Thriving as a Wife and Mom in the Middle Years (Part 1 of 2)

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That's focusonthefamily.com slash careers. If you find yourself somewhere around the midpoint of life, how's it going? Do you feel like you're on track with your goals? Or are you still playing catch-up? Or maybe you're considering some important changes to life. Wherever you may be in that journey, we want to explore what life is like in the middle years on today's episode of Focus on the Family. Thanks for joining us.

Your host is Focus President and author Jim Daly and I'm John Fuller. John, I think I'm still trying to wrap my head around what is the middle life, the middle years. There's no chronological definition.

I think it's, I've said it's when you send kids to college then you qualify for middle-age. Is that right? What do you think? I don't know.

I don't know if it's chronological, like 40 to 60. Sounds pretty much like the middle. I don't know. We'll ask our guests when we get a chance. But the one thing is I love this idea, our guest has written in her book, The Middle Matters, this idea of assessing where you're at.

What's working, what's not working. And maybe we'll be mature enough to say we've got to make some changes on the things that aren't working. Yeah, and we've all seen train wrecks where people are having kind of a midlife crisis, right?

I mean the stereotypes for that. We're gonna get beyond that though and think through scripturally what does it mean to be in these middle years. And we have Lisa Jo Baker back with us. She's an author, speaker, and podcast host. She has a real gift of encouragement and especially for women and some good insight for men as well, of course.

She's written a book that's the basis for our conversation called The Middle Matters. Jimmy referenced it. The subtitle is Why That Extraordinary Life Looks Really Good on You.

And we've got copies of that here at the ministry. Just click the link in the episode notes or give us a call. Lisa Jo, welcome to Focus again. I'm so happy to be back.

It's great. And of course, Jean is merely a teenager. But I thought she could give us some, you know, insights on midlife.

Barely in the middle years. I'm surprised I even thought of this. It's so good to have you here too. Well, it's always a pleasure being here.

It's so much fun. Lisa Jo, let's ask that question. What is the definition of the midlife, the middle years?

Who are we? I'm guessing it depends on who you ask, right? So I think it could be by age, but it could just be by stage. I've had women that are in their late 20s tell me I feel like I'm in midlife right now just because I have kids that are so much older that are going into high school or college.

And then there are moms who started later in life and so they might be in their 40s by the time their kids are heading into high school or graduating high school. So I mean, I do think it's one of those things your internal barometer nudges you and you get that feeling you wake up one morning and you think to yourself, oh, I'm not at the beginning anymore. I'm in the middle.

That's so true. I think that hit me at 50. That feels like the middle of something.

I don't know. Let's dive in to your story, Lisa Jo. You describe how in these middle years you tend to be more concerned about the comfort of your clothing rather than the size. That's definitely true even for guys, right?

What fits and what's comfortable. Right, right. I mean it really hit me one morning when I was going to my closet and there are a pair of jeans I bought once upon a time in Prague. And my husband and I, right, that tells you right there. They're not really midlife jeans. But my husband and I had taken a trip, a lost trip, just the two of us before we had kids and we'd gone to Prague and there was this beautiful little store. I got this pair of jeans and I looked at them and I felt like the jeans were looking back at me and telling me there's not a chance. And I thought about those jeans and I thought about trying to fit into them and instead I reached for a pair of comfy sweatpants or a different size jeans. And I realized in that moment though I wasn't sad. I didn't miss that version of myself. I had a new kind of contentment with the stage I was in now.

And I think about this body that grew these three humans that live in my home now and how it has changed over the years. And I realized I wouldn't go back. I wouldn't trade what I have now for those Prague jeans. And maybe, listen, maybe one day I'm gonna wear those jeans again. I'm not saying I'm never.

You're betting on it. But at the same time there's just a sense of peace with this age and stage I am now. You know those jeans represent me before I had kids, before I knew what it was like to deal with difficult teenagers, before I'd been married 20 years. So I love those jeans. They tell a love story but my sweatpants tell a whole different story. Jean, are you relating to this? Absolutely. Absolutely. Every pair of pants I own right now don't have a real zipper. They're just stretchy. It's practical.

Nothing will break. Somebody came up with a great idea. Man, forget that. Lisa Jo, you struggled with the idea of feeling beautiful as a woman since you were a teenager. Some people are probably hearing an accent. You're from South Africa. So speak to that struggle and so many women who have that similar struggle. Sure because there's all these messages bombarding us from culture about what beauty means, what beauty looks like. There's this one standard of beauty and I have a daughter and so after two sons and having a daughter it suddenly became really important to me to figure out like what do I do about this whole beauty conversation. And I wonder if in childhood a lot of us, Jean, I'd be interested if you've had an experience like this but when we're little, when we're tweens or teens, we can be shaped by the things people say to us. And I remember being 16 and driving in the car with my mom and it was the season of Miss South Africa, you know. And I remember telling her mom one day I am gonna be Miss South Africa. And she looked over at me with just tenderness and the love of a mom and then said words I wish she could take back. She said oh my darling I think you're beautiful just not in that way.

Yeah right like what a zinger. So that stays with you and it starts to define part of who you are. And having a daughter now what I've realized is important is that beauty is is in the eye of the heavenly beholder.

Like God names everything that he made good and he talks about everything being beautiful in Ecclesiastes. And I now as a mom of a daughter I remember a moment where when she was a toddler she was talking about her little tummy. You know how toddlers have like a little chubby belly.

And she was really worried and concerned about it. And I took her outside and we have these giant oak trees in our yard and they're hundreds of years old. But they start with a tiny chubby little acorn right. And I showed her the acorn and I said this is what your belly is like. Everything God knows that you need to grow is packed into you and he is gonna stretch it up and grow you into one of these big trees. And none of these trees I promise you leans over and whispers to another tree. You know do these pants make me look XYZ? Like how do you what do you think of this bark? Like am I okay? No these trees are mighty and beautiful and they give us shade and they've lived hundreds of years and they tell long stories about weathering storms. And so now when I think about beauty I define it differently. I mean sure there are parts of us looking in the mirror that we want to feel comfortable and beautiful but strength, kindness, joy, courage, faithfulness. All of these are elements of beauty that are packed into that little acorn. That's a great advantage.

Yeah that's really good. What a great way to explain it to a young person especially. Jean what about that I know that the teen years that can be tough on girls especially girls. You grew up in Southern California. I mean it was all about looking perfect right?

Absolutely yes. I think you get those messages even those of us who didn't grow up with social media that yes you know who are the the prettiest girls at school and and when I was growing up thin lips were popular. Isn't it funny the things that change over the years? And I had I had the same size of lips when I was six years old so they were big at the time. And I can remember standing in the milk line in elementary school and a girl in front of me didn't know I was behind her and said oh yeah Jean and Linda have huge lips. And I so then at my sixth grade picture I smiled I got my lips released tiny but those things you know they they do they stick. Well I'm glad you have lips the way you do. I love your lips. Thank you. Let me ask you too you had this exchange and again a lot of this goes to body image which has captivated so many young people so many young girls that's why we're spending a few moments on it here but you had that experience with your dad and you were gonna see him and you hadn't seen him in a while it was his 70th birthday I think and it seemed like in the book you mentioned your first thoughts were about your weight and I know and how sad is it that having not seen him in so long that's what I would be worried about so I think it's common yeah and I had you know part of it is my dad's a doctor he's very health conscious he you know takes fitness and exercise seriously and I felt like I'm just gonna prepare him that we're just a little fluffier around the edges you know we are carrying some of our stress in our jeans and so I called him and I just was like kind of trying to ease into mentioning that we're coming home a little heavier than then we wish we were and it was the most beautiful reaction it really was sort of the antidote to how my mom had responded with my beauty pageant question he said to me in his beautiful South African British accent oh my darling no just come home the more of you the better we can't wait to hug you and hold you and really the whole time you're here we really intend to put a few more pounds on because we've got all your favorite foods player you know I hope people listening are not hearing me talk about this is not a conversation about healthy eating or exercise per se it's really about healthy viewing of ourselves and when you are viewed through the lens of love like that which is really how God sees us too I think and you feel so lovable it changes how you look at yourself in the mirror so when I look at the pictures from that trip home I just see joy I see delight I see family that's beautiful it is and it's a great way to see yourself okay we've kind of looked at the self image of how we view ourselves and those things that hurt whether it's about your lips or your weight or whatever it might be I remember a guy in high school I was a ninth grader he was probably 11th grader I've mentioned this before he was a big dude a swimmer and he turned around in PE class and just hit me right in the sternum hit it to the point where it cracked and he goes to his friend he goes see this this kid hasn't filled out yet like us and I'm sitting there wheezing you know about to die I'm going thank you for making me your example but it happens in that way with the boys you know physique and you know are you buff and built out and somehow all those feelings follow us all the way Lisa Jo another issue that you mentioned the book and this is a little corner turn here but it's about marriage and you know we read articles where midlife can take a toll on marriage you've raised the kids you're raising the kids and they're kind of toward the end and you're both looking up going who are you right and you know it's unfortunately one of the fastest areas of divorce so when you start to think about feeding your marriage and taking care and tending to your marriage when you're in that midlife zone how do you approach your relationship with Pete your husband well maybe I'll begin by saying I had read an article in the Huffington Post that I think is sort of a segue between body image and midlife of marriage because it was the teenager quote of the week and this is what the quote was my life will never be complete until someone has run through an airport to stop me getting on a plane right which is this trope from all the rom-coms right yes you could never do today anyway but I understand it right it ties into all these ideas we have about how we're supposed to look or how we're supposed to be loved and I remember reading that and thinking no just period full stop no that cannot be the end of the story because the problem is with movies is after that moment the credits roll right and you go back to your real life where real love you forget actually lives because after the guy ran through the airport they have to live 20 years together or 30 years and 50 years of him throwing his socks on the side of the bed every night like where's that love story and so I remembered writing and thinking about this idea about love in the middle like that's the real love like the love stories that are the beginnings they they're fleeting they're gone in like a heartbeat but then you've got 50 years where are the love stories in the trenches and so for me it has really been having eyes to see what love looks like there I mean there the love story is my husband who chooses to drive the minivan in the heat of summer with the broken air conditioning for me you know or the guy who says don't worry I'll go out at 830 into the late night run and the pickups or the guy who comes home not with roses but with like chocolate-covered strawberries or you know that kind of rice or bread that you like it changes but for me it has been constantly this the shifting of how we see because I think there's this emphasis you know carpe diem seize the day but what if you're too tired to do that and what if though it's about a shift in seeing the day it's how you see the day so it isn't about that dash through the airport instead it's the long love story of 40 years in the middle yeah that's good concentrate on that gene I was gonna ask you though I mean we're the couple here so I mean what do you think what in the midlife that we are completing absolutely and I did when you were talking about the airport story I when Jim and I were first married and he started traveling I would park the car and go inside and greet him at the gate which you could do that then and I did that I don't know you know maybe a year or so and then I started you know I didn't know you were going somewhere yes there are seasons in marriage and it's not a fairy tale right and yet God uses it to refine us right it's good and there are so many good things there Lisa Jo I don't mean to put you on the spot but you wrote it in your book out there first I remember one time years ago Jean said to me you know I love you I just don't like you right now to which I was like how could that be who could not like me I didn't actually say that I just thought it it's terrible to think that by the way but in your book you talk about right before you go on a live interview I think Facebook live or something you're yelling at me and we had so I got it I'm gonna out you so what was going on with you and we're a big old fight so literally like four minutes before I supposed to go on my Christian living Facebook live I love your ice cream so hard at him my throat hurt afterwards we were in the middle of a doozy of a fight and I remember actually yelling at him and now I have to go on TV it'd be a Christian can't believe you're having this fight with me yeah I mean you know one of the things the book is called the middle matters and the subtitle isn't just why that extraordinary life it's in parentheses to emphasize the extra why that extra ordinary life looks really good on you and I think we take for granted the ordinary part and we forget about the extra and that God puts us in families and marriages in order to teach us things about ourselves so I know nothing better than a marriage to help you see yourself for who you really are for how God sees you and I don't mean that in any kind of self-critical way instead it's kind of a discovery of the parts in your story that maybe you hadn't recognized need work and that conversation that Pete and I had I use conversation lightly but it showed us a lot about how we communicate and I think what has surprised me is you can be married to someone for 22 years like I have and still learn things about them their origin story that have shaped how they interact with one another and so we're big advocates for therapy and counseling and after some great seasons of that what we learned is that Peter tends to keep a lot of what's happening with him in his head and I say all my words out loud and so the problem could become when there are things happening that I had no idea are happening with him and then he will approach the conversation as if I know and then I have to say I don't live in your head because I did not know that that was happening with you and I say this to young married couples again the trope from the movies is that he will just intuit what it is that you need or want and show up and play music outside your door and I tell young couples no if you want that to happen you will have to explain that to your husband like my love language is gifts or acts of service or please do XYZ so I am not kidding you and I tell you we had many fights about how I would clean the kitchen or the home and then no one would notice and so now what Peter does even to this day with our teenage children is he walks in the house and if it has been cleaned he stops everything and goes kids wow look at the house isn't it awesome isn't mom great look what she did cuz words of affirmation yes I had to tell him that you only have like 500 fights before you figure out oh I have to say words to you so you know what it is that I need to feel loved in this relationship or what you need well let me ask you this this idea of trying to do better in some area for a performance reason like an external reason or because it's a healthier place to be so not to be the Pinterest person right but to be the god-fearing person to be more comfortable with how God has made you there should be a distinction sure I mean absolutely yes I really do believe a large part of our experience here on earth as creatures created in the image of God is a redemptive purpose right he wants to see us redeemed he Jesus said all the time the kingdom of God is now and we live in the kingdom of God here and now and he gives us opportunity after opportunity for wholeness for healing for redemption and marriage is beautiful place for that because let me just say it's it when it comes coded in love right when it's not a critical nitpicking constant nagging almost abusive picking at somebody but when somebody really loves you and they really see you and are able to help you identify places in your life that might have ties to when you were a teenager and then gently work with you in those places the growth and freedom is really beautiful you had a story about your son Micah your second son who struggled with reading and and spelling what happened there and what what did you learn and what did he learn through that well Jean he's the one who sounds like your son I always say he pushed his heart against me when he came out as he still does wow I mean he is God's refiners fire in my life he's a very unique child deeply passionate and because of that when things are difficult for him he he explodes like all his feelings are everywhere and for anyone who's had a kid with any kind of learning disability it's deeply disheartening because not only are you feeling the pain for your child and you want them to succeed you are also as just being honest as a parent experiencing your own dread because you now know when spelling homework begins it's now gonna be like a three-hour marathon of wailing and gnashing of teeth it was so traumatic but we've often said that when we invest in our kids what we need is a team around them and I needed a teacher on my side and I went and met with his teacher and I described to her the struggles he's having I I do this now every year I write an email explaining to the teacher what we love about Micah I want to preempt their frustration like so I share here are the things that are so great about him this is why he's gonna be your ally in class because he's so passionate in these areas and so he had a teacher who finally believed in him too and so he stopped saying I can never do this and he started saying I think I'm gonna do this and he wanted his goal was to make honor roll in and in order to do that he had to not fail English and reading and spelling and so I just felt like not failing should be the goal not making honor roll right and but we championed him and we cheered him and he just had this growing goal in his life and I was really nervous about it because they would have these assemblies where we would all sit there and then they call the names of all the kids who make honor roll for things which is a sort of crushing experience if your kid is the one who's always left sitting always five years of school he was in fourth grade and he was determined to make honor roll and I remember how hard we worked and how much we believed in him and then he believed in himself and then his belief in himself became like a runaway train and I remember he kept telling me tomorrow mom tomorrow we get our report cards tomorrow we get our report cards and I remember being so afraid and he told me we're good we're praying I've been praying this whole time mom like God is gonna I'm gonna make honor roll then I felt really worried because what do you tell him like God still loves us and answers prayers even if you don't make honor roll like it's really difficult and I remember sitting at the bus stop waiting for him the day he was gonna get off that bus with his little report card and really talking to God who is a father also and saying listen you better not hurt my kid today Lord and if and if he does not make honor roll you better give me the words because I'm real worried about it but I just felt the delight of the Lord I sat there and waited for this kid and the big yellow school bus pulled up and he wasn't even off the bus he was standing on the bottom step waving this piece of paper above his head yelling I made honor roll I'll just never forget it and to this day he's 14 now and he's still a pretty intense person but I tell him honey how God built you is the reason that when you set your mind to something you are able to follow through whether it's honor roll or football or faith when I look at his journey now or how he champions other kids all of those things this is my encouragement to moms of littles who are struggling that kid who is making you feel like you you're never gonna sleep again he's gonna change your family one day because Micah is a driving force in our family who moves us forward whether it's adventure or faith or whatever it is he's interested in that passion just pours out of him and it isn't a direct answer to prayer because when he was asleep at night as a toddler an older mom told me you need to make his bed your prayer bench and I kid you not I would kneel at the side of his bottom bunk bed put my hands on him and pray for him and tell him Lord please you have to use all of this passion for good because if the other side get em we're really in trouble Lord and I remember he would wake up sometimes be like mom well what you doing and I'd be embarrassed it's sort of awkward and then I decided I wasn't embarrassed anymore and I tell him I am praying for you son I am praying you will be a warrior for God one day and that's just become the beauty of watching these kids that can be so challenging for us man in the kingdom of God he has big plans for them and I look at Micah now he's giant he's 5'11 he comes in every night to hug me before he goes to bed still and I look I look him in his eyes and tell him son you amaze me like you amaze me that we're at this place together I cannot believe who you who you are growing into it I'm so honored to be your mom and he knows all these stories I've written about him he has signed off on them he has read them he knows and he laughs because he knows how difficult it was and yet when I look at the fruit of who God is growing that boy into you it it's amazing to me yeah and I I concur with that that our strong 21 year old we have a beautiful relationship I think because we are so much alike I just adore him and I light up when he comes over for Sunday night dinner and Wednesday night and it's it can be beautiful it can will be beautiful well that's the whole point that's why I'm so grateful and I'm gonna keep the conversation going so let's come back for one more day and continue to talk about these wonderful things that you have in the middle matters book that you wrote and first can you do that yes that and man I hope you can get a copy of this I know where you can get a copy right here from focus on the family and if you can participate in helping us do ministry we don't pay shareholders so everything you give to focus we'll send you the book as our way of saying thank you as being part of the ministry and and then you get to participate in saving lives and helping couples helping midlife couples helping kids do better just all around it's it's a wonderful way to invest in the kingdom so send a gift today and we'll send you the book is our way of saying thank you yeah make a monthly pledge if you're able to that really helps us smooth out the budget throughout the year if you can't do that a one-time gift is certainly appreciated either way donate and request your copy of Lisa Jo Baker's book the middle matters just click the link in the episode notes or give us a call our number is 800 the letter a and the word family Jean it's so great to have you here and I'm looking forward to both of you joining us next time well thank you I'm looking forward to it as well so am I thank you and on behalf of Jim Daly and the entire team thanks for joining us today for focus on the family I'm John Fuller inviting you back as we once again help you and your family thrive in Christ