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Understanding the Impact of Investments

MoneyWise / Rob West and Steve Moore
The Truth Network Radio
December 16, 2021 5:26 pm

Understanding the Impact of Investments

MoneyWise / Rob West and Steve Moore

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December 16, 2021 5:26 pm

As Christians, we want to know that our portfolios do more than just generate a financial return. We want them to make a real difference in the world. On today's MoneyWise Live, host Rob West will be joined by Mark Regier to help us find ways to understand the impact of our investments. Then Rob will answer your calls and various financial questions from a biblical perspective. 

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The word on the minds of many Christians comes to their investments. Rob West we want to know that our portfolios do more than generate a financial return want to make a real difference in the world. Margaret Geer joins us today to talk about that but it's all your calls at 800-525-7000 you could call them 24 700-525-7000.

This is what he was live wisdom for your financial decision and of course investments to make a difference in understanding how that impact can and should happen are often two very different things. Our guest today is a good friend, Margaret Geer, VP for stewardship investing for praxis mutual funds as an underwriter of this program. The praxis is a leading faith-based family of mutual funds that seeks to deliver real-world impact in all of their funds and markets a joy to have you back on the program. It's great to be back. Rob Markel, you're going to help us understand where real impact comes from and how we can look for impact in our investment options.

But first you been working with praxis now for over two decades. So look for you to start today by sharing a bit of the history you've had with praxis and how it came to focus on impact investing sure.

Well, I've always worked for the church and its institutions, and I actually came over two decades ago directly from seminary to work for reverence as they were just beginning to roll out the praxis mutual funds and our organization has a long history of investing, and as it started its mutual funds praxis. They asked a lot of questions about why we were doing this and how it was to be done and what values we were bringing to it, which had always been a very natural part of the investing that evidence is done for over 75 years. However, when we came to the organization with a vision for stewardship that seemed to really fit what they were trying to do and so I know I was pleased to be able to bring a passion for faith and values as it integrates with business decision-making that is sort of embedded in investments and that said that's how we became to where we are today was really exciting work, work, and I know you're making an incredible impact in seeing God at work all over the globe. Through these investment opportunities blood to sort out some terms because praxis is right in the middle of a really exciting growing space but we hear these terms impact investing on the secular side we hear the term ESG environmental stewardship and governance investing which is growing dramatically and then we hear about faith-based or faith driven investing as well.

So help us sort this out. Why do you think there's the sudden interest in these topics.

Well first of all I think the faith community can really take a lot of credit for where we are today globally with this movement that you've described the idea of bringing values to investments and asking questions beyond the simple financial bottom line and goes back literally hundreds of years within the Christian community and in other faith traditions and it's it and it was important I think for us to root ourselves in that tradition as we move forward in a course. What we're seeing today is that the mainstream financial services field is also understanding that things like the environment, social issues and governance haven't have a real impact on investments and they want to integrate those those issues as well. However, I think the important role that the faith community is played and is why we continue to use phrases like values based investing or faith-based investing is to to show that we are looking forward and I think that's the role that that the faith community is played for so many years is not just asking what's material today, but what should be material. What could be material in the investments going forward and and what will reflect the values of those we are seeking to invest on behalf of PS and Mark when we pursue these types of investments were essentially seeking a double bottom wide right a financial return and the social kingdom impact is that right and that is absolutely true and it sort of why we really migrated to focusing on impact from the very beginning.

That's been a big concern at praxis. How do we really deliver a real difference in impact and and that's that's why that term is so important to us is we want to make sure there's a real difference in the world of such great work Margaret Geer with us today from praxis mutual funds were to pause, we come back much more on this exciting space and what impact is actually occurring. We'll talk about that in your investments just around the corner. This is moneywise live stay with us will be right back to back him. Rob stridently today is Margaret Geer with praxis mutual funds were.

He serves as vice president for stewardship investing were talking today about impact investing and it's an exciting and growing space in the investment landscape and Mark just before the break you were sharing how this original leave the original impact investing model was something that believers were a part of it seems like the secular mainstream investing landscape really picked up on that and had been driving it forward as of late was something called environmental, social and governance investing, but the faith-based investing is now growing rapidly again alongside dad and I know praxis is one of the leaders in that with all of that interest in impact investing. Mark how can our listeners better understand what our investments are actually delivery. Well Rob I think the first thing that they can do is ask themselves what's important to them and it sometimes is easy to hit some personal passion issues, but I think when one reflects broader when should list the array of concerns that they have and what they want to see happen in the world.

We at praxis like to focus on the positive, what can we do to reflect kingdom values in the world and how can the investments we manage support that another way that investors can serve take ownership of this is to check out a fun website coming today with all the interest in in ESG and in certain values driven investing. These funds are putting out a lot of information so check it out and find out what the funds that you're connected with are saying that they're doing in the world and does that feel like it's reflecting what you want to see happen. We should have a conversation with your advisor and obviously kingdom advisors are key partners in all of this great work because they know how to provide biblical advice to a retail investor and that's a great opportunity to have a conversation with someone who understands your values. Just asking the question, no matter who you work with will tell you a lot about what they might be able to bring to the table. You can look at various sorts of websites that are out there. As you and many others. Many of these sometimes have their own perspectives on things to take that into account, but I think definitely do a little research and see the web offers us a lot of opportunities if were smart about it, and finally so do the funds issue a impact report. This is a report that details the social and environmental impact that the funds are having.

We've just released our real impact report for 2021, and are excited at the response were receiving and it goes into a fair amount of detail describing how we see our funds delivering real-world impact for kingdom values. While that's the key to understand what impact is actually taking place. And that's why I'm so excited about this annual report, you put out about the real impact that's occurring so investors can actually see what's taking place on the ground I know is a part of that mark your launching something you called the impact X framework tell us about the yeah this is really exciting. We often have people coming to us and asking us how can they know what kind of difference there funds are making in the world and in fact even today we have the SEC being very critical about how various fund complexes across the EM investment arena are using, for instance, ES and G and wanting to know that it's real.

It's not just some soda label.

They're throwing on there because it seems popular and it's given a lot of attention and so we sat back and thought about it and we look at her own history.

Any one of the things we've been dedicated to for so many years.

Here is trying to say how can we really make a difference and we color impact report the real impact report because this isn't just about getting a score or looking pure in our holdings we wanted to make sure that we could connect a real difference in the world to what were doing and so impact axis is designed to provide a framework for ourselves as well as for investors to take a look at and see one of the strategies that really can help us do that. And we've really identified seven that really we feel can help make a real difference in the world, and they include things like values in ESG screening. I will we bring together sort of art values concerns from a faith perspective is along with environmental, social and governance materiality concerns that a lot of folks are are paying attention to today as the integration of environmental, social and governance data into the investment process.

Both for our equities in an index like structure but also then for our actively managed fixed income portfolio company engagement like sitting down talking with company executives about those issues that are of concern to us, how do we just help the world come to a better place that is bringing good to all people positive impact investing. This is a place where my colleague Benjamin Bailey he's her senior fixed income portfolio manager and VP of investments is really a industry leader in taking the sleepy corner of fixed income and turning it into a real powerhouse for making a difference in the world through targeted fixed income products that are available and can help with addressing issues of climate change can help with helping refugees in various parts of the world addressing the needs of low income communities in Africa and Central America through World Bank bonds and other sorts of tools that really help us channel.

This products to those investments to places where it really makes a difference in the values driven proxy voting is a way for us to communicate with companies, community development, investing's probably is one of the most exciting areas where we can take 1% of our assets and channel those investments directly to play someplace that really needs assistance and low income communities on the margin and we accept a occasionally below market rate, but we know that were making a real difference where it's needed most. And finally, industry advocacy and education where worksheets are speaking up for important issues that change the very fabric of the markets that were working and so these are the types of things we think any fund can do some to some of them. We are very pleased to be doing all of these things that's really exciting work mark. Let's finish today with an example. Can you give us an example of where Christians have put their money and how it changed people's lives for the better.

You bet. There certainly are so many of them and we love telling the story through our websites and other documents, but one of the ones that is really touched. I think our lives in the in a variety of different ways is particular is us who are travel just work that we've done with Delta Air Lines who had we been engaged with over number of years on issues around anti-slavery and human trafficking concerning us and they recently step forward and really outlined a comprehensive antislavery and antihuman trafficking statement and in it made a number of commitments to address concerns about their airlines being used for the trafficking of persons and particular children and they've done a number things to really back this up, including establishing a cross divisional human trafficking advisory Council so they internally are meeting and talking about this and a they have 80,000 Delta employees have already gone through their human trafficking training program so that their staff at all levels can be aware of what human trafficking looks like and how they can spot and report those incidents as needed and and then they become a really active supporter of antitrafficking legislation and and lobbying efforts. So it's a real great way to see our investments in our engagement, making a difference in the world of the lives of those who are so vulnerable.

Well, congratulations on all the great work you're doing marker gears with praxis mutual Mark, thanks for being with us.

It's been a great pleasure.

Thanks so much Rob your calls or text 800-525-7000. That's 800-525-7000.

This is moneywise live biblical wisdom for your financial journey stay with us for turning in the moneywise live Rob Webster hose. This is wisdom for your financial decision to God's principles apply to what you're dealing with each day in your financial life. Saving giving your lifestyle or perhaps paying down debt. Whatever you're faced with today. Would love to hear from you. We got lines open. Perhaps once for you. Here's the number 800-525-7000 before we head to our first call today. Let me remind you moneywise live is listener supported in here at year-end, we would really appreciate your consideration of a gift to the ministry. You can do that quickly and easily online moneywise just click the donate button as we try to close our gap for the year and prepare for ministry in 2022. Your gift would go a long way as we are entirely listener supported. Again, you can make your gift online moneywise before 1231.

Just click the donate button. You also find her physical mailing address and a toll-free number. If you'd like to talk to somebody you make a gift over the phone and thanks in advance. Phone lines open for your calls and questions today on anything financial 800-525-7000 will begin today in Orlando, Florida hi Beth, thank you for holding.

How can I help you regarding our art appreciate out and how long you are paying an annual yes right well I think the key is number one in terms of the depreciation. A lot of folks will tell you that the cars value will decrease by 20 to 30% by the end of the first year and then between years two and six. The depreciation ranges from 15 to 18% on average in terms of how long to keep it dwell, our former host of this program. My good friend Howard Deighton coined the saying that you should drive the car until the wheels fall off in this point there is that we should maximize the useful life of the vehicle. No Consumer Reports or so to the study. Not too long ago that so the average life expectancy of a new vehicle these days is around eight years or hundred and 50,000 miles, although some well-built vehicles maintained properly can go much further than that almost doubled 15 years and 300,000 miles. We got 250,000 out of the last vehicle we turned and so I think you know, the idea is to buy a good quality car that you can drive for a long long time until you get to a place where the repair costs exceed the vehicle's value, or one months worth of monthly payments you know is you look up to and compare the vehicle replacement costs and the repairs that are going into it so I think for that reason, the best idea is to buy it, hold it, and then if you can make payments to yourself. The idea Beth is that when you're ready. When the car no longer make sense to keep because of the repair because then you've got cash to buy the next one. Does that make sense okay.

You're very welcome.

Thank you both. We appreciate your call. I listened to Kansas City, Missouri Sally, thank you for your call very very much always and I'm not very smart yet not the money and everything I need some advice. I about $20,000 just in a regular savings account and I have about 43 or $44,000 cash in safe feeling kind of relationship. Don't know what I should be doing like that we are in our mid-50s completely debt-free. We have Roth IRAs already we have life insurance thing and stuff like that so I just don't want to be dealing with death if extra money. I don't know if I can apply it to their regular rock that we have which I think you can only put so much on a year extract or yes we should go like a totally different deal. And I don't even want to call it that, like Eventide or one of the day. I hear you talk about often sure well it's a great question is good.

I know there's multiple facets to this Gotta begin to make our way through it. The first thing is that you have a spending plan and you know what's coming out each month and then what it takes to fund your lifestyle.

What I would call the fixed expenses those things you get a bill for and your discretionary spending. The things that you spend every month but are necessarily going to be billed to you. That's trips to the grocery store, clothing, haircuts, things like that do you feel like you have a good handle on what it takes in terms of your monthly expenses and secondly do you have enough income such that you can cover all your expenses and have something left over the end of the month sometime that yet we everything paid for at the end of the month take credit cards are paid off and everything great in what you think the total roughly monthly expenses are each month, probably 2200 and where. Okay, that sounds well but let's say it's 2200.

Let's it's 2500 a month if that's the case here six months would be 15,000. And that's what I would recommend you have an emergency savings that though I would have a savings account with an online bank could be a physical bank of the Skidmore interest with an online bank. Both have FDIC insurance and I would link that to your checking account so I would say the goal of the 15,000 would be there in terms of cash on hand at home in a fireproof safe. If your you would like to have some cash at home.

Most folks recommend a rule of thumb, of around one to $2000 and the reason they would typically give her that if this is a very remote situation, but if there was a national emergency bank operations are shut down.

You want to have enough cash to cover cover three days worth of expenses and you know just things you would need to cover as at home cash if you will. So I think between those two, you know, that should really cover it in terms of longer-term, you do want to be saving for retirement and I would recommend Sally that you have 10 to 15% of your pay going into retirement plans. You can use a company-sponsored plan work. You could use a Roth IRA over 50 you could put in 7000 year each under 56,000 and that would at least get you going in that direction. I think between the emergency fund cash on hand than saving for retirement with the rest you will be building wealth for the future. The only other thing would be medium-term, and short-term savings goals that you might stand alive, pause and take a brief break we come back will talk about where you can invest. This is moneywise one moneywise live biblical wisdom financial decision lines open today for your call 800-525-7000 give us a call right now would look just before the break we were talking with Sally in Kansas City and so is got to $60,000 so roughly that is she's wondering what to do with 20,000 the bank 43,000 at home in a safe and I was saying Sally if you think in terms of one to 2000 at home for you know if if the banking operations were disrupted a national emergency some sort of major weather event that would probably cover you. And then if you had 20,015 to 20,000 Macs in your emergency fund in a savings account linked to your checking account that would essentially give you 40,000 that you could invest unless you had short-term or medium-term savings goals that require that you needed to access the money in less than certainly less than 10 years, but definitely less than five years, you'd want to keep that aside so reactive that before we talk about where you'd invest okay yeah I could do that and I would I would I don't know where to put it. I just don't know where where to put it savings account attached to it checking.

I don't think I understand that, sure. So the idea there would be theirs in the bank, whether that's a local bank that you walk into, or an online bank which basically operate the same ways. Just the online banks.

Instead of paying for all of the buildings. Everything is conducted online and then they're able to pass some of that savings on the form of no fees and higher interest rates things like that but essentially with a checking account that's probably what you have to pay your bills with every month with you do that with physical checks or online bill pay and I would recommend you know your income be deposited in your checking account of the use that to pay expenses as you are now based on your budget. I would though have a separate savings account that is where you keep your emergency reserve so it's not mixed with your your checking where your writing your bills every month and that way it's there, it's earmarked for only the unexpected but it's not tapped, you know, just for month-to-month spending and the idea is that it's linked to your checking which is done electronically.

Very simple to do so that if you ever needed money for an unexpected expense it with a couple clicks of a button you could transfer money over to your checking and it's usually there through the what's called the ACH system, which is the banking transaction system within 2 to 3 days there would be the cost to do that but I like a little bit of separation for your savings from your checking your monthly kind of spending account if you will. Does that make sense what would happen. Okay, great.

So I would have your expenses going out of checking but I think you could probably Muster for some reason I have more you could That savings at 15 to 20,000, and then only keep one to 2000 and home now. When you identify the rest of it. As long as you are willing to earmark it for the long term meaning 10 years. Plus you really for retirement account were looking toward that season of life than you could invested in a retirement vehicle. Now do you will have thought either your husband have a retirement plan available at work now in point. Okay, so a Roth IRA would be a great start.

You could what is your age that okay and what is your age. I think that okay so you could each put in 7000 you could do that for 2021 and then you could turn around and put in another 7000 each for 2022. So you could put in $28,000 and 14 and each really quickly here between 2121 2022. Moving forward, you would typically want to have another type of retirement account that would allow you to put away a bit more and a great tool for somebody to self-employed us on the cold, except IRA, SEP, and that's can allow you to put away more than you would with a Roth IRA with the setup of her 2022. You can put in 25% of compensation or $61,000 whichever is less, but that's can allow you to put away more money. If you have the ability to do so when I would look at that in terms of where to keep those I'd probably while you're still building.

That's probably look at the Schwab intelligent portfolios or Vanguard advisor.

You can read about those online Schwab intelligent portfolios Vanguard advisor. Essentially, you would have a portfolio inside Roth are set up that's pegged to the benchmarks that the major indexes in the country. Stock indexes like the S&P 500, the bond indexes things like that. And all this would be done for you in a basically a very simple question and answer format. It's low cost should be well diversified.

So I think that might be the way to go.

The other approach would be to connect with an advisor who could canna walk you through all of this. Do some planning and help you get these investments set up, so I'd probably go in that direction either the Schwab intelligent portfolios of the Vanguard advisor or contact a certified kingdom advisor which you can find on the website moneywise just click find a CK and you could connect with a certified kingdom advisor there in Kansas City to walk with you, so hopefully that at least get you pointed in the right direction. Last thing I want to do is get you to stay on the line so we can get you a copy of the sound mind investing handbook. It will be our gift to you in this allow you and your husband begin reading about investing, familiarizing yourself with one of the terms and concepts, but will be done from a biblical perspective. So stand line will get that book out to you and you have a Merry Christmas to Sarasota, Florida. Gina is waiting patiently, Gina. How can I help pay my debt were quite a few times so and I'm 60 want some really, really behind. I know you are probably not the biggest fan of consolidation on the list into your shallow home. I have about $14,000 in debt.

I've been chipping away at that adequate amount and I want to see what you thought about how even though it meant to discover: about on the 14,000 and they settle without running the credit channel based on what I gave school.

He said I'm only looking on that amount is the 14,000 Gina all on credit cards.

It's it's quite yet and assisted us on the student 3000 and the student looks okay. I'm not a bit of Santos credit consolidation is as you heard in the past and the reason is you were replacing debt with that. A lot of times, although the interest rate comes down. The term gets extended so we end up paying more. The other challenges it doesn't lead to solving the real problem which is rightsizing are spending living within our means and so typically we replace the debt with another loan you take the pressure off and then only to find that the debt will return because again were treating the symptom. So what I'd rather you do Gina with the 11,000 in credit card that is contact your friends are Christian credit they will help you get on a credit counseling program through debt management. You get the interest rates lowered one fixed monthly payment and you'll pay it off 80% faster. It's the best way to go. In my view will help you build it right in your budget and with that those balances coming out even quicker than they are now. You'll see some real progress each month and will be encouraged to keep going that I just keep attacking the student loans on your own begin Christian credit is my recommendation. Thanks for your call 800-525-7000 six to moneywise live biblical wisdom for your financial decisions. If you haven't created a free moneywise account would love for you to do that are moneywise weekly wisdom went out today with a thought for me are trending podcasts and articles. Great information each week in the moneywise weekly wisdom.

There is no cost for just over moneywise and sign up for a free account you be able to post to our community, and you get our weekly email below for you to check it out back to the phone today.

David's in Tennessee. David how can I help you in my unit about everyday and are you talking when I wake about bonds yes and and you said I'm really pain likes & that's right in as one advantage or disadvantage of man in no about five years to yes very good welding the I bonds are a great vehicle right now there pegged to interest rates and because of that their pay and 7.1% right now in terms of what it is.

It's a security that earns interest based on both the fixed rate and then a rate that set twice a year, pegged to inflation. The bond earns interest until it reaches 30 years or you cash it in whatever comes first. So, because interest rate is ticked up right now were at 7.1% that that inflation component is reset every six months so April 2022. It'll happen again you can buy 10,000 worth an electronic I bonds a treasury treasury and then you can get up to 5000 in paper I bonds using your federal income tax return so that means you could actually acquire up to 15,000 in a calendar year and you can gift them as well, which you can do both with the paper and the electronic it's backed by the full faith and credit of the United States government.

You do have to keep it five years or you'll give up some of the interest not a lot but there is no some amount that you would have to get back basically about three months worth of interest that you would you would lose if you cashed it in less than five years, so it's a great tool right now, David. I wish we could put more in. But that's your limit, but there was no reason enough for something that has essentially no risk to get that kind of return on is just unheard of in doubt go there when I was in the yes or that's the treasury's website for the U.S. Treasury treasury direct.GL V and you'll see information there on I bonds and how you can buy him and get your electronic I bonds read through that website. No thanks a lot.

Okay David thank you for listening sir. God bless you of Fort Lauderdale Florida is where Elsa is located. Elsa, how can I help you all I need some advice from my retirement. I have not RNA. I own my own home and have been saving for that year. Did you see yourself employed Elsa here okay very good so you're still working and how long do you plan to do so. Do you have a plan for the okay very good and you said you have some retirement accounts what he thinks the total in all of your retirement accounts together okay and do you have any other savings other than the 60,000 in the one year's worth of emergency funds have okay so you got a total of 60 in retirement accounts another 60 then on top of that one year's worth of emergency savings okay very good at saving about 18 months okay very good and as you look at your monthly expenses, and I realize a somebody on your business. This could fluctuate it in terms of your income, but what what you have left over at the end of each month to month. Okay, it's about 12,000 year that you could put away okay very good.

Well, you could continue to fund the IRA. 7000 a year. But you have a bit more than that.

So I might look at what's called a separate IRA, SEP, which would allow you to put away a bit more than you can do in the Roth. The key would be for you to put away as much as you can to try to come to catch up in terms of your overall savings over the next five years. The great news is you have no debt, you have low expenses you got plenty reserves the key would be if you are going to be able to live on Social Security alone. You want to have enough saved so that you can supplement the Social Security income with an income stream that you would generate from the investments. So during your working years. It will be important for you, at least in these next five or more years while you're working for you to get as much going into those retirement accounts is possible if you find that your maxing out your IRAs, then that's where I'd look. Perhaps wherever your IRA is see about opening a separate IRA, which would put a lighter put away a little bit more and I think between your rental property.

You know the month the money you're putting away and investments your low expenses your no debt. You'll probably in pretty good shape. The key will just be how long you want to keep working so that you can save and that's really good to be driven by the amount of income you need on top of Social Security. If you would feel better about it. You could do some retirement planning with a financial planner that would actually look at all of this.

Do some projections on, what you're going to need to have them give you a pretty specific roadmap if you will, and how much you need to set aside each year so you have enough when you get there and I would do that by just heading to our website moneywise click find a CK and see about just doing some hourly financial planning specifically for retirement. That would probably give you added peace of mind to know, okay, here's my plan.

This is what I need to do a cheer and here's how long I need to work so that I've got what I need you when I get there. We appreciate your call today.

Thanks for checking in with us but said next to Chicago, Illinois. Have you know how can help you hurry good afternoon, so I do have three questions upright on put them together and in one question.

I am currently employed. I have I have this a 401(k) with my employer. I I receive about.

I now have about 185,000 in my 401(k) plan and every year I get 63 my two cars are fully paid. I'm just paying for the repairs and then I have to rent the house and one house so my questions would be, would it be all right for me to retire early and when I be able to get my pension estimates I retired.

It say on 54, I want to retire at 60 on the next question would be, would it be wise for me to get rid of the two old cars that I keep on repairing and then just buy a secondhand car in cash okay very good what are you putting into their retirement accounts each month. Right now every pay period.

Every month I put 500 okay 500 a month and you said you wanted to work another six years and then used asked about a pension or are you calling the 401(k) pension or do you have a pension on top of the 401(k). I'm calling the parliament.

My pension okay got it all right. Very good. Well, if you have essentially your hundred and $85,000 and if you were to over the next six years you were to put away an additional see you said the you would put away 500 a month. I think the key would just be what you need each month in income over and above Social Security to be able to fund your lifestyle.

Have you looked at what your retirement budget might be okay alright well I think you know that's really the key for you is to be able to think about what your expenses will be in retirement. You know if if you have five you put away an additional 6000 a year for the next six years and it grows at 8% you'll have about 300,000 you when you get to the end of this and when you're ready to retire in the key would be whether that 300,000.

It will give you the income you need that would generate about 12,000 a year on top of that you have Social Security and then if you had some rental properties that were generating income. At that point, you know that rental income until you're ready to sell it. The key would be is the any rental income over and above your expenses and debt service +12,000 a year from the investments plus Social Security is that enough to fund your lifestyle. If so, great, you're there. Essentially, if not your you're really the key would be the reduce your expenses or work longer you follow that line of thinking here. I'm just concerned about the uncertainty of this kind sure yeah and what respect and expect disability of the government like the market might crash so inflation is going up and then for health reasons, I'm 50 or so and I'm feeling the HTML. My body is still knee given away rather later and I think that's enough for those reasons. Number one, we realize you know we want to be in service to the Lord forever, but we can't work forever because there may come a day where we're physically unable to continue to work, which is why we save and set something aside for the future as to the uncertainty of the government, the economy in the market it with inflation going up that's a reason why we don't want to go to cash because if you're in cash or certainly can lose purchasing power. Yes, we have some headwinds but because I look across the rest of the world. The US is still in pretty good shape in the stock and bond market is the very best place for you to grow your wealth outpace inflation and have something down the road for you to count on. So I'd say if it were me, I'd stay the course, but the next step is really to look closely at that retirement budget. We appreciate your call today. Let's get to do it for us folks.

Thanks for tuning in moneywise. Live is a partnership between Moody radio and moneywise media. Thank you to my team today Jim, Eric, Devon, Amy, think being here as well. I hope you come back and join us tomorrow look for you

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