Matt Slick Live

The following program is recorded content created by the Truth Network.

Let's see, it is July 6th, 2022 for the podcasters. If you want to give me a call, all you got to do is dial 8772072276. And for those of you, I just want to say thanks for your prayers to my wife. We had a procedure today and it went really well, really quickly.

And just thanks for your prayers on that. Also, last night I was involved in a debate with a Oneness guy. If any of you heard that debate or be interested in hearing your feedback and what you thought, I don't care who calls, give me a call if you liked it, you didn't like it, you thought I did well, didn't do well, him well, not well, whatever.

All you got to do is give me a call at 8772072276. I thought he had one good point and I'm going to study this, but other than that, I didn't think he did very well. He was not able to answer several of the issues that I raised and was not able to address the Trinity chart that I brought up. And I said, this is how the doctrine of the Trinity has arrived at. And I even said, as I've said over the radio and other debates with Oneness people, I said, look, this is what I'm going to go to. And I even said, for anybody in the future who's watching this debate now and you want to debate me on Oneness, this is what I'm going to bring up right here. Deal with this.

And he wasn't able to do it. So, you know, that's how it goes and other things. It was a good debate, good discussion. And I'd like your feedback on that if you're interested. Also, hey, I do want to remind you, just want to remind you, I don't like doing this very often, but I do, I need to do it, is just to ask you to consider donating $5 a month, five, that's all, just $5 a month. If you'd consider doing that to support this ministry, we would appreciate it.

All you got to do is go to karm.org, C-A-R-M dot O-R-G, forward slash donate. And you can check it out and help us out. And, you know, you can cancel it anytime. But $5 a month is not very much. But if we get enough people coming then and signing up, then we can just do a little bit better.

Because the summer, you know how it is, the summer is tough. And the economy is not that good. I wonder why the economy isn't that good. And also my Patreon supporters are going down. Everything's going down.

It's just how it is because of the economy. And we could use that $5 a month if you would consider that. Okay, having said that, we've got four open lines, 8772072276. Let's get to Rudolph from Raleigh, North Carolina.

Rudolph, welcome. You're on the air. Yes, sir. Yes, sir. Before I ask you this question.

Okay. The thing about Satan, you don't make any sense. But in my opinion, I don't think that he is. Because my question is, is Satan currently inhabiting hell? No. No, the final judgment hasn't happened yet. And so he's not been cast into that and outer darkness.

And all of that stuff. Not yet. Okay. Right, but I've talked about the lake of fire is where the devil is.

It's eight o'clock. Hell is some different puzzle. Right. If you read, it says that deaths of gravens go into the lake of fire. So hell has got to be different.

But, you know. Yeah, it's going to be, well, everybody goes there. The demonic forces, the bad people who haven't trusted in Christ, and the like.

So they're going to end up there, okay? In the lake of fire, but, so, and like I said, in the word of God it says that he's the prince of the power of the air, and God's on him falling through us. That's why I don't think there's so, so, where do people get the idea? That Satan is controlling hell.

What is the difference? Oh, well, it's just fabrication, you know, that he's in charge of everything down there, and that it's bad and stuff. It's just fabrication. No, he won't be in charge of anything except his own agonizing screams for eternity. That'll be one thing he'll have to be worried about. And, you know, without hope, without deliverance, without end.

Oh, it's going to be horrible. And all those who have not trusted in the true God, the true Christ, and the true gospel, they will join him. And you better find out if you believe in the true God, the true Christ, and the true gospel. I'm not talking to you, I'm talking to everybody out there. I know Mormons are listening, atheists are listening, Roman Catholics are listening, and so there's a lot of false stuff out there. Yes, sir.

I told these little children, one time, I was talking to them that that is the most important decision you would permit in your entire life, whether or not to accept Jesus Christ as your Savior, because you died without him to recognize, to give up. I told them, man, you're in trouble. But thank you very much, and I'm glad to call you back, and you said it's karm.org.org. Yes, karm.org, C-A-R-M, dot O-R-G, forward slash donate. Yeah. Yeah, I don't really, to be honest, I don't like, I don't like mentioning it, you know, for money.

I just don't like it. And I rarely do it, but, you know, I got to do it, and let people know that we have those needs. We are a ministry. No, I'm just saying, I can say thank you, and I want to, I'm going to donate, because I want you to stay around, because I don't want, I don't want you to stay around. I really do.

All the ministry. But thank you very much, and God bless you, sir. God bless. Well, thanks for calling, buddy. Appreciate it, man. Thank you, sir.

Thank you. Bye-bye. Bye-bye. Bye-bye.

All right. Three open lines, if you want to give me a call. 877-207-2276. Courtney from Ohio.

Courtney, welcome. You're on the air. Hey, how are you? Doing fine, by God's grace. Doing fine.

So what do you got? All right. Okay, so I have two questions. They're unrelated. I just, one of them was, I was listening to you last week, and somebody was asking you about, you know, the January 6th thing, and you just kind of, like, threw in there something about, in the government, masons, and I don't know a whole lot about that.

So I didn't know if you didn't have time, or you didn't feel comfortable talking about it, but if you do, I don't know really much about that. So I was wondering what you think about that. Yeah, there are all kinds of theories, conspiracy theories, running around the Illuminati. The Illuminati, the Masonic order, there actually does look like there's some actual Masonic infiltration in the government and in the area of the capital. There are Masonic symbols and various things out there. So there are presidents who've been masons, and they have a hierarchical structure there along with oaths that must be taken when you get to higher levels of masonry, and they are ungodly oaths. So, you know, how much of it is true?

I don't know. Then there's Bohemian Grove, people have heard about that. There's, like I said, the Illuminati. I remember once, this is for real, this is not a hearsay thing. For about a year or so, I'd be driving down a road and there'd be a Mormon ward or a building that was empty or whatever. I would just get this impression, go walk in, and it'd be empty. And I remember once walking in, for example, into a, there was nobody there, Mormon church, Mormon ward, just walked up and pulled on a door and it opened.

Just walked in. And I was the only one in the entire building. And I would never do any damage or anything like that. But it was just, things like this would happen. And I had a girlfriend at the time, this was before I got married, and she was doing, she was doing, what's it called, Job's Daughters, that's right. And so next door was a mason hall. What's that? It's just like a girl part of Boy Scouts inside of masonry, okay? Oh, okay.

That kind of thing. Low level, and not a big deal, but she was a nice person. And at any rate, so I went over to this building that was close by. It was a mason, mason symbol on it, it was a mason hall.

I just pulled on the door and opened up. And no one was in there, and I walked around, and I still remember it. A lot of these red chairs everywhere. And it was a pulpit kind of thing, platform, elevated about a foot or so.

And it was about six feet wide. And I walked into it and just looked around, and there were these books. There were these books, which I thought of stealing later because of what they said, but I didn't do it, of course.

I opened up these books, and I fanned through them. And one of them said, Jesus is not God. It actually made a statement. Uh-oh.

Yes. And then I go, that's weird. And why did they do that? And then they said some other things about Jesus. And then I closed, it was fanning through the other one. And they said, I just fanned through. It took me a few minutes, and I found this thing where it said the Christians were a problem and that they needed to be dealt with.

It wasn't those exact words, but it was the Christian movement that was hindering the proper development of the country and politics and varying things, and they needed to be dealt with and restricted. And I remember reading this. Wow.

Oh, yeah, with my own eyes. And so, yeah, there's a lot going on. Look up Bohemian Grove, and you'll find stuff.

How much of it is true? And then there's a Georgian guide stones. Do you think that any of our founders were?

Yes. Yeah, they were a lot of more Masons. But you've got to understand that Masonry has digressed over the years. It's gotten more and more occultic. There are people who've come out of Masonry and have just flat out said there's occult stuff that goes in. And there are reports of having to swear allegiance to the god of Masonry.

And Joseph Smith was a Mason, and in his temple ceremony, he took the Masonic procedures and integrated it into the morbid temple ceremony. And so when he was arrested for destruction of a printing press, which was big, big bad news back then, you don't do that. He actually, he was murdered. He shouldn't have done what they did. But he was arrested.

That was proper. But they stormed the place and shot him. And he shot back. He had a gun smuggled in and killed two people. But any rate, so I don't blame him for defending himself.

But should have been by a trial, and he should have just been tried and kicked him out or whatever. All right. So there's a connection between Mormon and Masonry then? Yes. Okay. And one of the things that has reported him saying during this was happening was, is there no mercy for the mother's child?

And I think that's the right phrase. What? And it's a Masonic distress call because it looks like he saw Masons, fellow Masons in the crowd who were coming after him. But he swore a blood oath in Masonry not to reveal what went in their sacred ceremonies, but he used it in the Mormon temple ceremony. So it looks like he got himself killed.

I'm not justifying it, but he got himself in a lot of trouble, and he was killed for it. Wow. Yeah.

Yikes. Mm-hmm. Okay. Wow. Yeah, the widow's son. That's right, Charlie says.

That was the phrase or something. Okay? All right. Okay. Interesting. Okay.

My second question is completely unrelated, if you don't mind. All right. Sure.

So a friend of mine, I noticed there's certain people that she likes to listen to, you know. It's a break. Hold on.

Teachers, preachers. Sure. Can you hold on?

It's a break. Okay, we'll be right back. Okay, Courtney.

Yep. You guys got to go. Okay.

All right. Hey, folks, we have one open line. If you want to give me a call, 877-207-2276. We'll be right back. It's Matt Slick live, taking your calls at 877-207-2276.

Here's Matt Slick. Everybody, welcome back to the show. Let's get on the air here again with Courtney from Ohio.

Courtney, welcome. You're on the air. Okay. So here's my second question.

Mm-hmm. A friend of mine who listens to certain preachers and teachers and whatnot, I won't say the names because I'm not trying to go against anybody or anything like that. But I noticed that she's kind of picking up some of those same tendencies that they say, which is a lot of times, like when you listen to them, they will not say the Holy Spirit. They only say Holy Spirit.

Whenever they're like talking about the Holy Spirit, they will not use the word the. What preachers are these? And I just think it's awesome.

What preachers are these? Do you want me to say anything? Yeah, absolutely. I don't have a problem with it.

Sure, absolutely. Well, the one of them that I've noticed that she's listening to, his name is Dutch Heath. And he seems like a very nice guy.

I've listened to some of the things, you know, she sent me different things that he is teaching on. He seems like a big patriot, you know, but I noticed whenever he's talking about the Holy Spirit, he will not say the. And it's almost like it's forced, like, you know, it's almost like he purposely thinks about not saying it. And I'm like, why would you not say the? There's like a ton of scriptures that say the Holy Spirit.

Jesus said the Holy Spirit. So I just, am I being picky or is that weird? Yeah, it's weird. Can you email me at info at karme.org who this guy is?

Maybe a website or something like that. And I can do a little bit of research because, you know, the cults will drop the definite article and say Holy Spirit, like electricity, like light, it's a force. And it's just pretty typical. So that might be exactly what's going on. And if you were to give me the name, you know, in an email, I guess it'd be fine.

I thought it would be like a regular preacher, like Beth Moore or something like that, you know. But let me know, you know, I'm curious. I'm going to check it out. Okay. Okay, so then I wasn't being super picky. I'm just like, wow, okay, I totally will.

I'll get off the phone and do that right now. No, no. And there's other patterns that other preachers will say. They'll say like, well, you know, you get baptized in the Holy Ghost. You know, they'll say Holy Ghost. I'll say it real quick, quickly.

You need the Holy Ghost. And that's usually it's in Pentecostal circles that they'll say that. And they have different phrases and styles that are picked up among groups that hold the same thing. So, you know, it's interesting.

But yeah, denying the personhood of the Holy Spirit is often accomplished by dropping the definite article and not saying the. Absolutely. Wow. Okay. Good eye.

Or good ear, I should say. Good for you. All right. Thanks, Matt. All right. Talk to you later. Good stuff.

Okay, Courtney. God bless. All right. Good for her.

Good for her. All right. Let's get to Jose from North Carolina. Welcome. You're on the air. Thank you. Good afternoon. Hi. Hi. Hi. Hi. What do you got? All right. Thank you for taking my time. I read a short article on karm.org about exorcisms.

And I'm trying to remember the title of it, but I'm blanking out. My question has to do with what you said, which I wholeheartedly believe that the Catholic priests are not. I guess they don't.

I'll say my way. They don't have the monopoly on casting out devil. Right. If they could do that. Could you expound on this, how other Christians could do this?

Sure. We are Christians, and therefore we are adopted Romans 8, and we have the authority to be called the children of God. John 1 13. And the power of exorcism is in the name of Jesus Christ. And the sons of Sceva in Acts, I'm trying to remember where, they were casting out demons. They got jumped by demonic forces. The power of the name of Jesus is so true that even false religious systems like Mormons and Roman Catholics can use that name, the name of Christ, and demonic forces will respond to it.

So as Christians, however, we do have that authority, that right to cast out demonic forces. But it's not to be attempted willy-nilly. It's to be attempted very carefully.

And this is not something to play with. A very serious thing. Okay.

Okay. I mean, what's, I mean, what's, I mean, I sound stupid. Is it like as dangerous as, like, one of those scary things they show on TV?

You know, where they have a priest, and they're attempting to do the exorcism, and then they get attacked? Well, I've never done one. Like, what would be the danger? I've never done one. I don't know of anyone, I don't know of anyone in my life that's ever attempted or anything like that.

Yeah. No, I've not done one. I suspect I probably could have lots of occurrences to do it if I went to Washington, D.C. and hung out long enough. But, no, I've not done one personally, and I don't know anyone who's done one either.

So there's really not much experience I can call on in that area. I just went through scripturally to write a short article. Our Catholic priest is the only one who can do exorcisms. I don't affirm the authority of the Catholic Church. I think it's a false church, and their priesthood is a false priesthood. But still, the issue of the name of Christ is there. And demonic forces can appear to be cast out in order to trick people into thinking that their church has power and authority. It's just another deceptive method that demonic forces can use. That's something that needs to be understood and assessed.

I have, in my opinion, encountered someone who was possessed, and there's only one instance where I really think that person's possessed. But that was a long, long, long time ago. It was a very brief encounter.

So other than that, you know, that's all I can tell you. No, I mean, that's true. It's there in the scripture. Other people were making the attempt, and they got messed up.

They got hurt bad. But it's there in the Bible. Thank you for writing that article, by the way. And thank you for taking my call. Hey, no problem, man.

No problem at all. All right. Well, God bless. All right.

God bless you. Thank you. All right. You too.

All right. Let's get to, let's see, the next longest waiting person is Kit from Tucson, Arizona. Kit, welcome. Then we'll get to Tiberius about the King James.

That'll be interesting. Kit, welcome. You're on the air. Hey, Matt. The first thing I wanted to say is thank you for talking about the Freemasons. Just so you know, we've got somebody that converted from the Roman Catholic Church to Reformed faith, and after more than a year, we found him at church in England, and last week they had four masons there in their, in their, you know, aprons and everything like that, and it was very disturbing to him.

Yeah, it would be. Hey, Kit, now I recognize your voice from Discord. How you doing, buddy? Oh, I'm doing all right. I'm going to ask you to make an infallible decision on something you can't possibly infallibly decide. Sounds good.

Looks like I get a respite because there's the break, so you've got to hold on, buddy, okay? Okay. All right.

Yeah, I've talked to Kit many times. Good guy. Hey, folks, if you want to give me a call, 877-207-2276. We'll be right back. It's Matt Slick live, taking your calls at 877-207-2276. Here's Matt Slick. All right, everyone, welcome back to the show. We're at the bottom of the hour. If you want to give me a call, 877-207-2276. We'll be right back on here with Kit from Tucson.

Hey, Kit, you're back on. Okay, Matt, well, you know me well enough to know that I don't get work and grace messed up doctrinally. And so here's my question. When you have somebody like a Ravi Zacharias, and you know that Jesus did everything for us, God did everything for our salvation, all we brought were our sins, and so we're not saved based on our performance. Where do you come down on this when somebody says, Is Ravi Zacharias in heaven? Or somebody like him? We don't have to talk about him specifically, but anybody like him. Yeah, it's tough because of his sexual immorality and stuff, treatment of women, it's very bad, very serious.

So from a distance, I can't tell you. Because I know that people can be trapped in varying sins and still be saved. And I'm not saying that, hey, it's okay to be bad and be a Christian at the same time. But on the other hand, if you say you know him and don't keep his commandments, the truth is not in you and you're a liar. So one of the things if I were sitting down interviewing him about this issue, I'd say, Is it wrong?

Do you believe it's wrong what you've done? Yes, it is, and I've really struggled, I've really failed. Well, it's a sign of regeneration. If he says, well, you know, God understands, then it's a sign of non-regeneration. So it's hard to just say so. But generically, you know, it makes me doubt if he was really saved. But I can't say if he was or wasn't. Yeah, I certainly am not calling to say how much sin can I get away with and still slide into heaven.

I'm certainly not doing that at all. It's just been on my mind and you've been saying I'm not getting enough calls. So I thought, well, I'll give him a call, you know.

During the summer, the calls slow down. It's just pretty typical. But it's a good point and it's a good question, and people have called me up about him before, and he's either with the Lord or he's not with the Lord right now. But someone in that kind of a position who should know better, who was gifted in his speech, yet was used by God, it's certainly possible he could have been an unregenerate individual who was just good at what he did.

But it's also possible he was regenerate and fell into bondage and God took him home and killed him. You know, Matt, I'm not trying to weigh in on either side of it, but have you ever done anything since you became a Christian that you knew better, that you knew was wrong? Because I sure have.

Yes. Oh, heck yeah. Yeah, I've got regrets, you know, after I became a Christian. In fact, I have a certain, let's just say there's some history, even after I became a Christian, I periodically pretty regularly review and I still say to myself and to my Lord, I say, how come you didn't kill me? You know, what was up at that point? What was I thinking, you know? But God, he's merciful.

That's all I can say. His mercy is incredible. I'm astounded with what he puts up with in me. I really am. Oh, so am I. I mean, I know about you.

I know who you are, man. I can't believe it. It's just incredible. Boy, he's gothic gracious, isn't he? He certainly is. And when he saves people, he keeps them saved. That's why it gets muddy when we talk about something like this.

You know, and I don't want to gossip about Ravi, of course, but just anybody like that. Obviously, the question comes up quite a bit. Because we know we don't perform our salvation. We're not saved because we did something good or because we didn't do something bad.

That's why it gets muddy. Yeah, it does. And then, you know, having to judge someone's salvation, so to speak, from a distance, it is very difficult. So I'd like to just say I don't know. God does. And we just move from there. But, you know, you and I have worked together on the Internet impromptu discussions and stuff like that. So we both know that each of us are sinners, saved by grace.

And that's just how it is. And God extends that mercy to others as well. So, you know, praise God. Yeah.

Hopefully that's the case with Ravi. And that's why I was giving you the footnotes. I knew you would know, but I didn't want other people to think that I was calling up saying, come on, how much sin can I get away with? Just give me an amount so I can be just under that amount and still speak into heaven. No, no, I don't believe in that at all. Yeah, anybody would do that is actually a good sign they're not regenerate to see how much they can get away with. Right.

Absolutely. All right, brother. Anyway, if you would pray for our friend Young KK, he asked me, he said, if you talk to Matt, ask him to pray for me. He's the one that's the former Roman Catholic, and he was very disturbed in his Reformed church in England over the weekend. Yeah, the churches in England and France are largely just empty carcasses of what used to be there. And people go there to whitewash selfless dead men walking. It's a lot of those churches.

But there are some good ones there, too. It took us forever to find a church that wasn't Roman Catholic in the area where he lived, and we finally found a Reformed one. And he's loving it. He's been going every Sunday and all that. And it wasn't the clergy that was in the Masonic gear. But, you know, a guy came in and he had just been elected mayor or something like that, and they had a ceremony for him in Masonic gear in the church on Sunday morning during a worship service.

And it really rocked him. Yeah, that's not good. He should go talk to the pastor about that.

Yep. Yeah, that's good advice. That's great advice. Anyway, have a great day. God bless you.

We're praying for you and your wife. All right, man. Appreciate it, kid. God bless. Thanks, buddy. All right. Yep. Thanks.

All right. Let's get on the air with Tiberius from New Jersey. Tiberius, welcome. You're on the air. Hey, Matt. How are you? Thanks for taking my call. I'm doing okay, man.

So what do you got? Well, I got a situation here where it seems like my church is attempting to codify in the Constitution that they want to only use the King James Version. 1908.

1908. And I'm trying to, yeah, yeah, that 1908 version seems to be the inerrant and, you know, word of God. And my pastor's all wrapped up in this, and I just wanted to get your perspective on maybe the best way of talking to him about it and maybe bring some points up that maybe can, you know, help him understand, you know, where the King James is coming from, how some of the more modern versions are actually, you know, based on earlier transcripts and things like that. Well, I'll tell you, if they want to codify that version of the King James as being the inspired one and the true one, you go in there and you say, wait a minute, we've got problems here. They're going to basically turn feather you.

They're already... Yeah, I thought so. It's pretty ridiculous. The King James, as good as it is, fails in some important areas.

It fails miserably in Romans 5.18, in Titus 2.13, 2 Peter 2.1. It violates such theatrical rules in some places, and I just don't use it. I'm not saying don't use it.

I'm saying I don't use it. And... Understood. So, you know, if I go to a church and they're preaching under the King James, that's fine, as long as they know where the errors are and they can explain things. That's fine.

But, yeah, you know, it's just, it's like, why would anybody say it has to be the King James and then a particular year of the King James? Yeah. It's just like you stare at them and just roll your eyes and say, seriously? Yeah. Seriously?

Yeah, yeah. That's where I'm at. That's really where I was at. I couldn't believe it.

When I first heard this, I couldn't believe it. And then they sent the memo out to the whole congregation, oh, this is what it's going to be. And, you know, if you have anything to say about it, you know, they gave us until August 31st to send back, you know, something in writing. And that's actually what I'm going to do.

I'm going to put something in writing back to them about this. Well, you know, we have King James only section on Carmen. You can go through there and you can read what Luke wrote.

You can contact Luke and he can fill you in on more specifics on that. But the King James, it's a good Bible. But to say it's the official one that we're going to use in this particular year, it's like, what are you thinking? You know, it's ridiculous. And you know, what if I were to be, what if I were to go preach at the church, something like that?

I have to use the 1908 King James version? You know, I wouldn't. Yeah. I don't, you know, just crazy. You know, it's just sometimes I just can't believe how stupid people are. It's just so stupid.

But you know what happens, man? I mean, you know, you know, in all honesty, I think it really comes from that, that leaning on tradition. These are, you know, Southern people that they lean on in the old ways and they're using that as a crutch to not move forward, I think, a lot of times. I call it a blue hair church. I'm saying it with a smile, you know, because if you know what I mean, sometimes the elderly and I'm 65, but you know, sometimes the elderly, they want things a certain way.

They have this, the certain King James, good news for Paul, you know, and if that's okay, that's what it is. But hey, we got a break, buddy. You got to move along. All right. Okay. Thanks a lot, Matt. All right.

God bless. Hey folks, Four Open Lines, 877-207-2276. We'll be right back.

Please stay tuned. It's Matt Slick live, taking your calls at 877-207-2276. Here's Matt Slick. Hey everybody. Welcome back to the show, the last segment of the hour. If you want to give me a call, 877-207-2276. Let's get to Alex. Alex.

Welcome. You're on the air. Hey, what's going on, brother? Hey, radio.

That's what's going on. What do you got, man? Hey, I tried your little vitamin C baking soda mix and yeah, it made me sick, sick to myself.

I'm never listening to you about medical advice, that's for sure. Man, you're totally killing me, man, that's so funny. What did you do? What did you do, like a cup of each or something? Downed it? No, I did exactly what you said, it came up to me and I went out and I threw up. It was disgusting. I couldn't handle it. Oh, man. I can't laugh real loud because I want to blow people's ears out. But anyway, I had to tell you, I had to tell you that one.

Wait a minute, man. You're making me laugh. It's so... It made you sick. That's awesome.

Well, when you are sick, give it a shot again and see what happens. Hey, if it's a good laugh for you, I'm glad I want you to do that. It's awesome. Well, I didn't expect it. You go, hey, I tried it.

It worked great. No. He said, don't make me sick. It's just hilarious. Okay, I'm sorry, man. You caught me off guard. That was good. Okay.

But seriously, it was pretty funny. No, it's all good. Yeah, it's all good. No, so I have a question. So, stuff on eBay, part-time.

Okay. And there's a thrift store that's part of a Seventh-day Adventist church. And we were kind of talking about it and, you know, I went there once and then kind of got conflicted, you know, my conscience, I was like, you know, should I keep, should I go there again to support a place like that or? It's tough because, you know, how consistent can we be? You know, Amazon, Bezos is, he's got his, he doesn't have his head on straight in some areas morally and ethically and stuff.

And yet he says certain things, we not go there, not here, not this. You know, it's just tough. So I'd say do what your, I'd say do what your conscience tells you to do in different situations. I try and curtail my purchases at businesses like that. But on the other hand, if you don't, sometimes you can't even eat. So what do you do?

And it's a little bit tough, but, yeah, you know. So I won't go to a, you know, the Deseret bookstores and Deseret, they have these facilities. I don't go to those. I don't support them because it's just Mormonism flat out. I don't support them.

Catholicism, I don't go to their things and support them. SDA, I probably, me, I probably wouldn't, you know, probably, but you know, they're closer to the truth of course and stuff, but you know, there was something, you know, whatever. I just wouldn't make a real habit of it. That's just my preference. If you have something different, okay, you just got to do what you got to do. How consistent we'd be on that kind of a principle.

It's not easy to be consistent. So you know, it's a tough one. It is. Yeah. Well, yeah, I appreciate you taking the time to kind of bounce stuff off you with this. My other thing was I just finished your oneness debate.

It was pretty good. Yeah. That guy is a cuckoo man. Yeah. He was just confusing.

How can you follow all that? What are you saying? It's like he's trading this totally false thing that's nowhere in scripture. Yeah.

Yeah. He would try and make it up, you know, and, and, uh, uh, you know, there's only one God and it's, and Jesus is the father and all this stuff. And, and, you know, like I said, I showed him the Trinity chart, you know, I shared the screen and showed him. He basically ignored it like three or four times.

I said, this is how it's arrived at. And it was just nothing. And um, didn't even touch the issue of, uh, the nature of personhood and, uh, in the, in the issue of the static mind problem, which I went over quickly. Those are just things to talk about, but yeah, I didn't think he, I thought he was smart.

It was, it was, he is intelligent, had some knowledge, but his position just didn't make sense. You know? Yeah. So yeah, no, exactly. I mean, exactly. I was listening to it and I'm like, something this confusing is just not biblical.

That's what I'm thinking. The whole time I'm listening to his position, I'm like, this is all over the place. Then when he brings baptism into it, baptism into it and says that you need to be baptized only in Jesus' name, well there, there you've lost me. You've completely lost me. Right. Yeah. Maybe he and I'll have a discussion on that. Um, I really enjoy discussing that with people because I have some, uh, tricks up my theological logical sleeve about baptism that a lot of people are just, what? You know? But, um, yeah, I thought it was an interesting debate and, uh, so yeah, I liked the part about going to, you know, for example, John 14, 23, you know, uh, the father and I will come and make our abode.

We will come and make our abode. Jesus is a person. Yes.

Was the father person before the incarnation? Yes. So was Jesus a person talking to himself?

Yes. So when he says we will come, is the we two people, two persons to what? It didn't make any sense. And then the issue of communication takes two individuals. You don't communicate with yourself.

And then he actually said, Oh, do you ever talk to yourself? What? And, uh, and then I thought it was interesting was the will. When I said the will is a, as a part of the personhood, having a will in person that we're talking about the nature of the Trinity and God and God has a will. Right. And then he said, well, in, uh, was it in Romans seven, 18 through 25, he was referencing, uh, the things I want to do.

I don't do. Paul was talking about sin in me. See, the flesh has its own will. And I said, well, when it was a flesh, a person, and he wouldn't answer, you know, it's just like what? And he was mixing the idea of a metaphorical use of the will in anthropological, uh, what's called anthropomorphism versus the literal definition of what we go and talk about personhood in relation to the Trinity is confusing the terms. So it's like, yeah, I caught that when he was confusing the terms and mixing things up.

And then, yeah, the flesh has a will. I mean, you're just grasping a straw at that point when you're trying to go back and forth. I mean, I just thought it was good for the actual biblical position of the Trinity. I mean, I thought you kept it cool and it was pretty well during the whole thing. So yeah, it was interesting. And, and, um, I always learn from my debates and then afterwards, don't know if you saw the after show, there's a guy who wants to debate me in August who, um, says that Jesus was only a man while on earth, but was not divine.

And did you hear that discussion at all in the after show? Uh, no, I'm, uh, I'm about to get to that. So that's like, what, just kenosis, basically, is that what he's arguing?

A strong kenosis, kind of a pollinarian kind of a, there's kind of, it's weird stuff. And um, his, uh, let's just say he is, his confidence in his position was zealous and he was warning me that he's going to destroy me. He's polite about it because I don't have any arguments and stuff like that. Really? And we'll see what happens during an actual debate. So yeah. And Bill says that that dude was whacked, it was equally whacked.

Bill says, yeah, yeah, yeah, for sure. Well, yeah. And also I'm going to catch that show on my button at the batting cage, but I can do it on the way home, but I'm glad I got you with a good laugh. Well, it was funny. You caught me off guard, but, uh, yeah, when you want to know something else, let me know and I'll give you some other advice.

But uh, yeah, no, I think I'm all tapped out in the mass blicket for the, for the time being. Man, I wish I could just laugh as long as I want to because I love that kind of stuff. You know, I said it to my wife, I said, this guy tells me this thing is disgusting. And I go in the back and she's like, why are you listening to that guy? Because you're stupid. That's why? What do you think it was a guy named slick, what vitamin C and baking soda and you actually fell for it.

What are you a moron? But Hey, look, I'll tell you, it's sure, it sure works for me to talk to others who said this worked. So I don't know. I don't know what happened with you. Something with my stomach doesn't work. Did you let the fizz go away or did you drink it right away? I let the fizz go away, I mixed it up, I just let it sit and then I just drank it and it just was terrible reaction. I told you, I tell everybody it's terrible, but you didn't do one breath, you drink it, you get it over with, you man up. I had COVID man, I was desperate, I was like, whatever.

I totally laugh at the mute myself and you're killing me, man. I love that stuff. You have my kind of personality. You do.

It's really stupid. Fun humor. Yeah, yeah. No, it'll be good. I'm talking to my wife. I might make a trip up to Idaho or something.

Anytime, buddy. Yeah, we'd have stupid fun. I bet you if your wife and my wife were sitting there, they'd be looking at us shaking their heads like, oh yeah, yeah, this is not good. Hands down. That's right. Yeah, brother. All right, brother.

Well, thanks for the, thanks for the answers, man. All right, buddy. God bless, man. All right. God bless that.

Man, he was killing you. That's awesome. Made me laugh. All right. Let's get to Berkeley from North Carolina.

Berkeley. Welcome. Okay.

Got to focus. All right. Welcome to the show.

You're on the air. Okay. Thanks for taking my call.

I appreciate it. My question, first of all, I'm pro-life 100%, but how, when people bring up abortion concerning the life of the mother, how would you answer that? Concerning the life of the mother, I don't understand. Some people believe that abortion should be okay or it's allowed if the mother's life is in danger. That's a personal decision at that point because there are different levels of which a mother's life can be in jeopardy. If it's just an inconvenience and it might happen, it doesn't justify killing the child. The only question I have is that I would have to work through more is if you know for a fact that the pregnancy will kill both, then what do you do?

Because that's the only thing I could even think of that might be a justification, and that's only from a logical position. Even then, I have my reservations. You never know what you're going to do until you're in the position. If my wife had gotten pregnant again, the next pregnancy probably could have killed her, the doctor said, because of her condition. But I know for a fact that what she would have done was kept that baby. She would have done it.

I would have been right behind her going, yep, that's fine. That's a tough one. That is a tough one. They're both going to die. It's like the lesser of two evils.

What do you do? That's the only place I can see any rational justification for the possibility. That's it. Even then, I'm cautious. I just didn't know how to give a good answer, a biblical answer, when that gets brought up.

I've read some documents that they've never... We're almost out of time. The music is going to start any second. If you call back tomorrow, we can talk about this. I can give you arguments, and we can talk about this more in depth and go through it because a lot of people need to hear it if you're interested. Okay? All right, man. We'll talk about that. But the break was coming up. I knew it would end. All right, buddy.

God bless, Berkeley. All right. Hey, folks. There you go. If you want to give me a call, then you've got to wait until tomorrow. May the Lord bless you, and by His grace, we'll be back on the air. Oh, tonight, at 10 p.m. Eastern time, I know it's late, I'll be teaching on Eastern Orthodoxy on Clubhouse. We'll talk to you later. God bless. Bye. Another program powered by the Truth Network.