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Tax Scams to Avoid

MoneyWise / Rob West and Steve Moore
The Truth Network Radio
March 8, 2021 7:03 am

Tax Scams to Avoid

MoneyWise / Rob West and Steve Moore

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March 8, 2021 7:03 am

We always need to be on the lookout for potential identity theft scams so we can avoid them. But this becomes increasingly important during tax season, when dangerous tax related scams are on the rise. On the next MoneyWise Live, hosts Rob West and Steve Moore share some things you need to know about these scams. Then it’s your calls and questions on the financial matters you’d like to discuss. Tax scams to avoid on the next MoneyWise Live at 4pm Eastern/3pm Central on Moody Radio. 


This is Doug Hastings, VP of Moody radio and were thankful for support from our listeners, and businesses like United faith mortgage mortgage commercials are rarely exciting. So to make it slightly more interesting. Here my nieces to do it for me. Interest rates continue to drop like my sister's baby teeth, uncle Larry had still not scared. It was rates are boring. Talk historically low and now this year is even more boring. Talk historically lower than the previous point talk historically low sounds boring for so many listeners who just wanted to deal at refinancing right now could see the amount of light rates have gotten that some borrowers could potentially save hundreds monthly and tens and tens of thousands over the life of the loan, and that he didn't put 20% down before somebody ends up having to pay PMI gave uncle Brian I sent we are United faith mortgage United faith mortgage is a DBA of United mortgage Corp. 25 Millville Park Rd., Millville, NY license mortgage banker for licensing information, go to an MLS consumer corporate MLS number 1330. Equal housing lender not licensed in Alaska, Hawaii, Georgia, Massachusetts, North Dakota, South Dakota and Utah approaches were reminded of the saying of the taxman, but this year there's something else to worry about because the conmen come to this text should watch out for some new, some whole. Today was to know that your calls and financial 55 7805 five 7000 times more scams to avoid tax season is stressful enough, but now we have to deal with scammers to.

Unfortunately, yes. But as clever as these conmen are these days.

Steve you can avoid their snares by being vigilant, so there's really no need to pick okay let's get started. To see what's the first item in the scammers bag of dirty tricks. Yeah, this one's been around a while and it's gradually gotten worse. It's a form of identity theft and let's call it tax refund fraud is what happens. A crook gets a hold of your Social Security number and files a false tax return to get a refund will usually file electronically making up a bunch of numbers to make it look like you have low income and a whole lot of deductions to get a bigger refund having your social. They can also open up a bogus bank account and receive the refund by direct deposit or they'll use a temporary address to get a paper check. Then when you file your legitimate return. The IRS rejects it because someone else is already filed using your defecation or information at that point you'll have to claim fraud with the IRS and go through their process to fix it, which unfortunately can take months.

Well that's not very nice okay so how do you prevent this from happening, file early.

Well that's probably a good idea, but there's something even better you can sign up to get an identity protection pin number from the IRS to use when filing your return.

Scammers won't have it. Of course, so they can't filing your name will have a link for that in today show notes, the great I what was I called again a identity protection pin number you think of it like you freezing your credit report. Except this one is for the IRS okay great information. What's next, what's the other scam or other scams that you have on your list. Yeah that would be the W-2 email phishing scam reports. That's fishing with a pH we talk about this often. This is when crooks use a fake email to trick you into giving them your financial information well with the W-2 version crooks are targeting you directly, at least at first. Instead they send the fishing email to your company's payroll or HR department claiming to be a company executive, sometimes even the CEO. The email asked for sensitive W-2 data, which unfortunately those departments sometime provide to the crux having that information greatly increases the crooks odds of getting fraudulent refunds now there's not much you can do about this one, except inquire at your company about steps they are taking to prevent getting taken in a fishing email scam yeah and if nothing else, I would suspect that this will at least alert them to the problem so they can take some steps okay what's next what this next Wednesday was called ghost tax preparers.

That's just another name for a faker fly-by-night tax preparer who takes your money and most likely falsifies your return getting you in trouble with the IRS. Typically, the ghost prepare won't sign the return. The IRS says that any tax preparer who doesn't sign and put down their preparer tax identification number is breaking the law sometimes will base their fee on a percentage of your refund, meaning they'll think things like claiming bogus deductions to make it look like you're getting a bigger refund than you're entitled to. So always ask for a tax preparer ID number before hiring someone to do your taxes, the IRS is an online directory where you can verify that your preparer is legitimate and again that will be in our show notes as well. Maybe they should call it the ghost cluster directory exactly right time for one more, this would be your typical IRS phone scam someone calls you claiming to be an IRS agent and says you have them, or you have a tax bill that you haven't paid the caller then threatens to seize your bank accounts and have you arrested. If you don't pay immediately. That panics a lot of people and how they want you to pay will get this, usually by buying some type of gift card and then giving them a 16 digit card number, which enables them to use the card.

Of course it's all fake. You should just hang up in any time and somebody mentions gift card or if the IRS is calling you which they don't do without mailing you first.

Well you know it's something that isn't a scam it's our number give us a call 800 557 with us today moneywise. The wonderful thing wherever you are. The sun is shining and well Rob rest Rob rest I'm a semi professional radio announcer apparently not on Mondays. Try this again. Rob West is his name of the regular spelling with the W in front W EST and is taking your financial calls today on anything 800-525-7000 before we go there. The Rob know we did have some Facebook. I responses to their Facebook question was if you've ever received a call or an email from a scam artist.

How did you respond to and manual says not very smart. I guess I failed miserably. Luckily it wasn't too much money that it wasn't too much money that I lost so we hope we didn't lose too much there.

Anna says I usually don't answer if I don't know the number. If one comes through.

I try not to say a lot as I know they have the ability to take snippets from what I say for their own use and that is absolutely true. John says I hang up and block that number. Sandy says once I reported to the police, but mostly I hang up. Doug says I'm not very kind. I cut them off and hang up. Is this Christlike.

Well, we don't know. I think you probably have to pray about that. Doug see what the Lord tells you and then ash us as I share the gospel and I'm not sure whether those folks hang up on Asha or not, but that's always a good thing. But generally speaking, Rob.

We don't like to engage those folks at any level duly know.

I mean, obviously if it's somebody that is using tactics that would most often be used with a scam of some kind. You want to disconnect immediately and you want to keep from saying. If anything, if possible, and then I like the idea of blocking that number which is becoming more more easy to do these days, so this is just a part unfortunately of the times in which we live, both via telephone and now more commonly online through email and through malware on your computer.

You folks are contacting you through a variety of means you just have to be on your guard the wine so trust the Lord. But do your part. Yeah these are not things we recommend that these are things we've heard in the past, just passing on some some information as we hear it as we find it. I've heard of someone who gets their dog to start barking in the in the phone receiver read back at the the bad guys I've heard from someone who just screams at some your piercing level into their phone may break the phone as well. You want to be careful and I think we got this call.

Once in the program someone uses an air horn when they realize that there are scammers on the and again were not unending, and I certainly don't endorse those approach for the Cigna though it might affect.

But one thing that might've been semi interesting, not that we recommend it, of course, that is what we do recommend 800-525-7000.

If you want to speak with Rob West today about anything financial and I can tell just by looking at him. He's loaded for bear.

Let's begin a masculine Ohio hi Gary, how can we help different between mutual fund and damages of each. Yeah, that's a great question, Gary, and that you know ETF's obviously have become much more popular as of late. Were seeing more and more exchange traded funds in the mix, primarily because of the other lower cost and you can buy into them during the day because they trade with the market and that really is the key differentiator I Gary with between a mutual fund and ETF and that is that a mutual fund you buy based on the net asset value and you can only buy and when the market is closed so they take the total amount of the assets the holdings and they come up with what's called a net asset value at the end of every day, and then you can buy into more shares of that fund, or you can redeem shares of your existing shareholder and then you would own a piece of that mutual fund with an exchange traded fund same idea in that it's a pooled investment product where you owned a number of investments inside the investment.

So you're properly diversified. At least yelp to begin with, you need to look at your overall portfolio to make sure it's the right allocation, but it's a way to own a number of investments in a pool but within ETF the trades like a stock so it would trade on a major index, typically with a buy and sell order as that market is open ETF's tend to be more tracking type investments, not all, but they tend to either track a market index or some other tracking tool there's ETF's to track the price of commodities like an ETF that tracks the price of gold, whereas mutual funds can be trackers to a particular index or they can be actively managed and what that just means is you're buying into it to get a pooled investment where a money manager is using his or her expertise to buy and sell investments inside the mutual fund based on the strategy that's outlined in the prospectus and so you would be investing in a particular fund because you believe they have the ability to outperform the index in their particular slice of the of the stock market. So one is not better than the other. They are different, but in that you're looking to try to get a basket of investments. You know they can both be very very effective. So I think it always comes down Gary to what is your investment strategy, which will always relate to your age, your risk tolerance your goals and objectives and then do you want an actively managed portfolio that an investment professional can manage on a separate basis buying individual stocks and bonds or do you want to do it through pooled investment like a mutual fund with an active manager or you want to basically buy into the market indexes. Whether that's the stock or the bond market which you can do through mutual funds or ETF's and typically in terms of their fee structure. The ETF's are going to be the lowest cost of the only other thing I would say about mutual funds that you need to be aware of is that there are many classes of the mutual funds and they have different fee structures associated with them so you need to understand the structuring of the mutual fund before you go into it to know are you paying the loader commission on the front end of the backend. Your what is the management fee that's built into it and are there sales charges incited or marketing fees like what are called 12 B-1 fees so hopefully that's a bit of a primer on what these are and I think for more information you can visit with our friends and sound mind and read some of their great articles on these topics, Gary.

We appreciate that and we wish you the best as you work through that lesson we know what works through a break right now and then will come back and speak with Jordan we have an interesting email to from a couple who want to leave a large inheritance to their son concerned about the best way to do that to help them not hurt him in your calls as well. 800-525-7000. We have multiple open lines. So now was a great time to give us a call back moneywise getting out of debt, managing what you have teaching your children about money balancing your checkbook or balancing your project. I give us a call. Would love to try to help you with that today it's one 805 five 7000 number of open lines available to you right now 800-525-7000. If you'd like to say hi to Rob West. I let's continue on down to Fort Lauderdale Jordan. What's the situation you're dealing with.

How can we help I meant we had executed the quote that wrong way not access so I don't think about it some surgery, yet very good.

Well, you know, the, the IRS will never call you first. Without first sending you something by the snail mail through the regular mail to alert you to a problem or an issue and what I want you know is that you're describing a common theme in many of these scams, which is they will say that your Social Security has been linked to some type of illegal activity, usually in another state and often related to a crime that has occurred, they might say there was a crime and there was a car recovered in your Social Security number was in that car, something like that in they'll want you to do something in response to that it could be to verify your information they might tell you that you need to send money they might tell you that some kind of benefits or entitlements might be suspended. The bottom line is if if any of that is being communicated over the phone that your Social Security number was involved in something like that just immediately hang up that that is a scam. Jordan if there was something legitimate related to the IRS that is going on with your particular file there to contact you by the mail. You can be assured of that and then you can respond by calling them with the number on the information that would be the same number that you could verify online as to be the customer service line for the Internal Revenue Service, so I would disregard it. Based on what I'm hearing. Don't take those calls so quickly can disconnect them and don't ever give them any information or send the money Jordan good for you for catching that. Thank you very much for your call today in your warning to others.

800-525-7000 Chicago. You have a question, yes. So I have a an IRA account with the brokerage firm and I also have a just regular brokerage there that I keep my savings and like my emergency savings driver connected to my bank account like get the money in and out of my needed my question is would it be better since I'm on 60 years old to be able to just put it in the IRA words are in a little bit better money and if I needed to take some out for emergency type situation, or if I were you. My income was broken for a period of time for lost work or something there be any penalties or any any any reason why would want to do that. Yeah so you said you're 60 years old, so this is money that you have already put in the IRA that you want to cut your mark for emergencies are you looking to add additional funds to the IRA for this purpose know I was going to put it in the IRA instead of keeping it in the invite. My non-IRA brokerage account.

I see and so making that contribution to a traditional IRA as long as you still have earned income you're still working as a right yes okay yeah so you can make contributions to the IRA up to the limits as always you know your income is not such that it's beyond the threshold that would permit you to make that contribution.

But if your income is in the right range and your contributing up to the maximum you can contribute each year is no problem making that contribution and then when you take any of that money out because you got the deduction you're going to pay it no income tax on it. Now the question though is should the IRA be the proper place for the appropriate place for your emergency savings and on the say no to that tear. You know, it is much as it might be frustrating especially in this interest-rate environment to watch it sitting there earning you know maybe 1/2 of 1% or a little better deal.

The whole idea is that we want to invest for the long term, and that means we want at least a 10 year time horizon with money that's earmarked you in the stock market you even in the bond portion of your IRA, especially in this environment where interest rates are heading up bond prices are going to be headed down. So if you're having to sell because an unexpected expense comes up, you know you are could find yourself in a situation were you having to sell at a loss and you know that's just not the best place for that type of money because ill unexpected expenses do come up now. It may not be you losing your job, would you be kind of a desperate or dire situation, but it could be that you know an unplanned event happens in your home or in your car.

Now we should be putting some aside for maintenance of those things but we know things can come out of left field. A couple of thousand dollar deductible that we have to pay on a tree falling on a portion of our home or something like that that would be ripe for your emergency funds.

I just don't want you to have to liquidate investments that that might be at an inopportune time. So for me I would just keep that part in that liquid FDIC insured probably online savings account earning .5 .6% and hopefully more than that. Down the road and that way it's readily available with a couple of days worth of waiting for an ACH transfer you get it right in your checking account and then have it ready to go. I realize you may give up some you know if you were to invest that and not need it but at least you know it's there. It's stable and you're not can have to liquidate an investment that's not good timing.

Terry, thank you. We appreciate your phone call today again. Her phone number if you'd like to speak with Rob West about any financial question or worry you might be having. We don't want you to worry.

God's word tells us that there's not a lot of faith in the concept of worrying, but we want to put our trust in God, who was promised to meet all of our needs. And who knows knows the future, which is something we don't know. So again, her phone number 800-525-7000 Rob we haven't chatted for a little bit about the about the brand-new app anything a new and exciting on that front, sir. I yeah there's a lot of exciting things going on with Alton for the benefit of our listeners you if you've not checked out the money was that we'd love for you to do that. We took over a year with a team of developers that are a part of our ministry at moneywise and built what I believe is the best digital envelope system out there.

You can download your transactions automatically categorized into your envelopes and stay on budget. Throughout the month for you and your spouse if you're married he is. You can track what's there or you spend it, not just report on it after the fact. And then there's a community where you can connect with others and are discovered to have all of the best content in biblical finance feeds and in one place to search for moneywise biblical financing graphs. Thanks.

Wrap back and check somewhere with Rob 805 wisdom, faith and finances. This is moneywise live again. Here's her phone number jotted down 800-525-7000 back to her phone stole Ojai oh hello Ken, what's up are you great. Thank you, great. I appreciate your program. I had a quick question concerning retirement. I am trying to get my ducks in a row to retire and my company offers. I have both a 401(k) and also a pension and I'm looking at the options on the pension. There's a lump sum option and then there's of course monthly payments would bear in ovarian percentages. So I'm very intrigued by the lump sum I wanted if you had any feedback concerning the options.

Yeah well yes and you need to really think long and hard about this and understand the options that are available to you and it may make some sense can I think it would if you don't have a financial planning professional you work with to actually go through a financial planning process to make sure all of your ducks are in a row for this season of life and make a really wise decision here.

You know, I tend to like the flexibility that comes with the lump sum payment because you can convert it to an income stream which is what folks are often looking for in this season of money. See season of life.

I should say, but also it gives you the flexibility of being able to access the principal which you know. Also, this is really helpful if for some reason you need to access a major portion of this all at once. I think the other thing to consider is that you know this decision may affect your children as well.

So if you want to leave something behind you.

Once you and your spouse die often the pension payments. On the other hand, with a lump sum distribution you can, of course, name a beneficiary to receive the money that's left after you and your spouse are gone then there's of course the tax implications which will need to think through and and consider you know where folks will take the monthly payout through the the annuitization portion is where there is perhaps a gap between the guaranteed income they're expecting and what they need to cover their bills and their just simply looking for the peace of mind to know they're not going to be responsible for the investments on this and the risk that they'll have to take by investing it, even if they hire somebody did. Someone to do that, they'll know they have a guaranteed payout for them or for them and their spouse for the rest of their lives. That kinda serves as a base of income to know okay lease based on what we know today, the bills are paid and that especially for summary like you who has a 401(k). In addition to that they know that they have this kind of larger amount that's continuing to grow and could be there for you long-term care if that's needed, or some other major expense down the road so there is no that trade-off, and again depends on, which is ultimately going to give you the most peace of mind.

But for me, all things being equal, I like the flexibility in the control that you have by taking the lump sum because then you're really in the driver seat as to how you invest that what you do with regard to an income stream. How you can access it now and how you can pass it on down the road that does not all make sense.

So very much, so that pretty much my thinking.

I was thinking that with the lump.

If I took a monthly and me and my wife would pass away in the near future I'll close payments are gone. So yes I hated thinking that way but the lump sum sounds much more attractive. Yeah well I again I think you need to look at the whole picture and that's really where a financial professional can really shine, but I think you are thinking correctly, in the sense that you have. These are the considerations you need to work through and that's typically where I come down on most of these, but the end of the day you've got a look at the actual numbers because there's because there's going to be an internal rate of return that is going to drive that monthly payout and it could be that you know you're in a much better position in terms of taking that assuming you will live a long time versus you know what you could expect to receive as a reasonable income stream from the lump sum and you gotta compare those two numbers and do the math and just make sure that works in your favor. But if it does, it certainly would afford you a lot more flexibility, so excited for you in this next season of your life that be prayerful as to what the Lord has for you and we appreciate your cold. Thank you. Can God bless you. Let's go to South Florida hello okay you have a question about your your giving how what's the situation. Thank you for taking my call and I really appreciate your spell. I'm pointing outů Last year to cultivate out of the hand that my income really loud but that's part time in a long time I Got it and kill refund late collect tax refund coming because you know I got credit and think that I kind of like a my question is said hi hi pop that we find and in my question. I thought about you printed text, I often tell yeah well I appreciate so much you thinking about this gay because clearly by you even asking the question that you want to honor the Lord with your giving in to acknowledge his provision in all of these situations. And that's certainly the way we should. The approaching all that God entrusted to us. You know when it comes to the tithe. I love that as a principal here we are under the law of Christ, not the law of Moses, so it's less about being legalistic and checking a box and more about an overflow of our gratitude to the Lord and giving is an act of worship. But clearly we see even in the New Testament, we should be systematic givers and I believe that systematic giving should start with the local church were replanted and then we give sacrificially. Beyond that, and applying the principle of the time. The 10th of your increase. I think is a great beginning point for your giving. Now, in terms of what is defined as your increase. I put a lot into that. I mean I would typically put in your Social Security payments and I'd put in no stimulus check coming that's God's provision to you regardless of how it came. It's part of your increase. I would apply the principle of the time there. I would put that on a business where I'm paying myself in a business that I own in distributions, not the gross receipts, but the profit or the income that's coming out of the business back to me I would include that in my increase there be just a couple of his exceptions with regard to defining my increase in a tax refund would be one of them in the sense that if you're already tithing on your gross pay. Then, in the sense you've already given on that money. That's just the return of the money you prepaid to the IRS. The you didn't need to begin it for obvious reasons.

But again, as always, were giving off of the gross then essentially we've Artie tithed on that money.

The only other exception I should say only but one other exception to an increase would be insurance proceeds. The based on a loss that you had where you're getting the oh money sent to you because you damage to your home or a car that was totally some like that, you know that's not really your increase. That's you know you're offsetting a loss that occurred there. So I think in those cases that we wouldn't necessarily apply the principle of the time because it's not really your increase, but I would certainly put the stimulus payments and that if it were me. Okay great question. Thank you very much and we appreciate your heart and generosity there. Thank you again for your call today. Our phone number should you want to speak with Rob West about any financial situation you find yourself in the middle of his 800-525-7000 800-525-7000 can also visit us online to find lots of useful information is moneywise live a Thanksgiving out there today for all of the college program. If someone called Landon Nancy George 805 five 7000, Indianapolis hello Lucy, thanks for your patience with my call is my my topic that 90 lately and you go, but not at giving me the profit sharing link and kind and not paying tax on and I don't want it right that I'm not getting money on yet so I know told him I wanted to Count my my share to him. Yes, I think that's not why I cut he goes well I love how that doubtů Hope hope property. No end in mind in half and no doubt now it he will have to pay tax by AP that if he passed away he can't.

They don't have to pay tax so now I don't know what to do Lucy when your husband passed away. Did this, his portion of the property passed to you for name by so your 50% owner yet. Okay.

Is this an income generating property yet and you're not receiving any of the income now.

Well unfortunately he's not doing the right thing here clearly and he's getting all the benefits and you're getting none.

And on top of that you're paying the taxes for your portion as in a 50% owner which is just not right. And so this needs to be rectified and I realize this can be very difficult because obviously he's manipulating you in the situation, your husband, this is not here to step in and rectify the situation, and he's frankly taking advantage of you based on what you're describing here because he's not 100% owner and so essentially he's taking your portion of the profits which is stealing from you. And on top of that, as I said, you're paying the taxes and so the other. The challenges it's going to involve some relational damage here, but I think you're going to have to assert yourself and you will protect what is rightfully yours because as a steward of God's resources.

He's here unless you decide to give it to him.

It doesn't sound like you, perhaps even have the ability to do that yet.

This is something you were counting on you. You need it.

You certainly don't want to pay tax on it. If you're not getting any benefit from it. So there's no problem with you claiming what is rightfully yours but that's going to involve you. Getting somebody to represent you and help you pursue this deal. Assuming everything was titled properly and has been taking care of your through the probate process and retitled in your name I would engage a real estate attorney that could help you to pursue a remedy to this contact him let him know that what he's doing here is is not right. You could certainly approach him first. If you know what I would be real prayerful about this and start on your knees asked the Lord to give you some wisdom here and approach him and say listen, I realize you're struggling right now. Your business sounds like is not doing well, but at the same time, you're not doing what's right for me.

And note 50% of this is mine. And so I'm entitled to 50% of the income and I'm certainly not can pay the taxes moving forward less. I'm getting my portion and if he's not willing to make good and give you an accounting of what has been paid out, and therefore what you do which you may decide to give him some flexibility on how he makes restitution on that that you're going to need to pursue some legal remedies and if you feel like you that's the step you want to take you want to contact the godly real estate attorney who can be an intermediary, and perhaps help you work through a plan with your brother-in-law to make this right and you can do it in a way that's God honoring that you know and even give him some grace and how that happens.

If he's in a financially difficult spot. But the longer you wait the harder it's going to be to get this back on track so I would pray through it. Decide what you're willing to do what you want the outcome to be approach him with that. Perhaps with one other person or family member or church member of somebody who can provide some accountability and then if that doesn't go well.

I think you need to think and pray about pursuing a legal remedy, and I would contact your church and see if they can give your referral to a real estate attorney and Lucy that legal remedy might just be having your attorney I contact him.

Write him a letter that states what should be done, what has to be done and you don't necessarily have to take it to the nth degree often just hearing that you that you're prepared to take it a step or two steps further is all it's necessary and we know you want to do the godly thing as well so we wish you the best.

Thank you very much very tough situation, Lake Villa, Illinois, Deborah, what your question for Rob West. Thank you for taking my call. Share a brief I returned from taking care of my parents after five years to my house and had a lot of damage to the house, never been left alone wouldn't be why I'm I'm really asking what it be wise to take a loan out from the house and have it repaired and wait for proceeds of the estate to come to me when it can, or should I try to just manage making payments on things until such time it and say and get a state to make sure I understand.

So you sing and bless you for caring for your parents.

During that season really needed you to do that. You said you return home after five years of this is your primary residence that is in need of repair crack okay when you said wait for the estate payout you mean for your parents estate. The proceeds that are coming to you or something else. Okay. All right. Very good.

And do you plan to stay in this home Deborah for the foreseeable future, I get it I get it because I don't feel like a satellite in my family had a lot of repair right but I think the you know if this is a home you're telling me I have no plans on selling and moves unless something changes than they can, but unless something changes. I see myself here 10 years from now that's you would approach the repairs and the renovations differently than if it was something you say I want to get it to where I can sell it and then I want to move on by something else with which would be more accurate.

Okay so I think then the next step is to say yet what is needed. If you've got some some money coming your way and it sounds like you on this home free and clear, is that right now I don't okay right so you got a mortgage on it what what kind of you know of the beyond the mortgage and all your other expenses are you are you just getting by. Every month you have a little bit of margin at the end of the month to me about that.

Well until I went I went to be with my parents. I had my turn now I had to pay for their house and my house while Riley and Karen so I have arm and I pretty much depleted.

When I had okay what about on a monthly basis. Your income minus your expenses. Is there anything left over might not know why I even even the move here kind of really trimming back quite very good. Well, I think the key here is I don't want to put your home at risk. I also don't want you living in that situation it's unsafe. So I think we've got a prioritize what's absolutely necessary, and if the home could be lived in, in others, not mold in the walls are a leaky roof or something that's going to result in further damage to the home, then obviously you'd want to wait and hope that that estate gets settled quickly and then you don't have to add any additional expense, either in closing costs or monthly you know debt service to the budget that's already pretty tight especially with the where savings accounts have been depleted. I think that would be the ideal situation and then you just know soon as you get that money. You have all your contractors lined up you gotten your bids. You know who's doing the work and you're ready to go you with the money that's available. Hopefully that'll take care of those renovations and replenish your emergency savings and you cannot build from there. If you were to say Rob there's some things where it's creating further damage to the home or it's unsafe or unsanitary for me that obviously you not you might want to be looking at a home equity loan, but I would really go into that knowing exactly what that's gonna cost you and make sure that you can cover them on a monthly basis because I wouldn't want there to be a ripple effect that could cause other bills to go unpaid or you to put your home in jeopardy because you're not able to cover the monthly payment so I think my answer is I try to wait and do it out of the estate if at all possible and use the home equity loan is as a last resort. Deborah, thank you very much for your phone call today and we wish you the best as you go forward with that you're listening to moneywise live and were almost done for today but you know someone was asking me recently. Rob, who are these coaches that you guys mention a lot me are they local people are they in another state. Do they work for you.

Can you give us a overview quickly is the only wise coaches are yeah we have a wonderful group of coaches.

These are all volunteers who have said is a part of my ministry. I want to come alongside other believers and help them put spending plans together and develop by giving plan, get set up and answer their questions and would like to do it just as a ministry which means it's free of charge. Apart from a very small amount will ask you to pay for a workbook that said digital workbook. If you can afford and if you can't will even give you that, but that's typically over 6 to 8 weeks meeting with you on line and again helping get everything in order and if you want to connect with one of those coaches just our website moneywise, click the button that says you might expect, connect. Thanks for appreciate that and we appreciate Amy and Dan and Aaron and Jim Henry for their technical assistance today moneywise live is a partnership between Moody radio and moneywise media thanks join us again tomorrow

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