All the things that I wanted to do, pushing the obstacles out of my son's way, because I just wanted to stop the pain. But a lot of times when I want to stop the pain for my kids, it's that pain and that shaping that God is longing to do in their lives. That's what I'm pushing out of the way for this temporary benefit. It's Janelle Breitenstein, and she's our guest today on Focus on the Family with Jim Daley.
I'm John Fuller. You know, John, I think as parents, we so want our kids, obviously, at the very core to embrace faith in Christ, right? So we're doing everything, sometimes probably a little formulaically to try to get to that point where they make that confession of faith. But in the end, I mean, it's aiming for the heart and making sure they understand that God loves them, that their identity is in Christ, and that they are loved, even regardless of their behavior. And sometimes that's hard for us as parents to express. But man, that I believe is what's going to lead to a healthy relationship with God through Jesus Christ. And today, we want to help equip your children to become disciples who are on fire for the Lord. And we have a great guest to talk about it.
Yeah, and there aren't formulas so much as an approach. And boy, our guest Janelle Breitenstein has a terrific approach. She's an author, freelance writer and speaker. And she's mom to four and she's been here before. We're going to talk about her book called Permanent Markers, Spiritual Life Skills to Write on Your Kids' Hearts. And you can find out more details about the book. Just check it out. The link is in the show notes. Janelle, welcome back. Thanks. It's so great to be here again.
Yeah, it's good. Now, let me start with my poor experience with permanent markers. Everybody just went, oh, yeah, that's me. Because every parent has one. Well, right. You forgot to put those in a special drawer and the washable ones you put away and the permanent ones you laid out for the kids and then you realize, oops, I made a mistake. And at least the first thing they write usually is their name. Or they try to. So you know who did it.
Yes, you do. So I mean, you're a mom of four, you're super busy. And, you know, everything's coming at you. How do you concentrate on saying, oh, yeah, Lord, help me today to show my four kids, between all of it, what it means to have faith in you?
I mean, that is the million dollar question, right? Because we can start out with that great goal. But the reality is, it is the everyday habit, because it's not just habits we're building in our kids. It's habits we're building in ourselves. You know, as parents, Deuteronomy 6, how am I going to do this as we walk along the way when they rise?
You know, how are we going to make this a part of our day-to-day, even when we're just trying to find the other soccer cleat, for goodness sakes? Yeah. And in that context, I mean, how are you reminding yourself to be that, to do that between everything that you're doing? That's really the question. With all the busyness, how do you put that at the forefront of your mind to remember to be an example of Christ to your kids, to not fly off the handle when things are, mommy, mommy, mommy? Yes.
And is there a way to do that regularly? Well, I'm going to tell you, I'm going to give you the Sunday school answer, but it is the one that I'd start with, that, you know, it's one thing if we've just got an agenda to tell this to our kids. It's another thing if it pours out of us, because that's what's inside of us, and that's what we're experiencing.
Yeah. You know, so I mean, if I'm trying to be the good mom or whatever, I mean, that's a great goal. But ultimately, my kids are going to suss out pretty soon what's authentic and what isn't. You know, that's just the bottom line. I mean, when I look at what I'm trying to help kids do in their lives, at the risk of putting this on too human of a level, it's a little bit like helping somebody fall in love, you know, because we're trying to draw their affections to somebody.
But at the same time, it's not the kind of thing that your daughter brings home somebody who you know is great for her, and he happens to have this habit of picking his nose. It's not that kind of thing. Instead, it's like, this is the guy for whom rocks cry out to worship.
This is the one who elders are worshiping day and night, night and day. You know, so what we're trying to do is expose God for who he really is. And so we have to experience that. We've got to experience it before we can roll it out, you know?
Yeah, no, it's good. You know, you have, and I'm sure when people hear this, they're going to go, oh, okay, now I get it. Yeah. You and your family were missionaries in Uganda. Now everybody just went, oh, they're that kind of family.
Stereotype, yeah. Okay, they're out of my reach. I mean, you're doing things for the Lord that I would never consider doing. But I mean, you did learn a lot and you had, I think as a missionary couple, you learned the power of prayer through this story.
What happened? You know, it was just really cool. One day we were traveling on these back roads.
I mean, and the Uganda back roads, I mean, it's kind of the thing where you're hitting your head every five seconds, you know, and you're dodging cattle that scraped their longhorns around your car. But what really captured, just a normal day, exactly. But what really captured my mind from that time is we were talking to some people who were missionaries and I asked them, sometimes it's just fascinating to me when people, to hear people's faith stories of what really captured them, you know, kind of like you with FCA when you were 15, I believe. Oh, you remember that?
Oh, well, yeah. I mean, you know, that's, there was something, there was a beauty that was so great. There was a power that was so fantastic and attractive.
You couldn't say no. It was irresistible. And this family, the woman was expressing to me, I just said, what was the thing that captured you? And she said, actually, we had neighbors and they had us over for dinner and they were praying.
And the way they prayed was like God was real. Wow. You know.
Just saying that. Yeah. Just the way that they prayed. They prayed. There's something different about people who really experienced God, just like it is for that mom who's really experiencing God.
And that moment where she wishes she could really be getting a few more moments of sleep, you know? Yeah. No, that's good. Speaking of prayer, cause that's kind of one of the core things and how we teach our kids to pray. So let's hit that kind of practical point for parents who are listening in or viewing, starting with toddlers. I mean, we're probably going really, how do you teach a child how to pray when they can barely speak, but it's a good thing to do.
It is. It really, and you know, sometimes I think what we naturally do for toddlers isn't a bad thing. We start with requests or with rote prayers, you know, thanking God for food and things like that.
Those are all great things. Little prayers. Yeah, little prayers that are at a toddler level. At some point, I think it's still good for us as parents to have the goal in mind, which is that the goal is not for our kids to make sure that they dictate the entire grocery list to Siri.
You know, it's not that kind of a, just make sure that he gets all your requests because really God's a cosmic vending machine. You know, instead, what do we want? We want this to be an ongoing relationship and let's say your toddler, you want them to develop a relationship with their grandma who you live in New York and they live in California. What are you going to do? You're going to give them some FaceTime and you're going to help that toddler relate and start talking about things.
Tell grandma about what you did with your friend at preschool today or on the church playground, you know, and, and we start making it a relationship far more than it is. God gives me what I want because I tell you, at some point, God's not going to give that toddler what he wants. You know, one of the things I remember when I was parenting Trent and Troy at a young age, just simple things in life, I mean, the Word of God says you can just look into God's nature and you're going to see, if you see it, you will see God in his nature.
And so there's easy ways to connect with storms and trees and snowfall here in Colorado. I mean, just good things you can do at that age that helps them to connect spiritually to the concept of God. Yes, that's an excellent, I mean, just, I mean, kind of letting ourselves exude a little bit, you know, a natural awe for what's outside of us. And I think another one is meeting our kids in their pain. I had a friend tell me an interesting story recently. And when he was even, I think he was in elementary school, he mentioned that he went into his parents room for a nightmare. And his parents, I think in a good hearted way, just said, you know what, God is your comfort, go back to bed, which is not a bad thing.
I mean, we see Eli doing a similar thing with Samuel. But he said, as somebody who couldn't really understand God's presence at that age, what really would have helped is my parents arms around me, you know, and maybe them praying with me and taking the time to just hear what my nightmare was about, you know, and in that way, we really do when we can be present with our kids emotionally, man, are they going to see the glory of God in a hug, or when somebody, you know, dashed their Lego creation or whatever. That's a moment right there for them to encounter God's presence and his intimacy.
It's so good. And we're hitting on this. But as you move up the spectrum to grade school age, and you know, junior high, oh, my goodness, how do you help a junior higher? This is this is the golden nugget, folks, lean in and listen.
Oh, yeah. Well, um, you know, I do think, you know, when I look in john one, I see the God who pitched his tents among us, you know, who dwelled among us. And I think if there was a junior higher who came into this studio, what would we be talking about with them? We'd be like, Hey, cool. Nike's, you know, I mean, we'd be we'd be talking about, you know, like, what's going on with your teacher, you know, things like that, and starting to help them direct whatever their days are, in, unfortunately, in junior high, it's a lot of heartache, and it's a lot of insecurity. I remember driving the boys to school, because I would do that, drop them off in carpool line. And remember that? Anyway, I can remember one conversation I had with him, because I'm trying to, you know, you're thinking, how do I connect the Lord to their daily life. So we're driving along. And I, I said to Trent, Troy said, you know, if there was a good friend that you had, and something happened, and somebody was trying to kill you, and this friend said, Listen, I'm going to take that bullet for you, I'm going to die for you, I said, how would you treat that family? You know, what would you do? They go, Oh, man, we treat that family so good, I'd do things for them to recognize.
And I went, that's exactly how we should have an attitude toward the Lord, because he died for you. And they just the light bulb went off, it was like, you know, but just finding those ways to intersect in a practical way, because kids are so honest, they're kind of just show me your hires. Yeah. Whether you want them to be. So you got to find ways that they could, you know, build that into how they see the world. That's what you're working on. How do they see the world?
Sure. And it's probably totally different for a Trent and for a Troy, those are very different. I mean, two totally different kids. I've got a daughter who's totally artistic, so and she's musical. So how does she connect with God? Writing poetry, writing music, and, and creating artwork, you know, whereas my my son, Jack, who's, you know, bouncing off the walls all the time, he's the kid, you know, let's send you out on a run, you know, let's let you let's worship God, while you know, or use all that energy. He's serving at church constantly, because he's not he's always bored. I mean, and part of that you're hitting it is how do you develop a habit of prayer in children?
And any insights into how to do that? Well, I mean, again, I would come into, I would say, let me back up a little bit. And I'd say, let's, let's use the analogy of a personal trainer. Okay, let's say, I know, right. Okay. Yeah.
We're only talking about prayer. Another analogy. Well, I have a friend who's a personal trainer. And I've learned that if you're approaching somebody who's not who, you know, thinks they might want to get back into shape, their couch potato, you know, and they've got one hand in the Doritos, you're gonna, you're gonna approach that totally differently. I'm not incriminating anybody. I don't like Doritos.
If you said Haagen Dazs, I'd be a little more convicted since we're getting personal. But since you know, you've got you've got that person. And then on the other hand, maybe my personal trainer friend is training somebody who's trying to run a better marathon. And you've got two totally different approaches to those people with the one you're trying to just find the thing that clicks for them, whether it's Zumba, or speed walking or tennis, or whatever it is to just get them out and, and get them to the next level. But the other one is going to eat up your peloton pace and raise you 20 push ups, you know, and when you've got kids who are that different in their spiritual development and their personalities, you know, look at it like a personal trainer. So so back to your back to your original question, you know, how can we start developing habits, I'd say look at your kids natural proclivities. I mean, we we attribute the quote to Eric Liddell's movie character, at least, you know, I feel God's pleasure when I run, what is that thing that your kid was born doing?
And start there, start with the musical kids start with the mechanical kid. And rather than seeing that as, as a weakness or something that gets in the way of their spirituality, how can you help them worship God in the way they're made for the artistic or crafty kid? Maybe you're creating a paper chain, a paper prayer chain that they take off, you know, a link every day. Maybe there's a kid who's got physical affection as his love language, and you have a great smelling lotion every night and you rub his back or his feet while you pray and you hear about his day and you connect and you bring that data God together. You've got two totally different kids, but they're learning a habit of prayer that hopefully will stick with them.
It's not a formula, as you said, I mean, there's there's some some approaches that work. In this regard, you included a story about your son who came home from visiting some friends and asked for some downtime. What was that all about? Yeah, well, I asked him to do his tours because he'd been at a friend's house all day. And he was like, Mom, can I just have some downtime? He was like, they're a really nice Christian family. And I was like, wait, are we are we a nice, are we a nice Christian family?
And he goes, yeah, but they're a gentle, quiet, nice Christian family. And I was like, yeah, I mean, rather than like that kind of spa like atmosphere you picture for meditation, mine's more like the bring a helmet kind of side that was more, you know, it was hard to picture my kids meditating on anything rather than Minecraft, you know, you got four kids going at it totally and it feels like six, you know, so so I mean, we had to laugh at that. But really, what we're trying to get kids to do with meditation is to chew on God's Word and kind of soak in it like you would a teabag, you know, and there are ways that you can get kids to do that.
I mean, some moms and dads are going, you know, way, you know, my kids, but you can achieve it. Oh, totally. I mean, and sometimes it's just this idea. There's a there's lots of things that we can meditate on. We can meditate on how God is working in our circumstances. We can meditate by chewing on the same Bible verse and really sinking deep into a passage.
You know, we can meditate on creation or just be still in God's presence. Is this one of those things that kids need to catch it? They need to see you do it in order to understand it, like to meditate on the Lord, to sit quietly, that you need to illustrate it so they can, oh, okay, that's what that is. I think so. I think it would be helpful.
I think it's 100 percent because every skill like that is just so much better caught than taught. There's also ways that we can create space in our household, maybe by just turning off the TV going all the time, you know, or not having music in the car all the time or maybe having worship music instead where we just we sing along and we start to chew on God's word again. Now, I want to be mindful of the parents who have that child who may be a little hyperactive. I don't want to lay a label on that or use the medical terminology. But you know, a lot of boys tend to be it's difficult for them to sit still.
So, you know, in that context, I could see parents, you know, wanting I heard this on Focus on the Family today. Let's try some meditation, Johnny. It's like you cannot sit still.
You cannot do this. And it turns into a argument now rather than what you intended it to be, which is a calm kind of instructional moment. One hundred percent. I mean, this is definitely I would say a learned. This is going to be a baby step thing, just like with when you would ride a bike. You know, you're not going to start them out on the two wheeler with no training wheels. You're going to start them off on that little is it the glide bike or whatever they put their feet on the side. You know, I'm talking about and, you know, you take baby steps.
So maybe it's just creating more more quiet in your home. And then I think there's also things like, you know, let's roll out some butcher paper and let's write out verses and help kids think about them. Let's have them make posters for their bedroom door. You know, let's maybe if we are trying to maybe get in a little more to more pointed meditation, give them some some play doh. Give them some pipe cleaners.
Give them some watercolors, you know, help them. I mean, they don't you don't need to be wiggle free to focus on God's word. Yeah.
There you go. Help them wiggle while they're learning. Oh, totally.
Wiggle while they're learning. That could be a book somewhere down the road. I'm hearing it.
I'm hearing it. But the book we're talking about today with Janelle Breitenstein on Focus on the Family is Permanent Markers, Spiritual Life Skills to Write on Your Kids' Hearts. This is a terrific book. It's got so much content in it, and it's not for formulaic. It does have some great ideas that you can implement, tailor it to your family.
And a copy of the book from us here at the ministry of the details are in the show notes. Janelle, I love these life skills, the way you put these in the book, the target we're trying to hit as a parent. That helps me at least. I'm kind of goal oriented, right, John? A little bit. A little bit.
So I really like that. And one of them and one of the life skills is adoration. I would not, as a parent, sit and think, how do I teach my child adoration? It just isn't something I would think about over my Wheaties. But how do we help our children make adoration? A, what is that?
And then how do we help our children find that practice? You know, that's a great question. Let me tell you, I have a daughter who's 16, and she's very lovely.
And I tell you what, if there's a boy who would want to date her, I'm going to have my eyes on him. Because if he would even get his foot in the door, he's the one who's the lucky dog. Does that make sense? Absolutely.
Okay. So in a sense, adoration is embracing our role as the lucky dogs. We are God's kids. And we're the ones who, again, if rocks are crying out to worship this God, and everybody's going to cast their crowns at his feet, not probably out of obligation, but because they can't help themselves.
Every knee shall bow. Yeah, I mean, that's the kind of task that we have is to, I mean, as Paul says in Ephesians 1 18, that the eyes of your heart may be enlightened. We want to cultivate so that God can show himself as he is to our kids. You know, in that regard, I could see that we as parents, we can tend to keep the negative list a bit more strongly than the positive list.
And I'm not talking about positivity. That's not what I'm saying. But I'm saying those things, those benchmarks, those places where God really showed up and to remind our children of those stories, and to talk about that, and that is a form of adoration, right? Oh, very much.
Very much. I mean, you've probably heard john piper sentence about how missions exists, because worship doesn't. There are people who don't get to enjoy God as we do. And by the way, we're all natural evangelists about something, whether you just got a positive pregnancy test, or whether you love the Golden State Warriors, you're an evangelist for something and you're naturally worshiping something.
So how can we turn the spotlight of our kids hearts toward the one it was made the person we were made to worship? You had a situation I think with your husband, it was his birthday. And I think it helped the kids to learn how to apologize. What happened? You don't have to apologize on your birthday. You know what, it was my it was my it was me. You know, my grief there that I needed to apologize for.
Yeah, I am. I've struggled with with mom anger throughout. Throughout my parenting. I didn't really think I had a problem with anger until I had children. I don't know if there's any moms who can relate. Well, just for context.
What does that mean? Your definition of that is losing your temper? Just Yeah, I just realized I was I was yelling at my kids.
I mean, to be honest, like I remember, even just like around nap time, my son would melt down and I would yell to try to get control. I mean, you know, it's just a terrible strategy. I'm not empathizing with him and bringing him down.
I'm escalating the problem and I would be shutting the windows so that I wouldn't be damaging my testimony with my neighbors. There's so much wrong with this story. But but it's been a real journey for me. In fact, I'm looking at mom anger as their parent anger is the topic of my next book because it has been quite a journey. But I know that on this particular birthday of, of my husband's, it was a milestone. We were having lots of people into town, I was throwing a big, a big party for him.
And sounds like the 40 Oh, well, you know, it certainly wasn't the 30 considering I have four teenagers. So I mean, you know, I, everything is going okay, but I'm, I'm a, I'm a helper, and I'm somebody who, who associates shame with my own needs. And so I don't know that I'm angry, or that I need to rest until man that ship has left the harbor a long time ago. You know, and I'm going to, you know, from zero to 120 in about point three seconds, you know, and so we're finally the party has come off without a hitch.
My husband is honored, you know, we've made great memories, and we're going home, kids are past their bedtime, and one of them has a balloon. And he's going the whole time and watching you know, I'm, I am this close to just losing it. You know, and that's what exactly what happens when I mean, I know I have parents on this.
So maybe you've seen Monsters Inc. in that moment where they, they freeze, you know, Mr. Waternoose, and he looks horrible. And that's exactly what happened in the Bridenstine household that night. And you know, I mean, man, I can get a lot of things right. And if I get love wrong, I really get a lot wrong. Oh, my goodness.
Yeah, we do forget that. Yeah, I can get the Bible right. And I can get love wrong says another author, I'm paraphrasing him. And so I did have something I had power left in my hands that next morning. I woke each one of my kids up at the right time, not early, but just with a hug and just apologizing to them. And letting them know that I just I still need a Savior. You know, not that he didn't save me once for all eternity, but that I need to preach the gospel to myself day after day. And you know, I used to think that the goal of Christian parenting was to raise godly kids. And I would still tell you that but I would put a big but on there. Or accept is probably the better word.
It's to play at the gospel in my home. Because God needs something this world needs something more than my perfect kids. Wow, you know, amen. The world needs kids who know that they need Jesus. The Pharisees were working really hard on perfection.
And they really missed Jesus right in front of them. And will be unto me, if I raise kids who I have control of, and who are what looked like morally perfect, and their hearts are far from him, and they have no idea how much they need a Savior. And that starts with me, as a mom creating a culture in our home of the gospel.
And in that moment, it looked like creating an I'm sorry, I forgive you culture in my house. Yeah, that's powerful. I mean, can hear it in your voice. And I mean, it is the key. I'm just sitting there thinking of a parenting book called Don't Raise Pharisees. There's a title for you.
But I mean, true. I mean, talk about missing the mark, if that they can do all the legalism correctly, but they don't know the Lord. Man, have we blown it as a parent. Think of David, think of being the parent of David.
He's out there alone slinging rocks, yeah, killing bears. And God said he had a heart for him, even though he committed big sins, you know, but his repentance is there and it's it's a beautiful, beautiful understanding of God. In terms of helping our kids grasp the life skills, I did want to cover the A's that you mentioned. And let's come back next time. We're right at the end of today. But let's hit those A's really quick. Just give us the list.
Give me one or two that you are gravitating toward. And then we can pick up the conversation next time. That sounds great. Yeah, these are actually partly from an organization called Peacemakers that you may have heard of. But the five A's of confession would be to admit what you did wrong, apologize for how your choice affected the other person, accept the consequences, ask for forgiveness, and alter your choice in the future.
Yeah, those are good A's. Let's come back next time and cover some more of this great book, Permanent Markers, Spiritual Life Skills to Write on Your Kids' Hearts. It's wonderfully done and beautifully authentic.
I think people can hear that in your voice. And if we can, let's do it, can't we? Thanks. I would be so honored. This is a privilege. Thanks, guys.
Okay. And turning to the listener and the viewer, you know, we make this really easy. It's a great resource.
It's one as a parent that you should have in your arsenal of being the best parent you could be. So make a gift of focus of any amount, be part of the ministry to families that need help. And we'll send you a copy of the book as our way of saying thank you for being part of the ministry.
That's an easy way to do it. You get a great resource, focus gets the fuel that needs to help more families, and therefore Jesus is lifted up and more families are touched and helped. Yeah, we're a phone call away, or you can stop by the website. Our number is 800, the letter A in the word family, 800-232-6459, or you can donate and get the book and other resources at the website, and we've got the link in the show notes. On behalf of Jim Daly and the entire team, thanks for joining us today for Focus on the Family.
I'm John Fuller inviting you back next time as we continue the conversation with Janelle about permanent markers and leaving a spiritual legacy with your kids, and once again, help you and your family thrive in Christ. Hey, parents. Parent here. If you're searching for biblical and practical tips for your kid's specific age, you know, with all that extra time you have, well, you can stop. Focus on the Family has weekly age and stage emails that bring the tips to you. Each week I get an email from my son that I can read on my phone and put directly into practice. No more sifting through junk on the Internet. I can focus my time on being intentional. It's easy. Visit MyKidsAge.com, add your kid's age, and get to parenting better. It's MyKidsAge.com.
