Matt Slick Live

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If you want to subscribe or subscribe to the Truth Network algorithm, we're going to MasterCard.com Plus, we have people who go into that account and answer them, so they might have moved it in another folder, so I'd have to look. But anyway, go ahead. That's all right. Send it again. Send it again. Okay. Send it again. All right.

Yeah, yeah. It's a lot better if I send it again. So I'll send it like five times, so that way, you know, there's a lot.

You can just send it once, because I'm looking at the account right now, and when I see it come in, I'll move it to a folder, and I can take a look at it. Okay. Okay.

And it's not even arriving right now, though. So I will send that again, and then I'll call back in a few days after you've had a chance to go over the material in it, all right? All right. So, look, can I ask what it is? Because I have a question about it, depending on what it is.

What is it? Well, okay. So, I mean, you were asking for sources with the issue about the tribute penny and the Gospel of Matthew. Oh, okay.

And then, yeah, you asked for examples of prophecies and other religions and so on and so forth. Okay. So if you have any material in there, I can expand. I mean, I guess if you didn't get it last time, I'll go home and put some more stuff in there, and then you can go over it, all right? All right.

Sounds good. All right. All right. You have a wonderful evening. You, too. Thanks a lot. All right.

That was Nathan. Let's get to Kim from North Carolina. Kim, welcome. You're on the air.

Kim? Thank you, man. Okay, buddy. There you go.

What's up, man? My question is coming from Exodus 4-11 and John 9 verses 1, 2, and 3. Okay. So now, when Jesus says that he created, well, he makes the deaf, the dumb, and the blind.

Right. Exodus 4-11. When he healed the man in John, was he just undoing what he had done to him, that he had put on him, the blindness? Well, it looks like that, because God does things for a reason. A lot of people are not familiar with Exodus 4-11, which I'm very familiar with.

We need to go over it a little bit for people who are listening. And what it says is the context. Moses does not want to go talk to Pharaoh, and God is sending him. In verse 10, Moses said to the Lord, please, Lord, I have never been eloquent, neither recently nor in time past, nor since you have spoken to your servant, for I am of slow speech and slow of tongue. The Lord said to him, this is verse 11, who has made man's mouth or who makes him mute or deaf or seeing or blind?

Is it not I, the Lord? That shocks a lot of people, because what I'll do when I'm talking to the positive confessionists who say that God always wants everyone to be healthy and wealthy, is I will quote that without them knowing I'm quoting it. And they'll say, no, I reject that. And they don't realize I'm quoting the exact word of God. So in that context, God certainly has the right to make people blind if that's what he chooses. And he can do whatever he wants. People say, he would never do that. That's what he says right there in Exodus 4-11.

You've got to deal with it. Now, in John 9, Jesus is healing. Now, does it mean then that God directly made that person blind?

Not necessarily. God can certainly do that, according to Exodus 4-11. But there's also the natural consequence of sin running in the world where one of the effects of sin is blindness, for example. The effects of sin in the world, imperfection and failure.

So we don't know in the case of John 9 if it was God's direct hand or if it was just something that God allowed to occur because of the nature of the fall in the world. Okay? Okay.

Good ranking, Matt. That make sense? Yeah, it does.

Thank you. What do you mean? What do you mean? Of course it does. Because in Exodus 4-11, he's saying he directly does that, but it doesn't say he did directly do it in John 9. Because in Exodus 4-11, he makes people blind and deaf. It doesn't say he makes every person who is blind or deaf blind and deaf.

It's just simple logic. In John 9, it doesn't say that God is the one who did that there. We know that sin has a deleterious effect biologically in the world. God can certainly make someone blind, but he doesn't have to do that. Sin can work its way into creation and result in blindness.

And then God can heal that as well. Okay? But now it doesn't say he did, so we can't assume it's possible that he did do that. It's possible. He's doing it.

Yeah. It's possible, but the thing is, like I said, it doesn't say he didn't. It didn't say he did. So if I were to write an article on this, I would be saying something like, here's the logical possibilities for both of those verses, and then how do we combine them?

And we just work through the combination of them. We've got to be careful that we don't make assumptions and say, well, in John 9, it means that he absolutely did that. He made someone blind.

And even if he did, so he can make someone blind and then heal them. Why not? For the glory of God. No problem. So there's nothing, no problem there in any way. Okay? Okay. I can say thank you, man. All right, man. Anything else? All right. God bless, Kim.

No, that's it. We'll keep calling. Okay. Let's get to Anthony from Virginia. Hey, Anthony, welcome here on the air. How you doing, Matt? Can you hear me? Yes, I can hear you. You sound good.

So what do you got, buddy? I wanted to ask you about the Westminster Confession of Faith, and are you familiar with that, and how do you feel about it? Yeah, I like the Westminster Confession of Faith, the BCF, yeah.

Say that again? Yes, I'm familiar with the Westminster Confession of Faith, yeah. Do you believe it's an accurate summation of the Christian faith, or is it biblical, or do you disagree with anything in it?

It's been a long time since I've gone through it, and I think it leans towards cessationism, which I don't. But for the most part, I think it's a very good representation of biblical theology. In chapter 3 of the Westminster Confession of Faith, I'm not looking at it, but it says something along the lines of, before the creation of the universe, God foreordains everything that comes to pass. Do you think that's true? Yes. Doesn't that mean that God foreordains evil? If evil comes to pass, does that mean God has foreordained that to happen? Yes. Well, that's pretty shocking. Why? Because you're saying that God is the author of evil.

Nope. You said two different words, author and foreordain. So if you're going to understand, I know this is what you're going to, and that's why I kept saying, nope, yes, just waiting for you to get through it, because people often make that mistake of thinking that God foreordaining something means he's directly the author and cause of it.

He can directly ordain and indirectly ordain. Anything that occurs occurs because God has ordained it. Now, the Bible says in Ephesians 1-11 that God works all things after the counsel of his will. That's Ephesians 1-11. Do you agree with that, that God works all things after the counsel of his will?

Do you believe that? I believe God has a will, but humans also have free will. No, no, no. You're not listening. Does God work all things after the counsel of his will?

Well, I guess he does have a will. No, no, no. You're not listening. You're not listening.

This often happens with people who can't kind of grasp the theological perspective. Hold on. I've got to break, okay? I'm going to get back.

I'll answer that, and I'll show you something in Scripture. So, hold on, buddy. All right? Hey, folks.

Three open lines. If you want to get back to me or give me a call, 877-207-2276. We'll be right back. It's Matt Slick live, taking your calls at 877-207-2276. Here's Matt Slick.

All right. Welcome back to the show. We have three open lines. Give me a call, 877-207-2276. Give me a call. Let's get back on the air here with Anthony. Are you still there, buddy?

I'm here. Okay. Now, what I want to do is read a verse to you. I want you to, if you don't mind, just to pay attention to what it actually says, not what you think it says, but what it actually says. This is Ephesians 1-11. So, we have obtained an inheritance, having been predestined according to his purpose, who works all things after the counsel of his will.

Okay? So, the question is, does he work all things after the counsel of his will? What's your answer? What does it mean to work all things?

I mean, I understand he has a will. First of all. First of all. I read you this scripture, and you have to agree with this scripture.

And then we asked that question. Do you agree that God works all things after the counsel of his will? I don't know, because I don't know what that verse means. Well, what do you think it means when it says God works everything after the counsel of his own will?

Everything is worked after what he considers and does. What do you think it means? Do you think God guesses? Do you think God looks into the future to see what people will do and reacts to what they're going to do? Do you think people's free will means God doesn't know what's going to happen?

Here's what I think it could mean. I think God has created the universe, and he has a will, and he works according to that will, but nevertheless, there are other circumstances to consider where things may not happen according to his will. Well, but the Bible says he works all things after the counsel of his will. So let me ask you, do you think God would predestine anything bad to occur? Do you think God would predestine anything?

Bad? Well, I do not believe God would predestine people to engage in sinful activity, no. Okay, now I'm going to read you two verses. This is Acts 4, 27, and 28. For truly in this city there were gathered together against your holy servant Jesus, whom you anointed, both Herod and Pontius Pilate, along with the Gentiles and the peoples of Israel, to do, so that means the ones who were doing this, Herod, Pontius Pilate, Gentiles, peoples of Israel, to do whatever your hand and your purpose predestined to occur. So I'm going to read it again, for truly in this city there were gathered together against your holy servant Jesus. That means if they're against Jesus, they're automatically in sin. They were gathered together against your holy servant Jesus, whom you anointed, both Herod and Pontius Pilate, along with the Gentiles and the peoples of Israel, to do whatever your hand and your purpose predestined to occur.

So these people were gathered against Jesus by God's predestined purpose. That's what it says. Honestly, I'm not familiar with that verse. I'd have to see the context and who's saying it and who's writing it.

I know it's in Acts, so it was written by Luke, but who is speaking in that instance? Well, look, you are perfectly entitled to go look at it in context, and you should, and I have no problem with that. What it says is clearly what it says. Now, I'm going to say something that you and a lot of other people, and I don't mean this in a derogatory sense, but a lot of people have just been taught that Jesus is the blonde-haired, blue-eyed Caucasian surfer dude dressed in a woman's nightgown, and that he's standing at the door of your heart asking permission for you and your wisdom to let him in. That's not biblical. A lot of people deny the idea that God will ordain evil to occur, and they also don't understand what ordain means, because ordination does not necessitate direct causation. If God knows someone's going to do something evil and he permits it, that is a form of ordination, because nothing can occur without the will of God, without the counsel of God, whether God directly brings it about by his own hand or indirectly brings it about by allowing it to occur. Either one is an ordination of God, and that's what that means. I actually, I kind of disagree with a lot of what you just said there, but I do have one quick question.

No, no, no, no, wait a second, wait a second, wait a second, wait a second, wait, wait, wait, wait. I'm giving you the biblical theology, I'm giving you the theological position. I'm telling you what this means. There's direct causation and indirect causation of God. God directly says, let there be light, and it occurs. And yet he put Adam and Eve in the garden knowing that they would sin. So let me ask you, did God not know Adam and Eve were going to sin?

Was it a surprise? He may have known. Did he know? He may have known. Did God? He may have known, but I'm not, I wouldn't say that he caused them to do that, no. Okay, you're not listening. I mean, respectfully here, you're not listening.

Okay, what you're doing is reacting, you're not listening. God directly causes things like, let there be light, the universe came into existence. He caused the garden to exist where it was.

He directly made Adam and Eve and put them in the garden. Are you with me so far? Do you have any problem with that? Yes. You do have a problem with that?

No, I don't have a problem with that, no. Now, did God know that Adam was going to choose to rebel against him? He probably did.

Wait a second, wait a second, wait a second. He probably did? I don't know what God you're serving, but apparently it's not the God of Scripture, because the God of Scripture, no, hold on a sec. The God of Scripture knows all things, and he knows all things that are potential as well as actual, because he knows everything.

There's not a, well, he probably knew. That's not the God of Scripture. That's not the God of Christianity. Well, some people do, some people question whether God knows what we're going to do if we truly have libertarian free will. Right, those are called open theists, and they're basically heretical in that view.

And I've written a great deal. Is that your opinion? Yes, it is my very educated opinion, and I've debated them, and I've written a lot on it. Open theism reduces God's sovereignty and majesty at the expense of human wisdom and sovereignty. You will find in Scripture that libertarianism doesn't work, because it's based in part on counterfactuals, which is the idea that people can do certain things in different situations according to their free will. But that would mean that their free will choices are outside the ordination of God. Then you get outside the realm of the true nature of who God is, and what you do is you start reducing God, the Christian God, and pretty soon you're no longer serving the Christian God.

You're serving something else. The Christian God knows all things from all eternity. There is no increase of God's knowledge. There is no change in God's knowledge. There is no condition in which God does not know what libertarian, and I don't agree with libertarianism, what libertarian creatures would or would not do.

And even if he did, if libertarianism was true, and he knows all potentials of what people will do, and he still brings it into existence that they would do this, then he's the one indirectly permitting and causing these things to occur. And so you need to study the issue of what's called direct causation and indirect causation, because I'm telling you, you don't know about these things. You don't know also about the decorative will and the prescriptive will. You also don't know about God. I do.

Really? What's the prescriptive will of God? Well, let me just say it. Okay, so you did.

Let me just say it is. You also need to study what is called ultimate causation, proximate causation, and deficient causation. I know all these things. Well, apparently you don't, because when I asked you to define one of them, you couldn't.

Well, you're just leveling all these accusations against me. Yes, I am. Hold on, buddy. We'll be right back. Hey, folks, we have three open lines. We'll get back to him after the break, and he's an open-fist, and that's the problem.

We'll go through that a little bit. Folks, be right back, 877-207-2276. It's Matt Slick live, taking your calls at 877-207-2276.

Here's Matt Slick. Welcome back, everybody. Anthony, are you still there? Yes. Okay. So you said you know these terms.

What's efficient causation? Well, can I have a second to say something? Sure, sure.

And then you'll go on for five minutes about how I don't know what I'm talking about, and then you won't be able to defend myself. It is my radio show. It is my radio show, and you don't. All right, well... Let's see you go.

Go ahead. Okay, well, you're... All right, well, here's the thing. I don't appreciate when I make a statement, and then you talk for ten minutes, and half of it is just, well, you don't understand anything. You said five minutes.

Now it's ten, and you're wasting time. So go ahead and make your statement. All right. Well, God could ordain that people have free will, and they operate accordingly. The problem with... First of all, the Westminster Confession of Faith, we established that it was concocted by Calvinists. Concocted? That's a negative, pejorative term. What do you think free will is? The ability to choose between two alternative paths or options at a given moment, according to... Does that include good and bad?

Yes, it does. Okay, so you're a humanist, because God can't choose to do good or bad, can he? So your definition is based on man, not God. Your system, the reform theology, throws in a whole bunch of presuppositions about the nature of God.

Excuse me, excuse me, excuse me. They're not explicitly... Anthony, Anthony, look, you just said free will means you can choose between and do good and evil, but that excludes God, so you don't base the definition on God's nature, but on the human nature. That's humanism.

No wonder you have a strong conclusion, you have a bad starting point. So let me ask you, in your view of Open Theism, does God learn? Well, you just... All right, let's go back to that point. Can God do bad? Does God learn?

I would... Does your God learn? No, God does not learn, no. Okay, can your God make mistakes? No.

Does your God know exactly what every creature's gonna do in every free will, libertarian even, situation, in all places, all times, all events? Uh, no. I don't, maybe not.

No? Oh, so God doesn't know all things, so then when it occurs, that means he's learning. Oh, okay.

So you are inconsistent. God is omniscient in the sense that he knows all things as they are, but due to having created humanity with... You just contradicted yourself. You said God knows all things, and you said he doesn't know all things.

So which is it? He knows all things as they are, but as a result of God's... Well, then I'll get a question. Okay, got a question for you. Did Jesus bear our sins in his body on the cross?

See, now you're changing to an entirely different subject. Did Jesus... I'm gonna show you where your theology really runs amok. Did Jesus bear our sins in his body on the cross?

Are you there? Do you know what the scripture says? 1 Peter 2.24. He bore our sins in his body on the cross. Do you believe he bore our sins in his body on the cross? In a manner of speaking, he did.

In a manner of speaking. So when the Bible says he bore our sins in his body on the cross, you say in a manner of speaking. So your God doesn't know all things. He grows in his understanding, and you don't even know if Jesus bore our sins in his body on the cross. In open theism, it's a heresy, okay? It's a heresy that you're believing. It's a false teaching, and you're leading to a false God. So your teaching says you don't even know if Jesus bore our sins in his body on the cross. So here's the question. If God only knows the present exhaustively, as open theism says, then how would he know what sins in the future to impute to anybody since they hadn't occurred, according to the people's free will choices?

How would he know? Again, these are the kind of theological assets that are a bit much deeper, but people can choose between good and... You can't answer, can you? You dismiss it. Look, I'm trying to show you that you believe something false. I want others to understand you believe something false. Folks, what open theism says is that God only knows the present exhaustively, not the future. If that's the case, how would he know which sins of the future people to impute to Christ so that Christ could bear those sins? According to libertarian free will, in open theism, God does not know everything. God has to grow in his understanding. He has to find out what's going to happen. So then how could he know what sins in the future anybody would commit in order to impute them to Christ on the cross? You see how it happens?

When you have a false God, you get to a false atonement, and this guy needs to repent, flat out. If you have any questions about open theism, go to my website, karm.org, forward slash open theism. Check it out. Let's get to Ray from Charlotte, North Carolina. Ray, welcome. You're on the air.

Hey, Matt. Thanks for having me on your show. Okay. I'm calling because I've been listening to you for a long time, and the thing is I really do enjoy just a lot of the difficult insights that you've given, but I'm struggling right now. I'm struggling because you've mentioned that there are some people that God predestines those who he's going to save, and I believe that.

That's what it sounds like. Right. And then there are people that God hates, and I've got to just give this out. I feel like God hates me, and this is why I think that. Okay. I'm not showing any proof of the Spirit. If I go into Galatians 5, it talks about how now the works of the flesh are evident, sexual morality, impurities, sensuality, fits of anger. I am still, I've been a Christian. I know.

I know. I've loved and trusted Jesus since I was seven years old, and I've been struggling with fits of anger and sexual immorality. It's been off and on.

I feel like I've been successful in waging war, and then I just fall right back into it, and I'm just tired of it. And then I'm not showing proof of the Spirit. I'm not showing, I feel like I'm not showing kindness. I'm not showing goodness, faithfulness, self-control. I have fits of anger. I don't have self-control. So I mean, how do I know that the Lord doesn't hate me?

How do I know that I'm not saved, and I'm basically, it doesn't matter what I do. Well, can I ask you some questions? Okay. Sure.

All right. So do you believe that Jesus Christ is God in flesh? Absolutely. Do you believe he died on the cross? I do.

Do you believe that he bore your sin in his body on that cross? I do. Do you believe he rose from the dead after three days? Yes.

I believe that he's alive now. Okay. And do you believe that- I just don't know if I'm a pope. If I'm believing- And hold on. Sorry. It's okay. And do you believe that you're declared righteous by faith?

Not by anything you do, but by faith in Christ? Okay. Do you? I believe that. All right. I just want to see it in me.

Okay. So what I want to say to you is, I would call you my brother in Christ. I would call you a brother in Christ who's got sin in his life that beats him and weakens him and hurts him. And yet God has still loved you and still chosen to save you and allowed you to struggle through your sin. And you failed so many times. And yet you turn to the cross, right? Don't you go back to that cross all the time?

Yes, sir. I feel like I'm coming back just every time as a failure. Well, you are.

And when you're at the cross with your face to the ground and you won't dare look up to it, just look to your side and you'll see me there with you. Because there are things that you're listing I have been guilty of and still struggling with. Now, not sexual immorality, but there are some other things that I have to deal with. And I'm not turning this into myself. I'm just saying we have problems. Your salvation is not dependent on how good you are or how bad you fail, but in your faith in Christ. Now, here's an odd thing I want you to think about.

We're going to talk about this some more because the break is coming up in a bit. Here you are, a man struggling, and you fail. I'm not saying your sin is okay.

I'm not saying that. You need to repent. But you go to the cross and that glorifies God every time that you admit your sin and you go to him and you say, please help me. And then you get weak and you fall and you go to the cross again. And what you're doing is you're admitting your weakness every single time. And you're going to the cross every single time. And you're appealing to Christ every single time. And it's by faith. That glorifies him.

Believe it or not, it does. Now, let's get back to the break. We'll talk a little bit more about what our stuff is, okay? Okay. All right? All right, brother.

Absolutely. All right. Hey, folks, we'll be right back after these messages. Please stay tuned.

It's Matt Slick live, taking your calls at 877-207-2276. Welcome back to the show, Ray. Are you still there? Yes, sir. All right. Yes, sir. Now, you went to Galatians 5, 19 through 23. The deeds of the flesh are evident. Yes. Which are immorality, impurity, sensuality, idolatry, sorcery, enmity, strife, jealousy, outbursts of anger, disputes, dissensions, factions, envy, drunkenness, carousing, and things like these of which I forewarn you, just as I have forewarned you that those who practice such things will not inherit the kingdom of God.

Right? Yes, sir. You're thinking, but I practice some of them so I can't be going to heaven, can I? I feel like if I... Sorry.

Go ahead. I feel like when it says now, I'm reading off of the ESV, and it says, I guess, that those who do such things will not inherit the kingdom of God, and then the next verse in 22, it talks about the fruits of the Spirit, and the thing is, when you mentioned earlier about repenting, I feel like every time that I mess up, I declare repentance. I'm like, Lord, I repented this. I want to repent.

At what point do I sit there going, okay, I'm repenting, and I'm still doing these things, and I'm not producing the fruits of the Spirit. Well, you're not producing the fruit. You don't produce the fruit.

No Christian does. It's the fruit of the Spirit, not your production. But I want to get back to something. You went to the ESV, which is fine, but the Greek word there for do is praso, and it means to practice, to do it habitually, a continued kind of a sense, and that's what he's talking about. What about if I do something...

I'm sorry. What if I do such... Okay, when you say if I'm doing habitually. Well, what if I'm doing those... I've fallen into that sin.

I'm good for a week or two, or even three, but then I go back. Wouldn't that be considered practicing? Yeah, in that sense, sure. But what is really meant in the context?

Because look at it. The deeds of the flesh are envied. Is this you?

Immorality, impurity, sensuality, idolatry, sorcery, enmity, strife, jealousy, helplessness, anger, disputes, dissensions, factions, envying, drunkenness, carousing. Is that you? Well, I mean, I just, I have impure thoughts. Yeah. Okay.

So do I. And I mean, but I'm not less fits of anger. I mean, I'll go... Yep, I lost my temper last night on a discussion forum. I shouldn't have. Yep. Okay, next.

Well, I mean, I probably got some envy there. Okay, so do I. I don't think I got drunkenness. I don't think I got drunkenness or... Neither, okay.

...or Jesus or... Okay. ...enmity. I don't think I got that or sorcery. Okay, I don't either.

I would not think it was... So you're reminding me of, well, you know, me and half the other people I know. What he's talking about here in the deeds of the flesh are those who practice them. They're not regenerate. Those are the ones who are not led by the Spirit. Those are the ones who are not saved. The reason you certainly appear to be saved to me is because you're alive and you're working. If you put a weight on a dead person, the person doesn't feel the weight. You put a weight on an alive person, he feels it.

You're feeling the weight of your sin upon you because you're alive in Christ. Now, as far as the fruit of the Spirit goes, it's not nine fruits. It's one. The Greek is karpas. It's a singular. The fruit, karpas, of the Spirit is.

It's one fruit in Greek. Love, joy, peace, patience, kindness. This is what God works in us. Now, look.

Right. Are you loving? I don't want to talk about perfectly, but are you loving?

Many times, yeah. I love my wife. I love my kids. Okay. Do you have joy sometimes? I love others.

Okay. Do you have joy? Joy, yeah. I feel like it comes and goes. All right. How about peace?

Am I conflating that with happiness? No, no. That's okay. We're not getting into too much particulars. Have a good one.