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May 21, 2020 5:50 pm
This archived broadcast of Janet Mefford today is brought to you by Liberty health share liberty.
Healthcare is a nonprofit healthcare sharing ministry that allows you to control and manage your own healthcare and choose any doctor or hospital in the nation. If your freedom loving American looking for contract free healthcare call now 855-585-4237 or go to liberty, health share.org/GMT for more information liberty health chair.org/GMT generated reference to our confidence is in Christ alone, before God says that soil is timeless reality as the un-manifested life that animates your physical form. You can then feel the same life deep within every other human and every other creature you look beyond the veil of form and separation. This is the realization of oneness. While these are the words of Eckhart toll lay the man the New York Times once called the most popular spiritual author in the United States.
But why is tolling is popular as he is, one could point to the clear career boost he got from Oprah Winfrey. If you years back but there's actually more to it.
In fact, this idea of oneness is increasingly tantalizing. Americans and spiritual seekers across the world.
We used to refer to this as the New Age movement but now perhaps we have to say is my next guest. As we have entered the age of re-enchantment the assembly of meaning and purpose within a matrix of wonder and mystery all pointing to a paradigm of holism. This is our post-Christian context in which the god of this age is convincing more and more people that they just need to recognize their own oneness to be as God, to be masters of their own meaning and destiny and to build heaven on earth, but Christians would do well to remind these folks how the garden of Eden turned out how the Tower of Babel turned out, and how human history will turn out with the Lord Jesus Christ will not share his glory with another returning to save his bride and to judge this sinful world in righteousness and the meaning in the meantime, what is going on out there were to find out today with researcher Carl tie crib editor, forcing change, which documents the major social, religious, political, economic and geostrategic trends that are impacting the West's brand-new book is called game of God's car along and sure I recognize but it's so good to welcome me back.
How are you, great, great, really important subject. Well, it certainly is you and I have talked a lot over the years about your visits to places like burning man. These transformational festivals around the world. We talked recently about going to the Parliament of the world's religions. So you've had a long period of time where you've been studying this whole game of God's how would you describe what's going on. What would be your overall assessment of this age of re-enchantment that is now upon us really recoiled out and hard for some people to wrap around really what's being offered is another road salvation.
A powerful solution made in her own we are designing an producer nor own the meeting saying what will our gut will be really difficult for neutrality or adult alternative form of salvation and working for us to keep in mind as Christians is easy to point to save your beautiful government to bring about in the book in which we talked about a while back and we can point all of you know the world is changing. We Christians overcome and all you know the world is becoming more evil goal of life you seen a lot of changes but really what we have to do is recognize the physical salvation message directly opposed salvation through Jesus Christ's will is you talk about the difference between oneness and otherness and I think this is such a vital distinction for Christians to understand how would you differentiate between the game of God's salvation message and the true salvation message of Jesus Christ. While God, you're building it ourselves.
We were we are literally playing all kind of game God. We are making the declaration that we can we elevate ourselves critical so we that we do it collectively. Re-enchantment is about about doing that collectively.
Collectively with each other, but collectively planted with the environment with the cosmos and also also, we will do it collectively with spiritual powers improve the power of Paul talks about that really is the beginning of God being played since Genesis chapter type of salvation we find in the we are going to construct this with our own have basically the creation worshiping itself where the biblical worldview is. No no creation Fix itself.
Problem Fix itself, that have come from literally all of life's the one the one who created all who himself control the world so that he could and would be hope, and hope, eternal, and so the real fiction here. You know the fundamentals of fiction is one of the temporary system. One of the world. What is Memphis temporary temporary of the breath that we have the other roof eternal one who doesn't change one who gives life and not give his wife demonstrated that power was interesting when you look back in history.
I can remember when the New Age movement kind of exploded on the Christian scene in terms of attention that all of a sudden we recognize Taylor bunch people who are into crystals, and you know are doing weird things over in Denver. I kind of into the environmentalist staff and New World economics and Robin to come together as Juan and Holman all these kinds of things you don't hear too much about the New Age movement per se anymore. They don't call it that much anymore but is that still around just under a new name and is that really the essence of what's going on here because you also have other streams coming into play like Hinduism you know and and how I think it was time or Newsweek that had on its cover number of years ago were all Hindus now, and this idea that were accepting of Carmine yoga and all this kinda stuff these things all fit together. Carl oh yeah you know we have a spiritual work in the West, I would argue that what work rubbing shoulders with talking know? Is there a form of spirituality that transcend even some feeling. We can all get out really spiritual. But the New Age movement chart this in the book the New Age movement itself really began to change around the year 2000, and not even the New Age drift loaded it really flourished what one thing the New Age goodwill was a really emphasized self five view of human potential that we could become more than ourselves. We are, we have to recognize and discover and remember our divine selves and it became a very oriented had that pendency oriented movement and orientation or self orientation. Really, started to change your 2000 and more reflective you talk to me anymore.
You and I are neighbors trees rabbits in the field. Everything coming together as one and we all recognize our oneness though. I mean back in the 80s and 90s was preaching the same thing. The idea of one. They also talked about the but after the year 2000. For some reason at that point really seemed to be the emphasis within the American mindset within the Western point of orientation. We are doing this together that really what separates. I think this movement from from the yoke of the more New Age ideas of the 1980s and 90s really no moves toward the concept of what we have a collective responsibility to either collective responsibility to each other. We have a collective responsibility to create heaven on earth. There is no difference between the two.
They both always been cut hand-in-hand, but now the emphasis is on leave collective work background.
The emphasis was one what I could get well that's an interesting distinction because we hear a lot of this collective ideal as you call it in your box all around us and I think of Romans chapter 1 where suppressing the truth in unrighteousness. Man begins to worship and serve the creation rather than the creator who is blessed forever is a lot more to talk about a game of God's name in the book Carl to grab my guest and will come back on Janet Mefford today right after this. Are you in need of a healthcare program you're in love as a member of Liberty healthcare in your part of a community comes together to share their medical expenses.
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Find out more by calling 855-565-2561 855-565-2561 or visit Liberty healthcare.org/GMT that's Liberty healthcare.org/GMT here's Dan Steiner, president of pre-born with an important update the covert, 19 virus is having a terrible impact for the most vulnerable among us, the unborn this past week, a woman sure she for being pregnant was so much going on in the world. The abortionist gave her an RU-486 pill to terminate her pregnancy are pre-born sinners there for her, however, reverse the abortion pill and saved her baby or crisis line is flooded with women similar stories pre-born sinners are the alternative to Planned Parenthood, and this may through a challenge grant pre-born will be able to send $100,000 to clinics. If this goal is reached, and you can help, call 855402 baby that's 855-402-2229 one. Ultrasound is just $28. But this challenge will double your efforts to donate, just call 855402, baby. That's 855-402-2229. All gifts are tax-deductible.
That's 855-402-2229 or there's a pre-born banner to firstname.lastname@example.org you're listening to you today and here's Joe we are back on Janet effort today is quite happy with us and great-aunt with us. Carl Ty grabbed his new book is called game of God's the temple of man in the age of re-enchantment we have seen a lot of New Age emphasis over the last several decades.
But as Carl was saying before the break we have seen a move from an emphasis on the self to now an emphasis on the collective. It's about we in the oneness that will bring us all together.
You mentioned in the book Carl which I think is such a great jumping off point to talk to people about what's going on here when you went to the global citizenship 2000 youth Congress you talk in the book about that what you observed there. And of course you you travel around a lot these kinds of weird offense and get a birds eye view of what's going on but what are your observations about that event in the context of moving from the self discussion to the Wii oneness discussion very around oneness and so from the event was geared towards creating a type of global ship education curriculum for Canadian school and the importance of stressing global food shopping and today I am our education about my own problem grade 12. Social program is all about global ship. Being a good global what it means to be a global ship along those lines where I really thought about emphasis on the we was the school that were participating as they uncocked what looked like could be good global for the emphasis was on view of collective we are. We have to do this together. We have to become together. We have to put down strategies we have to. In the words of one of one of the little round table group so bring the photo of the book we have to make virus we have to infect everyone.
No inoculation was the language that was said directly and so for me it was like wow okay this goes from the fixed vote of the academic and already have been reading up on the New Age and spending time going through documents and books and talking to people. But then when you when you go to an event like that movie from the academic goal from the academic side to you that there are emotions involved. There is there is a patient there is hope there is being long-lived and acute educators, schoolchildren and educators we had community leaders.
They left supercharged. They were moving forward.
Social dresses warriors forward global United common cause of saving the earth and therefore saving right so it's what they recognize of course that you can't just have a bunch of people in robes with crystals hanging out forever. You have to move this into the general population.
So what better way to target the next generation.
Then, by targeting the kids. I mean it. That's what they're doing right. The global citizen stuff is being you know it's in schools here as well, not just Canada but also in the US through expedited review on Sir 1970 really was.
You could call you everything off in terms of gross loyalty. Now that was that was where whole generation was being you to be cool to think of themselves first.
Having a loyalty rise and I think for example of the mind up program familiar with that thing from the Goldie Han foundation and the emphasis on mindfulness in this curriculum is published by Scholastic which is one of the major educational publishers in the United States and they talk about being mine fall in social emotional learning, and all this kind of stuff, but this is basically Buddhism wrapped up in some educational language so they're getting the spirituality into the kids minds, but they're not always honest about what they're really doing right and do not have a major role in researching Western mood mood in such a way that we know are our eager. We we are reaching and looking for those experiences. Those practices both techniques that bring us into a feeling that we are connected in yoga does… It was better a very important aspect of Eastern practices.
It allows you to feel like you have just accomplished something spiritual you something spiritual you taken your mind to a new place and with it comes a new worldview. One of the chapters are talk about how we spent some time at the Lotus Temple the Krishna Temple solely for the mouth of Salt Lake City onion right in the heart of Mormon countries are the most concentrated counties of Mormon Utah right in the heart of this concentration is Lotus Krishna Temple you you were back and forth going back and forth in and basically you said we are in the wising yoga were doing it through things like the holy holy of color run and struck me mean we are becoming Hindu.
Are you surprised in spirit though. Real people are joining outcomes, not joining a temple joining a community but we are becoming Hindu eyes. Work. Something about worldview.
When we talk about you know that Congress that you went to some of these festivals that you gone to. That's one part of it. You also talk so in the book about some of the big entities that are promoting oneness you mention, of course, the Gorbachev foundation USA and then the state of the world forum, the Esalen Institute. Places like that.
What are some of the big organizations that are on board with this oneness emphasis owe you a foundational role in shifting mind for those who may not work and retreat center on the California coastline suffered Cisco and early 1960s replace the real you. The place that merged together Eastern philosophy experiences you still worldview with the human potential psychology movement really birth whole human potential movement that came out of a flaw introduced America to the bistro worldview is also the place where a lot of liberal theology began to emerge, including liberal view of sexuality and sexual and gender identity all about.
In many ways emerged out of Exelon retreat workshop time that the people would spend in the pools of the song is their address along.
It had a huge impact a major impact really did change the way in many ways it still part of of network large network that blossomed after the 1960s. What I felt was for me one of the little prizes in writing the book was the connection between Exelon and the Gorbachev foundation is one Michael Gorbachev himself and the important Exelon reports place the floormat in bridging being kind of shuttle between the Soviet Union and the United States in the 1980s and how it really that was the point of contact between the between the curtain what was happening behind the Iron Curtain and America and then the spinoff before the wall we were fulfilled out before the Iron Curtain collapsed to be able to go into Moscow to go into the Soviet Union to bring help bring workshops and experiences on new spirituality just how important a flaw in one in helping to change the thinking of Moscow's elite and normally important role of the individual Jim Garrison comes out of a Christian background hold back story. There he was Exelon's front for their Soviet Union program and that he is becoming the president of the Gorbachev foundation so so many connections interesting, and for myself. That was that was huge all horrible because those doing the research and probing deeper and deeper and deeper into what F1 had been doing, because not only have the restructured Western thinking they had informed of thinking of major players. Are they still involved heavily in this sort of thing. They still relevant today. Died out during the end of the leadership holding the leadership retreat centers or their leadership retreat before you go very very general Wilbur who played such a big role in helping the emergent church. Think about about spirituality has played a role with Brian McLaren over recognize that one. Just an enormous influence upon the changing face of American spiritual swelling that makes a whole lot of sense. If you understand about the emergent church and this is something else I want to get into when we come back from the spring, the interfaith movement in the spiritual formation movement. What does that have to do with this game of God's will come back with Carl to grab right after this. This archived broadcast of Janet for today is brought to you by Liberty healthcare Liberty healthcare is a nonprofit healthcare sharing ministry that allows you to control and manage your own healthcare and choose any doctor or hospital in the nation. If your freedom loving American looking for contract free healthcare call now 855-585-4237 or go to liberty, health share.org/GMT for more information liberty healthcare.org/GMT, here's your host for today. Glad to have you along.
Glad to have with us Carl Ty Graham.
He is editor forcing change and author of game of God's the temple of man in the age of re-enchantment notice that there is an emphasis today on oneness and we saw that in the New Age movement of the 80s and 90s as Carl has been outlining what were seeing more and more across-the-board.
Oprah helped with this Carl as I mentioned before Eckardt telling you talk about that in the book the fact that Oprah has been a huge spiritual influence, shall we say in a bad way in popularizing this stuff but let's little bit about what you were saying before we went to the break and that was you were mentioning some of these emergent names Brian McLaren, for example, can Wilbur and talk about the Esalen Institute and its influence in this whole push toward oneness as if we can ever really have that but what kind of a fact has the oneness movement played on the interfaith movements and things like this mystical spiritual formation movement that's found its way to so many churches.
How have Christians been affected by this oneness movement will one wonder if the dominant worldview that nobody really talks about what man God and nature all should that man God in nature. All have a commonality record and we were bridged all 303 dangers together were Christians have played into the emergent church movement did have a rule that have a role in Percival following the postmodern mood that we don't really looking for answers or audio. We have questions we don't really we don't really know if we can we can land on solid ground with solid answers were looking for answers, but really were more questions, more than anything else. There was this the search for the experiential search for meaning and purpose and how we we experiencing worship together or how we experience life and in the postmodern mood.
With stripped away really anything that was meaningful and became moot as we can question everything, but we really can't find out that the conversation emphasis yeah we get that today in evangelicalism.
We have answers.
Let's just talk about the big questions and I'm thinking Jesus was the answer. Did we forget so quickly that we do manual and server yeah you vacuum and vacuum with soap body is filled with re-enchantment looking for the mystery and wonder in the environment of the earth really is what we would consider to be a pagan world and in the Christian the Christian community. I say that we follow culture we fold the trends to follow to to understand that we follow to embrace it soon and we have seen that across-the-board we should go go Christian birthday.
We Christianize everything that the world spiritual life we Christianize that we therefore think somehow different. Or maybe it's better to live a Christian language or Christian is attached to it long wrong we are separate we are different. There was a burnt different point of reference work with. We have a different different meaning.
We've confused the computer that greatly comes with the interfaith side of talk, you know, if you want back I was at the parliament to local visions and their oneness was constantly being reinforced, including by Christians who are attending wall will say we are representatives of the Christian communities were also hammering forward.
Oneness oneness will therefore oneness 2015 parliament 12 Salt Lake City Brian McLaren was there. He is one of our keynote speakers. He was giving a talk on on climate change and in his talk, pressing he wasn't really sure if you love God because you nature you love the trees and everything or you love birds in the trees in nature because he loved God he wasn't sure which way it went. Interesting part of his talk with about the drawing to us from the earth and singing to it more or less given up to give us a new story or to give the growth of new story doing building a new story building myth, not a fairytale, myth in the sense of a fable myth in the story that has a message of meaning and purpose and the meaning and purpose being present. We are all connected with one were all part of each other and were all feeling together.
One of the questions that came up to 2015 part of the workshop on the question, are we all. One and that was that with this workshop. How do we find out we are all one to boil down to all you we all have feeling experience that connects us together and doesn't matter if you are a Muslim Sufi or a Christian or Hindu or Buddhist. We feel we have the sense of connection that we feeling that feeling that binds us together that is what we are all one that's working very well in the Middle East going on granting that's intent, Christians and Muslims in Africa that's working great. The oneness thing is just fantastic, no good point, good point. I mean, so your spirituality and your belief system is well structured on what you feel are you kidding right you absolutely like garbage and Christians, we have to recognize that same day yesterday and tomorrow is my favorite is on the feelings I have exactly exactly well at the root of this Carl what really is the premise it seems is we've got it all together. We just have to realize it we don't have it together we are one. We are one falling sinful human race. And we need a Savior. This is very basic stuff and the fact that Brian McLaren and those like him have to say well we need a new story because her old one didn't work proves that this guy is standing on shifting sand when he needs to be standing on the foundation of God's word. 1.1, so I think you will want one separate my argument is no oneness use of the Aleutian right we all live in a practical way we understand and recognize distinction provisions the very core value, out of an understanding of what is different and distinct legal argument of the oneness are making that were working for a better tomorrow. So often is completely bogus from a oneness perspective oneness tomorrow doesn't really exist. All one and hope why there is no hope because in order to have hope. You must recognize that the distinction and divisions that you are seeking better condition prior unwelcome position you hope and tomorrow essentially nonexistent. Oneness perspective. I'm sorry there is no hope in oneness your cancer and your goodness all the same war joy, pain, nothing really ultimately matters what we know we can even do anything about the hairs on her head like how in the world. We can bring about world peace.
It's ridiculous. I mean why are there fighting in and wars among you, it's because of what's wrong with us and they don't want to look at right to be able to include culture around the reality were living around the worldview that we are accepting without really understanding friend who became a Christian.
The writing of this book was instrumental in helping him to swing from Buddhism and has coupled with the beliefs of the Native American spirituality that he embrace the writing of this book toward feeling of the writing of the book he was reading sections of it. We are talking you become a Christian because of that would want to hear more.
But we do have to pause for very sharp break with the scheme of God, since his return for today is proud to partner with pre-born to help save babies lives. My name is Dan Steiner and I'm the president of prewar ultrasound truly is a game changer when mom comes into pregnancy center under pressure to abort her child. Perhaps the day is gone, perhaps her mother is pressuring her most of the time in her heart she doesn't want to abort what she needs is something that will give her the strength to choose life against the pressures that are forcing her to consider abortion. That's the ultrasound. She hears her baby's heartbeat and sees that baby on ultrasound. Everything's different. We can join us in saving babies lives pre-born funds. Pregnancy centers across the nation so they can offer free ultrasounds to women in crisis pregnancies. Ultrasound is a game changer because when abortion minded women actually see their babies in their wombs for themselves. 80% of the time they choose life, would you please join us at Janet my effort today to support the ministry of pre-born for $140 you can provide five free ultrasounds to women in crisis pregnancies a gift of $22 will provide one ultrasound and every gift helps to donate please call now 855402, baby.
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855402, baby. That's 855402 baby 855-402-2229 or there's a banner to firstname.lastname@example.org, listening to you effort today. I grabbed my guest of God's is the name of his book the Temple of man in the enchantment and were discussing the oneness movement. It's really throughout the world. It's all over the west. Now Hindu is stick Buddhist deck if you want to use that word Eastern mindset, some referred to ancient paganism making a revival and it certainly is but it's all about this concept of oneness we can become one with the divine and everything will be fine. Everything was wonderful. And this is diametrically opposed to what is actually true that God so loved the world that he gave his only begotten son, that whosoever believe it in him should not perish but have everlasting life. We are sinners in need of a Savior.
God is provided that Savior and that's how we are reconciled to a holy God from whom we were strange because of our sin.
They are radically different messages but we need to understand this age of re-enchantment and how are we are to respond to it, you are saying you have a friend who became a Christian during the time that you were writing this book and I think that Sony and I wanted to let you finish that you working through some of that I was in the book springtime pursuing the argumentation for making myself or making a God, you think that you you you different becoming a campaign the Christ recognize that Christ is really the beautiful way maker I just mentioned the story just briefly in the last chapter of my book no fertile.
What is important because some of the FF question how well do we use this information. How do we respond how my friend responds to the little shop come into a shop in the pocketbook, spirituality, and of course everybody has a field-goal file in the face. Yes, we know about the and my friend will say hey you know I did want studies in Buddhism will allow me to read you a little passage on the redo the passage my friend read is that the page we become free. Nothing disturbs us, we act according to crazy wisdom of the text of behave like a pig or a dog who has no dualistic considerations. Good clean dirty perceived as having one case another text says that at this stage we become like a little child who does not know anything will do anything without any preferences or concepts of good or bad. So there is nothing to accept or reject the pink and the strobe longer.
Everything arises in its own weight and was liberated in its own way we do something following. If we do not do it. It is fine. There are no longer able to follow and then when you gonna little section of client's sudden realization really this is where this takes me were oneness goes, everything is fine nothing up for it matter if you do anything if you don't do anything good that bad is good.
Nothing really matters as his client is "up and give them an opportunity you've been to basically allow the other person to recognize the folly of the worldview.
Hello, can a person's heart and mind begin the change we recognize the problem itself. You really need to. As you emphasize in the book Carla is there needs to be personal interaction with individual Christians with other people who do not understand what were talking about here and is to ask you though.
Where do these oneness proponents want to take the rest of us who aren't on board with their oneness. What's their plan.
I wish I would look after it went really well time in Toronto really emphasize that you're not on with your me if you're not on board of, if you're not on board. You need to be silenced because we have a way forward. We have a way forward and needed a way of salvation that came out clear without any any murkiness to whatsoever we are offering a way forward. We are offering with filtration you were standing in the way of celebration and I don't bring that out in the book was well cropped up after the book was published.
Well you going to look you going to stay on top of it. Unless you're willing to arena and that really was like okay 3540 different international event or events of some global importance and the first word heard the anger and the rhetoric retched up that's disturbing, yes disturbing the Christians need to know this and I think as we consider biblical prophecy in light of what's going on around us.
We always need to be on the alert, and to be understanding of the times in which were living and and I like that you talk about. We shouldn't just have a reaction to this, we should have a response to it as ambassadors for Jesus Christ in this world. What would you like to see the response be from more Christians because clearly you're on top of this all the time but there a lot of Christians out there who are not informed and maybe don't even know what to do because they don't even know enough about what's happening to do anything but what would you like to see happen become informed about your role, your position what what what about I love whole language of Scripture we talk about farm labor, being a soldier. I can get that being sweet as always metaphors that we understand. Talk about being about Christ that we all loggerheads okay… Cool.
Have you spent time in embassies, have you spent time in the community. You do understand the context of what it means to be an ambassador really understand that years ago I was at an event where the US about Saudi Arabia describing is whole and and the work required for him to take on the position, and I turned around and I placed the context of the Christian worldview of the Christian Christian life you will hear about your first is the legal and official represent representative of his government.
We to the legal and official representative of our king's vacuum this right.
That is absolutely massive second he needs to represent government interest, and even align his own personal interest to that of his government because he is operating in that capacity. Likewise, ourselves, we need to align our priorities with God's priorities. We need to put his interest for our interest about God and third vascular takes time to know the culture when old guy going to completely form you need to look at where you going understand this culture understand the context understand how the people think. Understand how the people work so that you can be effective messenger in that culture. Culture is hostile to you only to you is not going to shoot it is are you going to be the legal representative that gives honest message to that culture.
You need to know the culture well enough, in other words, your Christian your your your your in the will. You are not of the world, and I think as Christians we need to really break down what it means to be best because we are finding ourselves in a foreign letter right here at home that we now need to be a way Paul was at Mars Hill exactly Keiko need is in other words, because there's too much of that going on.
I want to look at the culture and then we end up becoming like it.
We end up with Christian yoga. That's not helping God hoping is going to open up the conversation but that allow people now entrenched in our Nuance oneness is across-the-board, including the political side of the religious topical cultural right right there so many aspects to a crawl and I think he just did a brilliant job of laying it all out. It's really a comprehensive look at oneness and and in all the little areas in the big areas where it's infiltrated and even into our own religious circles. At times in the interfaith movement in some of these other groups that you talked about the emergent church and so forth. But we have to be on the alert. We do have an enemy. We do have a time in which were living where the enemy is at work and wanting to deceive us and we can't be deceived. We absolutely have to stand on the foundation of God's word and I highly recommend to you game of God's Carl's hiker of the author and it's just been so good having you here Carl, thank you for schooling us in keeping us informed on this important movement because it is absolutely everywhere, absolutely.
Thanks a lot.
Carl's hi great game of God's is the name of the book and we appreciate your being here. Thanks for listening to Janet today and will see you next time