Today on Focus on the Family with Jim Daly, we'll return to a remarkable story about two men who experienced a somewhat awkward interaction several years ago in the lobby of a church. Well, that's Walker Hayes, the Grammy-nominated singer and songwriter, describing the beginning of his friendship with Craig Cooper, who serves churches today as a Bible teacher and speaker.
Together, these two men have written a book called Glad You're Here, Two Unlikely Friends Breaking Bread and Fences. John, last time we had a fascinating conversation with Craig and Walker about how the Lord deliberately began weaving their lives and families together. Their relationship didn't make any sense, an atheist and a pastor, but their wives became friends and their kids became friends. Isn't that how it always goes? And through a series of remarkable circumstances, they started hanging out together. And here's the thing. Craig didn't have a special gift of evangelism.
He was simply being a good friend, something we can all do with the people we meet and interact with every day. And that's one reason why we're sharing this program with you. It's a wonderful redemption story. And if you missed last time, get ahold of us and get the audio copy of it, or you can watch it on YouTube or get the Focus app for your phone and you'll have access to everything. Yeah, we'll tell you more about Walker and Craig and our previous conversation with them and their book, Glad You're Here, when you stop by the show notes for all the links. And now, Jim, we're going to pick up part two of the conversation with Walker Hayes and Craig Cooper talking about the impact of their wives, Laney and Laura.
And it's today's episode of Focus on the Family with Jim Daly. Laney sounds amazing. I mean, she's a believer through all this. She does trust in the Lord. Yeah. She's taking the glass at night as you fall asleep and making sure it doesn't spill. She's hanging in there with you.
Yeah. She sounds like an amazing woman. I mean, I did that.
There's no way. I mean, I can't quantify, you know, what my wife means to me. I mean, I met her when I was we started dating when I was 17. And I mean, she is my best friend and has been since then.
This is kind of that typical story, four messed up guys who all married wonderful women. And then for you, Laura, just speak to Laura and what she has meant to you. Well, I met my wife, you know, when I was a freshman in college and after I had come to Faith in Christ, she actually shared her testimony at the campus ministry. And I was listening to her and seeing her joy in Jesus, her her passion. And, you know, she was talking about summer vision trips to Albania and Russia and Botswana.
And you said you had me at Botswana. I remember it may have been a little weird. What's crazy is I, I listen to her.
I was like this. That's the kind of woman I want to marry. She just seemed like she would sharpen me in my faith. And afterwards we got introduced, which is funny story because the dude picked me up, turned me upside down.
A guy who's six foot nine, one of my friends. I was literally head over heels when when somebody said, hey, Greg, I want you to meet Laura. And and they flipped me back over and I said, your testimony is amazing. I love your smile.
We've talked for two and a half hours. And that night I left going, that is the woman I want to marry. She's very hospitable. She has a like a heart for the Lord. And she but she also makes you comfortable, makes me comfortable. You know, I just I can't imagine doing life without her.
Yeah. When Lauren Laney like hit it off and then Walker and I hit it off, it was like, hang on a minute. Because you have sometimes you have couples where it's like, oh, the husband gets along really well with the other husband or the wife gets along well with the wife. But it's magic. It's magical. It's a blessing when all the kids get along and, you know, then the couples get along together and then individually.
And that's what happened with us. It was just it's just awesome. But not only that, there's a story about your dog, right, Walker? I mean, yeah, the dog story. It's not just you guys bonding, but somehow the dog.
Yeah, this is my favorite part of the story because I got to unload the worst dog ever. And yeah, Craig saw it as an answered prayer. It actually. Yeah, let's explain that. Yeah.
Yeah. Which once again, when I was an unbeliever, I was like, sucker. Yeah, we would they you know, we were so we were so our lives were just mashed, you know, like a like a tapestry, you know, and interwoven. And our kids hung out and we would be at Craig's house. And we had two golden doodles, made the mistake of getting two. You know, when you go to pick up your puppy, one was remarkable.
And one is literally the Satan version. Hey, Craig, here's a dog for you. So Craig, we're at Craig's house. And Craig's daughter's like, I want a dog. And I was like, bro, I have a dog.
Craig knew that we had two. And I was like, bro, I'll give you one. It's ready to go. I was like, here's the receipt. A bag of Purina. Oh, gosh. I was like, I'll put a bow around.
I'll get it groomed before we give it to you. And and and Craig did. But it was actually remarkable. It was quite remarkable. The specifications. Yeah.
He basically outlined too many regulations. Like seven different. Yeah. Well, this is your daughter, right? So your daughter wants a dog. This is how this all meshed together.
But you said what? So she's 21 now. Our oldest daughter, Caris, she was 11 at a time.
And she was one for her birthday. She was wanting a dog. We had had a terrible dog, a dog named Charlie, who was a Beagle who like this is when the kids were young. And in diapers and he would get into the trash can, pull the diapers out the dirty diapers and rip them apart the whole house. He was just mad. And we had given him away and we had gone for five years without a dog. And so when Caris is asking, I'm like, baby girl, I love you. And we're just not a dog family.
And she kept asking, kept resisting. And then I said, all right, look, there's about seven things that would have to happen for us to get a dog. You know, your mom's allergic, so it'd have to be hypoallergenic. It'd have to be free because we don't have any money to buy a dog right now. Somebody would have to be willing to watch the dog when we're out of town because we're not going to pay to create the dog.
It'd have to be crate trained, potty trained, you know, and this is probably going to have to be like a Labradoodle or something like that. And, you know, here's I gave her all these stipulations. I was like, you're welcome to pray for it.
But I just I don't see it happening. Well, she took that list and she started praying for it. So we've got them over to our houses the first time they were over. And that's when Laney's talking about their home life and these two dogs and and all this kind of stuff and how they loved Noli Magnolia and how they just couldn't stand Tulip. You know, she's like, yeah, I mean, we'd love to find another home for this dog. And and she's like, I mean, he's hypoallergenic, you know, he's crate trained or she's I'm sorry, she's hypoallergenic, she's crate trained, she's potty trained.
All this kind of stuff goes through all this. And then and then she's like, I mean, we we would actually even be willing to dog sit whenever a family goes out every year. And Mike, I had my fork.
I just stopped. My mouth was open and I think Laney smelled blood. And she's like, do you all want to take the dog? And I'm like, well, she said just for a trial, like, why don't you take Tulip for the weekend?
See if you all like it. Well, we fell in love with Tulip and Tulip bonded us, our families together. Because anytime they went out of town, we watched Noli. Anytime we went out of town, they watched Tulip.
And, you know, Tulip actually she died of cancer a little bit after Walker came to faith in Christ. Wow. And I thought, well, you did your job on earth. Yeah. That's I think that's why she was here. That is so sweet. Isn't that crazy? Yeah.
Walker, let me ask you. Let me bring you in, because, you know, you're on the other end of this relationship going, OK, who is this guy? You ended up years later writing a song and you named it after Craig. I mean, that's pretty cool. Yeah. Just a couple of the lines out of there.
And maybe we could link to the Web site on your Web site and people could. Oh, yeah, I wrote I wrote Craig a song just because I did not know how to thank him for his gift of a van. My wife and I had one car and we would drive everywhere in the Honda. And if a cop drove by, I would yell cop and all my kids would dive onto the floorboard to hide from the cop. You didn't have enough room for I didn't have enough seatbelts. So, you know, we probably my wife was usually holding a baby, you know, in the front seat and not proud of this.
But this is that's where we were in life. And Craig knew this. And, you know, I was so proud and never would have said, hey, can I get some help, you know, from somebody? But, you know, Craig, again, back to the trust, you know, for some reason, I trusted Craig, you know, and he knew these things about us.
And he shows up at my son's baseball game one night and hops out of his own van and he has the keys and the title to this car. And I'm not going to lie, it infuriated me. I mean, you would think a smart human would go, oh, my goodness, thank you.
Thank you for this gift. But I was embarrassed. I was unwilling to admit that I needed such a wonderful gift. I felt like accepting the car was throwing in the towel, you know, on myself and just in the rudest way. I probably said, like, I'll borrow it, you know, or whatever, because I didn't want to give him the satisfaction of being a hero. A, of all, he was a Christian. I didn't want some some Jesus guy saving the day, you know. And so anyway, reluctantly, I drove the car home and I remember looking in the rear view and seeing my kids buckling up.
And I remember something softened in my heart. And it honestly, if you if you listen to the song, Craig, you can hear a nonbeliever not mentioning the name of Jesus on purpose in the song, being confused by the love of a neighbor, basically just going, hey, I don't know what this guy's got, but it's pretty perplexing that this man shows up and supports me, even though my hymns, my songs don't belong in a hymnal, even though he knows my story. There's no benefit in knowing a person like me. I will not help you up some ladder at all.
You do not benefit by knowing me or my family or the mess we're in. Yet he is willing to jump in and sacrificially give us the car out of his garage. And so that's what the song Craig was about. And again, I didn't run to Jesus that night. I just didn't know how to thank Craig. And honestly, writing him a song was pretty awkward.
I mean, there were many times where I was like, I'm writing this dude a song. And I was like, Laney, is this weird? And thank goodness Laney, Laney sent it. Laney texted the song to Craig. So it was kind of out of my hands.
No, that's good. And, you know, this morning when I was reading the prep and reading your book and Jean and I, she was we played the song. She's crying. Oh, man. And I started crying.
Yeah. So I don't know who to blame, you or you. I'm blaming both of you for tears this morning, but it's very touching.
We'll link to that. So, Craig, you're sitting there, neighbor man, and you're going, OK, Lord, this is interesting. What kind of conversation are you having with God about this?
Yeah. I mean, I had regularly prayed, you know, specific things for Walker. The Lord would bless his his music. I would I would stand outside of Puckett's Boathouse. That was a Walker Wednesday nights when he would play. And I would tell him, dude, mark my words.
You're going to pack stadiums. And I believed it like I really believe that with all my heart. I would also pray, God, you've gifted him. So because I knew it was from the Lord, like the gifts they've given to my friend. But I was like, Lord, please use his gift of songwriting and music to draw his attention to you and draw people's attention to you through things he's written. And, you know, there was an inkling, I think, when he sent the song. Craig, that came to me in a moment where we were five years into the church plant.
I was feeling like is anything happening here? And I was really discouraged at that particular moment. I was a bivocational pastor at this point.
I've been full time before, but this time I was holding down basically two different jobs to do ministry. And I took a walk in downtown Franklin in the square, and I poured my heart out to God then. I remember stopping in the middle of the, you know, on Main Street, and I just said, God, I need you to encourage me. Do you have me where you want me? Is my life making any difference to anybody around me? You know I try to encourage other people.
Would you please encourage me? And I had sent an email to the pastoral team saying I think I might be done. I wasn't seeing any fruit. And that was the moment that Laney sent the song, Craig, which happened a long time after we gave the man. I mean, that's probably a year and a half.
I mean, it may be a year and a half, two years after. But that was the timing? At your low point, boom. My low point, we were on a date in Cool Springs in Franklin, and we're sitting in our car, and I'm telling my wife how discouraged I am. And that's when the phone buzzed. And it was from Laney. And I remember being a little irritated, because I'm like, hey, babe, who's that? And she said, it's Laney. And I said, can you please tell Lane that we're on a date, you know, that you'll hit her back later?
I'm just trying to tell you how discouraged I am. I kind of need you right now. And she said, well, it's got a file on it. It's got an MP3.
And we were accustomed to getting that from Walker. He would send songs he'd written, and we loved everything he wrote. I mean, he's just a brilliant songwriter. But she said, this one has your name on it.
It says Craig. I think we need to play it. And I pushed back, because he writes funny songs, too. And I didn't know what kind of song this was. I wasn't in the mood for it. I was like, we'll play it later.
And she persisted, and it went through the speakers. And that's when I heard, I met Craig at a church called Redeeming Grace. It's like he understood my I don't want to be here face. I fell out of place. I smelled like beer.
He just shook my hand and said, I'm glad you're here. And then he goes through, and when he got to the chorus, it's all about my relationship with Jesus. And I just lost it. I was bawling.
And I was speechless. And it felt like Zephaniah 3, where it says, the Lord your God is in your midst, a mighty one who will save. He will rejoice over you with gladness. He'll quiet you with his love.
He will exalt over you with loud singing. And that was what happened to me, is I felt like the Holy Spirit was singing over me through my atheist, unbelieving friend. It's just how God will do it. And I was literally floored, blown away. And then I felt like, okay, okay, Lord, you have me where you want me.
I surrender. That was the first time when I thought, man, God's doing something in Walker's life. And I went and told the family, God's doing something in Walker's life.
Let's pray that God saves him. Let me, Walker, let me continue with you. In the book, you share how you and Lanie had this recurring, I guess, argument about Jesus. That's a good thing. In fact, during one late night conversation, I think you said to your wife, then prove it to me.
Prove that the gospel can change someone's life. Yeah. Wow. That is a daring statement. Oh, the Lord. You know, the Lord is waiting for you to say that. Oh, yeah.
I just think he's ready when somebody says that. Here we go. Yeah.
You know, I would. This was following the loss of our seventh child. So I was just crushed. You know, we lost our seventh. She was a stillborn and just I was confused.
I felt like an idiot getting up every night and singing song. You know, I just didn't feel. I don't know, man. I just was just despair.
That's why I just I was confused. And, you know, for once in my life, I could look at something and go, I don't have answers, kids. Lanie, I don't know how to make you smile anymore.
I don't know how to make me smile. You know, and I would I would try to do good things. I would try to go, hey, it's about my fans.
I'm gonna make it about them. And I could only be good for seven seconds. You know, as soon as soon as I said that before I finished the I'm gonna be good sentence. I was selfish or bored or, you know, and I and I and I called Lanie one night and I did. I said, give me an example.
Please give me an example of a transformative, like a nasty person who is truly transformed by the gospel on this side of heaven. And she said, Paul. And I said, you're cheating. You know, I said, he's in the book. You know, he's in the manual. You can't use one of those.
Those are excluded. Yeah. I was like, no disciples allowed. And you had some rules here. I did. I was very. But, you know, and, you know, Lanie and I, I'm so grateful for a relationship where I mean, we definitely argued, but that was a cry. You know, I was, you know, I was begging her just. I was just confused and I was in need. You know, that statement that you said I made to Lanie.
Show me someone. I think that was my version of saying, man, I just want to be. I need I need to say. Did you get an answer to that either from Lanie or from somebody? You know what? I actually did. And it was from a book that I read.
And it was from, of all things, it was crazy. Lanie used to go to this Bible study called Flourish. And she, I would jokingly make fun of. I would be like, you're going to go to your girls group tonight.
You know, you're going to go flourish. And she would go to this girls group and somebody shared with her a book called Secrets of an Unlikely Convert by Rosario Butterfield. I know. She's a friend.
Rosario Butterfield. She's great. And honestly, I couldn't even tell. I was starstruck. Like I, when I met her, Craig laughed because I didn't know what to say.
I was such a geek. But I've heard her speak since. But I, she shared me that book. I got it on my phone and I read her testimony overnight on a bus.
I didn't go to bed. I just read her testimony and our testimonies and our pride and the feeling of driving up to a church and holding a bulletin. Her insecurities and her fears and anger in those situations were so similar to mine.
Our testimonies were so similar. I just hadn't surrendered. I just hadn't said yes.
Correct. Whatever you are, whoever you are, we please have me. You know, we and and I didn't do that. And so when I got home from that show, I finished that book and I snuck into a Barnes and Noble with my hoodie on and I bought a Bible. And I took it home in the dark of night. I did.
I was so, so stuck in my just not gonna go there. I didn't want my wife to know. I hid it in the bag.
It lived in the white bag behind the picture in our living room. Wow. And I and I would wake up and read and just devour it. And I and I began to read about all these idiots just like me.
That's exactly right. And you know what? For the first time in my life, I read the scriptures as those guys not being heroes, that God was the hero, that they were just like me and failing left and right.
And he would continue to rescue them. And and one day I told my wife and, you know, I said, I just want I believe I'm in. I'm 100 percent. And then we met them at a sushi restaurant. And I was like, bro, I was like, I don't even I'm ignorant.
I don't even know how to explain what I desire, you know, but I, I believe. And that's the change. Oh, that's the difference.
It was for people that that is so good because, you know, I remember doing a catechism at a church in San Diego. And that was how they said it. They said the evidence of being filled with the Holy Spirit is a changed life. And that's what you went through. That's what you experienced.
You changed even in the dark of night. It's so funny. I mean, the Lord comes after us in all kinds of ways.
I love the fact that you just said, prove it to me. Oh, yeah. It wasn't just your wife hearing that. Yeah, it was the Lord here. It was OK, son, I'm going to prove it to you.
And here I come. How much, what was the period of time between that night that you laid that out there? Give me an example of where somebody's life was changed from the gospel to when you were sneaking, reading the Bible in your house. Oh, goodness. Is that a couple of years, a year, months, weeks?
I mean, I'd say it was a matter of reading scripture for maybe a month or two. That's so good. Just soaking it up. What an amazing story, you guys. This is incredible. And man, I just want to say thank you so much for being here to share the story. Thank you for having us. Oh, it's awesome.
Thanks for being here. This is Focus on the Family with Jim Daly and I'm John Fuller. And we just heard the conclusion of a two-part conversation with Craig Cooper and Walker Hayes, as they described their rather unusual friendship of more than 20 years. Craig and Walker have written a terrific book called Glad You're Here, Two Unlikely Friends Breaking Bread and Fences. We'll send a copy of that book to you when you make a monthly pledge of any amount to the Ministry of Focus. That's our way of saying thank you for stepping up and partnering with us to strengthen and support families. Our number is 800, the letter A in the word family, 800-232-6459.
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