How to Live

Hey, here's a visual concept for you. Think of your money as a pie. It doesn't matter how big the pie is. Now, if the slice you carve out for lifestyle gets too big, then all the other slices have to shrink. It's safe to say that most Americans live on more than they need to. Our culture is built on the idea that more is always better.

The Bible takes a slightly different view. Today, host Rob West welcomes financial expert Ron Blue to talk about our spending choices. Then it's your calls at 800-525-7000.

800-525-7000. I'm Steve Moore. How to live. That's next on MoneyWise Live.

Well, Rob, our friend Ron Blue has written many books on personal finance from a biblical perspective, but today we're taking a deep dive into one chapter in his book, Never Enough, Three Keys to Financial Contentment. Well, that's exactly right, Steve. I didn't realize why you were so excited about today's program, and then I heard pie. I know how you love pie. Rhubarb. Rhubarb is a favorite. We are going to talk about our financial pie today, and in fact, we're going to focus on the live wedge of that pie.

I would say the one that has perhaps the most impact on our success or lack thereof. Ron, welcome back. Good to be here, Rob. Steve.

Nice, Ron. So why Ron is choosing an appropriate lifestyle so important to our financial success? Well, if you think of the pie and if you think of, first of all, there's five wedges to the pie. There's the give wedge, there's the debt wedge, there's the tax wedge, there's the save wedge, and then what's left is the lifestyle wedge. And we're not talking about living expenses. We're talking about lifestyle. People could live on a lot less than what they have established as their lifestyle.

But lifestyle is kind of everything other than those other four pieces. And typically, it represents at least 50% of people's income. And really, the unfortunate thing is, is that it becomes the first priority use of money. And I think the biggest mistake that people make is let's just assume you get a bonus or a raise. And all of a sudden you adjust your lifestyle to that bonus or raise, not thinking about the taxes that have to be paid on that, as well as the giving that needs to be done out of that. So all of a sudden, you're overspending that that bonus or that raise and you're overspending your lifestyle, which means that every other piece of that pie wedge in that pie has to decrease somehow. And that's difficult. Well, it really is. And wouldn't you agree that this is the particular area of our spending that has the tendency to get out of control the quickest?

Oh, for sure. And I think credit card usage has allowed that to happen. You know, it is so easy to spend using credit cards because you don't feel the amount, if you will. I like to humorously say I didn't even know what I needed until I went to the mall.

Yeah. And that's that's part of my lifestyle. Maybe it's clothes, maybe it's electronics, you know, maybe it's eating, maybe it's something that I spend that I don't necessarily need to spend, but I do. And it can get out of control pretty quick unless you have made a determination ahead of time that you are going to control your lifestyle. The beauty of God's word is that it's not prescriptive in this area. It doesn't say exactly what our lifestyle should be. And yet there are clear principles we can pull out that really help put the guardrails around the lifestyle we decide for ourselves or if you're married with your spouse.

We have just about a minute left. Why don't you take us into the first guardrail or principle, if you will, in this area? Well, probably the first guardrail is provision. I am commanded to provide for my family. God's word says that a man is worse than an infidel that doesn't provide for his family. The big issue is what does provision mean?

Okay. And I remember Larry Burkett's teaching on this. He always used to characterize it as a line from poverty to surplus. When do you cross that line? And you're not really providing anymore, but you're trying to protect yourself. And that's God's job. So when do we cross over in terms of our accumulation to taking God's place?

We've got just a few seconds left. Maybe we'll have to pick back up on this. How have you and Judy navigated that and made those decisions? Well, we plan and we plan our lifestyle, but we've been married 55 years now. So it's habitual at this point. Okay. If you wanted to look at our lifestyle expenses, they're pretty consistent over a long, long number of years. Very good.

Nothing wrong with living habitually, as long as those habits are based on God's word. And I suspect when we talked to Ron Blue and his wife, Judy, that that's really the case. This is MoneyWise Live. Your host is Rob West.

I'm Steve Moore, author and teacher Ron Blue with us today. We'll come back and chat some more about lifestyle. What's yours? What's mine?

We'll be right back. Money and life run on the same track. But unfortunately, sometimes it seems like your money is heading in a different direction from your goals. In Never Enough, Three Keys to Financial Contentment, author Ron Blue helps you to break down all your financial options to a basic four, and then shows you how to keep it all chugging along in the right direction on the same track. Never Enough, Three Keys to Financial Contentment, available when you click the store button at MoneyWiseLive.org. For 30 years, Soundmind Investing has been helping Christians reach their financial goals with step-by-step guidance for investors at every stage, from those just getting started to those getting ready for retirement. Through scriptural principles and practical suggestions, SMI offers financial wisdom for living well.

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That's christiancreditcounselors.org, or call 1-800-557-1985. And really nice to have you with us today on MoneyWise Live. Our guest is Ron Blue, and Ron's the author of lots of books.

Splitting Airs is one. The one we're sort of perusing today is titled Never Enough. We're talking about lifestyle today, the largest wedge of your financial pie, if you will.

How do you navigate that? What's the appropriate lifestyle for a Christian? Well, we're diving deep into God's Word to unpack that today with Ron Blue. And Ron, just before the break, you were saying really the first guardrail, if you will, or principle we pull out of Scripture related to lifestyle is this idea of provision that we are to provide for our families.

And yet, you mentioned there's a tension in that. Where do you find the balance between providing and perhaps over-accumulating or having a surplus? And that's really where the rubber meets the road. You were talking about, you and Judy, over many years have worked that out for yourselves in prayer and conversation. But this really becomes very specific when we're making decisions, like buying a house.

How many square feet is too much and how much is okay? Is that just something each person needs to establish their own conviction about? Yeah, it really is.

And you put your finger on it. It's a conviction issue. And I often say that, you know, if the Bible said thou shalt spend thirty-eight point seven percent of adjusted gross income on your lifestyle, it would be really helpful because that's what we would do. But the Bible says the just shall live by faith. So I need to establish a lifestyle that I believe is appropriate as God has blessed me. Just because he gives me more money doesn't necessarily mean that he wants me to increase my lifestyle.

So if this is not a matter of prayer and conversation, husband and wife and development through scripture of conviction, there's no stopping point. And that's the hard thing is I like to say that you need to answer the question, how much is enough? How much is enough for a lifestyle? We can afford perhaps a lot, but that's not the issue.

You know, when you go to the bank and borrow money, typically they'll say you can't afford and they'll tell you how much you can borrow. That's not necessarily the right amount. So if we don't spend time listening to what our God tells us and how husband and wife will agree together, then we're never ever going to stop and we'll continue to spend it. Frankly, I think God gives Americans especially an overabundance of money, and one of the reasons for that is the giving. You know, we're facing a lot of issues right now where there's a lot of people with a lot of need. So perhaps I could adjust my lifestyle in order to give to people that have a much greater need than what I have. Yeah, that's very good. Well, let's continue to unpack these principles because I think perhaps this second principle will help to rein in our lifestyle as well.

We'll stay in the book of 1 Timothy, we move from provision to contentment. Yeah, and that's the big one. You know, as a financial planner, I can run the numbers and I can tell when someone's financially independent or when I'm financially independent or when I have enough, but you can't feel it.

Okay, I can put it on paper, I can put it on a spreadsheet, and I know that intellectually it's enough. You know, I've known millionaires and billionaires and they never feel rich. Okay, they know they are, but it's not a feeling. However, contentment is a feeling. Contentment is an attitude.

It's a sense of I know when I'm content because when I'm content, the attractions that might cause me discontent are not attractive. I like to think and believe that there are billions of dollars being spent today to make me discontent. It's called advertising.

It's called advertising. So if we don't choose to be content, and the Bible says this, be content with what you have. So the answer to the question is how much is enough right now is what I have. I can be content with that because God has provided it. Now that doesn't mean that he won't provide more, but it does mean that I choose contentment right where I am, right now, and I think with what we're facing with all kinds of crises, medical crises, hurricane crises, political crises, and a lot of things, it's easy to get discontent. I was in a conversation yesterday with five or six very wealthy people who were looking at all of the reasons to be discontent. Well, businesses are struggling and families are struggling and children are struggling, but I can choose to be content. Ron, would you say that one of the biggest enemies of contentment is comparison? As we look down the street at our neighbors, even other members in the body of Christ, and we see what they have, and then we don't have that, and then we didn't know we were discontent until we started looking around, right? Oh, absolutely, Steve. I think if we look around, we'll be discontent, but if we look at God's word, I think we can choose contentment, but it's really, really easy to become discontent. Some more than others.

My wife is probably less attracted to things than what I am. I wish Apple had never been invented. Technology makes me discontent, which is why they come out with a new phone every year. That's right. That's right. And I haven't had a new one for a year now.

And for some reason, the old one just doesn't work quite as well as soon as the new one comes out. That's right. All I have to do is talk to you, Rob.

That's great. Let's move along. So we talked about this principle of provision. We've talked about contentment. The third principle that we really apply in this area of lifestyle may surprise some folks, and it's enjoyment. It is enjoyment, and it says there that God gives us richly all things to enjoy.

Now, that doesn't mean that I choose a luxurious lifestyle, if you will. It means that I enjoy his provision. When I say enjoy his provision, if my wife and I have thought through what does provision mean for our family? Does it mean private schools? Does it mean a second home? Does it mean a new car every other year?

What does provision mean? And if I don't set some guardrails on that, the word you used earlier on, I can become discontent, and therefore I can't enjoy what God has provided. Discontentment is the enemy of enjoyment. It's interesting. If we think about it this way, that every spending decision is a spiritual decision, and you've taught us that for years, then if we look at this, there's nothing more spiritual about giving than taking a vacation, if I'm doing it in the context of a plan and doing it to build memories with my family.

Is that true? Oh, for sure. I think vacation is a great illustration. You know, if I've planned for my vacation, if I've saved for my vacation, then I should enjoy my vacation, because God has provided that. Where the discontent comes is when I don't plan for it. And then all of a sudden, the spending of money on a vacation puts me in a foul mood, perhaps. Christmas is another one.

Boy, if I don't set some limits at Christmas, it's really easy to overspend at Christmas, especially when you've got five children and thirteen grandchildren and one great-grandchild. I love it. Well, Rod, you've taught us for years that God's Word is always right, it's always relevant, it's never going to change, and that's certainly been true today as we've applied His timeless wisdom to these decisions we make every day and lifestyle. Thanks for being here.

Oh, what a joy. Thank you for asking me. Provision, contentment, and enjoyment, three biblical guardrails to keep your lifestyle from getting out of control.

Ron Blue has written a book about this. It's called Never Enough, and you'll find it at MoneyWiseLive.org. Your call is next.

Stick around. Do you know if you have enough? Enough money? Enough house?

Do you know how much is enough? If not, Ron Blue can help with his book Master Your Money, a step-by-step plan for experiencing financial contentment. Learn how to save, invest, and give wisely, how to create a long-term financial plan, and how to get out of debt.

You'll find it all in Master Your Money by Ron Blue, available when you click the Store button at MoneyWiseLive.org. I want you to look at irrevocable in verse 29. It says this, For God's gifts and His call are irrevocable.

I don't know many more encouraging words than that. Irrevocable is something that we understand a little bit better, but that, without repentance, is exactly what it's saying. I've got the Greek word down there for you. Very often in a compound word, when you see the A on the front of, not always by any stretch, but when an A is on front of another compound, a word that it's compounded with, it means no, not, or without. So put that in that first blank, A meaning no, not, or without.

In other words, there's no, whatever, not, whatever, or without, whatever. The rest of that word, if you see it in the transliteration we have in the lay scope form, M-E-T-A-M-E-L-E-T-A, it means to be sorry afterwards. To be sorry afterwards. God was not sorry afterwards that He saved your scrawny neck. It's not sorry afterwards that He called you. He's not. He hasn't finally done it.

Listen, if you could finally do it, I surely would have finally done it. So you need to understand that these words are not just to the nation of Israel. The gifts and calling of God, that gifts charisma. Gifts and calling of God are irrevocable without repentance.

There's not a single person He ever saves that He's sorry that He did. Beth and Tim are thankful for the grace gift to serve you. Your letters, prayers, and support are a vital part of this program. To request this month's thank you gift, text the word gift to 57682. Again text G-I-F-T to 57682 or go to Bethmoor.org forward slash donate.

That's Bethmoor.org forward slash donate. The financial wealth you leave behind could be the best thing that ever happened to your loved ones or the worst. In splitting heirs, giving your money and things to your children without ruining their lives, Ron Blue explains why it's important to make these decisions now instead of forcing your heirs to do it later.

Splitting heirs will foster a real appreciation for the precious resources that God has entrusted to you. And it's available when you click the store button at MoneyWiseLive.org. And we're back with you today.

It's MoneyWise Live with Rob West. I'm Steve Moore. We've been chatting a bit with our good friend, author, teacher, Ron Blue. And you know, I just love it when Ron joins us because he's a man who's been around this for quite a while. He has great wisdom, not only of what's in the Bible, but just of human nature and people and the way we respond. And you just always learn something from him whenever he's around, you know?

Well, that's exactly right, Steve. And I love this topic of lifestyle. You know, it's the one area that will trip up most people when it comes to experiencing God's best with his resources. And it's living beyond his provision. And, you know, we spent a good bit of time talking about this idea of contentment, which I believe is one of God's big ideas when it comes to managing his money. Are we willing to live within God's provision and not outside of it, which we're able to do through the use of credit and ultimately something called debt? Are we willing to be satisfied with what God has provided right now and operate within the context of that? And do we have a plan to do that so that we can live out our values, have some margin, not have the stress that comes from living right up against the edge? And are we supporting our goals, starting with our giving goals, but then our savings goals and other goals related to how we feel like God is leading? You know, all of that fits within the context of, I believe, God's plan for our money. And that's what we talk about each day here on the program.

So, yeah, really a valuable discussion today. And hopefully we can continue that with our listeners. Okay, let's do that. One more time, the phone number, because we have a number of open lines available to you right now, 800-525-7000. Let's begin. Oahu, Hawaii. Joseph, how are things today in sunny Hawaii, sir?

Very sunny, very warm. I want to thank you gentlemen for your show and want to thank you for taking my call. I've called you before. And today I got a quote about refinancing. Currently, I have a 3% loan and the balance that we house is $530,500.

And I talked to the gentleman yesterday, and they can re-finance me 2.375% and 2.79%. Joseph, we're losing you just ever so slightly. Oh, I'm sorry. No, that's okay.

Just try to maybe relocate a few feet in one direction or the other, see if you can get a stronger signal. And why don't you just back up and give me the value of the home, the mortgage, and then pick up from there with the interest rate. Okay, the value, what the home can sell for, you mean?

Yes, sir. Yeah, the value is right around 800,000. Okay. And then we owe just 503,000 on it right now.

All right. The loan is at 3% interest. So they were saying that they could refinance at 2.375%. So I know you guys always say that you never should make a refinance a term back up above what you currently are on it. We still have six years on the loan we have now.

My question to you is, we could obviously save money if it was a three-year loan and, more importantly, save interest on a loan. Do you think that refinancing or mortgage companies, they let us do a six-year loan, the term the same as we have now? Yeah. Did you say they will let you do a new 26-year term? Well, I'm asking if that's a normal thing or they don't normally do that. Probably not.

Typically not. And if you try to do even a 25-year, you're going to limit your options. You could do a 20-year, you could certainly do a 15, but that's probably going to drive your payment up considerably higher and push it probably outside of what's reasonable in your budget. Just my guess. I'm also questioning this interest rate.

So you're being quoted 2.375 on a new 30-year refi. Is that right? Correct. Okay.

Yeah, I would be a little suspect of that. I mean, the only way you're going to get that low in this even low, low interest rate environment is by buying that rate down significantly. What kind of discount points are they talking about on this loan? Well, what they on the sheet, the estimate he sent me, the discount points, it says 0.017%. Okay.

Yeah, I would be surprised at that because that rate just sounds unusually low. So you have a good faith estimate with all the estimated closing costs, the actual APR, everything is all spelled out on the documents? Yes, sir. Okay.

Yeah. So that would be something that I'd be interested in having perhaps one of our coaches take a look at just to see what those numbers look like. The thing that I would be concerned about is, again, yeah, you'd be starting over in terms of the length of this mortgage. So you're extending it for years. And one of the challenges with that is not just these extra four years, but the way an amortized loan works is you pay the most toward interest in the early years. And in the years leading up closer to paying it off is when the majority of it is going to principal. And so you're kind of resetting that clock, if you will, where the vast majority of your payment is going to be going to interest you by starting back in a new 30 years. The other thing is, I'm questioning that rate just because that's unusually low for a refi, even in this environment, without you buying it down significantly, which would be very costly on a half a million dollar loan. And the other thing is we like to see at a minimum a savings of a point, you know, maybe even a little bit more, especially if you don't know that you're going to stay in the home for a long time. But even then, you know, it's really going to be a function of what are those closing costs, which can run 2% and higher. And at 2%, we're talking about $10,000 on a, you know, half a million dollar loan, you know, and you've got to then make that up in the form of reduced interest, which there is a reduction there clearly. But the question is, what does that break even point? And so I think you need to do a couple of things. Number one is do some analysis on what is the break even based on the amount of savings.

Could you go with a new 25 year mortgage instead of a 30 and look at your options there and then have somebody else, perhaps a friend, a mortgage broker or one of our coaches, take a look at whether they can look at that good faith estimate and just get a better feel for what are the actual costs you have that you will incur for this mortgage and get the answers to those questions before you decide how you're going to proceed. Joseph, nice talking with you again, sir. Have a great remainder of your day in sunny Hawaii and we'll be right back. Investing is more than just returns. It's an expression of who you are and what you value. Does the way you invest your money reflect your identity as a Christian? At Eventide, we design investments for performance and a better world so you can invest with a confidence to reach your financial goals while remaining true to your Christian values and commitments. We call this investing that makes the world rejoice. More is available at investeventide.com.

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Call 800-791-6225 or visit chministries.org. Hi, my name is William, a communications major at Moody Bible Institute. The Moody Radio Verse of the Week is found in Proverbs 10, 4-5. A slack hand causes poverty, but the hand of the diligent makes rich.

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Go to mymoodyradio.org, mymoodyradio.org. Do you know if you have enough? Enough money? Enough house? Do you know how much is enough? If not, Ron Blue can help with his book, Master Your Money, a step-by-step plan for experiencing financial contentment. Learn how to save, invest, and give wisely, how to create a long-term financial plan and how to get out of debt.

You'll find it all in Master Your Money by Ron Blue, available when you click the Store button at moneywiselive.org. With SRN News, I'm John Scott. Tonight's vice presidential debate in Salt Lake City. Each candidate will have a clear petition on the side of their desk that faces each other, and they will be spaced more than 12 feet apart.

No petition between the candidates and the moderator. The former Minneapolis officer charged with murder and the death of George Floyd has posted bond and been released from prison. According to court documents, Derek Chauvin posted a $1 million bond. He had been in custody at the state correctional facility in Oak Park Heights. Chauvin and three other former officers are scheduled to stand trial in March.

Those three officers all previously posted bond. And a hurricane watch for Hurricane Delta issued for the northern Gulf Coast from High Island, Texas, eastward to Grand Isle, Louisiana. Stocks closing higher today. The Dow was up 530 points. The NASDAQ up 210.

This is SRN News. Hey, thanks so much for joining us today. We hope you're having a good day wherever you are. Here's our phone number if you'd like to chat a bit.

800-525-7000. Taking your financial calls on any topic of interest to you. Let's continue on Spokane, Washington. Hello, John. How can we help? Yes, sir. Thank you for the call here. I volunteer at a recovery center.

It's a mission, Union Gospel Mission Center. I help the men in recovery with just setting up budgets, helping them understand some principles of financial management. But one thing that has consistently come up that I don't have much depth in is their debt side of the equation. And these guys were in this program for 18 months with very sporadic income from day one to month 18. And they now the problem is their credit scores are low, but they need to get meant, which sometimes triggers a credit check. I'm wondering, are there some ways to help them improve their credit score over a period of 18 months when they can't really commit to regular payments on their existing debt? And I did look at Experian. They have a program called Boost, but I'm a little wary of that. I wondered if you have any experience with any of that.

Yeah. Well, John, unfortunately, there's not a silver bullet here in terms of improving a credit score in any company that tells you, apart from the bureaus themselves, anybody who tells you they can help you do that by paying a fee, I would run far from that because there's nothing you can't do yourself, no cost. And it really is just a function of being an on time payer and keeping your debt levels below 30% of the limit. Let me ask you, given the fact that you're saying most of them come into this program with debt and they have sporadic income while they're in the program, are you saying that they're often finding themselves unable to make the minimum payments, therefore getting into a past due or delinquent status during the time they're there? Yeah, definitely. Most of them are almost all of their debt is delinquent when they get here.

They've been on the streets and addicted and so forth. Yeah. Got it. Okay. Yeah. So I think about the best thing you could do. And by the way, I love the work that you're doing.

It's incredible. I think, you know, after they get out of this program and begin a recovery phase and trying to repair their financial situation, I realize the reality is they need to be able to get an apartment and that will be difficult with a poor credit score unless they're able to put up a couple of months, you know, as security. I think, you know, beyond that, getting them assuming they can find a job where they've got now all of a sudden some reasonable and expected income, getting them into a credit counseling program if the accounts are still active, they haven't been sold to a collection agency would be a great option just because that closes the accounts, gets them on a monthly payment they can afford and is actually, through the reduction of the interest rates, going to help them begin to make some progress. And the combination of those balances becoming on time again and headed, you know, in the right direction, meaning the balances are actually being reduced, that's going to begin this process of repairing and restoring the credit over time.

But it's not going to happen quickly. And a great resource for that is christiancreditcounselors.org, christiancreditcounselors.org. Now, Experian Boost factors in your utility and telecom payments. That probably wouldn't be a factor here just because they've been living in the home. Obviously, once they establish service with a utility company, telephone company, you know, once they get out, you know, the boost actually brings those in which typically those had not historically been a part of the credit scoring equation because they just weren't being reported to the credit report. But given those other pieces, if they're on time, again, that's where that can be helpful. But all of this is going to be after the fact and it's not really going to help them as they're emerging from this program because these things are going to be once they establish new service, once they get into the apartment, once they get a job, once they start paying now on these debts, you know, the credit score is going to repair itself over time. So it doesn't mean it's not possible to get into an apartment with credit that's been destroyed. They're obviously just going to have to come up with a little bit more upfront, which I know is going to be a challenge.

But apart from that, there really is not a solution that is going to repair that credit score any quicker than that, unfortunately. Does that all make sense, though? Yeah, it very much does. And that's pretty much what I was expecting. But, you know, not being an expert on the debt side, I just I figured, well, if there is if there is another way you guys would know about it.

Yeah, well, I appreciate you checking. I will say one thing that they could do again, once they get into the apartment, once they get a job, mention a secured credit card to them, because they probably won't nor would we want them to be going out looking for new credit. But a secured card, again, once they can put a little savings aside, if they could put, let's say, three hundred dollars on deposit, get a credit card against that with a limit equal to that amount on deposit, which is, again, what securitizes the card, then they could begin using that for budgeted monthly recurring expenses, paying it off in full every time. And that's going to be reported to the credit bureau as an on-time payment. And if they ever charge it up to the 300 and don't pay it back, well, then the bank will just take the 300 to satisfy it. But the idea there is for somebody who has poor credit, that's a way to begin to reestablish it.

So, again, none of these things are going to be quick, but hopefully these are some steps that will help you move in the right direction. John, we appreciate your heart and the ministry God's given you. I tell you what, stay on the line. Let's get your mailing address. I'd like to send you a couple of copies of the Financial Stewardship Bible, perhaps a copy for yourself, and maybe God will direct you to give the other copy to someone else who you think will read it, someone else who might be helped. But it's just our way of saying thanks for what you do, John, and we're glad that you're you're a listener and that you got through today. Thanks very much.

Eight hundred, five to five, seven thousand, Aurora, Illinois. Mark, what's going on in your life, sir? Daily life is just kind of one of those axes that grind.

Yes, I know. Moody's Verse of the Week is Proverbs 10, 4, and 5, talking about the sluggard and the one who works hard. So your guys' discussion point is contentment with finances and how God will bless you when you steward his money as well. My question is, I have a large family and I have a full-time job and I've been riding this just barely keeping above water for better than 30 years. How do you continue to be content with that?

Yeah. Well, you know, I think the starting point there, Mark, is just to recognize what you have, beginning with God's grace and his incredible demonstration of generosity with his Son on the cross. I mean, I think for all of us that has to be the beginning point to recognize we only can give back to the Lord, but it's so meager compared to what has already been done on our behalf. And accepting that free gift of eternal life is really the beginning place. I think beyond that, we have to begin to explore what it looks like to be grateful for the blessings that we've received, our health and our family. You mentioned you've been blessed with a large family.

We've got to look at that. And all of us, I'm talking to myself as well, and perhaps in certain seasons even getting a gratefulness journal out just before you go to bed to write down the things that you're thankful for. I think we've got to reshape our mind around that and then recognize there's different seasons. And the apostle Paul said, I've learned what it means to be content in times of plenty and in times of want. And that's something that's learned. It doesn't necessarily come easy to us. So I think starting with those foundational pieces, our gratefulness for the Lord first, and then our learned behavior of contentment in all seasons is really where we need to be.

Stay on the line. Let's keep this conversation going. We'll be right back after this on MoneyWise Live. God cares a great deal more about our money than most of us imagine. In fact, Jesus says more about our use of money and possessions than about anything else, including both heaven and hell. In managing God's money, author Randy Alcorn breaks it all down in a simple, easy to follow format that makes it the perfect reference tool if you're interested in gaining a solid biblical understanding of money, possessions and eternity. Managing God's money is available when you click the store button at MoneyWiseLive.org.

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The Treasure Principle is available when you click the store button at MoneyWiseLive.org. Just before the break, we were speaking with Mark Colling from Aurora, Illinois. You have a large family, Mark, and for quite a while, it sounds like your resources have been limited at best. How large is your family, if you don't mind me asking? Well, we have eight kids. One of them is married, so we have seven left in the home. Wow. That's a large family. That's a large family. It sure is, and quite a blessing. Go ahead, Steve. What were you going to say?

No, no. I was just wondering what Mark's situation was, and it's nice to know that God has blessed you and helped you work through this situation. My children are young adults as well, both of them married, and it is a great blessing when your children grow up and become like real people. They're still your kids, but the greatest blessing is when they remain a friend, and we're just loving that.

Hopefully, with your children, as they continue to grow and move on, you'll find the very same thing. But where were we as far as helping Mark work through this type of budget? Well, yeah, I think it's a very appropriate question, and I suspect one that a lot of our listeners do wrestle with, are wrestling with, and that is I'm trying to navigate the resources that I have.

Obviously, they're limited resources. There's been a real strain financially over the years and in different seasons, and in particular, with a large family, eight kids, seven in the house, being a dad of four that are at home, I know how stretched the dollars get, and I can imagine adding three more to it, just the implications of that. And so what I was saying just before the break, Mark, is I think we've all got to start—I'm talking to myself as well—with the recognition of what God has already done on our behalf with his Son on the cross, and then we have to move from there and just recognize how grateful we should be for what we've already been given. And God's faithfulness demonstrated day after day.

Many times we miss God's faithfulness, even right in front of us, and myself included, our health and the blessing that is our family, and seeing God show up at different times in our lives in ways that were unexpected. And then this idea of learning contentment, which the apostle Paul says it's not something that's necessarily innate because it was a learned behavior, and in times of want and in times of plenty. And that's something that we're all on this journey together as God shapes our spiritual journey through our financial journey. Then I think moving beyond that, we just need to recognize that we need to invite God into our financial situation. You know, I think oftentimes we use the credit cards and we rob God of the opportunity of showing up miraculously in some situations, rather than spreading the bills out on the table and saying, Lord, you see our heart's desire, which is to be found faithful and being a good steward of your resources, honoring our obligations, living within our means.

And yet we have questions about how we're going to do all of this. And we want to invite you into that and then watch as he provides, hopefully the body of Christ coming around you in times where there is a real need. And then just navigating this journey to do your best to be faithful, to follow these principles that we talk about on this program, keeping lifestyle at a minimum, not overbuying in your home situation, living on a spending plan where you know where every dollar is and is going, enjoying what God has given you, but also recognizing that you've got to operate with restraint. So I think kind of in all of that is our journey. That is our walk with Christ.

And I'm not saying it's easy, especially when things become very, very tight financially, but react to those thoughts and give me what you're thinking. Like the point about the Great Gratefulness Journal, my wife and I are blessed to have all of our kids. We are both born-again believers and I've actually had the opportunity to baptize all eight of my kids after they professed faith in Christ. There's every single person in our neighborhood who knows us, comments how well behaved our kids are, how good our family is to them.

So there's joy in that. It's hard to put food on the table with that kind of, you know, grace and joy. I came home yesterday, my 25-year-old Buick, and my son was talking to the neighbor over the fence, chit-chatting.

So he's an adult, a very young adult and our neighbors are chatting with him. So, you know, they're growing up and they're staying in the faith. And so, you know, if the price is a financially-strained life, so my kids would be continuing in Christ, I'll take that. So, you know, in this day and age where a lot of kids go away from the faith or go away from church when they get out of the house, it's because they haven't grown up in the church and been part of the church.

They weren't either allowed to be part of the church or they never chose to be. And so I see our kids doing that, and they've made that choice. It's their choice, not mine. So these are things to be grateful for.

It's just... Doesn't mean it's not going to be hard along the way. I recognize that. What I suspect, though, Mark, is there's some folks listening today who find themselves with a financial surplus that are hearing you describe what God has done in your family and his faithfulness. And your children's walk with the Lord and are saying, wow, that is a blessed man. And so I think we can take away from that what really matters.

And, you know, it doesn't minimize the strain that is going to come. But what I hear, sir, is that you're on the path toward hearing, well done, good and faithful servant. And that's what we should all aim for. So I appreciate you inviting us into your journey today. I'd love to send you a copy of Howard Dayton's book, Your Money Counts. Perhaps that will be an encouragement to you. I'd also recommend that you connect with one of our Money Wise coaches who would be delighted to pray with you, walk with you in this journey, perhaps even give you some ideas on how you can cut costs or even reduce, increase income.

You can find them at MoneyWiseLive.org. But we appreciate you calling today. We do indeed, Mark.

Thank you very much. And, you know, Rob, that's a great reminder for all of us who are members of a local church. I trust just about all of us are. Look around your church. If there are people in your church that have special needs, whether it's being out of work or they're struggling medically in some way, or they have six, seven, eight kids and maybe things are just always tight, don't look the other way. Maybe God would have you pray for them or help them in some way.

You just never know how God is going to work. Near Austin, Texas. Hello, Joe. Thanks so much for holding.

And what's your question for Rob West? I'm just about to be 59 and a half. And I'm just I'm fine as far as work and all that.

As far as I can keep working if I want or I can retire. And I don't know how all that plays out because I've had my own business for a very long time in construction, but I also have eight properties that I rent out. And then I get that income. And somehow, I know my CPA told me that that mixed with my rental income changes how that's taxed. And so if I didn't have my construction income, my I would pay a lot less taxes. But I'm just wondering how all that and anything you can help me about the whole advantage or disadvantage to retiring at 59 and a half or waiting or keeping a business or letting it go.

Yeah, yeah. Well, obviously, there's there's real implications here, Joe, in the path that you're on in terms of your age and your work situation. One is related to Social Security. So you know, at some point, you will have the choice to either begin to claim that early or to wait. Obviously, the longer you wait, you know, the higher that check will be and beyond full retirement age of either 66 or 67. Every year up to 70, you know, you'll increase that by 8%. So that's one consideration, I think the ability to continue to work and store up resources so that when you do retire, you don't have to rely on Social Security.

So you can let that check build is one piece. And secondly, related to Social Security is assuming you're earning more now than you were in the early days of your working life, you're replacing some of those lower working year amounts with higher amounts, which is going to push that check up. So the number of more years you can work with higher income that's being reported, that's better for you.

Because again, those lower income years are falling off. I think beyond that, it's really just a function of how much have you accumulated? What is your budget or your lifestyle going to look like as you transition to whatever God has for you next? Assuming you'll still have this rental income flowing. If you were to sell the construction company, obviously, you'll have the sale there that will result in an asset. You know, obviously, your CPA can help you understand all the tax implications of any one of these scenarios.

But I think it really just comes down to some planning. Just to say, again, what is my lifestyle going to look like? What income sources will I have both in the way of a lump sum on the sale of the company, if that's what you're planning to do the continued rental income for as long as you can continue to maintain those and desire to do that even in retirement, and combining all of that with what will ultimately come with social security and what your monthly need will be in terms of maintaining your lifestyle. So, you know, I think you're at a great place. And perhaps, Joe, you could benefit from connecting with a certified kingdom advisor there in the Austin area, who could really just help you do some planning and look at all this, the tax side, the investment side, the insurance side, the budget side, and just the accumulation. So you have a plan between now and whenever that ultimate retirement is to know what you're heading toward and how you're going to fund your expenses when you get to that point.

And Joe, with that, we're going to have to say goodbye because we're out of time here. But I hope that information helps you. We're glad that you called. Thank you very, very much.

And Rob West, always a great pleasure, sir. Thanks very much. We'll come back tomorrow and do it again. All right. I look forward to it, Steve. Thanks.

All right. You know, we mentioned to a few people today that they might benefit from talking with one of our coaches. If you'd like to do that yourself, or at least look into it, just look for Connect with a Coach when you visit MoneyWiseLive.org, MoneyWiseLive.org. Just look for the window that says Connect with a Coach.

And of course, that's also where you can get information about finding a CKA, a Certified Kingdom Advisor in your area. My thanks today to our technical team. That would be Gabby T, Dan, Amy, and of course our own Jim Henry, taking care of research and checking our spelling. For Rob West, I'm Steve Moore, hoping you have a great remainder of your day. Say something nice to someone and then join us again tomorrow because MoneyWiseLive is a partnership between Moody Radio and MoneyWise Media and listeners just like you. Fellas.