Biden Admin Admits They Won’t “Contain China”

Today on Sekulow, the Biden administration admits it's not attempting to contain China while the Chinese military expands its global reach into the Atlantic. We'll talk about that with former Secretary of State Mike Pompeo.

Live from Washington, D.C., Sekulow Live. When it comes to China, we've been very clear that we're not trying to contain China or hold it back, but we are determined to uphold the so-called rules-based international order that we've invested so much in over so many decades and that has been good for us and good for the world, and I think even good for China. Phone lines are open for your questions right now. Call 1-800-684-3110.

I think what we've witnessed over the last several years is China acting more repressively at home and more aggressively abroad. That is a fact. And now, your host, Jordan Sekulow. Welcome to Sekulow.

We are going to take your phone calls to 1-800-684-3110 on this Friday. Secretary of State, former Secretary of State Mike Pompeo will be joining us in this first half hour of the broadcast. Of course, senior counsel with the ACLJ to talk about this conflicting message out of our current Secretary of State, Tony Blinken, who I will point out right from the top. I think we've been very fair about his statements.

It hasn't been all negative from us at all. You know, it's such a partisan attack. It is looking at what is in the best interest of America. I mean, I think we should go right to this idea.

We played it in the beginning of the broadcast. This idea that, one, we're seeing on 60 Minutes on Sunday, Secretary Blinken says, you know, it's a more repressive China at home and more aggressive abroad. But then, just yesterday, he says we've been clear that we're not trying to contain China. This is while there's news reports out about Chinese expansion of their military, so operating a military base, which they hope to be able to launch in northwest Africa, so into the Atlantic. They've already got one that's almost operable near the horde of Africa, so that's northeast Africa, and they want to operate in northwest Africa to then, of course, expand their reach militarily into the Atlantic, which I think should be – alarm bells should be going off. This is, again, an expanding – it's not just an economic issue with China anymore. They're expanding their military capabilities abroad.

I want to go right to Wes Smith on this. When you look at where the U.S. has bases, we've been engaged in massive conflicts where we have bases all around the world to protect long-term interest. But I'm wondering, where is the Chinese interest in operating, you know, extensively in the Atlantic? Well, China is not our friend, you know, and we have to deal with that. We have to look at the world as it is, not as we wish it were. And so I think what's lacking right now is a coherent and consistent policy regarding China. How are we going to deal with it? Because militarily, they are aggressive.

And Jordan, here's the thing. A lot of people do not realize this. China, present day, has the largest standing military in the world. Now, we have better weapons.

We have a little more technology, probably better trained troops. But right now, China has the largest standing military in the world. Their military budget is the largest in the world. They continue to expand their navy. They have one aircraft carrier in operation.

They have two more that are getting ready to come out. For them to have a presence with their aircraft carriers and their submarines in the Atlantic, that has never happened before. And it should concern the United States and our allies.

But they are aggressive. They are looking to expand their reach globally, militarily. In the same week, a statement from our current Secretary of State saying, yes, acknowledging China is more aggressive overseas, more repressive in their own country, which is true. And then a couple days later saying, but we're not doing anything about it. We're not going to do anything about it.

We're not going to contain China or even try to contain Chinese expansion overseas. So we'll talk about all this. We'll talk about it with you. We're going to talk about it with former Secretary of State Mike Pompeo as well. 1-800-684-3110.

If you want to be on the broadcast today, that's 1-800-684-3110. How serious do you believe Chinese expansionism around the globe is to the United States? How serious of a threat is that? We'd love your thoughts too at 1-800-684-3110. It's not getting enough attention.

The Chinese opening up a military base to expand into the Atlantic. We'll be right back. And we have an exceptional track record of success.

But here's the bottom line. We could not do our work without your support. We remain committed to protecting your religious and constitutional freedoms.

That remains our top priority, especially now during these challenging times. The American Center for Law and Justice is on your side. If you're already a member, thank you. And if you're not, well, this is the perfect time to stand with us at ACLJ.org where you can learn more about our life-changing work.

Become a member today. ACLJ.org. Only when a society can agree that the most vulnerable and voiceless deserve to be protected is there any hope for that culture to survive. And that's exactly what you are saying when you stand with the American Center for Law and Justice to defend the right to life. We've created a free, powerful publication offering a panoramic view of the ACLJ's battle for the unborn.

It's called Mission Life. It will show you how you are personally impacting the pro-life battle through your support. And the publication includes a look at all major ACLJ pro-life cases, how we're fighting for the rights of pro-life activists, the ramifications of Roe v. Wade 40 years later, playing parenthood's role in the abortion industry, and what Obamacare means to the pro-life movement. Discover the many ways your membership with the ACLJ is empowering the right to life. Request your free copy of Mission Life today online at ACLJ.org slash gift.

Welcome back to Sekio. We are taking your phone calls to 1-800-68-431. Tim will have former Secretary of State Mike Pompeo join us next segment to discuss this Chinese expansionism. But I want to go right to Harry, because Harry, one of the issues that we looked at with this conflicting, and there's a lot of different ways this is posing concerns to the US, but you brought up in your research a couple of points. There's a Biden Center for Diplomacy, which many people might not know about, at the University of Pennsylvania Ivy League. And the former director of that is now our Secretary of State Tony Blinken, who's saying we don't want to contain China. But you found out who was funding that Biden Institute, and it's pretty shocking the amount, and of course who's behind it. Absolutely. So one of the key questions that we should consider, and our audience should consider, is whether Tony Blinken, the Secretary of State, can explain why the University of Pennsylvania created the Biden Pen Center, and then took $22 million from China. While Mr. Blinken served as the managing director, can Mr. Blinken, or the University of Pennsylvania, which took over $67 million over a two-year period, while Mr. Blinken was connected to the University of Pennsylvania, explain this particular connection. So one of the key issues that we should think about is, yes, I think Wesley is absolutely correct that the United States military has an advantage vis-a-vis China, but China has a huge advantage over the United States.

Why? Because it has the will to deploy China's military might, and because China is well connected to influential Americans in the academy, in, for instance, military defense contractors. And so I think that puts us at a strategic disadvantage as China's ambitions continue to expand from Africa to South America and Europe and abroad. Yeah, I mean, you look at the Daily Mail has a piece about the China's African takeover, talking about the ports that they've built, it's throughout, you can see the maps, you can see where they've got, where they're providing power stations, but also where they're potentially putting bases for their own military. So they're looking at Angola, Kenya, Tanzania, the Seychelles as well, I mean, so, and then of course we talked about how they're already on the Horn of Africa and they're looking at something that's more Northwest Africa so that they are able to operate in the Atlantic more easily.

So they're in the Indian Ocean, they're of course in the Pacific, but then now to expand into the Atlantic as well. When you put this on top of the fact of what we see, I mean, Dan, we talked about the money that is being thrown around by the Chinese, you know, $67 million for the Biden Diplomacy Center, that's got no discussion whatsoever, it's not in the news, it's not added into this. And yet, what do we expect from these leaders? They are making millions and millions of dollars. Former government officials in the United States with peddling influence, and then they re-enter the U.S. government, so they've got, their own personal interest is not to upset their main financiers. Well, and you add to that the Honeywell situation, Jordan, where, you know, plans for war fighters were actually leaked, and that company was fined, but then said, you know what, we'll continue to give you contracts, we'll continue to give you more plans for future weapons, are you going to leak those too?

That should have never happened, Jordan, but I think you put it all together, and it's not difficult to determine what you have here. You have a regime, the Chinese regime that is dead set on being the next superpower of the world, but you have limits on those in Washington, D.C. who are willing to acknowledge it. One person that comes to mind that has warned about this repeatedly over the last several years is Senator Marco Rubio, but, Jordan, the volume in Washington, D.C. isn't nearly as high as it should be, and I would tell you, especially this week, you played that soundbite from Secretary Blinken where he says, we're not trying to contain China. Look, when you look back at the Obama administration, Jordan, containment was exactly the goal that they would tell you they were after when you were talking about regimes that were our enemies. Iran was the biggest one at that point. Jordan, the left in Washington, D.C. has walked away even from the idea that an avowed enemy, someone who is trying to overtake the United States, should be contained.

That should set off alarm bells for everybody. Yeah, I mean, I think that, you know, and Wes, you're also, you know, you've got a China that is looking at putting a naval base inside Iran, I mean, so on the coast of Iran. They are also, I think that that points to the fact that they think that Iran is stable enough to invest in as well.

Well, and they share a common enemy, and that is the United States. Yeah, several weeks ago, China and Iran in great ceremony signed an agreement that they're getting ready to implement where they're going to share a lot of things, including they're going to do joint military exercises. They're going to share military intelligence, and they're going to share a military research and weapons development. That in itself is pretty alarming, but as a part of that agreement, Iran has given China permission to build a naval seaport on the coast in the Persian Gulf, not far from the Strait of Hormuz, where most of the world's oil supply travels, and not far from the headquarters of the Fifth Fleet of the U.S. Navy. And China is going to build a base there. What they're looking to do is to have these bases around the world, and you'll often hear Chinese leaders say, well, they're for commercial purposes, they're for fishing. Well, they may be used for that, but they're also for refuel and resupply of their navy, their navy so that they have a global military reach.

That is their intention. And I really do believe that with COVID, with the way the world kind of shut down, and we didn't interact the same way internationally, you know, the travel, and so it can be tough. This is when these countries seize upon these moments where we're not paying attention, where we are looking domestically because of issues that we're dealing with, whether it's a pandemic and the economic consequences of that, all of the issues that we deal with.

It's so you can quickly stop watching what's happening around the world. Well, those world actors are not. But again, this idea that we're not going to do anything, to me, Harry, is very upsetting. Just as an American, and I don't think, it's not war we're talking about here, but the idea that we're not trying to step in, and I want to go to that statement because he's talked about the so-called, now he called it that, rules-based international order that we've invested so much in over so many decades that's been good for us. You know, the UN and international law and international standards, except for the fact that the Chinese Communist Party, they don't abide by any of those rules.

Absolutely. And I think Secretary of State Blinken's response to Chinese aggression suggests that China has the capability to surgically remove the backbone from influential U.S. officials. It's important to keep in mind Blinken's prior history at the Biden Center. At the Biden Center, heavily funded by the Chinese government and Chinese officials, guess what? The Biden Center heavily criticized the response of Poland and Hungary with respect to their actions taken during the coronavirus pandemic.

Guess what? They did not criticize China's response. They did not criticize China's inaction or failure to fully disclose the source of COVID-19.

So I think at the end of the day, the scales are not balanced. And so at the end of the day, people like Secretary of State Blinken, they are predisposed to give the Chinese government a pass, just like the National Basketball Association is prepared to give the Chinese government and the repression a pass. And so again, I think we have basically created a situation in which China realizes that under the Biden administration, they may have a wide open door for future aggression.

Again, we have not gotten to even, and we'll get to this with former Secretary of State Mike Pompeo, but we talked about their expanding military. We even talked about the way that they clawed back their supposed to be white hat hackers that would compete in these international competitions. And they were winning. I mean, they were the best. And they said, wait, why are we going abroad to help Western companies figure out where their problems are in their data and in their databases when we can exploit those back at home?

So let's do that at home. So they actually banned their white hat hackers who would compete in these competitions to help make all of the data that we put online more secure. They banned them from going abroad. Because they said, why are we not, if we can break into this technology, so they're not, again, not abiding by the law, not abiding by any international rules. You know, he doesn't say it's international law.

He says it's so-called rules. So-called rules are not going to stand in the way of an expanding China that doesn't care what the rules are. And the UN is not going to impose anything on China. They're a permanent member of the Security Council. So nothing's going on there. So they can break any of those international rules that they want without any consequences.

Unless the U.S. and the Western world and other allies step up and impose those consequences on China. We'll have Secretary of State Mike Pompeo join us when we come back this break. Only when a society can agree that the most vulnerable and voiceless deserve to be protected is there any hope for that culture to survive. And that's exactly what you are saying when you stand with the American Center for Law and Justice to defend the right to life. We've created a free, powerful publication offering a panoramic view of the ACLJ's battle for the unborn.

It's called Mission Life. It will show you how you are personally impacting the pro-life battle through your support. And the publication includes a look at all major ACLJ pro-life cases. How we're fighting for the rights of pro-life activists. The ramifications of Roe v. Wade 40 years later.

Play on parenthood's role in the abortion industry. And what Obamacare means to the pro-life movement. Discover the many ways your membership with the ACLJ is empowering the right to life.

Request your free copy of Mission Life today online at ACLJ.org slash gift. The challenges facing Americans are substantial. At a time when our values, our freedoms, our constitutional rights are under attack, it's more important than ever to stand with the American Center for Law and Justice. For decades now, the ACLJ has been on the front lines protecting your freedoms, defending your rights, in courts, in Congress, and in the public arena.

And we have an exceptional track record of success. But here's the bottom line, we could not do our work without your support. We remain committed to protecting your religious and constitutional freedoms.

That remains our top priority, especially now during these challenging times. The American Center for Law and Justice is on your side. If you're already a member, thank you. And if you're not, well this is the perfect time to stand with us at ACLJ.org where you can learn more about our life changing work. Become a member today.

ACLJ.org. Welcome back to Sekulow. We are joined now by our Senior Counsel for Global Affairs, former Secretary of State Mike Pompeo. And we're focusing in on China, of course, and this dual statements from our current Secretary of State, Secretary Blinken, on this idea that he is acknowledging Chinese aggression at home, repression at home, and aggressive actions abroad. But that we're not going to try and contain China.

I want to go right to Mike Pompeo. Secretary Pompeo, this idea that we've got a current Secretary of State representing the United States and telling the world two days after talking about how aggressive China is that we're not going to do anything to stop it. Jordan, this misconception that somehow if America plays nice that the Chinese Communist Party will just leave the rest of the world alone is the mistake that we had for 40 years before President Trump took office and began for the first time in modern times for a President of the United States to confront the central challenge to us, the Chinese Communist Party. When I hear people talk about, well, you know, we don't want to go to war, make no mistake about it, the Chinese Communist Party has declared war on the American worker. They stole our intellectual property. They stole millions of jobs in the United States, good jobs, high-paying manufacturing jobs.

They stole the semiconductor industry by subsidizing Chinese state-owned enterprises. To walk away from that, the Biden administration, to walk away from that and think somehow we can go back to engagement and if we just all get along, the Chinese Communist Party will change its stripes and won't continue down its path towards global power and hegemony is an enormous mistake. It is an enormous threat to countries all across the world and it matters an awful lot for average Americans each and every day. I want to play this, I want to get your reaction to it, because I think that this key line, because this is the interview just on MSNBC where Secretary Blinken says we're not going to contain, but there's a key part here about so-called rules-based international order.

Let's play it. When it comes to China, we've been very clear that we're not trying to contain China or hold it back, but we are determined to uphold the so-called rules-based international order that we've invested so much in over so many decades and that has been good for us and good for the world and I think even good for China. So international norms, Secretary Pompeo, international law, China sits as a permanent member of the Security Council, they can veto any kind of sanctions there. It is I think impossible to even make that statement without laughing that the Chinese are following any kind of rules-based international order when you're just talking about the internet, the intellectual property stolen from the US, the jobs taken from the US, declaring basically war on the US economy. From your position as the Secretary of State, did China follow any of the international norms?

Never. There was the World Trade Organization and the massive violations, whether it was their promise that they made to the people of Hong Kong or one that's still impacting us today. They violated the basic norms of how you operate a biosafety lab inside of Wuhan and the result is now almost 3 million deaths across the world and billions of dollars worth of economic destruction because the Chinese Communist Party came to have dominated the World Health Organization in a way that international regulatory body and then hit the outcomes. This is a country that violates every international norm. The world has permitted them to do this for decades and the only solutions for the United States to lead a global coalition to confront them and to impose costs on them unless they change their ways, unless they begin to comply. There's no sign that they intend to do that yet. That means our resolve needs to be all that much greater.

You know, Secretary Pompeo, this is Wesley Smith. You know, I think they see us as a declining power and our periodic change of leadership politically as a weakness. Obviously, they do not have that, unfortunately for the Chinese people, and so they want to take advantage of a change of administration and of what they perceive as weakness in the Biden administration. I have a question because, you know, this is something that goes back to all of my life that's been an issue and the U.S. government has sort of been on both sides of the issue there. And I know you can't reveal certain things that might be classified, but lately China has made it very clear that they are intent on retaking Taiwan. They see that as one of their provinces. If they do that militarily, if they were to attack or invade, and of course we arm and train them, how should we respond and would we be willing to take military action to defend Taiwan?

And I know you might be limited in some of your answer. Yeah, Wesley, I do want to be a little bit careful, but note this. Note how the Trump administration handled this issue. It was, Wesley, it was, you know this, every meeting I had with every Chinese official. I met with Xi Jinping.

I met with Wang Jiechi and Wang Yi, all their senior national security team. Every meeting was Taiwan first. You all leave Taiwan alone.

This is ours. We're going to go take that island, an island by the way that was never part of mainland China, but they pretend was. They used the word reunification.

This would in fact be an invasion. Our policy was to make sure they were never in a position where they could do this, and they always knew that there would be enormous costs if they even hinted in a kinetic way at going after Taiwan. And so we provided them F-16s through sales of military weapons systems. We provided them with political support. I made the decision to allow our diplomats to meet with them just like they would when a diplomat from any other country.

We set the conditions for deterrence so that the risk that we would have to confront that complex problem set would be very, very low. I think the Taiwanese appreciated that. I know it gave them greater freedom and autonomy. That's the right policy for the United States of America. For so long, Secretary Pompeo, it seemed like it was an economic war. You talked about the economic battle, but I think we were also seeing the reports now, and the Chinese are trying to hide this about their expansion into the Atlantic. They're looking to operate now and open a military base so that they've got a presence in the Atlantic. They're looking at spots in northwest Africa. If you look at a map of Africa and look at where the Chinese have got ports that they've invested in and other facilities, they've got kind of the Indian Ocean side. But then to also expand into the Atlantic, I mean, again, we've got long-term interests that we've protected since World War II, and so I think we have reasons to be operating around the world. This is a next level of aggression that is not just economic.

And the CPA got alarm bells should be going off. It's absolutely the case that they have expanded their reach. They've created their first military outpost in a place called Djibouti, a very strategically important location. They're working on another one in another strategically important location, a port called Gwadar, South Pakistan, and there are reports that they're looking at islands not too far from Hawaii.

So islands far ashore inside the Pacific, in the eastern Pacific, much near the United States of America. We have to make sure that free and open trade is possible, that the Chinese don't have the capacity to exert political coercion against the people in those places and deliver the Chinese strategic outpost from which they can restrict the capacity for America and for the world to engage in the activity that has raised billions of people out of poverty over the last 100 years. I mean, if you were still in this position, I think the words have consequences, the signals that we send. So if our Secretary of State goes on, does interviews, talks about how aggressive China is but we're not going to do anything to stop it, giving them the green light, do you think there's a way to reverse it quickly?

There is. You have to show, go back to Reagan, peace through strength. You have to demonstrate enormous resolve. You have to be prepared when they punch you in the face to punch them back. You have to be prepared to confront them when they're spying at your universities and at your biggest companies.

You have to close the consulate like we did in Houston, Texas. You have to take real concrete actions to demonstrate American resolve. If we do that, we will push back against the Chinese Communist Party and we will continue to live in a republic where we have the capacity to live our lives in the way we want. If we don't, we'll live in a world that looks a lot more like the authoritarian regime that China has today inside of their own country. Folks, I think that was it right there with Secretary of State Pompeo is that you've got to be able to, they have to know that you're going to punch back right into the face.

If they know that, they act differently. We'll be back in a second half hour coming up. Thank you. And if you're not, well, this is the perfect time to stand with us at ACLJ.org where you can learn more about our life changing work.

Become a member today, ACLJ.org. Freedom! The idea of, you know, how do you confront all of this with China?

How does this change? They have to know that you're going to punch back. They have to know that you're not going to announce to the world that we're not going to do anything to contain your aggression or the repression. So we will acknowledge that you're committing genocide in your own country, but we are not going to do anything about it. We're not going to, we're going to try and let international law and international norms and international rules be enforced by international agencies, which are basically all in the back pocket of the Chinese. And we'll just leave it to that. It's the lead from behind versus the punch you in the face.

You know, there's a big difference there in the consequences of diplomacy. So I want to get right to your phone calls. 1-800-684-3110.

A lot of people have been hanging on and I want to get to those calls. Now let's go to Richard first in California on Line 1. Hey, Richard. Hey, God, God's blessings to all of you guys.

Um, I appreciate what you're doing and thank you for taking my call. I just, I just want to say that, you know, pretty much this is all our fault. Uh, whatever money they have, you know, I look in my house and I think a majority of it's made in China, you know, and, and here President Trump was trying to bring companies back and here Biden goes again and starts raising taxes, corporate taxes and everything else. And then you talk about human rights. What about the slave labor? I mean, basically they have slave labor. That's why everything's so cheap. And I, you know, I blame the American companies for this too, for, for, uh, you know, it's all about money and it's, it's, it's, uh, what China is able to do is because of, uh, uh, uh, everything's made in China.

It's pretty basic, you know? Well, I think this is the idea. It was, again, it was, we, things got, I think out of control was, I mean, we, we allowed it to get out of control and, um, we'll, it just like, you know, whether it's made in China or made somewhere else, this is, we've allowed these massive economic investments. Now they're taking those economic investments to expand their ability to be a superpower.

Yeah, they absolutely are. And we are tied to them economically. And I think what is lost on many people in the Democrat party is the consequences, the second and third order effects as the caller alluded to, to our tax policy, to our trade policies. You know, as companies leave America, there is less production of goods in America, and we are, we're tied to China economically. They own most of our debt, but we're also tied to them trade wise because much of the stuff we use in America that used to be made in America, it's all made in China. Uh, and, and somehow or another, our manufacturers, as well as our political leaders need to start putting a divide between us and them so that we're not so dependent on them during the COVID crisis of the last year. What we discovered is most of our medical equipment, our personal protective equipment for COVID, it was made in China. And so there was a shortage for a long, long time. We've got to detach ourselves from this trade and economic dependence on China.

That is a long term process. But how we tax corporations in America and our trade policies have a direct impact on that. And sometimes I think that's lost on our political leaders. And I think here to this idea, again, that we, we acknowledge all these parade of horribles that China's engaged in, slave labor. And we utilize it, you know, and then your iPhone is built with that, and a genocide going on of Muslims. And yet the, uh, the world is not, they acknowledge it, but they're doing nothing about it. This is, we're letting them get away literally with murdering their own people. I think that's precisely correct.

I think the caller was precisely correct. So we have corporations and we have politicians who are to blame. We have tolerated the theft of our intellectual property. We've tolerated military spying by the Chinese and our influential leaders are co-opted by China. And so there's very limited pushback against Chinese aggression, Chinese genocide. And yet then you have American corporations pushing back against a voting bill, an election integrity bill in China. I'm sorry, in Georgia doing nothing about what's going on in China.

It makes no sense. All right. We'll be right back. Take your calls.

1-800-684-3110. The challenges facing Americans are substantial at a time when our values, our freedoms, our constitutional rights are under attack. It's more important than ever to stand with the American Center for Law and Justice. For decades now, the ACLJ has been on the front lines, protecting your freedoms, defending your rights in courts, in Congress and in the public arena. And we have an exceptional track record of success.

But here's the bottom line. We could not do our work without your support. We remain committed to protecting your religious and constitutional freedoms.

That remains our top priority, especially now during these challenging times. The American Center for Law and Justice is on your side. If you're already a member, thank you. And if you're not, well, this is the perfect time to stand with us at ACLJ.org, where you can learn more about our life changing work.

Become a member today. ACLJ.org. Only when a society can agree that the most vulnerable and voiceless deserve to be protected is there any hope for that culture to survive. And that's exactly what you are saying when you stand with the American Center for Law and Justice to defend the right to life. We have created a free, powerful publication offering a panoramic view of the ACLJ's battle for the unborn.

It's called Mission Life. It will show you how you are personally impacting the pro-life battle through your support. And the publication includes a look at all major ACLJ pro-life cases, how we're fighting for the rights of pro-life activists, the ramifications of Roe v. Wade 40 years later, a play on parenthood's role in the abortion industry, and what Obamacare means to the pro-life movement. Discover the many ways your membership with the ACLJ is empowering the right to life. Request your free copy of Mission Life today online at ACLJ.org slash gift.

Welcome back to Secular. We are taking your phone calls to 1-800-684-3110. That's 1-800-684-3110. I want to go to Julie's call.

I think this is out of California. Hey, Julie, welcome to Secular. You're on the air. Hi, Jordan. First of all, I've just been amazed about the wisdom of your panel and the fact that we have Secretary Pompeo, but all of you are so smart and so informative. When Secretary Blinken said our purpose is not to contain China, to hold it back and to keep it down, to me that was a seismic shift in the understanding of America and our identity and our role in the world. And it was similar to when Obama said, we are no longer a Christian country.

I just went on both statements. What? These are shocking statements about our very identity and role in the world as a country. And I'm very concerned about China spying on me personally as a citizen. I'm convinced they know everything I do through my cell phone, and pretty soon we'll start having social credit systems in the United States on what I can buy and sell. It's terrible.

I'm terrorizing. Well, I think you hit on the right point, which is that it's a huge shift in the United States' role. Out of Washington, the idea that it just seems like everybody's on their payroll. And if everybody's on their payroll, they're not going to stand in the way. They don't have the same, it's not as taboo as like accepting, and we haven't made it because of all the goods.

We're talking about the idea of their phones, the technology, the list goes on and on. So the idea that you would receive funding from Chinese-owned businesses or represent Chinese interest in Washington, it's not as taboo as you say, representing Russian interest. Or some other country, which the U.S. is made out to be a pariah, even if they're not posing as big of a threat. But yet, the Chinese, they have thrown the money around.

Yeah, in fact, I would say in many ways it's mainstream, Jordan. It's not just the economic interest, but it's also the infiltration into our government leadership. We haven't even talked about the issue that we're involved with involving Congressman Swalwell, who was clearly compromised with a Chinese spy, and yet Jordan, he remains on committees that get classified information. We're not even taking it seriously inside the Democrat leadership in the House of Representatives to make sure that the people that are responsible for getting this information aren't compromised by the Chinese.

That should tell you something. But Jordan, I would say I want to tack back just very quickly to something that Secretary Pompeo talked about, because he talked about tangible solutions that should be coming out of the State Department. And if you think about just a couple of examples, we really have seen a very wide shift in how the State Department responds. I mean, at the end of the Trump administration, you had the designation of genocide of the Uyghur people.

You also had the Trump administration getting tough on the economic side, on the trade side. And now, when you find out that a U.S. contractor, Honeywell, was losing secrets, was leaking secrets to the Chinese, you can't even get a serious response from the State Department on that. So those are the kind of specifics behind the scenes at the State Department that have to be happening, but I just don't think they're taking it seriously, Jordan.

It doesn't feel that way. It feels like they are trying to do everything possible not to own this issue. It's like, well, we're going to let the world deal with this, which is what Secretary Blinken said. We'll let the world deal with it, but we're not going to take the lead in containing Chinese aggression. He came up with the line. He calls it aggression, internationally, and repression domestically.

That sounds like you're going to fight back, and then he comes and says, we're not going to do anything about it. Absolutely. And I think that is the long-term strategy of the Biden administration. Apparently, the Biden administration is prepared to confront Russia, notwithstanding the fact that, at least in my opinion, Russia is less of a strategic threat than China. China's tentacles in the United States, both economically and politically, are absolutely huge, and they're very, very influential within the academic community. So there are a large number of apologists for the Chinese government who work for our leading educational institutions and who have profited from that relationship, and they continue to provide cover.

And then you add into this equation corporations. Corporations continue to carry the water for the Chinese government, and it goes from textile companies, it goes to companies that are producing our cell phones, you name it. We are advancing China's interests step by step, and there's very little response by the Biden administration, and for the foreseeable future, the possibility arises that Joe Biden and the Biden administration will simply take pages out of the Neville Chamberlain Handbook. Dick is calling from North Dakota on Line 3. If you want to talk to us there, 1-800-684-3110. That's 1-800-684-3110. How big of a deal do you believe that this Chinese threat is to the United States, not just economically, but globally, and also the military level? Hey, Dick, welcome to the Secular Year on the Air.

Thank you for taking my call. I was just reading an article on Newsmax here. It says that already a Chinese billionaire has bought 150,000 acres of land in Texas, and another Chinese firm is attempting to buy 130,000 acres next to Laughlin Air Force Base to put up a wind farm. So it's just not that they're all around our edges.

We're allowing them to infiltrate our country too. Yeah, so this is in foreign policy too. This is one of the richest people in China, former military general, and this idea that there is no way Russia, I mean, China, Russia wouldn't either, though, allow a former top military official from the United States to buy up their properties near a military base. And of course, all of these businesses in China, they come with these corporate names, but they're state-owned or state-invested, so there's always an interest in the Communist Party in China, always has an interest there, so there is no private business.

No. The general is rich and powerful, but he is still part of the machine. Yeah, all the businesses there have a connection, some indirect, but still a real vivid connection to the Chinese Communist Party. And they are not only buying land in Texas, that's the other thing. China, the billionaires and millionaires in China are buying real estate all across America. They're buying interest in our companies all across America. And yet the odd thing about this, Jordan, is that in some of the World Trade Organization policies, as well as some of our climate policies, China is still considered, laughable as it may seem, as a developing nation.

John Kerry met with China over the last week talking about climate control and what have you, and they are still specified as a developing nation on client. It's one of the richest nations in the world. They're buying influence all over the world. Some of these military bases that they're building in Africa and along the Indian Ocean, they're there as well as in the Middle East, they are buying influence. They're going into those governments buying land, but more strategically they're buying influence there because it is their gold, not just to be a superpower.

And they've made this very clear, they want to be the world's only superpower, both economically and militarily. I think it boils down to all this. We come back for the next break, we've got a couple minutes here, but we're going to take more of your calls. We've got a lot of phone calls coming in at 1-800-684-3110. But I do want to take John's because I think we've got time to address it.

It's unique because I have a different answer to John now than I would maybe 10 years ago. Hey John, welcome to Sekulow, you're on the air. Yeah, how are you guys doing? We're good, thanks John.

We love having Mike Pompeo on your ACLJ, it's great and I really appreciate all you do for pro-life. My question is that it seems like history repeats itself. Germany and Japan were pretty unlikely allies in World War II, and now we're seeing Iran come along China, and one is a largely Muslim country, one is a communist, atheist country, and we are practicing outright appeasement in my view right now in America, in our political realm.

And a former caller, Richard, talked about how it's really our fault, it's how we buy, it's what we do at our daily decisions. So I'd just like to know what you think about the future, especially in terms of biblical prophecy with China and Iran. Well I think this, I think listen, you don't have to look at prophecy, you look at, and this is why I say it would be different, current as they stand, the Chinese a decade ago you would say they would basically just look the other way on ideology. That's why they got so heavily invested in Africa, they weren't there to, they were there for economic purposes, they were exploitive, extremely, of the resources of these countries, corruption, buying off leaders, none of this trickling down to the people of these countries, the investments that China was making. But they didn't necessarily have an ideology, they're able to work in that, that's why they're able to work within Iran, who has this kind of serious religious ideology, the Chinese don't, but they have this shared interest, and I think they are developing an ideology. That's where I think I'm different than where I was maybe a decade ago. I think we're starting to see the next phase of China, which is not just as an economically developing country, but is now a country trying to move into the space as a military superpower.

And that's a different position than China's been in, we'll talk about it when we come back. This is called Mission Life. It will show you how you are personally impacting the pro-life battle through your support. And the publication includes a look at all major ACLJ pro-life cases, how we're fighting for the rights of pro-life activists, the ramifications of Roe v. Wade 40 years later, the play on parenthood's role in the abortion industry, and what Obamacare means to the pro-life movement. Discover the many ways your membership with the ACLJ is empowering the right to life.

Request your free copy of Mission Life today online at ACLJ.org slash gift. The challenges facing Americans are substantial at a time when our values, our freedoms, our constitutional rights are under attack. It's more important than ever to stand with the American Center for Law and Justice. For decades now, the ACLJ has been on the front lines protecting your freedoms, defending your rights in courts, in Congress, and in the public arena.

And we have an exceptional track record of success. But here's the bottom line, we could not do our work without your support. We remain committed to protecting your religious and constitutional freedoms.

That remains our top priority, especially now during these challenging times. The American Center for Law and Justice is on your side. If you're already a member, thank you. And if you're not, well, this is the perfect time to stand with us at ACLJ.org, where you can learn more about our life changing work. Become a member today.

ACLJ.org. We're taking your phone calls to 1-800-684-3110. And to contrast to how this administration and the current Secretary of State Blinken responds to what it's about Russia, which by the way, I will say that even though they talk tougher on Russia, I'm not sure they're taking the right actions there either. I mean, Russia is amassing a massive amount of troops in the Ukraine. I'm not sure we're showing a lot of strength there to a country that doesn't have the kind of economic power to wield around the world. But take a listen in how different, how much more cavalier it sounds coming from the same Secretary of State when it has to do with the Russians. What President Biden has said very clearly and repeatedly is, if Russia acts recklessly or aggressively, as it did with the SolarWinds cyber intrusion, as it did with interference in our elections, as it did with what it's done to Mr. Navalny, then we will respond.

I mean, I would say this. One is the elections issue again, this hacking issue that we got to the point where, I mean, everything that was found was that nothing was changed, nothing was done. They were doing things. I'm not saying that the Russians should get a pass on anything. But we know what they're wrongdoing. Think about the Alexei Navalny situation. He's an opposition leader there. He's been horribly mistreated, poisoned, arrested, apprehended, his family threatened too. And yet, okay, that is, again, that's bad.

But they're very careful about what they're doing there. At the same time, though, that's not genocide. That same Secretary of State, Harry, will acknowledge that there is a genocide ongoing in China. There's not a genocide ongoing in Russia. Vladimir Putin may not be a good guy, but not carrying out a genocide. Maybe carrying out a conflict in the Ukraine, but an actual genocide of its own people. He points to, you know, one opposition leader, the kind of hoax that Russia rigged an election in the US, which is not the case, and yet we're ignoring genocide. Absolutely.

So there is a clear and unmistakable lack of proportionality going on here. First, we should note that China has interfered in our elections. That's number one. Number two, we know that China continues to engage in genocide. There are hundreds of thousands of Muslims imprisoned or in camps in China. There are hundreds of thousands of Christians imprisoned in China.

This is now going on. So what is Secretary Blinken's response to that? His response is, oh, we will continue to follow international rules, but we will not attempt to contain China. That raises a quintessential question, which is why not? Why not confront the Chinese? Why not, as Secretary of State Pompeo has said, why not punch them in the nose? Why not send out our resources to confront China from Africa to Asia to South America?

I think the answer, of course, is the Biden administration has already predetermined that they are prepared to cave to Chinese aggression. And that, I think, is a huge problem going forward for the United States. Yeah, I want to go to Karen at Oklahoma Online, too. Hey, Karen, welcome to Secular.

You're on the air. Hey, you all are so right. There are some of us out here, you know, we just want to be left alone, but we've been awake to China and what they're doing for a long time. You know, this is a global issue. They're in Australia the same way. There's a lot of pushback by certain people in Australia trying to say, quit assigning our ports so low cost. I mean, it's global. Yeah, no, I mean, New Zealand announced, Wes, they were kind of stepping back outside of the partnership that's been to contain China in that region of the world. And New Zealand said they're out because the Chinese economic interest in New Zealand is so important to New Zealand's economy. They don't want to be seen as standing in the way of China at all.

Yeah, we have that relationship that's called the Quad, which includes Australia, I think, India and us, and maybe it used to be New Zealand. That's where the financial commercial connection is so powerful. And China knows this. And even you look at the United States, we are not, we may be in a group trying to counter China least on paper, but what are we doing practically as far as financially, economically, commercially to counter China and to decrease our dependence on them?

We're not doing much at all. And they will continue to buy influence and they use that influence for their own domination. And the future of China and how it dominates the world, it is not looking good because they are marching unabated. And the world, including the United States, we are not doing much to stop them.

Talk is cheap. This is the issue that foreign policy-wise, and there's obviously always lots of issues, and you can talk about Russia all day and night, and I think it's easier for Americans maybe to digest because they've been seen as the enemy, and Washington goes to great lengths not to paint China in that same light. And we know because of all the economic investment that they've been treated differently, but I do see now at least Republicans are willing to call China out. So whether or not they had economic interests in the past with the Chinese, whether or not they did business in the past with the Chinese, they are realizing now, okay, we've got to put the brakes on here. I think really the first serious effort happened under the last administration. I do see continued effort inside the Republican Senate.

I mentioned Marco Rubio early in the broadcast, and I think he's been on this for some time. But, I mean, here's the real truth, Jordan, to actually do what it takes to address a rising power like China, you need a President. I mean, so much of this authority lies with the chief executive.

You need the President of the United States to implement a lot of these things. And look, I mean, Secretary Blinken might want an improved relationship with China. I think all of us can want that if they were an honest partner. But, Jordan, during the course of this broadcast, we've listed out all of the ways that they have demonstrated they are not a trustworthy partner, so you need a President who will take it seriously. I agree with you. The Senate Republicans may be in the right place on this, Jordan.

We need more than that, though. Let's go to Jean in Idaho. Final call of the day. Hey, Jean, welcome to Secular on the Air.

Thank you for taking my call, Jordan. I wonder if any large portion of Americans even realize how much we're tied into China. I mean, they own so much property or lean on so much property.

One of them is in Nevada, where it's Heavenly Valley Ski Resort. It's a big draw for Nevada's money. And when we owe them, we're at a vast disadvantage. I don't understand why President Biden isn't more American and less Chinese, because it seems to me he's looking at his money. Yeah, well, I think that you said you got it right there, is that they've been funding his family, they've been funding his foundation, they've been funding his institute at Penn. I think you asked a question, do people realize the Chinese influence?

I don't think so. And it's because it'll be a Chinese corporation that invests, and they'll say, oh, that's not really the Chinese, but that is the Chinese. I think that is what people have to understand, is that it might have a corporate sounding name.

I only have 50 seconds here. It might sound like a corporate name. It might sound like it's independent.

It's not. There's no business operating there at the level where they are investing in buying U.S. properties or economically here that is not controlled by the Chinese Communist Party. They have a stake in everything. So you have to look past the name, the generic names of who's investing, and look to who's behind it, and then not be afraid to say, wait, that's the Chinese government. This is the same government that is committing a genocide of its own people. How much power do we want them to have internationally into our own affairs as well domestically in the United States?

We can talk about it on end, but we've got to do something about it, and we are at the ACLJ by having people like Secretary Pompeo on who pose the alternative idea of responding. For decades now, the ACLJ has been on the front lines, protecting your freedoms, defending your rights, in courts, in Congress, and in the public arena. The American Center for Law and Justice is on your side. If you're already a member, thank you. And if you're not, well, this is the perfect time to stand with us at ACLJ.org, where you can learn more about our life-changing work. Become a member today. ACLJ.org.