrick, thank you for your patience and great so he loved it. Melissa, thank you so much. I have been blessed so much comes from Leno and now God has blessed me with. You know quite a bit of money sitting in just saving so I would love to get in touch with twenty-year advisors to sit down and know what to do with this and also that's why I'm gone. I mean just sitting there not earning anything in a regular savings sure and all at and was Bob talking earlier I hope things are going down so I don't know where to go with it. So we kinda like you don't trust. That's not a Christian: people get a little bit nervous when it's so yeah questions Patrick what is your age 54 okay and you're still working.

I actually was well blessed open my own business I gave years ago and Jesus just let it take great.

Congratulations. The terms of this this money that you've been parking that you'd like to put to work about how much are we talking about 300,000 okay and separate from that, you got some emergency savings to fall back on, but then I have a couple of like 401(k)s and of course from sailing vessel are entrapment bankruptcy that learn to pay everything cash in on by the grace of God is just an old that's what I do now. I mean, I know a lot of people can't thank the Lord that I can assure so you have in those 401(k)s on 2140 and another. And then I got some gold, thrown a little bit around here and there. Okay well here's the thing, I think you really would benefit from sitting with a financial professional first not to invest anything. But to do some planning. Just figure out what you have in the way of assets. How are they currently positioned cash gold stocks and bonds and then where you go, what is your financial finish line. What is your objective in terms of how much you need to save and in what vehicles would be most effective for you.

If your you now own your own business and you don't have a company-sponsored plan for you know your employees and perhaps you need to look at, you know, an individual 401(k) were set up IRA something like that. If you have a plan for your employees and you can participate in a great but you need to look at all of that and it's not just about the mindless accumulation of wealth for saving sake.

It's really about where we going what is God want to do in your life and what your values and how can money be a tool to accomplish that in generosity, but also in savings for the long term, and so I think as that holistic picture becomes more clear I think. Then we can deploy a strategy to have those assets managed via perhaps rolling those old 401(k)s into a single IRA and then looking at ways to get as much of that 300,000 beyond what we carve out for an emergency fund of at least six months and since you're in business for yourself and we might enter into recession here. You need to have even more than that. Do you have working capital for the business and then how can we get as much of that into a tax-deferred environment as possible and then finally after all of that. How should be managed with what time horizon and what investments make the most sense he can take as little risk as possible but to achieve a return that's appropriate for your age and risk tolerance. All of that can be dealt with with an advisor so that Patrick, you mentioned one of our financial advisors we just clarified moneywise is a not-for-profit ministry. We don't have any financial advisors we don't sell investment products. We do however believe that the certified kingdom advisor designation is the designation you should be looking to to find it, financial advisors, investment advisors who met high standards and biblically wise financial advice and can bring God's perspective to bear in the context of that financial counsel you'll find a CK a there in Illinois.

When you visit our website just to a ZIP Code search and either two or three for financial planning and investments. We appreciate your call to do it for us of your holdings down will.

I will try to get as many calls as after the program is a thinking my team today managing our phones to dwell in Anderson was our engineer today Rios producer provided.

Thank you for being here as well is a partnership between you this tomorrow policy

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