This is Darren Kuhn with the Masculine Journey Podcast, where we search the ancient paths to find ways that God brings light into a dark world and helps set men free from the struggles that we all face on a day-to-day basis. Your chosen Truth Network Podcast is starting in just a few seconds. Enjoy it.
Share it. But most of all, thank you for listening and for choosing the Truth Podcast Network. For stories of hopelessness that turn to hope, here is your host, Mike Zwick. The prophetic voice out there. We really appreciate him standing on the Word of God, standing for truth. Today we're actually going to be looking at Revelation chapter 2. And if you've got your Bible, start in verse 1. We're going to be going to verse 11, and I'm going to be reading from the New King James Version. It says to the loveless church, to the angel of the church of Ephesus, these things says, he who holds the seven stars in his right hand, who walks in the midst of the seven golden lampstands, I know your works, your labor, your patience, and that you cannot bear those who are evil.
And you have tested those who say that they are apostles and are not, and have found them to be liars. And you have persevered and have patience and have labored for my name's sake and have not become weary. Nevertheless, I have this against you, that you have left your first love. Remember therefore, from where you have fallen, repent and do the first works, or else I will come to you quickly and remove your lampstand from its place, unless you repent.
But this you have, that you hate the deeds of the Nicolaitans, which I also hate. For he who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches. Here it is, to him who overcomes, I will give to eat from the tree of life, which is in the midst of the paradise of God. And to the angel of the church of the church in Smyrna, right, these things says, the first and the last who was dead and came to life, I know your works, tribulation and poverty, but you are rich.
Know the blasphemy of those who say that they are Jews and are not, but are a synagogue of Satan. Do not fear any of those things, which you are about to suffer. That's good America. That's good.
Check that out. Indeed, the devil is about to throw some of you into prison that you may be tested and you will have tribulation for 10 days. Be faithful unto death and I will give you the crown of life. He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches. He who overcomes shall not be hurt by the second death. And Dana, Pastor Dana, I believe about a year ago you had a dream about Christians who were in churches and then there were wolves that were coming in.
Is that right? Yes, the dream I had started off with a bunch of wolves being whipped into a frenzy by a figure in black and they went into churches and they went into churches where the pastors were preaching and teaching and they were teaching with a fierceness of veracity. They were just crying out, preaching the word, sweating like crazy because they were trying to get the message out and these wolves were coming up beside people in the church and people who were asleep and people who were checking their watches and people who were playing games on their phones and not paying attention to the message. And they would begin to rub up against the people and try to get them stirred up and although there was a core group of people up near the one, the pastors that were preaching that were praying, people up around them praying in support, these people began, in the back began to yell and throw things and tell them to shut up and be quiet, they did not want to hear the message. And basically those wolves were stirring up people within the church and we realized there was going to be even division within the church over the message. In the last interview we did, one guy was talking about a conversation about a certain church and there was a house of representatives member back in early this year.
He said a prayer opened the meeting and a United Methodist minister and he prayed in the name of Brahma and you think that's a Hindu god. So we're seeing even people within the house of God who are starting to step away. He said there will soon be doctrines of demons. What that means is there will be people simply in our pulpits preaching stuff that is just flat out demonic and people will be listening to that. And if you don't know the word, you're going to fall for everything that's coming down the pike and that's why also those of us that believe the word and stand on the word are going to pay the price for not compromising the word. I told my congregation last Sunday as I'm preaching through Romans 1, I said, look, on those terrible weekends, I expect we're going to have all sorts of hate mail and threats because I'm going to be preaching through the parts of Romans and dealing not with those aspects of it, but the things that are happening around it. And so the word is going to be compromised by people.
The enemy can do everything he can to get people to stay out of the word, to not be rude and grounded. And even more than anything, he's going to stir up people in the church to just ignore it or neglect it or stick their own way and their own will. And that persecution, I believe, is here.
The wolves are in the churches. They've always been here, but we're seeing more and more person-elected situations in Portland this last weekend where a worship event was attacked by, they're calling it Antipa, that's who they said it was. The people who were chasing people in the way of the cars being filed, churches being burned in Canada.
That wasn't happening a year ago or three years ago or ten, but it's happening now. Some of the people that are coming out strongly against a large core group of people who are not receiving a certain mandate are believers. And suddenly we're in the crosshairs, we're being talked about, and those people, those terms come out. So the persecution's here, the wolves are out, and even then, a lot of people in the church don't see it, don't understand it, don't grip it. And so we've got to be watching, we've got to have the armor on, we've got to be standing strong and faithful, and realizing that there's a reason that Paul told us about the armor, because we are in spiritual warfare. We wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against powers and sympathies, spiritual forces of darkness that are intent on the defense to still kill and destroy. So we have, too many people in the church are not really aware that the warfare's going on.
And once they become aware, it changes their lives and the warfare gets stronger. So we need the body of Christ to armor us, we need the body of Christ to sharpen the swords, we need the body of Christ to inspect that shield of faith and walk into battle with it and be ready to do whatever we can do to make a difference for the gospel and this nation. Absolutely, that's a good point, and I'm looking at Revelation 22 right now, verse 18, it says, For I testify to everyone who hears the words of the prophecy of this book, if anyone adds to these things, God will add to him the plagues that are written in this book.
And if anyone takes away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part from the book of life, from the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book. And when I think about that, I think about the story, and I don't know if you've heard of Charles Templeton, Dana, but I think about the story of Charles Templeton. He was a preacher who used to preach with Billy Graham back in the 40s, and they said at that time, Charles Templeton was a better preacher than Billy Graham. Well, what had happened was, was eventually Charles Templeton started to doubt the creation. He started to doubt Genesis chapter one, that God created the heavens and the earth, Adam and Eve, all of that.
And I like what our friend Pastor Chad Harvey said, who's also an assembly of God. He said that if you're telling me that that's not that important, creationism, he says, let me tell you something. He said, if you start to doubt Genesis chapter one, there's going to come a day where you doubt John 3 16. And we can't pick and choose what we want to believe.
But it was a really interesting article. Right before Charles Templeton passed away, it was in 1999, he did an interview with Lee Strobel, who did the case for Christ, the case for faith, all that stuff that the movies came out. But what happened was, was Lee Strobel was interviewing him. And during the whole interview, Lee was telling him all these things, and Charles was explaining all the reasons why he did not believe the gospel, and why it was all fake, why it wasn't true, why he didn't believe it anymore. All of a sudden, towards the end of the conversation, Lee Strobel asked Charles Templeton, and how do you assess this Jesus?
It seemed like the next logical question, but I wasn't ready for the response it would evoke. Templeton's body language softened. It was as if he suddenly felt relaxed and comfortable in talking about an old and dear friend.
His voice, which at times had displayed such a sharp and insistent edge, now took on a melancholy and reflective tone. His guard seemingly down, he spoke in an unhurried pace, almost nostalgically, carefully choosing his words as he talked about Jesus. He was, Templeton began, the greatest human being who has ever lived. He was a moral genius. His ethical sense was unique. He was the intrinsically wisest person that I've ever encountered in my life or in my teachings.
His commitment was total and led to his own death, much to the detriment of the world. What could one say about him except that this was a form of greatness? Lee Strobel said, I was taken aback. You sound like you really cared about him, I said. Charles said, well yes, he is the most important thing in my life, came his reply. I, I, I, he stuttered, searching for the right word. I know it may sound strange, but I have to say I adore him. Everything good I know, everything decent I know, everything pure I know, I learned from Jesus.
Yes, yes, and tough. Just look at Jesus. He castigated people. He was angry.
People don't think of him that way, but they don't read the Bible. He had a righteous anger. He cared for the oppressed and the exploited. There's no question that he had the highest moral standard, the least duplicity, the greatest compassion of any human being in history. There had been many other wonderful people, but Jesus is Jesus. Ah, but no, he said slowly.
He's the most, he stopped and then he started again. In my view, he declared he is the most important human being who has ever existed. That's when Templeton uttered the words that I never expected to hear from him. And if I may put it this way, he said, as his voice began to crack, I, I miss him. With that, the tears flooded his eyes. He turned his head and looked downward, raising his left hand to shield his face from me. His shoulders bobbed as he wept. Templeton fought to compose himself.
I could tell it wasn't like him to lose control in front of a stranger. He sighed deeply and wiped away a tear. After a few more awkward moments, he waved his hand dismissively. Finally, quietly, but adamantly, adamantly, he's insisted enough of that.
And the interview was over. And so what I, what I've learned and what I've seen in my own life is that we say that atheists or people of the Muslim religion or another religion may be the most unhappy people in the world. Maybe that's not true. Maybe the people who are the unhappiest people in the world who were once Christians, who once knew the love of Jesus and how it was to be close to Jesus and then have turned away. As it talks about in 2 Peter chapter 2, a dog returns to his vomit. But one of the things when I read this story about Charles Templeton, Dana, it reminded me of the dream that you had with the wolves where you said the thing that you remembered in your dream was that it wasn't the Muslims who were coming against Jesus. It wasn't the people who are always atheist. It was the people who may have grown up in the church and who weren't listening. They were the ones who were coming after the Christians.
Is that right? Exactly. It was the people who had been raised and then decided once they got out that they wanted to fill their wild oats or get what they wanted. They wanted to live by their own principles. Instead of saying, okay, word of God, I'm going to live by your standards, your mandates, your statutes. They said, no, I'm going to live how I want to live. And as much as Paul described in Romans 1, it's the rich, young ruler coming in and saying, hey, I've done all this. And Jesus has to say, but that's not enough. You've got to do this.
It's the people who said, I'm not going to, I'm not going to take that myself. I'm not going to deny myself, take out my cross and follow. Because the price of discipleship, if you've ever read Bonhoeffer's book, The Cost of Discipleship, that book changed my life.
It transformed my life. And I find interesting, you mentioned Genesis, because as soon as I'm done preaching through Romans 1, I'm starting in Genesis 1 and going through the time of the Ark. And I'm going to emphasize the fact, once again, that if we throw the garden of Eden out and we throw Adam and Eve out, we have to throw everything else out in the word of God. If we don't accept that there were six literal days of creation, not that people call me everything you can imagine, but if we deny that God did it, if this is what the word says, then we believe it.
Well, we don't. And if we don't, we begin to question one thing, and that's what's in the garden. The serpent basically said, now Eve, look, the reason you shouldn't eat from the tree is because you'll become like him, so why won't you eat from the tree? In other words, question authority. You don't have to do what Uthosa did. And that became the line that ended up causing sin to enter the world.
It cursed the planet, it cursed the universe, so to speak. And so we've got to stand strong. But the persecution that's going to come, I believe much of it will come from the church. I told you I have a lady in my church who was told by her family, well, you've not had this thing, this mandate, so we don't want you coming up for things to get.
And I'm already starting to hear from other families online telling me different things, that they're seeing the same thing. Churches are being divided over the mandate. Churches are being divided over who believes God, and all this information is out there. And for such a time as this, so to speak, the enemy is working overtime to divide and conquer. The enemy is working overtime to delude. That deluding influence that Paul talks about in Thessalonians, I believe it's already here. As long as the spirit of the Antichrist is in here, that deluding influence has been too. And that delusion in our culture is also in our church.
You can talk to people and say, you know, what do you think Jesus came about? There are people who are going to think that the Lord is coming back. And I look at the headlines and I think, well, the headlines, when I look at headlines, they are indicators of where we are. And so when I see headlines that talk about some of the things that are happening or this and that, I say, okay, Lord, this reminds me of what you said in Matthew 24. Look at the signs.
The signs will tell you when he's coming. And yet there are so many people in this church that have no idea. And in some of our churches where, you know, the doctrine has been compromised and the Gospel has been compromised, it's no wonder those people don't have any sense of what's happening. But nonetheless, we as believers who know and sense it and read the signs need to be living our lives for him as much as we can and making a difference.
And the tribulation that Smyrna was going to deal with. Basically he said, you know, be faithful unto death and I'll give you the kind of life. He was saying, this persecution, this stuff is coming, it may kill some of you. But even if it does, realize on the other side there's a kind of life. And that's in verse 10, behold, do not fear what you're about to suffer. I think that's the word of the Lord's church in America right now. Do not fear what you're about to suffer. Because if we're faithful to him, whether we die or we don't, his faithfulness, his faithfulness to us will make a difference in our lives. And the other thing is this, there will be a watching world, watching us go through persecution opposition and see how we respond. Last week I talked about Polycarp.
Polycarp, when they came to find him, he was hiding in a house, and when they found him he asked for the people whose house he was in for them to fix food for the men who came to get him. And that's from Fox's book of Martyrs. Yes, when push comes to shove, there's going to be a shove back. But our shove back has to be Christlike. Our shove back has to be gospel glorifying, Jesus glorifying, God exalting, because the push is coming. And our response is going to make a difference in the watching world.
That's right. And you know, one of the things that I was thinking about, because there are a lot of good things going on, we heard about August 7th, and that's probably where you heard about where in Portland Antifa came to a group of worshippers and they took their equipment and they threw it into the river and were spraying them down with, I don't even know what, and basically harassing them. And one of the things that I heard in that first video was they said to the Christians, where is your God now? And you know, it kind of reminds me of a story of a guy, a grown man, and his young son had a very bad sickness, I believe it was cancer. And he, when his son ended up passing away and the guy was a Christian and he knew that he was not supposed to question God or be angry at God, he said, but one night he got so angry and he started to shake his fist at God. And he said, God, where were you when my son died? And he said, he felt in his spirit, the Lord speak to him.
And he said, I was at the same place I was when my son died. And Jesus said, a servant is not above his master. He said, if they persecuted me, I mean, right, they're going to do it to us, right, Dana? That's right. That's right.
Absolutely. And the gospel is going to bring persecution. The gospel is going to bring opposition.
The gospel is going to bring people who are dimensionally opposed to the standards of the word of God. And Jesus told us that was going to happen. The apostles told us that was going to happen. John told us that was going to happen. Even the prophets of old told us that was going to happen. So we should be, you know, Peter, he said, don't be surprised by this fiery trial you're going through.
Vote that for the people he was writing to. And we need to have that same purpose. We're not going to be surprised by this. We're not going to be shocked.
We're going to stand strong, we're going to stay faithful, no matter what it causes, no matter what it does. And Andrew, one of the disciples of Jesus, supposedly when they were carrying him off to be crucified, they were taking him to the cross and he saluted the cross. And he said, I've been waiting for this day for a long time. And they said, when he was on the cross, they killed him very slowly, from what I've heard.
And he was on there for two days. He was preaching to the people who were crucifying him. When Jesus was on the cross, one of the things that he said to his father, he said, Father, forgive them for they know not what they do. And so when an unbelieving world, when they see us respond with love to the people who are persecuting us, they say, I want that. I'm miserable.
I don't have this. I want the same peace that you guys have. And we were talking about on August 7th, what happened in Portland. Well, what a lot of people didn't hear about was on August 8th, the very next day, they had another worship group there, a guy who came into town. And people who were in Antifa were getting saved.
People who were on the streets were throwing their heroin needles on the ground, throwing their cigarettes, saying, I give all this up and I want to choose and I want to follow Jesus. So in the midst of all the bad stuff, there's a lot of good stuff. And I told you earlier this morning, the word, I felt like the Lord gave me a word and it said it was from not a Christian, but it said it's going to be the best of times and it's going to be the worst of times. And so, yes, there is going to be a lot of rough stuff. There is going to be a lot of bad stuff, but the Lord is going to be moving as well. And I know you said that sometimes the best way for there to be revival is persecution because we have to show our true colors.
And yes, there are going to be, the cold are going to get colder, but the hot are going to get hotter. And we had talked about a little bit, wanted to get to this verse in verse four. Nevertheless, I have this against you in Revelation 2 that you have left your first love. And Pastor Dana, there was a psychologist who used to talk to pastors and he said when he saw pastors who would fall morally, whether it was through adultery or embezzlement or whatever it was, he said there were two things that they always did, that always happened. Number one, they stopped reading their Bible and number two, they stopped praying. But what do you think it means to leave your first love?
And if somebody's left their first love, what would it mean for them to come back? I think it means you walk away, well I know it means you walk away from your commitment to Christ. You know, when you become a Christian and you're transformed and you begin to change your thinking, you begin to change your speech, you begin to change your attitude. And the thing about the Gospel, the Gospel is once that seed is planted and it begins to bloom and sprout, it grows.
And you're like, we're supposed to be planted by the water. And so that picture of leaving our first love means basically that we detach ourselves from the, you know, we're the branches, he's the vine, but we're the branches. We pull ourselves away from fellowship, we pull ourselves away from intimacy with God, we do stop praying, we do stop praying, we stop getting our eyes off Him and we start putting our faith and our hope in our own ideas, our own ability to take care of the problem of the situation. A lot of times the big problems come up. You know, one of the things in the church world we always say is, well, you know, when things are good, people are happy, but when people start having major difficulties, the churches are full and this and that. Just like 9-11, after that event, seven Sundays in a row, church attendance was on the highest in the nation, you know, highest in national history.
And then after eight weeks, it started going back down, the saints got back to normal. And so a lot of times, even in the church world, there are folks that serve God when it's convenient, when it's easy. And so what it really comes down to, we need to make a solid commitment from the beginning, okay, Lord, I need you to change my life, transform my hope, put something in my heart. And for those that need to come back and back, sit and fall away, and have left their first love, they've got to be willing to admit, well, I walked away from you, I put my faith and my trust in myself. And then there needs to be a reckoning of understanding that I walked away.
God never moves. It's always, it's me, it's you, it's us. And so we have to recognize that we have abandoned our commitment to Him, and we need to repent. And sometimes I think even that means a public repentance. Sometimes it means a private, but for the most part, we have to look to the Lord and say, Lord, forgive me, I've put my faith and my trust in myself on man's ways, on this institution or that doctor or this situation, and get back to trusting Him. And that's really where I think faith is, faith is more, I prefer to say it this way, obedience is the soil of faith. And if we really have faith, we're going to lay down, we're going to walk with Him, and when we fail, when we sin, we're going to say, oh God, forgive us, and we're going to repent, and we're going to keep getting back up. And the Bible says a righteous man falls seven times and he keeps getting back up. In other words, the righteous man is committed to his first love. When he stops getting up, he's basically said, my first love is not enough, I've got to have something else to entertain me, to fulfill me, to satisfy me. And so that's where that daily prayer time, that time in the Word, that time in prayer, that time of fellowship with the Church, the body of Christ, Barna research shows that about 40% of the people who left the Church last year are gone.
They'll never come back. And I understand why some of that happens, but it also has exposed that many people in our churches were just there to come to church, it was a duty, something they could check off. So to keep your first love, it's like anything in marriage.
You still have to love that person no matter what happens, what goes on, so death, whatever. I do marriage, premarital counseling, any couple that I marry, I always do premarital counseling. And I asked the young man one time, I said, okay, let me ask you a question. It's the middle of the night, you've got to be at work at six in the morning, and your wife is very, very sick, and so sick, and she gets up and can't get to the bathroom in time, and throws up all over the floor.
Who cleans it up? He said, oh man, she's got to do that, I've got to go to work. And I said, you just made a big mistake, and if you do that in marriage, you don't want to love your wife. What do you mean, what do you mean?
This is a rough guy. She's going to say, I've got to make the money. I said, yeah, but your wife is sick. We're talking about hypothetical situations, and I said, do you realize that this woman who's your wife is going to be your wife because of all your children? She basically just said, honey, if you get sick, you're on your own. I said, you know, there's something called, you know, incitement to your health, preventative heart, you know, I never thought it meant that.
The idea was she really kind of understood, wow, you're right, if I marry her and she's sick, I'm the one who's going to stay home, I've got to take care of her, I can't just depend on somebody else. It's a commitment. It is a commitment, and we're running out of time, but I'll finish with the verse five. It's remember, therefore, from where you have fallen, repent. I think that's a dirty word in America for a lot of people, but repent and do the first works or else I will come to you quickly and remove your lampstand from its place unless you repent.
And so we still have time to repent, but I don't think we have a whole lot of time. So Pastor Dana, thank you so much for coming on again, and we hope to see you again soon. Love being on here. Thank you. Thank you, man. God bless you. Thank you. God bless you.
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