Matt Slick Live

The following program is recorded content created by the Truth Network. It's Matt Slick live. Matt is the founder and president of the Christian Apologetics Research Ministry, found online at KARM.org. When you have questions about Bible doctrines, turn to Matt Slick live.

Francis taking your calls and responding to your questions at 877-207-2276. Here's Matt Slick. Hey everybody, welcome to the show.

It's me, Matt Slick, and you're listening to Matt Slick live. If you want, you can give me a call. As usual, all you have to do is dial 877-207-2276, and if you are interested, you can also send me an email.

That's easy to do as well. I'll put the subject line, radio comments, radio questions, something like that. I'll get into it and answer questions. Let's see, hopefully everything sounds good. Good, okay. All right, so I'm still doing research and writing some stuff, and researching what's called the recapitulation theory of the atonement, Christus Victor, and other things.

Doing that, not a big deal. And let's see, what else? I had to do some shopping today, and I talked to this woman who had one of those head cap things on, and she was a Church of God Mennonite. And she was nice, and we just had a little... I go, hey, what church do you go to?

Because they dress a certain way. And Church of God in Christ Mennonite, that's what it was. And we just had a nice little conversation. So that was interesting, and I asked her to believe the Trinity. She says, yes, and you could lose your salvation, though, and things like that. So let's see, I'm reading some of the stuff that they teach, feet washing, and matrimony is a divinely instituted thing, and the sacredness of human life, education, purity, modesty, apparel. Oh, the beard. That reminds me, I remember I went out a few years ago, and I met some guys from the Mennonite church, and they invited me over, and we had some nice dinner. All the ladies were dressed in that Mennonite style, and the guys all had beards. And I said, we'd sit down to talk theology. I says, how come you guys have all beards? Just curious. And he goes, how come you don't?

I realize they're not going to answer the question. They weren't mean. Well, don't look good with a beard.

My wife says, if you have a beard, no smooching. And I said, so that pretty much knocked that off. And they just chuckled, nice folks and everything like that. But boy, I'll tell you, they sure did not like the doctrines of grace, the idea of God's election and predestination. It's really interesting how many people just don't like it. And I've been trying over the years to really understand the other view now.

And it's hard, because why is it that they don't believe what it says? Anyway, it's just one of the things. So no big deal.

All right. So hey, look, if you want to give me a call, the number's 877-207-2276. So last night, we had a caller who called up. And we were discussing the issue of the Trinity. And I was talking about it being the necessary preconditions for all intelligibility.

I don't know if any of you are interested in continuing that discussion. It gets complicated. It gets sophisticated. It's one of those things where, if I were to teach it at a seminar, you'd have slides and a handout where people can understand the concepts and stuff like that.

But it is worth getting into sometimes. But one of the analogies and things I use when discussing the doctrine of the Trinity is time. And what I'll do is I'll say that time is one thing, one substance, one thing.

Time is, but it exists as what we call three aspects, the aspects being past, present, and future. And I say, God is one thing. And we see within him the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. And we recognize their distinction, I should say, by their relationship to each other and to creation.

And it's a really good way of illustrating what the Trinity is, that it's one thing, one being, and that reminds me of something else, one being, one being. And I try to remember because someone wrote an argument against that whole thing. And they presented it to me. And I'm trying to remember where it is because I copied the argument.

I copied what he said. Now, here it is. Here it is.

Here it is. I got it. And it didn't make any sense. So this guy gave me this argument, P1, P2, P3, P4, and P5. It's a premise one, two, three, four, five. And it actually is kind of a conclusion.

P5 is a conclusion. And so he said, God's essence is singular and cannot be separated, divided, or petitioned. He said, Matt, do you agree with that?

I said, yes. He says, God's essence is identical to his action. It's a premise. And then I said, what does that mean?

What does it mean? Because the main issue here is that it seems to confuse the unchanging divine essence with a variety of God's actions in time, leading to category errors. And the confusion of the categories between the creator and the creation, potential implications of God being the author of sin. And he wasn't able to really get into it much more. He was just repeating what some of the things he'd heard.

And so that's one of the problems. And then P3, all perceived actions from God are one action. And I said, well, that's ridiculous. That blurs the distinction between God's thinking and God's doing. So that it says his actions are all of his perceived actions are just one action.

And that doesn't make any sense. And I even said, well, that makes no sense because it says perceived actions is plural, which are really one action. And I said, so the statement itself, it seems to be self-refuting.

So that was that. And then he said, number four, any singular decree of God is an action of God. And I said, well, yeah, it's an action of God to decree something.

I said, yeah. And then his conclusion was, since God decrees all things that come to pass, including sin, God's essence is sin. And the conclusion did not follow from the premises. And it was just a bad argument. And this was, believe it or not, given by a Mormon who said he was studying Catholic theology. Because there's a filter, a couple of filters to go through to try and get everything understood.

And it didn't make any sense. And so I said, well, maybe you might want to go polish that argument a little bit. And anyway, that was one of the things that I got into recently. Yeah. All right. Now, look, folks, if you want to give me a call, you can, 877-207-2276.

You can also email me info at karm.orginfo at karm.org. Put in the subject line, radio comment, or radio question, and we can get to you. And let's see. So here's some of the radio questions that are emailed in to us.

Let's see. My husband and I both grew up claiming to be Christians, but did not truly accept the gospel and received the spirit until 23 after we were married. My husband has previously married.

His ex left him because they didn't get along. I have a Church of Christ friend who is claiming that we are in perpetual adultery now and must divorce. Can I help understand that?

Yeah, I can. So again, Church of Christ basically is a cult. So you've got to be careful of what it says. Anybody from the Church of Christ is legalistic cult stuff. And they teach that salvation is dependent on your baptism and your faithfulness and things like this. So with them, legalism is a natural conclusion to their system of thought. And the legalism here is that now you're in perpetual adultery, so you have to divorce. Well, not necessarily.

So here we go. So the husband grew up and this lady claimed to be Christian, but not really didn't accept the gospel until 2023. So the husband was previously married.

His ex left him because they didn't get along. So there are two grounds for divorce in the Bible. One is adultery and the other is abandonment in 1 Corinthians 7. So if his ex left him, then that's a biblical grounds for divorce. So if a man and a woman are married and she leaves him and won't be reconciled for whatever reason, then she's abandoned him. She's broken the covenant and he's innocent in that. And so then he is free to remarry. So no, he's not an adultery in that sense.

So no, I could just get rid of that. And adultery is having sexual relations outside of your marriage partner. And so if that's the case, then that would be adultery.

But since the previous wife left him, abandoned him from what the sentence says, then he's innocent. Okay, hope that helps. So yeah, you need to stay in the... And I'm reading...

This is actually interesting. We have email helpers and I'm going to read what he said. I'm sorry to hear about your complicated situation.

You're in my personal suggestion on this would be that you should stay in your current marriage rather than divorcing because that would be breaking another set of promises. That's true. However, I understand it is not a simple question and I understand that your Church of Christ friends view, ultimately you may have to agree to disagree with your Church of Christ friend. It's a good generic answer. And so there we go. So I've answered that and hopefully, hopefully a person is listening and I've answered the question because it says, hey, it's on the show. Let's get to another question. I'm currently going through a difficult season emotionally and mentally, but I don't know if this is something I should talk about with other believers or bear my own. My question is, how do we discern between the burden mentioned in Galatians 6, 2 and burden mentioned in Galatians 6, 5 in our own lives? That's interesting because the person is saying there's different words there.

So now I have to go look. So let's do this. Galatians 6, 2, bear one another's burdens. I know that verse and the word burden there is, okay, 9, 22. And then Galatians 6, 5 and bear his own load.

Yeah. And that's a different word. So what it's saying is bear one another's burdens and thereby fulfill the law of Christ. For if anyone thinks he is something when he is nothing, he deceives himself, but each one must examine his own work and then he will have reason for boasting in regard to himself alone and not in regard to another, for each one should bear his own load. You know, it reminds me what's happening. Paul is just simply using different words, the same way we would use different words to get the idea across.

I don't think we have to worry too much about what this is. Bear one another's burdens. And the idea is, let's see, is barre, is burdensome weight in reference to its pressures, burden load, burden of the day, designated precepts, to designate precepts which are burdensome, et cetera. And the other one is, it's 4T on, and that is a diminutive in form but not in the sense the goods or merchandise carried by a ship. Okay, interesting. So the first one is the difficulties you have and the other one is the loads and stuff that you carry, the burden of ceremonial observances, which is used also that way, figuratively the burden of Christ's commandments.

So they're both, they're just different words generally conveying the same idea. And if you want to talk to other people about stuff, just talk to them what you trust. And good Christian counsel is what you need. Hey, there's the music. We'll be right back after these messages.

We have Wide Open Lines. Give me a call, 877-207-2276. We'll be right back. All right, welcome back to the show.

I should have read the text from somebody. All right, during the break, I shared my screen. And somebody yesterday took my image and made me into a saint. And it's a really well done graphic. And it has me with that hand thing, some of the saints, these weird icons had a hand. And I'm in an old robe and took my face and it's caricatured, but it looks good.

And then I have a microphone in my hand, a radio microphone, like Pope Slick or Saint Matt Slick. Anyway, it's well done. It's funny.

And I got a copy of that yesterday. And so during the break, I just popped it up on the screen so that the people who are during the break in the chat room are there. And then one person, I just saw one word. He goes, scary. So it made me laugh right when the break ends. Oh, man.

You know, I got to stop that because it makes me laugh. All right, let's get to Alberto from Georgia. Alberto, welcome. Alberto, you're on the air.

Yeah, good evening, Matt Slick. My question is, why do Christians try to win the lost people when they finally do come to Christ? Then later on, if one of these prove, are they truly child of God or are they really safe? So what's the purpose of going to Christ then later on with the question of their salvation? Well, I think you're just drawing an occasional inconsistency and asking it a question and implying that it's universal.

So people are just inconsistent. They want people to become saved. And yet maybe the people aren't saved. They're trying to figure out if they are saved later. That's all.

It just seems to be that. Yeah, but like for example, if I get saved recently and the person sees me out there, they don't know I just got saved. I'm still a baby in Christ. You know, and they see me doing something. Maybe I don't know any better. And then they start judging you and saying, oh, you're not a child of God. Look what you're doing. You know what I mean? So it's like spreading false, spreading stuff against you, against other Christians, against you. And they don't understand that you just got saved recently. You're still growing.

So they automatically digest you and they can catch you without knowing. There's just a lot of variables in your questioning. Just lots of conditions, variables, what's said, who said, you know. So it's hard to nail it down exactly. All right. You know, that's all it is. All right. Okay.

That's not a quick question, too. So since you're in the air, what about the person who served the Lord and witnessed and wouldn't let our people for Christ and then he dies and he goes to heaven. He's going to hell at the pearly gates.

Okay. They tell him, well done, faithful servant, come into the glory of your Lord. And that person says, nah, I don't want to go into heaven. I changed my mind. I don't want to go to the pearly gates. I'm not impressed with heaven.

I don't want to go. It won't happen. It doesn't happen. No, it doesn't happen.

That's a really saved. So in other words, once you sub Christ, you turn to security. She had no choice in that matter. Once you die, you automatically going to go into heaven regardless of your will or not. Right. No, it's not like that. It's not like that.

Okay. Once you're saved, you're regenerated, you're changed. God lives in you and you seek to be like him and to live with him and for him. So that's what happens with the true Christians. So if they abandon that, it's because you're not true Christians.

Okay, all right. But what about the ability to serve the Lord down here? They did want a lot of people for the cause of Christ, you know, and then they die. They accept the Christ and they end up in heaven, you know. So out of Mecca, they're going to go to heaven regardless into the kingdom of Christ's presence. Right.

Out of Mecca, yes. Yes, they go to heaven. They're guaranteed to go to heaven.

But it doesn't mean that such people go out and be evil. It doesn't work like that because they're changed. They're changed. They're regenerated and dwelt by God. So they're changed. They're changed.

A lot of the people who criticize eternal security say, oh, then you just go be evil and do all kinds of bad stuff and you go to heaven, right? And they completely fail to understand the fact of regeneration. We're changed. Mm-hmm. Okay.

All right. Yeah, that's not much of a lie. I heard about it. I heard about it, the death of the generation through Calvinist teach or the reform. But other churches, I never heard that teaching until I started watching Mark Taylor's videos on the internet. He talked about the regeneration and the glory of my free will. In other words, people like the Calvinists, we don't have a free will. Our will's an influence.

Alberto, Alberto, okay, okay, hold on. You're all over the map here. Um, I see that video to make a comment on it and don't know what's really going on. I know, but I understand. But it's not on the internet.

No one took it down. But anyway, yeah. All right. All right, thank you. All right, buddy.

God bless. All right, let's get to Jermaine from California. Jermaine, welcome, buddy. You're on the air. Hey, how's it going today, Matt? Oh, it's going. It's going.

So what do you got, big man? Well, yeah, just, um, want to discuss Genesis chapter 12, verse three, uh, were, and I think I may have brought this up a long while ago, but I want to revisit the, I will bless those who bless you and curse those who curse you. Um, so I was in a Bible study last night with some family and they seem to take the slant of, like they're very pre-Trib rapture type folks, good people, but we just disagree. But they, they seem to think you can't say anything critical about Israel at all, even as a critique. Well, and God, but God did.

Right. Criticize Israel all the time. So wouldn't it be, well, my question is the word curse is very specific. There's a difference between being critical and cursing. I'm not cursing anyone, but I will point out just like, I mean, if anyone was married, I know you've been, you've been criticized, you know, and from a point of correction and it goes both ways because that there are things that come up that are legitimate, but not cursing. I just want to kind of hear you break down what the word cursing in that particular context is. Oh, what it means there is to bind under a curse because actually what it says in the Hebrew is an influent and the words, I'm just looking at a translation thing here at the word, uh, for if anyone curses you is, uh, deals with, uh, reviles you speaking evil off. He says that God will bind that person or group under a curse, a judgment.

Okay. So yeah, don't, don't, don't revile Israel, but you know, Israel's not perfect and they make mistakes. It's not reviling Israel. It's just saying that, you know, they're not perfect.

They blow it like any nation does. That's all. There's nothing wrong with that. You could say that God certainly did and he said a lot more. Okay.

Okay. And, and, um, the second part of that, I've known some who even they go so far as to say you, uh, they don't even believe preaching the gospel to Israel is even appropriate. And I personally, I think that's pretty ludicrous.

I think everyone who's a human being needs to hear the gospel and God knows who his are no matter what, it doesn't matter where, you know, Palestinian, Israel, whatever. But I've just never heard that. Yeah. It's a little whacked, but that's what happens.

So now people, they get a little bit too narrow, but that's okay. You know, Hey buddy, there's a break. Got to go. All right. All right. Okay, buddy. God bless. Hey folks, we'll be right back after these messages.

Three open lines. Give me a call. We'll be right back. It's Matt Slick live. Taking your calls at 877-207-2276.

Here's Matt Slick. All right. Welcome back to the show if you want to give me a call.

It is easy. 877-207-2276. Let's get to Jacob from Virginia. Jacob, welcome.

You're welcome. Hey, Mr. Slick. How are you doing? Can you hear me all right? I hear you fine, man. You're doing great. What do you got buddy?

What's up? Okay, cool, cool. Hey, I'm always a firm believer in that there was no way us Christians was going to go through the tribulation.

Yeah. But after listening to you for years and some other things and stuff happening in front of me, you know, my eyes and my technology, you think the new Pope could be the one? You never know where it's going to be. You never know.

You never know. Is the Antichrist going to be a Pope? He's certainly a candidate for it because of the false doctrines of the Catholic Church.

A lot of people don't know how bad the Catholic Church is and its evils and its history. It's false this and false that. It's all cult stuff. Could be, but it could be also another theory is it could be an imam out of Islam.

And it could be that. So in other words, other people say he could be just a secular figure who is incredibly charismatic and capable. So the different theories have been offered about who the Antichrist is. He definitely is a male who would probably be homosexual.

And I've got an article on it where I go through and show the citations in the Old New Testament about him. So he says it will have no desire for women. He will not have any regard for the gods of his father. He'll have a wound on his head.

His right eye and his right arm will be withered. And there's going to be a miracle. Some say possibly a resurrection. He will have died or come close to it and then miraculously be healed.

And it's going to cause a mass conversion of people to his false doctrines. So there's a lot there. We don't know what the absolute truth is yet. Okay, so I believe AI is going to have a big part in that. You thought that technology could be it or do you think it's definitely a person?

Yeah, it could be. Actually, I'm entertaining opening up my computer in order to write a second novel in the series called The Influence. And I thought about the AI issue. And I'm thinking about how to, if I should, integrate it.

And then questions in line. You know, if an AI is going to have any main part of it in this context, it would be a negative one as a potential. But I wrote another novel, a science fiction novel, where an AI is very good, very beneficial, very helpful. So I'm familiar with the concepts and the issues of logic dealing with them and things like that. Okay, and as for your point of view on the rapture of the Christian, I know you go to Matthew 24 and verse, I don't know what time it is, but I know you always go to Matthew 24 a lot, and I'm not trying to put scripture against scripture.

It's all right, it's okay. But every time somebody calls you, it seems to me you're going to tell the same ones every time, you know, respectfully. What are some other ones that you could point to that, not definitively, but get pretty close to, if you were debating like David Jeremiah or something like that? Well, if I was doing a debate, what I would do is present the two-age model. The two-age model, and it's very powerful, okay? So let me give you an example here, okay? The two-age model is what Jesus talked about and what Paul talked about, but you never hear from any preachers and teachers about eschatology. You just don't. You don't hear revelation at all?

Yeah, you don't hear it. But see, the blasphemy of the Holy Spirit will not be forgiven in this age or the age to come. We receive much in this age, in the age to come, eternal life. These are the words of Christ. Paul says Jesus is above all rule and authority in this age and the age to come.

In this age, we receive 100 times as much. People are given in marriage, and Jesus rescued us from the present age. In the age to come, we receive eternal life, do not marry, et cetera.

So you can see that the Bible teaches two ages. And all you have to do then is look at what happens at the end of the age, because it mentions the end of the age. At the end of the age, specifically, it's stated at the end of the age, the wicked are gathered, the judgment of the wicked occurs, the elect are gathered, the harvest occurs, which is the rapture, and Jesus returned, okay? So it specifically says that. But it also, we have issues, because when it says the judgment of the wicked, because it says it happens on the last day, excuse me, at the end of the age.

They're gathered and burned with fire, all right? Well, that's also said to be the last day in John 12.48. And it says, he who rejects me does not receive my sayings, has one who judges him. And the word I spoke is what will judge him at the last day. So there's judgment. Couldn't that be, you know, Jesus' rules were all on this earth?

Couldn't that be at the end of the earth? That's the problem. That's one of the problems, that this study knocks that out of the water. It just removes the idea of a future thousand year reign.

I'm sorry it does. So let me explain something here. I'm going to read something to you.

Okay, let's see if I can set you up. I'm still not seeing hell. What's that? I'm still not seeing hell. Let me show you how. Let me read something to you. And this is not like a gotcha, not trying to embarrass you or anything.

It's like, hey, that's not helpful. Okay, good. So just check this out, okay? This is what it says in 1 Thessalonians 4 16. And I'm going to read through chapter 5 verse 2. For the Lord himself will descend from heaven with a shout. That's the return of Christ, okay? With the voice of the archangel, the trumpet of God, the dead in Christ will rise first. And we who rely to remain should be caught up together to meet him in the clouds. So that's the rapture, okay?

Therefore, comfort one another with these words. Now as to the times and the epics, brethren, you have no need of anything to be written to you, for you yourselves know full well that the day of the Lord will come just like a thief in the night. So the rapture and the return of Christ will occur on the day of the Lord to come like a thief in the night, right?

No problem, right? All right, now check this out. It says in 2 Peter 3 10. But the day of the Lord will come like a thief, in which the heavens will pass away with a roar, and the elements will be destroyed with intense heat, and the earth and its works will be burned up.

Well, wait a minute. Say that again, so does that, say that one more time. It says the day of the Lord come like a thief, in which the heavens will pass away with a roar, and the elements destroyed with intense heat, the earth and its works will be burned up. So we have a problem here. It doesn't say anything about us, though.

Okay, go ahead. Yeah, because the day of the Lord come like a thief, one says in the night, and the other one says the day of the Lord come like a thief. There's no other phraseology like this in the entire Bible. It's just these two places.

And in one, it's the return of Christ and the rapture, and in the other, it's the new heavens and new earth are made. The question is, are they the same day? That's the question.

If they are... It could be different, definitely. I don't know. But if it could be... My thing, my only... Sorry. Yeah, that's okay, go ahead.

I just, I don't know, I know I'm going to forget if I don't ask it. Go ahead, that's all right. Couldn't we be the saints under the altar? Let's say we're raptured away. Couldn't we be the saints under the altar? I don't know where we got that, the saints at the altar. But in Revelation... Well, you know, it says that when Jesus... At the end, when Jesus comes in the horn, and he says that with the saints, so that's us. And the one on earth will meet him up in the... Or it's those who died in the faith who've preceded us, and he comes back with them.

We meet him in the air. But it's possible that it could be us, the rapture, as well as the ones that have died before. Well, maybe. So in 2 Thessalonians 2, get a lot of noise in the background there, okay? I'm sorry. I know you can't concentrate with that. Yeah, it's very good.

But also, there's noises when people are driving on the road, they start hearing clicking sounds out of the radio, makes them get distracted, and they might take their eyes off the road, think, there's something happening to my car. That's one of the main reasons, too. And so... Is it better?

Yeah, that's fine. So we have... There's a lot... I'm not even getting into it, hardly.

But let me say this. I've got a study on karm that goes through... Oh, we've got a break coming up. Hold on buddy, okay?

And I'll talk about this, the study I have on karm, which I presented many times, and every single time I've done it, people are, they say, very challenged by what the Bible actually says, that they've never been taught. So hold on, hold on. I'll keep you right back after these messages.

Please stay tuned, folks. 877-207-2276. It's Matt Slick live, taking your calls at 877-207-2276. Here's Matt Slick. Hey everybody, welcome back to the show, if you want to give me a call.

The number is 877-207-2276. Let's get back on with Jacob from Virginia. All right, Jacob.

Get back on here, buddy. Yes, sir. All right. So anyway, I was saying, I've got this article I've done on this, on karm, and it's titled, An Examination of This Age and the Age to Come, in Support of All Millennials. I'm going to write that down, because I just got home.

So just go to karm, and just type in the search engine, An Examination of This Age and the Age to Come, and you'll find the article. Okay. And what I've done many times in Bible studies is present this. And at one time I was doing this at a church, and I had a lot of noises in the background there, man.

I'm sorry, you won't hear that again. Okay, so where I've actually presented this on a chalkboard, and had people tell me what events go where from this age to the age to come. And when you break the end times into two ages, this age and the age to come, which is the model Paul used and the model Jesus used, which no one else does, but they do. It's just tremendously baffling to me why people don't bring this up. But when you look at what happens at the end of this age, according to the Scriptures, and the next age according to the Scriptures, you get a radically different view.

It's just natural to get a radically different view. So, I have a paragraph summary in this. So, I can give you the Scripture references, but I'll confuse, it's all with Scripture references, but this is how it works. At the end of this age, the wicked are gathered and judged. Also, that is when the elect are gathered, which is also when the rapture occurs. And on the last day, the wicked are judged, but that is also the day of the rapture. It's also the day of the resurrection, which occurs at the last trumpet, which is also when the rapture occurs. So, the rapture occurs with the last trumpet, which is on the last day, which is when the wicked are judged. And you can see all this in Scripture by just going through the list of things. You just go, that's the last day, that's what it says. Okay, the resurrection occurs on the day of the Lord, which is also Jesus' return, and it's also called the rapture, and all happen after the tribulation. And the day of the Lord, which is Jesus' return, the rapture, the resurrection, will come like a thief in the night, which is also when the new heavens and new earth are made.

So, it really packs a wallop to people, and I do it very slowly and take about an hour to go through it. And then I say, what do you guys think of this? And they all go, man, I've never heard this before. I know, it's, you know. Okay, so that's on the website? Yeah, uh-huh.

Okay, I'm going to look into it, then I'll call you back. But, I heard you say rapture twice. At the end of this age, we were going to be raptured. And then you said it again at the, you know, the next age. They get on the second age.

Yeah, there's only one rapture, but there's different things related to it when it occurs. One's with the trumpet, one's at the end of the age, you know, things like that. So, and what I would recommend you do- I know you've got two holes, but- No, we don't, but it's okay. What I'd recommend you do is on that article is table two. Is table two.

What I would recommend you do is get a piece of paper, eight and a half by 11, you know, whatever piece of paper, do a landscape, draw a vertical line down the middle. And then left is this age and the right is the age to come. Because that's the model that Jesus and Paul used. And then look at the verses, the judgment of God. Like 1 Corinthians 1, 8, who will also confirm you to end, the blameless end, the day of the Lord.

Well, you could write a note. The judgment is at the day of the Lord. But you don't know when it is yet. Day of the Lord's the judgment, right?

And then you go- Yes, sir. Like, for example, John 12, 48. He who rejects me and does not receive my sayings has one who judges him. The word that I spoke will judge him at the last day. So this is all talking about judgment and it specifically says at the last day.

So when is the last day? Well, it's going to be in this age, not the age to come. And so you start going, okay. And you start putting things in arrangement the best you can on that model. And you will arrive at a different conclusion than what you've been taught by basically everybody else, basically.

But what about the people? So I know in the age to come. So the age to come is that that's the millennial or not? The millennium where Jesus is King of Earth? Well, the Bible says- Or is that what it says? The Bible says in the age to come, blasphemy is not forgiven. And you receive eternal life and there's no marriage in the age to come. So if the millennial reign is the age to come, there's no marriage there, then that's a problem. Because in premillennialism, people get married in that age, in that 1,000 years. So it can't be that.

It has to be after that. You see? Just simple stuff like this. Yeah, it's a challenging study. And I've presented it many times. I've had people say, I don't agree with your conclusions. And I say, that's okay, that's okay. And I say, but can you refute it? And I've had them say to me, I think three guys said, I'm going to refute it. And they never did.

They would come back the next week and- That's because you say slick. But so you- Let me get this right, okay? I'm sorry. That's all right. That's right.

I'm a layman's term, old country boy. So you think that when Jesus is going to be king of this earth, it's going to be right now, this age. Okay.

Well, either way, then he destroys the heavens and the earth. And then that's the next stage, right? That's the age to come. I see how it's kind of making sense with the millennial stuff, how it doesn't fit.

By talking it out loud. Well, let me throw some other stuff out at you. People say, well, wait a minute. How can it be that Jesus is reigning in the king right now in this age?

Well, there's a couple of things to say about that. One of them is, for example, Jesus says that blasphemy will not be forgiven in this age or the age to come. But he says in order to cast out demons, he says you have to bind the strong man. And he's doing that in Matthew 12. He says a strong man is Satan, so therefore Satan's bound. In Matthew 12. That's what Jesus says.

I show that to people. I'm like, oh, okay. He bonds them up and puts them in the lake of fire for a little bit, right? Not for a little bit, but that's the final judgment. So he ties them up. Well, I know he lets them go for a while. Not necessarily, but we'll get into that another time. So in Matthew 13, in Matthew 13, you have the tares and the wheat, wheat and the tares, right?

And he says a lot of... Yeah, I know you said this a million times. Uh-huh, the first ones gathered. The first ones gathered, it's tares to be burned up. But that's judgment.

So wait a minute, they're judged. And now this is about the kingdom, right? So this is what Jesus says in Matthew 13, 30. First gathered the tares and bind them, gather the wheat into the barn. But he says the first ones gathered are the wicked.

That's what he says. But what's really interesting is then he goes down in verse 40. He's interpreting it. The son of man will send forth his angels. They'll gather out of his kingdom all stumbling blocks.

Well, who's the wicked? It's the ones taken first are the wicked, taken out of his kingdom. So where is his kingdom? It's on earth.

That's right. And so if Christians were taught this, instead of our kingdom is not here, not now, Christ is not reigning on earth at all. We're waiting for a rapture to get us out of here and a future thousand years. That's what he's going to be ruling. Then the risk of that kind of theology is I'm not going to fight hard for the kingdom of God now because it won't make any difference. It's going to go to pot.

I'm going to wait. But if you believe he's the king now and that we're obligated to serve him as a king in this time now, then it's a completely different attitude we're going to have. So this is the attitude I have, and I am not saying, hey, look at me, not that, but I'm saying, I believe in this, and I'm always working for the continuation of the lordship of Jesus, who's king right now in Christian churches and out of churches. Yeah, you can go to which one the Holy Spirit is in and which one it isn't.

Because the pre-trib rapture... I've always envisioned, you know, with Jesus on the throne of earth, I've always envisioned like I wanted to play college basketball. What if, you know, do I get to do that, you know, and like have like the Holy Spirit and like lift me up to be like this, a better athlete and not do those things that maybe not become a...

I mean, are things like that going to happen? Are we going to be worshiping? And I know my daughter is listening right now on a different radio, and I've always told her, and I want to make sure this is true, aren't we going to be able to like interact with the animals?

Is that... Could I make that up? Well, the Bible doesn't say we're going to interact with them as a cognitive way, but we'll interact with them probably. We can pet them, we can look at them, and we'll influence them.

But we are the only ones made in the image of God. And the kingdom of God on earth, which will be remade earth, etc., we'll spend time here. But also the Bible says we don't even know how good it's going to be. We can't even imagine. It's all... Yeah, my daughter thinks it's going to be boring.

She's 10. I'm like, it's going to be boring. It's going to be sweet. Yeah, no, I've had an experience of the presence of the Lord once in my life, and I mean exceedingly profoundly, not traumatizing, but dramatic.

And let me tell you, if that... You've got a sliver of that. You won't be bored for eternity. It'll always be ecstatically wonderful. It's just in his presence.

I always try to think of it like, yes, sir, when the Holy Spirit just takes over you and you'll fall to your knees or whatever, and you know that great feeling, I just feel like it'll be like that all the time, nonstop, even better. Even better. And then what's really going to be weird? You're going to meet people that you know, and you won't recognize them, and they won't recognize you because they're going to say to you when they figure out who you are.

Oh, that's what you look like without sin. I didn't recognize you. So we will know each other though?

Eventually. That was a joke. We did run into each other.

It was a joke. Yeah, we'll recognize each other. Oh, country boy.

That's all right. We'll recognize each other. We will know each other though? Yes, yes we will. Do you think we'll know that we were family on earth? Yeah, absolutely. Or we'll have memories. Yeah, that's awesome.

Yeah. And one more little thing I want to remind you. Well, we're almost out of time.

We've got like 15, 20 seconds before the show's over, before the music starts. You're going to have to call back tomorrow. We can talk some more, okay? All right. Thank you, man. I appreciate it. Sure.

I'd suggest go to the sites, look up the thing on this age and the age to come, and just go through and map it all out and see what you come up with. I guarantee you'll be doing some serious thinking, okay? All right, will do. All right, man. God bless. Okay, God bless. Yes, sir, you too.

All right. Yes, God bless. Bye, Jacob's daughter. Saying hi there too. Hey, folks, God bless. We're out of time.

There's the music. I'm out of here. May the Lord bless you. And by his grace, we're back on the air tomorrow, Friday already. Wow. And have a great evening, everyone. God bless. Bye. Another program powered by the Truth Network.