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The Art of Negotiating

MoneyWise / Rob West and Steve Moore
The Truth Network Radio
April 6, 2021 8:03 am

The Art of Negotiating

MoneyWise / Rob West and Steve Moore

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April 6, 2021 8:03 am

Many people believe that negotiating with someone means that there has to be one winner and one loser and that is not always the case! There is an art to negotiating properly and it’s absolutely essential in day to day business activities. On the next MoneyWise Live, host Rob West and Steve Moore teach you the art of negotiating. The give and take of negotiating on MoneyWise Live at 4pm Eastern/3pm Central on Moody Radio.

Rob West and Steve Moore
Family Life Today
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Rob West and Steve Moore
Family Life Today
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Rob West and Steve Moore

This is Doug Hastings, VP of Moody radio and were thankful for support from our listeners, and businesses like United face mortgage. If you go to our mortgage teams website you'll find hundreds of testimonials of real Christian radio listeners. We've helped Laura here is a recent friend was kind enough to share a few words with our local station. Grandma and back without letting Brian how to marry Kelly and we found out if they like making out with a sellers market Filing.

But anytime we needed her stealing fair practice he got everything we needed anything that we ask for it and made it work. Steve made sure that if that was the house that our family wanted plea-bargaining at that house their wonderful company and were just really glad that we found them in a contest that they helped us get there and we are in now. My migraines been in our family is so happy we are united. Mortgage is a DBA of United mortgage Corp. 25 Millville Park Rd., Millville, NY license mortgage backer for licensing information, go to an MLS consumer corporate MLS number 1330. Equal housing lender not licensed in Alaska, Hawaii, Georgia, Massachusetts, North Dakota, South Dakota and Utah moneywise. Life is reporting vast wealth that Americans enjoy. Compared to much of the world is something of a double-edged sword does allow us most of us to live a comfortable lifestyle but at the same time it makes is terrible at negotiating. We almost always decide to buy something based on the offer price. While in many other countries and go shooting life today. Rob West has some ways you can talk your way to better deal then we can some calls from all across the country. However, this edition of the program is not live. I'm Steve Moore, the art of negotiating next right here moneywise Rob will be the first to admit that I don't often try to haggle for a better price on things but when I do try quite often it works. So why do you suppose so many of us are a bit shy or reluctant to try. Well, I think Steve it starts with just a lack of confidence. We don't really know how to do it so we don't try, and that it just becomes a habit to pay whatever the seller is asking and I think some people might think that it's in some ways may be dishonest or in biblical to talk someone down a bit in price what you think about that but I don't think it's on biblical at all.

It's actually good stewardship making the most of the resources God has entrusted to us of the Bible as many examples of God's people negotiating with others.

The spies coming to terms with Rahab and Joshua to just one of them. It reads so the men said to her our life for yours. If you do not tell this business of ours, and it shall come about when the Lord gives us the land that we will deal kindly and faithfully with you that negotiating is not at all like trying to dodge a debtor or evade paying taxes, which of course are clearly dishonest and on biblical as long as the seller has the freedom to say no. There's nothing wrong with trying to get a better deal. The objective of course is that it typically when I negotiate I don't start out with my life for yours don't want to step good idea coming lower low and slow. There are so it's a word we start the day. Well, Steve.

The first thing is to determine where you can negotiate and where you can. There's no sense wasting your time if you know the offer price is absolutely firm.

Here are some things you can often get a lower price on. If you're willing to negotiate, take your cell phone plan.

Perhaps your cable package that's more true now than with all of the available streaming options and apps your credit card interest rate, even maybe your gym membership with those sometimes all you have to do is ask and you'll get a better rate. Some others will require more work your car insurance your rent to even your salary. But what about car insurance.

You might have to give up some things to get a better price or just be sure you're always maintaining adequate coverage, that's for sure. I let's get down to some nuts and bolts here give us an example of how one might want to negotiate how you start yeah well let's see you decided to negotiate your rent. By the way this will work with your mortgage because that really is carved in stone and less you're willing to refinance, but to negotiate a better red price start by doing your homework so use the lower Craigslist to find out what others are paying for comparable units or properties in your area. Make a list of a few with lower rents that you can cite in your negotiation then be ready to offer something in return for lower price. Maybe you can pay a few months in advance or you be willing to sign a longer lease or increase the termination notice from 30 to 60 or even 90 days of those are attractive features to the landlord, but you can also offer things. It won't cost you anything. So for example if you don't have a car, offer your parking space or promise not to smoke in the unit that could save the landlord money not to even keep a pet if they are allowed the real art to negotiating Steve is working toward both parties getting something out of it and again that goes back to this idea that I mentioned earlier that it's a true win-win yeah good point that you mentioned negotiating a better salary.

That seems like it might be a tough one with covert shutdowns rest true, but some businesses are actually doing well despite the shutdowns you know if your company hasn't had layoffs and there's plenty of work. It may be time to think about asking for a raise start by making a list of problems you solve for the company.

Maybe you've decrease the accounts receivable balance or your ideas and suggestions eliminated certain expenses. That's a great start, then make a separate list of problems you will solve going forward.

Finally, determine your asking salary.

I would visit. or pay to get an idea of what others are paid for similar work in your area. Now you're ready to negotiate. So then make an appointment with the boss to talk about your salary and after the break.

Steve will talk about what could happen in the way we do that the art of negotiating with Rob West, listening to moneywise live but today we're not lives so if you hear that phone number. Please don't call but to stick around.

Lots of good information.

Rob West needed to get his head wrapped around his newfound freedom I mean responsibilities of hosting moneywise by himself.

Steve is retired so enjoy your week of encore presentations of program.

Tune in next week for Rob without a safety net on the all new moneywise live talking about negotiating something Americans typically are fond of doing. But around the world. It's almost a daily thing.

People serve expected so Rob you've arranged to have a meeting with your boss you're prepared. Hopefully I hear she is prepared as well to discuss your salary and how do we negotiate from that point on. Yeah, in the reminder.

Just make sure your well versed in what asking salary should be in have the backup for it. pay Both will give you an idea of what others are paid for for similar work in your area when you go in to make that appointment with the boss and you sit down, I would again show that list of problems solved problems. You will address the worst that can happen is the bosses know and if that happens, hang on to those list you've made. If you decide to move on though be a big help when you schedule your next job interview and again no harm in asking.

Companies are looking for the opportunity to hang onto great workers. And if that's you and this could be a great opportunity to advance in your career.

I read let's just use only take a couple seconds or less. Role-play a little bit art, so I come in I sit down across the desk from you. Your desk is a long, broad, deep desk. Nothing on the top of the desk at all. Very imposing. You've got on your black suit the black shirt. The black tie, and I say excuse me, Mr. West. I'll try not to take much of your time but generally speaking, are you happy with the work I'm doing for you, sir, and you want to know what my next statement will be yeah yeah it's role-playing her eyes yeah and I and I fully agree Steve great work you're doing all right. Will that case, Rob, how about I don't show up for Friday's program unless I get the dressing room I've been asking for for years, sir, I say, I'll see you tomorrow that you give us a and will miss you today Bellevue, Ohio hello Sue, how can we help you. All we are retired home, retired, recommend $35,000.275,000 which we currently 275 account .55 week and you really never been much of a taker.

We work hard to get one & well I think the key here. First of all, Sue is that you're doing a great job you have all your ducks in a room, so to speak your living well within your means you've been a diligent saver and you've accumulated quite a bit. I love the fact he had that emergency fund in place. So if the unexpected comes you've got something to fall back on. I think the question is what is the right level of risk for you given what you know today and what you don't know. With regard to this money lasting the rest of your lives. I think the key is nobody else can really define for you what that appropriate level of risk should be. It's really going to come down to what are you trying to accomplish and feel what is prudent given the principles we see in God's word about living within your means and being content but also being able to provide for yourselves now and in the future in terms of the income sources that you have Sue do you really anticipate unless something unexpected comes, they will continue to cover your lifestyle needs in the future.

Meaning, you wouldn't expect to have to touch these investments are left.

Something came that was unforeseen okay and as you all talk about the appropriate level of risk that you might want to take.

Are you interested in having beyond the 35,000 its allocated utility stocks are you interested in any portion of the roughly 275,000 being at the risk of the stock market, which would then in return give you the ability to see potentially a greater return over the long haul. On that portion what I just wanted to I that there a relatively healthy we don't have any life insurance or insurance. Well, we could go back to rules and that could be a starting point for us. But at the end of the day the right mix of investments is only what you are most comfortable with.

What allows you to sleep well at night and feel like you're being a good steward of your resources and not taking on any unnecessary anxiety or stress because you have this money which you are the steward of no one else at the perhaps with the higher level of risk than you're comfortable with so that starting point would be give that rule of thumb that would say you take 100 minus your age. And that would be the portion that you would want invested in stock allocation so that would be 40% of your portfolio which you know if you have 275,000 and then you said you had about 35,000 in utilities we got 310,000 so that would be about 125,000 potential he that could be at the risk of the market now, does that mean that's the right number for you know not necessarily. You all may decide we don't want that much at the risk of the market, working to back it down to 30% or even 20% or less.

Because whatever portion is at the risk of the market you have to recognize that there could be in any given time. If we were into a recession in a bear market. You could see that portion of the portfolio decline depending on how aggressive it's invested 2030% and you have to ask yourself what I be okay with that for a period of time where I could see that paper loss on a statement and not react emotionally and go in and sell it. Perhaps as the market was falling and waited out for as much as 18 months to three years at least based on historical trends for it to come back and move to higher ground. If you felt like you and your husband you could see that happen in weather that storm for that portion then the upside of that is, historically speaking, that would allow you to have a bit more growth in the portfolio beyond the two half percent you're earning right now on the lion share of this, but if you said you know what Rob I just wouldn't be comfortable with that. I'd lose sleep. I'd open the statement I'd feel like we need to do something I want to go in and sell it that I'd say you know what, we probably don't need that much allocated to the riskier asset classes. Even though we could be on the more conservative end of them there still risk and I would say will then let's dial it back. I don't think 40% is your number. Perhaps it's between 10 and 20% that's the conversation you need to have a nobody else can really tell you what's right or wrong. I think at the end of the day. We want to try to balance what is God called us to water our needs. What is the appropriate amount of risk for us to take for us to feel like we're still in a good place and were not beyond what were comfortable with and how do we allow this to grow, to outpace inflation and to continue as the cost of healthcare increases, and if we were to live a long time. The Lord tarries for this money to be able to be around for us and I think somewhere between that 10%, which is basically where you're at right now, and 40% of the portfolio allocated to stocks is probably the right range and you will have to decide where in that range you want to land the last thing I would say Sue is you may be a little bit over concentrated toward the utility sector. I like utilities in that they tend to be in a little more stable. They have dividends so they pay income. But if the utility market gets out of favor in certain economies.

It does, then your highly concentrated with basically 10% of your assets in one sector.

You may want to dial that back just a little bit now after a lot out you have any thoughts or comments. 483 and one go down.

We rest taken out and put it back in the same way that that idea. It's exactly right because during that period of time which again just based on history, a bear market can last on average 18 months to three years and you'll see the market declining.

It certainly happened back in 2008 2009. But what's happened since then. Well, we probably had the greatest bull market ever for the last 10 or 12 years then of course the pandemic in 2020, with a steep decline.

That was short-lived. Now the markets recovered and is continuing to trend upward in recent months and usually those who react to a decline in take their money out of the market during a crisis. Don't time their reentry well because you just simply can't. And then they missed the recovery so my point is, you would have to have some confidence that that portion and that's all it is that portion that was allocated toward stocks you felt like you could weather whatever store may hit the market in the future and you would be able to ride it out, and I think that's where you've just really got to give it a matter of prayer.

You gotta talk through it and that's where a financial advisor could come in as well. Something shares your values like a certified kingdom advisor so hopefully this is been helpful to you want to think about it pray about it. If you want to talk some more. Give us a call thank you soon. God bless you. Today's broadcast is recorded have some calls lined up in some great way when we come back from our break will say hi to Norma in Chicago and Joe in Alabama is not on Steve Moore if you thought you heard Steve Moore say goodbye last week but we're giving you one more week of Steve in the form of encore presentations of the wise, listening to moneywise live. Here's a great verse when it comes to investing is from the book of these he asked nasty seven to divide your portion 27 even 284. You do not know what misfortune may occur on the earth and obviously the concept of principle. There is all about diversification, Chicago, Illinois. In normal what's on your mind and have a savings account out-of-pocket outside one day. I need to pay off my Margate and you said the balance. Norma is 37,000 on the mortgage and what you have in savings pocket outside okay yeah that would be a little concerning. Just because you'd obviously bring your savings all the way down to 3000. I'm assuming you're able to meet your expenses just with the Social Security coming in all okay and at the end of the typical month. Norma, do you have a little bit left over. Even while you're paying the mortgage payment.

Yes, how much would you say roughly the thousand a month left over her okay very good well and what would you say roughly are your total expenses that you have on a given month.

Yes men will expenses together will be one I 1500 and okay well here's the thing that the good news is you're obviously living well within your means and as soon as you pay off the mortgage, you would still need to continue to escrow for taxes and insurance, but you drop that mortgage payment what is the mortgage payment not including any escrows, do you happen to know what that is all okay well that amount would be added to your surplus. So let's say your mortgage payment just the mortgage itself. Principal and interest is 500 a month for example. So now you have 1500 a month. Well if you paid it off and you had 3000 left over, which is essentially about already two months expenses then you could add another 1500 a month to that moving forward because you have the thousand surplus plus the mortgage payment and really focus on building your savings back up.

One option would be to delay this so you continue to cannabis say about this extra thousand dollars a month until you have at least three months expenses. You know what you're not far away from another couple of months you be there or you could go even for or six months of putting an additional thousand dollars aside and at that point, I think between three and six months expenses in the bank. I like the idea of you going ahead and paying off this mortgage being completely debt-free. Assuming there's not anything on the horizon that you know about this can be a major expense.

A major home repair health event that's coming. Something like that. If you don't see anything like that today. Then I'd wait a few months continue to say, but then go ahead and wipe out the mortgage and then really focus on taking your margin that you had today plus the amount of the principal and interest you're saving and pile that back into savings so you can build that back up as a reserve and I think you'll be glad to have that off your back and feel a lot better about being debt-free, Norma. We appreciate your phone call today and wish you the very best on that. Thanks so much. When we come back we'll chat with Joe wants to know about annuities versus stock market stocks, mutual funds also wants to know about house or being house her opinion of her husband's opinion that as well. Taking your calls today I moneywise live. Don't forget to visit us on our website. Any time you like. Moneywise live.oh, this is moneywise live event in Atlanta and Ryan in Grand Rapids were moving in your direction.

Stay with us, but first it's Joe in Northport, Alabama Joe were so glad to have you on the program today. How can we help you have learned a lot that I participating in the yeah Beverly retirement program. On the whole story really. Yes, her and I have a total love for all the thousand dollar event 260,000 being from annuities and hundred and 80,000 from stocks. Q: how my 81 years old and a guaranteed rate.

Only problem is 40%. Now I'm staying in money, and you can only get 1% for five minute solo round, preferably guaranteed rate of 3% my wealth management dispensaries have significant extent that output how wholeheartedly Bari thousand dollars into the annuity phone I want to get strike could get yeah you faking your opinion only inserts so you said the roughly hundred and 80 that's in stocks and bonds. How has that been performing for you is been doing pretty good yeah okay what I've been doing. I have been any vesting, probably over 50 or 60 years so I.keep performing the unit. So sometime I hate to put it into the surface, but the annuity is what has the 3% guarantee on it. Yeah okay and are you drawing an income off of this roughly 440,000 Joe pickup of interest solely okay alright so that supplementing your income is okay very good. Well, I think the key here is list one more question is about what what is that amount that you need from these this portfolio to balance your budget each month. This particular phone. I have several others. I've probably got slightly over finding right, BB money market knows, if that is so actually I'm just pulling that money out to try and help me to meet that require distribution.

I see I see so you have about a million, all in or more in terms of investable assets for Isle of Man immediately to okay and what is your monthly need from all income sources beyond Social Security to maintain your lifestyle. How much do you need, regardless of which account it's coming from what you really need to pay the bills, probably about 2000 month okay so if you got a million to and you're only needing 2000 a month. You really only need about 2% of this money which means there's really not any need for you to take unnecessary risk. You've got to obviously good assets. You've been a diligent saver your lifestyle and set a minimum you know your you're not trying to find an extravagant lifestyle and so if you only need to percent a year on this 1.2 million. There's probably not a reason to take much more risk, then the guarantee portion because you just don't have to.

Now if you wanted to try to grow it because you wanted to pass it on or you want to be able to give it away to your church or favorite ministry and you wanted some allocation to stocks just to be a prudent investor. Well, there would be nothing wrong with that.

It 80 years old. You could make a case for heaven. 20 or even 30% of this invested in the stock allocation. But again, if it's not necessary.

What you're trying to do is not beat somebody else's returns. You're just trying to accomplish what the Lord has for you and you've obviously accumulated all that you need. So if you would feel better not being at the risk of the market, especially given where were at in this cycle with 11 years of bull market behind us, then moving to the guaranteed portion would probably be a great idea because you just don't have to take any more risk then you're already taking.

In fact, you could take less risk. So I don't have any problem with that. I think at the end of the day.

It really just comes down to what you're most comfortable with. Does it make sense. As a down on illegal rule church that have the young people what they don't they don't have very much to someone. So now this morning. Do you know something that might be you value to the end setting that out I would do is check with our friends at the National Christian foundation. They could help you determine what the type best type of account would be for you to do that they could be something like a donor advised fund where you could go ahead and park the money there and then just release it as it's needed for the church, but they would probably have some other ideas they really are skilled in this area of Wise giving and you can go online and in CF to get more information and to get the phone number for the office closest to you.

Or you could talk to the folks in the national office here in Atlanta but they're just wonderful folks that would love to walk alongside you and give you some great godly advice on how best to serve this local church. With the resources God has given you NCF Joe were glad you called today sounds like you're doing great.

We appreciate that call today wish you the best. Thank you very very much. Let's see event in Atlanta. Can we make it quick. We have just a couple of minutes. How can we help TO make a quick thank you call. I am that I have a tiny house phone wheel and I lived in it up to my husband I got married in both retired and I want to use my TSP phone, might yet be up to pay it off it. 25,000. I have 62,000 in the THP and I pay the note for bandits 515 a month only other debt we have is a house note if the 10 year and it's about 700 so my husband think it's a waste of money to pay it off, but I don't actually I can just pay it off and it 515 I can save it, give it away and invested and he walked. He wants you to help us to become one by hipness to figure this out tiny house. Okay well event. I think clearly in God's word. We see the warnings around Scripture that is not wrong. It's not a sin, but we should purpose ourselves to be debt free and I like the idea of you all striving to be debt-free over time, including your home.

I think debt for a home in an asset that's appreciating is probably one of the most wise uses. If there is such a thing of debt but I think the ability to get out of debt is going to take the pressure off. It's going to get you out of being servant to the lender and to your point, you'll save the interest on it. So here's what I would do. I would strive for oneness in this area and I realize that's why you're reaching out your husband pray about it.

One potential compromise would be to develop a plan to get completely out of debt if not all, right now. Over the next maybe two or three years and take the amount you owe and divided up which mean you have Lex less tax burden as well stay on the line will talk off. There will be right back. Thanks so much for joining us for listening today. Thank you also for your prayers and your financial gifts that help keep this radio program on the air and help us meet our expenses on a monthly basis if you'd like to make a donation of any size you can do it easily, quickly, safely when you visit our website moneywise, click the donate tab right there at the top of the page moneywise and thanks.

Thanks again in advance for helping us out. Grand Rapids, Michigan hey Ryan, what's your question for Rob West yet so my wife and I are in the process of selling our home. We met with the realtor month or couple weeks let's take whatever competent stuff in. We have the potential to meet to get roughly 40 to 50,000 worth of equity based on his estimates. Now it's not final but so we're wondering, what's the best option to use for the equity so I like are both pretty young.

I'm almost 30. My wife 30. We still have a bunch of the loan that about $100,000 worth broken down 50,000 30,000 19,000 and 5000. So what we're wondering is basically three options. One is we really want our next home to be our forever home but that would require using all the equity as like a down payment. The other option would be maybe getting a cheaper home and use all of the equity and that and potentially get a really low monthly payment or the other option would be to do a cheaper home, and maybe use half of the equity towards the outcome of the smaller cilantro we can really take in and of those monthly payments and then use the other half and you know another down payment hoping to get some wise counsel yeah love the way your thinking and sounds like you got great options you all been diligent. I realize the student loan debt is hanging over you. You'd like to get rid of that sooner rather than later. I think the first thing that jumps out at me.

Ryan is perhaps not trying to jump into this idea. You guys are still young. Your building wealth. You've got some good equity in this house but you have this large debt hanging over you not trying to jump into court and call your forever home because that's can require you to perhaps stretch a little bit you know we don't know what the future holds. Perhaps there is an interim step here, which is kind of this next home that would still keep expenses low. Give you the space you need in the area you want to be and where you can go in with you hopefully at least a 20% down payment may be a little bit more. Using this equity that you have keeping your expenses and and lifestyle. At a minimum, so you can really focus on making a concerted effort toward getting the students will student loans paid off if you wanted to do that and again not try to jump to this forever home. What do you think you would want to spend for this, interim home that you'd keep for the next 3 to 5 years. Yeah, we're probably looking around. All right now our monthly payment or mortgages, escrow and all that is 800 a month so that works really well for a budget right now.

So we are looking for something that will essentially equal or be less than that. So wiring is the current home.

Oh that's also good question. We so I I work north of Grand Rapids and just a far drive and so we are hoping that potentially get closer to my employer. I drive almost 40 minutes one way. So yeah our kids are or might youngest is in the process of going you know going to kindergarten next year so we're gonna make the decision on no Christian schooling or public schooling based on budget needs and stuff like that so okay well I think the key is, you know, keeping your expenses right where they are.

You gotta you don't have a huge mortgage payments. You obviously you kept your lifestyle in check, which at this point how much are you able to put toward the student loans. Hopefully something over and above the minimum payment yeah right now are, in a place where only paying minimum every now and then we get a little bit of my my wife's job. Her her pay fluctuated fluctuates on occasion issued hourly, so it will end up using that surplus actually towards the smaller student loan but for the most part were paying minimums on all the loans so it really feels like were trying to make this event and you know we see all the potential equity and really gone then we could really use that. So just that I think the thing I would like to do though is to take all this equity in the home use it to pay off debt.

I realize that would free up a monthly payment and get your part of this paid off, but then you go into this next home without much in the way of equity. I think at a minimum, I'd love for you to know. Try to keep your expenses where they are and still have, you know, I at least 20% equity going into this next home so you don't perhaps you take 10,000 or so and and you know maybe as much is as 20 to to wipe out the smallest one assuming though you could find a place which is probably can be challenging where you can still go in with a 20% down payment and keep your budget in line because you know if your just making enough right now to pay a relatively small mortgage payment and only the minimums on the student loans and were looking at the possibility of adding Christian school on top of that, it sounds like were going to have some budget challenges so I don't think we can increase just based on what I know today, the overall that your spending toward the principal, interest, taxes and insurance, which means you may just have to you make a lateral move closer to work but roughly the same amount the same size home same price point pile that equity back in and just wait for your income to grow.

Keep your lifestyle in check live on carefully defined and controlled spending plan so that as your income goes up we don't increase lifestyle were really focused on sending more and more to the student loans and once we get that paid way down. Then were starting to think about, you know, jumping to this forever home because you have more money at that point as the student loan payments come off so I don't think were making the jump to know this house that's gonna last year. Real long time. I think you're probably making a lateral move, and pollen that equity back in a just and focused on paying the loans off as quick as you can Ryan. We appreciate your phone call today and we wish you and your family the very best. Thanks, Dallas, Texas, Jenny, go right ahead is have a good life financially.

I and I keep track of everything and and morning Mike, I'm single so I've been single for four years and I was reading in my divorce care book about EM budget and how detailed some of the budgets can't can be and I don't have that written out like that. I'm just wondering considering I have access from my pension security each month. Based on my my lifestyle and pretty forgot and black. Is it important to get like really specific with the budget. That's my first question should I go with that kind of detail or right now I just have Mike Collins with the monthly regular expenses in clothing and groceries and Gaston miscellaneous how to extent that think things like that. Well it sounds to your first question, Jenny.

It sounds like you're living fairly frugally, your budget is relatively simple. Could anyone and everyone benefit from a spending plan. Yes, absolutely. But it doesn't have to be complex. You have to find something that's gonna work for you or else it's not sustainable and you know for those unless you really want to track it using the smart phone app or something like that, really, that the discretionary items not the bills but the spending portion of your budget is where things can get out of control so you know once you have your you know utility payment every month and you much know what it is based on the season and you know what you can spending Gaston you know what the you know some of these more fixed expenses are to be once those fit into the budget you've done that once you can forget about him, really, in some cases I think those categories that tend to be the problem areas are the discretionary ones. It could be. It's different for each person could be eating out. It could be clothing. It could be vacations. That's where you benefit from your funding and envelope either physically or virtually, and then using that as a guide to say when it's gone, it's gone and that's all I'm going to spend for the month on those particular categories. Or, you know, for vacations, I met up with X amount a month in and then you know based on the plans I have for the year. I'm only gonna spend that amount. You know a couple times a year when I take a trip to see family or go away with some friends or something.

Yeah but you don't have to be elaborate again. You want to be a careful steward of God's money. It sounds like you're doing that and you want to find a system that works for you. And beyond that, you know, I think anything else is unnecessary. Frankly well I thank you. Your think you Jenny. We got just about 30 seconds left. Did you have just a quick follow-up call back and I do not have that nursing home insurance, long-term care insurance kind of a mixed bag of both saying yes yes it's a good idea. More saying, wait you okay let me just give a quick comment on that you hold the line will talk off their but you know I'm generally in favor of it between ages 55 and 65, that 66 that still look at it. It's gotta fit into the budget though because it doesn't make sense to take on long-term care which can be costly. Long-term care insurance.

If you cannot, you're going to drop it down the road so I'd start by just getting some quotes from an insurance agent who specializes in this area so you begin to understand and at least you've looked at it and if it fits into the budget. It can be well worth the expense of Jenny.

We appreciate your call today. Thank you very much and thank you again. As I mentioned for tuning in this thing of being a part of the program moneywise live as a partnership between Moody radio and moneywise media and view our listeners around West time Steve Moore hoping you and yours have a wonderful remainder of the day, then join us again next

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