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Janet - Mefferd - Today - J. Warner Wallace (The Evidence of God)

Janet Mefferd / Janet Mefferd
The Truth Network Radio
January 5, 2021 4:30 am

Janet - Mefferd - Today - J. Warner Wallace (The Evidence of God)

Janet Mefferd / Janet Mefferd

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January 5, 2021 4:30 am

What are the eight critical pieces of evidence in the "crime scene" of the universe to determine if they point to a Divine Intruder? On the next edition of JANET MEFFERD TODAY, Christian apologist and former cold-case homicide detective J. Warner Wallace will join me. We’ll talk about the evidence for our Creator as we talk about his book, “God’s Crime Scene!” That and a whole lot more – be sure to join us for Tuesday’s JANET MEFFERD TODAY.

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This archived broadcast of Janet Mefford today is brought to you by pre-born for $140 you can provide ultrasounds to five women in crisis pregnancies. Call now 855402, baby. That's 855-402-2229 or Janet Mefford.com is our confidence is in Christ alone, I saw you know the obvious evidence for God. That is all around us in his creation because I was driving them to school and we were looking up above us at a stoplight and saw a V formation of bird that were flying over our heads. As I turned to the kids and I said how is it, do you think that the birds know to fly in a V formation now. Just as an aside, one scientific source that I read explain why the birds actually fly in a V and it said they do it to conserve energy by taking advantage of the up wash vortex fields created by the wings of the birds in front. Another reason was to facilitate orientation and communication among the birds, now that's no doubt true, but my question is this how do birds figure that out. Do the geese gather together and discuss how they'll conserve their energy by utilizing up wash vortex fields.

Of course they don't. And we as Christians look at this and we say migratory birds fly in a V formation because God put in instinct into them. Then in essence programs them to do it for very good reasons.

And that's exactly what Mike had said. They said mom I just created and that way a lot people don't think that way and don't understand how easy it is to look at the creation and to conclude there is a creator who divinely designed it. We have overwhelming evidence of our amazing creator God all around us, but non-Christians will often reject it right out of hand. So today will examine the evidence for a divinely created universe the way a cold case detective would do it. We had to have one on hand with my next guest, Jay Warner Wallace.

He is a call case homicide detective also former atheist and he is now a popular national speaker in Christian apologist to really be talking about his book, God's crime scene. A cold case detective examines the evidence for a divinely created universe, and Jim.

It is wonderful to talk to again how are you today I will gladly back with you and your red beard and ravening. It's a joy to have you here not you wrote cold case Christianity. A lot of people will be familiar with your previous book and you look to the evidence for the Gospels want take the same detective approach with the origins of the universe might know I was somebody who was an 835 and I became interested only because somebody, pastor, challenge me to consider Jesus just on the simplicity of a be a wise ancient sage. That's it.

Nothing more. I was not interested in God Well I am under some smart people so there's an ancient smart guy who got wisdom up, I'm happy to read it and so I started reading the Gospels and the Gospels. I became convinced based on my might, expertise of the detective with the reliable eyewitness accounts up to the extent up to the point of the miraculous events in the Gospels project of that aspect of it is some form of a fictional history or of the account history with mixed with with mythology, but my problem was, of course, is why did I think that anything lactose was out of bounds out because I was I was a committed topical naturalist and the next thing I had to examine wasn't why do I believe that nothing supernatural that God is the best explanation putting this in the universe. I was committed naturalist because I believe that physics in the space, time and matter and the laws of chemistry.

These are the only things needed to explain everything I saw in the universe. That's why was a committed naturalist, of course, the question is thing sufficient to seduce to actually explain everything in the universe and the next thing I had to do was to take a look at the evidence in the universe and see what is the best explanation for that evidence of God's crime scene is the exact next step I took. Once I realize that the compound was a lot of reliability was eyewitness accounts we call the Gospels. I still have the problem of the supernatural elements in the Gospels that began the study of the universe. It's a fascinating way that you look at it in so interesting.

I have rarely read apologetics like yours that just grab you because you're approaching it just like a detective would approach it now right at the outset. Jim you've got this analogy of a crime scene and how evidence of an intruder in the room actually changes the way that you approach a case and Bessie any case, how does that apply to evidence for creator how would you take that detective model of a crime scene and say let's figure out the evidence for creator and a lot of people get the officers batched a dead body. Reportedly, DPR's dead body reportable by and calls out take a look and see why somebody had not and will get there.

There's really four ways that any of us can.you can die naturally you can die by way of accident, you could By way of suicide. You can be monitored. The first three homicide investigators not to get involved. You only concerned if it's homicide so the first thing we have to do in the scene to determine which of the four matters of death applicable and one of the easiest ways to do this is the place will give my call inside or outside the room. We simply asked the question can I explain everything inside the room by staying inside the room so I get there and there's a victim with a wound injury and there's a pistol laying out of Sidon and that pistols registered to him it's only his fingerprints and DNA on the pistol. There's no sign of an entry and he's the only person in the room and all the evidence in the room comes back to him.

Why can explain everything in the room by staying in the room which is basically his suicide accident not to be homicide on the other hand, is not registered to him at all the fingerprints on that pistol or not his of the DNA is not his and there even party footprints leading out of the room will now I got evidence in the room that I cannot explain by staying in the room.

I have to go outside the room for an explanation on that's the case I got a little to consider the reasonable inference of an intruder and that changes everything that changes this thing from a death scene to a crime scene and this is what injuries do they change the nature of your scene that we could turn a corner here and apply the same technique to the universe. I try to fight eight pieces of evidence in the room of the universe. The natural universe that everyone has to explain. Regardless of your worldview. The only question is, can I explain these eight pieces by staying inside the room if I can some form of naturalism is sufficient. If I can't look for what is the kind of divine or kind of cosmic level intruder that we might explain by best account for these eight pieces of evidence and that's were trying to do and I got contents while it makes total sense.

You want to establish the evidence that you see around you in the world and say how in the world could that just be here for example you would look at cosmological evidence or biological evidence, moral evidence, the sorts of things. But where would you begin when you're when you're doing those eight pieces of evidence which one example.

Let's say I suspect you seem okay great about a witness who puts Janet at the same but with a better approach. If I had your finger prints, there is little evidence there that is located you.

Maybe I saw somebody told me about your behavior before and after the murder that implicates you in the statements you made that implicated you.

Plus I have the witnesses saw you there will now this case is built on a number of different kinds of evidence all the point to Janet. That's the problem it's it's built on several legs.

Well, it turns out these eight pieces of evidence on for very very different categories of evidence, cosmological evidence, the beginning of the universe. The appearance of fine tuning in the universe, biological evidence, the origin of life in the universe. The appearance of design and biological structures, mental evidence of your own consciousness you build your free agency and then finally moral evidence. The object of transcendent moral truths we all acknowledge and the existence of evil. All these things are in the universe and have to be explained by your worldview regarding what time will be you hold all have a similar burden of proof to show how all worldview accounts for these eight pieces and I think this is one of you look at these are very different categories. In eight different kinds of evidence if they all point to the same source I think you got a reasonable inference about the correct conclusion. Now when you're looking at the pieces of evidence would you also include the biblical text, or for purposes of discussion, would you leave that out for the time being. I approach the really count my own renal journey and so at this point in my personal journey, you would never have been able to reach me with the biblical text which is great about it is, of course, at the end of all this one is okay, what if there's a suspect description that emerges based on the evidence in the room will then match that to something that's out there is comfortable worldview. If I hired I've got great friend. They marched Africa work for the FBI for years as a criminal profile crime scene profile what he would do that would tell him hey I'm not detail my suspects are not to do anything about myself and show you the crime scene. Given what you know about crime scenes and evidence, I want you to describe for me the kind of person I'm looking for, the evidence of the crime is looking for this system to Warner Wallace talking about his book, God's crime scene. This is Janet Mefford for Bible league international to pray for today.

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It's great to be with you and great to be talking with Jay Warner Wallace. He is the author of God's crime scene. A cold case detective examines the evidence for divinely created so before we went to the break you were talking about your friend in the FBI and this issue of evidence and I wanted let you pick you up, pick it up where you left off row which is okay for looking at you know the strength of testimony and what skills do you bring to testimony and how you evaluate testimony is no eyewitnesses to the beginning of the universe were to take a different approach and my friend Mark who works for the FBI for years user crime scene profile, or so he would just basically look at the evidence at the crime scene and then tell me what kind of suspect out of you looking for if it happens to be that of the four people looking at one happens to match. This should he offer even though he has no idea what my suspects are no idea why candidates are. That's a good way to approach that he's used a different set of skills and has given me objectively.

A description of somebody I should be looking for. That happens to match some family looking at the same thing happens here. I happen to get a profile of the suspect. That could account for all the events in the universe if that profile happens to match this description we have in Scripture of this being call Yahweh will that's a great no interesting way to do things match. I got good reason to believe I've arrived at the conclusion of Yahweh in a way that's really testable and refutable or verifiable conclusion. Even that much more powerful because I didn't come to it by. Based on my presuppositions as a Christian I came to it based on the evidence in the universe that happens to match the description of God that's given in Scripture that was very powerful for me as an atheist because you never reach me. The other way you started with me. At least with making the case from the crime scene and then leave that point to a suspect that is so neat how you do that. Now whoever is in the room as you see in the book is, for example, nonmaterial and uncaused. How can you tell that from the evidence in a piece of evidence of this piece of evidence origination of the evidence is really important, long blonde of the victims you shoehorn about it in order. The suspect bring in the room when he came in the room is going to help us to know how evaluate that evidence. What turns up the first to do with the universe as it is asked the question, how did the universe get here come into the room question we have probably have it all.

Science all the signs I would use as an atheist points to a beginning of all space, time and matter, and this is something that is really not up for debate anymore is the standard cosmological model is that all space, time and matter came into existence at a point in the past now to what that is that that to happen is to come into existence and all signs point to make a list of all the science in the book of points to this conclusion. You have to help us because that is itself not spatial temporal material because those are the things that come into existence at that point she had to have a cause that none of those things right away. The first piece of evidence causes us to have to go outside the natural universe nature is basically all space, time and matter outside that universe in order to explain the existence of that universe and most of the thinking based on what atheist is a site survey for the book is that some form of multiple burst generator or quantum environment you struggling to figure out what this uncaused eternal first cause of the universe could be wanted to be an impersonal eternal cause rather than a personal eternal that's going to go back to serve as the people who believe in God's existence is nonpersonal and the problem is not in order to explain this in personal first cause is also because it has to give you all the other pieces of evidence in the room generate not only account for the existence of our universe, but how does it explain objective transcendent moral truth in our universe is that it will provide you with the standard of good by which we would call anything evil and require something personal. Not something impersonal.

We said something interesting when you referring to atheists or non-Christians who say I'm trying to find an impersonal first cause for everything that we see all around us.

Aren't you already impeding your investigation because your limiting the beginning of the universe only to nonpersonal causes, which is not a good way to know if you went into a crime scene. For example, and saw a dead body and said want to rule out the husband and the wife is dead under rule out the husband. It's got to be 70 besides the husband how can you do an accurate investigation unless all possibilities are on the table. Happens to me everything you're absolutely science tells us nothing. Scientists tell us things and the scientists tell us these things based on the facts of science uncover. They interpret those facts is often based on their piece of positional worldview and they give us an answer so I look at the same evidence that they're looking at. I will describe the same science that they Dave described in this book is really science and philosophy, and the only differences on treating each fact more objectively and saying hey leave the conclusion open don't automatically rush to your natural explanations leave it open and see where the evidence points in the end I don't believe that those impersonal forces are typically described that would cause the universe to come into existence can give you the information. For example we see in DNA information typically comes from intelligence that never seen any set of laws of physical laws of physics or chemistry that could ever give you the kind of complexity and specificity that we see in DNA that kind of information always comes from intelligence. So again generator that impersonal because were talking about simply cannot explain that piece of evidence in our universe.

Instead, the better inference is an intelligent source and if that first cause is a personal, all-powerful, non-spatial, nonmaterial, a temple first cause while than that. That would actually do that, because could give you information that saying I think in the Bible. This case on all eight pieces of evidence could remember when you walk through the crime scene that one suspect your so you're saying is because has to account not just for one of the pieces of evidence in your crime scene that has to account for all the evidence in your crimes.

That's right, will you raise a great point with the DNA point. But what about also something that will come up in apologetics arguments about the creation of the world and the possibility of having a creator, the what is it the second law of thermodynamics entropy where things have a tendency to run down and to become less complex and here we have atheists and people like Dawkins and so for saying oh no, we became we we are. These complex life forms that came out of perhaps less complex life force it to me at strains common sense to even try to come up with a theory that would stay consistent. That would explain all that we have a chicken and a problem at all. You know life is basically adult on the simple building blocks of proteins from amino acids in the palm you have is a protein formation require some machines and other kinds of machines that are themselves built of proteins. You have a chicken and egg problem will have all the stuff come together in such a way as to create itself overcomes the chicken and egg problem in most biological systems is DNA genetic information which instructs all of this complex formation of both some machines on molecular machines in the cell, all those things are guided by DNA. So in the end we used to think the entire universe is grounded on physics. It turns out it's grounded information. That's the hardest thing to explain is how do we get information in the genome overcome the chicken and egg problem of all biological life. What do they tend to say when confronted with that argument. As I surveyed all the, the big questions the detectives ask and you can employ the wife how, what, when and where questions we always ask right you'll see the scientist absolutely conflicted and divided on all the answers to those big questions related to the origin of life. We are no closer today than we were.

The very first date. Any scientist ever began a study on the origin of life. We can agree on where could occur we can agree on how workers we can agree on when it occurs.

There is no science is established any of that. That's the problem. No one's got answers those questions because they are insurmountable based on the problem. DNA and information. This is why Anthony flew the famous atheist who for years held out as an atheist, ultimately changed his view about them because he was convinced, you can explain the is fascinating how would you go about identifying design in the universe looking at a divinely created universe and the order in the structure. What sorts of things do you think really demonstrate that there is a creator who has designed it, even in the literature we see from from the ocean and atheist alike. What is the science were the attributes of design, different spin on this, like all of it.

My experience as a detective tells me that the best cases Reichel cumulative cases right to do this is the idea is if I can build a case against somebody on 80 pieces of evidence that the much better case than the more diverse the evidence.

I think there are really eight different attributes of design that we typically associate with designers hard to avoid things like irreducible complexity that things like informationally based design.

There are things like direction. Complexity of the insufficiency of natural laws and getting it done, but the possibility of chance involved in some of these eight things that we typically recognize as attributes of design and one of my chapters. Chapter 4 and I show how we apply that eight prong template to anything that you ever picked up the phone if it's something on the floor. You pick up and you wonder did the nature create this intelligently designed. This template will help you decide what turns out you take that a piece template you apply it to biological structures. You'll find that those biological structures demonstrate the attributes of design that in any other structure we would say that's quickly design but indulgent blunder reject the intelligent desire when it comes to biological structures when that same template when applied to anything else in the world would conclude that there's an intelligent designer apply to a Bruins nest. If you apply this template to a birds nest. You see clearly. Okay, now I see other tablet works. That's clearly a design win didn't blow that nest together.

You didn't draw that nest together just to come back to Warner Wallace with me talking about God's crime scene will return to this this archived broadcast of Janet Mefford today is brought to you by pre-born for $140 you can provide ultrasounds to five women in crisis pregnancies.

Call now 855402, baby. That's 855-402-2229 or Janet Mefford.com here's your host Joe.

So how do we know that the universe was divinely created. We are entering the world of apologetics today great book is God's crime scene. A cold case detective examines the evidence for divinely created universe listening to the Janet Mefford today Angie Warner Wallace is my guest so you were talking about this template applied to the biological aspect of life and a bird nest. It's kind like what I was in at the beginning of the show about the formation.

How do birds know how to do something like that if you really take the time to inspect and to look into examine you will be amazed even even if you're not a Christian yet and hopefully those were listening or not Christians will be convinced and the Lord will save them down the road, but you look at something like a birds nest and conclude wow that just kinda came up came about big deal template eight piece template. All that is no way that natural laws could account for this that there is no way that that the chances of sufficient explanation. If we see something we recognize immediately as resembling other known designed objects. That's one aspect of any kind of sophistication and intricacy that seems to be unexplainable by natural law, that's another part of it. If it's informationally dependent. You know this is what we say information in the genome is so important to our equation. If we think it's got goal direction or some form of obvious intentionality. That's important. And also if there's an irreducible complexity and that's when we talk about occasionally. That's what you have an object that has to have a distinct number of pieces assembled in a certain way it cannot be reduced below that the limited number of pieces function when you see that that's your mark of design is, finally, is there some decision or choice reflection, we can see work alternatives were available but this appears to be a choice that made about what to use in the construction of this okay that's a lot to say. Big sentence. You actually several illustrations in the book where I show that you don't have to have all eight of these things in place for a designer is a matter of fact in the birds nest. You only have five or six of these things really in place.

But even with just five or six things in place, you recognize that birds nest is not an accident that birds nest is the product of intelligent design of birds so I show how the weapon that was left at a crime scene by the white Janet is every single chapter 1 introduced a complex concept or concept used it to infer what's inside or outside the room of the universe.

I begin with a crime scene for my professional career that were had to use that same skill set to make a conclusion we turn a corner and show how that same skill sets that everyone of these chapters basically begins with the top story and then we can move from the cop story into the universe and we talk about how we reply that technique to this piece of evidence of this particular issue of design, I show how we used this to determine that a weapon left at a crime scene was in fact a weapon that was built and designed and created by the killer was a garrotte which is basically a wire strangulation device right so you left this at the crime scene will want to be believe that that piece of wire is not just some artifact of the scene. When we look at that piece of wire with the two handles at the end and we go immediately. We know that's a designed object that's that's something that shows attributes of design will that's again we even consciously we apply a template of design to what is a small matter because you look at biological structures in your own physical anatomy at the cellular level. When you look at the icon of all intelligent design, which is Michael B's example.

He is a professor of biochemistry at Lehigh University. He's the first one who mentioned this bacterial flagellum is little motor that drives bacteria at the cellular level. My gosh, it appears to be like a rotary engine we see in in cars. How the world could this thing have evolved what mechanism of evolution could ever account for the kinds of machines we see at the molecular level yet he's right because the eight pieces of eight attributes of design that I described in the book are present in that molecular machine and we see that the most reasonable inference is design, not evolution. Absolutely.

So let's move on to some of the qualities of human beings because this is a huge area.

Talk about human beings having consciousness. I know some of the things I read from some of the new atheists and so forth struggle a little bit to fully explain consciousness. How do we do a crime scene on this and find evidence for a creator just by merely looking at the consciousness of human beings called the problem of mind or mind-body problem, and you see a lot of literature on this.

You can read a number of books in their title have the problem of mind why the problem it's a problem because you want impossible to explain atheistic physical, elastic, materialistic definition of the universe. You can explain in a materialistic universe how brains exist but you cannot explain how the nonmaterial mind could emerge from a purely physical universe. That's the problem is the mind simply an illusion.

We think we have unconscious self-awareness. But really, these are just physical activities in our brain to give us the illusion of consciousness a lot of atheist believe that's all. This could be because they know if atheism is true. The only thing they have to work with is the stuff that might give you a brain, but that same stuff is not going to give your mind chapter on this in the book is to show you five differences between the brain and the mind to think that our mind is the same as the brain is a mistake, then another one. I mean, most people recognize that what is called the problem of mind salt show in the book you five quick ways to distinguish between these two, but that leaves the problem unanswered.

How do we get mines in a purely physical universe and a lot of atheists. Every kind of the bullet on this and just so you know does not get you to mind. Therefore, we don't recognize my solution at least consistent atheists. Your physical determinist your people who believe all we have in the universe of space, time and matter and the laws that govern those things will guess what physics cannot govern your mental thoughts. That's the problem.

Physics could govern the neurons that are firing in your physical brain so that the stuff of atheism is available for the brain, but the stuff of atheism has no relationship to the mind is your mind is an illusion.

Why should I listen to you anyway that you think your mind is an illusion with what are you determining that this is using your mind, even to have an illusion requires a conscious mind to be deceived via the problem is that there's almost no way around our common experience of mind. Now imagine if there is a personal, non-spatial, nonmaterial, not a temple creative intelligent mind that is creating in its own image. That thing outside the room of the universe could actually account for the beings we see in the universe that have information there informationally loaded with DNA and the conscious mind because he been created in the image of the creator. This is that this is why think that the external suspect starts to look more and more and more step-by-step, more more like what we see in Scripture, there is a conscious mind. Also, free agency right if you have a mind you have the ability to make choices with your mind free choices because of all you have is a brain with neurons firing a physical brain that has basically dependent on prior physical events like dominoes falling one against the other will guess what you have re-created everything is been determined by prior set of physical events that incline you toward some behavior based on the way the dominoes are falling in it again. Atheists also consistent with their consistent. It also will tell you that you will have the freedom to think you have that's also illusion you have a more deterministic universe that is purely physical. Nothing but dominoes remembered almost can't make free choices. Dominoes simply fall falling. And that's the problem with this kind of universe. It turns out if you want to be able to reason to decide between two competing ideas to decide what you're hearing from you today is even reasonable. You have to live in and you stick universe that allows you the consciousness and freedom to make kinds of choices: reasonable, that's the problem can give you that kind of universe know and can explain loss for me that's a very large argument as well. When you talk about free choice and moral judgments, and so forth. How do you explain laws if were just merely materialistic matter. Everything that we valued as an atheist reason, creativity, compassion and empathy allowed.

More importantly, how about culpability as a cop, that's a big issue.

If you aren't making free choices. I can hold you accountable. I can't hold you accountable for your eye colors just a consequence of your genetic code physical nature of God's crime scene. She Warner Wallace and Jim hi this is Janet Mefford here to tell you about the ministry of pre-born sons and does everything for me. It really made it all worthwhile to know I was and I have a little listening. Once he got here is this you just heard a real life testimony from a woman whose life was changed by the Ministry of pre-born. You see, when a young woman considering abortion sees her baby on ultrasound and here's the heartbeat, she almost always chooses life for her pre-born baby. I don't know where my life without her pre-born steps into the darkest corners and finds women in need to help them choose life.

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The book from J.

Warner Wallace, by the way, you can check him out.

A cold case, Christianity.com and we have had a fascinating discussion so far about all the evidence that is available for us to examine just like a detective would when we are trying to determine the origins and the meaning of the universe and one of the things that you bring up in the book to Jim, is this question of morality were talking a little bit about free choices love reasoning culpability and so forth.

But morality were often told is just opinion. And yet, you will find globally some system of law and order is an and people believing one thing is good. One thing is evil even if it's reversed. If you have ISA seen slaughtering Christians is good. They have their own twisted moral code, but there is a sense of good and evil universally.

How do we look at that evidence and conclude there is a creator behind it. Great moral hierarchy. We bought a gang culture for two years working gangs off Los Angeles County and I can tell you that every group had its own moral code.

There were things they would've said you do when you don't do those behaviors as culture and it turns out, as you step up the moral hierarchy you know if your little gangster in Los Angeles County.

You bend your knee to the code of your gang member Los Angeles County. You can't park your car in certain places on the street. You could've been your need to Los Angeles County codes and if your Los Angeles County got up and you need to a California state laws and if you're in California get up in your need of them federal laws. And if you're in the United States. You know that the United Nations thinks accounting governs all of us.

We should have some say over doing this is the point is we go up each one of these levels provides us with certain laws. If everything you believe morality can fit in one of those levels are fine all just a matter of either cultural or national whatever opinion you might might made me think of.

Here's the problem. There are a number of laws that we agree transcend every culture. For example, it is never okay to kill someone for the fun of it that is code that transcends every culture and every point in history. No matter where you want a map that you can imagine a Star Trek world in which there's a confederation of planets in that code even applies to the Klingons okay transcends the species we call humans get transcendent objective moral codes that are not grounded in the gang group not grounded in the city or the state or the federal law there grounded in something that transcends even the species were such work is such a code come from well that's the problem is that you cannot get it by way of either cultural opinion. You cannot get it by way of DNA. If you think that your your your ideas about walls are embedded in your DNA will good luck trying to tell somebody else with a different genetic background that they're wrong about something like B accountable for this. My genetic code inclines me to believe this is actually moral behavior will make any kinds of moral choices. So the problem is we've got to account for transcendent objective moral codes that we all recognize transcend all of us in the best way to ground those is source also transcends all of us know what about the problem is evil. I know we don't have a whole lot of time to delve into that in great depth. But the problem is evil for many non-Christians. They will say there can't be a God. Because if God is good and God is holy, why doesn't he stop evil. We know the answers. The cross, but how do you deal with that using the limitations that you have here examining a crime scene. For example, I can suspect alibi will actually take that suspect off the table is evil and excavating piece of evidence that takes got off the table. I don't think so number one why do we say something is evil to evil to us, we mean is not truly evil. It is transcendently evil. Is it where you are in history were you on the universe. If that's the case we need a standard called good by which to measure something that is truly transcendently evil. The only measurement of what could be.

That's transcendently good like that is of course a source that transcends all the universe. And that's the problem. Once again you're outside the natural world you're outside looking at a source that could trap you could actually answer the question of why does evil happen is that today on the radio course. But I continue the book. I try to do is show you the complexity of any evil act I've ever investigated, not investigated my share. Believe me they are always complicated in the short good reasons to explain why an act occurs are always layered and multifaceted and their nuanced what turns out there are seven things I talked about this in the chapter would explain evil in the context of the universe in which there is an all loving, all powerful God who has dominion.

Why would these things happen want to go seven reasons and it's always good to be some combination that's nuanced and complicated in interrelated think they can say to me, Jim, why did that happen that little girl. I can just give you 140 character response on twitter. Forget it is never going to happen. It's a complicated, interrelated connection that's we try to talk about in that chapter on evil so the last few minutes we have.

I know that you make great closing argument. You also have a secondary investigation that you include in the book. But how do you formulate your closing argument to the jury on the evidence for divinely created universe in the and we know that can be completely appointed by one common causal factor.

That's a powerful case it turns out to explain all the evidence in the universe from the atheistic perspective I have to employ dozens and dozens and dozens of unrelated and contradictory, not even evidentially based explanations, hoping that one of them sticks to the wall so we can come to look at just a crazy combination of all these causes that give us a universe that looks a certain way, we can say there's one common causal explanation that could explain all the evidence, which is more reasonable to be the simpler explanation, that's more reasonable.

It turns out there is a theory of everything that scientists about looking for that everything is called Yahweh God is that one explanation could account for all the evidence in the universe. If you stop pushing against the final question nobody wants to ask what when where it's a who question could actually resolve the other unanswered questions. It will just allow ourselves to ask the question that gets us away from naturalism.

It points back to the God of the universe, that's for sure. Again, what keeps people from wanting to go on this investigation. In the first place is our fallen nature. I did and this is a problem because for a lot of us will see you but you're smart you'll turn to your non-Christian friend whose brilliant insight but you're so smart, how can you not see this. It's not just a matter of examining the evidence, but certainly once you start examining the evidence, the Lord uses that he used it in your life driving the divine intruder who actually is not only an intruder. Yes, I think multiple that's it. Now you talk also about a sense of urgency about the evidence for God's crime scene what you say for example to the non-Christians who heard what you had to say today to God as an answer because some days I might have an answer for me. But don't you think about this. We don't allow jurors to say to themselves considering a case in a jury trial. You can't make a decision five years from now some new piece of evidence will come up and change things really make a decision based on whether this is good enough today. Can't wait and hope that five years now something new will come up in the end I think there's more than enough evidence to the existence of God and in God's crime rate here.

Now the question is are you going to say no I don't want that to be true. Some of the weight, hoping that someday that some new piece of evidence will explain all the unanswered questions and atheism. Okay, I think in the end we have to have a sense of urgency. Act now because so much is at stake. The idea of the weight hope that someday these questions get answered as public, we would never be allowed to do that as Christians someday God will answer it know you want to move now science of the gaps.

If you say will God someday science will be able to answer it. Work on these questions for generations. There are no answers. I'm absolutely convinced that going forward there will be because the best inference is the inference we see today that God is the creator of the universe absolutely. And so those materialists are naturalists who would say well I know we don't really have sound answers on these massive questions, but now I just live with that tension well if you live with that tension and you never take the time to examine the evidence for creator your plane really Russian roulette with your soul. That's the bottom line is a lot of criminal trial. Somebody is a murder suspect rotted stakeholders even more stake that your eternal life that hangs in the balance you want to guaranteed tomorrow. Today's the day to act to make a decision based on what we do know today because you may not have it tomorrow for science to fill in the gap we make a decision today is why we say that the death scenes when the intruder was strong in the crime scenes and also should turn your sense of curiosity into a sense of urgency because we got a glutton catch the bad guy, listening, and you're listening to the evidence is being collected sense of urgency for making the decisions we don't have to model guaranteed beautifully set a wonderful book and I say that wholeheartedly. It's called God's crime scene.

A cold case detectives examines the evidence for divinely created universe J.

Warner Wallace consignment call case, Christianity.com. Jim always a pleasure. It's so great to have you here in a wonderful but good job.

I'm in so much thanks Jim.

God bless you and thanks for being with us and thank you to our website for.com. Thanks for being with us this hour has been brought to help us a 350 babies lives by the end of January, 313 ultrasound $28 saves one life call now 85540 855-402-2229


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