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Ken Berding (Bible Revival) Everett Piper (Gay Christians)

Janet Mefferd Today / Janet Mefferd
The Truth Network Radio
November 1, 2021 4:30 am

Ken Berding (Bible Revival) Everett Piper (Gay Christians)

Janet Mefferd Today / Janet Mefferd

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November 1, 2021 4:30 am

The Bible is the most important book in the life of a Christian. How do we make it so? Janet talks it over with Ken Berding, author of "Bible Revival." Plus: How narrow is the narrow road of salvation, and what does homosexuality have to do with it? Dr. Everett Piper answers that question from the Word of God on Monday's JANET MEFFERD TODAY

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This archived broadcast of Janet Mefford today is brought to you by Hartford, Lebanon, God is using hard for Lebanon to bring practical assistance and the gospel to the stricken refugee families in Lebanon for a gift of $116 you can give a child in his family survival essentials for four months and the hope of Jesus Christ which lasts forever. Call now 888-247-5499 888-247-5499 there's a banner to, our confidence is in Christ alone, water but a famine of hearing the words of the Lord. Now many concerned Christians today have observed that our churches in America are going through a famine of the hearing of the words of the Lord to but is that because we are also experiencing in our churches a famine of knowing the Bible in valuing the Bible and trusting in the sufficiency of the Bible to guide us in all things pertaining to doctrine and life after all. That is where the church has to be grounded in the word of God over to talk about this today with Dr. Kenneth Berning. He is Prof. of New Testament at Talbot school of theology by only University and is the author of many articles and books, including the one will be discussing today. It is called Bible revival recommitting ourselves to one book, Dr. Bernie, thank you so much for joining us today really well. It's great to have you here. This is an issue that is near and dear to my heart because I think you're right and you mentioned in the book that there is this famine, many people mention of knowing the Bible. What you assess is going on out there in our churches for not reading the Bible very much. We don't know the word of God, probably because we don't value it on the soul.the change though job and you know that in the past people valued and read the word of God a lot more than they do right now. Really I think people are reading the Bible very very little.

No, I think you're right and I think some of this research that's been done on the subject bears that out yet living in an age where we have Bibles on our phones and Bibles on our iPads and we have 10 copies of different translations at home.

What is the disconnect therebetween. The availability of the Bible.

Is it just that familiarity is breeding laziness or what you think is going on will probably part of long ago.

Very heartening. What why do I need to memorize the Bible got right through my phone a couple of helpful I would respond to the wall. You're not thinking about the word of God.

Your thoughts will be informed by the word of God. You can't wake up in the middle than my when you're having trouble sleeping.

She meditate on the word of God in your mind because you know it, so there is a disconnect. There's no question about it. Absolutely. So what you think has been the effect of this loss of reading the Bible, knowing the Bible valuing the Bible what you think that has wrought in us. What we don't we don't interpret the Bible. Well first of all because one of the key context for interpreting the Bible well will Bible context of the reformers are to talk a lot about about Scripture interpreting Scripture about Scripture can't interpret Scripture for us if we don't know what the other Scriptures say yes about the huge loss. There is obviously a huge loss in our spiritual lives, our growth with Christ.

What you make of this excuse that people will often put forward which is so busy.

I've got so much to do. I mean II can do one meal a little daily bread one verse that picks me up for the morning commutes.

But you know at what point is that become a lame excuse though the problem is the best metaphor for knowing and reading the Bible and for engagement with the Bible is getting our daily bread on too busy to be near you think that they were crazy.

We need to read the word of God were healthy Christians but probably would also respond by talking about a woman named Maxine going with my church. No elderly woman who who went to see came to the Lord, which is 36. She was a single mom. She was working three jobs that are trying to raise her children on her own, but the woman who discipled her so tour you need to read and memorize the Bible, so she did. She she fell in time late at night she would read it. She tried to memorize it, and in the meantime she memorize. I think five or six books of the New Testament.

She knows them by heart. To this day I look at her and I see if anyone anyone can do it if Maxine could do it well.

She she is a biblically formed woman that's great that's what we all need when you talk about the revival of learning the word.

What you think are some steps that should be taken or some things that really ought to be done are considered along that road of revival of learning the word. In other words, how do you get Christians excited about that and are not necessarily just hammering people with gals but also seamless in your Christian. This is something you want to be doing on a daily basis is learning the word of God will one. One way we could have more people who are committed to coming alongside Nur Christiansen sitting with them in reading the Bible together and talking about it helps to motivate them. Another thing is the we can help them to learn their way through the story line of the Bible stories like learning the stories what you learned from this culture growing up in the church actually learning were where things belong like where's the story of Saul and the Bible wallets and Samuel was the story of the good Samaritan in Luke, not a Matthew, Mark and John know how to the sacrifices relate to the coming of Christ, knowing their way through the people can learn that then they've got hooks to hang everything else on and then they feel confident in working their way around the Bible give a quick shout out to Bible Bible is a place that people can go website that I put together also have some physical materials but everything there is free where people can learn through music flashcards and even classes they can fill up in their churches. They can learn the 400 most important events, characters and themes in the Bible excellence that would be a way to get from here to there. That gap that is so common among people even post the growth of the church absolutely really really important now. One of the things that you also mention the book is worth needing a revival of valuing the word and in a way that almost comes before the revival of learning the word that first you have to really understand why the Bible is so important and why it's sufficient so this is something a lot of theologians have spoken to have said this is what we lost.

We fought so hard for inerrancy. But what we really lost a sufficiency that that the fact that the Bible is enough. How do we move in that direction, saying to Christians just in churches and in everyday life. Listen, this Bible is everything and it is trustworthy and it is sufficient for your life for everything in life you are right on your right on the Bible is when referred to Scripture, we don't mean that the Bible addresses every single question that you might have right. But what we mean is the constraints and a guide to everything that actually speaks to is true and everything that we need for life and godliness that is everything that we need to coming to salvation, to live electrical that would please God is actually there in the Bible we don't have to go outside of the Bible for the obviously the reasons that were having trouble with those because there's results with the pressures of our society to think otherwise. Think of self-help sort of magazines or shows as though those are the things that are really going to help you. Help move your life for but know everything that you need is in the Scripture for getting there. Let me just be honest I think we need some repentance from having imbibed the values of the world here. We need to get back to reading the Bible actually pulled his read the Bible more.

Eventually the authority of Scripture will start to take its place in our life. I really believe I need to, especially if you're starting out as a Christian, you already say the word attests that you know the Holy Spirit that this is the word of God and that is you mentioned that you know passages that did the Scripture says it's you know that it's trustworthy and that did it is good for all things of life and godliness. So we need to delight ourselves in the Bible absolutely read over the phone.

Absolutely what you think is the reason why there's a perception in the church that the Bible isn't enough. I mean what what really you mentioned some of the things that you think it's also you know being on the Internet and seen all these attacks on the Bible and now it's a book of mass in science is better than the Bible that sort of thing has that had us a widespread effect do you think I think the general condition of authoritative text in our society anyway about to tour the Bible so the general fishing that we've learned. Everybody needs to be skeptical until a bit of a problem. It certainly is. It certainly is an and it's unfortunate because we as Christians ought to know better.

And yet we need to repent. As Dr. Berning has said and return to one book Bible revival. The name of the book will come back with Dr. Kenneth Berning on Janet this is Janet math or turbine league international Esther is 17 years old and part of the Maasai tribe in Kenya Africa. Like many of her age and gender. Esther was subjected to practices not taught in the Bible. One is arranged marriage where a woman is forced to marry someone she doesn't know the other is female circumcision done out of superstitious belief with no known health benefits. Esther lived with bitter unforgiveness until it finally volunteer introduced her to Jesus.

Now she's let her husband to Christ and she seen 60 young women come to them race the hope of the gospel. Finals are scarce in this part of Kenya so please join Bible league and sending God's word to finalist believers in Africa and around the world for only $5.25 also costs $100 most generous gift by calling 800 yes word 800 YDS WORD 800-937-9673. There's a vitally manner over 169,000 babies saved and more than 51,000 commitments to Christ through the ministry of pre-born as they celebrate 15 years of saving babies lives here.

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That's 855-402-2229 or there's a pre-born banner to All gifts are tax-deductible. 855402 Beatty you are listening to today talking about one book that we need.

We need to recommit ourselves to that one book and of course I'm talking about the word of God. Dr. Kenneth Berning is joining me to discuss his book called Bible revival. One of the things that you get into and I'm so glad you do in this book Dr. Berning is the section on reviving our understanding of the Bible and you start to walk through how you can understand the Bible. First and foremost you talk about contacts and when somebody is coming to the word of God, that person may not be a great exegete or very experienced. But how would you advise that person to really understand the Bible and in know what it's about to be able to follow it while you're right most important thing for when we contact we don't we don't just mean what people think about contacts many times and when you talk about contact the people think of just the word food around the verse you're trying to interpret about is the most important contacts you look at how the flow of thought of going from verse to verse look up what is the main idea being so their friend looked whether the jury points as well. You also have to remember the genre is the literary types of threatening to consider certain differences between reading for the book of Revelation. In reading the book of yes and so that makes a difference as well. There is historical context and cultural context so it's actually good food.

Cross-cultural literature needed to remember that was set in a certain time certain. Remember that a lot of times we can help clear up some questions the people have.

That's right now. We may also hold Bible is also a context for you have to be comparing my much about this a few minutes ago often refer to the canonical context. Yes, now when you mention about the fact that we are reading cross-cultural literature when we are reading the Bible story. Practically speaking, how does that come into play. Like for example when Jesus talks about the mustard seed and things like that or some agrarian references. How does that, you know, how can you tell somebody you may run up against this, but you need to be aware that this is you know, in the context of the time of the Israelites. When Jesus was alive. Things like not for people to think a little bit of extra education in both areas, but there are many things that can be very helpful to me. One example so the world of the New Testament world the Old Testament as well is was an honor and shame society so people were very concerned about honor and very concerned about shameful Dr. shows up at a lot of different tax think about the parable of the of the prodigal son and his you know this phone goes off is profligate. He returns to his father. The father runs out to greet him will men, older men didn't ever run.

They would never have no stoop to that level because honor was what what was all about cutting right across the cultural drain there to help give liveliness to that story that you would never get any other way. One of hundreds of examples like you do you absolutely fill in when you're speaking of contacts like you just did. It's not just a matter of following that, therefore, and looking a little bit further behind in the text to see where Paul is going. For example, but it's also knowing the context of the Bible Scripture interprets Scripture as you've mentioned.

How do you put that into practice. In other words, you come across a verse, it seems like it seems something strange, but then you can think of another verse and another book that seems to contradict at how do you resolve the sorts of problems will want you to first look at the immediate context, make sure that your reading it carefully and then you you move out within the same author. First, the book you around and in the same author and pupil same author addresses this type of issue but then you start comparing it to other passages that are on the you know the Bible does not come contradict itself.

But God wrote it. God, in whom there is no contradiction is not going to contradict himself.

You can be confident that you can go to other passages that will help you usually you can go to a much clearer profits or other clear profit but hope to help you with the one that is not as clear.not every Scripture is equally clear as every other Scripture rights that's a good reminder inside only way to say about Janet, sorry to interrupt you.

There's also a problem with clarity of Scripture in people's minds.

I should believe the doctrine of the clarity of Scripture. I don't want anyone to misunderstand them on her.

The Bible is clear about everything from food there for life and godliness. Some things are not as clear, but everything that is actually necessary, the resurrection of Christ, justification by faith. The thought of Jesus being the son of God, and God himself. Those are all crystal-clear in Scripture that's a great point. I'm glad that you brought that up now.

You also discussed a revival of applying the word of course not just to read the Bible we are to apply it to our lives or to obey Christ. How do we apply it as opposed to how we should not apply it to address both of those things will people make the mistake on the front ended on interpret it well so they don't interpret according to the central intention of the author himself. You always wanted know when Matthew included the story about you throw these words up your coming from Jesus. What was he trying to teach what was he trying to encourage their then you look for analogous or circumstances in our own day and age, so you don't you don't follow garage maybe about the new term to some of your listeners but you don't pick something and try to make it say something else side of the text itself like Jesus can calm the storms of your life, the sun sets called allegorizing that inappropriate that Jesus can call him your fears is scriptural but wrong path. Yeah make sure that you actually go through on in a positive object calling the storms is about 240 thought about common storms of your life. What about Jonah everybody will use that you'll hear this from time to time.

What is the big fish in your life while I'm not Jonah. It is not the same that you can compare me to Jonah getting… Ella griping people.

Meanwhile, it's not that people don't mean well, but the problem with that is when you begin to use those sorts of tactics, even if their well-meaning they got you away from the tax. Don't rewrite.

Undermine the authority of Scripture right paren then you're not hearing an authoritative word from God really your inserting your own ideas at the point rather than submitting yourself to the Scriptures that is submitting yourself to God as revealed himself in the Scriptures is not usually problematic yourself in the place of God's authority and that's so important and ties into the revival of obeying the word that you say we need we need to confront problems like sentimentality or this idea that I will decide what I need to do that the Bible is so clear how we are to obey Christ. He didn't come to wipe out the law but to facilitate but not what in one jot or tittle will vanish.

We we have lost this a little bit because were in sort of an antinomian age where you know were free in Christ. Therefore, Roman sex, but on the other hand, we do have to obey Christ. How do you advise people to up really obey the word and take the word seriously in going home and going out and obeying the Lord will do whatever I read in Scripture of those confirmed. Of course by other scriptures. It will you submit yourself to it. I give an example and Bob revival what I was raising my children when they were little, my tenancy because I so wanted them to know Christ also is not the push know a disorder hopefully build data what I was thinking, but actually if you read Deuteronomy over and over again will talk to you about teaching your children when you get up when you walk along the way so not pushing them. Of course I want to draw them in, rather than pushing them into something but I'm bored to talk about the word of God to get up in the morning as I walk along during the day at dinner time in the evenings whenever I'm going to bring it up in such a regular way of life. I changed what I did, simply because I read it in the word of God, even to intuitively didn't feel right to me that's kind that's a good example when speaking the word. This is something else that you explain is important.

What do you talk about is it didn't cut it dovetailing on what you just said about that. Did the Deuteronomy passage where you talk about the word of God speak about the word of God.

It isn't just a matter of sitting and listening to a sermon once a week right right what about it and your family apart. There, but among other believers as well by my teaching colleague Dr. Troy and John. She actually revived an old Puritan practice is been talking about cold call friends that we meet differently for conference, but the Puritans is big enough at times to get together and just sit down and talk about the word of God and is really really exciting when you start to think about it, so we should be doing that as well call it someone to say hey, how would you like to get together… Discuss a biblical theme like the glory of God or the covenant of the Bible or lithic a particular passage and read it together and just talk about it.

You look good in small groups or we can do to while one I love that idea. I think we should be talking more and more, actually jot it if you want to try to gauge the health of the church, probably to the degree that were willing to help spiritual conversations obviously not just talking about. We read in the word of God. But things like I've been praying for you in this way, how's God been working in your life but to the degree of those come out in regular conversation and including what we read in the Scriptures, probably we can gauge the health of the church much better in that way we can tell whether or not we are spiritually minded church are not well that's right because normally what you're thinking about will come out of your mouth right so if you don't have you not thinking about the word of God. You have been studying and reading it. Probably a lot less likely to be discussing it with the people you run into. Instead, church Troy & woman. So you know that you're one of the spirit's that is absolutely right.

And you mentioned this before, but we have to squeeze this in the importance of memorizing the Bible really cannot be overstated. Right right. The problem is, a lot of people just have painful memories of memorizing and school so I got you laid out in appendix from about a very simple way to memorize large chunks of the Bible is not difficult.

So basically if you read this Scripture over and over again for the book of Philippians will take you maybe 12 minutes to read it out loud very good while you can read the book Bible revival. Great book Dr. Kenneth Berning, spending time with us.

Thank you, Dr. Bernie, God bless this archived broadcast of Janet met for today is brought to you by Hartford, Lebanon, God is using hard for Lebanon to bring practical assistance and the gospel to the stricken refugee families in Lebanon for a gift of $116 you can give a child in his family survival essentials for four months and the hope of Jesus Christ which lasts forever.

Call now 888-247-5499 888-247-5499 there's a banner to click Janet met and here's your host today is really sobering to the words of the Lord in Matthew seven versus 13 and 13.

He says enter through the narrow gate. For wide is the gate and broad is the road that leads to destruction, and many enter through it. But small is the gate and narrow the road that leads to life and only a few find it. This not only flies in the face of universalism, but it emphasizes that the road to eternal salvation is not an easy route that many people will follow just the opposite in fact. And again, that is a very scary thing to consider, but in light of that, what would you say if somebody asked you can homosexual be a Christian. Now we know from first contains chapter 6 that no unrepentant sinner of any kind. No one who practices sin will inherit the kingdom of God that my next guest, faced a question much like that recently and he is here to tell us how he answered it with the word of God. Dr. Everett Piper wonderful to walk me back. How are you today how are you just fine. Great to have you here so I understand you were at a church camp recently and somebody asked you a question about homosexuality and salvation. Tell us what happened here fired my boys out the last 25 years or so out there in Parker New York around the campfire one evening out of the blue was totally disconnected.

The conversation I was asked by somebody. Are you saying that homosexual or transgender person cannot be a Christian. My answer was pretty brief. I said well I think the issue is repentance, homosexual or transgender person or any other individual who is celebrating their sin rather than confessing their son claims to be a Christian, I would argue on its contents and confession of sin that leads you to be a Christian is not the celebration or the-ite DI Canadian euro Christianity by virtue of your center your inclination that would make you what I think the issue is repentance.

And then I said let me ask your question. Can you show me any Bible verse from Genesis 1 through the end of Revelation that says anything positive about homosexuality was a long pause person got up, stormed off and walked away. She didn't want to speak anymore. She was so conflicted.

She was so upset by that question about Janet. What I would say that I have the opportunity to talk this person.

Further, there are numerous numerous Bible verses. People claim well Jesus didn't talk about sexuality which is not true.

Read Revelation.

Also, if we believe in the Trinity would gotta acknowledge that Jesus is God, the Word made flesh and dwelling among us. In the beginning was the Word and the Word was with God and the Word was God. If we believe in the Trinity.

There isn't one jot or title. There isn't one letter, there isn't one for all of Scripture from Genesis to the rebel Revelation. It is inspired by Jesus because Jesus is God. Jesus addresses this issue cope with equally route picture. There's also repeated reference in the New Testament. I went through all the epistles in Revelation and I cited every Bible verse that refers to the issue of sexual morality and the necessity of being sexually sure if you're going to be within the kingdom within the family doctor going to claim to be a Christian in the verses are replete with her in Romans there in first Corinthians better in second Corinthians.

They are in Galatians and Ephesians and Colossians 1 Thessalonians in person second Timothy and Titus and Hebrews James and Peter person second Peter and John and you and Revelation.

There are hundreds of verses that tell us that you must confess your sins, you can't walk in sensuality, you cannot continue to define yourself by your sexual appetite. If you want to be part of the family of God. If you want to claim the banner of Christian answer is no, no one who celebrates his sin rather than confessing it is a Christian, no one who defined herself or her separate by her passions or desires is part of the family of God. I can't claim to be a Christian, no one who claims their identity is in their own libido rather than the Lord is a Christian and no one who claims to be transgendered.

Rather than transform is a Christian, I would argue this now.

Click no one argues that they were born that way. Rather than shouting from the rooftops that they are born again is a Christian it doesn't matter what my opinion is or what your opinion of this issue. What matters is what God's word say you don't get to make up and I don't get to make up around Christianity.the Bible but find that you don't and I don't know that so well said. And there's so many directions I want to go on this, but when you're talking about all the verses I know that you did an extensive post on Facebook and you went into all of the different verses in Scripture that back up what you're saying. Romans one is kind of the go to passage.

I know for a lot of us, or at least the first stop when we start to talk about the issue of homosexuality, where you know they became futile in their thinking.

The wrath of God is revealed against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who by their unrighteousness suppress the truth. That's where it starts is in it because that I think many times when you have people asking questions of that sort there. Just saying. Do you accept me as I am, or don't you, that seems to be. Sometimes a lot of the underlying emotion behind that kind of a question I say I'm not good enough to go to heaven, will nobody is good enough to go to heaven.

But what is your thought on this issue of the wrath of God and how those who deny the truth and deny God as he has revealed himself and up suppressing the truth in unrighteousness and that is the root and the crux of the issue fundamentally allowing this when the Lord Jesus is revealed from heaven with his mighty angels in flaming fire and collecting vengeance on those who do not know God and on those who do not obey the gospel. They will suffer the punishment of eternal destruction is because they refused to love the truth and so be say yes it is pretty clear that if we are not going to repent of those things with the Bible, not you, not mean that culture, not even some churches says is right or wrong because I don't really care what you are on your other sales right along with half Scripture, the word of God and Scripture is clear that sexual purity and sexual morality are among the many not only sends the many that will keep us from heaven if we don't repent and confess of those things become born again died itself become a new creation in Christ. Embracing the old right. I have the difficulty with this date Christianity movement when we hyphenate our Christianity by virtue of the sends or proclivities or desires or the libido that we bring to the table. That means we haven't died itself were actually celebrating the fans rather than confessing of the sound rather than putting them behind just making them part of us that is not what the Bible tells us about becoming a Christian you are to die to self become a new creation in Christ be born again, not sit around and claim you were born that way yes exactly right. And we wouldn't do that with any other sin. If we were to safer if I came to you for example in sex are you saying that I can't be peace and a Christian at the same time. Maybe no one would dare ask you that question.

So what's the difference why is there a special category for homosexual quote unquote identity and it's over and you know it, over and above every other sand that you would never pose as some form of your identity.

I'm a thief, I just, you know, I'm a Christian and a thief and I'm a you know I'm a liar and a Christian, no one would do that with other sin. So what how we created this opening for people to somehow think you can simultaneously hold on to your sin and Jesus at the same time. What we we're imbibing the Kool-Aid, but cultural cool weight of identity equals inclination we pull out that why not even not only get into our culture, but to get into our churches so that now we dumb down the definition of what it means to be a human being to nothing but the sum total of what you're inclined to do, but that's who you are not alive. We are the go day when not your model dog human beings made in the image of God. We have moral understanding and moral responsibility and culpability were not an animal but just walks around the policies appetite and has no moral consequences for doing so.

The irony here is the conservative Christian recognition of humanity actually elevates people to a higher standard, rather than diminishing them to this lesser standard in your right. If I were to go around saying I'm hyphenate my Christianity by saying I'm an adulterous Christian or McAuley or Morris Christian or I'm a player Christian you would rightly raise an eyebrow and suggest that's kinda creepy. Correct. Yes yes that's exactly right. Well I want to come back to get a very quick break will be back like Dr. Everett Piper, president of Oklahoma, Lessing University, listening to Janet effort today. Stay with us. The UN has called what's happening in Lebanon.

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Nance liberty call now 855-565-2561 that's 855-565-2561 four liberty health you're listening to you. Thank you for being with us and it's always great to have with us Dr. Everett Piper, president of Oklahoma was seen University were talking about what the word of God has to say to the person whom I asked the question, are you saying that you can't be a homosexual in a Christian.

The answer is no, you can't. And it has to do with repenting of your sin. It's not the fact that you are a sinner were all sinners but to repent of your sin and to confess Christ is necessary. It's not possible and you can see this from the text of Scripture as you mentioned, Dr. Piper is not possible to simultaneously hang on to your lusts and justify them in any sense and also claim Jesus Christ.

I mean I think of what Paul said in Romans chapter 6 what shall we say that.

Are we to continue in sin so that grace may increase may it never be. How shall we who died to sin still live in it.

But isn't this coming down Dr. Piper to what is a sin anymore. I mean this is the famous question asked years ago.

Whatever became of sand. What did become of sin with this LGBT movement will stop allowing the Bible to define what is right and wrong, good and evil bitter and sweet. Isaiah Alice wanted him to start reversing those definitions we become as God. We think we can find what's good and evil. We read we eat of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil and what was that why was that of because doing so we said we don't need God any longer.

Tell us anything, God, you don't need to tell us what's good or evil any longer. We know we know in and out of ourselves we are as God and we can define this ourselves thank thank you God be gone. And that's exactly what's taking place and culture right now. When we think we can start redefining the sand or diminishing be sentenced to nothing but kind of a complementary identity and as you know we covered the three boys conference in St. Louis where they actually celebrate the clear trigger and glory that your community will bring in the new lump Symbian crimes not close to a quote you know what I'm coming Castel a quote of one of the workshop yet that is not that is not confessing sand that is celebrating it and claiming that it brings glory and treasure to the new Jerusalem at the end of the calling. And that is just walks. Now it's so wrong, and there seems to be no fear of God before their eyes. Whenever you go to any of these people tied up at that conference and we say how do you justify terms like sexual minorities from the word of God. It's crickets. They don't even attempt to find any Bible verse, but if you don't go to the word of God. How do you know your within the realm of Christianity at all.

You have to have some true North. I mean, you can't just make it up as you go, but unfortunately for some of these people that doesn't bother them that much and that was my point to this young lady that asked me this question at the church matter what I it doesn't matter whether I think a person is a Christian or not. What matters is what the Bible say in the Bible is clear Colossians see to it that no one takes you captive by philosophy and empty deceit put to death therefore what is earthly in you sexual immorality, impurity, passion and evil desire, on account of these things the wrath of God is coming off the old self with its practices and put on a new cell. How can the organizers of the boys.

How can the advocates of a Christianity quote unquote which I could get her to be an oxymoron deal with this passage from Colossians may respond to your right it's crickets. They don't they ignore and they move on to try to reconstruct a new form of Christianity, and ignore these passages right and at the same time try to say what were on the moral high ground because were talking about being gay but never acting on it and I was talking to somebody over the weekend. I said what sin around which you would gather for a conference and say I Alice back to stealing. I I am a thief in my heart I really want to steal stuff, but thus far I haven't done it. Why don't we gather together all the would-be thieves and congratulate ourselves and pass ourselves, pat ourselves on our back first sacrifice for living for Christ for not acting on our thievery.

What they're missing is the repentance they talk about what were celibate. But then they do things like talking about redeeming clear culture eats double mindedness and it's so deceptive and it's influencing so many people. Dr. Piper. That's the real tragedy of it. Ignore the higher numbers debate on that but I hold that Jesus himself taught us a lot but desire the luck you will of the heart is equal to the adulterous action in and of itself right so if you hold fire that is unhealthy on holy and you refused to set it aside, died a self put that behind you, rather than celebrating as hard as you. How can you claim to be honoring the words of Jesus who told us that the fixation on both thought is equal to the simple act itself right that's an excellent point.

I think two of the passage in first Corinthians chapter 5 where Paul is saying. I wrote to you in my letter not to associate with sexually immoral people, but I didn't mean the people of this world. I was talking about people inside the church. He said you must not associate with anybody who claims to be a brother or sister but is sexually immoral or greedy, or idolater, or slander, etc. etc. don't even eat with such people, what business is it of mine to judge those outside the church.

Are you not to judge those inside and he finally finally says God will judge those outside expel the wicked person from among you. It's interesting to me in a time when you have churches saying we should embrace the sexually immoral because they are a special class of center and the Bible says the exact opposite. I I would love to see what the re-voice crowd we do with verse contents chapter 5 because it doesn't bode well for them really goes on and on and we want to get beyond what they will claim all thing called homophobia so sick of hearing you disagree with somebody doesn't mean you're afraid of them, phobia argument, let's go to St. Peter but will be on-call. Peter tells us there will be false teachers among you who will secretly bring constructive heresy and many will follow their sensuality and they will exploit you with false words but these like your rational creatures of glass came about matters of which they are ignorant and they will be destroyed. They have a high school of adultery insatiable percent. Peter goes on and he says they promised freedom. Another prophetic, I would argue computer they promised freedom, but they themselves are slain to correct to corruption Scott in the last last days, and they elevate their own desires. This is what Peter tells us, and Jesus covers in Revelation to the church of fire Tyra in Pergamum and then in the closing verses of Revelation chapter 22. He covers again, great passages, and there it's all right there in black and white. You can read it for yourself and you can either reject it or you can accept it, but you can't deny that it's there in the pages of holy Scripture Dr. Piper how you think, ultimately, conservative evangelicals will deal with this issue because it's obvious that we have a tsunami coming right at us. I think it's only going to get worse from here. You have gay activists from without. The also have gay activists inside the church who are fundamentally trying to transform the church and created in its own image. It's incredible that were at this point, but how do you see evangelicals responding in the long run. Do you think we will stand up with the word of God and defend the word of God, or do you think there will be more capitulation how to use what you see.

The temperature is on this issue credit on your shows earlier down.

I was invited to be on a panel at the National religious broadcasters Association conference this last spring on that panel dirt taxes Jim Daly Larry Elder and Craig are in the question before the panel was used Christianity under attack. All of the panelists that will course of this engagement anecdotes to justify their answer. My answer was slightly little different. I said of course Christianity is under attack, but not so much from culture as it is from the church. I would argue that Christianity local definition of what it means to be an obedient follower of the Lordship of Jesus Christ is under attack from the church with the C as much if not more so on the culture, yes we do know the end of the story, we know the church will prevail.

The gates of hell will not prevail against that there is a remnant that will stand true to the inerrancy of the word, but I also believe that we see all of these warnings from June to Revelation to Peter and Paul and all the way back to Genesis 1 that there is going to be a falling away because people will declare themselves to be of God, and I think even the evangelical churches falling prey to that temptation and that Sam right now I do too and I wish we had more time to get into this, but I think part of the problem is in the last several years, we have subtly allowed antinomianism to take root and a lot of evangelical churches I'm saved by grace, so that I can go do what I want will if you open up that Pandora's box and pretty soon you can't say anything about anybody else needing to obey the Lord, because you don't think you need to so we fall into these theological traps and we don't see that that can lead to something worse down the road. No measuring without a measuring rod outside of those things being measured. CS Lewis measuring rod is not the inerrancy of the word from Genesis 1 through the end of Revelation. All of the word is not inspired by God and dictated to us in terms of him giving us his Revelation all of Scripture. If we start cherry picking our verses as to what we want to live by.

And what we don't, then we are declaring ourselves to be that measuring rod rather than the word.

In effect, that time the church falters and culture loses a result you're so right about that way you can check out Dr. Everett Piper on his Facebook page. Great staff and also not a daycare is his book as well as his columns over the Washington Times, Dr. Piper. We really appreciate your coming back. I know how busy you are, but thank you so much for being here, and for doing what you do all right. God bless you too.

Thanks for being with us here in Janet effort today. God bless you and we will see you next time. This hour Janet effort today to impart my heart

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