Matt Slick Live

The following program is recorded content created by the Truth Network. It's Matt Slick Live. Matt is the founder and president of the Christian Apologetics Research Ministry, found online at Carm.org. When you have questions about Bible doctrines, turn to Matt Slick Live for answers, taking your calls and responding to your questions at 877-207-2276. Here's Matt Slick.

Oh, there we go. Welcome to the show, everybody. If you want to give me a call, as usual, all you got to do is dial 8772-07-2276. I want to hear if anybody give me a call. And uh oh boy, let's see, got some good news.

Um So, you know, a lot of people have known that I wasn't going to go to the Jordan trip in November.

Well, now I'm going. My wife's health is uh stabilized enough that I'm gonna risk going. and all that's associated with that.

So Just let you know that I should be getting it go on that, and that's good. Looking forward to being able to go to Jordan and see Petra and The uh The place of Sodom and Gomorrah. That'll be interesting.

So, looking forward to it, and hopefully, everything will work out with that. All right, having said that, why don't you give me a call? 877-207-0. 2276.

Now I got a question for the listeners. And I want you to call me up and give me an answer. Um Yesterday Yesterday, I spoke about the American church isn't doing that well. It needs to be doing better. And uh You know, there's always room for improvement.

And I'm not his judge, but uh Well I've been thinking, and so what I'm going to ask you is to call me up. What would you like to see? What would you like to see a church provide? What kind of things would you like to see in a church that you don't think are being provided for? Uh You know, better teaching, uh, doctrinal studies, uh, witnessing evangelism things.

Um, Guest speakers, whatever it might be. Or do you think your church is just great and not a problem? And I'm not saying maybe because maybe it is. Maybe you've got a really good church. There are a lot of good pastors out there.

There really are.

So I was just kind of curious about that. And I've got a reason for asking, and I want to know What is your opinion on that? I'd like to get the feedback from people.

So it's a serious question. I have another reason for asking.

So there's that. You can call me at 877-207-2276. And also, you can email me if you want. You can email me at info at Carm.org info at C A R M dot O R G And put in the subject line radio comments or radio question. I want to hear Penguin.

So uh Give a call. All right. Um So I'm working on an article right now. I've been thinking about something, and I'll tell you what the article's about. It's not released yet.

Somebody get out of Islam. Because in Islam They say Muhammad is the best example of what it means to be a man. Is the excellent pattern, and that's Sura 3321. And um Yet the Koran says that Jesus never sinned. Yet Muhammad sinned.

Just basic. Basic questions.

Well then why is it that Muhammad is the one we should be following? How can he Be the best example of what it means to be a man. If Jesus the man Never sinned. But Muhammad did. That's just the question I'm asking.

I'm writing an article on this with possible responses, and I'm breaking it down because I want to be able to. Ask. The question. Of Muslims. And I have asked this question of Muslims, and they don't do very well answering it.

Seriously, they picked out.

Well, he's the he's what we're supposed to follow. But why? But he he sinned.

So how do you know that? What he did was right or wrong. If Jesus, every single thing he did was right or wrong, was right, because he'd never sinned. Then doesn't it make more sense to emulate him and go to him? And they've not given me a good answer.

And this, you know, it just demonstrates that the loyalty is not too truth not to Jesus but to Muhammad because there's a framework.

Now, in February, I'm supposed to be out in Dallas, Texas, for a debate with Nadir Ahmed. And the topic will be, he's a Muslim, the topic will be: is Jesus God or prophet? And I do hope to Really bring some good stuff to bear. I'm going to be working on that for a while. And if by any chance you have good.

resources from him, like videos you've seen, particular quotes that are interesting that you've noticed, you know, send them to me. Say, hey, look, you know, in this video, he says such and such and uh go check it out. Because I'm gonna be doing a lot of his a lot of research anyway. But uh I I wanna be able to uh you know just get ahead a little bit and um and know stuff because I really plan on uh dismantling him. I do.

That's my plan. Will it occur? We'll see what will happen. Let's get to Rich from Ohio. Rich, welcome.

You are on the air. Thank you. Sure. contemplating your question there and I believe it's uh Complacency in the church and the Holy Spirit that they're not striving to have a one-on-one with Jesus and the Holy Spirit. Yeah, they are.

Yeah, that that's um Yeah, you know, complacency is the word that strikes me. Because um I'm trying to be careful here. I'm not the judge of people in the church and how God God's working and pastors and stuff. But I do have my finger on the pulse. have a lot of false religions and they're gaining ground.

And Is the Christian Church gaining ground?

Well, you know The false religion of Roman Catholicism is growing, as is Eastern Orthodoxy and Islam. That's funny. I was just thinking that as you said that. Yeah, they are. They're false religions.

And um and people don't know. And I remember once I went to a seminar And um About 100 people there at this one. And I asked him a question: I said, How many of you believe in the Trinity? Just show me your hands. And the hands went up, you know, everybody.

So this is a state of 100 people, you know. Yeah. Basically everybody raised their hands.

Some people just don't raise their hands for things. But it was like in a 90 percentile range. I said, Okay, good, okay, good, no no problem. I said, now how many of you could define what the Trinity is, and if you raise your hand I'll call on you. And, you know, three, four hands went up and I called them.

And they didn't do perfect, but it was pretty good. They did okay. And I said, Now I'm asking more difficult questions: what's the difference between justification and sanctification? Nobody raised their hand. Is Jesus a man right now?

Half the hands went up. He said, How many say he's not a man right now? About half the hands went up. You know I was baptized. And, you know, I said, give me some answers, shout some answers out.

And they say, you know, identify with sinners. And they don't even know. This is pretty typical. And it's not like you have to know all these high-falutin things, but it's just that. They very often don't even know the basics.

It's really just a little bit of a test.

Well, I always break it down into Three crosses.

Okay. One was in the middle and he is God. His blood was shed. And the other one said, remember me. And that's it.

What what else is there to know?

Well, in a hostile world, where Where the The attack of Christianity is on the rise, and people in churches aren't really aware of this very much.

Some are, but There's lots and lots and lots of stories of people at work being told you can't have a Bible on your desk, but people can have the Quran on their desk. You know, the hypocrisy that's there. Where you're not allowed to have a Bible verse showing on your desk. Where schools will say to a child, you can't wear a shirt that promotes Jesus, but others can do what they want to do. This kind of thing.

There's an increase in the number of hostile attitudes with the the desire for harm to Christians that's on the rise in America as well. Then we have Islam, like Dearborn, Michigan is basically an Islamic country. I just talked about this ten minutes ago.

Alright. I've been up there. They're even changing the motor vehicles to. to their language. Yeah, and that's ridiculous.

And this is a serious problem, and it should never be allowed to occur in this country. Because what they will do is spread. It's a cancer. Islam is a cancer. When you get a religion in that is anti-republic, we're a constitutional republic, not a democracy.

The news needs to stop saying that we're democracies. We're a democracy. We're not.

So when you have a religion that's gaining foothold, doesn't adapt to our culture, doesn't learn, you know, largely, doesn't speak our language, and wants to promote a religious system that will ultimately overthrow the country, this is a problem. And you can't just hope it goes away and hope that they're going to change. They don't. Everywhere they go into the, every country they go, like Sweden now. Sweden used to be one of the highest safe places around.

And now, in the past 20, 20, 30 years, it's become. There's a lot a lot of violence that's there and it's because of of Muslim imm immigrants. They don't adjust it. Yeah, I know. Yep, I know.

Because they don't understand Islam Islam is not just a religion you think about like Christians do, hey, you know, and particularly state religions. Run Christian religions in Europe. To them, Muslims, it's a lifestyle. It is eternity and a lifestyle. It's lifestyle, it's law, it's in their families, it's in how they drive, it's in what they eat.

Constant. Everything is governed by Islam. Everything. And so to move away from any part of it is to reject Islam. And so they can't do that.

They have to gather in groups and they have to find strength in their groups. And then what they do is they have lots of kids. England, mathematically, from what I understand, to verify this, is lost to Islam already. Even though it's not in control of everything, the breeding rate, the the the offspring rate, uh the Muslims are going to be the dominant uh political force within, I think, fifty or sixty years or something like that. It's really Penguins a poor source because they've rejected Christ for a long time.

Yeah, that's right. Uh Yep. Yeah. Anyway, the thing is, I know what we can do. I know how to answer.

Muslims. I know how to refute Catholicism or Eastern Orthodoxy. I know how to equip Christians. I've been doing this for so long, it's my passion. And, um, In complacency with the Holy Spirit when they're lulled into capitalism and Please get to go.

There's nothing wrong with capitalism. That's a biblical approach. The thing is that they are. They're they're complacent because they're not under persecution. That's why.

Yeah, we're very comfortable. We're very comfortable in the country. Mark Zuckerberg just built a market. What is that? Facebook facility for 500 acres on the other side of Columbus, Ohio.

Okay. Uh All right. And so, when you put in the Old Testament AI, was conquered by Joshua and the Israelites, Does history repeat itself? Possibly.

Well, I want to talk about the actual facts of what our country's in. And that's the thing that concerns me: is why is it that the Christian churches that I'm aware of aren't going door to door? I know there are churches that do that. People are fearful. Yes, well they don't need to be.

The pastors and the elders should be leading them. Here's an example. We're going to go out and go door to door. Just pass out tracks, do it for a half hour. But the pastors are fearful of losing their congregate.

Maybe. That's one of the problems. Hey, look, we got a break, so we're gonna get going.

Okay, Rich, thanks for calling, buddy. Really appreciate it. Hey folks, we have two open lines, 877-2072276. We'll be right back. It's Matt Slick Live, taking your calls at 877-207-2276.

Here's Matt Slick. All right, and welcome back to the show. If you want to give me a call, the number is 877-207-2276. Let's get on with Jermaine from California. Jermaine, brother.

Welcome, man. You're on. Hey, Matt, I um Wanted to ask about. I guess I told the call screener about all worship, but. I see a lot of like gangs, fraternities, and all these other people who are doing these horrible crimes and you start to dig into it and it looks like more ritualistic worship of something demonic.

And I I was just kind of wondering does the Bible I mean, you hear about Baal worship and societies being wiped out for this, but Does it elaborate on what that is? Or do we take it for granted like People just knew that in the past. like exactly what those practices were.

Well, not sure what you're asking, but uh Baal worship was paganism with idols, uh ritual prostitution, sacrifice of the young. I won't say too much here 'cause and uh Varying mutilations and various stuff that they did. And so God warned them, stop. They didn't. God had him wiped out.

So is your question... Is that happening today, this kind of thing, or what? You know what? Yeah, I guess I should have clarified it a little better. When I s just researching like the cartels.

And some of these gangs that do just extreme forms of wickedness, they they find altars. And then they look at the numbers of people who have been slaughtered. And I'll be discreet because I know there might be young people listening. just the numbers and the methods of of uh that basically tortures and the way some of these people are killed. is beyond simple homicide.

It's like there's a point to this. And it seems ritualistic.

So I guess that's what I was more asking: is this. Is this reminiscent of what God wiped out? Because I find. Yes. Certain people come out of the mafia They mentioned when they're quote a made man how they have these blood rituals.

Uh blood cubness, literal mock baptisms involving blood and they they have to swear on effigies and then they're burning You know, the saints. And I'm like, wait a minute, this is beyond normal here. This sounds like. A bunch of people are involved in some ritualistic stuff, and maybe the lower levels are not aware of it, but. Clearly someone is directing this.

Um well, um I can't say a lot of things that I'm familiar with. over the air. But there are some exceedingly demonic manifestations in people. Who? Will do, I gotta say this very carefully, who will do some pretty heinous.

torturous things to people. for ritualistic Oh okay. practices. to their false gods. And This is Bohemian Grove.

Some aspects of it And um How do I say this? Groups. that uh serve the evil one. and different types of groups are ritualistic. Then there's subgroups.

that exist. And I'm trying to be careful here, but it's one of the reasons there are disappearances of young. and other things. And so the stronger the demonic forces get, the larger the doors of demonic forces. open.

And it can perpetuate.

So You know uh I did an article, Signs of the End Times. And I have uh twenty-three things I found in Scripture. Presence of false Christs, false prophets, war, persecution of the faithful, apostasy, that means a Christian church is going to go bad. which, you know, it's one of the things I've been talking about this week so far. Lawlessness will increase, love will grow cold, increase of selfishness, ungodliness, unholiness.

mocking of Jesus and the rise of Spiritism. Spiritism is contacting horses. That are out there. I was in a room in Oculus, which is a 3D room. I go to different places and I witness.

And uh I do I win this everywhere I can. I mean but at any rate.

So I need to get a new oculus, one of the new ones, 'cause the mine's getting old. But I was in this room, and this guy was telling me about how he creates his own theology. out of his preferences of what he desires in a new age type Um emphasis. And he has a family, and apparently he was doing nice things, but he was trying to make his own religion. and he was very articulate about how to do it.

And what truth really was. And I had to undermine him logically. Say, let this make sense because of this, and tried to point him to Jesus.

So that's just an example of the kind of spiritism, which has many facets, that's alive and well today. And I could tell you other stories.

Okay, is this the kind of conversation that would be okay for the after show? We can talk more about it on the after show, particularly when it's not being recorded. Then I get to say things. But here's an example of something. Years ago, before I was married.

I went to a Masonic Lodge. I wouldn't go into it. I wasn't participating. I was in an adjacent building. And hey, look, a Masonic Lodge.

I went over and just opened the door and walked in. What was really weird is for about two years at that time, Uh I went to a lot of buildings, uh religious Buildings and just open the door and walk in. There'd be nobody there. Happened over and over and over again. I mean, strange, like driving down the road and having an urge.

to stop at a particular Mormon ward. Just dri I still remember it, driving down and something in me said, Go in there. What? I pull off and the first door I go to, it's open. And I go in.

I'm the only one in the entire building. And just things like this.

So I went into this Mason, Masonic Lodge. And um It was, I still remember it, a large room, all these chairs, and in the center area towards the front was a large podium kind of an area that was r raised, that you had a you'd step up into it. It might be six feet by five feet kind of the size. You step into it, had a little kind of an entrance and a chair or two in there. And there was a a po A platform inside of it that you'd have books open, that you'd face the people, that you'd talk.

And you know, you can imagine that setup.

So I looked at these books and I fanned through the books for a bit, and I found two interesting statements: Jesus is not God. And Christians are a problem. We need to get rid of them. And I read it with my own eyes.

So this was back basically forty some odd years ago. And I thought about taking both of those books, but that would have been theft, so I couldn't have done it. But uh 'cause it was documented. I had it I saw it with my own eyes.

Now have you ever ever heard of Bohemian Grove? I I'll just say generically, there's some really bad stuff associated with that. There's some really bad stuff so associated with Hollywood in the upper echelons. I've talked to two people who worked in Hollywood and knew people like one Person knew, I wouldn't say the names in case it gets out, but if I said the name of who this person knew, you'd recognize, are you kidding me? That person?

One of the top 20. 20 people in the world as actors. And Two people I talked to who worked in that industry. Told me to my face. Straight straight out.

That the stuff that goes on behind closed doors in those upper restaurants of the Hollywood. elite? It's just Horrible. Horrible. is Paul worship.

So, hold on, buddy. We gotta break. We gotta break. And be right back, folks, after these messages, please. Stay tuned.

It's Matt Slick Live, taking your calls at 877-207-2276. Here's Matt Slick. All right, everyone, welcome back to the show. If you want to give me a call, it's easy. 877-207.

2276.

Jermaine, are you still there? Oh, yes, I am. All right. So anyway, got it break right there, but uh You got any more comments? Wanna add anything?

Yeah, just um So I guess I actually live Just a couple of hours from the the uh Infinis URL then. Yeah. Okay, can you hear me better now? Yeah, yeah.

Okay, go ahead. Yep.

Okay. Yeah, I I live a couple of hours From the Bay Area, from the infamous Grove. And these stories have been out for so long that they're not. The saddest part is they're not necessarily secret, but a lot of people don't seem to believe or care. And right.

When you you hear uh you hear enough of this stuff, it's a trend. And I think it would be at least worthy of, if not investigation, at least prayer. And I think that's where a lot of believers, they kind of I heard your frustrations earlier, and I concur with that, but a lot of believers. need to really be praying against this stuff. Because these people are organized and they're following their practices religiously and.

You have a lot of American Westernized Christians who are way too comfortable. And that's how these groups, you know, they're able to kind of gain power and. and kind of stay there because I I truly believe if we were focused on praying and combating these things and there's spiritual work there.

So Warfare doesn't always have to be in a tank. It could be on your knees in prayer and through the study of God's Word because that's the only thing. that shuts a lot of this stuff down. You know, and that's why You just You know, you've become the the oddball, but If you're an oddball for the Lord, it's okay. You know, don't.

It's outside of conformance to this world. They don't like it anyway.

So Right. I wish more believers would would uh be willing to talk about this stuff. and at least just organize some prayer against it. Yes, um Yeah. You know, I've talked about this so many times over the year, and uh The risk is Matt Slick sounds like an arrogant jerk trying to judge everybody in the church.

And uh I can understand that that problem. Um but You know, the the truth is that I've seen what the power of the gospel can do. In my life and the lives of others. And pastors, and I've been doing research on this. What does it mean to equip the body of Christ?

What does it mean to do that? In fact, I've been researching it, and I'm going to write an article on it. And I want to write an article on the apostasy of 2 Thessalonians 2. and then an article on what can we do to to fix it. Uh And so Yeah.

Complacency is the problem in the Christian Church. And And it's not bad to have a comfortable uh country to live in and and have uh air conditioning and you know, GPS cars and stuff. It's all good stuff. But we just get accustomed to it and People our neighbors will be going to hell. And You know, as I've said at some seminars, I've said, How many of you, let me see your hands.

I'm not going to call on you, just how many have, you know, had Mormons or Jehovah's Witnesses knock on your door? You know, 95% of the hands will go up. I'll say, yeah, that's right. And you know they're not Christian, right? And is that the case?

You know, heads will nod all over the place. I'll say. And so you just say, you're not interested, right? And they go, yeah, that's right.

Okay, good.

Now, let me rephrase that. How many of you have done this? The Jehovah's Witnesses, the Mormons come to your door and you say to them, Excuse me, I know you're preaching a false God and a false gospel. I'm busy. Could you go to my neighbor?

Because that's essentially what's happening. And a lot of times Christians think that they have done their job by just saying no, thank you. They close the door and go back into doing whatever they're doing. And these false teachers go to the next door. Just you know I do not understand.

I don't understand it. How Christians can let that happen? I don't Get it. You know they're preaching false gospel, false God. And then they just go to their neighbors.

I mean, what I have done, they don't come to my door anymore for some strange reason. But what I'll do is I'll say no, thank you. Actually, I'll invite them in. And once they realize you know not Gonna join up and stuff, then they want to go and they go to my neighbors. I can't stop them from that, but what I do is I go get in my car and I just watch.

Air conditioned, nice, relaxed. And make notes of what houses they go to and spend time at. Can I go back? with literature. You know, it just It's not hard to do.

I'm whining. I just see what the frustration is. I know that God, what he can do to to wake us up, is just under persecution. That's what he'll do if he wants to wake us up. There's two ways, I say to people, there's two ways.

to get yourself right with God. One is voluntarily, the the hardship now that you deal with God as He works in you? Or the other one is involuntarily with the hardship that God puts you through to get you to come to Him and trust Him more.

So which one do you want it to be? And what what happens is nothing. And I'd like to know if any pastors are listening. They call me up and just say, What are you doing to equip the body of Christ? Yeah.

It's not a judgment thing. It's like, well, what are you doing? You know, give me some ideas. How are you doing things? You know, are you just preaching on a Sunday?

Providing doctrine classes, evangelism classes, apologetics classes, marriage counseling classes. You know, how to interpret the Bible classes, how to raise people up to teach Bible study classes to start them in your neighborhood. There's so many things that could be done. And here I go, reminiscing of my own whining. At least whining's biblical, I know that, because it The Bible says take a little wine for your stomach, so I'd do that.

Oh. Hey, he's gone. I'm just talking to myself. Didn't even know it. Anyway, I was just rambling.

Thinking out loud. Let's get to Alan from Ohio. Alan, welcome. You're on the air. Thank you.

Yeah, right. Cool and list after listening to you, um, engage with the previous callers thinking about the original question of What do you think, uh um About What can be done in church and And then The gathering of the the true members of the body, you know, I think in these days and times we're living in now. We should uh hearing About How to Um be prepared. for all these um False religions. And what we're up against.

And maybe reduce the recreational and entertainment. where these uh where they're gathered at these buildings, wherever they're gathered. And uh Preach the word. I don't have to prepare and help. to uh do all to stand and Fight the good fight.

Keep the faith. Right.

Well, um The uh What to do? But you know Something interesting occurred when I was doing marriage counseling, when I was counseling couples. I did it for years and years. I haven't done hardly any in a couple of Three years now. And So I counseled thirty-six couples, and when I counseled It's two three a lot of noise in the background there It's two, three, four hours at a time.

And um Are you there, Pen? Mirror and noises.

Okay. So I'm here. Yeah, if you're if there's a lot of noises coming back, I always it distracts me, I'm autistic, but I always think of people on the freeway driving, listening, wondering what those clanks and those noises might be, as it might be distracting them, might want to be unsafe on the road. But um One of the things I would do in counseling is teach the doctrine of the Trinity, and I started with God. And believe it or not, and I can connect the dots this way, but a lot of times the marriages just got better.

because they understood What the reason was for the faith, what they were to do in relationship to God. And anyway, the point is this: that I believe that pastors need to teach the basics of the Christian faith and provide classes on a regular basis that does that. Maybe on a year cycle, whatever they do, you know, like the month of whatever, January is the basic doctrine. And they work up a manual. And then the next month is learning what we've learned, how to witness to the Catholics, and then how to witness to the, or the Catholics and the East Orthodox, you know, how to deal with.

how to deal with the Mormons, how do we answer atheism, how do we answer evolution, and things like that, because we need to have that and pastors need to do it. There needs to be a source that they can go to and that's trustworthy. where they could download free lessons and things like that. That's what needs to happen. Are you there?

There's a lot of noise, man. Are you done? Yeah. Okay. So, uh Anyway, the Christian, the pastor needed to be praying and asking God to...

to send them and use them. to equip the body because And I can go anyway. We've got a break, so we'll just move along and we'll talk about this some more afterwards. Thanks a lot for calling, Alex. Good question, good issue.

Hey folks, we have four phone lines. You want to call me? 877-20722. 7-6, she'll be right back. It's Matt Slick Live, taking your calls at 877-207-2276.

Here's Matt Slick. Alright everyone, welcome back to the show. Trying to think here. Should I continue on with the basic discussion I've been going through, which probably is irritating and boring people, but I feel it's necessary to talk about this kind of thing. I'm hoping that.

people are motivated to study God's Word and to risk the idea of taking up their cross daily and following after him and saying that they want to serve God and they want to just have a relationship with him in a in a in a Well, a stronger way, but to be used by him. And that could be in a lot of different ways. It can be used, you know, raising kids is important and stuff, but as a whole. The Christian church needs to be more evangelical, it needs to be more prepared. You know, Ephesians 4:11 and 12 says, And he gave some as apostles, and some as prophets, and some as evangelists, and some as pastors and teachers, for the working It's going to be for the equipping of the saints, for the work of service.

Or some translations say the work of ministry. to the building up of the body of Christ.

So, different translations say different things: work of ministry, work of service, but the Greek. there is from Diaconius, which did we get deacon, a servant.

So it's the work of ministry or the work of service. It refers to that labor. that every believer is called to do. In the Christian church and part of the Christian church's ministry. and mission commissioned by God.

Because Jesus says, go out and make disciples. to all nations. And this is what he said to do.

So, you know, okay, well, we should be doing that.

Well, What's interesting is in Ephesians 4:7, this is before earlier in the chapter. He says, But to each one is given the manifestation of the Spirit for the common good.

So, excuse me, I've read the wrong verse. That's 1 Corinthians 12:7. I'm going to go to Ephesians 4, 7, but to each one of us, God. Grace was given according to the measure of Christ's gift.

So each one of us as Christians, we have gifts. Each one of us his grace was given according to the measure of Christ's gift. Each one of us. And then now we're going over to 1 Corinthians 12, 7. And here's a question I'm going to ask before I read this.

If the charismatic gifts have ceased for today, Then does that excuse us? from from operating in the giftings God given us. Just a thought. It says in 1 Corinthians 12, 7 through 11, it says, um. But each to each one is given the manifestation of the Spirit for the common good.

For to one is given the word of wisdom. another the word of knowledge, another uh faith. The same spirit. Um Another gift of healing, another miracles, another prophecy, another distinguishing of spirits, another various kinds of tongues, and then interpretation of tongues. But one and the same spirit works all these things, attributing to each one individually as he wills.

Now, I can't help but wonder if the idea of cessationism, that all these gifts are gone, could it be used as an excuse to not move in the gifts that God has given us in the church and then go just sit in the church on Sundays and be babysat? I don't know. There's a thought I've got. But what we're called to do, what the pastors are called to do, is build up the body of Christ, equip them for the work of service, the work of ministry. That's what they're called to do.

And when I was a pastor, that's what I did as well. Who tried to get people to understand the Word of God?

Now I'm a little bit different in that I believe they need to know some theology. I believe they do, I think it's necessary for all preaching. and that uh every now and then during the services, during the sermons, that uh when it's appropriate, a a deeper theological perspective needs to be visited for a minute or two. And to get into the theology so people can get a sense of what's going on. I also believe that.

Churches should be offering, if possible, mid-week studies where they can advance in theology.

Now, people think, no, you don't need theology, you just need Jesus. No, that's not true. To say that you don't need theology, you just need Jesus is a theological position. And so it's self-refuting to say you don't need theology, you need Jesus. Theologically speaking, Jesus Christ is God in flesh, died on the cross, rose from the dead.

You trust in Him for your salvation. And that is theology. Everybody has it in the Christian church. And too many excuses, in my opinion, have been made across. across denominations to not equip the body of Christ.

I I it this is what needs to be done. What needs to be needs to be done. Needs to be done. Let's get to Dan from North Carolina. Dan, welcome, you're on the air.

All right. Hey, hey, hey, Matt. First of all, I appreciate your show and thank you and God bless you for your service. I've listened to you for many years, never really called in, but. Um My question is this, sir.

Respectfully, you know, the in the, and I'm driving, I can't tell you in scripture, but where the Bible says, where two or three are gathered in my name, there I am also.

So my question to you is this. How do you feel about people who are at home. Who are unable to go to a Christian church, maybe because of sickness or whatever. But yet they tune into Uh Television on Sunday, and they do their church service in their living room. And but yet at the same time, In comparison to going to a physical church where it might be much more spiritual, much more uplifting.

But you're all around there to where if you're doing it by television. And I just wanted to get your sentiment or your thoughts on that. Yeah, um Normatively speaking, people need to attend a local congregation. Normally, okay. But what do you do?

When uh you know, something happens, you can't drive. Or you're living on a fixed income and you literally can't afford gas and you had to get rid of your car. You just have enough to live on. These situations are real.

So then what do you do?

Well, turn on the T V. Find a good uh Sunday preacher. and just fellowship the best you can. With the Lord Jesus through the preaching and the teaching of the Word. It's not a real church service.

But uh It's better than nothing. And it's good. I would say if you can't go to church, then do that. Just don't listen to Kenneth Copeland, don't listen to Joyce Meyer, false teachers. No.

Yeah. Joel Osteen, you know, there's a lot of charlatans out there, people who don't. who don't teach good biblical theology. Yeah. I I I'm I don't want to prom I'm not trying to promote a television ministry, but I I I'd be honest with you, I listen to the SDN network.

Um and um Of course, Jimmy Swaggert passed away, but to make a little story short, And I know a lot of people now that they tune in at 12 o'clock on the East Coast, and they're actually joining that church. more and more. Uh and I and I I you know, and and I feel that uh well I I j Oh well, let me say it this way. Going to a church, I think, is more spiritual uplifting than sometimes doing it by T V. But again, like you said, there's some people who are unable to due to sickness.

So that's why I just want to see how you felt. Right.

Well I agree. My own wife. Lately she's been improving. And I've th I'm so thankful for everybody, all your prayers. But we went to church on Sunday.

For the she went to the church for the first time in months and months and months because she. beforehand has not been able to sit in one chair. Because it's so painful. And now she's able to endure it. And um Sounds really a lot of anyway.

So we went.

Well, I get it, you know. And so I didn't say you have to go. I said, well, when you're ready and you're able to, let's do it. And she we went.

So, praise God. But yeah, there are people who just can't come and turn on T V.

Now Stay away from Joel Osteen, Benny Hann, Creflo Dollar, Kenneth Copeland, Paula White, Joyce Meyer. Those are my recommendations. Yes, sir. But I don't know about swagger ministries. Maybe they've gotten better.

Who knows? Uh you know, so I just Yeah.

Well, wh well unfortunately you're not on on Sunday. or you don't have like you said, you don't minister no more, you do the Christian apologetics. Right.

In reference to your wife, and you know, I I tell you, this is what I do. When I feel sickness or when I feel pain, I just raise my hands and I just start praising and worshiping the Lord from my heart. And I say, you know, I thank you, God, for the pain in this muscle in my leg. or a pinch nerve or or whatever it is. And I just start praising and worshiping God.

And I literally will take my hand and I'll just start tapping that area. You know, the Bible says praise the Lord in all things, both good and bad. And when I do that, I find a lot of times He is my medicine. He makes the medicine work. But I have, I was burdened for when you had talked originally about your wife.

And I pray for your wife, and I pray for the Karm ministry because it is a blessing and it is an inspiration. And I'm not giving you glory, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, but I'm acknowledging your ministry because you have really reached out to the general public. And you've made your sand, and I love that. And we don't have that in churches anymore, we don't have that. like we used to to have.

And I appreciate you, and God bless you for your stand. And in and being format is in the word. Uh you know, and you always are a blessing to me and um I I feel like there's a lot of People who don't call. But I'm sure they share that same sentiment and they pray for you just like I do. But anyhow, I love you, brother, and God bless you, and thank you for taking my call.

Sure, Brett, I really appreciate it. I appreciate the kind words as well. Praise God. Sure, sure. Thank you.

And thank you for controlling your callers, too, when they get a little bit carried away because we really want to hear. Hey, hey, hey, hey, I asked you, what is your question? Excuse me, sir. Can you respectfully just give me the question? Love you, man.

God bless you. God bless you. Thank you, sir. Bye-bye. God bless.

You know what he just said, you know. Referencing when I say, well, you got a question. I can't tell you how many times people have referenced that very thing. That's one of the things, the most common I've heard, you know, listen to your show, and they'll be talking, they'll say, and then they'll get somebody who just doesn't ask a question. You'll go, what's your question?

three times. That's what I get the most comments about, which I get a kick out of. Oh, let's get the Fred from Virginia Fred, we got about two minutes in the show. What's up, buddy? Yeah, real quick, thank you for taking my call.

I really love listening to your show. I want to share my view on you know, most churches don't disciple their people at any point. Especially the new ones.

So anyway, I belong to a group which is called 2-7. It comes from Colossus 2-7. And they've been around for decades. It's been a kind of a proven method. of discipling people.

And uh, I just wanted to put that out there. You can look it up, and uh, I love it. It's it's uh I've been a believer for years, and this is the first time I've ever really have been uh Mm-hmm. I don't know, trained and equipped because I believe that's the thing that is lacking, amongst other things.

So anyway, I just wanted to put that out there. And that's cool again. I want to check it out. What's it called? Oh, Navigators, yeah, they're a good group.

Uh-huh. Yeah. So yeah, two seven. A lot of people just uh they they don't really want to do it because they don't want to uh be discipled, you know, and uh I think when it comes down to it, I think Charles Spurton said if you're not discipling somebody, you're not a disciple. Yeah.

I don't know if you ever heard that or not. No, I haven't heard it, but that's perfect. I agree with it. Yeah, I agree with it. You know, But here's the thing: you know, I don't want to guilt with people, we've got just a few seconds in the show here.

But if they're, what about a mom just staying home and raising kids? Is that discipling? Absolutely, yes, it is.

So, there's different ways we can minister in the body of Christ. For sure. Yeah, that's right. And I'm not saying you weren't saying that, but I'm just throwing it out. Right.

But just think about it. Who, most of all, would you want to disciple?

Well, your own children. You know, uh let alone anybody else, you know.

So yeah, uh I'm gonna step on my kids. Late night. Thank you. God bless. I appreciate it.

And sorry, we just had to tell him there's a heartbreak. And we're going to show up. Thanks, Matt. God bless. Thanks for calling, Pratt.

Hey folks We're out of time, and the Lord bless you by His grace. Back on there tomorrow, we'll talk to you then. Have a good evening. Another program powered by the Truth Network.